Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
Some of you may remember this from a while ago, when it was known as Streetmons. You may also remember that we had huge trouble actually playing the metagame properly, especially in an environment where legality was properly implemented. Well, the good news is that Pokemon Showdown now supports the metagame fully! That's right, we can finally play Glitchmons extremely easily. There are a few legality issues at the moment(almost fixed), and for some reason there is no team preview yet (fixed!), but this should hopefully be fixed in the next update. Make sure to look at the legality section below to make sure you're not cheating. Then just click on the link, build a team and go!
For those of you who don't know what Glitchmons is, Theorymon can explain much better than I can:
Theorymon said:
In the Smogon community, bans are an important part of our metagames. We spent years on building a process just to figure out which things to ban in the Overused and Underused metagames. We have Little Cup, a metagame that’s based around banning Pokemon that are evolved. Even Ubers does not escape the importance of bans, because Moody ended up being banned, and clauses such as Evasion, Species, OHKO, and Sleep Clause are still important parts of the metagame.
A common misconception most people have is that clauses are needed for an enjoyable game, thinking that a metagame with no clauses will mean that you can mindlessly use Spore and getting lucky with Sheer Cold to win. While these moves certainly big factors in such a metagame, not only do all of them have match changing flaws, they are also not needed for many teams to work the best they can! What really makes a metagame without any bans insanely intriguing is the mimic glitch from the early copies of the Japanese Diamond and Pearl. If a Pokemon has Mimic, Metronome, Transform, Copycat, or Assist in generation 4, it can learn every single move in generation 4 plus one generation 5 move via Sketch! This gigantic movepool upgrade to 408 Pokemon makes this metagame radically different from any other metagame in generation 5!
So, in other words, the only rule in this metagame is that you cannot use what you cannot obtain in game without hacking. There are NO CLAUSES and NO BANS.
Legality – READ THIS BEFORE POSTING SETS
Any Pokemon which has access to Mimic, Copycat, Metronome, Transform or Assist in Gen 4 has access to the Mimic glitch, meaning it can learn any move in the game. The glitch only takes place in Gen 4, but a Pokemon with one of these moves can be transferred from Gen 3.
This means all Gen 5 Pokemon and Gen 5 abilities, including all Dream World abilities, are illegal with the glitch.
By learning Sketch before being transferred to a Gen 5 game, one move from Gen 5 may also be learnt. Additionally, a Pokemon has access to any level-up, tutor, or TM moves from Gen 5 (but not egg moves).
The vast majority of Pokemon in Gen 3 can learn Mimic via move tutor. Very few pokemon obtain the glitch through other means. This has a few implications:
The Pokemon obviously must have a Gen 3 ability as it is transferred to Gen 4. It is possible to obtain a Gen 4 ability only though evolution. This means that No Guard Machop and Scrappy Miltank do not have access to the glitch, but that No Guard Machoke and Skill Link Cloyster do.
The Pokemon must be at least level 5 (so any low-level Endeavor sets should be level 5).
Also, please, please test the sets you are posting, or at least play the metagame a bit and think about them very carefully. Every single thread so far has been packed with untested and ultimately terrible sets, and I really don't want this to happen again.
I'll be adding some of the best sets to the second post, along with any analysis you decide to add. I've already added some from the previous thread (including mine, because I'm that humble) so you don't have to trawl through it. Regardless, the old thread is located here if you want to read it. Even older threads can be found here and here, although I would strongly recommend against reading those, because they're full of untested/illegal stuff.
The Glitchmons metagame is heavily physically biased. This is largely due to physical priority moves from the likes of Ursaring, as well as the prevalence of V-Create. This means that many pokemon will invest in Defense before HP.
Resistances to Fire and Normal, and hence V-Create, Sacred Fire and ExtremeSpeed, are extremely valuable in the Glitchmons metagame.
Generally, Pokemon that are 2HKOed by Fake Out + ExtremeSpeed from Ursaring are not going to get very far, especially if they are setup sweepers. This is why Mewtwo and Rayquaza are rare, for instance.
Most Pokemon must have some method of dealing with Spore. Lum berry is by far the most common item for a reason.
Sturdy is an extremely valuable ability – each team will usually have at least one Sturdy pokemon on it to deal with Machoke and Machamp.
Other Pokemon may well wish to carry Sheer Cold themselves to quickly dispose of these two. Spore is also effective against Machoke, provided that it doesn't use Magic Coat.
Glitchmons sets
At the moment this is just a collection of some of the best sets from the last thread. Yes, most of these are from Theorymon and me, but if some of you guys post some good stuff this might very quickly change. I'll be adding any good sets posted in this thread too. I've left most of these sets as they were posted, but I've added a few comments where I feel an important option has been left out.
Ursaring
Ursaring is the primary priority abuser of Glitchmons, making a great revenge killer and status absorber. It's that good that every single one of my teams features at least one Ursaring, often two. Every sweeper out there needs to watch out for Ursaring's powerful ExtremeSpeed and Fake Out, and even bulkier Pokemon are not safe from Façade or Sun-boosted V-Create. The set below is fairly standard, although the last slot is pretty open. You can put pretty much anything in there.
Despite possibly being the most common Pokemon in mimic streetmons, Ursaring tends to confuse people who are new to this metagame, as at first glance, most people don't get the point of Ursaring. However, Ursaring is such a huge and influential threat that it's the reason Mewtwo and Rayquaza are very rare in this metagame! The reason for Ursaring's dominance in this metagame is because it may be the best priority abuser in the game! Fake Out may seem weak, but its extremely important to this set. One use of Fake Out allows Ursaring to activate Toxic Orb or Flame Orb, not only making Ursaring immune to sleep, but also powering up its already monstrous 130 base attack by 50% thanks to Guts. After Guts is activated, Guts boosted STAB Fake Out + ExtremeSpeed coming from 130 base attack makes Ursaring one hell of a revenge killer. Remember when I said that Rayquaza and Mewtwo are rare because of Ursaring? That's because Fake Out + ExtremeSpeed will actually KO both of them unless they make heavy defensive investments! Even Groudon has to be careful, because a Shell Smashed Groudon will take 90% minimum from Fake Out + ExtremeSpeed! Fake Out is also handy for basicly inflicting free damage, which may not seem like much, but the metagame is so fast paced that even a small amount of damage can change the game! Ursaring is part of the reason why Life Orb is uncommon in this metagame. With Ursaring's priority always around the corner, the recoil from Life Orb can be very dangerous! Another intresting thing to note about Ursaring is that it may be the most common abuser of the lack of species clause at the moment. With Shell Smashers being such huge threats, many teams opt to carry 2 Ursaring because of its useful revenge killing utility.
Because Ursaring causes so many switches due to its priority abuse, it has another very nasty tool to punish people trying to wear it down: V-create. In the sun, V-create is Ursaring's strongest attack. To give you a picture of its power, it deals 89-100% to max HP Groudon! To make this move even more appealing, Trick Room is a dangerous strategy in this metagame, and Ursaring's slow Speed and V-create make it very hard to defeat under Trick Room! For teams that have Kyogre, you may prefer Facade, which still deals a massive amount of damage to even Pokemon that resist it. Finally, the last move is mostly filler. Mach Punch is there to hit Magnezone and Tyranitar harder, Shadow Sneak allows Ursaring to revenge Gengar, and Low Kick allows Ursaring to hit Rock-types that may attempt to switch into it. Something that should also be noted is Ursaring's EV spread. Maxing defense on an offensive Pokemon may seem strange, but its very important for Ursaring. This is because priority is very common in this metagame, and the max Defense lets Ursaring take it as well as it possibly can while still maximizing its Attack. This may not seem like much, but Ursaring can actually survive stuff like +2 ExtremeSpeeds from a lum Groudon, and while it does a ton of damage, max Defense lets you possibly catch stuff like that with their pants down!
Like Machoke, Usraring is not without its flaws. Ursaring's biggest problem is residual damage. With Toxic Orb or Flame Orb wearing it down. This means that Ursaring always is always on a timer, and people WILL take advantage of this! Ursaring also isn't exactly that bulky. When its not using priority attacks, it risks being OHKOed by stuff like V-create. Because of these factors, Ursaring doesn't usually last too long on the battlefield. Despite these issues, Ursaring is one of the biggest threats in the mimic streetpokemon metagame that must ALWAYS be accounted for!
(There are a number of good options for the last slot that have not been mentioned. Power Whip hits Golem, Kyogre and Rhydon hard, while Drain Punch (with Flame Orb) improves Ursaring's longevity. Alternatively, swords Dance can actually let Ursaring sweep if the opportunity arises. Pursuit it also really useful, since Ursaring does tend to get walled by things, and easily forces a number of things out.)
Machoke
No Guard is probably the best possible ability in Glitchmons, granting 100% accuracy to all OHKO moves. Machoke and his big brother Machamp are therefore two of the primary threats in Glitchmons. Machoke tends to use his great bulk with Eviolite and abysmal Speed in Trick Room to pull off a sweep.
Once again, the set below is pretty standard, although Machoke can also run a Speed boosting set
Machoke is one of the most fearsome and influential threats in the entire metagame that MUST be prepared for in some form! The execution here is simple: set up Trick Room, and then destroy teams that have lost their Sturdy Pokemon with a never missing Sheer Cold. Thanks to Machoke’s lackluster Speed, there isn’t much that will outspeed it under Trick Room. Dynamic Punch is mainly here for Magnezone, the most common sturdy Pokemon. Gastro Acid is great for catching sturdy Pokemon like Skarmory on the switch, potentially forcing the opposing team to lose one Pokemon if that’s their only Sturdy Pokemon. Magic Coat is there in case you predict a Spore, a risky move, but this can be very game changing!
