Gen 5 OU. Help please.

[Gary Fucking Oak]

I don't know what to say here....Lets jump right into this.

Donphan (M)
Sturdy
Leftovers
252 def, 252 hp, 4 atk.
Impish.
-Earthquake
-Rapid Spin
-Stealth Rock
-Ice Shard
Pretty straightforward here. Donphan is a great defensive wall and along with Rapid Spin and Stealth Rock with the new Sturdy upgrade makes it a pretty great lead. Earthquake for STAB and Ice Shard to hit Physical Mence and Chomp hard. Only problem here is that I make Donphan out to be a physical wall, but with no great way of recovery, it doesn't last that long. Wish support maybe?

Espeon (M)
Magic Bounce
Choice Specs
252 sp atk, 252 spe, 4 sp def.
Timid
-Psychic
-Grass Knot
-Shadow Ball
-HP Fire
Espeon is one of the greatest Ferrothorn counters due to the new ability Magic Bounce. Switching in to counter rocks and then OHKOing with HP Fire is a great feeling. Psychic for STAB (Obvi), Shadow Ball for things like Reuniclus, and Grass Knot for Hippowdon and Pert. Forgot to include this. Espeon is also a great Sableye counter along with Whimsicott. It can bounce back taunts, and then Psychic on the switch and hit anything hard. Might as well include that.

Tyranitar (M)
Sand Stream
Choice Scarf
252 atk, 252 spe, 4 def.
Jolly
-Stone Edge
-Earthquake
-Pursuit
-Superpower
Standard Scarf T-Tar set. Sand Stream to get rid of opposing weather if facing Ninetails, Politoed, or Abomasnow. Stone Edge for STAB (I am not gonna explain these obvi things anymore), EQ for Heatran (If no balloon), Pursuit for Chandelure and Gengar, and Superpower for more coverage.

Salamence (M)
Moxie
Lum Berry
252 atk, 252 spe, 4 sp atk.
Naive
-Dragon Claw
-Earthquake
-Dragon Dance
-Fire Blast
Lum Berry to stop WoW or Toxic (If Espeon is dead). Outrage for powerful STAB though I am not sure if Dragon Claw would be a better choice considering it is a sweeper and confusion could break my sweep. Lum was originally supposed to be used to get rid of confusion and then continue to sweep with Outrage but normally my Lum is gone before that can work. EQ for Heatran which without would completely wall this set. Fire Blast to stop Ferrothorn (Of course you have to carry something to counter Ferrothorn on a sweeper.) Outrage has been switched to Dragon Claw. Intimidate has been switched to Moxie.

Jellicent (M)
Cursed Body
Leftovers
252 sp def, 252 hp, 4 sp atk
Calm
-Scald
-Taunt
-Toxic
-Recover
Still testing this. Switched from Gastrodon to Jellicent. Will put description when testing is complete. Suggested by zahariel. Generosity ftw.

Scizor (M)
Technician
Life Orb
252 atk, 252 sp def, 4 def.
Adamant
-Bullet Punch
-Swords Dance
-Bug Bite
-Roost
Pretty straightforward. Max sp def so I can switch it into a Latios whenever going for Draco. Scizor takes it pretty well, and then can either Roost or Swords Dance (Depending on what I know he has left). Bug Bite for physical walls like Slowbro and technician boost with STAB is really strong. Bullet Punch is run on every Scizor so no need for explanation.

I don't feel like spell checking this 100 times. Forgive any grammatical errors. Would really appreciate help. It is a good team, but any way you can help me improve? Thanks.

 

[Gary Fucking Oak]

Note to self, make this really pretty if want reply.

 

[The Canceler]

I'm not really sure about the potency of this team since I've never used one quite like this. Usually I set up weather as a lead, but setting it up later when all other weather inducers are down and you send out T-Tar as a surprise to your opponent could be quite annoying. Donphan does make quite a wall, but watch out for Hypnosis/Toxic running Politoed. Ninetales with Will-o-Wisp could be a problem too, as your Attack stat gets cut in half. On account of Salamence, I recommend Moxie, especially if it's a sweeper. For Gastrodon, watch out for Ferrothorn. Power Whip will destroy you, no matter how much bulk you have.

Hope some of this helped, good luck!

 

[zahariel]

You need to switch Gastrodon to Jellicent. Ttar always suckers in fighting types, and your team has no real synergy. This team has a lot of easily exploited weaknesses with no good counters, so you'd be base-racing your opponent every game, which is no way to play.

