Nails
Double Threat
This team is my first real team of Gen 5 LC. I had made it because of a conversation I’d had on PO about the Munchlax set that I made and wanted to test, and it surpassed all expectations. It has reached #1 on the Wifi and Dream World ladders (the Dream world ladder has no bans, Scyther and Tangela + Drought Vulpix are legal on that ladder for example). This team is my case as to why Evolution Stone should be banned from little cup, as well as the best team I’ve had in gen 5 so far.
Bronzor @ Evolution Stone
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 220 HP / 8 Atk / 152 Def / 4 SAtk / 68 SDef / 12 Spd
Bold Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Psychic
- Toxic
Bronzor is a staple in LC because it has awesome defenses and lays down stealth rock incredibly consistently. This set is basically here to put up rocks and have the bulk to switch into stuff and get some damage on it, it’s also the only user of toxic I have which is very useful. I’m considering protect over earthquake on it, as the stuff it checks are all covered by the rest of the team, and getting free poison and hail damage is quite useful. Bronzor’s role is fairly well known, and it does its role very well on the team.
Potential changes: Protect over Earthquake, as there are a ton of times I find myself wanting protect, but I infrequently use EQ. It basically hits the dark/steel thing, as anything else is beaten by toxic or psychic.
Tentacool (M) @ Oran Berry/Evo Stone
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 196 HP / 76 Def / 236 SDef
Calm Nature
- Toxic Spikes
- Protect
- Surf
- Rapid Spin
Tentacool is a fantastic choice for a LC stall team. It clears up toxic spikes (even though I only have one pokemon who gives a shit about toxic spikes, and it has a pseudo recovery move… it’s still useful to make them waste a turn setting it up again I guess), sets up my own, and spins away rocks/spikes. The team needs a spinner to function, as my main offensive pokemon is weak to every type of hazard, and I only have one SR resist on the team. Toxic spikes are also a must. Tentacool was basically the answer to those two questions, as Pineco doesn’t really check anything and is an even worse spinner than Tenta.
The moveset is pretty much standard. Toxic spikes and spin are why I’m using it, Surf is for STAB that hits its switch ins harder than slime wave, and protect is for me needing as many users as possible. I was thinking about toxic > surf though, since I barely use it, as it does shit level damage, and toxic always helps a stall team.
The item choice may look a bit odd, but because it's a spinner, it switches into SR and Spikes a lot, and Evo Stone doesn't help at all with that. Both have their merits though.
Snover (M) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Snow Warning
EVs: 36 HP / 36 Def / 184 SAtk / 36 SDef / 200 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Blizzard
- Giga Drain
- Ice Shard
- Hidden Power [Fire]
Snover provides a couple things. It gives residual damage in the form of hail, and it gives me a halfway decent revenge killer (though not foolproof, as it’s slow) and the only priority on the team. It has a SE hit on Pururiru, which is still sort of tough to kill for the rest of the team, although tox spikes helps with that. It also counters Moguryuu, which is cool. It’s basically just my standard scarfer that every team needs.
Misdreavus (M) @ Evolution Stone
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 36 HP / 120 Def / 80 SDef / 240 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Hidden Power [Fighting]
- Shadow Ball
- Will-O-Wisp
- Pain Split
Misdreavus is an amazing pokemon. Its offensive sets judt great, and they haven’t lost any viability at all in the generation change, but this bulky missy set is fantastic for this team. It is a bulkymon, a 19 speeder, and a ghost all in one. The EVs max out speed, put a point in SpD and HP and 2 in defense, in an effort to balance out the defenses. HP Fighting is important to hit munchy and any of the LC steels that resist shadow ball (there are several). Wisp allows me to get a status on stuff like Gligar and steel/poison types who aren’t affected by toxic spikes. Split is the only recovery it gets… it sucks, but it’s the best it has. Whatever.
Missy checks so much stuff it’s not funny. You need a SE attack to 2hko it, or something with STAB and a ton of base power (hydro pump, ect.). This allows it to serve as a partial oshit button for the team when I need to get out of something, and it works fantastically. Basically, it’s here because it’s just a great pokemon and does more than a lot of other mons.