Part of what makes Machoke so fearsome is its surprising bulk thanks to Evolite. To give you a picture on how bulky Machoke is, even a +2 Life Orbed Adamant Groudon Earthquake will only OHKO Machoke 41% of the time after Stealth Rock damage! In fact, with this ev spread, Machoke is as physically bulky as an Impish Metagross with maximum HP and Defense, and almost as specially bulky as a maximum HP Reuniclus. This bulk lets Machoke set Trick Room up against physical foes that lack Sheer Cold, and also means that Machoke will rarely get sniped by the large amount of priority in this metagame. This isn't normally an amazing achievement for an evolite user, but unlike other evolite users, Machoke is able to OHKO anything that can get hit by Sheer Cold, making Machoke an unmatched combination of bulk and power!
Machoke does have two flaws though: its so fearsome that people will over prepare for it by putting Sheer Cold or Spore on Pokemon just for it! Because of this, make sure you play carefully with Machoke. Machoke is especially deadly on Trick Room teams, since then it doesn't have to risk facing over prepared Pokemon as much! The second flaw is that Machoke's Special Defense, while decent with evolite, leaves a lot to be desired for when facing very strong special attackers. Although unboosted neutral Special Attacks will rarely KO Machoke, Machoke can't set up on extremely powerful special attackers such as Kyogre without taking a huge amount of damage, unless using a specially defensive spread. While a specially defensive Machoke can be a nasty surprise for people who attempt to deal with Machoke via strong special attacks, it becomes more vulnerable to priority. Despite these flaws, Machoke is still a huge force in this metagame that must always be prepared for!
Machamp
Although it is rather more vulnerable to priority than Machoke, its superior power and Speed, as well as its ability to carry items other than Eviolite, secure its place in the Glitchmons metagame.
Choice Scarf is the most obvious set for Machamp to run, although other than Sheer Cold the moves it should run are not entirely obvious. Theorymon describes a TrickScarf set below, although it is very possible to run Sleep Talk + 3 OHKO moves, or a more straightforward attacking set:
Machoke may be one of the biggest threats in the metagame, but that doesn't mean that Machamp is outclassed at all. In fact, Machamp is still a huge threat it just plays a different role than Machoke!
Because Machamp is speedier than Machoke, most Machamp sets equip a Choice Scarf. Machamp isn't nearly as bulky as Machoke, but the immedite speed Choice Scarf provides should never be underestimated. Even with that sluggish 55 base Speed, Machamp is still able to outspeed even base 105 Speed Pokemon. Since Choice Scarf is otherwise rare in mimic Street Pokemon, Machamp can threaten to easily destroy anything that's slower than it with no need to set up! Dynamic Punch is still here to deal with Magnezone, while Trick is great for cripling other sturdy Pokemon that may attempt to switch in. The last moveslot is filler, Shift Gear if you want to attempt a sweep after Tricking, or V-create if you want a powerful move to use when you are unsure what the opponent is going to switch in. Feel free to toy with the last two moveslots, there really isn't a standard for Choice Scarf Machamp beyond the first two moves!
Trickscarf Machamp is also extremely effective in combination with SmashPass Dugtrio. By Tricking the opponent's sturdy pokemon, you steal their lum berry and lock them into one move. You can then set up shift gear, knowing that if the sturdy pokemon opts to kill machamp, they'll be setup bait for dugtrio, and that otherwise Machamp can sweep having crippled their sturdy pokemon. Trick can also turn plenty of other pokemon into dugtrio bait. The only good way to beat this strategy is to see the trick coming and switch in something like ursaring, but this could easily lead to the loss of a valuable pokemon.
And here is my take on a Shift Gear set, taking advantage of Machamp's good attack stat and ability to run Lum Berry:
I used a similar Machamp set absolutely ages ago, perhaps even before Machoke was discovered. I've revamped it a bit, but I still haven't been able to test it fully, as there are too few people on the server. I'd still like to know exactly what EspyOwner uses (Sheer Cold, Shift Gear, Bonemerang, Substitute, it turns out). Even so, it is clear that this Machamp set carries several advantages over the more common Machoke. The greatest of these is the ability to carry Lum berry. If someone is relying on sleep moves to deal with Machoke, this may well give them some serious problems. Secondly, it has the ability to hit much, much harder. If you can support it with Stealth Rock to break Sturdy, it will easily OHKO Magnezone with +1 DynamicPunch, and will do excellent damage to most other sturdy Pokemon. Thirdly, stuff that outruns this at +2 is perhaps even rarer than stuff that outruns Machoke under TR, given that most things with greater than 130 Base Speed are frail, and that Choice Scarf Pokemon can become setup bait. Trick Room can also disadvantage certain teammates. Finally, though this is not usually relevant, I like to use this on my Baton Pass team. Baton Passing to Machoke is utterly futile.
What Machoke has over this though is quite a lot of bulk. Machoke's defense is roughly 1.5x better, taking into account the fact that it can run max hp/def and Machamp can't. If you use a Scarf Machamp as in the OP, it will obviously be even frailer. Therefore, Machamp cannot afford to take so much damage while setting up. It needs to be in pretty good shape to defeat Ursaring. Ironically, Machoke is actually one of the easiest Pokemon to set up on, as long as Trick Room isn't up.
The spread lets Machamp outrun base 130s at +2, and then maximises defense, which is absolutely necessary for Ursaring and other priority Pokemon. Two Ursaring will still beat you, but at least you can take out one. Even Machoke will often fall to two Ursaring. This set's power is still sufficient to deal with Magnezone and other Fighting-weak sturdy Pokemon. Even with maximum power it still isn't going through Skarm. The fourth slot is mainly just filler. A sleep move can help against sturdy Pokemon, and can help Machamp to set up. Hypnosis > Spore just in case the opponent has a Sap Sipper Pokemon (of the non-Grass-type sleep moves, Hypnosis has the highest PP. You can use Lovely Kiss or Sing if the idea of that amuses you). ExtremeSpeed is very weak but if you have space for it, why not? You might just take down a weakened Ursaring. You could use Agility instead of Shift Gear, which would then let you use V-Create in the last slot. With an Adamant nature you can guarantee to OHKO Skarmory with it in the sun after SR. I think this is too situational, though.
Machamp does also have another option which I have not mentioned: running a Trick Room set like Machoke, but with Iron Ball. Machamp is significantly slower and more powerful, which will occasionally give it the edge.
Magnezone
Given the threat of Machamp and Machoke, it is hardly surprising that Pokemon with Sturdy are extremely common in Glitchmons. Magnezone is perhaps the best of these Sturdy Pokemon, given its impressive Defense stat, resistance to priority, and excellent Special Attack. Given that Pokemon often invest in Defense over HP or Special Defense, Magnezone's Special attacks are going to hurt, especially after a boost:
I'm sure this will cause some head scratching, but Magnezone is a very important Pokemon in Mimic Street Pokemon at the moment, and it's all because of Sturdy! With Machoke and Machamp being huge threats, having a Pokemon with sturdy is highly recommended. While Dynamic Punch may 2HKO Magnezone, it can switch into Sheer Cold, outspeed both Machoke and non Scarfed Machamp, and threaten to set up on them via Spore or use Sheer Cold. Sturdy's boost this generation is also very nice for Magnezone, and is a very good reason to carry a Stealth Rock user. For example, if Stealth Rock isn't up, Shell Smash Groudon will actually lose to a full HP Magnezone without Bonemerang!
The ability to sometimes check Machoke and Machamp is more of a bonus though, because it's still an excellent Shell Smasher. Thanks to its Steel typing, Ursaring will not be able to easily revenge kill a healthy Magnezone without Mach Punch (be warned though, two Ursaring are going to destroy it), and Magnezone can really hurt stuff with +2 Thunderbolts and Ice Beams! Weather Ball is also an option, because it will hit opposing Magnezone harder, and is actually more powerful than Thunderbolt. Just note that max HP Groudon has a small chance of living through Weather Ball (deals 88.4% - 104% after a Shell Smash).
Magnezone does have a couple of other options. It can run a reasonable Trick Room set, perhaps with Tail Glow (Theorymon seems to like this, though I am not convinced). Quiver Dance is also a decent choice.
Groudon
Groudon is one of the best, most common Pokemon in Glitchmons, and this is hardly surprising. Not only does Drought boost Groudon's own V-Create coming off base 150 Attack, but also boosts V-creates and Sacred Fires for the entire team. It also makes Tangrowth a rather powerful Pokemon. In order to keep sun up it is very possible to use multiple Groudons on a single team.
Theorymon describes a support Groudon set below, ideal for setting up weather, but not at all lacking in power. The set is rather more flexible than you might think. Most notably, Trick Room + Sun is a very powerful strategy, and so you might also want to use Trick Room on the set somewhere, along with an Iron Ball to make Groudon slower than virtually everything.
Groudon really hit the jackpot in this metagame. Unlike most Ubers, Groudon wasn't nerfed in this metagame, it got boosted! This is due to two very threatening sets, V-create and Shell Smash Groudon. Something to note is that because Groudon is so common in this metagame, Sun is actually the dominant weather here! (edit: perhaps not any more)
Groudon may not get STAB on V-create, but thanks to Drought, it becomes a 270 base power move, FAR stronger than Groudon's actual STAB! This coming off of base 150 Attack is very frightening! Groudon's other big selling point is that awesome 140 base Defense, which allows it to take Ursaring ExtremeSpeeds and smash it with V-create. Thanks to Groudon's bulk and fire power, it'll cause a lot of switchs, making it a great user of Stealth Rock. For the last move, you have a lot of options. Sheer Cold and Spore are for Machoke, Power Whip is to hit Kyogre harder, and ExtremeSpeed is nice for extra priority. Feel free to expariment with the last two slots, you may find something awesome! Another nice thing about this set its an excellent Pokemon to use on Trick Room teams. Groudon's sun makes V-create way more scary under Trick Room conditions, and Groudon can carry an Iron Ball to underspeed Machoke!
