Trick Room in the 5th Generation

[yiran]

That's because it sucks. If you want to start discussing him, you'll need a better starting point than that.

Ok sorry... I'll post more about it.

Anyways, Trapinch.

Probably now your thinking "Trapinch sucks! Why use him?" Sure, he is outclassed in many cases, but there are two things about him apart from his attack;

1. Arena Trap. He revenges every non airborne pokemon that lacks a priority move.

2. He is the slowest pokemon in the game except for Shuckle and Munchlax. Shuckles never going to kill anyone, and Munchlax, uh, is NFE.

He is a great back-up pokemon. If your Rankurusu dies to a Dusknoir's Shadow Punch after dealing hefty damage with Psychic, Trapinch comes in and Crunches Dusknoir to his graveyard.

Trapinch @ Life Orb
Arena Trap
Brave
252 HP/252 Atk/4 Def
Earthquake
Crunch
Rock Slide
Quick Attack

Earthquake is there for STAB.
Crunch and Rock Slide are for coverage.
Quick Attack picks of certain weak priority pokemon like Floatzel.

Trapinch is not going to see much use in OU due to that medicore attack there, but in UU, he can revenge better than Dugtrio (Fact: Trapinch has higher attack than Dugtrio).

Another problem is, his defenses are way too low, so after you revenge something chances are if Trick Room has run out, or he can't OHKO the opposing pokemon, or is a bulky Priority poke (Azumarill, for example), you'll have to switch out, giving a set up chance for them.

Trapinch is still a very good revenge killer under Trick Room.

Your thoughts?

 

[AccidentalGreed]

Really, the only thing Mushana can contribute in Trick Room successfully is using the Yawn + Setup move approach. And getting a few decent hits in, of course.

Musharna stuggles to find a niche in this cruel world of better fish, but I'm thinking that Musharna has a point over Cresselia and Ranky, and that's Yawn. If the Pokemon switches out, good for you; you've potentially got a free Trick Room and maybe hazard damage. If not, you're still Bulky enough to take crap and bulldozer hits at once, and yet you've still got a Trick Room AND a potential counter slept. I would say Musharna is a bit outclassed in some respects, but this is a damn good combo.

 

[Tobes]

Ok sorry... I'll post more about it.

Anyways, Trapinch.

Probably now your thinking "Trapinch sucks! Why use him?" Sure, he is outclassed in many cases, but there are two things about him apart from his attack;

1. Arena Trap. He revenges every non airborne pokemon that lacks a priority move.

2. He is the slowest pokemon in the game except for Shuckle and Munchlax. Shuckles never going to kill anyone, and Munchlax, uh, is NFE.

He is a great back-up pokemon. If your Rankurusu dies to a Dusknoir's Shadow Punch after dealing hefty damage with Psychic, Trapinch comes in and Crunches Dusknoir to his graveyard.

Trapinch @ Life Orb
Arena Trap
Brave
252 HP/252 Atk/4 Def
Earthquake
Crunch
Rock Slide
Quick Attack

Earthquake is there for STAB.
Crunch and Rock Slide are for coverage.
Quick Attack picks of certain weak priority pokemon like Floatzel.

Trapinch is not going to see much use in OU due to that medicore attack there, but in UU, he can revenge better than Dugtrio (Fact: Trapinch has higher attack than Dugtrio).

Another problem is, his defenses are way too low, so after you revenge something chances are if Trick Room has run out, or he can't OHKO the opposing pokemon, or is a bulky Priority poke (Azumarill, for example), you'll have to switch out, giving a set up chance for them.

Trapinch is still a very good revenge killer under Trick Room.

Your thoughts?

No. Sorry, but Trapinch sucks. Using something solely for revenging under Trick Room is a horrible idea. You're wasting precious turns trapping and multi-hit KOing that Dusknoir when you could just plow through it with Kurimugan or Roopushin or something. Also, he doesn't revenge everything. His base attack is just to low.

