BW OU ◸◕◕◹ [Peaked #8]

gec

pharos
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
GRUMPHALLUS

purple best colour

Introduction
This team may look incredibly weird to you (well, normal except for Grumpig and Cobalion) but it is a really great team. The team itself has peaked a few times high up the ladder (around #8) and has been used by users like tab and Nachos and the rest of the UKers to exceptional success too. I'm not a particularly big fan of OU since Voltturn pretty much ruins the tier but I thought I would give it a try, so I made this team to try something unique and fun to play with instead of cookie cutter and auto-pilot to some extent - and this was the result. It has no weather inducer, no Volt Switch users, no U-Turn users and is a whole load of fun to use.
GRUMPHALLUS is a team based around Calm Mind/Baton Pass Celebi, something that apparently nobody prepares for at all but I can't really complain since that obviously benefits me. Celebi makes a great baton passer to Cobalion/Gengar/Heatran which are the 3 mons it can pass to, depending on the opponents team. It can be defined as 'bulky offence' however sometimes I use the CM/BP for a late game sweep, or if I see a weakness to any one of my mons in particular in team preview I just go for a sweep from there. The team uses its exceptional set of resistances and immunities to soften the opponent up until Celebi comes into play. The beauty of this team lies in Celebi's ability to pass numerous times a match which helps me scout my opponents scarfed Pokemon and other revenge killers and take care of them before beginning my final sweep.

The Team


ENGELBERT the Gliscor (M) @ Toxic Orb
Trait: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 164 Def / 92 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Facade
- Taunt
- Swords Dance

Gliscor starts of the team as a defensive pivot and makes a really good one at that. It makes an essential check to Pokemon such as Tyranitar, Terrakion, Scizor - and a lot more. Tyranitar is especially important to take down since I use 3 Pokemon weak to Pursuit/Crunch. While it does see a lot of use, especially some variant of thise set, that doesn't mean it doesn't work. Gliscor can easily set up a Swords Dance against many of OU's top tier Pokemon and can really put the pressure on my opponent if they let it get one in. It's bulk physically means it won't be taken down from there and sometimes I even pass it a Calm Mind or two from Celebi which aids it ridiculously well in sweeping. People already know what Gliscor does in OU so I can't really say much more here. The EVs grant me a ton of bulk to help me set up, and Gliscor is strong enough after an SD even without attack investment. 92 speed gives me a ridiculous speed creep on the 245/246 magic number and is more-so for my peace of mind!!

DELITAB the Celebi @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 184 SDef / 72 Spd
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Giga Drain
- Baton Pass
- Calm Mind
- Recover

Ok, just wow. Back in DPP when I used to play singles exclusively, I really hated Celebi. I didn't get the hype at all, to me it was just some Pokemon with 7 weaknesses that kinda sucked at what it did. Enter in 5th gen, and i've tried basically every set out there but this is the best by far. Celebi forms the first part of the 'CeleTran' combo and is amongst the most important members of the team. It does a lot for this team and it does it extremely well. Celebi is first and foremost my primary rain counter. It has a great typing which lets it switch into Politoed, Starmie, Vaporeon, Rotom-W etc and set up on them. Sometimes I've even 6-0ed a full rain team with Celebi alone. But it takes the opportunity to set up Calm Minds and pass them on as soon as possible. Don't get it wrong though - Celebi doesn't just set up once and match then dies - the aim of this team is to get passes along as frequently as possible through resistances to really punch holes in the opponents team. The set allows me to do this, as Calm Mind increases it's already great special bulk to astronomical levels. Giga Drain + Recover let it stay in tip-top shape during the game since it is essential Celebi lives for me to win. The EVs give me a buttload of special bulk to set up with, with a bit of speed which outpaces modest max speed Heatran.