 

[Gary Fucking Oak]

On account of Salamence, I recommend Moxie, especially if it's a sweeper.

Mence with Outrage and Moxie is illegal. Outrage is a gen 4 tutor move and Moxie is a DW ability. Should I replace Outrage with Dragon Claw so I can run Moxie?

 

[Gary Fucking Oak]

You need to switch Gastrodon to Jellicent.

Do you have a Jellicent set I can use that can go well with my team? I have never used Jellicent (I dunno why. Probably because I am an originalityfag to some extent) and every set I make looks weird to me. Like WoW AND Toxic on the same Poke?

 

[Charizard92]

Mence with Outrage and Moxie is illegal. Outrage is a gen 4 tutor move and Moxie is a DW ability. Should I replace Outrage with Dragon Claw so I can run Moxie?

Yes, get it a speed boost somehow (dragon dance, baton pass) and you've won the game.

 

[Gary Fucking Oak]

Putting any changes I made in bold. Still taking suggestions.

 

[zahariel]

Click my sig-link and just use my Jellicent from the team I've posted. I can burn with STAB Scald, Recover for HP, Toxic for Stallbreaking, and Taunt to make Ferrothorn useless when he switches in.

 

[Gary Fucking Oak]

Click my link and just use my Jellicent from the team I've posted. I can burn with STAB Scald, Recover for HP, Toxic for Stallbreaking, and Taunt to make Ferrothorn useless when he switches in.

Hah, I already saw that and made the changes. I am going to test right now. I can give you credit if you want. I dunno if it matters to you.

 

[zahariel]

It doesn't matter, especially since it wasn't my set. If you were feeling overly generous I SUPPOSE you could say I recommended it, but I didn't make up that set.

 

[Eternal]

Espeon really isn't going to help you counter Ferrothorn much. It takes big hit from Gyro Ball or Power Whip. I would suggest using Xatu instead of Espeon if you want to stop Ferrothorns.

Xatu @ Light Clay/Leftovers -- Magic Bounce
Nature: Bold - EVs: 196 HP / 196 Def / 116 SDef
- Night Shade
- Light Screen / U-turn
- Reflect
- Roost

This will help you sweep more with ease having screens up.

I would also like to suggest replacing Toxic from Jellicent for Will-o-wisp. This will actually help you sweep better as WoW decreases the power of all physical attacks by 50%. You can think of it as a permanent Reflect when you've afflicted it to an opponent.

Lastly, I would suggest replacing Salamence for Multiscale Dragonite. Multiscale Dragonite is a much better sweeper especially with the Rapid Spin and Magic Bounce support preserving it's HP from not getting harmed by Stealth Rocks. Multiscale halves damage, so countering/stopping this thing will be very difficult for your opponent.

Dragonite @ Leftovers Lv. 100 -- Multiscale
Nature: Adamant - EVs: 32 HP / 252 Atk / 220 Spd
- Dragon Dance
- Fire Punch
- Dragon Claw
- Roost

Hope that helps.

 

[Gary Fucking Oak]

Espeon really isn't going to help you counter Ferrothorn much. It takes big hit from Gyro Ball or Power Whip. I would suggest using Xatu instead of Espeon if you want to stop Ferrothorns.

Xatu @ Light Clay/Leftovers -- Magic Bounce
Nature: Bold - EVs: 196 HP / 196 Def / 116 SDef
- Night Shade
- Light Screen / U-turn
- Reflect
- Roost

This will help you sweep more with ease having screens up.

I would also like to suggest replacing Toxic from Jellicent for Will-o-wisp. This will actually help you sweep better as WoW decreases the power of all physical attacks by 50%. You can think of it as a permanent Reflect when you've afflicted it to an opponent.

Lastly, I would suggest replacing Salamence for Multiscale Dragonite. Multiscale Dragonite is a much better sweeper especially with the Rapid Spin and Magic Bounce support preserving it's HP from not getting harmed by Stealth Rocks. Multiscale halves damage, so countering/stopping this thing will be very difficult for your opponent.

Dragonite @ Leftovers Lv. 100 -- Multiscale
Nature: Adamant - EVs: 32 HP / 252 Atk / 220 Spd
- Dragon Dance
- Fire Punch
- Dragon Claw
- Roost

Hope that helps.

I will try these. I will let you know how they work. Thanks.

 

[Gary Fucking Oak]

Espeon really isn't going to help you counter Ferrothorn much. It takes big hit from Gyro Ball or Power Whip. I would suggest using Xatu instead of Espeon if you want to stop Ferrothorns.