Now, in Little Cup he's good. So try to build off that instead. ;)

 

[Forsety]

Some more experimenting with previously suggested stuff and other Pokemon has led me to find some others who can abuse Trick Room's effect quite wonderfully and some not so well.

• Encourage Kurimgan@Life Orb w/ Outrage/Fire Fang/Superpower/Crunch or Sucker Punch. This thing is a wonderful later game TR sweeper which I'd imagine is more effective in the actual game than PO. Reason being is that Encourage cancels out LO Recoil on Fire Fang and Crunch whilst they still gain 1.69x boosts. Sucker Punch isn't at all a bad choice too since it can let this guy score priority kills out of the TR. Crunch still feels more useful though being able to brutalize Evo Stone Dusclops.
• However Baffuron/Emboar these two I have mixed opinions on, although both their power is quite strong I feel they have huge shortcomings which inversely mirror each other.
• In the case of Emboar its simply he can't switch on much and expires too quickly the HP loss is simply too huge and unlike Kurimgan can't do much outside the TR. Also sometimes within TR he is actually too fast, however he is very hard to wall at least.
• On the other hand Baffuron is wonderfully bulky and seems to not mind the recoil as much. However he can be walled alot easier than Emboar. Second a Nattorei or Bronzong pops up you can't seem to do anything without Megahorn.
• Donphan is miserable, I never seen anything with that much power get so easily walled by a Dusclops or Porygon2.
• Crawdaunt is pretty freaking hillarious actually, DW Adaptability version is quite freakishly powerful with Crunch + Crabhammer(Extra power seems worth the accuracy). Just watch out for Mach Punches, wish I could've tried it more but it really is a tad fragile. I've found Superpower + Fight Jewel is a viable combination for coverage if you feel worried about running LO. However LO will net you more major kills with its STAB.
• Azumarill, this thing is quite nice and needs more love. Downside is you have to run LO to make it work as he still comes short of some major KO's without the boost. His flipside however is he is not absolutely useless out of the Trick Room with Aqua Jet. However unlike Crawdaunt a bulky water can be enough to ruin his moment.
• Oobemu is simply an inferior Rankurusu, nothing else can be said in its favour.
• Mixed Inconsistent Octillery is pretty great too and is one of the other other special based sweepers besides Shibirudon who pulled his weight. I say mixed because all too often Inconsistent is well...inconsistent last thing you want is a s.atk nerf when running full special. But if you ever get that s.atk/atk boost at the start of the turn have fun and if you should get the +2 evasion boost during the 3 turn sweep. GG.
• Lickilicky rips weather teams apart, as if its bad enough TR took away their speed boosts. In comes Cloud Nine Lickilicky who takes away their right to damage boosts too. PowerWhip/Hammer Arm/Dragon Tail/Zen Headbutt is what I ended up running.
• Rhyperior is finally at home within the Trick Room, despite his weakness to 4 types of priority attacks he is finally able to use his full attack power and bulk, moves are really upto what you want to cover but I do suggest Rock Blast at the very least to stop stall tactics. He got trolled hard abit though without a real move to abuse Reckless with. I still feel Gigaith is abit better than Rhyperior however.
• Nidoqueen was the big surprise for me but its not bad in a TR team, tad fast which is a slight problem but it does its job if you run a special based LO set and it'll only get better whenever the Encourage recoil thing gets fixed. I like to think of it more as a glue for a team, she just slots in nicely to a team providing some well rounded offense and good bulk. Actually main reason I could look past her rather average speed was because she has the bulk needed to fit into a TR team and slow good special coverage is abit of a luxury.

One more note, having a Trick Scarf user on your TR team is also quite convenient sometimes.

 

[Galblade]

Empoleon is a REALLY good TR sweeper. Rock, Bug and dark resistances pair it nicely with Dusclops and lets Empoleon come in and OHKO Ttars that like to come in on the clops. Empoleon is probably the best pokemon for taking down Hippo aswell, provided it doesn't come in on Earthquake.