However, Groudon can be exceptionally threatening in its own right as a Shell Smash sweeper. With an excellent base 140 Defense, it can even handle Ursaring after the defense drops. Theorymon's set here may perhaps be a touch slow, as it can be outrun by Magnezone before a boost, and some Choice Scarf Pokemon and Deoxys-S afterwards. I'd recommend at least 100 Speed evs for Magnezone, probably quite a bit more in order to beat kyogre and other groudon to the punch. I would also strongly consider using Bonemerang rather than Earthquake in order to OHKO Sturdy Pokemon without SR, and to deal with annoying Substitute users such as Dugtrio.
Groudon @ Lum Berry
Trait: Drought
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Shell Smash
- Bonemerang - Spore / Sheer Cold
- Sacred Fire / ExtremeSpeed / Stone Edge
Groudon's other set focuses more on sweeping than punching holes in teams. After a Shell Smash, Groudon is very hard to stop! +2 Earthquake smashes most offensive mons, except for Machoke. Because of this, Groudon must carry a move to deal with Machoke. Spore is usually the best option here. With this, not only do you shut down most Machoke, but you can also set up on Pokemon that have lost their lum berry! If your team has serious problems with Machoke, Sheer Cold can be a better option. The last slot can be a bit tricky. With ExtremeSpeed, you can prevent Ursaring from destroying you if Ursaring is in the KO range of ExtremeSpeed, and it's always handy to have some extra priority. If you are worried about the rare Skarmory or Balloon Steel-types, Sacred Fire is a nice option thats actually as strong as Earthquake. Finally, if you want to have almost flawless coverage, you can use Stone Edge.
Tangrowth
The most potent Chlorophyll sweeper in Glitchmons, thanks to its great Defense, Attack, and Special Attack, and passable Speed. In the sun, neutral-natured Tangrowth can outrun Aerodactyl, the fastest Pokemon commonly seen in Glitchmons (in my experience). It can then set up with Tail Glow, Shell Smash, Bulk Up, Dragon Dance, Swords Dance…you name it, really.
Special sweeping Tangrowth. Very little is going to stand in this thing's way in the sun. Its great Defense lets it survive an assault from Ursaring, while it sweeps with its phenomenal Speed in the sun. Things tend to have low SpD in streetmons and this takes advantage. After a boost it OHKOes pretty much everything, except the rare Dragons and Fire-types. In fact, it doesn't even need its more powerful moves; these are really only there in case Tangrowth doesn't manage to set up. Obviously, Tangrowth struggles outside of the sun, where it is both slow and fairly weak. Kyogre isn't switching in directly, but may do so after a KO. Make sure to pack a good switchin.
Physical Tangrowth does pack a couple of advantages over the special version. V-Create is immensely powerful, and Tangrowth can get away with it thanks to great Speed (in sun), bulk, and boosting moves. Bulk Up offsets the defense drops, letting Tangrowth take on Ursaring, while Dragon Dance lets it negate the Speed drops, and makes it less vulnerable to the likes of Kyogre. I don't really recommend SD, but it does rip stuff up.
Tangrowth does have one more trick up its sleeve: its second ability, Leaf Guard. This gives it immunity to sleep moves in the sun, and lets it function on Trick Room sun teams. Both physical and special Trick Room variants are potentially viable, but here is the special set:
In Glitchmons, Kyogre is not nearly as prominent as it is in Ubers, mostly due to Ursaring and the power of drought, but it's still an extremely potent threat. Rain boosted water attacks can easily plough through the many weak SpD stats of Glitchmons. Weather ball also provides a welcome boost for Kyogre, allowing it to keep going even in the Sun.
Most importantly, however, Kyogre is an excellent counter to V-Create spam, a thorn in the side for every Drought team out there. Additionally, Omastar becomes extremely threatening in the rain, bordering on uncounterable.
Kyogre isn't nearly as common in this metagame as it is in Ubers, and that's all because of the massive amount of priority (especially from Ursaring). That doesn't mean Kyogre is bad though, because its still a threat that you should keep your eye on! Kyogre's biggest selling point by far is Drizzle. Thanks to Drizzle and resisting Fire-type attacks, it's easily the best switch into V-creates in the game!
Because Kyogre's 100 / 90 Defense isn't too good, it's forced to max out its HP and invest in a lot of Defense to ensure that Ursaring won't eat it alive. Thanks to the rain though, Kyogre can get away with the bulky ev spread while still being able to cause a lot of damage! Quiver Dance is the prefered meathod of setting up. With 60 Speed evs, Kyogre will outspeed Choice Scarf Machamp after a Quiver Dance, and smash it with either a +1 Weather Ball or a +1 Surf. Note that Kyogre has two different attacking set ups here. If you don't care about accuracy, the best attacks to use are Surf (or Hydro Pump if you have balls!), Grass Knot, and Fire Blast. Fire Blast may seem really silly on Kyogre, but it's important because of how fast paced this metagame is. Without it, Groudon can set up the sun to ruin your chances of sweeping! If you don't like Fire Blast's miss chance, then Weather Ball / Grass Knot / Power Gem (for Fire mons in the sun lol) is your best bet.
If you want, you can use White Herb + Shell Smash to make Kyogre a more threatening sweeper. Just be warned, you only have one shot or else priority is going to maul it!
I've made a number of changes to the set here, because I don't think Kyogre is usually lacking in coverage. Spore is enormously more useful, and will probably deal with shedinja better than fire blast or power gem will.I put Ice Beam up there because it hits a number of things that are deliberately used to counter kyogre, like Giratina, Zekrom, and Rayquaza.
With everything investing in Defense rather than HP, rain-boosted Water Spout does huge damage. While Kyogre lacks the immunities of Chandelure (another weather-reliant Scarfer I feel is viable), it makes up for it with sheer power, and the fact that it does not require support. Almost no Pokemon I see frequently is capable of taking Water Spout from a full-health Kyogre, Groudon being the most notable exception, and similarly few Pokemon are able to outrun it. Really the only problem Kyogre faces is Ursaring, which KOes Kyogre with a combination of Fake Out and ExtremeSpeed. However, as long as the opponent doesn't set up too many hazards, you can simply switch out to something that totally walls Ursaring, like Rhydon, Golem, Omastar, or Giratina, and then bring Kyogre back in later to wreak havoc. Here is the set I am using at the moment:
I am not entirely sure what to run on the set yet. At the moment, I am simply going with a spread of 4 Def 252 SpA 252 Spe Timid, accepting that Kyogre will lose to Ursaring. I could imagine a slower, bulkier set working though too. The moveset I am even less sure about. Water Spout is a given, but the rest of the slots are flexible. Hydro Pump could be used over Weather Ball for additional power. If you choose to do so, you could also consider Blue Flare, for Groudon switchins. Grass Knot does a good job against opposing Kyogre and Groudon, but Kyogre can also be hit with Thunder, and Groudon with Weather Ball/Blue Flare. Ice Beam hits the Grass- and Dragon-types; though these are rare, this is really the only option for them, and therefore makes it onto my provisional moveset.
Omastar
This guy is definitely the strongest rain sweeper in Glitchmons. It packs phenomenal power, the ability to beat opposing weather inducers, and most importantly a resistance to Normal and a 4x resistance to V-Create, making it extremely difficult to revenge kill.
Omastar @ Lum Berry
Trait: Swift Swim
EVs: 56 HP / 36 Def / 252 SAtk / 164 Spd
Modest Nature (+SpA, -Atk)
- Shell Smash / Tail Glow / Quiver Dance
- Weather Ball / Surf
- Grass Knot
- Ice beam / Power Gem / Blue Flare
This is probably the best rain sweeper in streetmons, with passable Speed, Swift Swim, great Defense, great Special Attack, and great typing. Omastar resists Fake Out and ExtremeSpeed, and 4x resists V-Create, so Ursaring is not touching it. Speed lets Omastar outrun Dugtrio in the rain, Special Attack is maximised, then physical bulk. After a Shell Smash, it obviously outruns everything. Weather Ball is probably the best STAB move available. It brings flexibility, letting you continue sweeping even after Groudon comes in, but is not great if Tyranitar comes in. Grass Knot hits Kyogre and Groudon, and is therefore a staple. Finally, Ice Beam hits Giratina and the rare grass-types, Power Gem hits Fire-types in the sun, and Blue Flare wrecks everything in the sun. It's illegal with Quiver Dance though, so be warned.
The choice between boosting moves can be tricky. The main advantage of Shell Smash is to avoid being revenged by Groudon – you'll outrun it in the sun. Tail Glow and Quiver Dance are obviously preferable from a defensive standpoint.
Dugtrio
This is one of the most dangerous threats in Glitchmons. If even one of your Pokemon is not properly prepared for Dugtrio, it can be trapped, resulting in an almost certain loss. Even if Dugtrio doesn't manage to set up, it is going to render a number of Pokemon completely useless for the entire game
Dugtrio @ Leftovers / Lum Berry / White Herb / Focus Sash
Trait: Arena Trap
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Spore
- Shell Smash
- Substitute
- Baton Pass
This set is the epitome of a high-risk, high-reward strategy. Obviously, the potential rewards are great: if you get it in on the right pokemon, Dugtrio is virtually guaranteed to pass +6 in Attack, Special Attack, and Speed, as well as a Substitute, which may or may not be broken on the switch. The strategy is simple: get in on something slower that lacks lum berry and lacks a priority move, and then use Spore. Next turn, use Sub, which acts as security against the opponent waking up early. If the opponent does wake up, simply repeat, hoping that next time they will not. Note that while Trick Room may prove annoying if used on the wake-up turn, if you play correctly there is still no chance of being hit, and you will still likely be able to pass multiple boosts. If they do not wake up on that turn, use Shell Smash until they do. Repeat until Duggy gets to +6 with a sub up, or cannot make more subs. Then pass to any one of the very scary sweepers in streetmons, and win. If you don't win at this point you are doing something seriously wrong.
