Introduction
God damn it. Why, weather. Ever since the start of Gen V, everywhere. Not that it's a bad thing - it's thrown up a good number of interesting aspects of the game to use and get used to. But it's just getting boring now. I'm as guilty as anybody of using the various toys that were given to weather teams over the however long it's been - it's been the most popular way of playing, so why not use it? Yeah, my last team was an attempt at rain offense, but I apparently gave up on it (though thank you to everybody that gave suggestions, a lot of them did help very much - I just never really posted after that, sorry), and set my mind back on the playstyle that I was best at - stall.
But more than that. I wanted the element of surprise, and to be able to use it to my advantage as often as I could. As well as looking at Pokémon that are underused in OU, I also decided to look at alternative sets for common OU Pokémon, hoping that it would give me a usable advantage when it mattered. I also knew that I wanted it to be weatherless, even if it was just to show that it's still a viable way of playing. I'd done weatherless offensive teams many times before, but only actually a stall-based team once or twice. Should be fun.
There still seems to be some kind of assumption that just because a team doesn't utilise any specific kinds of weather, it's automatically beaten by them. Though I'm probably wrong, and will most likely be picked up on this, I'm of the opinion that the best way to counter weather is to use a weatherless team, not being constrained by any typing issues that may plague weather-based teams, just having a lot more options in general. It's something that I want people to realise again, though I'm not exactly the best person to show this, nor the team the best to prove it.
I don't ladder, I don't enter tournaments, I don't do anything like that, so I have no rating number to give any of you nor a peak on any ladder to help brag about the team's success (honestly, there's not a whole lot anyway). The team's nothing special. It's not game-breaking, it's not going to peak in the top 2,000,000 of wherever I might ladder, nothing like that. Which is why I'm posting it. I'm bad at teambuilding, I use stupid Pokémon - I need help.
Though this isn't my first RMT here, as I mentioned, it's the team that I've been working on for the longest, definitely - at least 3 months now - and there have been a good number of changes to the lineup in that time. As it stands now, it might not be the version that I'm most comfortable using, but it's the version that seems to be doing the most well against a variety of other teams.
Teambuilding
This is where I started. Gastrodon. Right off the bat I knew that I wanted to be able to take on as many different forms of weather as I could - of course, it's a weatherless stall team - and Gastrodon immediately sprung to mind as a way of beating the rain. As I mentioned in my previous RMT, I always have problems with VoltTurn, which Gastrodon also stops by walling Rotom-W, assuming they don't carry the dreaded and fairly uncommon Hidden Power [Grass]. One weakness to Grass-type attacks, easily covered. Seemingly a good base to start a team on.
Now, wanting to start covering weaknesses right away, I go for Skarmory, with the two of these Pokémon covering each other's weaknesses perfectly. This also gave me entry hazards to use, which are crucial on a stall team (obviously). There's honestly not much else to say here.
Rapid Spin, vital. Pretty much everyone and their mother carries at least Stealth Rock on a team, which I know would be a problem somewhere along the line. While it's a stall team, I still wanted a little offensive presence, which Starmie can provide. I decided to look over Life Orb for the set, though, anticipating that I'm going to want to bring it in a good number of times, especially when facing opposing stall, so I go for Leftovers and Recovery. Looking good so far.
At this point, it was clear that sun teams would be giving me trouble - a Venusaur with HP [Fire] or a Victreebel with Weather Ball would hit all three for super-effective damage, which I did not want. Heatran seemed like it could wall anything like that bar mixed Venusaur or HP [Ground] Volcarona (though I ran an Air Balloon set, so that wasn't a huge threat immediately). Two Steel-types looked good enough, so I didn't add any more. Fuck Dragon-types.
Speaking of Dragon-types, here she is. SubCM Latias came to me while I was thinking of a way to end the battle, and decided that she would be the best late-game sweeper for me. Switch in on something that doesn't hurt, Sub up, boost, spam Dragon Pulse. Simple, effective, and it worked.
And then I needed something that could take Special hits. Preferably something that could heal, and heal status conditions that I hated more than anything else. Completing the trio of Psychic-types that I didn't realise was a problem at the time (my thought process was effectively "fuck Dragon-types, fuck Dragon-types, fuck Fighting-types, fuck Fighting-types"), was Celebi. Could take hits well, could dish out painful Leaf Storms, could heal and Heal Bell others.
