Carvanha (Analysis)

[iss]

#7 :D

http://veekun.com/dex/pokemon/carvanha

Status: Done

Overview:

-Carvanha hasn’t changed much since Gen IV
-Still a glass cannon
-Substitute is still its best set
-Croagunk still destroys it

[SET]
name: SubVanha
move 1: Substitute
move 2: Crunch
move 3: Aqua Jet
move 4: Waterfall / Zen Headbutt
item: Life Orb
nature: Jolly
evs: 196 Atk / 36 Def / 36 SpD / 236 Spe

Set Comments:

-2HKOes almost everything in Little Cup
-Has 19 Attack and 16 Speed
-Substitute protects Carvanha’s frail defenses and allows it to fire off attacks without fear of retribution
-Crunch is a STAB attack that is Carvanha’s main source of power
-Aqua Jet is very strong and is very useful in Little Cup
-Waterfall is a backup STAB and can KO Pokemon like Gligar and Hippopotas

Additional Comments:

-Life Orb gives Carvanha a huge boost to its offense
-Zen Headbutt can be used to kill Croagunk from behind a Substitute
-EVs give max Attack and Speed
-Carvanha runs Jolly since the output from 18 and 19 Attack is almost identical

[SET]
name: Choice Scarf
move 1: Crunch
move 2: Waterfall
move 3: Aqua Jet
move 4: Zen Headbutt / Hydro Pump
item: Choice Scarf
nature: Jolly / Naive
evs: 196 Atk / 36 Def / 36 SpD / 236 Spe

Set Comments:

-Very powerful scarfer
-Reaches 19 Attack and 24 Speed
-Crunch hits hard against Pokemon like Gastly and Misdreavus
-Waterfall hits things like SD Gligar for massive damage
-Aqua Jet is used for revenge kills and faster scarfers
-Zen Headbutt can be used to kill Croagunk on the switch

Additional Comments:


-Hydro Pump can be used to hit switch-ins hard
-EVs max Attack and Speed
-Jolly is used for the same reason
-Use Naïve if you are using Hydro Pump- also take the EV

Team Options:

-Entry hazard support is helpful to assist Carvanha in its sweep
-Gligar is helpful to take out Croagunk
-Wynaut helps Croagunk set up and also can take out Croagunk

Optional Changes:

-Carvanha has access to Hydro Pump, Ice Beam, and Dark Pulse and can run a special or mixed set
-Boiling Water could be used for the burn chance but Carvanha is better off beating stuff down
-Agility could be used for a sweeping set

Counters:

-If Carvanha does not have a Substitute, faster Pokemon that can take an Aqua Jet can easily kill it
-Croagunk can take down Carvanha if Croagunk lacks a Substitute or Zen Headbutt
-The Scarf set is destroyed by faster Scarfers and Croagunk

Dream World:

-Speed Boost is amazing for Carvanha- it can Protect once and then outspeed most of Little Cup. Carvanha might even be broken with Speed Boost.

 

[iss]

This is done.

 

[(makeup)]

None of the sets have abilities. Since speed boost has been released, shouldn't that be the ability?

 

[Darkamber8828]

Vanha isn't bad as a lead. Speed Boost+Protect+AJ+Crunch+ZHB lets you get past a lot of stuff. Rough Skin works too.

Vanha seems like it'd have problems with Zuruggu. Without Waterfall. More than other fighting types.

 

[IcyMan28]

Speed Boost Carvanha has been released already, so the DW section can be removed and Speed Boost made the standard ability on most sets.

 

[(makeup)]

How is Tesshiido not even mentioned as a counter. Resists Water/Dark and rapes all sets with Bullet Seed, which even brakes SubVanna's sub.

-Croagunk can take down Carvanha if Croagunk lacks a Substitute or Zen Headbutt

wut

 

[Forte.EXE]

Should be mentioned in the write-up that Zen Headbutt is incompatible with Speed Boost, but Croagunk will be 2HKOed by Adamant Crunch.

 

[(makeup)]

Should be mentioned in the write-up that Zen Headbutt is incompatible with Speed Boost, but Croagunk will be 2HKOed by Adamant Crunch.

I don't really think you should mention that Croagunk is 2HKOed by Adamant Crunch cause...Croagunk @ Life Orb (188 EVs, Neutral Nature) Vacuum Wave vs Carvanha @ Life Orb (0/0 EVs, Neutral Nature): 114.2 - 142.8% (24 - 30 HP). Even with the lowest possible damage roll, it's a more than solid OHKO. Carvanha can't take Croagunk, Zen Headbutt or not, as it can't even get an attack down due to Vacuum Wave having +1 priority (and Carvahna's only priority attack can't touch Dry Skin Croagunk.)

 

[Forte.EXE]

I don't really think you should mention that Croagunk is 2HKOed by Adamant Crunch cause...Croagunk @ Life Orb (188 EVs, Neutral Nature) Vacuum Wave vs Carvanha @ Life Orb (0/0 EVs, Neutral Nature): 114.2 - 142.8% (24 - 30 HP). Even with the lowest possible damage roll, it's a more than solid OHKO. Carvanha can't take Croagunk, Zen Headbutt or not, as it can't even get an attack down due to Vacuum Wave having +1 priority (and Carvahna's only priority attack can't touch Dry Skin Croagunk.)

Yes, but Croagunk can't switch into a Crunch, which is the point I'm trying to make. That, and that as long as you hit Croagunk once with Crunch on the switch-in, if that's their only counter to Carvanha then you could finish off the team with it.

 

[(makeup)]

Yes it can. It can switch into Crunch, take it, then OHKO with priority. Plus, you can always lure a Water-type attack with good prediction. Not trying to start an arguement, but Croagunk is a 100% solid counter to Carvanha, as long as you have any prediction at all.

 

[comatthew6]

I have solid experience with Carvanha so I'll put my two cents into this argument.

1. Croagunk beats Carvanha 100% of the time if Carvanha isn't running Return/Frustration or ZHB.
2. Even if Carvanha does have Substitute but does not run ZHB, Croagunk still wins (assuming Carvanha stays in) because of priority in Vacuum Wave.

EDIT: someone should get Vader in on this.

 

[Darkamber8828]

What about HP Psychic? Carvanha has a very usable SpA, and I'm sure it would kill even with Adamant.

It isn't very useful on other fighting-types, though...

 

[(makeup)]

The thing with keeping your sub though is Carvanha is weak to both U-turn and Volt Change (although it doesn't matter; it could resist them and still lose its subs) so they can just U-turn / Volt Change to Croagunk to take the Waterfall / Crunch / Not ZHB and rape you with VW.

 

[BlocksRcool]

Minor nitpick, but you say that Vanha hits 19 attack on most of the sets despite running a speed boosting nature (which results in 18 attack).

 

[Darkamber8828]

The thing with keeping your sub though is Carvanha is weak to both U-turn and Volt Change (although it doesn't matter; it could resist them and still lose its subs) so they can just U-turn / Volt Change to Croagunk to take the Waterfall / Crunch / Not ZHB and rape you with VW.

The thing about doing that is that Carvanha can Protect on scarfers to get to +2, as well as scout what they're planning to do, as well as stall out another turn of sandstorm/hail/tspikes. Pokemon like Gligar and Chinchou get killed by Waterfall and Crunch, before they can even attack.

Of course, mindgames ensue about if they're going to switch to Croagunk or not.