BW2 In-Game Tier List Discussion [Updated 7/24]

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I'm just going to assume that Magmar is inferior to nearly all other fire types in Black 2 as you are stuck with the frail Magby and learns almost nothing other than fire type moves by level.
 

breh

強いだね
I'm just going to assume that Magmar is inferior to nearly all other fire types in Black 2 as you are stuck with the frail Magby and learns almost nothing other than fire type moves by level.
I wouldn't be so quick to judge, actually.

Although it does seem rather poor, if my experience with Electabuzz has shown me anything, it's that Eviolited <Pokemon that didn't evolve in a past generation and was actually ok in said generation> is pretty OK, actually. 100 base SpA is good enough, it gets Flame Burst early on (which is a pretty nice STAB move as far as STAB moves go), and gets Will-o-wisp and (later) Fire Blast and Psychic in Undella. I can't be sure (this is theorymon after all), but it doesn't look that bad; if I was able to get through the game with Electabuzz (granted, it wasn't the most entertaining mon to use, considering it has nothing but Electric-type moves until Psychic...) then somebody else could theoretically do the same with Magmar.
 
Doesn't he learn Low Kick ?
And you can use your shards for Ice Punch for Boltbeam coverage ...

And for Psyduck, I didn't use one in B2W2, but I think you are hard on him, he has good stats / movepool and good water mons are rare
 
Why did Venepide suddenly jump to second place in the "most traded" on the GTS? Is it beacause it is secretly amazing in game? (I say this because Magnemite is now #1 on the GTS, most traded for other Magnemites, Riolu, and Eevee, clearly an effect of in game BW2 trades.)

Also, there is 11 pages of discussion but no list? Can we at least draft one?
 
Why did Venepide suddenly jump to second place in the "most traded" on the GTS? Is it beacause it is secretly amazing in game? (I say this because Magnemite is now #1 on the GTS, most traded for other Magnemites, Riolu, and Eevee, clearly an effect of in game BW2 trades.)

Also, there is 11 pages of discussion but no list? Can we at least draft one?
Japanese players are mass-trading Magnemite in order to acquire as many NPCs as possible in their Join Avenue. It has nothing to do with how useful it is. I'd imagine Venipede is simply enjoying a similar memetic popularity.
 
Just wondering, only seen two references to Heracross (and no responses)-
Is it the consensus that it is High-Top?
 

Stellar

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Here is a link to the current rankings. Every post that contained an actual ranking (Top, High, etc.) was counted.

Here is a quick guide to the spreadsheet:

Column A: Name
Column B: # of votes for Bottom
Column C: # of votes for Low
Column D # of votes for Mid
Column E: # of votes for High
Column F: # of votes for Top
Column G: Total Point Value [=(B*1+C*2+D*3+E*4+F*5)]
Column H: Total # of votes
Column I: Average Rank (Weighted) [=G/H]
Column J: Final (Conservative) Rank [=FLOOR(I,1)]
  • Top = 5
  • High = 4
  • Mid = 3
  • Low = 2
  • Bottom = 1
Column K: Verified? (If # of votes >=3, YES)

I am only going to add a Pokemon to the tier list if it has received at least three votes. Any Pokemon that has a 0 in the Verified? column needs more votes.

Here is a link to the current tier list.
 
Just wondering, only seen two references to Heracross (and no responses)-
Is it the consensus that it is High-Top?
Even without Guts, he:
- sweeps 99% of Elesa's gym with Dig. That 1% being Emolga.
- sweeps Clay's gym between Brick Break and Bug Bite
- not so useful against Skyla, I admit
- sweeps Drayden's gym with Close Combat
- does the same for most of 8th gym, with the exception of Jellicent (water/flying types die to Rock Slide)
- single-handedly defeats the whole Team Plasma except maybe Ghestis (Black Kyurem one shotted by CC)
- sweeps 3 out of 4 of Elite Four. Can have trouble if Megahorn misses too much on Caitlin though
- wreaks havoc on the Champion too

If that's not a Top material pokemon I don't know what is.
 

