Nidoqueen

[Mastermind221]

Nidoqueen - The Defensive Nido

Really surprised no one's done a thread on her yet. Oh well, least I get to start one!

Type: Poison/Ground

Stats: HP 90/Atk 82/Def 87/SpAtk 75/SpDef 85/Spd 76

Abilities: Poison Point, Rivalry, & Sheer Force (DW)

Movepool:

Level Up
Scratch, Tail Whip, Double Kick, Poison Sting, Little By Little, Body Slam, Earth Power, Superpower

TM/HM
Hone Claws, Roar, Toxic, Venom Shock, Hidden Power, Sunny Day, Taunt, Ice Beam, Blizzard, Hyper Beam, Protect, Rain Dance, Frustration, Knock Down, Thunderbolt, Thunder, Earthquake, Return, Dig, Shadow Ball, Brick Break, Double Team, Slime Wave, Flamethrower, Sludge Bomb, Sandstorm, Fire Blast, Rock Tomb, Aerial Ace, Torment, Facade, Rest, Attract, Thief, Canon, Echo Voice, Focus Blast, Fling, Devastate, Postpone, Shadow Claw, Giga Impact, Stone Edge, Smooth Over, Rock Slide, Dragon Tail, Poison Jab, Swagger, Substitute, Rock Smash, Cut Surf, Strength

Egg Moves
Beat Up, Charm, Counter, Disable, Endure, Focus Energy, Iron Tail, Little By Little, Poison Tail, Pursuit, Skull Bash, Supersonic, Take Down

Pre-Evo Moves
Growl, Fury Swipes, Bite, Helping Hand, Toxic Spikes, Flatter, Crunch, Captivate, Poison Fang

Gen IV Only Moves
(TM/HM)-Focus Punch, Water Pulse, Shock Wave, Secret Power, Dragon Pulse, Avalanche, Stealth Rock, Captivate, Sleep Talk, Natural Gift, Whirlpool
(Move Tutor;Not Compatible w/ DW Abilities)-Fire Punch, Fury Cutter, Ice Punch, Icy Wind, Thunderpunch, Helping Hand, Snore, Uproar, Aqua Tail, Mud-Slap, Outrage, Super Fang, Headbutt

Movesets:

Nidoqueen-Leftovers (Poison Point)
Impish (Def+,SpAtk-)
252 HP/4 Atk/252 Def
Earthquake
Super Fang
Toxic Spikes/Stealth Rock
Dragon Tail

Pretty straight-forward. Only set I can think of at this point (sucks that Black SLudge can't be transferred to Gen V games). I prefer Toxic Spikes over Stealth Rock on Nidoqueen just because she can use them better. In case a levitating Ghost should come into the fray, just knock them out w/ Dragon Tail.

Any suggestions/ideas/comments???

 

[I Am Doz]

`I use a specially Defensive version, which to quote a few of my opponents:
'is a bitch to take out'

Nidoqueen @ Leftovers
Careful Nature
252 HP/56 ATK/200 SP.D
Earthquake
Dragon Tail
Toxic Spikes
Stealth Rock

The idea is simple, select the appropiate hazard first, then set up the second,followed by phazing out everything EQ can't hit, the 56 ATK EV's ensure Nidoqueen has some bit to her attacks, while max HP and 200 SP.D EV's mean unstabed super-effective moves 90% can't OHKO, and rarely 2HKO factoring in leftovers

 

[KokoaKiwi]

Nidoqueen is just outclassed by Nidoking especially since the both got Sheer Force...
I'm not sure how would a defensive queen work in the 5th Gen metagame.

 

[Mastermind221]

Nidoqueen is just outclassed by Nidoking especially since the both got Sheer Force...
I'm not sure how would a defensive queen work in the 5th Gen metagame.

Nidoqueen isn't intended for using things like Sheer Force. She's almost always been used defensively. ANd whether or not she's good in the Gen V metagame is what this forum is for. Any thoughts?

