Feint

[Axa]

From being an almost completely useless move, Feint's got an interesting buff this generation. It's new mechanic is: 30BP, +2 priority, and hits through Protect and Detect.

This now makes it a useful extremely high priority move (ties with Extremespeed), that will always hit unless the opponent is a Ghost-type or using Fly/Dig/Dive/Shadow Force. A little weaker than Quick Attack, but not a significant loss.

The Pokemon who learn Feint are:

Hide

Pikachu
Persian
Farfetch'd
Hitmonlee
Hitmonchan
Scyther
Scizor
Kabutops
Heracross
Skarmory
Medicham
Hitmontop
Sharpedo
Trapinch
Flygon
Absol
Infernape
Skuntank
Lucario
Yanmega
Gallade
Pinsir
Gliscor
Weavile
Houndoom
Electivire
Blaziken
Hariyama
Sableye
Zangoose
Toxicroak
Accelgor
Mienshao

While most of these generally have more useful priority, like STAB Mach Punch or Aqua Jet, there are still a few Pokemon that could appreciate the abiltiy to hit first, nailing something like Blissey, such as Heracross, who otherwise has to use the weak Vaccuum Wave.

So is Feint of any use this generation, or is it still completely useless?

 

[Benlisted]

So Feint is now essentially a weaker Extremespeed that breaks Protect - it doesn't fail if the enemy doesn't protect?

If so, I can certainly see this getting use. Actually doing damage, even if slight, will let it have utility to finish Sturd/Sash mons or just break their sashes initially - as opposed to having huge difficulty in being justified fro a moveslot last gen.

Another question would be if it breaks through the new Protect-esque moves Wide and Quick Guard? Presumably not, but worth a test if this hasn't happened already I suppose.

Anyway, since many teams on a timer hate being Protect stalled, this has excellent utility in Trips especially, where wasting a turn due to solely attacking a single mon is an awful thing to do, making this a nice tool to ease prediction.

 

[Axa]

So Feint is now essentially a weaker Extremespeed that breaks Protect - it doesn't fail if the enemy doesn't protect?

If so, I can certainly see this getting use. Actually doing damage, even if slight, will let it have utility to finish Sturd/Sash mons or just break their sashes initially - as opposed to having huge difficulty in being justified fro a moveslot last gen.

Another question would be if it breaks through the new Protect-esque moves Wide and Quick Guard? Presumably not, but worth a test if this hasn't happened already I suppose.

Anyway, since many teams on a timer hate being Protect stalled, this has excellent utility in Trips especially, where wasting a turn due to solely attacking a single mon is an awful thing to do, making this a nice tool to ease prediction.

Yes, it does damage even if the opponent doesn't use Protect/Detect now.

And it doesn't break Quick Guard.

 

[FrostFire]

Hm. Interesting new buff, though the 30BP is a bit of a turn-off, and nothing really good gets STAB to boost it. Generally, I feel there's better priority but nevertheless, it could have an interesting niche on some pokemon.

 

[Bobblefighter]

So thats why they reduced the base power of it, so it could be used even if the other pokemon didn't use Protect or Detect...

 

[min min]

It works kinda well in LC, from what I see, since Meowth's Fake Out and Feint can nab a couple extra kills. And it's all above +1 priority.

 

[opkil]

Technician Users: Persian, Scyther, Scizor, Hitmontop.
STAB:Persian, Farfetch'd, Kecleon.

STAB+Tech: Persian.

Though you have to admit that this would be a beautiful move in Doubles and Triples. Doubles especially, where Protect is a near mandatory move.

 

[yiran]

Persian's attack stat still sucks too much to actually make use of this move efficiently.

 

[Benlisted]

You really don't pick this move for the damage though, you'd use extremespeed if you did - it just adds utillity in always being able to hit and allow your othes mons to guarantee the hit too. Seems like a great move for supporters with nothing better to use to stop them being taunt bait.

 

[Benlisted]

Sorry for the double post, just thought I should mention this: http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3406441&postcount=2263

Basically, TMN has found out that Feint also breaks Wide Guard - no matter which pokemon on your opponent's team you target with it. Essentially, this makes in pretty awesome for those teams looking to spam spread attacks which would otherwise be ganked by Wide Guard users - as well presumably being able to break the targeted poke's protect if it uses it as well. Imo, this gives the move a great degree of viability for Doubles/Triples, so I wanted to bump this to let others see this development too.

 

[Virizion]

Sorry for the double post, just thought I should mention this: http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3406441&postcount=2263

Basically, TMN has found out that Feint also breaks Wide Guard - no matter which pokemon on your opponent's team you target with it. Essentially, this makes in pretty awesome for those teams looking to spam spread attacks which would otherwise be ganked by Wide Guard users - as well presumably being able to break the targeted poke's protect if it uses it as well. Imo, this gives the move a great degree of viability for Doubles/Triples, so I wanted to bump this to let others see this development too.

To be honest, I don't see Wide Guard being too popular, as it's quite situational in most battles and I can only see it having use against, say, a Hydreigon or Starmie or something like that.