MCOONLEY the Heatran (M) @ Air Balloon
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Will-O-Wisp
- Stealth Rock

Heatran forms the latter part of the 'CeleTran' combo and is my team's Stealth Rock setter. If you use this team, you'll notice without rocks a lot of stuff you face can live attacks with the littlest bit of HP left (or maybe my luck just sucks idk). Therefore, Stealth Rock is completely essential to this teams success turning 2HKOs into OHKOs. While Heatran is normally seen as a special tank, I've opted for a hybrid sort of build here, with Will-O-Wisp and SR helping it support the team while it uses max sp.attack/speed to help sweep when needed. Fast Heatran is really an essential Pokemon to me because a fast Will-O-Wisp neuters potentially dangerous Pokemon such as Adamant Gyarados and Dragonite. Fire Blast/Earth Power offer suprisingly good coverage and after a couple of Calm Minds, resistances don't even matter since this will hit too hard to care. Air Balloon is used so opposing Heatran can't touch me, and obviously for the ground immunity granted.


GERALD the Gengar (F) @ Life Orb
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast
- Pain Split
- Substitute

Gengar's amazing set of immunities and resistances, as well as it's incredible offensive potential earned it a well deserved spot on this team. I needed a Pokemon that could take advantage of all the Fighting type attacks, especially the scarfed ones that were aimed at Cobalion and Heatran. If you let Gengar get a sub up on you, it is incredibly frustrating to play since by the time you take it down, the damage has already been done. I opted for the SubSplit set over the SubDisable set since this poses more of an immediate offensive threat. Most of the time when Gengar is used, I need it to hit hard and fast and using a Life Orb allows me to do just that. Substitute allows me to scout for incoming choiced attacks and lets me act appropriately, while Pain Split lets Gengar start all over again. I really love it when people switch Chansey and Blissey into Celebi because if I get Gengar in without it getting paralyzed, they can't do anything at all to me while I get free health back. Other than that, Gengar is a fairly easy to describe Pokemon but that doesn't mean its easy to handle.


GRUMPKINNY the Grumpig (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Thick Fat
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SAtk / 252 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Psyshock
- Signal Beam / Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Thunder Wave

...what? What the hell is this? I get that a lot when I use this team or show it to anyone, and quite frankly I don't really blame people who question my use of Grumpig. Pulled out from the depths of NU, Grumpig serves a very specific role on this team and does that really, really well. When I was building this team and looking at weaknesses, I saw that Fire attacks had the potential to tear me a new one once Heatran was dead (Grumpig was the last Pokemon added to this team). That in turn led me to a massive Sun weakness, which I needed to fix drastically. I didn't want to use something like Blissey since it doesn't fit this team at all due to it being complete set up bait. I tried some Water Pokemon, but while they did fix the Fire weakness, I needed something to tank Grass attacks too since the problem lied with Sun teams. I threw Grumpig on this team on a whim while checking Pokemon with high Sdef base stats and it actually worked really well. Thick Fat Grumpig gives my team valuable Ice/Fire resistances and can wall most threats on a Sun team all day long. The Psychic typing goes a long way in deterring Venusaur and the like from having too much fun. The EVs are real simple, letting me tank Special hits as well as possible with a small portion in Sp.attack. It's really cool how Grumpig outspeeds min speed Scizor since luring cocky Scizors in and hitting them with HP Fire does so much help for Celebi when setting up. Psyshock is used to do more damage to Pokemon like Venusaur but Psychic can be used if you want to aid vs Bulk Up Conkeldurr (however its not so much a threat as other mons). The choice between Signal Beam and Focus Blast to this day still frustrates me and as always, when I pick one I ALWAYS need the other and vice versa. Signal Beam hits Pokemon like Celebi and Starmie for good damage, while Focus Blast is used for Heatran (another Pokemon I wall to infinity) and hitting TTar switchins. You have probably noted at this point Grumpig serves as a 'lure' of sorts to help get rid of troublesome Pokemon, which is the beauty of it. It does a fantastic job supporting this team and I don't really see anything else doing what it does as well.