 

[I Am Doz]

She is good, because she can take super effectives hits well enough most of the time, plus she only needs to be around for a max of 4/5 turns to set up what she needs to, plus most attacks which hit super effectively arent usually STAB'd. So in my opinion she is going to be low/mid OU

 

[Cshadow]

Nidoqueen's other abilities absolutely suck. Poison Point can be a liability because of it's chance to Poison Guts/Quick Feet Pokemon when switching into a resisted contact attack (specifically, Fighting attacks). Sheer Force can guarantee there is a little bite in her bark thanks to it's 1.3 boost. With Leftovers and Sheer Force, it's as though she's holding two items.

Nidoqueen @ Leftovers
Trait: Sheer Force (Encourage)
EVs: 252 Hp/ 252 Def/ 4 Sdef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Toxic Spikes
- Roar / Dragon Tail
- Earth Power
- Taunt / Filler

It's the one from my Hail thread, but with Taunt over Blizzard. Nidoqueen can also be an interesting way to deal with Nattorei, Skarmory, or other Steel-types thanks to Flamethrower. She resists Power Whip and is immune to Thunder Wave. Fighting, Poison, Electric (immune), Bug, and Rock resistances are also very useful.

However, running Sheer Force means she loses out on Stealth Rock. Eh, Toxic Spikes in and of themselves are fairly valuable anyways.

EDIT: Oops she does not resist Power Whip I'm just dumb

 

[PokéMontage]

Nidoqueen is just outclassed by Nidoking especially since the both got Sheer Force...

Nidoking might be a lot more useful in this metagame, but he can't "outclass" Nidoqueen due to the simple fact that they fill completely different roles. Nidoking plays an offensive role, and Nidoqueen is defensive.

 

[iDunno]

I use Nidoqueen on stall teams a lot if I need a Pokemon that can set up Toxic Spikes and cover up a Terakion weakness at the same time. Encourage helps Nidoqueen not become total set up fodder either since it makes it moderately powerful and defensive at the same time. Nidoqueen is by no means bad. It's just horribly underrated.

 

[Thorhammer]

Nidoking might be a lot more useful in this metagame, but he can't "outclass" Nidoqueen due to the simple fact that they fill completely different roles. Nidoking plays an offensive role, and Nidoqueen is defensive.

They fill slightly different roles. They have the same type, same abilities, similar movepool, and similar stats. They're different, but not that different.

 

[Mastermind221]

Nidoqueen's other abilities absolutely suck. Poison Point can be a liability because of it's chance to Poison Guts/Quick Feet Pokemon when switching into a resisted contact attack (specifically, Fighting attacks). Sheer Force can guarantee there is a little bite in her bark thanks to it's 1.3 boost. With Leftovers and Sheer Force, it's as though she's holding two items.

Nidoqueen @ Leftovers
Trait: Sheer Force (Encourage)
EVs: 252 Hp/ 252 Def/ 4 Sdef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Toxic Spikes
- Roar / Dragon Tail
- Earth Power
- Taunt / Filler

It's the one from my Hail thread, but with Taunt over Blizzard. Nidoqueen can also be an interesting way to deal with Nattorei, Skarmory, or other Steel-types thanks to Flamethrower. She resists Power Whip and is immune to Thunder Wave. Fighting, Poison, Electric (immune), Bug, and Rock resistances are also very useful.

However, running Sheer Force means she loses out on Stealth Rock. Eh, Toxic Spikes in and of themselves are fairly valuable anyways.

Wouldn't Earthquake be a better choice as Rock-types like Terakion & Tyranitar get a SpDef boost in sandstorm? And Being part Ground-type, Nidoqueen doesn't resist Grass-attacks, though you do bring in an interesting point about her & Steel-types.

 

[Thorhammer]

Wouldn't Earthquake be a better choice as Rock-types like Terakion & Tyranitar get a SpDef boost in sandstorm? And Being part Ground-type, Nidoqueen doesn't resist Grass-attacks, though you do bring in an interesting point about her & Steel-types.

Earthquake doesn't get a boost from Sheer Force. After the boost from Sheer Force, Earth Power has 117 power.