Anyway, onto the details of the set. Max Speed is obvious, letting Duggy spore on as many opponents as possible. Timid to lower confusion damage because you have no attacks. Priority moves are physical (ok vacuum wave, but that sucks) so 252 def evs are added – duggy just might survive one. The item is a tricky choice. Leftovers allows more subs, hopefully ensuring that more shell smashes can be passed. Lum lets Duggy switch into Spore (without it you will have to come in after a KO). Focus Sash allows Dugtrio an alternative route, letting it pass one shell smash even in the face of a lum berry. White Herb lets you pass fewer defense drops.
However, it is generally best to have at least one recipient with a white herb, since this negates all of the defense drops passed! Yes, all of them. The best recipients include Groudon, Metagross, and Jirachi, but there are a whole host of things that can sweep with so many boosts. You must be sure to have SR up, or use a move such as Bonemerang or Gear Grind though, so that you can get past sturdy pokemon. Much more difficult is getting Duggy out in the first place, and facing the correct pokemon. There are many inventive ways to engineer this, but just to get you started, you should be looking to trap stuff without priority moves (e.g Magnezone, Kyogre, Machoke, some Groudon), and you should try to burn up any lum berry they might have first. For example, you might use a Machoke with DynamicPunch and Magic Coat; this will attract Magnezone, burn up any lum it might have, and force it to kill you or risk being swept. You can then switch in Dugtrio and win. Other interesting ideas include using Machamp, or using Trick users to remove Lum Berry.
Metagross
Very dangerous Shell Smash sweeper thanks to monstrous attack and defense, and resistance to priority
Metagross @ Lum Berry
EVs: 168 HP / 252 Atk / 88 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpA)
- Shell Smash
- Zen Headbutt / Meteor Mash / Iron Head
- Power Whip
- Sacred Fire / Bonemerang / Earthquake
This is one of the most fearsome sweepers in streetmons, perhaps the most fearsome. Metagross has fantastic Attack and Defense, and resistance to priority. If you let it set up, you are unlikely to survive. Zen Headbutt is there mainly for Machoke, Metagross being one of very few physical setup sweepers able to OHKO it. Iron Head and Meteor Mash are great moves, but the metagame cannot really handle Metagross even without them. Sacrificing Metagross's best STAB for coverage is IMO the best option. If you want to use Iron Head use Jirachi. Power Whip destroys Kyogre, Golem, Rhydon and Groudon. Finally, the last move covers Steels. Sacred fire provides the best coverage, and great power in the sun, but if using Metagross in rain a Ground-type move is preferred. Watch out for Skarm though.
The EV spread lets Metagross outrun base 130s after a boost, maximises attack, and then focuses on bulk. SR support is recommended, as without Meteor Mash or sun-boosted Sacred Fire you need it to KO Ursaring.
Jirachi
As a Shell Smasher, Jirachi is a faster, weaker, frailer Metagross, but with the ability to flinch its way through counters with Iron Head, and to use Sacred Fire with a 100% burn rate.
Jirachi @ Lum Berry
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly / Naive Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Shell Smash
- Iron Head
- Sacred Fire / Earthquake
- Power Whip / Zen Headbutt / Psycho Boost
Oh boy, if you thought Choice Scarf Jirachi was annoying, wait till you see this thing in action! After one Shell Smash, Jirachi is actually pretty powerful. Iron Head can actually 2HKO maximum HP Groudon after Stealth Rock damage! With that power and 60% chance of flinching AND the lack of priority weakness, Jirachi can be a real pain in the ass to stop! Sacred Fire is also pretty annoying, because with it, Jirachi will always get a burn when it hits!
Physical Jirachi's biggest problem is the fact that you have to choose between hitting Groudon and Kyogre hard or Machoke hard. While Zen Headbutt can destroy Machoke after an Iron Head flinch, its not going to help much with Kyogre, and it forces you to flinch Groudon to death. Because of this, I have started to use a Naive nature and Twisted Spoon to OHKO Groudon with a +2 Psycho Boost after Stealth Rock damage, and OHKO Machoke without the boost. I actually prefer this set, but I haven't seen any other Jirachi try this yet!
Jirachi can also do a number of annoying things, taking advantage of its Speed, Serene Grace, and priority resistance. The set below takes advantage of the Spore/Whirlwind combo:
Jirachi @ Leftovers
80 HP / 252 Def / 176 Spe
Nature: Jolly (+Spe, -SpA)
Iron Head
Spore
Substitute
Whirlwind
This moveset revolves around the combination of Spore and Whirlwind. Generation 5 brought with it new sleep mechanics, such that the sleep counter is reset after a Pokemon switches out. Therefore, if a Pokemon is forced out while sleeping, it will have stay in for several turns straight in order to wake up. Essentially, a sleeping Pokemon when switched out is as good as, if not worse than a fainted Pokemon. If they come back in, they can be forced straight back out by Whirlwind at no cost, set up on, or simply KOed. Also crucial to the set is Substitute, which is used to scout switch-ins, prevent opposing Spores, protect against 1-turn sleeps, and to take advantage of sleeping opposition.
How to use this set: you need to get jirachi in on something which it can spore. This means either something lacking lum berry, or something it walls completely. Use Spore, or Sub and then Spore. Sub will cover against switches and Magic Coat. After the opponent is asleep, you can use this opportunity to set up another sub, or to phaze the opponent out, unless they get a 1-turn sleep. If you want, you can use Iron Head repeatedly, as the opponent will likely flinch as it wakes. This lets you reset the sleep counter again, allowing you to freely whirlwind them away, without ever having risked being hit. Obviously, you can also use Whirlwind if the opponent tries to set up on you.
My favourite way to use this set is with Toxic Spikes. Sub+Iron Head+Poison is a powerful strategy, but more importantly this will burn up Lum berries, letting you spore more freely.
A more defensive spread can be used to prevent Ursaring from breaking Jirachi's subs. However, Ursaring must use V-Create to do significant damage, and will be crippled by the defense drops. To build up more residual damage, it is also best to provide stealth rock support, and perhaps sand stream support from Tyranitar. This thing can put an entire team to sleep, but of course still requires a consistent source of damage.
Skarmory
Another decent Sturdy pokemon, but one that suffers from a V-Create weakness and doesn't have the attacking stats to sweep. Therefore, Skarm is forced to run more of a support set. The set below again takes advantage of the Spore/Whirlwind combo:
Skarmory @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: My specific EVs are confidential, but 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef works fine
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Substitute
- Spore
- Whirlwind
- Spikes/Disable/Close Combat
(For this post to make any sense I need to give a little context: after having unashamedly stolen his idea, I had decided that the Pokemon he was using, Skarmory, was not the most appropriate Pokemon to take advantage of this set. I have come to realise that Skarmory and Jirachi are both very capable of playing this role, and are appropriate in different situations. Make sure to read my analysis of Jirachi above.)
Surely you aren't naive enough to believe that the creator of such a revolutionary set was foolish enough to overlook a Pokemon that could potentially do the job better. Contrary to your assessment, I still believe that Skarmory is the most suitable Pokemon for this position. To start off, my Skarmory is more physically bulky than your Jirachi, although why you run so much Speed is beyond me; most major threats in Street Pokemon are quite slow. Despite its lower Speed, Skarm is still fast enough to outrun most important threats without investing in Speed at all (and can always run more Speed if you feel the need to outrun specific threats). Skarm also has superior typing, and with Bonemerang becoming more common, a Ground immunity as opposed to a Ground weakness is a huge boon. The last, and, in my opinion, most important advantage Skarmory possesses over Jirachi is its ability: Sturdy. This allows it to come in on Machoke and Machamp and actually use them as set up fodder. Jirachi can only dream of this, as switching into a Sheer Cold is a death sentence for the Wishmaker. Machoke and Machamp can only DynamicPunch Skarmory for pitiful damage as it proceeds to Spore them and then Whirlwind them away.
On to the set and analysis!
Skarmory @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: My specific EVs are confidential, but 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef works fine
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Substitute
- Spore
- Whirlwind
- Spikes/Disable/Close Combat
jc has already explained most of this, so I won’t go into too much detail. Like he said, get in safely, Spore or Sub depending on the situation, and then proceed to sleep and phaze anything slower. It’s not uncommon for this Skarm to put half your opponent’s team to sleep and still be behind a Substitute. If you have Stealth Rock up, this thing can take down entire teams once it gets rolling; Whirlwind faster Pokes who you suspect have a Lum Berry, re-Sub on a slower Poke or sleeping Poke that will inevitably be forced out, and repeat.
The last move is a toss-up between Disable and Close Combat. At first I had Close Combat, which allows you to take out Ursaring if you don’t have an answer for him. Switch in on Fake Out or ExtremeSpeed, Sub as Ursaring V-Creates, and, if you have enough residual damage (which isn’t hard to get on Ursaring), kill the unsuspecting bear with your mighty Close Combat, which deals 63.6% - 75.4% to a -1 Def 0/252 Ursaring. On my current team, I have Omastar, who uses Ursaring for set up fodder, so it is not necessary to kill it immediately (in fact, it’s preferred that I keep it alive so that Omastar can set up on it). In this case, Disable works phenomenally. Similar to Sub Disable Gengar, not many Pokes have two moves that can break or even hit Skarm’s Substitutes. You can Disable Machoke/Machamp’s DynamicPunch, Ursaring’s V-Create, Groudon’s V-Create/Sacred Fire, or other random attacks from Pokes that you suspect can only hit you with one move, all of which will guarantee you a free Substitute. Use Close Combat only if you have severe issues with Ursaring; otherwise, Disable is the superior option.
EDIT: Spikes should be the primary option in the last slot. This allows you to rack up more entry hazard damage and facilitates your own "sweep." This set can still be used without Spikes if that's what your team calls for, as sleeping half of the opponent's team is still an accomplishment, but additional damage is always appreciated. In this meta, it can be hard to find a slot on your team for hazards; Skarmory is perfect for both setting them up and abusing them to their full extent.
I think it would be hilarious if this Skarm became immensely popular, firstly because it would be absurd to have a defensive Poke be so successful in such a heavily offensive metagame, and also because Magnezone might start running a customized Skarm-killer set, swapping Sturdy and Spore for Magnet Pull and Taunt. Whatever the case, the ability to shut down stally Pokes and set up on top threats is what makes this Skarm so potent and it is definitely something you should be prepared for.