Xatu @ Light Clay/Leftovers -- Magic Bounce
Nature: Bold - EVs: 196 HP / 196 Def / 116 SDef
- Night Shade
- Light Screen / U-turn
- Reflect
- Roost

Couple problems here. If the opponent does not have a Ferrothorn, then Xatu is almost useless. No matter how many evs you pump into it, it does not take any hits well. If I don't have any screens up, Xatu is almost 2HKO'd by anything it doesn't resist. It counters Ferrothorn well, but besides for that, it is almost useless. Still testing the D-Night. Will post results.

 

[lostaurora]

Is it that important for you to keep hazards off completely? You already have Donphan who can spin them away later if necessary, and it seems to me like that teamslot would be better suited to something more diverse (and with better defenses) than Espeon or Xatu. Chandelure and Heatran both stop opposing Ferrothorn easily, and the former can trap and kill Steels and other physical walls (Gliscor) that would trouble Salamence, while Heatran can grab Flash Fire boosts from random WoWs or fire attacks aimed at Scizor.

Oh, and I highly, highly recommend Cursed Body over Water Absorb on Jellicent. Especially with that spread, it'll be taking next to nothing from water-type attacks anyway, and Cursed Body gives you a nice 30% chance of stopping Choiced mons in their tracks, and might trouble things that only have one move to hit you with.

I don't know how much attack you want to invest into Scizor, but I recommend shifting some of that into HP - it can take DMs much more easily with solid HP investment,

 

[Gary Fucking Oak]

Is it that important for you to keep hazards off completely? You already have Donphan who can spin them away later if necessary, and it seems to me like that teamslot would be better suited to something more diverse (and with better defenses) than Espeon or Xatu. Chandelure and Heatran both stop opposing Ferrothorn easily, and the former can trap and kill Steels and other physical walls (Gliscor) that would trouble Salamence, while Heatran can grab Flash Fire boosts from random WoWs or fire attacks aimed at Scizor.

Espeon is more to keep the Toxic aimed at my walls off and the WoWs aimed at my sweepers off. Leech Seed is also quite annoying and Donphan does not last that long. Donphan does not have a reliable way of healing. If something wants to come in and set up Spikes late game I will most likely still have my Espeon to keep them off. Oh, and Espeon can OHKO Gliscor with Psychic depending on the amount of sp def investment (Forgot to include SR). I also have HP fire to deal with things like Skarm so other steels are not that big of a problem.

Oh, and I highly, highly recommend Cursed Body over Water Absorb on Jellicent. Especially with that spread, it'll be taking next to nothing from water-type attacks anyway, and Cursed Body gives you a nice 30% chance of stopping Choiced mons in their tracks, and might trouble things that only have one move to hit you with.

I am putting Cursed Body on it now. I don't know what I was thinking.

I don't know how much attack you want to invest into Scizor, but I recommend shifting some of that into HP - it can take DMs much more easily with solid HP investment,

Do you have an EV spread you'd suggest?

 

[lostaurora]

I see. One thing you may want to experiment with is using Tentacruel. It seems to cover a lot of the problems you want to address at once - it's a bulky water that also happens to give a fighting-type resistance, has excellent SpDef like Jellicent, can set up Toxic Spikes, has access to Rapid Spin, and is a good switch-in when you expect Ferrothorn to Leech Seed, as it can drain their HP with Liquid Ooze.

I just don't like the idea of Espeon as a Ferrothorn check because it's really physically frail, and a lot of players, myself included, will Power Whip / Gyro Ball the first time their Ferrothorn attacks, expecting the Espeon switch and coming very close to KO'ing it. It's then free to switch out, rinse, and repeat later. Chandelure easily solves this problem because it resists Power Whip / Gyro Ball, and can roast the helpless Ferrothorn to death.

Using Tentacruel also means that you don't have to use the mediocre Donphan as a spinner. Gliscor serves a similar role as a physical wall, except better. Poison Heal / Toxic Orb Gliscor would be able to check Conkeldurr and similar threats while also being able to carry Ice Fang for Dragons.

If you want to try it, you should replace Jellicent with Tentacruel. Once that's done, you won't need Donphan or Espeon particularly much - I suggest Gliscor and Chandelure to replace Donphan and Espeon, which serve similar roles to the first two. If you find yourself missing SR (you should use Poison Heal Gliscor which is incompatible with SR) you could always stick SR onto your Tyranitar, even with Scarf. It'll have lots of chances to come in on weak Special attacks, SR on the switch, and will inevitably be forced out either way by some threat of a Fighting-type attack, so the Scarf shouldn't hinder it too much. I suggest Stealth Rock > Earthquake.