Did that team go well? Yes, actually. But it had flaws. Many, many flaws. For one, Reuniclus and Hydreigon shit all over it. That was something that I hated. Secondly, I had nothing at all to beat Blissey with bar gradually wearing it down through entry hazards, Whirlwind and the odd Brave Bird from Skarmory. Not only that, but I also had all of the worst days VS SubDisable Gengar. Not ideal, let's be honest here. It needed fixing, obviously, so I sat down and tried to do just that.
One, I needed to fix that god awful weakness to Ghost-types and Dark-types. Starmie was out. It was good, but not that good. Tentacruel came in as its replacement, being another way this team can (semi) handle VoltTurn - it could just about manage to shrug off Scizor's U-Turns, I guess. It also meant that I could rely on Celebi less to clear hazards, since it automatically gets rid of Toxic Spikes.
Because of that, I then decided that Celebi could be the next to go. Forming a SkarmChans core (or whatever it's called, who cares), Chansey bought the ability to take many more hits than Celebi, while still being able to heal well and heal the rest of the team if I decided to go in that direction. While Blissey was indeed another choice, and maybe a smarter one since I couldn't guarantee that sandstorm or hail wouldn't pop up (Chansey's lack of every-turn recovery hurts here), the extra bulk that it offered was too good to pass up.
With nothing being able to do a thing if I somehow let the opponent set up with something like DDNite (I just had to hope that I could somehow get lucky with a weak attack, or hope that I already had Latias behind a Sub), I knew I needed to face that next. It seemed to be physical attackers that screwed me over more than anything (Chansey could still somewhat handle CM sets), so I wanted something that could a) Taunt and b) burn.
Sableye. A stupid choice? Maybe. A bad one? Not really. Prankster Sableye, in my opinion, is one of the most underrated Pokémon in the game. Only two Pokémon are able to Taunt it before it Taunts them - Tornadus-I and Whimsicott, neither of which are seen as much as they could be. Prankster gives it priority Will-o-Wisp, Recovery, Taunt, every status attack in the game. Hell, you people know what Prankster does. Honestly great typing also gave me a check against Reuniclus - sets that lack Shadow Ball can't hit it at all - which the team sorely needed.
By this point in the team's history, at some time I'd switched Heatran's set to TormenTran - after adding Chansey, I assume (it was able to take on Vocarona well, so why not). Sableye then replaced Heatran, me figuring that they would both serve a vaguely similar role in shutting down opponent's Pokémon.
The team was then becoming more and more focused on stalling the opponent out rather than doing any real damage through attacks, so I looked towards Latias once again. The rest of the team tended to do well in stalling until the very end, not giving Latias much of a chance to do its job, so I ended up replacing her too. The Chansey set I was using at the time lacked Wish and Protect, instead focusing on surviving by itself for as long as possible, not supporting the team. I wanted to fix that. I wanted to fix everything.
I looked for Pokémon that could learn Wish. I'll be honest, there weren't many at all. Then I remembered what I wanted to do with the team. The element of surprise. Sableye provided that well, yes - seriously, why is it so uncommon - but there could be more. Salamence learned Wish. I went for it. Resisting Fighting-type attacks and having Intimidate as an ability was great for me, and the surprise factor of the set almost always gave me an advantage. It was great, and the team was starting to take shape.
Okay so Chansey and Blissey were still giving me problems. I don't think I can change that at all, so the seemingly best option was to go back to Starmie and instead have Psyshock somewhere in the set. Most members of the team can beat Blissey or Chansey in a one-on-one situation, but I at least wanted something that can damage it throughout the battle. Starmie. Starmie. More Starmie. Damn you, Starmie. Stop coming back. Seriously.
Okay, this was honestly the hardest choice that I had to make. By now, only two Pokémon had been a constant on the team - Gastrodon and Skarmory. However, I was still being beaten by boosting sweepers - the main of which was CM Reuniclus, which I did not want. Sableye was a check, yes, but that's all. Quagsire can at least slowly whittle its HP down, or at least PP stall it to death. With Sableye, Chansey and Quagsire, my Reuniclus problems aren't quite solved, but they're not team-breaking. I'm still iffy about this change, I'll be honest. I'm considering bringing it back.