 

[PokéMontage]

They fill slightly different roles. They have the same type, same abilities, similar movepool, and similar stats. They're different, but not that different.

What matters is how you play them. Nidoqueen will be EV'd more defensively to take advantage of the resistances the typing offers, and if you want Toxic Spikes to be set up (or Stealth Rock if Poison Point doesn't bother you), you're going to go with Nidoqueen. Nidoking will be EV'd offensively and probably won't run any support moves.

In a more offensive metagame, Nidoking might be overall more useful, but in order for something to "outclass" something else, they both need to fill the same role, and one needs to do it better. Unless you run an offensive Nidoqueen, Nidoking won't ouclass her.

 

[Mastermind221]

Earthquake doesn't get a boost from Sheer Force. After the boost from Sheer Force, Earth Power has 117 power.

Ah, now that makes sense.

 

[Lee]

There were a few occasions in 4th Gen where Nidoqueen became a very good Pokemon, with lots of good players throwing all sorts of praise her way. Her ability to counter some of the biggest threats such as Lucario, Scizor, Zapdos, Heracross, Breloom, some Tyranitar, Jolteon, Machamp etc, whilst being able to set up Toxic Spikes and Stealth Rock and phaze made her a great team player.

Sometimes she didn't hit quite hard enough for my liking (for example, 0 Atk Earthquake never OHKO's 0/0 Infernape) so Sheer Force looks set to be a much appreciated boost. A free boost to the likes of Earth Power, Fire Blast and Ice Beam will help her to nab OHKO's on some of the frailer stuff that she hits super-effectively. A notable example being Salamence who is always OHKO'd by Sheer Force Ice Beam but never crumbles to an unboosted Ice Beam. You also do cool stuff like OHKOing even 252/252+ Forretress which is very handy for preventing the Rapid Spin.

Unfortunately, the 5th Gen metagame seems very unkind to Nidoqueen because Earthquake is at least as common as it was last gen and the users of it hit harder than ever. Doryuuzu, Garchomp and Landlos being prime examples. And don't forget people actually use Psychic attacks now! Rain obviously fucks with her in any of it's forms and she's a free switch in for the ever-dangerous Latios. On the bright side she's pretty close to a hard counter for standard Roobushin. 0 SpA Earth Power does about 35% to 120/136 Roob...Nidoqueen resists Drain Punch and Stone Edge and can use Dragon Tail/Roar to phaze Roob and reduce Payback damage at the same time.

She'll probably not be as valuable as she was last gen but she might still pop up on rare occasions if only because she learns Toxic Spikes, hits reasonably hard (for a wall at least), and can counter a handful of threatening pokes.

Nidoqueen @ Leftovers
Bold
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Sheer Force
- Toxic Spikes
- Dragon Tail / Roar
- Earth Power
- Fire Blast / Ice Beam / Stealth Rock

 

[Jiggy]

This was the Nidoqueen I used on the recent ladder:


Nidoqueen @ Life Orb
Bold
252 HP / 120 Defense / 136 Special Attack
Sheer Force

Earth Power
Thunder
Fire Blast
Toxic Spikes

Today I'd use Ice Beam or Dragon Tail over Thunder since rain likely won't be as prominent anymore--that was just for taking out stuff like 0 Speed Politoed or Skarmory in rain, and not letting rain sweepers get free switch-ins.

252/120+ was something I used to guarantee surviving Jolly Balloon Doryuuzu's Earthquake after Stealth Rock damage, which made for some good times when the mole would come in on Toxic Spikes to use Rapid Spin or--what happened more often--aim for an OHKO (because some people far overestimated its power) only to get Fire Blasted to oblivion. Nidoqueen would be just about gone at that point too, of course, but at least I'd get what I wanted. You could use 252/252+ Nidoking to achieve the same thing and be faster, but his attacks would be a bit weaker and 0 Speed Nidoking probably isn't outspeeding many things that Nidoqueen wouldn't.