 

[yiran]

Trapinch is usable as a late game sweeper when Ground Immunities have been eliminated. In UU it does well at the very least.

 

[CPU]

Empoleon is a REALLY good TR sweeper. Rock, Bug and dark resistances pair it nicely with Dusclops and lets Empoleon come in and OHKO Ttars that like to come in on the clops. Empoleon is probably the best pokemon for taking down Hippo aswell, provided it doesn't come in on Earthquake.

Practically every Fighting type can do what you said except taking down Hippowdon, and even then most aren't weak to Ground.

 

[Lee]

The problem with Trapinch is that he's a total liability. You can only have 6 Pokemon on your team and there is a lot of competition for those teamslots on a 5th Gen Trick Room team. Do you really want to give up a valuable slot for something with 45 base HP, 45 Def, 45 SpD and a modest Attack stat? Arena Trap is good, but not -that- good. And there's no way in hell he's going on a late game sweep.

Kurimugan

Excellent, I was wondering when somebody would use him! I think that, along with Rankurusu, he is the greatest gift that Gen 5 brought to Trick Room teams. Outrage is just so broken and, assuming you've worn down the Steels, it completely removes the opponent's ability to switch around to waste the Trick Room turns. The ideal late game sweeper. Do you think you're really getting enough mileage out of Life Orb though? I found that Outrage was the only move worth a damn so I just slapped Choice Band on it. The syngery between Encourage and Life Orb is cool but Outrage is the backbone of the set so I'd rather focus on that.

Emboar

I think comparisons can be drawn between him and Rampardos. They both have insane damage output but can often end up being a burden on the team unless you go out of your way to provide them with all the support they need. Nonetheless, I am very excited to try out Emboar. He has some excellent resists (Dark, Bug, Fire, Ice), fantastic coverage and the base power of his moves are something to be admired (Flare Blitz has 216BP, Head Smash has 180BP, Wild Bolt has 108BP and Hammer Arm sits at 150BP). I think Life Orb is out of the question though which is a shame against stuff like Garchomp and Hippowdon but for the mostpart, Expert Belt is better anyway.

 

[Psikid]

To those with more experience and wisdom than I: could a mono-Psychic TR team prove feasible? Rankurusu could sweep and set up TR if necessary, (Regeneration) Slowbro could set up and stall, Gallade could lead or fill in gaps as a "quick strike" thanks to Sucker Punch, Celebi could also lead with SR and TR, Espeon could provide Magic Mirror support with possible sweeping/support, and Gardevoir could provide status/healing/screens.

 

[DDRMaster]

To those with more experience and wisdom than I: could a mono-Psychic TR team prove feasible? Rankurusu could sweep and set up TR if necessary, (Regeneration) Slowbro could set up and stall, Gallade could lead or fill in gaps as a "quick strike" thanks to Sucker Punch, Celebi could also lead with SR and TR, Espeon could provide Magic Mirror support with possible sweeping/support, and Gardevoir could provide status/healing/screens.

The main problem I see with a mono-Psychic team in general is that no Psychic type resists Dark or Bug and only Girafarig and Meloetta. I suppose it could work if every single one of your Pokemon has a way to deal with Scizor and Tyranitar but it seems really hard to pull of.

Gallade and Bronzong would probably be your best bets since they take on Tyranitar pretty well. Rankurusu is also obviously good as a Trick Room Sweeper.

 

[Galblade]

Practically every Fighting type can do what you said except taking down Hippowdon, and even then most aren't weak to Ground.

Didn't know fighting mons could take down Randorusu too...

Empoleon's only liability is when it's hydro pump misses. It OHKO's all SS mons with it. With 111 SpAtk and LO it OHKO's alot with hydro pump anyway.