One final change, courtesy of PK Gaming. Tornadus-T was still giving me trouble, not having anything on the team that could outspeed it, and only Chansey being able to take it on even remotely (it can tank a Superpower and heal it off, that's as far as that goes). It was mentioned to me that every member of the team had a way of recovering 50% of their total HP by themselves, something that I'd actually not picked up on at all, so having a FATMence on the team seemed... rather silly, to be honest.
Apologies for the long-ass team building process and explanation. Like I said, the team's been in the making for at least 3 months, and I wanted to cover the process as well as I could. I think I did well with that.
At a Glance
In-depth
Madness @ Leftovers
Prankster | Calm (+SDef, -Atk)
252 HP / 120 Def / 136 SDef
Will-o-Wisp | Taunt | Recover | Night Shade
In-depth
Madness @ Leftovers
Prankster | Calm (+SDef, -Atk)
252 HP / 120 Def / 136 SDef
Will-o-Wisp | Taunt | Recover | Night Shade
I love using underused Pokémon, and Sableye is definitely there. Spin-blocker, fast status conditions, the ability to Taunt every Pokémon in the game (bar faster Prankster and Magic Bounce), general bulky Ghost-type. Sableye fulfils a lot of roles that this team probably couldn't do without. Though nowhere near the best Ghost-type to use - nor anywhere near the best Pokémon - it's one of the most important on the team. I almost always send this gal out first, it being able to shut down any and all opposing Pokémon that wish to inflict status or set up entry hazards, as well as having the amazing ability to cripple hard-hitting Pokémon such as Landorus or Terrakion with Will-o-Wisp - extremely useful if Skarmory or Quagsire are weakened, or if I wish to keep them healthy. Thought not the bulkiest Pokémon ever, it manages to stay alive for a startling number of turns with priority Recover.
Walls Pokémon that will threaten me such as Reuniclus and Sigilyph, with Snarl also hitting them for decent damage while lowering their SpAtk stat, essentially doing the same job for special attackers that Will-o-Wisp does for physical Pokémon. While Foul Play may seem to be a better choice, being able to hit Pokémon that sport a higher Attack stat harder, that's not what this team does. This Sableye stalls, not focusing on doing much damage at all, just hang around for as long as it can. Snarl does its job just fine.
While it can hit Reuniclus for some damage, however, if it carries Shadow Ball then there might be trouble. The SpDef drop chance isn't a huge concern, as I can Recover easily and lower its SpAtk back, but I am known to take chances when it comes to critical hits - if a Reuniclus gets a good hit like that on me, then it's free to wall most of everything else I have (I'm in real bad news if it carries Psyshock for Chansey).
I'm not too sure what could replace this Sableye, as I don't think anything else does its job as well as it. Jellicent's a possibility, however it would add another weakness to Electric-type attacks that I don't think I can afford. Perhaps a SubSplit or SubDisable Gengar to do another good job of jamming the target, but I'm happy with leaving it as it is.
Changes:
- Night Shade > Snarl, suggested by Trinitrotoluene.
Animals @ Leftovers
Unaware | Bold (+Def, -Atk)
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
Earthquake | Recover | Toxic | Scald
I hesitate to say that this is my sure-fire way of beating Gliscor, but it's the closest I can think of. Skarmory can take anything it throws at me, but can't do much damage at all. At least Quagsire can hit it with a Scald or two while it whittles away at my HP. Stockpile boosts Quagsire's defences to levels bordering on obscene, which becomes even worse for the opponent when they realise that their +6 Dragonite it barely scratching it. Hilarious for me, though. Quagsire's been the reason for a good number of ragequits. It never gets old.
This thing does a great job against Terrakion and Landorus, as well as Thundurus-T to an extent (I lose VS Grass Knot, though). I must admit I'm missing the immunity to Water-type attacks that Gastrodon gave the team, and I've noticed a drop in performance against rain-based teams as a result of adding in Quagsire, but overall it seems to do just as well as the aforementioned sea slug.