252 HP / 40 Atk / 216 SpD works well for bulky SD Scizor.

 

[zahariel]

If you want to try it, you should replace Jellicent with Tentacruel. Once that's done, you won't need Donphan or Espeon particularly much - I suggest Gliscor and Chandelure to replace Donphan and Espeon, which serve similar roles to the first two. If you find yourself missing SR (you should use Poison Heal Gliscor which is incompatible with SR) you could always stick SR onto your Tyranitar, even with Scarf. It'll have lots of chances to come in on weak Special attacks, SR on the switch, and will inevitably be forced out either way by some threat of a Fighting-type attack, so the Scarf shouldn't hinder it too much. I suggest Stealth Rock > Earthquake.

Do not listen to this dude. Never assume Tentacruel is better than Jellicent. Jellicent is immune to Fighting-types, spinblocks, and has instant recovery. Also, Scald has 30% chance to burn so WoW, with its shite accuracy, is a wasted move - Toxic works better and can also hinder special sweepers (and it puts a timer of Guts Conkeldurr). Water Absorb covers the weakness of both Donphan and Ttar to Water, which is ubiquitous in the meta thanks to Drizzletoed. It's not about taking minimum damage on the switch, it's about synergy and damage negation. Jellicent can use Toxic on Politoed, for example. Make your opponent waste a round and get something out of it.

 

[XcRunner]

a much better Donphan set imo is a more offensive one seeing as ur having problems with keeping it alive w/ 252hp/252 def/impish try this instead
Donphan@leftovers
Sturdy
Adamant
252 hp/252 att/4 def
(same moveset)

 

[The Canceler]

Instead of having Espeon to bounce it back, you could use Reuniclus to absorb it.

Reuniclus@Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 94 HP / 62 Def / 252 Sp. Att
Nature: Calm
- Trick Room
- Psychic
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast

With Magic Guard, one of my favorite abilities, you can not only use it in the sand storm with no damage and get no Life Orb recoil (still boosts your attacks though), you can take any status like a boss and not worry about it. You won't get the gradual damage from Toxic or the regular damage from Burn. Trick Room works with Tyranitar and Jellicent, who are both fairly slow. Or, you can just ride solo and sweep the crap out of your opponent's team with Reuniclus. Although it's not as great as bouncing back the status, Reuniclus is bulkier and stronger than Espeon, so it can effectively play its role and still wreak havoc.

 

[lostaurora]

Do not listen to this dude. Never assume Tentacruel is better than Jellicent. Jellicent is immune to Fighting-types, spinblocks, and has instant recovery. Also, Scald has 30% chance to burn so WoW, with its shite accuracy, is a wasted move - Toxic works better and can also hinder special sweepers (and it puts a timer of Guts Conkeldurr). Water Absorb covers the weakness of both Donphan and Ttar to Water, which is ubiquitous in the meta thanks to Drizzletoed. It's not about taking minimum damage on the switch, it's about synergy and damage negation. Jellicent can use Toxic on Politoed, for example. Make your opponent waste a round and get something out of it.

I didn't say Tentacruel was overall better than Jellicent - it just isn't. But it can work here for two reasons - it alleviates the need for the crappy Donphan as a spinner, and it can lay Toxic Spikes which really help win weather wars.

What water attack is going to take down Jellicent? I guess it's a matter of preference, but Modest max SpA SpecsToed in rain manages a maximum of 38% with Hydro Pump, which can't 3HKO with Lefties, so you can easily poison it and Recover off the damage, even assuming Hydro Pump always hits and Cursed Body never activates. I guess it can be useful if you're overly concerned about Suicune and Keldeo, though.

 

[channerz]

Although your team is quite solid, i've been seeing a few attract pokemon such as eviolite chansey and togetic as a means of stalling. Since all you're pokemon are male, you may find it hard to sweep against attracters. maybe vary one or two genders in you're team. A little Effort goes a long way.

 

[Gary Fucking Oak]

Although your team is quite solid, i've been seeing a few attract pokemon such as eviolite chansey and togetic as a means of stalling. Since all you're pokemon are male, you may find it hard to sweep against attracters. maybe vary one or two genders in you're team. A little Effort goes a long way.

When I sav or make teams on PO, I don't pay any attention to gender. I will change those now.

 

[zahariel]

Unless forced, I always make my pokes female. Throws off Cute Charm every time.