Other 4th Gen CAPs in 5th Gen Metagame.

[Aerodactyl Legend]

This thread is to discuss the first eleven CAPs in regards to the new CaP server and how they fit into the 5th generation. You may also discuss strategies, teams, movesets, and ask questions. Any new ideas or suggestions can be brought up as well.

To keep in mind:

• We are not updating the current 11 CAPs to fit in with the 5th Gen. As stated before, they are "4th Gen anchored" Pokemon. We spent a long time dwelling on how they would fit into that period and how we'd learn from it. Shoehorning new moves and abilities to fit in wouldn't make much sense and alter their original concepts/goals.
• This is not a thread to post any new ideas for CAPs obviously. Same with any new custom moves, abilities, or changes to existing ones.
• As of right now, not all changes to the server have been made. Rising_Dusk is working diligently on updating it different areas. Some custom moves and abilities still need to be programmed for example. So, not all strategies you may think of may be practiced at this current state. You can theorize of course, as long as it doesn't have to do about making any changes to the CAPs.

Other than that, have fun really. Anything interesting you guys can think of?


To start, I battled ete in a small tourney a little bit ago (and lost). Pyroak is an excellent contender when the sun is out (provided by Ninetales). I also think that the rise of Chansey being used in the 5th Gen over Blissey can be taken advantage of by Kitsunoh. Since Chansey must pretty much rely on Seismic Toss for direct damage, Kitsonuh avoids getting hit. Its Steel typing makes it immune to Toxic, while Limber grants immunity to Thunder Wave. To top it all off, Taunt will shut down any other moves she may try. The only problem is that Kitsunoh has no real way of damaging Chansey hard with an attack of its own, but at least it could fullfill its concept a bit and force a switch to reveal another opposing team member.

*EDIT*

Mistake about saying the Kitsunoh can't hit Chansey. It can with Superpower. I thought it had the move, but when I checked its page, I guess I must have missed it. With the Attack drop, it's not completely reliable for another hit (since Chansey is so bulky now).

 

[Paradox]

I've only played 2 or 3 games, but I've also found Kitsunoh to be quite useful, especially as a Lati and Rankurusu check (though the power of ShadowStrike is sorely missed –it means you miss out on the OHKO on Latios). Techgem is also still great, with the same fantastic speed, coverage, and attack power as always. Also, I could see a Trace Krillowat with balloon being a handy way to deal with sand and rain.

 

[Aerodactyl Legend]

What set have you been running on Kitsunoh? I'm thinking of making a new team and might like to try him out. I'm deciding on choosing between the Scarf set for some nice quick hits, but I'm more attracted to the LO set for power.

 

[ssbbm]

Arghonaut is amazing, and it is probably the best bulky water to be found in Gen V, as it can deal with Nattorei, unlike the majority of other bulky waters. It also functions as a check to DDers, especially Tyranitar. It also beats Doryuuzu if it gets in on anything but an EQ.

 

[sax king]

I find Krillowatt to be the most useful, especially against rain teams. You can come in, trace Swift Swim, and sweep with your boosted STAB water attacks and your STAB Thunder. He also works well against Dory, as you can trace the Sand Throw

 

[Aerodactyl Legend]

Krillowatt does look like it can harass many guys in Gen 5. Too bad for its average offensive stats though.

I keep on missing things. I said that Kitsunoh could still force switches in this game. That may be true, but he obviously can't truly fulfill his concept much with Team Reveal already showing what you'll face in the standard game.

 

[Ice-eyes]

Yeah Argho being able to deal with Nattorei is a massive boon.

Skarmory is strong as ever.

I expect Kitsunoh to be amazing once it gets ShadowStrike (does it have it already?); it manhandles pretty much everything, with the exception of Poison Heal Gliscor - which is amazing; it hard counters Colossoil, the only CAP it doesn't hit for SE with EQ / Acrobat.

Krilo would be really good if it still had Overheat.

 

[Aerodactyl Legend]

Fidgit is performing at pretty much the same effectiveness this gen (for me at least) as well. Who needs Natorrei (or Ferrothorn)?

 

[Luigifan]

Changed your minds?

I expect Kitsunoh to be amazing once it gets ShadowStrike (does it have it already?); it manhandles pretty much everything, with the exception of Poison Heal Gliscor - which is amazing; it hard counters Colossoil, the only CAP it doesn't hit for SE with EQ / Acrobat.

Wait, Kitsunoh with Acrobat? I thought you guys weren't updating the 4th Gen CAPs...

 

[Rising_Dusk]

No, we haven't changed our minds, and no, Kitsunoh does not get Acrobat.