Stellar

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If you believe I missed your vote, leave me a VM with a link to your post. I am not going to update the spreadsheet continuously. I will probably update it around once a week.
 

breh

強いだね
On the topic of Volcarona, it should be noted that everybody seems to vote it mid after we learned that you can get those free 10 shards at Nimbasa for Signal Beam. Before that, everybody was going through the game with Struggle Bug and Ember until Silver Wind, lol. It's pretty close to mid to begin with.

Oh, and why exactly is Mareep in high and Sandile in mid? If anything, I feel like those two should be switched.

For the process of vote assurance, you could try using a check for standard deviation (if standard deviation / number of votes is less than an arbitrary constant (1/3, for example), then the rank is set)
 

Stellar

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The tiers can change, the ones listed in the second post aren't set in stone; they are simply the Pokemon that have at least three votes. You can view the spreadsheet if you are wondering about the voting distribution.
 
I didn't understand how we contribute to this file Stellar ...

My suggestions : (Pokemon / Current rank / My comment)


Mareep 4 -> 3
A bit overated too. Learns his coverage moves too late
Tepig 3 -> 4 (or Oshawott going to 4 -> 3)
For me, Oshawott are Tepig have to be in the same tier …
Petilil 4 (Separate the ingame trade)
Only the in game trade. The normal one is 3 at best (Very bad coverage)
Scraggy 5 -> 4
Overrated … 4 would be enough. We lose the Ice gym so he's less useful and Heracross is far better.
Riolu 3 -> 4
Steel Stype around 3rd gym ? Force Palm / Ice Punch / Dig make it very easy for most of the game. I suggest 4
Dunsparce 3 -> 2
Too hard to get … Should be lower
Sandile 3 -> 4
Very underated. I Mine was my powerhouse … I suggest 4
Psyduck 1 -> 2
When I see others 'rank 1', it's terrible …
 

Stellar

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You just post with your BW2 experiences in this thread. The file is just a way for me to keep track of people's opinions. You can't edit it.
 
From my experiences (1-1/2 playthroughs on norm, now this one im doing on challenge):

Magnemite - Top
Scraggy - Top
Axew - middle
Darumaka - top (Teach rock smash when u get it, and itll solo burgh and be good beyond)
Mareep - High
Oshawott - high
Zorua - havent used
Drilbur - high/top
Espeon - high
Heracross - Havent used but picking one up now, from what i hear should prolly be top
Joltik - high
Mandibuzz - low
Minccino - mid (Great coverage, but may also be a redundant team member at the point it comes in.)
Petilil - top
Piloswine - mid (if not for extreeme lateness)
Roselia- Top (comes within a few levels of toxic spikes. TS + Venoshock lets her sweep teams. just an all around good mon with good stats and moves. can aslo get slidge wave and energy ball via TM's
Sigilyph - Mid
Azurill - High (the babying required in the Azurill stage keeps it from top imo, that and you pretty much have to get a HP one. but HP marill + azumarrill are great.
Riolu - High/mid = decent stats, tho moves can be redundant with other members depending on the team. and (along with tepig) require you to get BP for Brick break for a reliable fighting stab for mid game.
Sandile - mid
Tepig - mid/high (See Riolu, only add fire punch to tutor list.)
Deerling - Great in BW1 for the normal/grass/fighting combo, havent tested it in BW2 bout should be better due to water gym. high not top due to lateness.
Ducklett- GREAT pickup if you don't have a steady water or flyer at the time. Does require a small bit of babying, (mostly just keeping it away from clay's rocks) but is great after evolution and beyond. Mid or High
Trapinch - Excellent when you get it for elsa, dies hard after that due to late evols. - Low
Growlithe - mid, Great early fire mon for non tepig choosers. looses luster when other options are available like Darumakka
Snivy - low
Volcarona - low, i got it was gonna ditch growlithe for it, but it had no good moves to speak of at the time, and they come so late..
Sandshrew- havent used. Tried to use but it seemed like a gimped Drilbur or Trapinch but that was prolly just me. Low
Sewaddle - high, Great early grass/bug type with great early stabs. Can loose appeal mid-late game when more options for the spots come available (like Heracross/Rosailia)

Anythign i didn't mention i haven't used yet at all.
 
