Moody

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Well, hydro pump only has 80 accuracy, so they're banking on multiple things. Something that's a mixed wall (Eviolite chansey, or a SpD specced Skarmory) should be able to handle both in at least some regard.
Chansey can't phaze..., and max SpD/HP Skarm is still 2/3HKOed by Hydro Pump and Surf respectively.


Furthermore, something like Gliscor (Again, with the Hydro Pump weakness, but bibarel's SpA is only 55) can taunt first, and Haxorus resists water but has a weakness to ice. If I'm worried about ice I can bring a Jellicent instead.
Keep in mind that people are only going to use Bibarel (if they're being serious) if they're already using the better abusers, Octillery and Glalie, both of which eat Gliscor and Haxorus alive. Jellicent can't damage the two much, and is vulnerable to Toxic, especially since Glalie outspeeds.


The end result of this line of theory is that it's possible for a pokemon with Inconsistent to, assuming it has the right moves at the right time and gets the right stat-ups, beat any other single pokemon one-on one. Maybe.

That just doesn't sound powerful enough for me.
Note that if a Moody abuser is on the losing side(by getting the wrong boosts, being perfectly walled), it can switch out and try again later. If a Moody counter is on the losing side(they get the right boosts, or the counter has been worn down), the team gets swept. This alone make it biased far towards the Moody abuser's side:

If a Moody abuser has 6 chances in a match (lead + come in after every teammate's KO), if it gets wrong boosts 5 out of the 6 times, it can still sweep if it gets the right boost on the 6th.

If a Moody counter can successfully counter 5 out of the 6 times, you still lose on the 1 time that your Moody counter failed.
 
I have two words for everyone to consider:

Imposter Ditto.

That is all.

A possible check/counter?
Imposter fails on anything that has a Substitute up, AKA, all Moody pokemon. :/

Also, for Standard ladder's purposes, Impostor Ditto hasn't been released yet.
 
In what country can you be throw in jail for being racist? Sure its illegal to discriminate, but not illegal to state your opinion.
Y'know, regarding this whole argument, he has the right to state that he thinks everyone else should shut up.

If it was some mod deleting posts, it'd be different, but he's just saying stuff.
 
Honestly, I sort of agree this should be put to bed. I've thrown all my serious comments out at this point, and even then, I knew they weren't quite compelling; just a question of how selective smogon precedence and it's use of elaborate excuses and situational examples are.
And hell, I can honestly say I don't remember ever voting for Moody, one way or another, so once again, I gotta raise the issue of padding the numbers here.

But again, I'm pretty sure I don't really care too much either way at this point. The people I play with don't really adhere to Smogon rules to a tee, so my input really isn't that big of a deal here.
 
In what country can you be throw in jail for being racist? Sure its illegal to discriminate, but not illegal to state your opinion.
It was still an awful terrible analogy. Its not an opinion, its just a twisted and messed up point of view that is incorrect and undebatable. A single group of people aren't all the same, and its impossible to label them all "bad" or "evil" or whatnot.

Regardless you should never have brought that up. : / Its like bringing up a Mac VS PC debate or mentioning a religious opinion. Theres a time and place for everything and this was neither the time or the place.

So.....CHANGE OF SUBJECT!!!! Seriously.
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Does unaware completely destroy this abillity?
 
Does unaware completely destroy this abillity?
No, because none of the Unaware Pokemon like being Toxiced - which Inconsistent Pokemon often carry. The boosts will still matter after the Unaware Pokemon dies, so the Inconsistent Pokemon can protect/sub stall while Toxic kills the Unaware Pokemon. Then they can easily sweep after that.
 
First off, you're assuming that I haven't faced it, which is incorrect.
Considering the person I was responding to said they'd never faced it in the post which I quoted, I tihnk my assumption that they weren't lying was pretty justified...

Secondly: So? Anecdotal evidence isn't worth anything.
Depends what you're trying to prove. If you want to say that "It's possible for a single Inconsistent Bidoof to sweep a team" then a single log showing such is indeed all you need to prove the statement.
 
Depends what you're trying to prove. If you want to say that "It's possible for a single Inconsistent Bidoof to sweep a team" then a single log showing such is indeed all you need to prove the statement.
I can't really say I agree, if only because the request is as poorly worded as the proof. The parameters were never really set; a single Inconsistant Bidoof could easily sweep a team of, say, level 5s, or pokemon like Geodude. That's hardly proof of anything. Even in competative terms, a well-done Bidoof could have no problem against a poorly designed team. It's always going to be POSSIBLE. What's important here is if it's PLAUSIBLE or PROBABLE.
But let's face it, after what, Toxic, Protect, and Substitute(all of which I've heard are necessary so far), what attack goes into the last slot that even makes it capable of a sweep? Stab options are clearly out the window, as a good team should have a Bulky Water with Water Absorb and a Ghost for spinblocking. It just sounds like the teams getting swept are over-cocky and poorly built, as no ONE single attack, no matter how boosted, should be able to knock out an entire team. No, not even Ice Beam.

Not to harp too much on the issue still (I really gotta stop reading posts in this topic), but a stratagy based completely on LUCK, by definition, could never pull of consistant wins.
 