Also, epic first post.
(I bet we all wish we had a first post like this one. Anyway, I would definitely recommend that you use Spikes on this set rather than the other two options, and would also recommend that you add some more Speed to the set. Getting that first Spore off quickly is utterly crucial. Though there are many slow pokemon in Streetmons, most things not designed for Trick Room are still faster than a 0 Spe Skarm.)
Gengar
Gengar is a very powerful setup sweeper with great Special Attack and Speed, and immunity to Fake Out and ExtremeSpeed. It will also survive an Ursaring Shadow Sneak even after Flame Orb has activated (without SR), but at the same time, will struggle to set up on anything. Theorymon's set below uses Spooky Plate and Judgment, though this is not the only way to go. Lum berry and Life Orb are very useful items for Gengar, and should be considered even if they lead to weakened STAB.
Gengar may be frail as hell, but it has one trick up it's sleeve that makes it a HUGE threat: immunity to ExtremeSpeed. Because of this, Gengar is actually one of the most threatening Special sweepers in the game if it can set up!
After one Tail Glow, Gengar's Spooky Plate boosted Judgment (so it can be a ghost type Judgment) is EXTREMELY powerful. To give you a picture of it's power, +3 Judgment OHKOs both Kyogre and Magnezone after Stealth Rock damage! To make it even more threatening, Gengar's +3 Vacuum Wave can destroy Ursaring after Stealth Rock, and thanks to that Ghost typing, Gengar doesn't have to worry about Fake Out and ExtremeSpeed's higher priority! Although currently somewhat uncommon, anything faster than Gengar will destroy it, so you can opt to use Shell Smash and Aura Sphere instead for a less powerful but still threatening sweeper!
Gengar's biggest problem lies in actually setting up. Gengar's defenses really suck, so you either have to rely on Sporeing Pokemon that aren't carrying Lum Berry or pairing it with Wobbuffet. This is probably why Gengar isn't as common as it was in the beginning of the metagame. Despite this, I recommend preparing for Gengar, because if it gets a turn to set up, it's very difficult to stop!
Slaking
With the ability to use Skill Swap, Slaking's appalling Truant ability is now only a minor disadvantage. This allows it to take full advantage of its outrageous stats. STAB ExtremeSpeed from Slaking may not quite be as powerful as Ursaring's, but it's still going to hurt.
Slaking has always been a disappointing Pokemon. Its stats are excellent, but Traunt is such a terrible ability that it's rarely used. Mimic Street Pokemon is a far different story, as thanks to Skill Swap, Slaking can finally be used to its fullest potential!
After a Skill Swap, Slaking will have time to set up a Swords Dance, and with that 160 base attack, ExtremeSpeed will deal a ton of damage! Even if the opponent switches into Skill Swap, they will only have once chance to attack before Traunt kicks in. This means if the opponent is foolish enough to stay in after that, you get 2 Swords Dances! Slaking is also good at V-creating Pokemon on the switch, having a V-create thats even more powerful than Groudon's.
Slaking does have one really annoying flaw though. It is possibly the easiest Pokemon to metagame ever. Any Pokemon with Protect will beat this set one on one, it hates the rare Arceus or Shedinja, and worst of all, it actually has trouble with other Slaking because Skill Swap! Regardless, don't let these flaws make you think Slaking is easy to prepare for. It's not very viable to put Protect on every Pokemon, and Slaking has a knack for being really mean to face for unprepared teams!
Pretty much, Skill Swap can force switches, bringing you to use whichever of the other moves you feel necessary (Sheer Cold for "holyfuckidkwhattodo/Machoke/Machamp), Explosion to hit tons of things hard with STAB base 250 move, coming off of 356 attack, uninvested. 252 HP for maximum Transform HP, a 504 HP Aerodactyl with a coil under its belt is nothing to scoff at.
The main reason I'm posting this set is because I want other people to test it out. I have had success with it, but I'm waiting to see other people's reactions.
Tyranitar
Tyranitar is a very strong Pokemon in Glitchmons, thanks to its stats, Rock typing, and weather changing ability. Sandstorm is very handy for wearing the likes of Ursaring down.
Tyranitar's best set is probably a Shell Smash sweeper, although it is vulnerable to being revenge killed by Ursaring's Mach Punch (if it carries it). Tyranitar can also run some sort of priority abusing set utilising the likes of Fake Out (which will help rack up sandstorm damage) and Sucker Punch.
Aerodactyl
Aerodactyl was gifted with every recoil move in the game with which to take advantage of Rock Head, including Head Smash and Brave Bird! Combined with 130 Base Speed, this makes Aerodactyl quite the sweeper.
Aerodactyl is best off boosting with Coil because of Head Smash's disappointing accuracy, and Aerodactyl's problems with Ursaring. Disappointingly, even after a Coil some sort of boosting item will be needed to OHKO Machoke with +1 Brave Bird (e.g Life Orb, Sharp Beak, Expert Belt) which would leave Aerodactyl open to Spore. Still, it's something to watch out for.
Solid Sturdy Pokemon that walls the likes of Machoke and Ursaring. It's not especially powerful, but it has great physical defense, great defensive typing for streetmons, and Speed low enough to tie with Machoke in Trick Room. V-Create is its most powerful move, and will let it become even slower in TR. Bonemerang is superior to Earthquake in this case because you don't want things like Jirachi and Dugtrio to set ups subs on Golem for free. It'll also OHKO Magnezone through Sturdy, which is neat. Sheer Cold/Spore is for Machoke/Machamp. Spore has more use otherwise, but Sheer Cold is more reliable, as it is not susceptible to lum berry or magic coat. As Golem isn't going to sweep with this set, it may as well support. Stealth Rock, Spikes and Toxic Spikes all work. Trick Room is obviously a good option on a dedicated team.
The spread gives Golem a little power boost, which is necessary to ward off Dugtrio, and will come in handy in general. The level of Defense is already very impressive.
(Head Smash is a pretty cool option that I missed out here. It's especially useful if you want to use Golem in rain without it being extremely weak. I might also recommend the use of more Attack evs, to ensure that opponents cannot freely set up on Golem.
Rhydon
Rhydon may unfortunately lack Sturdy, but it makes a much better user of Rock Head than its RBY rival, Golem, and can take advantage of Eviolite to give it monstrous defenses. Its Speed is low enough to be slower than Machoke in Trick Room, and yet still fast enough that it can instead boost its Speed with Shell Smash.
Rhydon (M) @ Eviolite
Trait: Rock Head
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SDef (I would consider running a much faster spread)
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpAtk)
-Shell Smash
-Head Smash
-Earthquake
-Wood Hammer
(Toaster's spread here is a little odd in that it totally lacks Speed. I would add enough Speed to outrun Dugtrio at +2, or at the very least Gengar. His current spread won't even outrun max Speed Magnezone at +2. It's also worth mentioning Brave Bird and Sheer Cold, the former having a small chance to OHKO Machoke after a boost, and the latter dispatching it extremely easily)
--
At first glance, its defensive capabilities and offensive seem pretty similar to golem as they both share the same common typing and same great resists to several common moves (V-create and Extremespeed.) However, Rhydon's niches extend beyond that. In addition of being another soild counter to Ursaring. Rhydon also gets access to Rock Head Head Smashes. Coming from 130 Base Attack, unboosted Rhydon alone has the ability to 2HKO most physically defensive focused Streetmon Pokemon (with the exception of Machoke which we'll get to later) , and due to the massively offensive nature of streetpkmn, most other pokemon Rhydon will see are more offensive tailored and are already not willing to come in on unboosted Head Smashes.
However its main interest lies within its impressive physical bulk coming from an eviolite. To put this into perspective, Support Groudon only has a chance to 2HKO Rhydon with Earthquake and after a Shell Smash only has a 2.56% chance to OHKO it. Meanwhile Rhydon does 80.69% - 95.05% to Max/Max Impish Groudon with Wood Hammer after a Shell Smash Boost. The lack of Recoil Damage further taken by Wood Hammer and Head Smash allows Rhydon to still maintain its health while taking such attacks. While not the best scenario, Rhydon also has the ability to survive unboosted Power Whips from the likes of pokemon such as Arcanine. It's special bulk coming from an Eviolite isn't too shabby either despite the rarity of specially oriented pokemon and the fact Rhydon would be unwilling to stay in on them. Lugia's Aura Spheres only put up a 3HKO at best and a 28% chance to kill with a Tail Glow boost.
Head Smash and Earthquake are your obligatory STAB moves and and as such is pretty self explanatory (with the latter being your best move against Machoke after a Shell Smash.) While Wood Hammer covers up Groudon, a common obstacle for physical attackers. Rhydon, as with probably most shell smashers, requires Entry Hazard Support to crucially secure some 2HKOs and OHKOs after or before a shell smash despite the difficulty it is to maintain entry hazards in streetpkmn. Rhydon also appreciates pokemon such as Lum Sucker Punch Tyranitar who also further supports Rhydon with Sandstorm and the Special Defense Boost.
Rhydon @ Eviolite / Lum Berry
Trait: Rock Head
IVs: 0 Spd
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Brave Nature (+Atk, -Spd)
- Trick Room
- Head Smash
- Sheer Cold
- Earthquake / Wood Hammer / V-create
I know user toaster has talked about Rhydon in another post, but I'm going to talk about my favorite Rhydon set to use. Before I get to that though, I may as well mention the reason why Rhydon is superior to Rhyperior in this metagame. It's all about Rock Head. Having a no recoil Head Smash coming from 130 base attack is pretty scary, and Rhydon's stats are very similar to Rhyperior's anyways. Solid Rock is a cool ability and all, but it's not going to beat having a STAB no recoil Head Smash!