Gligar (M) @ Evolution Stone
Trait: Hyper Cutter
EVs: 236 HP / 236 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Roost
- U-turn
- Aqua Tail
For the same reason as Misdreavus, Gligar is used because it’s one of, if not the best pokemon in the metagame right now. With this spread, it’s bulky enough to stall out LO Murkrow brave birding it repeatedly with just roost. In the hail. And it still hits 19 speed. EQ is STAB, roost lets it stall crap while piling up hail damage, U-Turn lets me get to something to set up or hit it in the face, or generally counter it, and Aqua Tail is just kind of there. Might replace it with toxic, as it’s sort of useless. EVs max out speed for 19 which is so very useful and max hp for more bulk, as Gligar doesn’t need the 3 extra attack points a lot (they help ofc, just no always needed).
Munchlax (M) @ Evolution Stone
Trait: Pickup
EVs: 76 HP / 196 Def / 236 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Stockpile
- Whirlwind
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
This is the set the team was build around. It has surprise value going for it… and the fact that it’s incredibly bulky. At +3, literally nothing (barring Meditite's High Jump Kick) in the metagame 2hkoes it without some kind of boost. And setting up on it is risky because it has whirlwind, which when combined with Stealth Rock, Toxic Spikes, and hail damage, literally lets it stall out entire teams. The set plays in a really straightforward manner; if you are awake, stockpile until they will KO you. If you’re asleep, sleep talk until +3 and then whirlwind spam until you've killed everything on their team that can't recover HP through toxic spikes, stealth rock damage, and hail damage (I've frequently killed bronzors using just hail damage). For an example of its bulk, at +3 Scarf Machop's Dynamicpunch does 8 damage, or 30%. Misdreavus' Life Orbed Hidden Power Fighting does 5 damage, or 16%.
The sett admittedly has some issues. Munchy is slow as balls, so a faster roarer will always phaze it. Taunt also completely shuts it down (I run bold and 0 attack ivs for that reason). Leech seed does a number to the set too, as it frequently relies on stealth rock damage to net kills. However, huge potential flaws in the set aren’t as big of issues because neither roar, nor taunt are frequently used at all, while leech seed is on a minority of teams at best, and the sets' pros more than make up for its cons.
That’s my team. I’ve been consistently top 5 on both ladders (Wifi and Dream World) since I made the team. At the time of this posting, I have like a 100 point lead on the next closest person on the DW ladder (the ladder has no bans), and it’s still been successful. The point I’m trying to make by posting this team is that Evo Stone is broken, when a pokemon can stall out the metagame with such a simple set. Imo, I don’t think the fact that stall is usable in Little Cup is all that bad. I think the fact that a single set can be so incredibly dominating and near-impossible to stop without a few specific counters (strong fighting types) is what’s wrong with the item.
Thanks for reading this, rate/hate/steal.
Ok, so I have this cool Munchlax set I wanted to try out. Munchlax @ Evo Stone hits 30/21/27 Defenses, which is ridiculous. The fact that it gets stockpile is even more ridiculous, after 3 stockpiles it hits 30/52/67 defense. It needs recovery though, so while uncommon in LC rest talk was the way to go, as it has no other options. The 4th move I decided on was Whirlwind, which is generally unviable in LC, but it’s worked because Munchy has the bulk to absorb hits. Also, it looked like getting set up on would be an issue for it. So that’s the munchy set I decided to build the team around.
After that, I looked around for what I’d need to support the Munchlax. Residual damage was the obvious answer. I took an idea from Eo’s (gen 4) team and decided on toxic spikes Tentacool, as it can set up on so much crap. Its special defense is actually higher than Munchy’s to give an example of its bulk. After that, I needed Stealth Rock, and Bronzor was the obvious choice for a stall team, outside of Hippopotas. I decided against using Hippo because of the fact that sand is quite powerful and I didn’t need to help it any. This also meant that since I wasn’t using sand, I had one option for auto weather. Snover earned a slot, but I wasn’t sure about movesets at this point.
