-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
-
Congrats to the winners of the 2023 Smog Awards!
Reflecting on BW and Looking Ahead to Gen VI - SEE POST #508
- Thread starter Huntofthelion
- Start date
- Status
blitzlefan
shake it off!
I just realized. I'm really sick of Dragon Tail's imperfect accuracy. Honestly, isn't a measly 60 Base Power and ridiculous negative priority enough of a drawback? Now adding a rage-inducing 90 accuracy just seems like overkill. PLEASE GAMEFREAK! FIX THIS! And just more Ghost-types in general would be nice. Like Rotom but with like Grass-Ghost, Water-Ghost, Fire-Ghost, etc. instead of all Ghost-Electric.
I also want more ways to screw over items. Better distribution for Knock-Off and Trick, and maybe an ability that shuts down all items on the field. Choice X should not be guaranteed.
Not a speculation, more of a question. If something gets Multitype other than Arceus(the fairy of this gen seems a possible choice), and it's not Uber, do we think Smogon's going to count usage for individual forms(like Rotom and Arceus) or is it going to combine them as one mon(Keldeo)? Splitting them seems like the smart/consistent option, but that might force lower tiers to do a LOT of unnecessary suspecting. After all, look at the usage very good Arceus forms(Poison, Fighting, Dark) get just because they have to compete for team slots with EKiller. Another multityper would be just the same, except outside of Ubers usage actually matters.
Not a speculation, more of a question. If something gets Multitype other than Arceus(the fairy of this gen seems a possible choice), and it's not Uber, do we think Smogon's going to count usage for individual forms(like Rotom and Arceus) or is it going to combine them as one mon(Keldeo)? Splitting them seems like the smart/consistent option, but that might force lower tiers to do a LOT of unnecessary suspecting. After all, look at the usage very good Arceus forms(Poison, Fighting, Dark) get just because they have to compete for team slots with EKiller. Another multityper would be just the same, except outside of Ubers usage actually matters.
New Eeveelution: Ninfia.
I honestly have no idea what the fuck this Eeveelution's typing is. Usually it's pretty obvious in the name and the looks, but to me it looks like a cross between a Cinccino and a Mienshao. Maybe a just a Normal type Eeveelution? I guess that would be cool since Eevee can't be used in anything but LC. I'm kind of hoping it's something unique though. The last two Eeveelutions were quite depressing competitively. It HAS to have something unique about it, because GameFreak wouldn't have announced it so early if there was nothing really special about it. Sure it's a new Eeveelution, but I honestly think there's more to Ninfina. Some are speculating that she could be a Dragon type because she is the only Eevelution that has fangs (seen in another article), but that doesn't necessarily mean it's a Dragon type. It looks a little girly for a Dragon, but then again....Altaria.
So, maybe Ninfia is just another throwaway Normal? OR she could possibly be a good, but not stellar Dragon that fits good in the UU tier which lacks Dragon types in general? Maybe a new typing that could yet again shake the OU meta game up even more?
I've heard a lot of Speculation around adding Light and Sound types. There's obviously a lot of little things inside the game already about sound (Uproar, Soundproof, etc) and Light is one of the most highly demanded types by fans whether people want to believe it or not. If this somehow ends up being true, maybe the eeveelution could be one of those? I don't know how it'd fit into either of those. Maybe Light, but still, I'd assume it's just another Normal type. The best we can really hope for is it being a Defensive/Offensive monster, or having some really cool unique move or ability to make it really viable.
Honestly, if I had to guess, I would say it looks most like a flying type to me. Maybe that's just because I REALLY would rather not have that great design wasted on another normal type, but it could also be that the flowing ribbons remind me of a flying type. Can't really say for sure.
New Eeveelution: Ninfia.