Rhydon @ Eviolite / Lum Berry
Trait: Rock Head
IVs: 0 Spd
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Brave Nature (+Atk, -Spd)
- Trick Room
- Head Smash
- Sheer Cold
- Earthquake / Wood Hammer / V-create
I have been using this guy since around April, but Rhydon's been appearing on a lot of my TR teams lately because its such a great mon. First of all, while Rock / Ground is normally considered a poor defensive typing, Rock is actually a great defensive typing to have in this metagame. It provides Rhydon a vital resistance to V-create and ExtremeSpeed, which is not only important in Mimic Street Pokemon in general, but is even more important on TR teams considering how hard it can be to fit a Fire resist! Because of this, Rhydon makes a great check to most Ursaring, with most Ursaring being unable to 2HKO Rhydon, while Rhydon threatens to Head Smash it to death. The other great thing about Rhydon is it's poor Speed. Thanks to that base 40 Speed, it will outspeed Machoke under Trick Room, and then OHKO it with Sheer Cold.
Like I said before, recoiless Head Smash is a big part of what makes Rhydon so good in this metagame, and good lord does it fucking hurt! Almost anything that doesn't resist Head Smash will get 2HKOed, and even mons that do resist Head Smash still take quite a bit of damage! The last move can actually be quite tricky to choose. Earthquake is the most common choice for the last slot. It provides great coverage with Head Smash, crushing Steel-types that may attempt to switch in on Head Smash. However if you are more worried about Groudon, you can use Wood Hammer over Earthquake. While being walled by steels is annoying, Wood Hammer 2HKOs most Groudon as long as they aren't Impish, meaning that Rhydon can actually beat Groudon under Trick Room! Wood Hammer also slams Golem and opposing Rhydon hard. Finally, Rhydon isn't a bad user of V-create. V-create does more to Groudon than Wood Hammer, and it busts through steels as well. Sadly, you will lose to Golem and Rhydon if you use V-create.
Another tough choice for Rhydon is the item. Evolite is pretty awesome, making Rhydon the most bulky Pokemon on the physical side in the game! It also boosts Rhydon's lack luster SpD, which can be helpful for taking stuff like sunny Fire Blasts. However, Evolite gives Rhydon one big weakness: Spore. Rhydon's biggest problem is that after Trick Room runs out, Pokemon such as Magnezone will usually set up on it via Spore. Unlike Machoke, Rhydon's physical defense is still pretty good without evolite, so you can elect to use a Lum Berry to screw up Magnezone and friends after Trick Room is done. Losing that bulk sucks, but having a way to deal with Spore can make lum a reasonable alternative.
Giratina
Giratina doesn't have access to the Mimic Glitch, but makes up for it by walling virtually everything in the metagame. It has some trouble with Machamp and Machoke though, and must resort to pressure stalling to beat them.
Giratina is viable in streetmons just because it walls so much stuff. Ursaring, Slaking, Kyogre, Groudon… the list goes on. Here I've maximised Defense, because this is what Giratina does best. You might want to consider a bit of Speed for the likes of Machamp, and other base 90s. Calm Mind provides Giratina with a way to boost its mediocre offensive stats. I've often swept a team merely with Dragon Pulse. Sub and Protect let Giratina stall out Sheer Cold from Machoke and Machamp, and then set up on them (especially if they try to use useless moves to conserve PP). Alternatively, with good support from sturdy pokemon, and a good source of residual damage, you can accept the loss to Machoke and Machamp, and run other moves, such as Roar. Earth power should provide good coverage with Dragon Pulse. Without sub and protect, you are better off with a lum berry.
Shedinja
Shedinja gained an awful lot from the Mimic glitch, and though certainly not a consistent Pokemon to use, it is something you need to prepare for. Most notably, Shedinja gains access to Endeavor, which will bring any opponent down to 1 HP, and a variety of moves with which to change its typing, including Conversion (2), Reflect Type, and Camouflage (which turns Shedinja into a Ground-type). With a moveset of Endeavor/ ExtremeSpeed/Camouflage/ Shadow Sneak or Magic Coat Shedinja can be extremely dangerous. However, its vulnerability to Spore and entry hazards really lets it down. Chandelure
Chandelure is viable in Glitchmons because it is immune to both Normal and Fire, which gives it numerous switch-in opportunities and makes it entirely immune to some Ursaring movesets, and because of the power of Fire-type attacks coming off its enormous Special Attack stat in the sun. Its Choice Scarf set is detailed below, but it can do other things; Flame Charge is an interesting idea, as is Trick Room (which it learns naturally).
Chandelure @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 44 Def / 252 SpA / 212 Spe
Modest Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
- Fire Blast
- Energy Ball
- Hidden Power [Fighting]
- Shadow Ball
Chandelure is actually pretty good in streetmons even without its Dream World ability. In the sun it is astoundingly powerful, especially if you can get a Flash Fire boost, and it has two of the best immunities in the metagame. With a Choice Scarf it is fast enough for sweeping; Snunch swept me with one yesterday. Let's take a look at what happens to the Pokemon from the OP, and a few others mentioned in the thread, assuming Modest nature, either sun or a flash fire boost (not both), and no boosting item. All targets are 252 HP, neutral nature. To most, this is very generous.
Fire Blast vs Eviolite Machoke: 96.4% - 113.7%
Fire Blast vs Ursaring: OHKO (252 HP is generous to Ursaring)
Fire Blast vs Groudon: 94.3% - 111.1%
Fire Blast vs Machamp: OHKO (again, generous)
Fire Blast vs Slaking: 98.4% - 115.9%
Fire Blast vs Eviolite Rhydon: 52.7% - 61.8%
Energy Ball vs Eviolite Rhydon: OHKO
Energy Ball vs Kyogre: 45.6% - 53.8%
Hidden Power Fighting vs Tyranitar (sand): 60.4% - 71.3%
Kyogre and Tyranitar are the things that are likely to stand in its way, and, as you can see, even these can be dealt with by the appropriate coverage move.
Also:
Max Attack +1 Ursaring Shadow Sneak vs 0/4 Chandelure: 60.5% - 71.3%
Ursaring cannot OHKO even the frailest Chandelure variant, even with Stealth Rock support. Basically, it's not going down to priority unless you've got two Ursarings, both with Shadow Sneak.
Speed lets it outrun max Speed Dugtrio. Could run max Speed but tbh there is not much to outrun, especially given the imperfect Speed IV required for HP Fighting. Timid is an option, but as you can see in the calcs above many of its OHKOs are somewhat marginal. As far as support is concerned, you should be using at least one Groudon. Outside of the sun Chandelure is underwhelming.
Heatran
Heatran is fairly similar to Chandelure, but trades the immunity to Normal for greatly improved defenses, and access to support moves such as Stealth Rock and Roar.
Heatran@ Lum Berry / Air Balloon.
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SAtk
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Fire Blast
- Stealth Rock
- Earth Power
- Roar
Heatran is viable in streetmons despite not getting the glitch, largely due to its resistances, but it does face some competition from Chandelure. Heatran walls Ursaring completely, and will also wall some variants of Jirachi, Metagross, Slaking and Tangrowth. With Air Balloon, it can wall a lot more, but becomes very obviously vulnerable to sleep moves. In the sun, Fire Blast is the only attack worth using, ripping up almost everything in streetmons but Kyogre, especially with a Flash Fire boost. Stealth rock provides vital support, and the remaining moves are largely filler. Roar prevents stuff like Dugtrio from setting up, and helps you to check sweepers that resist fire. Earth Power might hit another Heatran or Chandelure, but is, again, pretty much filler.
Arcanine
Arcanine makes use of Flash Fire (or perhaps Intimidate), good stats, and STAB V-create in the sun to do some serious damage. With base 95 Speed it outruns most of the metagame, and can even outrun a decent number of things after having used V-Create. This is not a Pokemon I've personally used, so please go out and test it, and post your findings here.
Ho-Oh
Ho-Oh has great all-round stats, including a very good attack stat, letting it fire off enormously powerful V-creates. It lacks the resistances and immunities of the above Pokemon, and is very weak to stealth Rock, but is probably more powerful and versatile than any of them. Sets please!
Forretress
Another Sturdy pokemon. Weak to V-Create, but at least STAB U-turn is quite cool, and it's slower than Machoke which is good for Trick Room.
Forretress @ Lum Berry
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Ability: Sturdy
Nature: Relaxed (+Def, -Spe) 0 Spe IVs
Trick Room
Spore
Stealth Rock
U-turn
Let's face it, Forretress isn't an offensive juggernaut and its 4x weakness to V-Create is highly undesirable. However, It is a very effective support Pokemon for a Trick Room team. Under Trick Room it is slower than Machoke and can Spore it, set up a hazard, or U-turn away. U-turn is particularly helpful for Forretress given the immense unpredictability of streetmons, in that it allows Forretress to keep whatever momentum it might earn. If it sets up TR and Spores an opponent, U-turn allows Forretress to do at least visible damage thanks to STAB, but more importantly with 5th Gen Sleep mechanics it essentially allows you to either bring in a counter to your opponent's Pokemon knowing it will still be asleep when the switch is made, or alternatively lets you counter whichever Pokemon they bring in with one of your own. It also has utility in letting Forretress get away from teams that use trappers while keeping the Lum Berry that defends it against other Spores (in lieu of Shed Shell). Not to mention it can get away from "faster" V-Creates under Trick Room, another very useful function.
Granted the set doesn't have recovery, but since Wish has epic distribution in Streetmons and Forry finds its best use in switching into OHKO moves and normal attacks like Extremespeed, it can go in and out several times. It may seem weird that a Pokemon with 354 HP and 416 Def with Sturdy is best suited to an in-and-out role, but welcome to Streetmons I suppose. It's much more important to be able to switch into boosted Extremespeed 8 times. Another cool note: Unless Ursaring itself has 0 Spe IVs and Brave nature, Forretress is still slower under TR if Ursaring has used V-Create previously, so you can use Forry to bait a second one and hit Ursaring's lowered Defense.
