Swampert

Not entirely. It has a good movepool and ability, Unaware. Unaware differentiates it from all of the other bulky waters. Plus, it's an extremely useful ability.
But then again, it's Quagsire. Also, it just takes too much damage, it has bad offensive stats, and Storm Drain is infinitely better than unaware
 

SJCrew

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Unaware is also disappointing because it doesn't cancel out Speed boosts. Were it not for that, I would have tried out Kokoromori sooner or later. :/
 
Not entirely. It has a good movepool and ability, Unaware. Unaware differentiates it from all of the other bulky waters. Plus, it's an extremely useful ability.
I haven't seen much bulky waters anyway. All I have seen are Swampert leads, 2 gyarados, and 2 milotic, 1 vaporeon, and 1 suicune, of about... 50 battles maybe...
 
the only move any other ground/water has over swampert is recover, but pert has stealth rock and roar and would be kind of ridiculous with recover.
 
the only move any other ground/water has over swampert is recover, but pert has stealth rock and roar and would be kind of ridiculous with recover.
Gastrodon also has a far better ability which gives him an extra immunity and a boost to his moves
 
Gastrodon also has a far better ability which gives him an extra immunity and a boost to his moves
lets see...a LO ADAMANT 252atk metagross's explosion does 79.2%-93.3%(it no longer halves the target defece in gen 5 so i just half the damage dealt) to a standard mixpert and it deals 85.5%-100.5% to a 252/252 Relaxed gastrodon. So you can't say gastrodon has a better ability, swampert's damp is pretty useful as well.
 
lets see...a LO ADAMANT 252atk metagross's explosion does 79.2%-93.3%(it no longer halves the target defece in gen 5 so i just half the damage dealt) to a standard mixpert and it deals 85.5%-100.5% to a 252/252 Relaxed gastrodon. So you can't say gastrodon has a better ability, swampert's damp is pretty useful as well.
Not many Pokemon use Explosion anymore. Suicide leads are somewhat of an exception, so I guess that LeadPert could utilize Damp. Otherwise, Stormdrain is definitely better (immunity to one move < one type). However, Swampert has enormously better stats than Gastrodon.
 
Not many Pokemon use Explosion anymore. Suicide leads are somewhat of an exception, so I guess that LeadPert could utilize Damp. Otherwise, Stormdrain is definitely better (immunity to one move < one type). However, Swampert has enormously better stats than Gastrodon.
i agree.

i do not play wifi but in my town there are several competitive players and we often make new sets for making our pokemon more original so, their swampys are not leads all(i´ve seen choice banders phazers cursers,..)
 

Legacy Raider

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Not many Pokemon use Explosion anymore. Suicide leads are somewhat of an exception, so I guess that LeadPert could utilize Damp. Otherwise, Stormdrain is definitely better (immunity to one move < one type). However, Swampert has enormously better stats than Gastrodon.
Damp makes you lose Stealth Rock. Without Stealth Rock, I'd use Gastrodon or Unaware Quagsire any day.
 

SJCrew

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Keep in mind that in saying that, you lose out on his significantly better overall stats, including offense, Defense, and the ability to phaze.

Gastrodon's Ice Beam vs. Garchomp: 86.3% - 102%
Gastrodon's Avalanche: 87.4% - 103.1%
Swampert's Avalanche: 109.8% - 130%

You don't want me to do the calcs for Quagsire. :/
 
Keep in mind that in saying that, you lose out on his significantly better overall stats, including offense, Defense, and the ability to phaze.

Gastrodon's Ice Beam vs. Garchomp: 86.3% - 102%
Gastrodon's Avalanche: 87.4% - 103.1%
Swampert's Avalanche: 109.8% - 130%

You don't want me to do the calcs for Quagsire. :/
Also, keep in mind that Gastrodon doesn't learn Avalanche.
So, another (tiny) reason to use Swampert.
 

Legacy Raider

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Keep in mind that in saying that, you lose out on his significantly better overall stats, including offense, Defense, and the ability to phaze.