Edit: I thought I mentioned it as an epic sweeper against SS, well I said it now ;)

Also Gallade unfortunately doesn't get Sucker Punch, it gets Shadow Sneak though.

 

[Forsety]

Do you think you're really getting enough mileage out of Life Orb though? I found that Outrage was the only move worth a damn so I just slapped Choice Band on it. The syngery between Encourage and Life Orb is cool but Outrage is the backbone of the set so I'd rather focus on that.

Well it depends on how you see it, its kinda a personal choice.

CB Outrage should work fine too. I just simply liked the choice of Fire Fang or Crunch so I could also use him earlier for taking out potential sweep cockblockers because hes not really limited to only a end game trumpcard. Though like I said I think LO is only really for the Wifi players and far as simulator goes CB is probably better for now.

I think in the end I just ended up having a personal preference for Shubarago as he had better synergy with a Rankurusu TR setup and its pretty hardcore when Swarm activates and you're plowing down 'counters'. I haven't tried this out yet myself but I think Kurimgan may actually be better off with Slowking, Bronzong or Burunkeru as its TR setup partner. They seem to really draw in the stuff which makes it easy for it to just switch in and immediately threaten. As it is, I'm still drunk on the raw offensive power of Rankurusu so I focus my choices around him.

I think comparisons can be drawn between him and Rampardos. They both have insane damage output but can often end up being a burden on the team unless you go out of your way to provide them with all the support they need.

One minor difference between the two, Emboar does not get blocked at all. I find his coverage is pretty much near perfect with balanced power, this is what Rampardos lacks since best he can do is Fire or Thunderpunch. Emboar just has some way of doing huge damage against everything without fear of something wasting its time (cept with protect/subs).

For something which is unlikely to be coming back in this is great, as quite frankly it does way more damage to itself than you'll be taking often. I had a mind to try running Shell Bell because of this but never got round to trying. This is unlike Kurimgan, Scizor, Azumarill, Shubarago who can find opportunities throughout the match to keep coming back and harrass your opponent.

Empoleon's only liability is when it's hydro pump misses. It OHKO's all SS mons with it. With 111 SpAtk and LO it OHKO's alot with hydro pump anyway.

I tried out Empolean too in TR, it was quite frankly a utter dissapointment. It just doesn't have the complete coverage weaker mons need or the absolute raw power + bulk to justify using TR for it.

 

[AccidentalGreed]

As far as Trick Room support goes, I think a fast Trick Roomer with Dual Screens and a filler move is plausible to help "get the party started". Since most of you guys seem to be more experienced in Trick Room than me, is the “fast Trick Roomer” strategy plausible? I find myself wanting to suicide without hurting Erufuun, Rankurusu, or Shanderaa, and to me, having Choice Band Kurimugan on the team makes me set-up bait sometimes, even though it hits hard as it should. If only Magnezone learned Trick Room so I could deal with Scizor more easily.

 

[cobaph]

Baffuron is a good addition. I put him in my non-TR teams too. Herbivore Baffuron counters standard Nattorei (after taunt) who don't run Gyro Ball/Iron Head, Erufuun, and Jarooda. The boost in Atk is pretty useful for sweeping with his coverage, plus providing an immunity to a common move type with all the Grass Knot, Leech Seed, Power Whips, and Leaf Storms running around, along with Stun Spore and Sleep Powder. Some people don't even read the text and will consistently keep boosting you.

A pretty niche role, but preferred often enough to warrant viability.

Also, I've noticed that TR teams destroy Dittos, which definitely seems to cause grief to a lot of people in general.

 

[Forsety]

Baffuron is a good addition. I put him in my non-TR teams too. Herbivore Baffuron counters standard Nattorei (after taunt) who don't run Gyro Ball/Iron Head, Erufuun, and Jarooda. The boost in Atk is pretty useful for sweeping with his coverage, plus providing an immunity to a common move type with all the Grass Knot, Leech Seed, Power Whips, and Leaf Storms running around, along with Stun Spore and Sleep Powder. Some people don't even read the text and will consistently keep boosting you.