I honestly have no idea what the fuck this Eeveelution's typing is. Usually it's pretty obvious in the name and the looks, but to me it looks like a cross between a Cinccino and a Mienshao. Maybe a just a Normal type Eeveelution? I guess that would be cool since Eevee can't be used in anything but LC. I'm kind of hoping it's something unique though. The last two Eeveelutions were quite depressing competitively. It HAS to have something unique about it, because GameFreak wouldn't have announced it so early if there was nothing really special about it. Sure it's a new Eeveelution, but I honestly think there's more to Ninfina. Some are speculating that she could be a Dragon type because she is the only Eevelution that has fangs (seen in another article), but that doesn't necessarily mean it's a Dragon type. It looks a little girly for a Dragon, but then again....Altaria.
So, maybe Ninfia is just another throwaway Normal? OR she could possibly be a good, but not stellar Dragon that fits good in the UU tier which lacks Dragon types in general? Maybe a new typing that could yet again shake the OU meta game up even more?
So we want Weavile?
I saw speculation on another board that she was Ghost, which is honestly the only one that makes sense. Other than Espeon, every Eeveeloution has been blatantly, blindingly obvious what it's type is. I can't look at Ninfia and see clear Flying, Fighting, or Dragon, and Normal would probably look more like Eevee. Ghost, though, is just out there enough that it makes sense. After all, there's no reason Ghosts need to be scary, so it could easily be an 'obvious in retrospect' that she's undead. Fangs, pale, big eyes, all very standard 'ghost' markers.
A ghost type Eeveelution would be outstanding, but I can't really see much of a Ghost type in Ninfia other than her eyes and small fangs. She looks more majestic than anything else, which makes me believe that she's possibly either a Normal or Flying type. Normal type Eeveelution wouldn't piss me off as much as a Flying type because that's just another possibility of a Hurricane abuser, but now that you mention it it could possibly be a Ghost type.
I know this sounds weird, but could that Eeveelution be Dragon-type? I know it doesn't really look that much like a Dragon-type, but neither do Altaria or Vibrava really.
If they continue the pattern with the stats, what would be the best distribution for the Eeveelution?
About the above posts with Gen V OU being awful, etc. I think next generation we need to go a simpler, and also faster route. Go from the top down (and I mean the VERY top; we can do it quickly, but at the same time, no short-cuts). Whether we have 3 or 50 Pokemon on the OU banlist (Ubers), it doesn't matter. Ideally as little as possible, but if we have to ban 50 Pokemon to get OU "right", then we'll have to do that. And we also shouldn't be scared about the possibility that we would hardly need to ban anything at all.
If they continue the pattern with the stats, what would be the best distribution for the Eeveelution?
About the above posts with Gen V OU being awful, etc. I think next generation we need to go a simpler, and also faster route. Go from the top down (and I mean the VERY top; we can do it quickly, but at the same time, no short-cuts). Whether we have 3 or 50 Pokemon on the OU banlist (Ubers), it doesn't matter. Ideally as little as possible, but if we have to ban 50 Pokemon to get OU "right", then we'll have to do that. And we also shouldn't be scared about the possibility that we would hardly need to ban anything at all.
The cool thing about Ninfia is that we know that it gets every single move Eevee learns from Gen 3 onward (that fantastic support move-pool) and if it has a Dream World ability, we'll have access to it from day one with none of that Male-only crap we got early 5th Gen. Since all Eeveelutions follow the same level-up move pattern (more or less,) it wouldn't be hard to fill in the blanks unless it really is a new type.
Aside from having a sleek design, it's also the lightest Eeveelution so it would make sense for it to be quick.
It also doesn't seem to have an elemental basis as of yet, much like Umbreon before it so I think it might also have crap for attack. While Flareon, Vaporeon, and the rest of the Eeveelutions all have powerful elements for their attacks, Umbreon's is...headbutting things, giving people mean looks, and glowing at night. So yeah I expect Ninfia to be maybe a little less threatening than that even unless it can whip you with it's ribbons.
Based on those observations, I'm really hoping for a 130/60/95/65/65/110 Base stat Ninfia. A fast support Pokemon that can take hits and pass big Wishes and Subs. Nothing too threatening but being the one Pokemon fast enough to pass 101+ HP Subs without having the Sub take damage before the pass to ensure a resisted hit on the Sub would be enough to merit a niche even without knowing its typing or move-pool unless it's typing is just that awful. It even has Yawn to basically ensure a free Sub the next turn.