Nice spreadsheet Stellar.

I'll second everything good about Heracross that was said above, and yes Swarm is a good ability too, although Guts is still crazy.

I started a new game with Growlithe over Darumaka... Darma is better by a long shot
 
Had the game for a week now but my progress has been slow because of a lot of work and commitments, thus I'm only up to the fourth gym, but thought I'd post to give some opinions on a few (note I'm playing Black 2 btw):

Magnemite - Top Tier
This thing has yet to fail me in terms of just being reliable and dependable no matter what the situation, whether it be the multitude of resistances to its offensive capabilities in a load of situations, especially after being captured, where Sonicboom just murders anything put in front of it. I'm getting to the point in the game where I'm starting to notice its use dropping, but I am sure it is temporary given the upcoming guantlet of Clay soon, and other members have highlighted this area as its weakest point.

Mareep - Mid Tier
I think Mareep is rather the unfortunate victim of Magnemite's usefulness. I really wanted to give Mareep a decent bash on the team, but it proved frail and didn't carry the clout that Magnemite did, and overall has not seen battling action since entering Castelia City(it's being trained via Audino's in spare time to keep levels close to main team).

Magby - Mid Tier
This is a fairly decent choice on the fire type of choice, particularly if you are considering the special side. I think if Tepig is Mid Tier, then Magby should get some consideration as its stats are stack up fairly respectably across each evolution stage, and Magmortar and Magmar have respectably higher speed stats and defenses in comparison to the starter. Even on the physical side Magmar is still easily usable and mixed sets can work to decent effect (in fact Magby is stronger on the physical side making Return a reasonable addition once happiness is increased). Coupled with a gym that it deals with favourably in general relatively soon after capture, it gives it the perfect platform for it through the remainder of the story. I will concede though there are possbly more attractive options though for others.

Riolu - High Tier
Riolu's early stages before Force Palm was somewhat of a painful experience to train through, even with Counter because of having to hope the AI would attack rather than endlessly spam stat-reducing moves. However, upon gaining Force Palm and then evolving, it has been able to hold its own in battle and remains a great offensive tool.

Lillipup - Low Tier
In the game to the first gym, Lillipup is almost invaluable. Stab Tackles off of its Attack stat at that stage is not to be underestimated, and if you attain one with Pickup, it provides amazing utility for gathering some early medicinal items. However, it's usefulness seems to dwindle very quickly after Cheren and Roxie, with more variety on offer and comparatively not hitting as hard as before. I dropped it after completing the Castelia Sewers.

Sewaddle - Low Tier
What I have seen of it, the early game requires it to be assisted in training. Bug Bite provides a useful boost in firepower, but until it evolves into Leavanny, it does require some support throughout from my experiences. Leavanny though has yet to disappoint me; its attack at this point is sizeable, but it has yet to hit any real sweet patch in proceedings (note I've yet to tackle the desert yet despite reaching Nimbasa as I wanted to attain another member before going through it.)

I'm currently using a team of:
Pignite ; Leavanny ; Drilbur ; Magnemite ; Lucario ; Petilil

I'm going to compare Leavanny and Petilil with the desert trainers, and see hoe Petilil stacks up. First impressions though are very positive. Drilbur is also proving to impress, but I've not used it sufficiently to have a defined impression on the pokemon, but with Elesa coming soon, I'm betting it will be an integral part of the strategy.
 

Mario With Lasers

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Oh, look. Mareep high.

Ergh.