What moveset item did you run on your Baffuron? I did absolutely adore the Herbivore boost (take that Breloom/Jalord) but I did find issues finding a good balance between coverage.

I thoroughly agree though Herbivore alone is the reason to use him, there are many highly threatening grass attacks flying around this generation. Though I'd love to meet some of these repeat Power Whip/Leaf Storm spammers you speak of....

Also, I've noticed that TR teams destroy Dittos, which definitely seems to cause grief to a lot of people in general.

Oh yes I did notice this and I love it, glorious Scarf Ditto tears are glorious.

Since most of you guys seem to be more experienced in Trick Room than me, is the “fast Trick Roomer” strategy plausible?

Fast TR setup...only to a moderate extent if they pack some kind of major status and basically fast enough to get the first move in one some slower bulkier Pokemon but still slow enough that TR ruins sweepers when it goes off. Shinporaa the Psychic/Flying with Magic Guard is probably the only one who can pull off what you're thinking of and maybe Jirachi.

Thing is its simply easier sometimes to have something bulky like Porygon2 Magic Coat since usually you're forced to attack it or risk losing momentum.

 

[CPU]

Didn't know fighting mons could take down Randorusu too...

Empoleon's only liability is when it's hydro pump misses. It OHKO's all SS mons with it. With 111 SpAtk and LO it OHKO's alot with hydro pump anyway.

Edit: I thought I mentioned it as an epic sweeper against SS, well I said it now ;)

Also Gallade unfortunately doesn't get Sucker Punch, it gets Shadow Sneak though.

You never mentioned Landros in your previous post, either.

 

[FearZeCrawdaunt]

Can't be bothered to read the thread (5 pages... I'm lazy) but if it hasn't been mentioned, the presence of triple battles is going to make trick room that much more effective.

Have your trick roomer(s) on the edge and have a good defensive poke in the middle. First turn you have 2 attacks and a trick room go out, second term I would predict all three of their pokes die. Seriously, that's how much a threat a trick room team could be in triple battle. A (pretty much) surefire way to have all three of your pokes go before theirs and likely using powerful attackers, it couldn't get any better. Heck, you could have your middle guy curse if you want, and enjoy more survivability and power. The one thing to watch out for though is that your middle poke doesn't have important weaknesses, since they'll be able to target it with all three of their poke's. Nattorei SEEMS like a good option, 11 resistances and only 2 weaknesses, but a weakness to fighting will probably see him getting punched in some fashion. Nonetheless, they'll take damage too, and a rugged helmet will help your sweep the next turn. Though leftovers would help Nattorei survive after that. You can specially target fighting or fire threats the next turn anyways (provided Nattorei managed to survive the first turn).

Whether or not TR will be effective in single battles in 5th gen, double and triple battles will benefit greatly from it's presence and new potential sweepers.

 

[cobaph]

What moveset item did you run on your Baffuron? I did absolutely adore the Herbivore boost (take that Breloom/Jalord) but I did find issues finding a good balance between coverage.

I'd love to meet some of these repeat Power Whip/Leaf Storm spammers you speak of....

I use 4-attack Baffuron: Afro Break, Wild Bolt, Megahorn, and Earthquake. I used to run Swords Dance over Wild Bolt, but he faces a lot of Burungeru switching in. While not necessarily hitting everything for SE damage, it manages to do neutral damage to everything that's common right now. And there's no doubt that STAB Afro Break with Herbivore boosts hurts anything that doesn't resist it really badly.

Also, it's really funny, but uncommon, the grass spammers. I got boosted to +3 before by a Jaroda before the user was like, "Oh god, I should've been paying attention." Getting Power Whipped twice from Nattoreis happens PRETTY frequently for me. Although slightly unrelated but still relevant, seeing as how fantastic of an option P2 is on TR, Trace Porygon2 gets a lot of this too. I've been Thunderbolted repeatedly by Volt Absorb Jolteon and Surfed by Water Absorb Vaporeon for full HP recovery just because people don't pay attention to what they're doing.