I can't really say I agree, if only because the request is as poorly worded as the proof. The parameters were never really set; a single Inconsistant Bidoof could easily sweep a team of, say, level 5s, or pokemon like Geodude. That's hardly proof of anything. Even in competative terms, a well-done Bidoof could have no problem against a poorly designed team. It's always going to be POSSIBLE. What's important here is if it's PLAUSIBLE or PROBABLE.
But let's face it, after what, Toxic, Protect, and Substitute(all of which I've heard are necessary so far), what attack goes into the last slot that even makes it capable of a sweep? Stab options are clearly out the window, as a good team should have a Bulky Water with Water Absorb and a Ghost for spinblocking. It just sounds like the teams getting swept are over-cocky and poorly built, as no ONE single attack, no matter how boosted, should be able to knock out an entire team. No, not even Ice Beam.

Not to harp too much on the issue still (I really gotta stop reading posts in this topic), but a stratagy based completely on LUCK, by definition, could never pull of consistant wins.
The problem is not it pulling off consistent wins, but pulling off undeserving wins far more than anything else. No to mention that once you start setting up with sub+protect, if they don't have a phazer, you're good to go until you have +4-6 in all stats and can sweep, and it is not as inconsistent as you make it out to be. Not perfectly consistent, and maybe not as consistent as some other top threats, but still has a very high payoff for not too low a risk.

Not every team has a water absorber or ghost. They are not requirements for good teams. Plus, it would only matter if they were also immune to toxic. That leaves only toxicroak and gengar- 2 pokemon who are definantly not the OU of OU, if OU at all- and both are frail making them easily possible to be eliminated before attempting a moody sweep. And even then I've heard of pokes sweeping with +6 struggle. Even if it's only 50 BP, you've got quadruple attack. It's like being able to SD and then having a stabless but perfectly neutral 100BP move.

Also, Bidoof has swept UBER teams.
 
Water and Normal immunities are nowhere close to requirements for a team.

It's also worth noting that you specifically stated the Water-immune Pokemon to be bulky, and spinblockers are generally supposed to be bulky, so both Pokemon should be reasonable to defeat with Toxic.

Not that Bidoof gets STAB on Water-type attacks anyway; that's just Bibarel.
 
Why hasn't this been shut down yet? It's a pointless argument about something that is long gone from the standard metagame. Get over it. It's banned and nobody is going to change that.
 
Why hasn't this been shut down yet? It's a pointless argument about something that is long gone from the standard metagame. Get over it. It's banned and nobody is going to change that.
We could discuss its use in the StreetPKMN tier, where it is allowed.

I wonder how many people use Moody teams in that tier...
 
We could discuss its use in the StreetPKMN tier, where it is allowed.

I wonder how many people use Moody teams in that tier...
I haven't played in street since the most recent reset but I was #1 in that tier for a long time (Fiddy). I can honestly say that I only saw it maybe once or twice.
 
Wait, is the ability called Inconsistent or Moody in English? It's really annoying how people still use their Japanese names when the English names have come out.
 
Wait, is the ability called Inconsistent or Moody in English? It's really annoying how people still use their Japanese names when the English names have come out.
The name of the ability is Moody in English (Bulbapedia is your friend). There are many reasons people still use the Japanese names, be it that they like them more or aren't players of the English game. However, whatever the reason, there's no reason to get upset at people for doing that since it's still clear what they are talking about.
 
I personally don't think that this ability is broken by any means. I myself use a Moody Bidoof. It earns me a few victories, yes, but for the most part, not believing the hype. In my signature, I link to a blog post I made, advocating the unbanning of Moody. I DID post it in the suspect test sticky, but it was promptly deleted because apparently I don't know what I'm talking about. Well, I kinda disagree with that, and I urge you all to read it.
 
I personally don't think that this ability is broken by any means. I myself use a Moody Bidoof. It earns me a few victories, yes, but for the most part, not believing the hype. In my signature, I link to a blog post I made, advocating the unbanning of Moody. I DID post it in the suspect test sticky, but it was promptly deleted because apparently I don't know what I'm talking about. Well, I kinda disagree with that, and I urge you all to read it.
I read the whole thing and I have to disagree. You act like the only reason it was banned is because it can boost evasion. While that is true and a big part of why it was banned, it is not the only reason. Bibarel doesn't need an evasion boost to toxic stall or protect/sub stall. With just one speed boost, defense or spdef boost or possibly SpA boost to KO a threat, it can stall out until it gets the optimum boosts. With the way moody works, it is only a matter of time before you get one of those boosts. It is not a chance- it will happen.

You didn't even use toxic on your bibarel. That's a pretty big difference. So I can tell that you were going for the evasion boost the whole time. You don't need to do that. I have had NUMEROUS amounts of times where I've swept teams with a octillery and had negative evasion.
 
I read the whole thing and I have to disagree. You act like the only reason it was banned is because it can boost evasion. While that is true and a big part of why it was banned, it is not the only reason. Bibarel doesn't need an evasion boost to toxic stall or protect/sub stall. With just one speed boost, defense or spdef boost or possibly SpA boost to KO a threat, it can stall out until it gets the optimum boosts. With the way moody works, it is only a matter of time before you get one of those boosts. It is not a chance- it will happen.

You didn't even use toxic on your bibarel. That's a pretty big difference. So I can tell that you were going for the evasion boost the whole time. You don't need to do that. I have had NUMEROUS amounts of times where I've swept teams with a octillery and had negative evasion.
I wasn't just going for the evasion boost. I'd be going for Speed boosts, defense boosts, anything that would help. And more often than not, I would start with a boost that would be useless (like to Special Attack, or to, say, Special Defense against a physical attacker), and a detrimental stat drop (like to Speed, Evasion, or the at-the-moment necessary defense stat). I'll try it again with Toxic, though, see if that really makes the difference you say it does. But half the time, with the stat boosts/drops my Bidoof would get, it would be in no position to use Toxic even if it knew it.
 
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