Speedrunning Pokemon X + Y

[Articanus]

Hello smogon community! I am articanus and I used to be a very avid gen IV battler during the four year period where it was most popular here. On smogon I was most popular for my warstories above all else, but I also participated in tournaments and was a badged tutor during the original creation of the tutoring sessions. During gen V I took a bit of hiatus due to schooling / general dislike of the generation in general, but I feel like I am back with gen VI up and coming. Now with my short list of credentials out of the way, let's discuss the main topic: Speedrunning Pokemon X+Y.

Speedrunning has become an activity that only over the last year has become much more mainstream, and with a new game comes a new community of people that want to run it. Pokemon speedruns are particularly interesting due to the luck involved, as well as the main strategy of the game which is considered routing.

Routing is a relatively simple concept; it is the order in which you complete the game. Speedrunning pokemon is all about finding the best route and then executing it for the shortest amount of time possible by the time you beat the elite four(though in this game maybe AZ, idk). You can choose to do it in multiple segments, but those aren't as popular as single segment runs where, ideally, you would act like you just started a brand new game and try to beat it in the shortest amount of time.

Well... that's the general idea. If you want to see an example of a great pokemon speedrunner, you can check out werster at http://www.twitch.tv/werster . He holds the majority of pokemon speedrun records, and I guess he holds the current X+Y one at 5.5 hours at this moment.

I myself speed pokemon blue, you can search me on twitch and find it easily if you're interested, but Werster holds the WR on that and mine is much slower(2:04 compared to 1:53).

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One thing I am trying to decide on is what starter would be best to run the game with. The grass starter has the quickest early game vs the bug gym(grab an early x-accuracy at the first pokecenter so you don't miss with rollout - Surskuit is set up fodder) and the fire one has a decent time with a resistance to bug and being super effective overall(but is slower than chespin due to surskuit using water sport a lot). Finally we have the water starter, Froakie, who has an unusually hard time early game(you're forced to fight a pikachu at your level, and he can easily kill you). In addition, he also has a rough time against the bug gym with no SE damage and weak defenses... but he has the fastest fight vs the professor afterwards(just dies to Bulbasaur immediately), and has the more usefullness to get you going(team flare sucks until you have Lapras/ Lucario). I also tend to find myself heavily outleveled when I skip every trainer and every wild encounter, so I would probably have to route a way to get more experience.

Also, X vs Y is weird, but I think Y is better because just being able to get ahold of Drought + Mega Charizard's damage is too gay at like the 4th gym. So basically I just have to route a way to get through till I have mega Lucario and mega Charizard Y, then us the right pokemon in the right situation.

Thoughts? Questions? Suggestions? I'm open for anything really.

 

[Magicxgame]

Since speedruns are the only Pokemon challenge I do (used to hold the record for Pokemon Gold at 4:15 on SDA), here's some speedtheorymon:

Are you planning to use Mega Lucario AND Mega Charizard Y? Speedrunning with one Poke's far more efficient. I actually think Mega zard's too slow since you'll have to go through the Mega Evolution animation even with animations off, THEN see the Drought animation every single time you bring it in. Plus, it starts only at level 10. Best strat seems it's like the good old "use the starter" strat. Really wouldn't use Froakie; worst early game + 3 gyms in a row that hate him (4-6) outweighs his early Water Pulse + somewhat early Surf. Fennekin has a good time early on due to all of the Bug-types (though Water Sport Surskit is annoying) and has the best Gym matchups overall, but it struggles with Gym 2 and its STAB attacks blow until you get to Delphox. I really wouldn't pick Chespin, unfortunately; Rollout is nice, but Grass is a shitty attacking type in-game, and he's slow.
I'd just:

• Go with Fennekin, breeze through early game.
  
• Catch Pidgey/Fletchling on Route 2 for Fly (need to backtrack at one point IIRC).
  
• Buy X-Items in Lumioise? May be too expensive for the time, though.
  
• In Ambrette Town, pick up Old Rod and TM94 Rock Smash. Fish up Luvdisc with Old Rod, trade for L20 Steelix w/Gyro Ball in Cyllage City. Get the Bike. Teach Rock Smash, Rock Smash/Gyro Ball way through Rock Gym, which would destroy Braixen. I'm not sure if this is the most efficient method, but Luvdisc is a 100% encounter and Braixen would get owned here in a RTA (single segment).
  
• Have Braixen beat Korrina with Psybeam (use X-Special?), throw Mega Lucario fight by using normal Lucario since Mega Evo animation takes forever and losing here isn't a Game Over.
  
• Get L30 Lapras for Surf.
  
• Blitz through Route 12 to Courmarine City, grab Lucky Egg in hotel, level up like weed in Grass Gym, rain destruction for rest of the game w/(hopefully?) overleveled Braixen, which will start to pick up moves like Flamethrower and Psychic naturally. Would definitely want X-Items for Elite Four. If playing X, Xerneas may

RTA timing typically ends at "The End", so end time would be after AZ.

I would test this, but you can't start a New Game unless you delete your current file in XY. :\

 

[IOS]

Routers have pretty much exclusively used Lucario after getting him:

http://www.twitch.tv/extratricky/profile/pastBroadcasts
http://www.twitch.tv/moneyhypemike/profile/pastBroadcasts

 

[Articanus]

That's what I was starting to think yeah hahaha.

 

[Shiruba]

^ for the thing about drought animation... can you not just turn the animations off? the text line'd be a bother, though, for sure, and would probably set you back considerably over time.

aside from that, though, do you do live, or just in-game timing? not particularly important, just curious.

