Other 6th Gen Pokemon OU Candidate Speculation Thread

[Blitzenith]

Please limit discussion to Pokemon introduced in Gen 6 ONLY.

Hi guys! I wanted this thread to be used for speculating on what 6th gen Pokemon we think might be OU. Of course, there are still a lot of variables up in the air, but let's talk about what we know.

I've heard many people say that Aegislash will probably be OU. I've even heard some say it'll be Uber. Sounds like a solid guess to me. Great offense, defense, typing, and priority. I don't think Aegislash will be Uber though, if only because it really has one viable set, which makes it easy to predict and prepare for.

Other than him though... the guesses get murkier. I've heard some people hype up Noivern. While at first he doesn't seem very strong, with only 97 Sp. Attack, he's fast as hell, hits with STAB Draco Meteor, can switch in on stuff due to his bulk and typing, and most importantly, gets Inflitrator, which can hit through Subs! Seems useful to me. I don't expect him to be as popular as Garchomp or anything, but I can see a place for him.

I've also heard people mention Goodra. But sadly, as much as I like Goodra, it just seems like he came too late, huh? With Rain being nerfed, I can imagine Rain will be more about quick offense than allowing Hydration stalling sets. I've heard some people say Goodra will be outclassed by Latias... but what about Gooey? If you run a mixed Goodra, perhaps lowering your opponent's speed can be useful?

And sadly... there are the Pokemon who looked like they had potential... like Protean Greninja and Barbaracle. Greninja sadly doesn't have many good moves or stat boosters, and Barbaracle is just too slow, even with Shell Smash. A shame, because he's cool looking.

Lastly, I wanted to mention Zygarde. I know some people think he's just an inferior Garchomp, but he IS bulkier and has a priority move, for what it's worth.

So, what are your thoughts? I think that takes care about all the potential OU candidates, yes?

 

[Ashfield]

Greninja will be OU. Protean is just that good. Spikes as well is the icing on the cake.

Most likely Azumarill and Togekiss will go to OU with their new found typings.

And Galvantula if Sticky Web is as good as it seems

 

[Anartya]

From Gen 6: Greninja, Aegislash and possibly Zygrade (unlikely) that's it.

Can't say much about megas.

 

[GDK]

Azumarill gets both aqua jet and belly drum plus a new typing, it's a serious candidate.
But it all depend on the playstyle. With weather mostly gone (just gaining a turn of setup is not a big deal), hyper offense could be less present than before.

 

[wonny2000]

Dragons might actually not be as good due to the new possible OU fairies, such as Azumarill and Togekiss.
I'm surprised no one's said much about the Mega Evos. Some of them have a ton of potential...

 

[Blitzenith]

Please refrain from mentioning non-6th gen Pokemon. :)

Also, reasons why you think a Pokemon might be OU would be appreciated!

Lastly, anyone else think it's funny that Fairies were hyped up to be Dragon killers and there's like only 2 viable ones, and they aren't even from 6th gen?

 

[Lazybeef]

Other than the ones already mentioned, Pangoro is a possible OU candidate. Parting shot offers great utility and it has pretty good stats and a nice offensive typing.

Heliolisk would have been clear OU if it wasn't for the weather nerf.

I also think Sylveon and Florges have a fighting chance to be OU, because they are both great special tanks with useful support options.

 

[Mattman324]

Dragalgae

I'm sorry, Dragalgae doesn't look any better than RU to me. Explain this.

Aegislash is almost guaranteed OU. Zyguard is BL at worst, same with Greninja. Talonflame will be high UU, so will Delphox and maybe Avalugg. Goodra is high UU at worst as well.

 

[Raikaria]

Personally I see very few Gen6 pokemon as OU material. I also think Ageislash is overhyped. I've had no problems facing them in online battles so far, and I've not even been prepared,or using a serious team.

Goodra probobly has the best bet, outside of Ageislash. It's a good mixed attacker, it's the only Dragon who can really use Grass-type attacks [A niche], it's pretty bulky, and it doesn't have the downsides of the Psychic type like Lati@s, such as Pursuit.