It would be like a faster Alomomola with Baton Pass that's actually worth using...so a faster Vaporeon...Yeah that.
Oh and if Mawile can be Steel-type, all bets are off for Ninfia.
Aside from having a sleek design, it's also the lightest Eeveelution so it would make sense for it to be quick.
It also doesn't seem to have an elemental basis as of yet, much like Umbreon before it so I think it might also have crap for attack. While Flareon, Vaporeon, and the rest of the Eeveelutions all have powerful elements for their attacks, Umbreon's is...headbutting things, giving people mean looks, and glowing at night. So yeah I expect Ninfia to be maybe a little less threatening than that even unless it can whip you with it's ribbons.
Based on those observations, I'm really hoping for a 130/60/95/65/65/110 Base stat Ninfia. A fast support Pokemon that can take hits and pass big Wishes and Subs. Nothing too threatening but being the one Pokemon fast enough to pass 101+ HP Subs without having the Sub take damage before the pass to ensure a resisted hit on the Sub would be enough to merit a niche even without knowing its typing or move-pool unless it's typing is just that awful. It even has Yawn to basically ensure a free Sub the next turn.
It would be like a faster Alomomola with Baton Pass that's actually worth using...so a faster Vaporeon...Yeah that.
Oh and if Mawile can be Steel-type, all bets are off for Ninfia.
Being a steel type would be pretty neat. High base speed and HP, as well as being able to pass wishes and immunity to poison. It being a ghost type however would mean spin blocking while having Wishpass and Wishprotect to keep itself alive.
Something like an steel eeveelution would have been pretty cool, and I actually think Ninfia isn't the only eeveelution we are going to see in x & y. This is because everytime new eeveelutions get released its always two of them so im rather excited if there is coming two in gen VI as well.
So a video of the newly-named Sylveon has shown up.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=pse_I1klRhA
I spy Trump Card and Swift in the battle and considering Eevee hasn't had Swift since PtHGSS Tutors, there's some decent momentum for a Normal-type Sylveon. But then it pulls all this Brave Bird/Dark Void crap out of nowhere so...Yeah. Game Freak's not really giving any clues here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=pse_I1klRhA
I spy Trump Card and Swift in the battle and considering Eevee hasn't had Swift since PtHGSS Tutors, there's some decent momentum for a Normal-type Sylveon. But then it pulls all this Brave Bird/Dark Void crap out of nowhere so...Yeah. Game Freak's not really giving any clues here.
Trying to not find out anything factual until the game comes out, it's just my luck that I stumbled upon this. I was just hoping to see what theorymoning was hot but nope, there's a new eeveelution. Fuck my life.
Maybe it's just a Normal-type evo through level up? Not all the Ee-lutions evolve through stones so i think it is plausible.
EDIT: After researching it's name, I think it may also be possible to be a bug-type. All the names relates to forests and one of them is even derived from a word meaning "larva of an insect". I will assume bug but I won't count out normal.
Maybe it's just a Normal-type evo through level up? Not all the Ee-lutions evolve through stones so i think it is plausible.
EDIT: After researching it's name, I think it may also be possible to be a bug-type. All the names relates to forests and one of them is even derived from a word meaning "larva of an insect". I will assume bug but I won't count out normal.
Guys now that I think about it, I HIGHLY doubt that this Eeveelution is Normal after seeing the description of the video that Katakiri just posted. Look what it says:
This makes me think that GameFreak most likely made Sylveon a different type then Normal. Think about it, why would Gamefreak make a new Eeveelution of a type that's already been used in the Evolution line? I mean technically Eevee can't evolve into a Normal type, but I think they count Eevee as a checked off type. I'm banking Flying or Bug typed. Since it's the only Eeveelution that has fangs (although it could mean nothing at all), a Bug type seems to be pretty plausible, however it wouldn't be a surprise to me if it's a Flying type either. Lots of Flying types in Pokemon have fangs. They don't have to have beaks.