GECCYKINS the Cobalion @ Life Orb
Trait: Justified
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Focus Blast
- Flash Cannon
- Taunt
- Hidden Power [Ghost]

As well as Grumpig, Cobalion was one of the last Pokemon to make it onto the team. I was focused on getting the best recipients for Celebi and I needed something fast and strong, with good coverage and a set of resistances I could effectively use. Cobalion is perhaps my favourite Pokemon on this team (along with the mighty GRUMPHALLUS) since it is one of the more unique Pokemon. You don't see Cobalion a lot in OU which is a mighty shame since it is so good at what it does. It's typing is fantastic when compared with Celebi (and the rest of the team obviously) since it resists all its weaknesses basically except for Fire, which is fine. Even with a full offensive spread, Cobalion is exceptionally bulky on the physical side tanking attacks from a lot of Pokemon with ease and has the resistances to use it's bulk nicely. The set is a 3 attacks + taunt set, which I think is the best combination possible. Outside of the 3 attacks Cobalion doesn't really get much but it doesn't need it anyway. Focus Miss is a solid STAB move which is really strong even off base 90 sp.att. It tears holes after a couple of CM boosts however the miss chance is so infuriating, but I can't do anything about it. Flash Cannon may be redundant but I like Steel a lot as a coverage move since it can hit a lot for a good amount of damage. HP Ghost may seem a little weird, and I did have HP Ice there originally but Jellicent and the like were too big a pain to ignore when I passed to Cobalion, and HP Ghost works decently at nabbing them. HP Ice isn't missed too much since after SR, I get a nice strong hit on Dnite and Mence anyway, and with a great base 108 speed I outspeed them easily. Taunt is used to stop Jellicent recovering or WoWing me, making it tremendously easy to dispose of. Of course it stops other Pokemon from setting up on me too, and a lot of players think Cobalion is weak enough to set up on but its real fun stopping them in their tracks.

Conclusion
In conclusion, I hope you guys like this team. It is incredibly fun to use and is a breath of fresh air in what in my opinion is a really stale metagame. I personally love how it doesn't have weather or any Voltturn parts in it which can help surprise the opponent and can prove crucial when I use this team. No team is perfect however and this is certainly no exception to the rule as this team has a fair share of threats.

Rate/hate/steal!

(importable)
Gliscor (M) @ Toxic Orb
Trait: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 172 Def / 84 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Facade
- Taunt
- Swords Dance


Celebi @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 184 SDef / 72 Spd
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Giga Drain
- Baton Pass
- Calm Mind
- Recover


Heatran (M) @ Air Balloon
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Will-O-Wisp
- Stealth Rock


Gengar (F) @ Life Orb
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast
- Pain Split
- Substitute


Grumpig (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Thick Fat
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SAtk / 252 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Psyshock
- Signal Beam
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Thunder Wave


Cobalion @ Life Orb
Trait: Justified
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Focus Blast
- Flash Cannon
- Taunt
- Hidden Power [Ghost]

 
yah like I said to you, Volc shit rocks you, and with no Phasers you will have a ton of trouble with Baton Pass teams. Your main hope is probably to go to Cobalion and hope they don't predict a taunt after you set up with Celebi, but if they phase you out before you BP, then it's probably GG.

My main solution would be to swap Grumpig with Snorlax. Gives you pretty much the same defense, but helps you a bit more with Volc and gives you another physical mon (special walls look like a bitch)

Cool team though. Luvdisc for Grumpig <3
 
You have a lot of problems with Gengar. If it behind a Sub (which is very easy as Gliscor and Celebi are both fodder) it totally destroys your team with Shadow Ball and Focus Blast and, worse enough, it outspeeds your whole team beside your own Gengar.

Ice Fang over Facade on Gliscor may helps a bit. Maybe a Scarf on Cobalion?
 

destinyunknown

Banned deucer.
Hi Gec,

Your team is really original (good job definitely) but as other people have said you look pretty weak to Volcarona and Special Attackers in general that can beat Grumpig, especially Gengar. A way of solving it could be replacing Grumpig with Snorlax. Snorlax still provides you with a Fire (and Grass) resistance but it isn't weak to Bug moves making it a decent Volcarona's check. Snorlax can also take on Gengar decently (though it takes a lot from LO Focus Blast). Here's the set:

Snorlax@Leftovers | Thick Fat
Careful Nature | 252 Hp / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Body Slam / Fire Punch / Crunch / Pursuit


Something like Flamethrower/Seismic Toss/Softboiled/Thunder Wave Blissey could probably fit better (since it shuts down Gengar and Volcarona completely), so it might be worth trying even if you don't like it much, but Snorlax has the obvious advantage of being more offensive.
 
