So if it is a "serious" moveset that is a "viable" option in OU(ie Chain Chomp), it should be posted in C&C and not here?
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New and "creative" moveset/EV spread thread. Mk. 3
- Thread starter Tangerine
- Start date
- Status
Trick Room Jynx will bring a surprise factor, and incompassitate at least 2 Pokemon: 1 will be sleeping, and another will be KOed by Counter.
Jynx: @ Focus Sash
252 Speed, 252 Special Attack
Modest/Timid
Lovely Kiss
Trick Room
Ice Beam
Counter
Sleep, Trick Room on the switch, Counter can be used for a surprise KO or just switch. Ice Beam incase Jynx is typically slower than an opponent. (Like Crobat).
Nature depends. Modest works better with Trick Room up, but Timid works better for using Lovely Kiss
Jynx: @ Focus Sash
252 Speed, 252 Special Attack
Modest/Timid
Lovely Kiss
Trick Room
Ice Beam
Counter
Sleep, Trick Room on the switch, Counter can be used for a surprise KO or just switch. Ice Beam incase Jynx is typically slower than an opponent. (Like Crobat).
Nature depends. Modest works better with Trick Room up, but Timid works better for using Lovely Kiss
I really don't see what this is supposed to do. Why Trick Room on the switch? Why not just Ice Beam? Jynx will go last with Counter anyway, and other than that it's pretty fast.
hhjj I thought you were banned from this thread ._.
Trick Room lasts 5 turns. This set wastes almost all of it. It is fast so it will more often go last in Trick Room. You are relying on a Focus Sash to set up a Counter but you have to use Counter on the turn you were attacked, it has negative priority. I don't see how that set is even useful.
Just because I have to say it every time I respond to you (though you won't / haven't listened): Stop trying to make sets for the sake of it. Or rather, stop making them when you don't have a near-complete grasp of Pokémon. You've been clearly just trying to look for a "new set" for the sake of a "new set" for 6 months now, and you've gotten the same answer every time.
Trick Room lasts 5 turns. This set wastes almost all of it. It is fast so it will more often go last in Trick Room. You are relying on a Focus Sash to set up a Counter but you have to use Counter on the turn you were attacked, it has negative priority. I don't see how that set is even useful.
Just because I have to say it every time I respond to you (though you won't / haven't listened): Stop trying to make sets for the sake of it. Or rather, stop making them when you don't have a near-complete grasp of Pokémon. You've been clearly just trying to look for a "new set" for the sake of a "new set" for 6 months now, and you've gotten the same answer every time.
I usually tell people to "test the waters" by posting good sets here first, then write a revamp. As long as you put thought in it you won't get any nonconstructive criticism (don't let my comments to hhjj sway you, that's different)
252 speed EVs on a trick roomer? wtf?
And I have to agree with Chris is me, this set isn't going anywhere.
Double Status Darkrai
I was surprised to see that the Darkrai analysis doesn't mention Thunder Wave, even in Other Options. I have been using this set successfully in Ubers lately and I think it deserves a mention.
Darkrai@Focus Sash/Wide Lens
Timid Nature
252 Speed, 252 Special Attack, 4 HP
Dark Void
Thunder Wave
Dark Pulse
Spacial Rend/Focus Blast/Nasty Plot
Send this out against a slower opponent (preferably after a KO so Darkrai doesn't get hit) and use Dark Void. Whatever they sacrifice to sleep is now dead weight. Now they send out something that actually has a shot to beat Darkrai, so you Thunder Wave on the switch. Voila, 2 enemy Pokemon are, in the fast-paced world of ubers, useless. Now you can switch out Darkrai and use for its usual revenge killing later on. Spacial Rend for dragons, Focus Blast for darks and steels, and Nasty Plot can enable a sweep if you're lucky enough have crippled Darkrai's counters (and Blissey is gone).
Not too creative, just a new move, but it works.
I was surprised to see that the Darkrai analysis doesn't mention Thunder Wave, even in Other Options. I have been using this set successfully in Ubers lately and I think it deserves a mention.