While I admit I didn't use it to its fullest potential (I thought Electro Ball had 40 BP min like ThunderShock, not 60), I really, really think it was sub-par. As Mareep, it was slow as fuck, was fragile and didn't do much besides Thunder Waving the opponents. As Flaaffy, it got better for a while, but I guess I don't have to say it fared... poorly... after Castelia (lol desert). Static was a godsend to her, so she could at least be more useful. But then, Driftveil came and I found Joltik and lol screw with Flaaffy.

I believe it would fare a LOT better if I used T-Wave + Electro Ball all the time (with only 10 PP?) but, from my experiences, it's between Bottom and Low. Probably Low, considering Electro Ball. But with Magnemite and Joltik and maybe Elekid in White???, I wouldn't put a finger on Mareep anymore.
 

breh

強いだね
Okay, I've dropped Seviper much as a I did Flareon last game...

Seviper seems good enough at first glance. Its attacking stats are not shabby (100/100 is OK) and the rest of its stats are good enough for ingame, right? Nope. Seviper is really quite frail, or at least more frail than you'd expect, and has little to make up for it. Unlike Arbok, which gets Intimidate to give it some immediate physical bulk, Seviper is stuck with Shed Skin, which is nice but arguably useless most of the time considering that it can't get poisoned...

If you've ever used any Poison-type in the BW2 maingame, you can also infer another problem - a serious lack of STAB. Every single Poison-type TM - every single one bar Venoshock - is gone from the maingame and stuck in PWT or postgame. This means that until level 42, you are stuck with nothing but Poison Fang / Night Slash / Dig for Seviper, which is, frankly, lackluster. The fact that Poison Jab still fails to even 2HKO a lot of things is demoralizing.

Seviper is also one of the few members of an elite experience group known as Fluctuating, meaning that it has the second-slowest level up rate in the game. As a result, it seems to take forever to level; it doesn't succeed in battles too often, which doesn't help at all.

A 5% encounter rate isn't terrible, but is mildly annoying.

Seviper deserves Bottom, maybe Low if you're being a bit generous.

@MWL: Electabuzz is forced to use Electro Ball + Thunder Wave for most of the game. Although it's ok on Electabuzz (it pretty much means a 150 BP attack for most mons considering it's faster and a 25% chance to escape unscathed), I'd imagine it's worse on Ampharos, which is far, far slower and thus not able to get the full benefit.
 
There are so many Pokemon I want to try out... First thing I'm going to do after completing the game is starting new one.

Mareep doesn't need coverage moves that much. Charge (this +1 SpD really helps, it's fun to mess with very predictable protectfags too) or Thunder Wave + Electro Ball kills everything not Ground. Guaranteed 120 bp (Charge), sometimes 150 or even 240/300 (if both are used). Can't care about resists with this power and above average bulk. Electro Ball alone is strong too, it comes just when Thundershock becomes too weak. It ohkos everything so 10 PP isn't bad. It's quite bulky too (only Crobat gives it some competition in my team). Magnemite is top, Mareep is high, nothing wrong. Main difference between them being lower number of resistances. It's good that GameFreak decided to change level up moves of this sheep family.
I think you're trying to play it as Jolteon and are surprised that it doesn't deliver.
 

breh

強いだね
Terrakion: I was too lazy to catch it and caught it in a Master Ball (there are no roamers anyway) and it does pull its weight, but it is a bit awkward at times. Rock Slide and Sacred Sword seem to both fail to KO a lot of things (+2 Sacred Sword missed the KO on Haxorus wtf) and, as a result, it often dies in the process. I got one with a shitty Speed IV, which also meant I couldn't solo Iris with it (it might well be 0, lol). Still, it does do a good deal of work and, provided you don't get a crappy one like mine, can sweep a good bit of the Elite Four, including Iris. I'm not sure how to rank it, but I think I'd stick it in Mid.

Traded Cottonee: I was surprised to learn that after the initial shit stage with Cottonee (the little arse that trades it to you deletes Leech Seed wtf), it actually evolves into something fairly decent. Giga Drain / Charm / Psychic / Leech Seed works pretty well through most of the game, it levels up quickly, and has an oddly high attacking prowess. It's honestly comparable to normal Lilligant.

