2012 USA Election Thread: Obama projected winner

Who are you going to vote for in the 2012 Election?

  • Barack Obama

    Votes: 221 54.8%
  • Ron Paul

    Votes: 44 10.9%
  • Mitt Romney

    Votes: 37 9.2%
  • Jill Stein

    Votes: 85 21.1%
  • Vermin Supreme

    Votes: 11 2.7%
  • Gary Johnson

    Votes: 5 1.2%

  • Total voters
    403
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I would encourage liberals to vote for Jill Stein and conservatives to vote for Gary Johnson. Even though it won't make much of a difference, at least it would send a message to people and maybe a third party will win in the extremely far-off future. If you want to learn more about the third party candidates, procon.org seems like a decent resource to me.

Jill Stein

Gary Johnson

Sorry if this is irrelevant to the topic at hand; it just seems no one has brought it up yet, so I might as well.
 
Even though it is wrong, I sometimes think we should have literacy test, except everyone takes it this time. smh
Why do you think Kennedy beat Nixon? It's not like people just became stupid for this election, they've been this stupid for over 50 years. What about the fact that in 2008, the year that had record African-American voter turnout, 20% of those African-American voters said race was "the single most important factor" for who they voted for. (Don't call me a racist, it's just statistics. There were probably just as many white/asian/whatever people who didn't vote for Obama because he was black, they may have just not been as honest on the survey.)
 
Why do you think Kennedy beat Nixon? It's not like people just became stupid for this election, they've been this stupid for over 50 years. What about the fact that in 2008, the year that had record African-American voter turnout, 20% of those African-American voters said race was "the single most important factor" for who they voted for. (Don't call me a racist, it's just statistics. There were probably just as many white/asian/whatever people who didn't vote for Obama because he was black, they may have just not been as honest on the survey.)
Ok, I don't really see the point of your response? I also disagreed with people voting for or against Obama just because he's black, I thought that was pretty obvious....
 
I would consider myself an conservative independent as well (I don't really like Mitt either), but I just think it's funny how Democrats just eat up President Obama's false promises and plans.
Personally I'd be considered way left in America mostly due to my stance on personal issues (abortion, gay marriage, drug legislation, and prostitution) rather than anything else.

My economic stance isn't aligned with either side -- basically I think Keynes had it right, including the parts nobody pays attention to, people on the right accuse Keynesian economics of being 'spend spend spend' and people on the left like to ignore that Keynes advocating cutting spending when the economy is strong. In conclusion they're both buffoons, and if electoral cycles are lucky enough they balance out.

This being said, I've seen no real evidence to indicate they're not Obama's personal plans (beyond the usual "he's a politician" reasoning), Obama has been stuck with gridlock in the houses for basically his entire term (Obama had an effective majority in both houses for about 1/8th of his term). The only mistake Obama made was compromising on the Bush Tax cuts in 2010 instead of just letting them die for everyone, but the other option was to be stuck in gridlock for the rest of his term. Personally I think he should've held his ground given the state of the economy, but it wasn't going to achieve anything.


The unstable bonds is an effect of Spain's deficit, not the cause. Because of Spain's debt, their credit rating has been downgraded. This makes buying their bonds more risky, which means the yield on their bonds must be higher (I believe Spain's is above 6%, which is ridiculous). If the US ever gets to the point that our credit rating goes down because of our high debt, you will see the US bond market become very unstable. We have already seen a slight downgrade in our credit rating.
Spain's bonds are not problematic simply because of their debt, they're problematic because it's becoming a concern if they have any capacity to actually pay their debt (which in turn forces credit prices up and makes it even harder to repay their debt). Spain isn't showing any signs of real recovery while the US is gradually coming back, that's why Spain shouldn't be too much of a concern for you in my books.


I find the time of these revised numbers from this summer to be funny. Not wrong, just funny. I also find it funny that most of the jobs that the US gained were part-time jobs, while manufacturing jobs have decreased. Not really as good of a sign as you think.
Manufacturing jobs will never increase in a country with decent wages (manufacturing in the US has been on a steady downward slide since the late 70s), you get to pick 2 of the following: decent minimum wage, unskilled jobs, free trade with other countries.

Those are your options, if you want people being paid enough to live on and free trade with China or any other number of countries where $2 a day is enough to live then yes you'll lose manufacturing jobs. It's an unfortunate but inevitable result of a strong currency -- this being said I believe manufacturing in the US has improved since 2009.


That's why it's better to discuss the deficit as a % of the GDP. And when you look at it that way, it is still at it's lowest point since World War 2. I'm pretty sure it's over 10% now.
There has also been the worst economic crash since prior to WW2 recently, it's not so simple a situation to judge in my view.
 
What about the fact that in 2008, the year that had record African-American voter turnout, 20% of those African-American voters said race was "the single most important factor" for who they voted for. (Don't call me a racist, it's just statistics. There were probably just as many white/asian/whatever people who didn't vote for Obama because he was black, they may have just not been as honest on the survey.)
20% is a perfectly "acceptable" level for morons in our culture. 20% of Americans believe the sun orbits the earth.

And as far literacy tests / IQ tests, I don't think you fully understand why they were abolished int he first place. Your rhetoric is about on par with saying its fair to pay women less because they might get pregnant and become homemakers.
 
You cant.

Now, having said that, could you tell me why you should trust Romney to cut the deficit?
You can't.

As I said in another post, I'm not really a supporter of Romney either, but if I had to pick one of the two to lower the deficit, I'd chose Romney. I'm also not the one sipping the Obama cool-aid.