Darkrai@Focus Sash/Wide Lens
Timid Nature
252 Speed, 252 Special Attack, 4 HP
Dark Void
Thunder Wave
Dark Pulse
Spacial Rend/Focus Blast/Nasty Plot
Send this out against a slower opponent (preferably after a KO so Darkrai doesn't get hit) and use Dark Void. Whatever they sacrifice to sleep is now dead weight. Now they send out something that actually has a shot to beat Darkrai, so you Thunder Wave on the switch. Voila, 2 enemy Pokemon are, in the fast-paced world of ubers, useless. Now you can switch out Darkrai and use for its usual revenge killing later on. Spacial Rend for dragons, Focus Blast for darks and steels, and Nasty Plot can enable a sweep if you're lucky enough have crippled Darkrai's counters (and Blissey is gone).
Not too creative, just a new move, but it works.
I've been having some fun in UU with this Claydol set.
Claydol@Choice Specs
Bold 252 HP / 216 Def / 42 Satk
-Earth Power
-Psychic
-Trick
-Rapid Spin
Can really mess with most spin-blockers. Psychic will hit all except Spiritomb hard, and if you predict it coming in, Spiritomb could get a lovely new pair of Specs. Also makes a nice counter to physical pokemon, especially physical fighters. EVs might not be the best, but they get the job done. Obviously for use on a team that sets up SR with something else.
Claydol@Choice Specs
Bold 252 HP / 216 Def / 42 Satk
-Earth Power
-Psychic
-Trick
-Rapid Spin
Can really mess with most spin-blockers. Psychic will hit all except Spiritomb hard, and if you predict it coming in, Spiritomb could get a lovely new pair of Specs. Also makes a nice counter to physical pokemon, especially physical fighters. EVs might not be the best, but they get the job done. Obviously for use on a team that sets up SR with something else.
Toxicroak @ Leftovers
Adamant 252 SpD / 156 Hp / 100 Atk
Dry Skin
~ Focus Punch
~ Sucker Punch
~ Substitute
~ Taunt / Protect / Swords Dance
UberCroak! The evs allow him to never be 3HKOd by Timid ScarfOgre's Thunder. He has Dry Skin to restore 18.75% (w/ Leftovers) of his HP per turn. Focus Punch OHKOs those Hasty Palkias. He carries nice resists to Dark, Fighting, Rock, and a Water immunity. Sucker Punch is for the Psychics. Taunt means you easily outstall Lugia / Giratina and most likely end up with a Sub up and full health. Swords Dance can boost his attack to 600, whilst Protect nets 18.75% of free health.
IMO SubPunch Toxicroak really needs Taunt to be effective in Ubers. The problem with Sucker Punch also is that it has only 8 PP and almost everything you'd be using it against has Pressure, reducing that to 4 effectively. Without Taunt, Lugia / Giratina can just sit there and either Pressure stall you or simply PHaze you out. What's interesting is that Lugia's Ice Beam never breaks the Subs either, meaning with Taunt you can stall it easily out of PP yourself, ending up at full health and most likely still behind a sub.
Toxicroak @ Leftovers
Adamant 252 SpD / 156 Hp / 100 Atk
Dry Skin
~ Focus Punch
~ Sucker Punch
~ Substitute
~ Protect / Swords Dance
UberCroak! The evs allow him to never be 3HKOd by Timid ScarfOgre's Thunder. He has Dry Skin to restore 18.75% (w/ Leftovers) of his HP per turn. Focus Punch OHKOs those Hasty Palkias. He carries nice resists to Dark, Fighting, Rock, and a Water immunity. Sucker Punch is for the Psychics. Swords Dance can boost his attack to 600, whilst rotect nets 18.75% of free health.
I posted a set similar to this about a year ago, except with Focus Punch / Substitute / Poison Jab / Taunt that explains the strategy in much more detail. Unfortunately I can't find it through searching, but this was pre-Platinum so if using it now I would probably consider Ice Punch over Poison Jab, although the idea was to use the residual Poison damage to wear down certain walls, paticularly Giratina. Still, Ice Punch has more useful offensive coverage for things like Rayquaza and the Latis.
