Most Generation PRNG Help / Information

[Dizzybanana21x]

Is the nature of Suicune set when you release it or can u reset the nature?

 

[opiaboy]

Just thought this would be good for everyone to know, another piece of info about RNGing in HGSS.

I just successfully RNG'd for my Raikou in HG!!!!

I know that there have been a lot of questions in this thread about RNGing for the roamers in HG SS. I thought posting a play by play of how I accomplished this would benefit:

a) The people who are only somewhat familiar with RNGing who just want to get to a good Raikou, and:

b) Those who are researching frame advancement in HG SS and are wondering about consistent methods of frame advancement and such.

Maybe this can shed some light on frame advancement, or maybe its already old news. Whatever the case may be, here is step by step how I did it:

1. Calibration

I calibrated for the delay for my game using RNG reporter. I tried 6 different times, then averaged the results. I got:

(489 + 481 + 489 + 493 + 491 + 487) / 6 = approx. 489

Seconds: 14

If you are familiar with calibration, this doesn't need a huge explanation. If you need to know more about calibration, check out the general RNG guide.

(NOTE: I personally do not like soft resetting within the game itself, as I usually mess up. I calibrate my delay using the time it takes for me to get from entering the game from the DS start screen, to hitting continue).

2. Spread

I figured out the spread I wanted for Raikou (a method 1 poke). I used a spread mentioned to me earlier by gameman87 (Thank you so much for your help btw!):

Nature: Timid
30/1/31/30/31/31
HP Grass, 68

Seed: 730d048c
Frame: 26

3. Time and Date

I then used RNG Reporter's Seed to Time function, plugging in the day I wanted to catch Raikou:

Date: 3/21/2010 (a Sunday)
Time: 13:38:14
Delay: 1154

4. Setup/Prep.

I actually had all of this done before anything else, but really you don't need to do this part until right before you attempt to RNG.

I did the following:

a) Obtained 12 rare candies (from my diamond version, through 2 trades... that took a while)
These were used to raise Raikou's level so the RNG reporter could more accurately determine the seed I hit.

b) Obtained a master ball (traded, again, from my diamond version)
I didn't want to risk killing Raikou, also this made the process SO much faster.

c) Switched my pokegear to Radio, having the station set to the bottom right one

d) Saved on the basment steps of burnt tower, 1 step before triggering the legendary dogs event

Also, I prepared some software:

Downloaded PikaTimer,
-plugged 489 in the calibrated delay field
-plugged 1154 in the wanted delay field
-clicked create timer button

On RNG Reporter,
-clicked the DPPt Seed Finder button
-clicked the Find Initial Seed by Stats tab


ONE LAST THING! If you'll notice in step 1, all of the delays I encountered were odd. Since my target delay was even, I attached a copy of Pokemon Emerald version to the bottom of my DS. This changed my delays from odd to even (I am pretty sure about this...)


SO.... i was ready to go!

5. Attempts

I then attempted to try catching Raikou. I knew that his monster frame was 1, and that I needed a frame of 26, but I wasn't sure about consistent frame advancement.

For all of my attempts, I hit the space bar on my computer (to start PikaTimer) at the same time, pressing A to change the time on my DS to 13:37. I then waited for the PikaTimer to count down, and pressed A to enter the game when the timer hit zero. I then hit A on the continue screeen when the second timer hit zero.

ATTEMPT 1I used sweet scent twice, running from the pokemon each time I encountered one. I don't remember which pokemon they were... but I believe they were 1 Koffing and 1 Rattata, or it could have been 2 Koffings.

I then triggered the event. Afterwards I tracked Raikou down and captured him. I then pugged his stats into the RNG Reporter to find the seed. I got:

Seed: 730d048c
Delay: 1154

But after checking Raikou's stats and nature, I knew I wasn't right. I then checked the adjacent frames to see what I hit. I had ended up hitting:

Frame: 37

So... that was odd.

ATTEMPT 2

I basically repeated everything I did above, with one crucial exception. Instead of using Sweet Scent, I used the Pokegear. I then dragged the radio dot into the center of the BIG cricle, being careful to pull it only until the radio station stopped. I then pressed the bottom right button to reset the radio. I repeated this process 24 times. However, I believe I messed up on a few pulls, because when I caught Raikou I got this from RNG reporter:


Seed: 730d0490
Delay: 1158
Frame: 28

So I clearly messed up... but I got the feeling that the frame was advanced by 1 for each radio detuning. Hmmm...

