No Haxmons

[Platina Kirin]

Sun seems best option for weather now.
Rain was mostly used to boost acc. which doesn't excist in this tier.
Heatran with MagmaStorm is usable now and cuite good.
Prankster mons like Sebleye love the new acc. since no longer WoW miss.
I really like sleep and para changed since with it the old way it was still kinda haxy.
We might want to choose ''THE'' amount of hits for 2-5 hitting moves without Skill Link it was still kinda ''hax'' having only 2 turns or getting the max 5.

 

[Pikachuun]

We might want to choose ''THE'' amount of hits for 2-5 hitting moves without Skill Link it was still kinda ''hax'' having only 2 turns or getting the max 5.

3.

 

[Platina Kirin]

I thought the chosen number of sleep turns was 2?
Well i had a battle and the foe woke up after 1 sleep turn, jut reporting this.
Also skymin is still banned when you try to batte with it.

 

[Pikachuun]

I thought the chosen number of sleep turns was 2?
Well i had a battle and the foe woke up after 1 sleep turn, jut reporting this.

Do you have a replay of this so I can take a look at it? Also, did the message for the sleeping Pokemon being asleep display twice? If the last question is the case, it was 2 turns.

 

[Platina Kirin]

Yeah pika i battled you and you saw it yourself.

 

[Pikachuun]

It's some bug. I'm looking into it and trying to fix it.

 

[Snaquaza]

ehhh, never mind, wrong tier :/

 

[SpartanMalice]

Snaq... that's Haxmons...

Those two would be useless in no Haxmons anyway...

Edit: That's cleared, someone delete this post cause it makes no sense now.

 

[Shadow Poochyena]

With no crits, I can see standard Cosmic Power Sigilyph becoming a huge threat after one or two boosts. As a result, I ask this:

Do moves that always crit (i.e. Frost Breath) crit?

 

[PokemonMasterDebater]

With no crits, I can see standard Cosmic Power Sigilyph becoming a huge threat after one or two boosts. As a result, I ask this:

Do moves that always crit (i.e. Frost Breath) crit?

They should, since they always crit, therefore a critical hit wouldn't be counted as hax.

What about Charge Beam (or any other move with a greater than 50% secondary effect chance)? Does that never boost special attack, or always boost special attack?

 

[SpartanMalice]

[Nevermind, wrong meta]

And yes, those moves will always crit.

Charge Beam's special attack increase is likely a primary effect, if the same applies to Flame Charge, so may keep it's old 70% chance, as only secondary effects have been removed. Moves with a 50% secondary effect chance won't work though, not even Fiery Dance. But those with a 100% chance will. Case in point: Zap Cannon, Inferno and DynamicPunch.

You'll never be fully paralyzed or confused however.

 

[Pikachuun]

Charge Beam's special attack increase is likely a primary effect, if the same applies to Flame Charge, so may keep it's old 70% chance, as only secondary effects have been removed.

Charge Beam is a secondary effect, and I'm trying to work on Serene Grace + >50% Chance moves so that they will work properly.

 

[SpartanMalice]

Hmm, I recall someone mentioning earlier that Self inflicted stat buffs like Flame Charge and Charge Beam are primary effects... o.O

 

[Chaoswalker]

I've been wanting this side meta to be a feature on Smogon for the longest time. Or at the very least a "No Crits" button would have been nice.

You've got a player right here. >:]

 

[PokemonMasterDebater]

Hmm, I recall someone mentioning earlier that Self inflicted stat buffs like Flame Charge and Charge Beam are primary effects... o_O

I believe that those are Primary effects for non-damaging moves, and Secondary effects of damaging moves.

Because I wish to contribute something, here is a list of all* attacks that should still have their secondary effects activating:

• Acid Spray (-2 target Sp. Defense)
• Bulldoze (-1 target Speed)
• Charge Beam (+1 user Sp. Attack)
• DynamicPunch (Confusion)
• Electro Web (-1 target Speed)
• Fake Out (Flinch)
• Flame Charge (+1 user Speed)
• Glaciate (-1 target Speed)
• Icy Wind (-1 target Speed)
• Inferno (Burn)
• Low Sweep (-1 target Speed)
• Mud Shot (-1 target Speed)
• Mud Slap (-1 target Accuracy, which I don't think will have any effect)
• Rock Tomb (-1 target Speed)
• Snarl (-1 target Sp. Attack)
• Struggle Bug (-1 target Sp. Attack)
• Zap Cannon (Paralysis)

*Please correct me if I've missed any*

...I'm trying to work on Serene Grace + >50% Chance moves so that they will work properly.