^^^^ Quite sweet. I like it. I should try it on my team.
Anyway, this isn't particularly creative either, but this is a Nidoking set I've been using to blast away the walls in UU. Changed the movesets and EVs from the analysis. I severely underestimated Nidoking before; he is a deadly mixed attacker, sweeper, wallbreaker.
Nidoking @ Life Orb
Poison Point
64 Atk/228 SpA/216 Spd
Mild/Rash
-Earth Power
-Thunder Bolt
-Ice Beam/Shadow Ball
-Superpower/Shadow Ball
With some good prediction, this Nidoking will wreck the primary walls in nUU, 2hkoing Registeel, Steelix, Slowbro, Milotic, and Uxie and Chansey, and also makes for a good sweeper with his above average speed in UU.
The given SpA EVs net 289 SpA, which with LO, will 2hko the first four of those walls easily with the appropriate SE move with rocks up (some you can still kill without rocks). Actually, you 1hko Steelix with EP. Meanwhile, Chansey takes 75% minimum from Superpower, a 1hko if you can get 1 layer of rocks, and 1 of spikes up.
Thunderbolt and Earth Power are a given. Superpower is for Blissey, but if you don't feel Blissey is going to try to wall you or you have some other method, you can use Shadow Ball for Uxie. Ice Beam is also a solid choice, 2hkoing most Grass types (although more of them, like Roserade and Shaymin outspeed you), and would give you some great coverage with Earth Power. Shadow Ball can still go over it though.
The Spd EVs hit 260, enough to outspeed neutral natured base 80s
Anyway, this isn't particularly creative either, but this is a Nidoking set I've been using to blast away the walls in UU. Changed the movesets and EVs from the analysis. I severely underestimated Nidoking before; he is a deadly mixed attacker, sweeper, wallbreaker.
Nidoking @ Life Orb
Poison Point
64 Atk/228 SpA/216 Spd
Mild/Rash
-Earth Power
-Thunder Bolt
-Ice Beam/Shadow Ball
-Superpower/Shadow Ball
With some good prediction, this Nidoking will wreck the primary walls in nUU, 2hkoing Registeel, Steelix, Slowbro, Milotic, and Uxie and Chansey, and also makes for a good sweeper with his above average speed in UU.
The given SpA EVs net 289 SpA, which with LO, will 2hko the first four of those walls easily with the appropriate SE move with rocks up (some you can still kill without rocks). Actually, you 1hko Steelix with EP. Meanwhile, Chansey takes 75% minimum from Superpower, a 1hko if you can get 1 layer of rocks, and 1 of spikes up.
Thunderbolt and Earth Power are a given. Superpower is for Blissey, but if you don't feel Blissey is going to try to wall you or you have some other method, you can use Shadow Ball for Uxie. Ice Beam is also a solid choice, 2hkoing most Grass types (although more of them, like Roserade and Shaymin outspeed you), and would give you some great coverage with Earth Power. Shadow Ball can still go over it though.
The Spd EVs hit 260, enough to outspeed neutral natured base 80s
I dont really like this set because it doesnt Wallbreak as effectively as it could.
I like the set with Earthquake, Thunderbolt, Sludge Bomb, filler.
Its evs are something like 252 SAtk / 200 Atk / 56spe.
Speed is not important for wall breaking imo.
Curse Glaceon
@ Leftovers
Ability: Snow Cloak
Careful Nature
EV: 168 HP / 120 Def / 220 SpD
-Curse
-Ice Shard
-Return
-HP [Fighting]
I tried out this set and with amazing bulk it works well best paired with Abomasnow to get hail with Glaceons ability. Snow Cloak helps it rack up Curses nicely before getting hit. Curse is a good option to increase it's defensive stat and take the fighting attacks. Ice Shard paired with Curse is good, priority with a slow pokemon is good and it gets STAB also. Return is to hit bulky waters that try to wall this and HP [Fighting] handles steel types that wall this.