ATTEMPT 3

I did al of the above, except I only detuned the radio 22 times, just to check what frame I would get:

Seed: 730d048c
Delay: 1154
Frame: 23

ATTEMPT 4

I tried again, this time detuning the radio 25 times. The result:

Seed: 730d048c
Delay: 1154
Frame: 25

I got it!

SO... the ending.

DISCLAIMER!!! I am pretty sure that the method described above in Attempt 4 would allow anyone to get a Raikou with the above spread, but I am pretty sure (as others can attest) that frame advancement is not consistent for some of the methods described above (specifically the radio) on certain days and at certain times. ALSO, I got pretty lucky as far as RNGing goes, because I got Raikou in a mere 4 attempts (as opposed to hundreds of tries I have had for other RNG'd pokes like wondercard Jirachi). So unless you are using the exact date and time etc. that I used above, these methods may not work!

So I think this account is a good way to give some of the community a better understanding for RNGing the roamers in HG SS.

I have one question though... How did sweet scent work here? How did it advance the frames?

thanks,

opiaboy

 

[Misdreavus]

If I save on the 10th floor of the Tin Tower (where there are no NPCs) with no roamers out, SR, and immediately use Sweet Scent (no steps/turns/radio/talking to Pokémon/etc.), the Pokémon I get is GUARANTEED to be on frame 3, correct?

Also, after the battle, no matter whether I catch, defeat, or run from the Rattata/Gastly, the current frame will be the frame listed under "actual" next to the method K frame 3 spread, right?

 

[Ortega]

When RNGing the doggies (specifically Raikou), do I need to beat the League with five Poke'mon? And do all of the steps before Lance?

I regret not trying to RNG Raikou in the tower, because it looks like RNGing him after defeating the E4 is going to be a real pain. But, I'm willing to do some research to see if it's even possible.

The seed never changes once you enter the game, right? All Pokemon are generated on that seed by whichever method generates them, on whatever frame is active, and the seed only changes if you reload the game, correct?

So it's simply a matter of hitting that seed, then tracking all possible frame advances between checking your seed and defeating Lance. Each Elite Four battle will advance frames, and the cutscenes after beating Lance could advance frames, also. So the first thing to do would be landing on any seed, then beating the Elite Four and catching Raikou to find out what frame it landed on. After doing this a few times, we can get an idea what frame Raikou is generated on after beating the E4.

There are a lot of potential problems. The Blackbelt in the Indigo Plateau Pokemon Center randomly changes which direction he faces, which might advance frames like moving NPCs do. Another problem might be finding a way to reliably check your seed before entering the E4, and avoiding unintentional advances (counting steps will be crucial). If the Blackbelt has no effect on frames, and there are no other variables between checking the seed and entering the first E4 battle, then it could be possible to reliably hit a certain frame.

I'm going to try it and record my data once I get access to Mt. Silver. Is it possible to Fly from the Mt. Silver summit? If so, I can catch a Pokemon there to check my seed, Fly directly to the E4, beat them, catch each roamer with Master Balls to see what frames they were generated on, then reset and start the process again to see if consistent results are even possible. This method is probably better than saving in front of Lance and advancing the frame, since there's currently no way to check your seed from there (I miss the Coin Flip app so freakin' much) if you're trying to do this on a cart. All roamers should be KOed prior to trying anything, since they don't seem to add frames as consistently as they did in DPPt.

Oh, a question before I attempt any of this, do phone calls advance any frames, regardless of if you answer them or not?

 

[Newts]

I regret not trying to RNG Raikou in the tower, because it looks like RNGing him after defeating the E4 is going to be a real pain. But, I'm willing to do some research to see if it's even possible.

The seed never changes once you enter the game, right? All Pokemon are generated on that seed by whichever method generates them, on whatever frame is active, and the seed only changes if you reload the game, correct?