I looked at my team up to this point, and the most obvious issue was 2 pokemon weak to fighting, one neutral, and one resist who couldn’t take physical hits that well. A ghost is the fairly obvious choice here, especially with High Jump Kick being good this gen. I had 3 choices, and that is Pururiru, Duskull, and Misdreavus. I decided on Missy because the team looked really slow, which, even though I’m playing stall, is still very bad for LC.
The last choice was actually really easy for this team. Gligar is one of, if not the best pokemon in the current LC metagame, and it checks physical threats amazingly well, and provides another 19 speeder as well as a powerful attacker… basically, Gligar does it all.
After that, I looked around for what I’d need to support the Munchlax. Residual damage was the obvious answer. I took an idea from Eo’s (gen 4) team and decided on toxic spikes Tentacool, as it can set up on so much crap. Its special defense is actually higher than Munchy’s to give an example of its bulk. After that, I needed Stealth Rock, and Bronzor was the obvious choice for a stall team, outside of Hippopotas. I decided against using Hippo because of the fact that sand is quite powerful and I didn’t need to help it any. This also meant that since I wasn’t using sand, I had one option for auto weather. Snover earned a slot, but I wasn’t sure about movesets at this point.
I looked at my team up to this point, and the most obvious issue was 2 pokemon weak to fighting, one neutral, and one resist who couldn’t take physical hits that well. A ghost is the fairly obvious choice here, especially with High Jump Kick being good this gen. I had 3 choices, and that is Pururiru, Duskull, and Misdreavus. I decided on Missy because the team looked really slow, which, even though I’m playing stall, is still very bad for LC.
The last choice was actually really easy for this team. Gligar is one of, if not the best pokemon in the current LC metagame, and it checks physical threats amazingly well, and provides another 19 speeder as well as a powerful attacker… basically, Gligar does it all.
Bronzor @ Evolution Stone
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 220 HP / 8 Atk / 152 Def / 4 SAtk / 68 SDef / 12 Spd
Bold Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Psychic
- Toxic
Bronzor is a staple in LC because it has awesome defenses and lays down stealth rock incredibly consistently. This set is basically here to put up rocks and have the bulk to switch into stuff and get some damage on it, it’s also the only user of toxic I have which is very useful. I’m considering protect over earthquake on it, as the stuff it checks are all covered by the rest of the team, and getting free poison and hail damage is quite useful. Bronzor’s role is fairly well known, and it does its role very well on the team.
Potential changes: Protect over Earthquake, as there are a ton of times I find myself wanting protect, but I infrequently use EQ. It basically hits the dark/steel thing, as anything else is beaten by toxic or psychic.
Tentacool (M) @ Oran Berry/Evo Stone
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 196 HP / 76 Def / 236 SDef
Calm Nature
- Toxic Spikes
- Protect
- Surf
- Rapid Spin
Tentacool is a fantastic choice for a LC stall team. It clears up toxic spikes (even though I only have one pokemon who gives a shit about toxic spikes, and it has a pseudo recovery move… it’s still useful to make them waste a turn setting it up again I guess), sets up my own, and spins away rocks/spikes. The team needs a spinner to function, as my main offensive pokemon is weak to every type of hazard, and I only have one SR resist on the team. Toxic spikes are also a must. Tentacool was basically the answer to those two questions, as Pineco doesn’t really check anything and is an even worse spinner than Tenta.
The moveset is pretty much standard. Toxic spikes and spin are why I’m using it, Surf is for STAB that hits its switch ins harder than slime wave, and protect is for me needing as many users as possible. I was thinking about toxic > surf though, since I barely use it, as it does shit level damage, and toxic always helps a stall team.
The item choice may look a bit odd, but because it's a spinner, it switches into SR and Spikes a lot, and Evo Stone doesn't help at all with that. Both have their merits though.
Snover (M) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Snow Warning
EVs: 36 HP / 36 Def / 184 SAtk / 36 SDef / 200 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Blizzard
- Giga Drain
- Ice Shard
- Hidden Power [Fire]
Snover provides a couple things. It gives residual damage in the form of hail, and it gives me a halfway decent revenge killer (though not foolproof, as it’s slow) and the only priority on the team. It has a SE hit on Pururiru, which is still sort of tough to kill for the rest of the team, although tox spikes helps with that. It also counters Moguryuu, which is cool. It’s basically just my standard scarfer that every team needs.