As I've mentioned a couple of times, I do consider replacing it with Gastrodon once again, but if I keep this set I'd also consider Earthquake over Stockpile, though it would lose a lot of its bulk - the number of opportunities that Quagsire gets to set up Stockpile borders on ridiculous.
Changes:
- Earthquake > Stockpile, suggested by A l e x a n d e r.
- Relaxed > Bold, suggested by SA1TS.
Prelude @ Leftovers
Sturdy | Impish (+Def, -SAtk)
252 HP / 240 Def / 16 Spd
Brave Bird | Roost | Whirlwind | Spikes
What the hell am I supposed to say here? It's a standard god damn Skarmory. For three generations, one of the best at its role of being a big metal bird. Along with Chansey and Quagsire, it forms a great physically defensive core, all of them covering each other's weaknesses nearly perfectly. Dragon-types that threaten the rest of the team are dealt with by this thing well, giving it time to Roost and set up Spikes against an Outrage. While it might not wall boosting physical attackers such as BU Conkeldurr or DD/BU Scrafty, it can easily either hit them, phase them out or hand them over to Quagsire to be taken care of slowly and painfully.
Again, handles Landorus and Terrakion well - between it and Quagsire, that's pretty much a non-issue here - though Ferrothorn can still be an issue. The team only seems to have one real way of being able to deal with the spiked iron ball of doom, and that falls to Salamence, which I don't like. Taunt somewhere on this set could be very much welcome, though I'm not sure what I'd replace. My first guess would be Brave Bird, as I'm able to do damage to the mentioned Pokémon with Quagsire well.
As far as replacing the Pokémon entirely goes, I'd welcome a Gliscor to the team with open arms, though I'd then be without Spikes, which I really do not like the idea of - a stall team with the only entry hazard being Stealth Rock doesn't strike me as ideal, even if I am firing out status conditions left, right and center.
Survival @ Eviolite
Natural Cure | Bold (+Def, -Atk)
120 HP / 252 Def / 136 SDef
Stealth Rock | Softboiled | Seismic Toss | Aromatherapy
This team's synergy isn't perfect - something that always gets to me is the fact that I have two Pokémon weak to Electric-type attacks, but only one immunity - but this girl is the reason that I don't obsess over it as much as I maybe used to do. Most Electric-type attacks are special, that's kind of a fact here - the only physical Electric-type attack I can name right off the top of my head is Wild Charge and whatever it is that Zekrom and Victini have (Fusion Bolt or something?).
This lone-standing Chansey set was never a favourite of mine - I always like having a Wish Chansey/Blissey and Aromatherapy on the team, a role that Celebi before it provided (kinda) - but it's definitely helpful. Nearing the end of the game, chances are that I'd be able to win one-on-one against a Pokémon that the opponent has, since I'm able to take out physical attackers easier than special attackers, so it's not a lost battle as soon as Chansey's the last one standing. It gets a lot of chances to set up Stealth Rock through the game, as well as Toxic any unfortunate switch-ins due to the number of switches that it prompts (it's pretty stupid, almost forces as many as Landorus-T).
Was never a fan of giving Chansey or Blissey max EVs in HP, but it really needs it - I can take a powerful hit from Genesect if needs be (though burning it beforehand would be a huge help). Works well with Sableye to achieve this, with one weakness between them which is covered easily. Getting the burn on Genesect can be extremely helpful to make sure that I'm not raped by U-Turn.
I am not going to get rid of Chansey. I might replace it with Blissey, but it's essentially the same thing. Without Blissey or Chansey, this team gets swept by Latios, Volcarona, Rotom-W, you name it.
Changes:
- 120 HP / 252 Def / 136 SpD > 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef, suggested by Joeyboy.
- Aromatherapy > Toxic, suggested by Joeyboy.
Panic Station Genderless @ Leftovers
Serene Grace | Careful (+SDef, -SAtk)
252 HP / 224 SDef / 32 Spd
Iron Head | Body Slam | Wish | Protect
On the advice of PK Gaming, I replaced my Salamence with Jirachi. The team had problems with Tornadus-T, with only Chansey being able to do anything against a mixed set (which wasn't a whole lot anyway), but this Jirachi does a better job of countering it than anything here could dream of. As people mentioned, every member of the team could already heal themselves for 50% of their total HP, which I hadn't picked up on at all (embarrassingly), so Salamence being there as being a way of passing around healing suddenly seemed stupid.