So it's simply a matter of hitting that seed, then tracking all possible frame advances between checking your seed and defeating Lance. Each Elite Four battle will advance frames, and the cutscenes after beating Lance could advance frames, also. So the first thing to do would be landing on any seed, then beating the Elite Four and catching Raikou to find out what frame it landed on. After doing this a few times, we can get an idea what frame Raikou is generated on after beating the E4.

There are a lot of potential problems. The Blackbelt in the Indigo Plateau Pokemon Center randomly changes which direction he faces, which might advance frames like moving NPCs do. Another problem might be finding a way to reliably check your seed before entering the E4, and avoiding unintentional advances (counting steps will be crucial). If the Blackbelt has no effect on frames, and there are no other variables between checking the seed and entering the first E4 battle, then it could be possible to reliably hit a certain frame.

I'm going to try it and record my data once I get access to Mt. Silver. Is it possible to Fly from the Mt. Silver summit? If so, I can catch a Pokemon there to check my seed, Fly directly to the E4, beat them, catch each roamer with Master Balls to see what frames they were generated on, then reset and start the process again to see if consistent results are even possible. This method is probably better than saving in front of Lance and advancing the frame, since there's currently no way to check your seed from there (I miss the Coin Flip app so freakin' much) if you're trying to do this on a cart. All roamers should be KOed prior to trying anything, since they don't seem to add frames as consistently as they did in DPPt.

Oh, a question before I attempt any of this, do phone calls advance any frames, regardless of if you answer them or not?

Alot of this has already been answered if you used the search button....
Yes you can fly to the Indigo Plateau from both Kanto and Johto
Yes phone calls advance the frame whether you answer it or not, but on each specific seed the time (yes time not frame) the phone rings is always the same
Yes you can catch a level 50ish pokemon on Mt Silver to check your seed
Yes the NPC in the room does advance you but on the same seed he will always move the same way in the same amount of time.
No battling the E4 does not advance your frame
No the cut scenes do not advance your frame
No the radio does not work in the E4 you have to walk 128 steps alot of times =P
Be aware that 128 steps increases your frame and you are almost guaranteed to trigger it between Mt Silver and Lance

Above all its possible with a little patience, I got my Raikou which is listed in my thread but defeating the E4 3 times. Once for the calibration of frames, a 2nd time I missed my frame cos I only triggered one 128 Step advancement instead of 2 <_<, and hit it right on the 3rd attempt

 

[imapedarsag]

search doesn't work. how'd you guys rng suicune? also, if raikou's monster frame is 1, then what's entei?

 

[Newts]

search doesn't work. how'd you guys rng suicune? also, if raikou's monster frame is 1, then what's entei?

Suicune is a simple stationary Method K encounter. Hit your seed, advance your frame and talk to him

I'd assume Entei is 6, but I just beat the E4 and caught my target dog to found out its frame number so I didnt need to keep tabs on how many steps I took or what frame he was released on etc
EDIT: I just made sure I walked the exact same path each time so there was no variation

 

[imapedarsag]

but what about after you kill it. then what method is suicune? still k?

 

[Newts]

but what about after you kill it. then what method is suicune? still k?

Yeh if you kill it he will be back on the route next door to Bills house after you defeat the E4 again. Its no different to catching Dialga/Palkia in Platinum with the exception of method K instead of J

 

[Romsstar]

After trying to get PikaTimer to run at three different computers with three different OS (XP, Vista, Windows7)
now I wonder:

What the hell do I need in order to run this program smoothly?
No matter what I do the "Create Timer" button won't work for me, it just happens nothing.

I tried with Java 6, Java 6 SDK and even compiled it to an .exe and still nothing.

So please could anyone on which computer this program actually runs with all functions explain me what I need to do in order to use it?

 

[Pehu]

That would be nice to know too, since now I'm sure I'm not the only one that can't run PikaTimer.

 

[COKTAL]

I can't as well, but my computer doesn't even let it come up. I've talked to Pikachu25 about it, but were pretty much lost when it comes to how to get it to work.

 

[Ortega]

Alot of this has already been answered if you used the search button....
lots of really useful info, see above
No the radio does not work in the E4 you have to walk 128 steps alot of times =P

Does the radio just not advance frames in the E4? Because after getting the EXPN Card the radio does work in the E4. Or at least it does in Will's room, where I checked.