Ability: Snow Cloak
Careful Nature
EV: 168 HP / 120 Def / 220 SpD
-Curse
-Ice Shard
-Return
-HP [Fighting]
I tried out this set and with amazing bulk it works well best paired with Abomasnow to get hail with Glaceons ability. Snow Cloak helps it rack up Curses nicely before getting hit. Curse is a good option to increase it's defensive stat and take the fighting attacks. Ice Shard paired with Curse is good, priority with a slow pokemon is good and it gets STAB also. Return is to hit bulky waters that try to wall this and HP [Fighting] handles steel types that wall this.
Recently I've been seeing a lot of CounterBliss, so I decided to expand a bit on the idea.
Blissey (F)
Item: Leftovers / Chople Berry
Nature: Bold
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
- Counter
- Softboiled
- Protect / Toxic
- Ice Beam
The EVs maximize Blissey's defensive stats. You survive loads of attacks, such as a +1 Life Orb Gyarados' Waterfall, a Life Orb Brick Break from Scizor, and a chance to survive a LO Close Combat from MixApe. With Chople Berry you survive even the strongest STAB fighting attacks from CBCross and the like. Using Protect in conjuction with Leftovers will help greatly, allowing you to survive more hits and heal off Stealth Rock damage. It also gives insurance against mixed attacking Pokemon such as Salamence or Lucario, so you don't blow the secret too early. Thunder Wave is a big NO because full paralysis gives away your secret of Counter. Toxic however can be used to wear down the foe. Ice Beam is mostly filler, but gets decent coverage and hits the Ghosts that resist Counter.
Blissey (F)
Item: Leftovers / Chople Berry
Nature: Bold
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
- Counter
- Softboiled
- Protect / Toxic
- Ice Beam
The EVs maximize Blissey's defensive stats. You survive loads of attacks, such as a +1 Life Orb Gyarados' Waterfall, a Life Orb Brick Break from Scizor, and a chance to survive a LO Close Combat from MixApe. With Chople Berry you survive even the strongest STAB fighting attacks from CBCross and the like. Using Protect in conjuction with Leftovers will help greatly, allowing you to survive more hits and heal off Stealth Rock damage. It also gives insurance against mixed attacking Pokemon such as Salamence or Lucario, so you don't blow the secret too early. Thunder Wave is a big NO because full paralysis gives away your secret of Counter. Toxic however can be used to wear down the foe. Ice Beam is mostly filler, but gets decent coverage and hits the Ghosts that resist Counter.
CounterBliss survives 252 HP / 252 Def also survives CB Outrage from Garchomp with or without SR in play.
Perhaps mine is more of a mixed sweeper then. I think Earth Power is the better option, since you not only invest more into SpA (and probably use a +SpA nature), but it 1HKOES STEELIX!! Just found that out. Sludge Bomb is useless beyond pure Grass types (most bugs are part poison, most grasses are part poison) like....Shaymin and Meganium.
IMO Nidoking should definitely take advantage of his base 85 speed. With the EVs, he is already tearing up what he needs to; why not use that cool speed to sweep a slow team?
As for Curse Glaceon; why not use Avalanche somewhere? As sweet as the priority is, Avalanche is almost guaranteed to double its power since you are cursing.
God... Lovely Kiss first turn. Trick Room on the switch.
MEANT FOR UU AND AS A LEAD. *NO SANDSTORM/STEALTH ROCK/HAIL DAMAGE.
On the 3rd turn, you either stay in and use Counter depending on the opponent to score a surprise KO, OR go first if the opponent is normally faster than you (say Crobat) and strike with Ice Beam, OR you switch out (like many Trick Roomers like Slowbro do).
The Speed EVs are for Ice Beam and Lovely Kiss (not under Trick Room).
The point of the set is to have Lovely Kiss sleep an opponent. Trick Room is simply to be used on the turn after Lovely Kiss as it is safe to use on the switch, and will surprise opponents.
If however, they send in a Pursuiter (say Absol), then have Jynx use Counter and kill said physical attacker.
Ice Beam works if you don't want to use Trick Room yet, or of you have and are aware Jynx is still naturally slower (i.e. Crobat).
I don't suggest keeping Jynx in all 5 turns. Counter is for Pursuiters and to score a surprise KO on physical attackers with or without Trick Room.
