Counter that 'mon (a team-building game)[Team 2 VOTING]

[CrackinSkulls]

Counter That OU 'mon - TeamBuilder

Hey guys, so i recently got into playing ubers and i noticed on their meta-game discussion page they have a "Counter that Uber mon" and i thought it might be fun to have one of our own. First off i would like to thank Furai because i have basically stolen his OP.

This is very similar to the CCAT but rather than trying to create a successful team in general we are creating two teams that will pay against each other. The two teams are made by you by submitted sets that are geared both towards countering the other team and providing solid support/teammates to the rest of its own team.

So how it is going to work is that we will have 2 teams (obviously) and we start off by suggesting sets for team 1's first pokemon. We vote on a suggested set and then start suggesting sets for team 2's first pokemon that will be able to counter team one. The exact order will be {1, 2, 2, 1, 1, 2, 2, 1, 1, 2, 2, 1}. Make sure the suggested sets include all details and refrain from using slashes as it makes countering it much more difficult. An example of a perfect looking set would be

Nidoking (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Sheer Force
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Earth Power
- Flamethrower

The only changes i will accept are minor EV changes in sets as we all make mistakes. At the very end, once all 12 Pokemon have been chosen, the two users who have the most sets chosen to be on the team will battle each other using the two teams that are created. You may post as many sets as you like as quickly as you like as long as they are reasonable, which i will be the judge of. Unreasonable sets will not be included in the voting. Please provide a brief description as to why we should use the suggested pokemon or it will not be included.


You will have 3 days (72 Hours) to post your sets and 1 day (24 hours) to vote. Voting will be manual; post your vote in bold when the voting opens. You may not vote for your own sets so if you want to just don't vote at all. I will post; when the voting has opened, closed, when the suggestion time is over and the voting result have closed.

Teams so far

Team 1

[FastFlygon's Terrakion]
------------------------------------------------

Team 2

I Am's Scizor

------------------------------------------------

Just a tip, for the first pokemon try to choose something that can devastate the meta-game; something that you can base a team around and work from there. Good luck everyone and lets do this!

If you are unsure of any details just PM me and i will improve the OP as i am not sure that i have done a great job.

 

[CrackinSkulls]

Counter that 'mon (a team-building game)

I am going to start this off by suggesting Nidoking

Nidoking (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Sheer Force
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Earth Power
- Flamethrower

Nidoking's raw power can shake up the meta-game and his coverage is nothing short of awesome. Weather teams must cower in fear because he carries a super effective move on all of them and weather teams make up half of the metagame as is. Nidoking is very hard to counter and with proper team support he will be nigh on unstoppable

 

[blunder]

this kinda just looks like the CCAT. So from what I'm understanding, the goal is for both teams to counterteam each other? Not trying to be mean but what's the fun in that? If that's not how it is supposed to be and I simply misread it, please feel free to correct me as this does seem kind of interesting. Anyway, here is my submission? And can I do two?

Kyurem @ Life Orb
Trait: Pressure
Evs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spd
Nature: Timid
- Ice Beam
- Draco Meteor
- Focus Blast
- Outrage

Kyurem is an extremely underrated mon in OU. It's amazing stat distribution along with a decent movepool make it quite the threat. It naturally outspeeds Nidoking and Ohkos with Ice Beam and also has the bulk to take an Earth Power rather easily.

Second suggestion

Latias (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVS: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spd
Nature: Timid
-Calm Mind
- Dragon Pulse
- Hidden Power Fire
- Recover

Latias can easily deal with Nidoking even if it has Ice Beam due to its marvelous speical defense. Backed by a calm mind boost, it can easily stall out Ice Beam and Recover off damage and easily get to +6 and proceed to do some damage

Hope you guys liked my ideas

 

[ginganinja]

So from what I'm understanding, the goal is for both teams to counterteam each other? Not trying to be mean but what's the fun in that?

The basic idea is that both teams possess significant advantages against the other team to which the two users selected to battle then exploit. Ironically, I guess the idea is that both teams "balance" each other out but w/e

 

[CrackinSkulls]

The basic idea is that both teams possess significant advantages against the other team to which the two users selected to battle then exploit. Ironically, I guess the idea is that both teams "balance" each other out but w/e

Thanks Ginganinga that is exactly what i was trying to achieve. PM me for some suggestions to make the OP a little easier to understand. thanks

 

[Pippy]

Here's my suggestion:

Metagross @ Life Orb
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 52 HP / 252 Atk / 204 Spe
Nature: Jolly
-Agility
-Meteor Mash
-Earthquake
-ThunderPunch

Agilitigross is a devistating late game sweeper. He can easily get off an Agility thanks to his great bulk and proceed to pound the opponent with powerful attacks thanks to his huge attack stat. He also has the potential to boost his attack with Meteor Mash, making him even more threatening. The other moves are Earthquake to hit steels and fire types who resist steel and ThunderPunch to hit bulky waters, particularly Gyarados.

So, there you have it. I might make another suggestion later.