I think Protean Ninjafrog is somewhat over-hyped and may not make OU; or, more specifically, stay in it long. It's lack of decent moves is the main reason. Surf... Ice Beam... [Oh yes everyone wants to be an Ice type!]... Extrasensory... uh... Grass Knot? Base 103 Sp.Atk and 72/67/71 defenses are not anything special either. I best see it as a Specs hit-and-run.

 

[Mysteryracer]

Zygarde would make for a pretty good parashuffler, via his access to Glare and Dragon Tail. If he had roost or another recovery move aside from Rest, he would be the best parashuffler in the game. Still, he could function like this:

Zygarde, Careful nature (+SpD, -SpA)
Aura Break, EV's: 252HP / 4Def / 252SpD
Moves:
Glare
Dragon Tail
Coil
Earthquake

Glare paralyzes anything (Including Ground and Ghost types), and Dragon Tail is the premier shuffle move. Coil raises the Atk and Def of Zygarde, as well as raise the accuracy of Glare and Dragon Tail to 100%, and Earthquake provide Zygarde with an extra STAB and some possible coverage. Zygarde doesn't really have a diverse physical movepool, so Earthquake is the best it's gonna get.

 

[wonny2000]

Well, Dragalgae's stats aren't that good; last time I checked, its only stat that goes over 100 is it's SpD.
Regardless, it can be a Special Wall in lower tiers, in addition to possessing Poison Point. Poison Touch would be great in theory, but I don't think it has the Atk to pull off most direct moves. I dunno, I'll have to check.

 

[Delibird is Amazing]

aegislash is almost guaranteed

clawitzer and barbaracle may end up ou because of shell smash

greninja is likely aswell

goodra is like, high uu at worst

noivern I am not sure will be ou but he will definitely have a niche and be usable

zygarde looks to be rather underrated and great bulk+dd+e speed will differentiate it from garchomp

 

[Mattman324]

clawitzer and barbaracle may end up ou because of shell smash

Naaa, not seeing it. Cloyster did for a variety of reasons, including priority, ability to actually use both sides of the spectrum, and a really, REALLY powerful STAB attack in Icicle Spear. These remind me more of Carracosta than anything, and Carracosta is not OU by any means. Clawitzer may make UU, to be fair, but OU is out of their grasp.

 

[Blue_Tornado]

Opinion on the Grass/Ghost-types? Their stats aren't amazing but the typing and movepool make me think they'll be sticking around in OU.

 

[wonny2000]

Clawitzer gets Shell Smash?
I'll have to check Serebii again...

In anyways, Clawitzer won't make OU, as long as other ShellSmashers (Cloyster) or better Mega Launcher Pokemon (Mega Blastoise) are here.

UU is a slight possibility.

EDIT:
Yeah, Phanthump might be viable (Harvest Phanthump with Wood Hammer sounds okay). Gourgeist, not so much.

Avalugg sounds a little interesting. Sturdy, physically bulky, Recover...
Custap, possibly?

 

[HockeyBoyz]

What about doublade in OU it has base 150 defs with Eviolite. Plus it can still attack with sacred sword. It will probably get the gligar treatment but who knows

 

[666lumberjack]

I'm sorry, Dragalgae doesn't look any better than RU to me. Explain this.

Aegislash is almost guaranteed OU. Zyguard is BL at worst, same with Greninja. Talonflame will be high UU, so will Delphox and maybe Avalugg. Goodra is high UU at worst as well.

I don't think Dragalge will be OU by any stretch - its stats are just too bad. However, unless gen 6 UU is radically different from gen 5 UU, it will have a pretty good niche there. If you ask any seasoned UU player what they think of (gen V) specs Kingdra, they will all tell you it's a fantastic mon because it has the power to rip big holes in things and great coverage. Dragalge is stronger, has the same Draco Meteor, a better special movepool and a poison STAB to hit Fairies who would try to block its attacks. Draco Meteor/Sludge Bomb/Focus Blast with Specs is a 2HKO on basically every wall in the current UU tier, with Hydro Pump turning some of those into OHKOs depending on the Pokemon. Really the combination of decent bulk, especially on the special side, a bunch of good resistances and just enough power to 2HKO things like Snorlax, Umbreon, Roserade and Bronzong and have a good to guarenteed shot at OHKOing Pokemon like Gligar, Swampert, Blastoise, Slowbro, Rhyperior, Qwilfish, Arcanine, Nidoqueen, Heracross, Azumarill and Togekiss (assuming the latter two don't drop). Really the only think holding it back is speed but there are quite a few Pokemon who can hardly scratch it so even that isn't a huge issue. I could seriously see it as a really potent offensive threat, I mean a lot of those Pokemon are pretty durable but it just blows through them. It is also a Heracross check, which is in itself a selling point. Really it is a lot better than the stat spread suggests, I mean I haven't even mentioned the possibility of a support set but it has Scald, STAB Dragon Tail, Toxic Spikes and enough bulk to fend off anything that can't hit it with a decently powerful SE move. I only wish the attack and speed were reversed, as it is it's just a little too slow for my liking.