What else is there really to say about this set? It's Jirachi. It's annoying. It's going to piss so many people off for years to come, and that's a truly amusing thought. PK Gaming was right in saying that it does a lot more for the team than Salamence could - Salamence wasn't there for coverage reasons at all, nor was it there to wall anything in particular. It was there for surprise factor, which, I admit, might not have been the best road to take with the team.
Changes:
- Jirachi > Salamence, suggested by PK Gaming.
Unsustainable @ Leftovers
Intimidate | Bold (+Def, -Atk)
252 HP / 240 Def / 16 SAtk
Wish | Protect | Dragon Tail | Fire Blast
Wish Salamence! The hypest of Salamence sets! Why this isn't used more, I'll never know. My main switch-in to Fighting-types, even though most tend to carry Rock-types moves too - it can (probably) tank a -1 Rock Slide or whatever, Wish up and either switch out or stay in (when I expect a switch) for free HP. Also this team's main way of dealing with Ferrothorn outside throwing Seismic Tosses at it - I've not done damage calcs since changing Fire Blast from Flamethrower, but the latter cleanly 2HKOs, so it can't be bad.
This slot would be taken with a Dragonite spread - possibly ParaShuffle - but the team really needs a way to deal with Ferrothorn, which this gives. Intimidate forces a good number of switches for the opponent, but I need to be careful around opposing Tyranitar - Ice Beam from a standard mixed set does around 97%, if I remember correctly. If played well (and if the opponent flat-out refuses to switch, I can switch and pivot around Salamence to rack up maybe two Intimidate cuts, paving a way for some healings.
Changes:
- Protect > Roost, suggested by A l e x a n d e r.
Supremacy Genderless @ Leftovers
Natural Cure | Timid (+Spd, -Atk)
252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
Rapid Spin | Scald | Ice Beam | Recover
Finally, this has taken long enough. This team is going to hate opposing stall teams and entry hazards, so this is the answer. Tentacruel wasn't giving the team enough offensive presence, and I had huge troubles with Chansey and Blissey, which Starmie seems to be able to take on semi-well, as well as being able to Recover when needed. Being able to 2HKO 252/252/4 Blissey is definitely a godsend, though most members of the team are able to take it down if it's the last Pokémon the opponent has.
Choosing the one attack other than Psyshock is definitely tricky, and I have gone for Hydro Pump for now solely for STAB purposes. Ice Beam is tempting, and I may end up going with it since this team has bad times with most Dragon-types. Though it loses to Jellicent due to lacking Thunderbolt, other members of the team (Chansey) are perfectly capable (Chansey) of taking it down in a stall war situation (Chansey).
Changes:
- 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe > 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd, suggested by Joeyboy.
- Scald > Hydro Pump, suggested by Joeyboy.
- Ice Beam > Psyshock, suggested by PK Gaming.
Look Again
Last Words
Last Words
Well, what can I say. This has been so much typing, and I'm sorry to anybody that's read all of this. I really didn't mean to get carried away and type this much, but hey. I enjoyed it anyway. I know it's not the ideal stall team, and I use some weird Pokémon (Sableye and Quagsire, I feel bad for even using them at all), but it's a team that's doing well for me. That's not that normal with me, if I'm honest - I'm actually really bad at this game. Thanks for reading, and I'm looking forward to seeing any suggestions.
Importable
PHP:
Madness (Sableye) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 120 Def / 136 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Will-O-Wisp
- Taunt
- Recover
- Night Shade
Animals (Quagsire) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Earthquake
- Recover
- Toxic
- Scald
Prelude (Skarmory) (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 240 Def / 16 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Brave Bird
- Roost
- Whirlwind
- Spikes
Survival (Chansey) (F) @ Eviolite
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 120 HP / 252 Def / 136 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Stealth Rock
- Softboiled
- Seismic Toss
- Aromatherapy
Panic Station (Jirachi) @ Leftovers
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 224 SDef / 32 Spd
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Iron Head
- Body Slam
- Wish
- Protect
Supremacy (Starmie) @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Rapid Spin
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Recover