 

[666lumberjack]

This sort of challenge has a lot of strategy to it, because really the "best" way to do this is to try to pick something that will force a certain response from the opponent and then pick other things that can exploit that. Picking a random underrated mon is cool and all but if it's going to take a fair bit of support, we've already decided on the team concept from the first mon, which gives team 2 an easy time building something to put us in a tough position.
With that in mind, I'd like to suggest Protect + Swords Dance Rock Gem Terrakion. With Protect to scout revenge killing attempts and a Rock Gem to power past most of Terrakion's usual checks, we force team 2 into a corner where there are only a few specific defensive Pokemon that can hope to take us on. Provided we teambuild well, this should be very easy to exploit. I suppose a set like SubSD could also work, but at that point the opposing team can just pick Scizor and have a pretty good shot at beating us. Scizor is a lot more difficult to exploit than the few defensive Pokemon that check SD Rock Gem Terrakion, so I feel that Portect is the better choice.

Terrakion @ Rock Gem
Jolly Nature | Justified
4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Protect
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat
- Swords Dance

 

[CrackinSkulls]

This thread has gone a little quites so i am going to pick things up again by suggesting Cobalion.

Cobalion @ Life Orb
Trait: Justified
EVs: 168 Atk / 88 SAtk / 252 Spd
Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Stone Edge


Cobalion is very difficult to counter as he is incredibly bulky and has that ever useful steel typing. Swords Dance turns his modest attack into a fearsome force when combined with Close Combat. Common Terrakion counters such as Gliscor are 1HKO'd with Hidden Power. Not much can switch in safely due to his formidable coverage meaning that most people will have to sack a 'mon for the slightest hope of countering him. His common counters such as Infernape can speed tie at best with him and with his base 129 defense Mach Punch is a joke barely 3HKOing. Cobalion is only hard countered by bulky waters like Jellicent or Vaporeon which are hardly good members to base/ start a team on.

 

[MyNameIsSPS]

Gyarados (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Thunder Wave
- Dragon Tail

To lazy to get a picture, a really underrated wall.

 

[CrackinSkulls]

The above post will not be included in the voting as it lacks detail, description and strategically a really bad choice. Try posting it in the Underrated pokemon thread in the OU forum.

 

[CrackinSkulls]

The suggestions for Team 1's first member is now closed. The voting is now open. The Voting candidates are :

CrackinSkulls' Nidoking

ThunderBlunder's Kyurem

Pippy's Metagross

FastFlygon's Terrakion
and
CrackinSkulls' Cobalion


Voting will be closed in 24 hours. To vote post your vote in bold. You may not vote for yourself and any such vote will not be counted. Anyway good luck and let the votes begin.

 

[CrackinSkulls]

Pippy's Metagross

 

[HolyAvatar]

I vote for FastFlygon's Terrakion
I love the protect against Scizor, you switch against bullet punch and stay in against u-turn. Unless he's not banded and then loses a lot of power.

You should add that the same pokemon cannot be picked by both teams as a rule.

I expect the enemy team's choice to be the infamous Scizor/Wash nonetheless. But then they may lose gliscor... Very interesting thread. Love it.

 

[Joeyboy]

FastFlygon's Terrakion no doubt about it. He seems to have followed the uber version of this and gets how to play ;) I'm with him.

 

[tehy]

I vote for FastFlygon's Terrakion
I love the protect against Scizor, you switch against bullet punch and stay in against u-turn. Unless he's not banded and then loses a lot of power.

You should add that the same pokemon cannot be picked by both teams as a rule.

I expect the enemy team's choice to be the infamous Scizor/Wash nonetheless. But then they may lose gliscor... Very interesting thread. Love it.

Firstly, LO sdzor does exist, and that probably still Ko's terrakion. And the problem with protect>sub/rock polish is that a scarfer can still switch in and screw you over, a scarfer like latios or landorus can switch in on 3/4ths of your moveset, whereas rock polish will add to your sweep and sub eases prediction. Also, if you're forced out, it's not necessarily guaranteed that you'll be able to get back in later and set up again, especially if he knows your set.

 

[Stratos]

not letting each team use the same mons is a silly notion; don't make that rule change.

FastFlygon's Terrakion gets my vote

 

[dragonuser]

FastFlygon's Terrakion

That Terrakion set seems to be a perfect pokemon for this game. It helps to control the tide of battles and force reactions from our opponent + trying to counter SD Terrakion is always interesting.

 

[Pippy]

FastFlygon's Terrakion easily gets my vote. Easy set up on a mon that's used on like 30% of teams? Heck yea!

 

[CrackinSkulls]

The voting for Team 1's first member is now closed. The voting results were:

CrackinSkulls' Nidoking- 0

ThunderBlunder's Kyurem- 0

Pippy's Metagross- 1

FastFlygon's Terrakion- 5
and
CrackinSkulls' Cobalion- 0


The polls have resulted in an outstanding winner. Congratulations to FastFlygon's Terrakion!! The suggestions for team 2's first member will now be open. It will close in 72 hours.