Nothing wrong with going full defensive on EVs, of course, or at least 252/240+ for the final bonus stat point. I had good experiences with Life Orb against stuff like Nattorei in rain, specially defensive Scizor in rain, Tyranitar, Hippowdon, Roobushin, Birijion, Burungeru, and the one Zuruzukin I saw, and never felt like the lack of recovery cost me--most of the things that 2HKOed would have done that anyway. Maybe I'll try Leftovers at some point and see how it goes, but it really is hard to give up the extra power boost after the nice times I've had.

For reference, even 4 Special Attack Nidoqueen hits like a 252 Special Attack base 108 if she has a Life Orb, and my 136 EV variant hits like a 252 SA base 120.

 

[Mario With Lasers]

You also do cool stuff like OHKOing even 252/252+ Forretress

After any kind of passive damage ~__~

 

[NoahChron20]

This is a wild shot, but...

Nidoqueen @ Black Sludge
Modest
255 HP /255 SpD.
Poison Point
-Sludge Bomb
-Earth Power
-Flamethrower
-Ice Beam

This set is kinda like Nidoking, except more bulky. This one is all Sp. Attacks, and 1/2 of them are STAB. Sludge Bomb takes care of pesky grass types, Earth Power is our trusty alternative to Psychic, except better, Flamethrower takes care of Registeel and other types resistant to Poison as a more powerful method. We also take care of FlameBeam which means we get two trusty powerful attacks at the same time!

 

[Cold Fusion]

This is a wild shot, but...

Nidoqueen @ Black Sludge
Modest
255 HP /255 SpD.
Poison Point
-Sludge Bomb
-Earth Power
-Flamethrower
-Ice Beam

This set is kinda like Nidoking, except more bulky. This one is all Sp. Attacks, and 1/2 of them are STAB. Sludge Bomb takes care of pesky grass types, Earth Power is our trusty alternative to Psychic, except better, Flamethrower takes care of Registeel and other types resistant to Poison as a more powerful method. We also take care of FlameBeam which means we get two trusty powerful attacks at the same time!

You should change the EV spread to 252 HP / 4 SpA. / 252 SpD. You are wasting 4 EVs with that spread.

 

[Meru]

Why are you using a specially defensive Nidoqueen? All of the types that Nidoqueen resists are pre-dominantly physical.

 

[Youkai Enslaver]

This is a wild shot, but...

Nidoqueen @ Black Sludge
Modest
255 HP /255 SpD.
Poison Point
-Sludge Bomb
-Earth Power
-Flamethrower
-Ice Beam

This set is kinda like Nidoking, except more bulky. This one is all Sp. Attacks, and 1/2 of them are STAB. Sludge Bomb takes care of pesky grass types, Earth Power is our trusty alternative to Psychic, except better, Flamethrower takes care of Registeel and other types resistant to Poison as a more powerful method. We also take care of FlameBeam which means we get two trusty powerful attacks at the same time!

Sludge Wave is slightly more powerful than Sludge Bomb, so that'd be better, unless you're going for the higher poison chance.

 

[PokéMontage]

I don't see why you would try to use her as a bulky "offensive" Pokemon. Not investing in her offensive stats means she's not hitting too hard or fast, but if you do invest in her offensive stats, she's just a worse Nidoking. She really needs to be more dedicated to supporting to have value.

 

[elchupo]

I don't see why you would try to use her as a bulky "offensive" Pokemon. Not investing in her offensive stats means she's not hitting too hard or fast, but if you do invest in her offensive stats, she's just a worse Nidoking. She really needs to be more dedicated to supporting to have value.

That's not necessarily true. I think, think, that Nidoqueen might actually have some utility this gen as an offensive 'mon. For a start, one thing that people always bitch about Nidoking for is that it is frail and dies easy. Nidoqueen is not. The predominant forces this gen are bulky boosting "sweepers" such as Reuniclus and Conkeldurr, and I think this trend is much more kind to Nidoqueen than it is to 'King.