Misdreavus (M) @ Evolution Stone
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 36 HP / 120 Def / 80 SDef / 240 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Hidden Power [Fighting]
- Shadow Ball
- Will-O-Wisp
- Pain Split
Misdreavus is an amazing pokemon. Its offensive sets judt great, and they haven’t lost any viability at all in the generation change, but this bulky missy set is fantastic for this team. It is a bulkymon, a 19 speeder, and a ghost all in one. The EVs max out speed, put a point in SpD and HP and 2 in defense, in an effort to balance out the defenses. HP Fighting is important to hit munchy and any of the LC steels that resist shadow ball (there are several). Wisp allows me to get a status on stuff like Gligar and steel/poison types who aren’t affected by toxic spikes. Split is the only recovery it gets… it sucks, but it’s the best it has. Whatever.
Missy checks so much stuff it’s not funny. You need a SE attack to 2hko it, or something with STAB and a ton of base power (hydro pump, ect.). This allows it to serve as a partial oshit button for the team when I need to get out of something, and it works fantastically. Basically, it’s here because it’s just a great pokemon and does more than a lot of other mons.
Gligar (M) @ Evolution Stone
Trait: Hyper Cutter
EVs: 236 HP / 236 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Roost
- U-turn
- Aqua Tail
For the same reason as Misdreavus, Gligar is used because it’s one of, if not the best pokemon in the metagame right now. With this spread, it’s bulky enough to stall out LO Murkrow brave birding it repeatedly with just roost. In the hail. And it still hits 19 speed. EQ is STAB, roost lets it stall crap while piling up hail damage, U-Turn lets me get to something to set up or hit it in the face, or generally counter it, and Aqua Tail is just kind of there. Might replace it with toxic, as it’s sort of useless. EVs max out speed for 19 which is so very useful and max hp for more bulk, as Gligar doesn’t need the 3 extra attack points a lot (they help ofc, just no always needed).
Munchlax (M) @ Evolution Stone
Trait: Pickup
EVs: 76 HP / 196 Def / 236 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Stockpile
- Whirlwind
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
This is the set the team was build around. It has surprise value going for it… and the fact that it’s incredibly bulky. At +3, literally nothing (barring Meditite's High Jump Kick) in the metagame 2hkoes it without some kind of boost. And setting up on it is risky because it has whirlwind, which when combined with Stealth Rock, Toxic Spikes, and hail damage, literally lets it stall out entire teams. The set plays in a really straightforward manner; if you are awake, stockpile until they will KO you. If you’re asleep, sleep talk until +3 and then whirlwind spam until you've killed everything on their team that can't recover HP through toxic spikes, stealth rock damage, and hail damage (I've frequently killed bronzors using just hail damage). For an example of its bulk, at +3 Scarf Machop's Dynamicpunch does 8 damage, or 30%. Misdreavus' Life Orbed Hidden Power Fighting does 5 damage, or 16%.
The sett admittedly has some issues. Munchy is slow as balls, so a faster roarer will always phaze it. Taunt also completely shuts it down (I run bold and 0 attack ivs for that reason). Leech seed does a number to the set too, as it frequently relies on stealth rock damage to net kills. However, huge potential flaws in the set aren’t as big of issues because neither roar, nor taunt are frequently used at all, while leech seed is on a minority of teams at best, and the sets' pros more than make up for its cons.
That’s my team. I’ve been consistently top 5 on both ladders (Wifi and Dream World) since I made the team. At the time of this posting, I have like a 100 point lead on the next closest person on the DW ladder (the ladder has no bans), and it’s still been successful. The point I’m trying to make by posting this team is that Evo Stone is broken, when a pokemon can stall out the metagame with such a simple set. Imo, I don’t think the fact that stall is usable in Little Cup is all that bad. I think the fact that a single set can be so incredibly dominating and near-impossible to stop without a few specific counters (strong fighting types) is what’s wrong with the item.
Thanks for reading this, rate/hate/steal.