You want an answer:

He actually ran a balanced budget while governor of Massachusetts. He did it with a similar strategy he is promoting now; fixing tax loopholes for corporations (though I think I remember reading that he cut the corporate tax rate to offset some of these changes) and adding a plethora of new fees from everything from buying boats to increasing the delivery fee for gasoline. This could also be seen as raising taxes, but he actually tried to lower the state income tax 3 times while governor, but was turned down by Massachusetts legislature.

Does Romney deserve all the credit for this? No. The state legislature actually has most of the power in Massachusetts. Also, Massachusetts requires balanced budgets. Massachusetts also saw a large increase in state government spending under Romney. However, his record is a lot better than Obama's has been the last 4 years.
 
Your rhetoric is about on par with saying its fair to pay women less because they might get pregnant and become homemakers.
Pretty much no organisation will hire a woman under 40 with preference to a man under 40 of the same qualifications, skills, and experience for this very reason.
 

Myzozoa

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Why do you think Kennedy beat Nixon? It's not like people just became stupid for this election, they've been this stupid for over 50 years. What about the fact that in 2008, the year that had record African-American voter turnout, 20% of those African-American voters said race was "the single most important factor" for who they voted for. (Don't call me a racist, it's just statistics. There were probably just as many white/asian/whatever people who didn't vote for Obama because he was black, they may have just not been as honest on the survey.)
Lol, you don't think white people voted for McCain because he was white? Or that race is no longer an issue in America? Or that Republicans don't pass ID laws targetting minorities to disenfranchise them? Maybe Clarence Thomas should run for president.
 
Lol, you don't think white people voted for McCain because he was white? Or that race is no longer an issue in America? Or that Republicans don't pass ID laws targetting minorities to disenfranchise them? Maybe Clarence Thomas should run for president.
Can I say that I am in favor of literacy requirements now? Cause obviously this guy can't read.
 
i really don't see the problem with black people voting for obama because he's black

a minority president will more than likely have that minority's best interests in mind, it isn't really a superfluous reason
 

symphonyx64

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Of course democrats are opposed to voter ID laws, they need every dead person vote they can get it. Cya Obama.
 

LonelyNess

Makin' PK Love
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There has never been a proven case of significant voter fraud in the entire history of US general elections. It's a "problem" that has been completely made up by the republican party in an attempt to make it harder for people (particularly minorities and lower income families) to register to vote and it's also not even a problem that these ID laws will eradicate (the most commonly cited voter fraud is with felons, but you can still get a driver's license if you're a felon, so this does nothing to stop that).
 
Anyone who thinks the voter id laws are anything other than attempts by Republican state legislatures to suppress the votes of the Latino and Black demographics (both of which favour Democrats) is an imbecile.
 
Minnesota's Voter ID amendment is anything but the boilerplate Voter ID that has been scooting along lately. It is strict (must show Voter ID), will delay election results (provisional ballots if you don't have Voter ID), and is going to do some unspecified thing to absentee voting (absentee voters must be "verified in a similarly qualitative manner".)

Also the state SHUT DOWN recently because it didn't have money, and here is this thing trying to spend money to kill something that hardly qualifies as an issue in the first place.
 

Stratos

Banned deucer.
There has never been a proven case of significant voter fraud in the entire history of US general elections. It's a "problem" that has been completely made up by the republican party in an attempt to make it harder for people (particularly minorities and lower income families) to register to vote and it's also not even a problem that these ID laws will eradicate (the most commonly cited voter fraud is with felons, but you can still get a driver's license if you're a felon, so this does nothing to stop that).
me said:
To give just one instance, 160,000 voters in Milwaukee who were registered to vote in 2008 did not turn up in the 2010 census. Now unless there was some sort of mass exodus, i'm 98% sure that this is a case of massive-scale voter fraud, which surely would have been caught by ID law.

Another instance is when approximately 400 felons illegally voted in the state of Minnesota. 400 may not sound like much, but Al Franken won the election by a mere ~300 votes. Another example of potentially game-changing voter fraud.
ps ID can eliminate voter fraud in felons if the polling places are capable of performing a simple background check.
 
ps ID can eliminate voter fraud in felons if the polling places are capable of performing a simple background check.
I already explained to you a vastly more simple way of fixing this shit -- remove the felons from the electoral roll. This isn't rocket science.
 

DM

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It doesn't matter whether there is voter fraud or not, none of you seem to realize that this voter ID law is blatantly and unapologetically unconstitutional. Not that I have much faith in the current Supreme Court, but assuming they're not THAT conservative, this would be struck down in a millisecond. A judge in Pennsylvania already did just that.
 
I'm going to be on a holiday in New York in October, and I'm quite looking forward to see both campaigns going up close. Out here in the Netherlands we get some coverage of the elections (summaries on debates and the likes), but that's about it. Excited to see how much coverage a presidential election gets in the States, a month before the actual election.
 

symphonyx64

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Vice presidential debate last night.
Romney overtaking if not on equal footing with Obama nationally and in nearly every swing state since his debate last week.
Election less than a month away and the next presidential debate is Tuesday

Discuss
 
Vice presidential debate last night.
Romney overtaking if not on equal footing with Obama nationally and in nearly every swing state since his debate last week.
Election less than a month away and the next presidential debate is Tuesday

Discuss
Since citizens are going to be posing the questions this time around, so there is almost no chance that Romney will get lucky and dodge the 47% bullet a second time. He has probably been preparing a response for it, but I have a feeling he'll actually make his position worse by trying to justify the statement on national television. He might also get asked about his time with Bain (which would have more of an impact if the question was posed by one of the people who lost their jobs because of Bain; Bain is not exactly ethically defensible and Romney will likely try to distance himself again because trying to defend it would be a big mistake), which could be absolutely disastrous for his campaign if the details get out there on a nationally broadcast debate.

 
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