Elekid: As I've stated above, throughout the whole of the game, I ran this with Eviolite. Early on, you get by with Thundershock, later Electro Ball; I kept both Electro Ball and Thunderbolt since Electabuzz doesn't really have much else anyway outside of Psychic and tutorable Signal Beam. Electro Ball is actually pretty nice since using Thunder Wave means it is nearly always (barring Jolteon and the like) a 150 BP STAB attack. Eviolite gives it surprising bulk that I tend to underestimate; it resulted in my win against Iris, really. Thunder Wave has a static utility throughout most of the game. It's not absolutely the strongest mon, but it's good enough, really. Goes in Mid.

(Mareep does not deserve high; it is objectively worse than Electabuzz and not able to actually use Electro Ball properly to begin with. Should be stuck in Mid if anything).

Pinsir: I had nothing to really go against Elesa then realized that this thing learns Dig. Well, that was a short gym battle. It learns STAB X-Scissor then just kind of... falls off later on. All of its moves have pitiful BP, with not a single one (outside of superpower) going over 80 BP. In this respect, it really looks inferior to Heracross, which, although it has to wait for X-Scissor, gets a consistent STAB in Brick Break as early and gets the slightly weaker Bug Bite if you want to tutor it. Anyway, at the end it's ok, but not spectacular. I tried to sweep Caitlin with it and then she crit OHKOed it with Sigilyph (though I think it may have KOed regardless). Swords Dance is nice on any Pokemon and Pinsir is no exception. Mid.

Skarmory: Skarmory wishes it lived in RSE-land, a land where the mystical Roar TM comes before (or is it after?) the fourth gym. Instead, it really gets nothing until Seigaha City, where it gets something wonderful - Roost, and for a meager 6 Yellow Shards. In the leadup to Victory Road, it gets the Roar TM and finally becomes really (tbh) funny. It can sweep some teams just by abusing Spikes + Roar. It's really sad that it doesn't get Roar or Whirlwind earlier; they'd fill up an empty slot that Steel Wing just kind of... "occupies" for most of the game. At the end, it's a really good wall that is nigh unbreakable. It can wall your rival's Afrobull, for example, which is impressive considering it has Wild Charge, which 2HKOes it... if you don't Roost. Mid, actually.
 

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With all the buzz about Magnemite going on, I honestly thought you would make a separate tier for it XD.

You should.
 
You just post with your BW2 experiences in this thread. The file is just a way for me to keep track of people's opinions. You can't edit it.
Ok thanks ! So my post was enough ! :)

I will soon start a new run on Black 2, and I will try to test others things
 

Chou Toshio

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Anyone give gligar a try?

I found that he was pretty much awesome. I caught one at a whopping level 43 at the Route with Virizion, when my team were around level 45-46. The Razor claw IS ON THE SAME ROUTE AS GLIGAR, so he immediately evolves, which is ridiculous. He comes with X-Scissor, Slash, and U-Turn, and immediately gets Dig + Acrobat (TMs you have at this point) for ridiculous coverage. Don't forget you can Heart Scale for Ice Fang (to kill the Dragon Gym right after you get Gliscor), and grab Roost before the water-gym (yes, I know, the water gym sucks). Gliscor also gets Swords Dance at level 50... omg...

Ground / Flying is so handy considering the army of ground / fighting / bug / poison types in the game, and basically everything physical has a really hard time getting past Gliscor. It makes for great STAB coverage too (Acrobatics is stupid strong). Only thing I didn't like was Acrobatic's incompatibility with Lucky Egg. Acrobatics / Dig / Swords Dance / Roost basically walked me through most of the game after the Dragon gym, though I kind of regretted not having Ice Fang for some parts of the elite four (I could not activate defeatist... fuck...). It still managed to pull me the win against Iris when it set up Swords Dances on Druddigon (best it can do is non-stab Flamethrower) and killed Haxorus.
 
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