I've been using it with SR since its the best one-move hazard, but you could certainly replace it with another hazard or possibly Rapid Spin. Maybe even Recycle if you think another mon has a better shot at setting up hazards and you want another Lum. Forretress just isn't cut out for attacking in Streetmons. I've had Gyro Ball on a few sets and there's simply too many other TR abusing mons and Shell Smashers with steel resistance or neutrality for it to be useful. Forretress is at its best in a supporting role.
Rock Arceus
Rock typing and fantastic stats just make Rock Arceus viable despite its lack of access to the glitch and inability to use Lum Berry.
Arceus@Stone Plate
Trait: Multitype
EVs: 124 HP / 252 Def / 124 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Recover
- Will-o-Wisp / Cosmic Power
- Judgement
- Substitute
Rock Arceus, the best Arceus in street, has the ability to counter Ursaring like there's no tomorrow. If Ursaring isn't running Drain Punch with Flame Orb (Like SOMEONE used.) it is most likely not going to be breaking this Arceus any time soon, if it's running WoW over Cosmic Power that is. The thing about Rock Arceus is that it resists both V-Create and Extremespeed, giving most Ursaring very little to work with. Arceus also has the ability to burn through Lum berries (quite literally) with Will-o-Wisp, and being able to burn Groudon is a nice thing to have in many situations. Judgement is powerful STAB, hitting neutral on most everything not named Groudon or Magnezone, and is the best attacking choice for this slot from experience.
Manaphy
Manaphy lacks access to the glitch, but is viable because of Hydration, which lets it take Sleep moves in the rain all day. Tail Glow provides a good means for it to boost its power, and dish out some serious damage with Rain-boosted water-type attacks. Its defenses are sufficient to take on Ursaring with investment.
Manaphy @ Life Orb
Trait: Hydration
EVs: 220 HP / 252 Def / 36 SAtk (I would consider adding at least 20 Spe in order to outrun max Speed Magnezone)
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Tail Glow
- Surf
- Rest
- Grass Knot / Ice Beam
Do not be fooled by Manaphy's lack of the glitch and my extremely strong bias for it, as this particular pokemon can indeed be devastating with the tools it has. Among these is arguably the more important of the bunch: its ability Hydration. This effectively gives Manaphy an immunity to spore, not only freeing up an item slot over lum berry but also gives Manaphy an opportunity to come in and set up. A resistance to the common V-create is also notable. With the resulting drop in stats for the opposing pokemon being the icing on the cake and gives Manaphy even more opportunities to come in and spill doom by nabbing a Tail Glow boost. Keep in mind that the majority of pokemon within the giltchmons environment are more physically defensive, meaning that should Manaphy gain a boost with Tail Glow it is indeed capable of doing some serious damage.
However, there are a fair few flaws that cannot go unnoticed. While Manaphy under a Tail Glow boost is deadly in its own right, its raw damage output can be fairly disappointing. In fact, without Life Orb, Manaphy is not even capable of OHKOing fragile threats such as gengar within the rain without optimal investment in Special Attack or Stealth Rock (and thats only a 25% fyi). Another, albeit more obvious flaw is that constant maintaining of rain is extremely vital to Manaphy's success and sadly, with the overwhelming presence of Groudon, this is not necessarily an easy task.
The majority of the moveset is self explanatory with the sole exception of the last slot. Grass Knot is generally more vital due to its ability to hit Groudon and Kyogre hard, yet Ice Beam can also be used if you fear the occasional Giratina and the few Grass types that roam within the metagame. The 36 Special Attack EVs ensures that no Gengar or other sweeper with such fragility will be going out alive as you come in on their spore. The remaining EVs are invested in both defense and HP for optimal defense against the widely used Ursaring. You may opt to use leftovers over Life Orb if you do not mind the loss for power. Keep in mind however that you will lose some OHKOs without help from entry hazards. If you do opt to use leftovers you are welcome to move the 36 EVs in special attack to anywhere you like (peferably in HP or speed.) Finally: make sure you do have rain under your control as it is absolutely mandatory in order for Manaphy to truly shine.
Scizor
I'll admit I haven't tested this one out yet, but thanks to Technician, Gear Grind has an effective base power of 150, not including STAB, which is just enormously powerful. Unfortunately, it's illegal with shell smash and V-Create, which is very annoying. Bonemerang has top-notch power too, and Bullet Punch is still more powerful than a non-STAB Extremespeed. I'm not sure what the best Scizor set would be. Dragon Dance? Choice Band? Life Orb? Trick Room? I have no idea. None of them may work at all. That's what testing is for.
Excadrill
What's this? Another Pokemon that doesn't get the glitch? Seriously? Yep, Excadrill in the sand is still a threat in streetmons, serving as a great revenge killer (since ursaring doesn't like sand very much) and, of course, a great sweeper, thanks to its excellent speed and resistance to priority moves. Excadrill already has all it needs: Swords Dance, Earthquake, Rock Slide, and Horn Drill or Fissure for Machoke.
Blissey
Blissey gained access to transform, which, with its massive HP stats, allows you to create a clone of the opponent with far superior defenses. Blissey has an enormous 714 HP, which is more than double most of those in Glitchmons. Still, since you have to waste a turn transforming, it's not overpowered in any way. I can't say I'd really recommend it, but it's something you should be aware of.
Glitchmons Speed Tiers
Everything above Deoxys-S is basically off the scale. Pokemon will achieve these sorts of Speeds, but will unlikely be contested.
504 Deoxys-S Positive Max
486 +2 Tyranitar Positve Max
480 +2 Magnezone Positive Max
478 +2 Metagross Neutral Max
459 +1 Kyogre Timid Max
458 +2 Machamp, Omastar Positive Max
442 +2 Tyranitar Neutral Max
438 +2 Magnezone Neutral Max
426 +1 Chandelure Timid Max
418 +1 Kyogre Modest Max, +2 Machamp, Omastar Neutral Max
Very interesting thread. While I can't think of any viable sets at the moment, this does seem reminiscent of Hackmons on Pokemon Showdown. It also seems to be more based on WiFi battling.
This has been played for far longer than Hackmons on Pokemon Showdown - to give you an idea, I myself had been playing it for a few months before Pokemon Showdown was even up and running. It didn't even have teambuilding capabilities until much later.
Also, Hackmons is based on completely cheating and using devices to edit data in your game. A glitch is not equal to cheating in the slightest - it is an exploit in the game that you can use without needing an outside device.
It isn't even possible to play this on WiFi, how would it be based on such a thing? Not only that, but could quite possibly take months to make a Streetmons team. To put such a thing in perspective, third generation tutors are single use, meaning that to get a single team you would have to beat the game SIX times, trading the team to 4th gen to perform the glitch however many times needed, and then again trade up to 5th gen to finalise any movesets that may need 5th gen moves.
The only ways to play Streetmons are Infrared battles and the Union Room, otherwise your Pokemon go through a hack check and you cannot connect to WFC with an illegal moveset.
I'm sorry that I did convey what I meant to say properly! I don't know anything about the history of Glitchmons, so thanks for letting me know.
The thing is, I meant to say that the Glitchmons metagame revolves around an in-game glitch. I meant to say DS to DS battles, they don't necessarily need to be WiFi battles. Though, it would be difficult.
Actually, you've got a few things wrong about illegal movesets and how hack checking works. While I'm not an authority on either of the subjects, I know a few things about it.
1) Illegal movesets don't really prevent a Pokemon from being used in WFC. Haven't you seen event Pokemon like V-Create Rayquaza? V-Create is nowhere in Rayquaza's movepool pre-loaded in the game. If the game checked every move of every Pokemon for hack checking, event Pokemon with new moves would become unusable in WiFi battles. Think about the event Legendary Dogs in Gen IV for instance.
2) I've only done it once, but I hacked a Dragonite in Gen IV PID Format to have Multiscale. I tried to see if it passed WiFi Random Matchup Hack Checks, and it did. In the one WiFi battle I used it in, I forfeited, as per the rules of sportsmanship and fair play in Pokemon.
You teach the Pokemon Sketch in the gen 4 game before transferring it, and then sketch V-Create. This is why each Pokemon gets one and only one Generation 5 move that it doesn't learn naturally.
Sturdy Pokemon do not require spin support for their primary purpose; OHKO moves do not work on Sturdy pokemon regardless of their level of health. However, Sturdy is still a very useful ability, and can be extremely handy for checking runaway Shell Smash sweepers, or at least those that lack Bonemerang. Still, there is often something better to do with that turn it takes to Spin.
If you're using Shedinja, however, Spin support is almost mandatory. If the opponent sees Shedinja in team preview (which should be implemented for Glitchmons shortly) then they are going to set up Stealth Rock as quickly as possible. Stealth Rock is still present on a lot of Glitchmons teams, even if time is not always found to use it.
The good news is that spinning should be pretty easy, even though Scrappy Miltank and Kangaskhan sadly don't have access to the move, because the opponent can never tell when it's coming.
Do not be fooled by Manaphy's lack of the glitch and my extremely strong bias for it, as this particular pokemon can indeed be devastating with the tools it has. Among these is arguably the more important of the bunch: its ability Hydration. This effectively gives Manaphy an immunity to spore, not only freeing up an item slot over lum berry but also gives Manaphy an opportunity to come in and set up. A resistance to the common V-create is also notable. With the resulting drop in stats for the opposing pokemon being the icing on the cake and gives Manaphy even more opportunities to come in and spill doom by nabbing a Tail Glow boost. Keep in mind that the majority of pokemon within the giltchmons environment are more physically defensive, meaning that should Manaphy gain a boost with Tail Glow it is indeed capable of doing some serious damage.
However, there are a fair few flaws that cannot go unnoticed. While Manaphy under a Tail Glow boost is deadly in its own right, its raw damage output can be fairly disappointing. In fact, without Life Orb, Manaphy is not even capable of OHKOing fragile threats such as gengar within the rain without optimal investment in Special Attack or Stealth Rock (and thats only a 25% fyi). Another, albeit more obvious flaw is that constant maintaining of rain is extremely vital to Manaphy's success and sadly, with the overwhelming presence of Groudon, this is not necessarily an easy task.