And for some reason, people use fire moves instead of fighting on my Baffuron. I guess people automatically associate Herbivore with grass types. Though this isn't really a "strategy" since it's based on human error and laziness, Herbivore stops a lot in Gen V.

TR helps Baffuron because he's pretty much a bulky and slow version of Tauros with slightly different moves for coverage. Without TR, he usually has enough bulk to take a few hits without recovery.

 

[RocketSurgery]

The past few days I've been trying out a trick room + sandstorm team on PO. The goal was to add consistent sandstorm damage while not taking much myself (i.e., abusing rank, bronzong and dory). Unfortunately, I haven't been doing too well.

The team consisted of hippowdown, porygon2, bronzong, Rankurusu, dory, and [x], where I tried a few different pokemon in place of [x], while mainly keeping the rest of the team constant. There were no dream world abilities on the team so I was just on the "wifi tier". So, you saw teams, could switch the lead, etc.

Leads: Hippowdown is basically there to set up sandstorm with sandstream, rocks if need. Alternatively P2 to magic coat and set up trick room. Whichever looked like it was the best option based on the foe's team.

TR setup + Sweepers: Bronzong on physical side (no stealth rock since Hippo & P2 should ideally have that covered) and Rank on special.

Fast Sweeper in case TR is down: Jolly Dory with sand throw, 4 attacks. I've considered testing out garchomp, too. I mainly went with Dory to abuse the speed boost in sandstorm.

[x] was supposed to fill holes in the team and be a sweeper that comes in when TR goes up. Unfortunately, I've yet to find a good fit for this position. I tried Emboar, Heatran, Empoleon, but they've all left something to be desired. The main problem I have is bulky waters. I opted for shadow ball over grass knot on Rank but I'm considering reversing that since outside of [x] I have no grass moves or electric moves, and bulky waters wall me and aren't friendly to hippowdown. Hence, although mixed sweeper Emboar could learn grass knot and wild bolt, I needed the water type to switch in on it, but grass knot and wild bolt couldn't KO with the mixed set. Maybe a pure physical or special set could, but then waters of the opposite defense style are still hard to deal with. I tried macho brace Jirachi over bronzong, so that it could have thunderpunch, but that didn't seem to work too well.

Part of it could be I don't have good EV spreads for some of them, but I also really feel like I haven't found an [x] that has good synergy with the rest of the team. Anyone have any good ideas?

 

[Forsety]

Bulky water problem? Shibirudon, Tangrowth, Lickilicky all come to mind...

Tangrowth is just a plain old powerhouse and can sleep potential switch ins and gets Regeneration as a DW ability to ease up on hazard/passive damage. He has a disadvantage though in that it wouldn't be unusual he just gets Ice Beam'd to hell which just about every water type can learn.

Lickilicky can Power Whip and shuts down weather teams while at the same time also being immune to your sandstorm (and cancelling it but thats besides the point). Although since you've got Drill mole + Pory half your team would end up fighting weak and thats pretty much the dominant attacking type this gen.

Shibirudon has no weaknesses, good bulk, STAB elec attacks and Grass Knot and if you run Dragon Tail can be a good phazer against CM/Curse abusers. But his problem is your Sandstorm works against him killing his normally decent HP.

Others I would've thought had better synergy have trouble in the Trick Room.

Gamageroge has decent s.atk good HP/decent defenses and Grass Knot, Water Absorb and that Water/Ground typing so doesn't mind your Sandstorm either. But hes really a tad bit on the fast side for a TR team.