Gastrodon's Ice Beam vs. Garchomp: 86.3% - 102%
Gastrodon's Avalanche: 87.4% - 103.1%
Swampert's Avalanche: 109.8% - 130%

You don't want me to do the calcs for Quagsire. :/
Yeah it's a shame the other two aren't a bit bulkier :(. Gastrodon has pretty much equivalent special defense, instant recovery, a Water immunity, higher SpA and the potential to boost it with Storm drain. If only its Attack and Defense were switched, it would be so much more useful overall...
 
even still 68% of swamperts have stealth rock and 50% of them have roar(only 1 in 3 are leads). it's clearly the biggest draw of using it(while still getting a great ttar/metagross/heatran counter) and no other water/ground type has either move.
 
Not many Pokemon use Explosion anymore. Suicide leads are somewhat of an exception, so I guess that LeadPert could utilize Damp. Otherwise, Stormdrain is definitely better (immunity to one move < one type). However, Swampert has enormously better stats than Gastrodon.
1:Explosion will do shit to Pert after the nerf, and Gastro's stats aren't that bad
 
Bump, but after a week or so of testing, I've really come to love CursePert again. While not the "instant win" that you get with some set up sweepers like Blaziken or Dory, it's very satisfying to watch people struggle to take him down after a couple of curses.

I use a ChestoRest set, that plays similarly to ChestoRest Kingdra: curse up as much as you can; rest; then sweep. It takes special hits like a boss (because of lots of investment) and after a curse or two nothing is hurting its physical side. Get rid of certain threats and all the grass moves from your opponent and it will likely cause them a lot of grief.
 
Care to post your set? I can hazard a guess.

Swampert@Chesto Berry
Torrent
Careful 252 HP / 4 Df / 252 SpD
Curse
Rest
Earthquake
Waterfall/Avalanche

404 HP and 306 SpD does seem pretty good. What is your At and Df after one boost? Ground and Ice seem like better coverage that with Water. Plus when you're so slow Avalanche will almost be at 120 BP. Seems pretty good to me. Virizion and Serperior would obviously chase you away but you don't have to worry about Serperior in Wifi. If you had to have a 4x weakness, outside of Steel and Poison, Grass ain't that bad.
 
Care to post your set? I can hazard a guess.

Swampert@Chesto Berry
Torrent
Careful 252 HP / 4 Df / 252 SpD
Curse
Rest
Earthquake
Waterfall/Avalanche

404 HP and 306 SpD does seem pretty good. What is your At and Df after one boost? Ground and Ice seem like better coverage that with Water. Plus when you're so slow Avalanche will almost be at 120 BP. Seems pretty good to me. Virizion and Serperior would obviously chase you away but you don't have to worry about Serperior in Wifi. If you had to have a 4x weakness, outside of Steel and Poison, Grass ain't that bad.
Not sure what my EV's are exactly, but it's pretty close to max max SpD, yeah. I go for Avalanche over Waterfall. You lose STAB but gain considerable coverage (unresisted outside of balloon and Shedinja?) - and I think Avalanche has negative priority this gen so you'll always go last (not that you'd be outspeeding much after a Curse). But the stuff that usually carry balloons can't do anything to Swampert with a couple of curses (Heatran with HP Grass might be troublesome, but most don't carry that anymore; Metagross can't touch Pert; Dory can't touch it after a couple of curses, etc).

Virizion, Gyarados, Nattorei, Celebi and Breloom are obviously the biggest threats to this set but all can be handled. Life orb Latios can handle them all though pretty nicely (except for Gyarados, but there's lots of stuff that can take that down).

Yeah, Grass is actually a pretty good type to be 4x weak to (relatively speaking, of course), although Nattorei running everywhere can ruin your fun, and Virizion uses YOU as set up bait, which isn't fun as that thing is awesome.

I'm not going to sit here and claim it's the best set in the world, or a world beater - but there's something pretty satisfying about taking your favourite Pokemon and building a team around it, and I've really enjoyed using this Swampert in this gen.
 
You should post it in the bulky boost thread. It's the exact kind of set and mon I can get behind. A double boost move, good HP and bulk in the non boosted stat, and good coverage. Kind of sucks you have to resort to Rest for healing but resisting Fire, Electric and Rock certainly helps.
 
I think Impish would be a notable mention over Relaxed if one wasn't going to use Ice Beam or Boiling Water, as it allows you to outspeed AntiLead-Champ as a Lead.
 

voodoo pimp

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I go for Avalanche over Waterfall. You lose STAB but gain considerable coverage (unresisted outside of balloon and Shedinja?)
Also Bronzong, Rotom-F/H/W, and Furiijio. More generally, any ice resist with Levitate.

Edit: and lolSurskit.
 

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