The point is to have Jynx serve 3 roles in 1:
1 - Status Inducer
2 - Trick Roomer
3 - Focus Sash Counter user
P.S. Have used this set to some moderate sucess, as it works as a great surprise factor (opponents are like "Wtf?") and then I bring in Pokemon like Camerupt or Marowak who resist some of her exploitable weaknesses and sweep.
I don't know about this... you're very vulnerable to Pokemon like Typlosion and Blaziken, Ice Shard is weak, Glaceon's attack is low... I don't think this puts out enough damage to be a real threat, and it's left relatively unguarded on the special side as it curses.Curse Glaceon
@ Leftovers
Ability: Snow Cloak
Careful Nature
EV: 168 HP / 120 Def / 220 SpD
-Curse
-Ice Shard
-Return
-HP [Fighting]
I tried out this set and with amazing bulk it works well best paired with Abomasnow to get hail with Glaceons ability. Snow Cloak helps it rack up Curses nicely before getting hit. Curse is a good option to increase it's defensive stat and take the fighting attacks. Ice Shard paired with Curse is good, priority with a slow pokemon is good and it gets STAB also. Return is to hit bulky waters that try to wall this and HP [Fighting] handles steel types that wall this.
You should use a Sassy nature so HP Fighting isn't weakened. Remember, it's a special attack now, unlike in previous generations. Also, consider trying out some these moves:
Wish, to help your longevity.
Avalanche, for the boost in power.
Quick Attack, for more priority.
Honestly though, Lapras does this better and has Shell Armor to prevent being wiped out by a unexpected critical hit. It also isn't weak to Fire.
And by the way, while I'm already posting... I'm not going to bash hhjj's Jynx set. TR may not last long but otherwise it's not so bad. He's clearly explained his unusual-looking choices and why he made them. There are much weirder TR leads out there on Shoddy, even LV1 Ralts with Sash and Destiny Bond. This set is sort of like that, with the added bonus of sleeping something. It's not a stupid set like, say, MissingnoMaster's Specs Wingull.
Edit: One more thing, CounterBliss might want Wish. That way you could counter something and remain at good health.
Uber Toxicroak needs Taunt / Substitute / Focus Punch / Sucker Punch in Ubers with a Life Orb. I posted a similar set in a little while ago in a thread about Ubers, and it isn't creative. Either way, Life Orb > Leftovers as you still heal 2.5% in the rain when you attack, and your Substitute already replenishes itself if you use Substitute THEN Taunt against a Whirlwinding Lugia.
Well if you care about Kyogre's Thunder then you really should be packing Parasect, not Toxicroak. Sure, Ice Beam KOs, but that is the only move that even scratches it(Thunder 5HKOs iirc).
Toxicroak is only useful in Ubers to soak up Toxic Spikes, but more importantly serve as an offensive alternative to Parasect, meaning it takes nothing from SpecsOgre's Water Spouts or Surfs.
Toxicroak is only useful in Ubers to soak up Toxic Spikes, but more importantly serve as an offensive alternative to Parasect, meaning it takes nothing from SpecsOgre's Water Spouts or Surfs.
Name: Led to your Doom.
Move 1: Counter
Move 2: Sucker Punch
Move 3: Taunt
Move 4: Overheat / Flamethrower
Item: Focus Sash
Nature: Hasty
Evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
IVs: 0 Def
I thought of this while looking through Counter users for my new PBR team (ZeroBPWin), I was suprised to see Houndoom had no Lead set so I made one up.
This set is meant to deal with a majority of Leads stoping or stunting their success.
Froslass was one of original threats I considered when making this up; though you can't outspeed you can Taunt killing 2 birds with 1 stone, Preventing Froslass from laying down another layer of spikes or Destiny Bonding allowing you to OHKO with Sucker Punch or Overheat easily.
Crobat, with a Hasty nature and 0 Defense IVs, Brave bat Crobat will OHKO 100% of the time taking 120% bare minimun, and Counter back KOing the little bat, same applies to Staraptor leads.