A bulky Hone Claws set might be viable since it’s the only boosting move she gets and uses her better Atk stat. Maybe something like this:

Nidoqueen @Life Orb
252 HP|252 Atk| 4 Def
Adamant
-Hone Claws
-Poison Jab
-Earthquake
-Sucker Punch/ Stone Edge
Nidoqueen reaches 578 Atk after two Hone Claws, and can actually cause some serious damage. Poison Jab is for STAB and gains a Sheer Force boost, and anything that resists is hit hard with EQ. The final slot is hard to decide. Stone Edge provides great coverage and allows Nidoqueen to abuse Sheer Force to a greater extent, but priority, especially that which is SE against Psychics, is also great.

The EV’s maximise bulk and Atk, since its pointless trying to outspeed anything since her speed sucks anyway.

A set like this would be much better when the third game is released with move tutors, giving Nidoqueen the Elemental Punches, as well as possibly Gunk Shot, all of which are boosted by Sheer Force.

 

[melvni]

That's not necessarily true. I think, think, that Nidoqueen might actually have some utility this gen as an offensive 'mon. For a start, one thing that people always bitch about Nidoking for is that it is frail and dies easy. Nidoqueen is not. The predominant forces this gen are bulky boosting "sweepers" such as Reuniclus and Conkeldurr, and I think this trend is much more kind to Nidoqueen than it is to 'King.

A bulky Hone Claws set might be viable since it’s the only boosting move she gets and uses her better Atk stat. Maybe something like this:

Nidoqueen @Life Orb
252 HP|252 Atk| 4 Def
Adamant
-Hone Claws
-Poison Jab
-Earthquake
-Sucker Punch/ Stone Edge
Nidoqueen reaches 578 Atk after two Hone Claws, and can actually cause some serious damage. Poison Jab is for STAB and gains a Sheer Force boost, and anything that resists is hit hard with EQ. The final slot is hard to decide. Stone Edge provides great coverage and allows Nidoqueen to abuse Sheer Force to a greater extent, but priority, especially that which is SE against Psychics, is also great.

The EV’s maximise bulk and Atk, since its pointless trying to outspeed anything since her speed sucks anyway.

A set like this would be much better when the third game is released with move tutors, giving Nidoqueen the Elemental Punches, as well as possibly Gunk Shot, all of which are boosted by Sheer Force.

Stone Edge, or any high crit rate move for that matter, doesn't get a sheer force boost.

 

[Katakiri]

A set from my old RTM. Copied & pasted so just ignore any Sun or teammate mentions.

Nidoqueen (F) @ Air Balloon
Trait: Sheer Force
EVs: 156 HP / 136 Def / 216 SAtk
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Earth Power
- Fire Blast
- Ice Beam
- Toxic Spikes

This is a combination of 4th Gen's Toxic Spikes Nidoqueen and 5th Gen's Nidoking, effectively applying what Nidoking does on a bulkier Pokemon. The Defensive EVs aren't exactly optimized yet as I haven't ran very many calculations yet. But I have at least optimized the Sp.Attack EVs. Nidoqueen with 216 Sp.Atk EVs OHKOs Max HP/Sp.Def Ferrothorn in Sand, Terrakion in Sun (And resists BOTH its STABs), Lucario, Infernape, Sawsbuck, Garchomp, and Gliscor. It can even survive an unboosted attack from all of them thanks to Air Balloon, so Nidoqueen does effectively counters all my threats. (Infernape being iffy due to Sun-boosted Overheat, but my own Infernape can handle it if need be)

This does however open some old wounds as with no Steel-type, by team becomes weak to Outrage again. Nidoqueen can survive an Outrage from most Dragons and hit back with Ice Beam, but it doesn't feel like a safe enough option to not consider it a big threat.

Probably the best thing about this set is how easy it makes some Pokemon to KO as they expect the tried and true 4th Gen Nidoqueen and forget that she has Sheer Force now raising her mediocre Sp.Atk to a very respectable 354 (or 312 in my case) making her powerful enough to not have to be completely defensive and can run Ice Beam effectively as well as Earth Power instead of Earthquake. So when that Gliscor tries to Taunt and set-up on this Nidoqueen, he's going to end up with something entirely different to deal with.

 

[Wrave]

Use Rock Slide instead of Stone Edge. It will be at perfect acc after a hone claws and gets a Sheer Force boost.