Also, I read some 60 pages of this thread in full, every day since HGSS was released in the US, and dozens of pages prior. And, I site:smogon.com'ed a ton of stuff on Google, but I didn't turn up anything quite as useful for this task as all the things you just listed in just one post, so thanks much for all of that info. A lot of people are just declaring it "too hard" when all the info you provided shows that it's very possible if you're willing to put in the work.

Now if only somebody could crack the Red Gyarados RNG puzzle... All I'm finding in every search is a lot of people giving up on it. :( I'm confident someone will find a breakthrough, so I'm leaving mine in Lake of Rage till that day comes.

 

[dragonboy52]

Is there anything other than Pikatimer which helps you hit your delay easily?

 

[Pehu]

Emloop. There are two guides that teach how to use it on the first page of this thread.

 

[dragonboy52]

Emloop. There are two guides that teach how to use it on the first page of this thread.

Thanks i figured that i could do this Plug in 15 seconds and restart the game mass 'A' till i reach continue then wait till 15 seconds get over and prees a is that ok?

 

[COKTAL]

@Ortega: About Red Gyrados. The problem is that there are 2 NPCs in the route. One is some girl near the house (she just turns I think) and Red Gyrados itself. It COULD be possible, but it'd be alot of guess and check to get it right if you let them move. If you don't, you'd have to advance your frame very quickly to do it.

 

[ΩDonut]

Now if only somebody could crack the Red Gyarados RNG puzzle... All I'm finding in every search is a lot of people giving up on it. :( I'm confident someone will find a breakthrough, so I'm leaving mine in Lake of Rage till that day comes.

The Gyarados is generated by the same method that creates chained shinies. As of yet, there is no program that generates lists of chained spreads, except for my modified RNG Reporter. And even that has been untested.

Ah, hell... here it is. Somebody please test it and see if ANY of the spreads generated for a seed are at all consistent with the spreads generated for the Gyarados. No, the frame number won't be the same because I don't know what the equivalent of "Method K" for the Gyarados is. Yes, the ID\SID still matters.

 

[Ditto]

If I save on the 10th floor of the Tin Tower (where there are no NPCs) with no roamers out, SR, and immediately use Sweet Scent (no steps/turns/radio/talking to Pokémon/etc.), the Pokémon I get is GUARANTEED to be on frame 3, correct?

In my experience it is guaranteed to be frame 2.

Also, after the battle, no matter whether I catch, defeat, or run from the Rattata/Gastly, the current frame will be the frame listed under "actual" next to the method K frame 3 spread, right?

It will be the frame listed under actual + 6.

 

[Nexus]

Oh, uh.. OK. I had already posted there, then I saw this and thought it'd be better here. I'm a bit confused. o_o

the first post of this topic will clear that up for you

 

[Kabuto Mushi]

the first post of this topic will clear that up for you

Ah, ok, I see it now.

Here's another question then: Let's say I get my SID from some nice person. How long does it normally take to move through each step and get to the point where you get the egg from the daycare man? Again assuming I have all the other prerequisites and such.

 

[Ditto]

Is Kyogre's Frame 1?

 

[Frozen_Spirit]

Quick question if I use an Adamant syncher on this spread Quiet 31/31/30/30/30/31 I could get a pokemon that is Adamant with those stats on a method J? What exactly does with a syncher do?

Edit :Figured out

 

[Hawkings11]

Wild Eep, I have a question for you regarding hexadecimal in order to find the Munchlax trees. I apologize if this has been answered elsewhere.

I do not have my secret ID, although I have my Trainer ID and was looking to find two of my Munchlax trees through calculation. However, I don't quite understand your instructions and was looking for some clarification.

My trainer ID is 35612, so in hexadecimal it is 8b1c.

Thus, is [SS] = 139, with [YY] = 139 % 21?

Likewise, is [TT] = 28, with [ZZ] = 28 % 21?

Thank you for your help.

 

[Frozen_Spirit]

last question say I'm trying to hit frame 1197.

So its

Target Frame - Monster Frame - Number of Wandering Pokémon

1197-1-0

so its 1196/2 is 598 journal flips. I have to do 598 journal flips to get my desired frame?