 

[TheMaskedNitpicker]

To be honest, I don't see Wide Guard being too popular, as it's quite situational in most battles and I can only see it having use against, say, a Hydreigon or Starmie or something like that.

Wrong. Earthquake, Rock Slide, Blizzard, Heat Wave, and Muddy Water are not 'situational'. They're common. In a Triple Battle, Wide Guard has huge utility, although admittedly this Feint discovery does limit its usability somewhat.

EDIT: Also, Hydreigon and Starmie? What? Hydreigon doesn't usually use any multi-target attacks and Starmie certainly isn't the premier user of Surf or Blizzard.

 

[Benlisted]

Wrong. Earthquake, Rock Slide, Blizzard, Heat Wave, and Muddy Water are not 'situational'. They're common. In a Triple Battle, Wide Guard has huge utility, although admittedly this Feint discovery does limit its usability somewhat.

EDIT: Also, Hydreigon and Starmie? What? Hydreigon doesn't usually use any multi-target attacks and Starmie certainly isn't the premier user of Surf or Blizzard.

Moreover, Surf/WaterAbsorb and Discharge/Volt Absorb/Motor Drive abuse strats are quite powerful if used right, making them incredibly useful. Water Spout and Eruption can also prove insane if used correctly. If I'm right, Wide Guard will protect you from your own spread moves, which can be used to your advantage as well. I've seen Wide Guard have a lot of use so far, though Feint may hinder that somewhat.

 

[Virizion]

Wrong. Earthquake, Rock Slide, Blizzard, Heat Wave, and Muddy Water are not 'situational'. They're common. In a Triple Battle, Wide Guard has huge utility, although admittedly this Feint discovery does limit its usability somewhat.

EDIT: Also, Hydreigon and Starmie? What? Hydreigon doesn't usually use any multi-target attacks and Starmie certainly isn't the premier user of Surf or Blizzard.

Well, my Hydreigon knows Surf :L Also, thanks for reminding me about Triples, you're right about those moves being common in that environment (For some reason I was thinking about the use of those moves in Singles lol)

I'ma try this move out on my Technitop. I'll post later with results.

 

[wtangelo]

I'd think that Feint Technician Scizor might have a niche. Hits Protect healing Gliscor at least.

 

[Kefka Palazzo™]

I'd think that Feint Technician Scizor might have a niche. Hits Protect healing Gliscor at least.

I don't think a 45 BP move(after Tech) will hit Gliscor very hard <,<

 

[verbatim]

I'd think that Feint Technician Scizor might have a niche. Hits Protect healing Gliscor at least.

Assuming standard sword dance scizor vs baton pass gliscor with yache berry,

Scizor with feint=16.7% - 19.8%
Scizor with hidden power ice= 20.9% - 24.9%

Granted feint breaks protect, but sword dance then bullet turn on the cannot protect turn is a much better option if you have a life orb. If you have a choice band, the flaws of locking your scizor into a normal attack with 30 bp are obious. The biggest impact of feint will be in little cup, and any tiers below nu should they come into being.

 

[internet]

hidden power ice scizor? what the fuck?

scizor could use it against protect vappy and gliscor, heracross gets it as his only physical priority (i believe) and some pokemon might be able to use it on an anti-lead set

 

[jas61292]

I know its not a top threat, but Persian is definitely one of the best users of Feint. STAB + Technician makes it a respectable 67.5 Base Power, and in combo with Fake Out can be used to easily take down weakened opponents.

Shame it couldn't have stayed at 50 power

 

[Zacchaeus]

Yeah even though Persian gets STAB, Scizor has the strongest Feint and it's pitifully weak as verbatim showed. The only way it could possibly be used is against a Poké with a used up Focus Sash who is now spamming priority moves or something. So it's not going to see much usage

 

[Chameleon]

I agree that this could have some use on Persian... With it he can do some major damage to frail priority sweepers like Breloom and Weavile by bypassing +1 priority moves. But I doubt he'll see much use for it.

The other use I can see for Feint is Zangoose. Poison Rampage SD Zangoose is threatened by priority and Protect stalling, and Feint covers both with its +2 priority and anti-Protect. Its power is lacking, but Zangoose's huge attack power can help mitigate that.

 

[NDenizen]

I didn't realise Feint was essentially a weak extremespeed now, that's actually pretty cool. The ability to essentially run through everything with priority and not even caring for Protect to waste your turns could be pretty cool.

 

[Sighhh]

Agreed. I hate pokes that protect stall and this move does the trick.

 

[kniteowl]

Wow Heracross finally gets a priority move, feint lol.

On Choice sets, the 4th move was usually filler anyway, after you include Close Combat, Megahorn and Stone Edge/Night Slash.

In the lower tiers, Pinsir, Electivire and Gallade also get it which is nice. althought move people will probably just use shadow sneak for gallade anyway.

 

[kaonohiokala]

Good luck dealing much more than 12.5% damage to Gliscor with this move anyways... And he's probably the #1 user of Protect I can think of in OU right now.

Maybe you could use it in RU against Yanmega? I'd rather use a stat boosting move when the opponent protects anyways.

Also, only Mienshao and Accelgor get this move in VGC. It's an interesting combo with Mienshao's Fake Out to say the least.