 

[CrackinSkulls]

I am going to start this off by suggesting Double Dance Gliscor.

Gliscor @ Flying Gem
Trait: Sand Veil
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Agility
- Acrobatics
- Earthquake
- Swords Dance

Double Dance Gliscor can easily set up on Terrakion thanks to its amazing bulk and it can use protect against it. Gliscor is also very difficult to counter as its common offensive counters such as Starmie are outsped and OHKO'd with +2 speed and Flying Gem in tact. It also makes sandstorm and impossible weather to run thanks to Sand Veil, easily one of the most annoying abilities. Swords Dance can boost his attack sky high and make him a formidable sweeper. Double Dance Gliscor is very difficult to counter as it is very bulky and can tank Ice Shards etc from Mamoswine and the likes.

 

[HolyAvatar]

I suggest Choice Specs Latios

Latios @ Choice Specs
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 HP / 252 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
- Draco Meteor
- Surf
- HP Fire
- Psyshock

Latios outspeeds and OHKOes Terrakion with both Draco Meteor and Psyshock. LO variant does too, we may need to discuss it. Surf hits a lot of the metagame for neutral damage and OHKOes Gliscor. It also abuses rain and deters the enemy team from using it. HP fire roasts steal types, namely Scizor and Ferrothorn.
Psyshock lets it damage special walls.
Note that standard LO Starmie doesn't OHKO and take 74.71 - 88.5% from -2 Draco Meteor, easily KOing after SR and some LO damage.

Picking Latios will severely reduce the enemy's options. Choice Scarf is also an option and I'd agree if you don't want to pick him so early.

 

[I Am]

Scizor @ Life Orb
Trait: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Bullet Punch
- Swords Dance
- Superpower
- Bug Bite

Offensive LO Scizor acts as a catch all against Team 1s Terrakion, and also limits their ability to pick other team members, as this Scizor is extremely powerful after an SD. Terrakion's Protect shenanigans won't really be all that useful, as Scizor can easily set up a swords dance, causing for some interesting mind games. However, the Scizor user will always have the upper hand, as bullet punch easily KOs without any setup, meaning we can always stop an hope of a Terrakion sweep with bullet punch spam, while also having the opportunity to set up ourselves should they decide to protect. It will force their team building to narrow their options as well, which can help us better predict the type of team they will be making (EX: Gyarados is one of the few offensive Pokemon that can deal with this Scizor well. Zapdos is another.) As such, we can better shape our team to be an offensive counter to the other, as we have knowledge of the few viable pokes they can pick.

 

[Joeyboy]

Gengar (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast
- Substitute
- Disable

The unfortunate thing about Terrakion is that so little can actually switch into it, even pokemon like Slowbro and Gliscor are harassed by Rock Gem boosted Stone Edges. So I decided to nominate Sub Disable Gengar, who if you can lure a Close Combat can switch in with immunity and begin to dismantle the opposing team. This set, once in, will always beat team 1's Terrakion as it can sub on the Stone Edge, Disable, and is then free to do whatever it wants. Also, Gengar's great natural speed can be used to check many offensive threats; this I think is quite key as Choiced threats(such as Choice Scarf) tend to get hard countered in games like these.

Also in the Teams so Far section, you should put the set of each pokemon, so it'll be easier to keep track of.

 

[WaterBomb]

I think now would be a good time to bring in my favorite pokemon of all time, and a previous suggestion, as Team 2's response to Terrakion...

Nidoking @ Life Orb
Timid Nature
Sheer Force
4 HP/252 SpA/252 Spe
~Thunderbolt
~Ice Beam
~Earth Power
~Flamethrower/Sludge Wave
-Similar to CrackinSkulls' set, but I opted for Timid over Modest since Nidoboss needs all the speed he can get. Flamethrower is probably more suited for OU in the last slot due to the abundance of Scizor and Ferrothorn, but I've found Sludge Wave to be very useful for neutral usage as it is Nidoking's most powerful attack. Nidoking resists both of Terrakion's attacks, and even though it is outsped it can handle even a +2 CC and OHKO with STAB Earth Power in return. Not sure if it can switch into a +2 CC though and still have enough HP to survive another, but it certainly can come in as a revenge killer, or a lead opposite Terrakion.

 

[Unitas]

Here is my idea......

Wobbafett@Leftovers
Bold
Shadow Tag
252HP/252Def/4SpD
-Encore
-Mirror Coat
-Counter
-Safeguard/Tickle

The damage calc says with the rock gem, Stone Edge does 45- 53% to this Wobbafett set. Without the rock gem it does 30 - 36% damage. Which means that it is a 3HKO. Now Wobbafett can mess with Terrakion a lot. It can Encore his Swords Dance or just flat out steam roll him with counter. You can use Tickle over safeguard, its really your preference. Wobbafett even has a chance to survive a +2 Rock gem boosted Stone Edge with 2% of its health left.