Yeah I agree with what Mike said, you should use Toxic over W-o-W on Heatran to stop yourself being 6-0d by Volcarona.

You could try Tornadus or Starmie over Gengar I guess, as they both outspeed enemy Gengar and can do a lot with Acrobatics and Psychic, plus they resist fighting. Gives you an edge over stuff like Latios as well.
 
As others have mentioned, you are a little weak to fast special attackers like Gengar and Starmie. You mentioned that Gengar's job is primarily to exploit choiced fighting types, but I think a Substitute Alakazam can do this whilst checking some important threats to your team. With Magic Guard, it's free to run a Life Orb and be even stronger than Gengar, and it is able to outrun and OHKO Pokemon such as Starmie and Gengar that threaten the team. I can't think of a fighting type that naturally outspeeds it, so it can act as a solid check to them despite its fratility. Although scarfers are fast, I don't think this is too much of an issue, since Gliscor laughs at Pokemon locked into a fighting move with a scarf. I would probably suggest a set of Substitute/Psychic/Focus Miss/Shadow Ball, or perhaps Thunderbolt in the last slot. Either one hits Starmie, but the former has the advantage of revenge killing any Latios without a Scarf, while the latter allows you to hit bulky waters harder, kill Specially Defensive Skarmory easier and hit a few things like Gyarados for extra damage. I would probably still prefer Shadow Ball, by either is usable.
Hopefully this is more useful in fixing up a few little issues without replacing the boss that is GRUMPIG.
EDIT: A couple of other things i forgot to mention: Firstly, Alakazam is a great recipient for BPed Calm Minds since they allow him to muscle through Pokemon like Chansey and Ferrothorn. Secondly, since you have a bit of a Volc weakness, you could consider Sash on 'zam so that you can take one hit and do heavy damage to it. I don't think Psychic will kill it without some prior damage, though. The other option to help with Volc is Roar>something on Heatran, but it sounds like all of your moves are important and HP Ground Volc is still a big threat.
 
Even of Grumpig seems really funny to use, I think something like Slowking could replace it. As his name says, he's slow, that's a pity. But otherwise, he seems to be better than grumpig. Better defenses on both side, an amazing ability, regenerator (and you keep the fire and ice resistance), a better typing as electricity and grass are well covered by your other pokemon, especially gliscor and celebi. A better spe attack, a better fire move, and can learn any move you gave to Grumpig, and other funny things such as ice beam or recover.

Anyway, really nice team, I like a lot your team, especially Celebi and Cobalion.
I think Rock polish Gliscor with BP (and Earthquake + taunt or ice fang) could work wonder in your team, he can BP +2 speed many times in a match. That might help pokemon receiving CM sweeping entire teams. But you would need a powerful physical attacker somewhere (maybe a DD dragonite or Salamence instead of Gengar ?)
 
Volcarona is a big big big problemi for your team (which i found great ^^ out of this weakness to Volca :/ ) ! Why don't you replace Gengar with a classic annoying and "fantasyless" Skarfkion? Skarfkion its always a good choice , its usefull and in your team could be intristing for 2 reason in my opinion : reason 1) Because you don't have a dangerous physical attacker, and reason 2) because you could exploit a double fight sweeping (Kion+Coba) ... Think about it , I thought to replace Gengar for exclusion because the other are too usefful for the Team strategy and because Grumping which was the other nominated to replace is simply to cool ;)
Congrat again, I hope I could be kinda useful ^^
 
DON'T GET RID OF GRUMPKINNY!! It's what makes the team unique and fun to use, which is much more valuable than a patched up Volc or Gengar weakness, imo. OU has gotten stale, and it's nice to see an unusual yet effective team that can utilize poke's such as Grumpig to such success! If this doesn't deserve a Luvdisc, then I dont know what does! <3
 

pasy_g

Banned deucer.
Volcarona is a big big big problemi for your team (which i found great ^^ out of this weakness to Volca :/ ) ! Why don't you replace Gengar with a classic annoying and "fantasyless" Skarfkion? Skarfkion its always a good choice , its usefull and in your team could be intristing for 2 reason in my opinion : reason 1) Because you don't have a dangerous physical attacker, and reason 2) because you could exploit a double fight sweeping (Kion+Coba) ... Think about it , I thought to replace Gengar for exclusion because the other are too usefful for the Team strategy and because Grumping which was the other nominated to replace is simply to cool ;)
Congrat again, I hope I could be kinda useful ^^
as there are so many threats in bw you cant counter every single mon you cant easily build in 2 or more pokemon against everything. The only suggestion that would help is to play roar on tran since the team is really special based an volcarona isnt hurt after some Dances. So i Think Roar > WoW and some special defense investment would be great here, since it helps you to sponge dmeteors and outrages better.
 