 

[amplafied]

I don't think Dragalge will be OU by any stretch - its stats are just too bad. However, unless gen 6 UU is radically different from gen 5 UU, it will have a pretty good niche there. If you ask any seasoned UU player what they think of (gen V) specs Kingdra, they will all tell you it's a fantastic mon because it has the power to rip big holes in things and great coverage. Dragalge is stronger, has the same Draco Meteor, a better special movepool and a poison STAB to hit Fairies who would try to block its attacks. Draco Meteor/Sludge Bomb/Focus Blast with Specs is a 2HKO on basically every wall in the current UU tier, with Hydro Pump turning some of those into OHKOs depending on the Pokemon. Really the combination of decent bulk, especially on the special side, a bunch of good resistances and just enough power to 2HKO things like Snorlax, Umbreon, Roserade and Bronzong and have a good to guarenteed shot at OHKOing Pokemon like Gligar, Swampert, Blastoise, Slowbro, Rhyperior, Qwilfish, Arcanine, Nidoqueen, Heracross, Azumarill and Togekiss (assuming the latter two don't drop). Really the only think holding it back is speed but there are quite a few Pokemon who can hardly scratch it so even that isn't a huge issue. I could seriously see it as a really potent offensive threat, I mean a lot of those Pokemon are pretty durable but it just blows through them. It is also a Heracross check, which is in itself a selling point. Really it is a lot better than the stat spread suggests, I mean I haven't even mentioned the possibility of a support set but it has Scald, STAB Dragon Tail, Toxic Spikes and enough bulk to fend off anything that can't hit it with a decently powerful SE move. I only wish the attack and speed were reversed, as it is it's just a little too slow for my liking.

You do know that Dragalge's hidden ability is Adaptability right? We have the potential for adaptability Draco Meteor on a trick room team and you are calling UU???

 

[666lumberjack]

You do know that Dragalge's hidden ability is Adaptability right? We have the potential for adaptability Draco Meteor on a trick room team and you are calling UU???

I did not know that. Last I saw we didn't know hidden ability. If that's true... holy shit. Not only is Draco Meteor really fucking strong, that makes Sludge Bomb way better as a coverage move. Even Suicune, who I figured would pretty much be a hard counter if it was defensive, is getting absolutely wrecked. If SR is up you can OHKO it with Draco Meteor 60% of the time. It's still a shaky OU prospect because that speed but that's a fearsome amount of damage.

 

[wonny2000]

Personally, for Dragalge, I'm looking at its defenses instead. Unless Serebii's stats are wrong, Dragalge has greater potential as a Special Wall thing... :P

 

[FrostFire]

^Yeah, but the problem with Dragalgae is that it's low HP stat also comprimises it's ability to take hits in the first place. While 123 Sp.Def is great, 65 HP really isn't. Also, 90 base Defence is passable, but when compounded with that HP stat again, it's actually pretty frail on the physical side. Now, when you combine all that with it's atrocious 44 base Speed (read: it's going to have to take a hit before it can dish one back out), and you can start to see where the problem is. At least with Kingdra (as mentioned before) you can outspeed some things (particularly if you're running Rain Dance or something). Also 75/95/95 gives it better physical bulk, while retaining adequate special bulk; you could also argue that Kingdra's defensive typing is superior as well. It may not have a STAB super-effective move against Fairies, but honestly STAB Hydro Pump/ Surf is still pretty good (as well as being a more threatening offensive attack than Sludge Bomb in general, should your opponent try to predict you).