The majority of the moveset is self explanatory with the sole exception of the last slot. Grass Knot is generally more vital due to its ability to hit Groudon and Kyogre hard, yet Ice Beam can also be used if you fear the occasional Giratina and the few Grass types that roam within the metagame. The 36 Special Attack EVs ensures that no Gengar or other sweeper with such fragility will be going out alive as you come in on their spore. The remaining EVs are invested in both defense and HP for optimal defense against the widely used Ursaring. You may opt to use leftovers over Life Orb if you do not mind the loss for power. Keep in mind however that you will lose some OHKOs without help from entry hazards. If you do opt to use leftovers you are welcome to move the 36 EVs in special attack to anywhere you like (peferably in HP or speed.) Finally: make sure you do have rain under your control as it is absolutely mandatory in order for Manaphy to truly shine. Support Rhydon is likely going to follow here soon enough just fyi
Trying to get into battles is stupidly aggravating, made even more so when the other guy is a clueless dude who hasn't really thought about making an actually usable Glitchmons team. However, it has been better than the existing alternative; the hurdles for playing Glitchmons on PO (and my falling out with PO in general) pretty much prevented me from bothering with this metagame. It's cool to see this metagame come to life, since it really doesn't belong to anybody. It's the only metagame that isn't regulated by anyone, and not built for any ulterior purpose (like PS! Hackmons).
I've been wondering if Final Gambit could be a justified, viable force in the metagame. For one thing, it actually hits Sturdy users and Lum/Chesto Berry users alike with 100% accuracy, unlike Sheer Cold / Spore. It seems it hasn't been explored all that much, with only a single post in the previous thread about it... and that was just an offhand suggestion to put it on Blissey. However, Blissey speed-ties with Machamp at best, and Chansey is obviously slower, so they don't strike me as the most promising users of Final Gambit.
From what I can see, the ideal Final Gambit users would have Base Speeds of at least 107 (Choice Scarf Machamp), maybe 111 (Gengar), or some other means of being faster than Machamp/Gengar (e.g. Chlorophyll Tangrowth). Obviously, high HP is desirable, as well as perhaps a lack of weakness to Stealth Rock. We could come up with something like:
(I am testing this)
Mewtwo @ Lum Berry
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 36 Def / 220 Spe Bold
- Substitute / Tail Glow
- Psychic / Psystrike
- Recover
- Final Gambit
or
(this is just the listed Tangrowth with Final Gambit instead of Spore)
Tangrowth @ Lum Berry
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe Modest
- Tail Glow
- Seed Flare / Energy Ball
- Blue Flare / Flamethrower
- Final Gambit
Now, I'm pretty sure that the main problem has become apparent. Why make a suicide Pokémon when you can just make Generic Sweeper #74683? Thus, I mostly see Final Gambit being used on a sweeper as a sort of bailout move, kind of similarly to the way Spore is used, when switching out and attempting a sweep later isn't that feasible (e.g. your counter is about to turn the sweep around on you). This would be a much faster way of "switching out" than Spore, at the cost of the user.
It's worth noting that Gengar is particularly important for a Final Gambit user, since Final Gambit doesn't faint the user if it fails (though as of this writing it does on PS!). So if it switches into Final Gambit, if the Final Gambit user is faster, it could just switch to an attack that nukes Gengar.
Aerodactyl @ Lum Berry
Trait: Rock Head
EVs: / 252 Atk /4Def/ 252 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Spore
- Coil
- Brave Bird/Flare Blitz/Wood Hammer
- Head Smash
This is my first ever post/contribution to anything so here goes:
The point of this set is to spore, coil-up, and attack with powerful move of choice. While there is no defense investment it resists Fake Out and Extremespeed and is not OHKO'd by Mach Punch, taking 3-4 hits to KO from a Guts Flame Orb +2 Atk Ursarang with no coil boosts. The choice in the third slot depends on what you want to bring down. Brave Bird is for Machamp/choke and deals nicely with Tangrowth if not in the sun with a 37.5% chance to OHKO without any attack boosts. Flare Blitz is for Metagross and Jirachi. Lastly Wood Hammer hits Kyogre and Groudon hard however it takes at the most 3 hits to kill max HP/4Def Groudon.
Another somewhat gimmicky set is an Unnerve/Spore set.
Aerodactyl @ Expert Belt / Lum Berry
Trait: Rock Head
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature
- Coil
- Head Smash
- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz / Wood Hammer
This set is a bit different from the one above and started out merely a means to slay weather starters. I was impressed that it actually managed a few sweeps on its own. Max Speed allows you to outrun opposing Aerodactyl and other Base 130s. Head Smash is your strongest STAB and Brave Bird is for OHKOing Machamp and Machoke. The next move is a matter of coverage. Wood Hammer hits the 3 main weather starters Super Effectively. With SR, it OHKOs 252/196+ Kyogre, 252/0 Groudon, and Tyranitar while nailing Rhydon and Golem. Flare Blitz has better coverage, notably against Jirachi and Skarmory, while recieving pSTAB in the sun.
The calcs assume Expert Belt but you can run Lum if you dont think Spore is a problem. You will miss out on crucial OHKOs, most notably Machoke and weahter starters, though you can still get Machoke with Spikes.
And here I was planning on making the first Aerodactyl post. Guess I'll find something else to test now.
One comment I have on the above set is to run 4 Def over 4 HP. It gives you an odd HP number so you can switch into SR more. (Not that you should be doing that too much but at least if you switch in once you can switch in again.)
Any Pokemon which has access to Mimic, Copycat, Metronome, Transform or Assist in Gen 4 has access to the Mimic glitch, meaning it can learn any move in the game. The glitch only takes place in Gen 4, but a Pokemon with one of these moves can be transferred from Gen 3.
There seems to be a glitch regarding this. You cannot use Deoxys with the glitch. I tried all 4 forms. The same answer every time is that Deoxys cannot learn this move. It learns Mimic though. In Gen 3. I tried Gen 1 moves, Gen 2 moves, Gen 3 moves, and Gen 4 moves. The result was the same each time.
Am I missing something? Does Deoxys' status as an event pokemon have anything to do with it?
Thanks for the aerodactyls guys. Should be putting those in the second post shortly.
And I'm fairly sure Deoxys does learn Mimic, but as I said Glitchmons is not perfectly implemented. If you want to be able to use Deoxys and Lead Guard Tangrowth, remember that if you aren't using the ladder and you trust your opponent you can always use "hackmons"
This is kinda for my own novelty since I like flygon so much, but it's been effective so far. Flygon is actually better than Salamence in this case as unlike Salamence he has a better set of resistances, especially compared to the sets here. Dragon Dance is that one move that could make flygon great if it got it, and now it does. Asides from resisting most moves thrown at it (although flygon is hardly a bulky pokemon) Outrage/Earthquake/V-Create actually hit just about everything for a lot of damage, V-Create being awesome as it kills all of the pokemon that walled flygon before. Provided flygon can get that turn of setup it's a lot better than it looks.
Bluh, I haven't tested this one too much but it's gone well so far. Maybe it's completely awfull and I've only battled bad players.
Garchomp does not have access to the glitch, making it really bad. Unfortunately, Flygon is pretty bad too, due to its stats. Rayquaza is much better than either flygon or salamence.
Also, BW2 brought Ditto into this metagame, serving as a really good check to the multitude of shell smash sweepers. Maybe this was exactly what it needed.
Isn't a Moody Bibarel set viable just based on how powerful Moody is? Although the presence of No Guard Machoke probably does it no favours.
I also wonder about how Safeguard would function in this metagame. Spore abuse is absolutely rampant. And I think Safeguard might be a better option than just having everything carry Lum. Especially with Lum being only one time use.
Something like Prankster Whimsicott or something bulky on the defensive side like Lugia who has a high base speed and also walls priority.
I think I'll test out a set like this.
Lugia @ Flying Gem
252 Attack, 252 Speed
Jolly/Adamant Nature
Safeguard
Gastro Acid
Acrobatics
Spore
Safeguard gives you 5 turns to prevent Spore. Gastro Acid is for Shedinja and Machoke among other things...and Acrobatics is for pure strength.
Set is bulky enough to take attacks from the likes of Ursaring and has useful resistances. Spore is just a filler move.
Another thing I wonder about is surely Rayquaza has to have some prescence in this metagame with some of the absurdly powerful weather sweepers.
I'm not sure if it has access to the Mimic glitch, but with a movepool already consisting of great moves like V-Create and such, and the lack of ice outside of Sheer Cold, surely Rayquaza has to be considered for a great anti-meta pokemon in it's own right?
The only thing that seems to plague Rayquaza is that using it probably implies you aren't going to be using a weather sweeper yourself.
This Shedinja is great in that it can always set up since most Pokes that carry a move to deal with Shedinja, such as Ursaring, don't also carry a move to super-effectively hit Ground-types. Ground-type also has the advantage of not taking damage from Sandstorm and from getting STAB on half of the EdgeQuake combo.
Steelix @ Lum Berry
Trait: Sturdy
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
-Spore
-Stealth Rock
-Spikes
-Roar
Since there are so many ridiculously powerful physical attackers, this Steelix works well to set up hazards, sleep a couple of things, and blow some things around. Obviously it's Taunt bait so you could technically run Dragon Tail if you want.
If a pokémon shares an egg-group with a pokémon capable of performing this glitch,can this be used to give normally-illegal combinations of Egg moves? (eg: Garchomp shares the Monster egg-group with Blastoise, so by utilising the glitch for breeding purposes, it becomes possible to run both Metal claw and Outrage.)
If a pokémon shares an egg-group with a pokémon capable of performing this glitch,can this be used to give normally-illegal combinations of Egg moves? (eg: Garchomp shares the Monster egg-group with Blastoise, so by utilising the glitch for breeding purposes, it becomes possible to run both Metal claw and Outrage.)