The fact that it's named Sylveon makes it most likely Bug typed. Sylvania means woods, forest land, etc., which is mainly where bugs live. Eeveelution names have always had something to do with what they are combined with eon. Vapor-eon; Jolt-eon; Flare-eon; ESP-eon; Umbra-eon; Leaf-eon; Glacier/ial-eon; it'd make the most sense if it was bug based off the name. But that's a very weird looking bug type. I'm sure you can make the argument for Birds in woods, but knowing GF they'd give something to it related to a bird, like wings or a bird-ish tail.
Or maybe Gamefreak is being Gamefreak and that's the female version and there's also a male version that would make it obvious as to what it is.
Or maybe Gamefreak is being Gamefreak and that's the female version and there's also a male version that would make it obvious as to what it is.
Ancient forest spirit could also be an alternative: ghost?
Bug type would be very weird indeed even tough there's a butterfly-ish look.
Bug type would be very weird indeed even tough there's a butterfly-ish look.
Leafeon: Leaves, grass type
Umbreon: Umbra=shadow, dark type
Sylveon: Silva=Forest... has to be bug type
Gamefreak has made it pretty darn clear that in the games you go to the forest to catch bugs, starting way back when with Viridian Forest.
Which is a shame because Dragon was the only special attacking type that hasn't been released yet and they've all been special based so far.
Edit: Unless there really is a new fairy/light type, then that would sort of make sense. Celebi was in a forest. Nymphali is its French name, so either bug or fairy.
http://thedailyhotness.net/post/42939398704/ninfia-or-nympheon-is-the-first-of-two-eevee
This says the type will be good against Dragon and bad against Steel and "has information from source code" to support the claims. Doesn't seem so legit, but interesting speculation either way.
Umbreon: Umbra=shadow, dark type
Sylveon: Silva=Forest... has to be bug type
Gamefreak has made it pretty darn clear that in the games you go to the forest to catch bugs, starting way back when with Viridian Forest.
Which is a shame because Dragon was the only special attacking type that hasn't been released yet and they've all been special based so far.
Edit: Unless there really is a new fairy/light type, then that would sort of make sense. Celebi was in a forest. Nymphali is its French name, so either bug or fairy.
http://thedailyhotness.net/post/42939398704/ninfia-or-nympheon-is-the-first-of-two-eevee
This says the type will be good against Dragon and bad against Steel and "has information from source code" to support the claims. Doesn't seem so legit, but interesting speculation either way.
Good against dragon and bad against steel is dragon (and ice btw). Maybe better SE coverage than dragon (not hard) but worse than ice, better defensive typing than ice (only resists ice and weak to a lot of things) but worse than dragon...
Hope we don't get too much redondant coverage with some other type.
Hope we don't get too much redondant coverage with some other type.
Sorry Mario it's pretty much my fault XD. I introduced Sylveon into this thread and it kind of spiraled into a typing discussion similar to the actual discussion thread. I'll switch up the conversation.
On the topic of Sylveon, if it were to be a Bug type with the stat spread of lets say 80/85/75/110/85/115. Basically, a special attacking Scizor but much faster. Not very bulky, but has decent Special defense and great special attack but amazing speed. Although I'm one of the many supporters of a more balanced 6th gen with not a whole bunch of offensive juggernauts like 5th gen, I feel like Sylveon would function more offensively just by looking at it. If Sylveon had this spread, I think it would be an amazing alternative to Scizor because it would be more of a sweeper/cleanup then a Pursuit trapping priority powerhouse like Scizor. Most would probably prefer Scizor over it because of his POWERRRR but Sylveon would be an amazing check to the Eon twins without having to worry about being out sped, and Sylveon could also speed tie Starmie and out speed Gengar, both who are really hard to out speed and check effectively without a Choice Scarf. I feel like it would literally be the complete opposite match of Scizor, and most would run something like Choice Specs for similar powerful coverage like Scizor, but on the special side.
Sorry for the theorymoning, but I really wish GameFreak makes Sylveon awesome and unique, instead of just some terrible joke like poor Flareon and Leafeon who would be decent if they didn't have such a terrible move pool. Just trying to stir up a competitive discussion again.
- Status