Oh, and while adaptibility is cool, 97 Sp. Atk isn't super strong, so something bulky should be able to take it OK. Maybe Bronzong? I'd have to check that out though.

eh, I feel like my post wasn't very clear, but I definitely feel like Kingdra is the better Pokemon overall. I just think (probably more than anything) that it's speed and HP stats killed it so bad.

EDIT: Just for reference; a Choice Specs Modest 252+ Special Attack Adaptability Dragalgae Draco Meteor versus 252 HP/ 252 +Def/ 4 Sp Def Bronzong = 53.55-63.01%. So after the -2 SA, you won't be able to 2HKO... and this is the most powerful attack Dragalgae can muster against a physically defensive spread. Make of it what you will.

 

[wonny2000]

Yeah, I realize that I actually didn't see the HP stat... :P
And yes I second that Kingdra is so much better and with Weather stuff being nerfed, perhaps Smogon will lift the ban on Drizzle + Swift Swim. Kingdra might become better not having to set up Rain Dance in the first place.

Anyways, what I really don't get is this: they give Poison Touch to Dragalge, who can't really use it that well. I suppose then Adaptibility is the best way to go.

 

[Thetwiggy13]

I personally think that Florges could make OU. It has insane special defense and decent enough special attack. It isn't downright slow, either. ~75 isn't fast, but for a specially-bulky Pokemon, that isn't bad at all. The only problems that Florges has is the weaknesses to Poison and Steel and the lower defense stat. Even then, Florges can tank any hit bar Dragalge, though it could live a Sludge Bomb and 2HKOish (or OHKO? Doubt it, but idk) with Moon Blast.

Edit: I did forget to mention that those Florges counteres will likely go after its lower defense stat, but I guess Wish+Protect/Recover would make up for that somehow. Still, I think it would be in OU, albeit not in the top tier.

I really wish Clawitzer could get OU, but I guess Mega Blastoise will take that spot away.

 

[Ash Borer]

Naaa, not seeing it. Cloyster did for a variety of reasons, including priority, ability to actually use both sides of the spectrum, and a really, REALLY powerful STAB attack in Icicle Spear. These remind me more of Carracosta than anything, and Carracosta is not OU by any means. Clawitzer may make UU, to be fair, but OU is out of their grasp.

tough claws stone edge is stronger than icicle spear, tough claws waterfall sits at a nice 104 power. That, and barbaracle is only 2 points behind cloyster in speed. Barbaracle also receives cross chop, which is an effective 130 power after tough claws. EArthquake although not tough claw boosted is perfectly accurate and achieves solid coverage with stone edge. Water / rock / fighting generally has better than coverage than rock / ice / water. Barbaracle also has better special bulk and base attack. It's definitely competitive with cloyster. Cloyster's typing grants it two resistances, and 4 weaknesses, while barbaracle's nets it 5 resistances and 4 weaknesses. Cloyster is much more resistant to priority not called extremepseed though.

im just sayin that barbaracle hits harder, has better coverage, and hits almost the exact same speed tier as cloyster, so it might be close to cloyster in utility.

 

[Brammi]

Zygarde will be OU for a long time.
Barbaracle will be OU until the meta settles down. The cheap win sweepers always end up higher than they deserve.
Gourgeist will be OU because of it's amazing matchup into spinners.
Aegislash will be weird, I think it's been overhyped, but I also think that it can hold an OU spot simply from it's defensive spread. It's like a better Registeel int hat regard. I wouldn't be surprised to see it in UU though. The weakness to ghost really hurts it not to mention it's still pursuit weak.
Dragalge won't be OU, and likely not UU either.
Azumarill will probably make OU, it's not going to be Belly Drumming, but it will be using it's usual Band sets.

On the topic of megas, the only ones I actually like the look of for OU are Manectric, Lucario and Scizor. Garchomp and Gyara are better off with staying normal. Gengar is ok, but you're switching what you want into Gengar before it traps you anyway so I think it'd prefer and item on most sets. Blastoise might make OU because of it's mega, but again that's not because of the mega, but because it has ForeSpin.

I would like to point out that both Rain and Sun are just as weak as they were in Gen 4. Because they relied on the rocks to lengthen weather times, a luxury they don't havewith the auto inducers, which is a trap I see alot of people falling into. Poli AND Tales will both have a hard time staying OU. I doubt either of them will be higher than UU.