I think main problem is you're trying to do way too much with only 6 team slots, most TR rooms have to move so fast that often they can't even be bothered setting rocks let alone trying to get a good synergy with Sandstorm too. Really only reason you're even setting up Sandstorm is only to use the Drill Mole and you have to ask yourself do you REALLY need it that badly? I mean a Dory, Bronzong, Rank core can function just as well in a non-TR team. As it stands half your team are TR setups and you have nothing to receive the TR, you could probably do well with just 2 TR users.

 

[Quegg]

Herbivore Baffuron and Abagoora seem to work quite well together. Paired with, perhaps, a Volt Absorb Lanturn (unfortunately there's nothing really slow enough to take advantage of LightningRod in Trick Room), I can see them being quite a formidable team.

 

[breh]

To those with more experience and wisdom than I: could a mono-Psychic TR team prove feasible?

An interesting idea... But monotype teams suck though.

However, that doesn't mean you can't run many of them on the same team. I did a similar thing in gen 4 UU pre-Heracross; I ran triple-psychic, with Mesprit (Lead, but still), Alakazam, and Gardevoir on the same team last gen. Although it had its weaknesses, I was often pretty happy with the end result, honestly. A similar thing could be done running Rankurusu / bulky, powerful Psychic / bulky, powerful Psychic, but I'm not sure what exactly you could use. There's a veritable list of NUs to use, but I'm not sure what any of them (Exeggutor, Oobeemu, and Musharna, and Slowbro/king, among others) are really able to do, especially in terms of the pure ability to break things down that Rankurusu has.

@ Rocket Surgery:

Have you tried to use Scizor? Maybe a Choice Band Guts Roobushin?

 

[Nandosagi]

I've been running various novelty Trick Room teams over Global Link battles to get a feel for new Pokemon and mechanics this gen, and I can definitely attest to just how effective it is in Triples.

There's something I'd like to bring up, though. What I've noticed is that Triple Battles tend to go fast, meaning that the sixth slot - which is usually the mop-up Pokemon for the end of the battle, is much more likely to end up coming out while Trick Room is still up. Has anyone done a more in depth test on how the mechanics of Triple Battles reflect upon the structure of the common Trick Room team, and what changes should probably be made?

 

[RocketSurgery]

I think main problem is you're trying to do way too much with only 6 team slots, most TR rooms have to move so fast that often they can't even be bothered setting rocks let alone trying to get a good synergy with Sandstorm too. Really only reason you're even setting up Sandstorm is only to use the Drill Mole and you have to ask yourself do you REALLY need it that badly? I mean a Dory, Bronzong, Rank core can function just as well in a non-TR team. As it stands half your team are TR setups and you have nothing to receive the TR, you could probably do well with just 2 TR users.

Actually, the reason I tried adding sandstorm was because Rank and Bronzong don't take damage from it and it added extra damage to the opposing side. The drill mole came in when I was deciding on the fast sweeper.

Otherwise, I agree. It is hard to cram everything I want into 6 pokemon. Hippowdown benefits slightly from TR, but not too much. Tyranitar might get more out of it, actually, and serve a similar role as Hippowdown, sandstorm-wise. The [x] pokemon would ideally also benefit from sandstorm + TR, or at least be neutral to one of them. I might try Cradily in that slot next time I test this sort of team to see how that does, since it could benefit from the storm and TR, but with Cradily's low attacking stats it might not be able to use both effectively at the same time.

As for scizor or roopushin - they may not be good candidates for [x], as I'd still be missing some type coverage that waters would make me regret. If I cut down on slowmons, maybe they could go over Porygon2.

 

[Romano]

Ever tried using Lickilicky in a TR team. His Explosion is nerfed now,but he has got a handy new trick in the form of Cloud Nine. He's the bulkiest weather stopper in the game and works great against Kyogre,so he works great in the VGC metagame. He stops Drizzle,survives a water spout and finshes off Kyogre with Power Whip.
I've made a double TR/sun team and it works great! Lickylicky will rise to the OU tier.