And here a list of moves that have >50% chance to activate with Serene Grace* in standard.
Here is the list of moves that will their secondary effect activate only if the users ability is Serene Grace*.

• Charge Beam (+1 user Sp. Attack)
• Rock Smash (-1 target Defense)

*Moves that can't be learned by Pokemon with Serene Grace were excluded from this list*

 

[Pikachuun]

And here a list of moves that have >50% chance to activate with Serene Grace in standard.

If a move has a >50% chance to activate without Serene Grace, it should work if and only if the mon has Serene Grace. If a move has a >50% chance to activate with Serene Grace or has a >50% chance to activate but the mon doesn't have Serene Grace, it won't work. That's what I meant to say.

tl;dr (in logical computer code format)

if (SecondaryChance >= 50 && (Ability === 'Serene Grace')) {
        SecondaryEffect = true
}
else {
        SecondaryEffect = false
}

 

[PokemonMasterDebater]

If a move has a >50% chance to activate without Serene Grace, it should work if and only if the mon has Serene Grace. If a move has a >50% chance to activate with Serene Grace or has a >50% chance to activate but the mon doesn't have Serene Grace, it won't work. That's what I meant to say.

I understand now, and I've edited my last post accordingly. So, unless I am mistaken, this only affects Rock Smash and Charge Beam?

 

[Pikachuun]

So, unless I am mistaken, this only affects Rock Smash and Charge Beam?

As far as I know of at this moment in time, yes.

 

[PokemonMasterDebater]

Are there any plans to change moves like Magnitude or Psywave, which rely on random variables to determine their base power or damage output?

 

[SpartanMalice]

That's actually a pretty good idea. They could be given the same chances of getting said magnitude, for example, as the number of hits for a multi-hit move.

 

[Snaquaza]

k, I'm back and it is playable again :D

 

[Snaquaza]

Okay, the server is back up, had some problems and was on holiday

Edit: The Reason for this double post is because it wouldn't be noticed otherwise and would just be left in the dust, if any Moderator sees this, please remove the post above, it is unnecessary but I couldn't find delete.

 

[Platina Kirin]

Dynamic Punch/Zap Cannon and Inferno now have 100% second effects.
Shaymin looks good with 100% acc. and not op cause no longer drops/flinch.

 

[SpartanMalice]

People who are interested in this meta vote for it as OM if you can ;)
Yeah Shaymin might have to be unbanned. It's still powerful not is kind of more like keldeo now that it doesn't flinch.

 

[Snaquaza]

ShayminS has GrassWhistle ;) watch out

Edit:

I believe that those are Primary effects for non-damaging moves, and Secondary effects of damaging moves.

Because I wish to contribute something, here is a list of all* attacks that should still have their secondary effects activating:

• Acid Spray (-2 target Sp. Defense)
• Bulldoze (-1 target Speed)
• Charge Beam (+1 user Sp. Attack)
• DynamicPunch (Confusion)
• Electro Web (-1 target Speed)
• Fake Out (Flinch)
• Flame Charge (+1 user Speed)
• Glaciate (-1 target Speed)
• Icy Wind (-1 target Speed)
• Inferno (Burn)
• Low Sweep (-1 target Speed)
• Mud Shot (-1 target Speed)
• Mud Slap (-1 target Accuracy, which I don't think will have any effect)
• Rock Tomb (-1 target Speed)
• Snarl (-1 target Sp. Attack)
• Struggle Bug (-1 target Sp. Attack)
• Zap Cannon (Paralysis)

*Please correct me if I've missed any*

And here a list of moves that have >50% chance to activate with Serene Grace* in standard.
Here is the list of moves that will their secondary effect activate only if the users ability is Serene Grace*.

• Charge Beam (+1 user Sp. Attack)
• Rock Smash (-1 target Defense)

*Moves that can't be learned by Pokemon with Serene Grace were excluded from this list*

Don't forget Storm Throw and Frost Breath