Ambipom though Trickier is also beat, Jolly Fake Out (Life Orb+Technician) won't KO Houndoom which allows him to Sucker Punch twice 2HKOing the little monkey, you can't Counter since Fake Out flinches. It can Taunt + Overheat or Taunt + Counter Steelix; Taunt + Sucker Punch(2HKO) Rotom or Overheat if you're weary of Trick, Taunt + Sucker Punch a U-Turing Uxie.
More info, You want to run 0 in def IVs it will allow you to Counter a majority of leads I just listed some of the most prominent, while Taunt can prevent you opponent's Stealth Rocks/Spikes/Toxic Spikes from being laid early in the game. Priority is always great, which is where Sucker Punch comes in. EVs put Houndoom at 279 Atk 2HKO a wide array of threats or OHKO some, while pumping the other half into Speed, and the remainder in SpA to boost Overheat's power.
Forgot to mention abilities, Early Bird is the preffered ability, though if you think you can get Houndoom in later, on a predicted Flamethrower/ Fire Blast / Overheat / Will-o-Wisp, go for Flash Fire.
You get the point. If you want calculations I can provide them. This was partly inspired by lead Arcanine, from Legacy Rider.
I'll re-edit the Speed EVs later if I recall he only needs 216.
I don't see how this really deals with Froslass that well. Destiny Bond DOES NOT trigger Sucker Punch (Sucker Punch only works against damaging moves), so it is useless. Froslass can either get 2 layers of spikes or 1 layer+kill you against this set.
Name: Led to your Doom.
Move 1: Counter
Move 2: Sucker Punch
Move 3: Taunt
Move 4: Overheat / Flamethrower
Item: Focus Sash
Nature: Hasty
Evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
IVs: 0 Def
I thought of this while looking through Counter users for my new PBR team (ZeroBPWin), I was suprised to see Houndoom had no Lead set so I made one up.
This set is meant to deal with a majority of Leads stoping or stunting their success.
Froslass was one of original threats I considered when making this up; though you can't outspeed you can Taunt killing 2 birds with 1 stone, Preventing Froslass from laying down another layer of spikes or Destiny Bonding allowing you to OHKO with Sucker Punch or Overheat easily.
Crobat, with a Hasty nature and 0 Defense IVs, Brave bat Crobat will OHKO 100% of the time taking 120% bare minimun, and Counter back KOing the little bat, same applies to Staraptor leads.
Ambipom though Trickier is also beat, Jolly Fake Out (Life Orb+Technician) won't KO Houndoom which allows him to Sucker Punch twice 2HKOing the little monkey, you can't Counter since Fake Out flinches. It can Taunt + Overheat or Taunt + Counter Steelix; Taunt + Sucker Punch(2HKO) Rotom or Overheat if you're weary of Trick, Taunt + Sucker Punch a U-Turing Uxie.
More info, You want to run 0 in def IVs it will allow you to Counter a majority of leads I just listed some of the most prominent, while Taunt can prevent you opponent's Stealth Rocks/Spikes/Toxic Spikes from being laid early in the game. Priority is always great, which is where Sucker Punch comes in. EVs put Houndoom at 279 Atk 2HKO a wide array of threats or OHKO some, while pumping the other half into Speed, and the remainder in SpA to boost Overheat's power.
Forgot to mention abilities, Early Bird is the preffered ability, though if you think you can get Houndoom in later, on a predicted Flamethrower/ Fire Blast / Overheat / Will-o-Wisp, go for Flash Fire.
You get the point. If you want calculations I can provide them. This was partly inspired by lead Arcanine, from Legacy Rider.
I'll re-edit the Speed EVs later if I recall he only needs 216.
When Ambipom uses Fake Out, he will still flinch you because you are slower, and so Sucker Punch won't hit. Which means you lose.
Please learn how to read, and do research before critcizing. On Frolass you Taunt first, letting them get down 1 layer of spikes and stopping her from laying down another and Destiny Bonding from there you can Overheat for the KO twice, or Sucker Punch if you think they have Thunderbolt and are willing to risk their health.
Sucker Punch goes before Fake Out so it can't Flinch therfore letting you Sucker Punch twice for the 2HKO.
- Status