AfroThunderRule

*yawn* ez
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
Hmm I'm not as good as anyone here but I was wondering if you only use Grumpig to combat sun teams then why not try out a Specially Defensive Dragonite on your team? It does the job just as good imo and comes with recovery. You can have a move set like Thunder Wave, Roost, maybe two of Dragon Claw, Dragon Tail, Fire Punch (maybe to lure in Scizor since if they see Thunder Wave and a bulkier Dragonite they might get caught out guard) or Stone Edge (for the Volc weakness).

Though if you go with that then you'll have a very large ice weakness.... idk, sorry if I'm not all that helpful.
 

gec

pharos
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Thanks for all the rates and feedback everyone!

So I've been using Snorlax -> Grumpig a few games now, and the team has been working about the same. The only thing about Snorlax is the lack of reliable recovery (Grumpig has the same problem unfortunately) but it's been working well I suppose.

Another suggestion I tried was a Starmie -> Gengar and I quite like it. Starmie after a couple of calm mind boosts is pretty grand, not to mention it gives me another mon to switch into choiced Fighting-type attacks. Also, it completes my FWG core nicely, which is always a massive plus. Having another status absorber can't go wrong now can it?

The final thing I have tested so far is Swords Dance + Acrobatics Gliscor, which I like a lot now. The only thing is since I rely on Gliscor to check so many threats, it really needs the Toxic Orb to increase longevity, but Acrobatics itself is a much better move than Facade imo.

Either way though, thanks for the feedback everyone - it's much appreciated!
 
Why not just use a SubHydreigon over Grumpig? You still beat Grass and Fire types fairly comfortably (even more so if you go with Starmie>Gengar), and its just a much better offensive pokemon. As an added bonus you get a nice VoltTurn check. Makes you weaker to Fighting types of course but the team covers them pretty well.
 
the fu** is this team ._. ....well its pretty damn original tbh lol i still wonder how it got you to #8 lol...good job..btw as the others mentioned...get a counter for volcarona xD
 
Hey there. Great and original team you got here. I have an idea that could help with the volcarona weakness. I think you can change gliscors facade for rock slide or stone edge. It can really hurt the thing. Though gliscor would be sort of double edged. The moves would make a heavy impact on any volcarona. That is pretty much my solution for the volcarona weakness. I don't know if this is the solution you were looking for, but I hope you consider it.
 
I would think Stone Edge > Facade on Gliscor. Also, female. You really can't afford infatuation effects on Gliscor.
 

Stallion

Tree Young
is a Tiering Contributoris a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnusis a Three-Time Past WCoP Champion
A big <3disc for one of my big <3's for using Grumpig and a Cobalion in a competitive team, nicely done! I do think that Snorlax suggestion, while less badass, is better to stop Volcarona though!
 

gec

pharos
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Why not just use a SubHydreigon over Grumpig? You still beat Grass and Fire types fairly comfortably (even more so if you go with Starmie>Gengar), and its just a much better offensive pokemon. As an added bonus you get a nice VoltTurn check. Makes you weaker to Fighting types of course but the team covers them pretty well.
This suggestion in particular does interest me quite a bit actually. It might be a bit hard to fit into the team but regardless, I shall try it.

Also Stallion thank you very much :D I agree Snorlax isn't as badass as Grumpig, maybe Munchlax is though...
 
Hey There Its A Solid Team You Got I think This Team Will Have Trouble Dealing With Chansey And Blissy And Bulky Steel Types In rain I prefer Adding Psyshock To grumpig and i think you will have trouble dealing with substiute + clam mind jirachi
 

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