 

[Tortferngatr]

If one of us has a sufficient amount of boredom and free time and puts the CAP ASB update moves/DW abilities into a PO-compatible format, would we be allowed to use them? (i.e. "for the heck of it while we're busy with Gen V CAP," once we've learned how the Gen IV CAPs fare w/o updates.)

 

[Venser]

We already can, just not in ladder matches iirc. Also @OP, he was referring to Acrobat Gliscor.

 

[Rising_Dusk]

would we be allowed to use them?

No, sorry. This was decided by the CAP staff unanimously. The DPP CAPs will not be getting updated for BW at all. We may eventually have a metagame available on the server where DPP CAPs and BW CAPs can both be used, but the DPP CAPs won't be getting changed at all if/when that happens.

 

[The.Lost.Hylian]

Seems like an awful waste of time to develop all those Pokemon and not even update them for the next gen, but that's just me.

 

[Rising_Dusk]

They were designed, implemented, and tested in the metagame that they were made to exist in. They will still be playable on the server in a DPP metagame, but it most certainly is not a waste to not update them for the new generation. We will be making new CAPs and doing new things in the new metagame, and we may even reuse the old CAPs' concepts. If we brought the oldies over, we wouldn't be able to. Also, one of the biggest things is that we wanted to start a fresh CAP metagame for the new generation free of a lot of the unavoidable imbalances of the old one. As a player of the CAP metagame and a member of the CAP process, I think this is for the best.

 

[Aerodactyl Legend]

Seems like an awful waste of time to develop all those Pokemon and not even update them for the next gen, but that's just me.

Well, the point of creating them was to learn about the (current) metagame, which we did. Not adding a generally distributed move like Work Up or Echo Voice or an extra ability certainly doesn't mean that all the time was wasted. Since they are usuable on the server, they are obviously not forgotten. As Rising_Dusk said, they may be usable alongside the 5th Gen CAPs in the future, so honestly the 4th Gen CAP's relevance (and our interest in them) won't disappear anytime soon.

 

[Deck Knight]

There is a reason why we decided to give the first 5th Gen CAP Project the title of CAP 1.

As cool as the DPP CAPs were, CAP is still primarility a competitive project with a competitive focus. We make CAPs to address the metagame we find outselves in at the time of their creation, which for 5th Gen CAP 1 means the Drizzle + Swift Swim ban metagame.

Upgrading and updating the DPP CAPs distracts from this focus, so it will not be done. They will however be implemented in the server and if we can get DPP Metagames going they will be allowed there. We're still working on some of the custom stuff they got, so bear with us.

 

[Nintenfreak]

I don't know, this makes sense. Think about it, after every generational change, (most) of the big hitters last time start to face greater adversity. Why not adapt them on the side? They're going to need Dream World abilities, after all.

 

[Objection]

I don't know, this makes sense. Think about it, after every generational change, (most) of the big hitters last time start to face greater adversity. Why not adapt them on the side? They're going to need Dream World abilities, after all.

Gengar didn't get a Dream World ability iirc.

 

[Aerodactyl Legend]

I don't know, this makes sense. Think about it, after every generational change, (most) of the big hitters last time start to face greater adversity. Why not adapt them on the side? They're going to need Dream World abilities, after all.

If you're talking about (updating) the current CAPs, they certainly don't need Dream World abilities.

Well, if they get outclassed or lose power due to other emerging threats (which some of them aren't; not by a long shot), then so be it. We are creating new ones, so why spend time dwelling on updating (not to be confused with improving here) old ones.

If you were talking about changing real Pokemon to improve them, then this isn't the project for that.

 

[NeoSeth]

The idea of not updating is a good one. These CAPs were created to test the 4th gen, not the 5th gen. Their purpose has been served, though I will miss the idea of Chlorophyll Pyroak (JKing).

That said, I've loved using Krilowatt. He runs through Sand like nothing, being the fasted Pokemon in the game once he's Traced their abilities. I've also been loving Stratagem, since it's power is still just as ridiculous. The LO-Technician set is my favorite.

Something I've noticed is that Revenankh spreads might start changing, since I've easily 2HKOd them with SpecsZard on my Sun team. In general, Revenankh doesn't wall as well as he used too.

 

[doominic77]

Idk, even if it does get updated on the server can we update the CAP's in our spare time.

 

[Numbuh 214]

Stratagem would miss Technician Giga Drain, I know that much.

 

[SJCrew]

I like how we inadvertently gave Voodoom a boost with the new and improved Lightningrod.

 

[Aerodactyl Legend]

I like how we inadvertently gave Voodoom a boost with the new and improved Lightningrod.

Haha, it needed the boost. Did it truly make it better in the CaP metagame (I haven't battled in a while, but never saw it before in the PO server, so I'm just asking to know)? I guess it has a better way to use that 110 Speed now.