 

[DHR-107]

I can see Route 13 being make or break in an XY speed run... That place is an utter nightmare when it comes to navigating cleanly.

I haven't come across too many trainers which either spin or are hard to avoid. Those can make differences too.

Shiruba they always go via the ingame clock, never an external timer (Unless the timer is perfectly synched with the game start).

Articanus we have a speed run thread for the other games located here: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/pokémon-speed-run.3470560/ Mekkah and Taylor are the main speed runners for Blue on Smogon, though most of the OI regulars have also had pops at the challenge. We even ran a first segment to Lt Surge for a round of the the XY Competition. People posted some WR equalling (I think the best was ahead of the record) times which was totally mind blowing.

 

[IloveslakingIGN]

First runthrough i made was about 20 hours because it was blind, i finished the second in something like 17:23. Not impressive, but still feel like it was good for me, I would be interested in seeing a speedrun.

 

[Ghostwheel]

I ran through the game with froakie today, and I think that could be the way to go. I've made a post on SDA with a preliminary route I'll try to refine it later in the week, and i'll have a better time estimate after I do. I only have a few fights to iron out SS, but his stats and varied movepool carry him to the end. You can fling your fossil repeatedly, get an early surf, and have amazing tech in acrobatics, grass knot, ice beam, and rock tomb. After you make it through rival 3, there isn't anything to worry about.

Biggest problems:
-The first double battle in which you have to rely on terrible partner AI and dicey opponent AI. Getting double targeted is no fun, especially when one of the aggressors is pikachu. Fighting one extra trainer might fix this, however.
-The rock gym. Yeah, this was coming, but froakie still does it best out of the 3 starters. The tyrunt is the biggest chore; in order to take it down, you have to hope for a water pulse confusion or a crit. You don't have time to set up on Amaura either, so the only think more consistent would be to revive yourself once.
-The rival fight in the tower. The cards are stacked against you here if you don't have fling, because it is a herculean effort to time the kill on meowstic right so light screen isn't up, and you're at +4 sp. atk on over 3/4 health. Otherwise, Quilladin eats you for breakfast.

 

[Warimano]

Would catching a pidgey or the like in first route and hope for something good through wondertrade be a viable idea? The trade takes a long time but the boosted xp could really help and if you use the exp share you can easily get a pkm that is overleveled wich could help a lot.

 

[goomy pls]

Is there any good way to record the 3DS screen? Handhelds are always so annoying to capture at a decent quality.

 

[Codraroll]

Would catching a pidgey or the like in first route and hope for something good through wondertrade be a viable idea? The trade takes a long time but the boosted xp could really help and if you use the exp share you can easily get a pkm that is overleveled wich could help a lot.

Thing is, you won't be the first to try this. Probably not the millionth-and-first either. Chances are you'll just end up with more Pidgey and Weedle.

Though, as you say, the boosted Exp. could help it a lot either way. But speedrunning is usually done without interacting with other games, so it wouldn't count in a speedrun challenge.

 

[Onicon]

If every second count people probably want to practice snaking with the skates. Until you get the bike this is the fastest method of moving around. It may save you one minute or two.

You probably have realized that when you go into the snaking animation when at maximum speed, you do not get slower. Unfortunately it is a bit tricky to pull of as you need to withdraw the Circle Pad half-way. Take the pad off too much will drastically reduce your speed.

Do you think it is worth the hassle or is it too risky without tool assistance?

 

[goomy pls]

If every second count people probably want to practice snaking with the skates. Until you get the bike this is the fastest method of moving around. It may save you one minute or two.

You probably have realized that when you go into the snaking animation when at maximum speed, you do not get slower. Unfortunately it is a bit tricky to pull of as you need to withdraw the Circle Pad half-way. Take the pad off too much will drastically reduce your speed.

Do you think it is worth the hassle or is it too risky without tool assistance?

I've tested movement speeds before:
bike 14.5 steps/sec
sk8s max boost 12.5 steps/sec
sk8s no boost 9.5 steps/sec
run 7.2 steps/sec
walk 4.15 steps/sec

Doing the boost with skates is definitely worth it even if you're not able to pull it off 100% of the time.

 

[DDRMaster]

I watched werster's blind speedrun of Y, and I remember that his Chespin got OHKO'd by Amaura's Takedown. I can't remember if his had horrid Defense, but I have a feeling you're gonna need to get Steelix if you don't go with Froakie. Squirtle might help, but werster still had a lot of problems. I'm thinking this might be best:

• Pick Fennekin, beat the first gym easily
• Pick up Rock Smash and Old Road in Ambrette Town
• Pick up Shadow Claw in Glittering Cave (for Lucario)
• Pick up the Heart Scales on Route 8 and catch a Luvdisc
• Get the bike, trade the Luvdisc for Steelix, teach Steelix Rock Smash, destroy the second gym
• Either beat Korrina in Geosenge with Braixen or catch a Golette, as her Lucario can't touch it
• Beat the third gym with Braixen
• Get Lucario (from everything I've seen, you have to at least Mega Evolve or Korrina challenges you again, winning should be faster than losing)
• Teach Lucario Shadow Claw, destroy the rest of the game with Lucario (and maybe Delphox but the EXP Share would likely take too much time)
• In Dendemille Town, you can reteach Lucario Aura Sphere/Close Combat, Dragon Pulse, and Metal Claw

Mega Lucario can definitely solo the game and I think you'd only run into problems with Valerie. Adaptibility Metal Claw is extremely useful for killing Fairies if they come up after her. I'm not sure the Mega Evolution animation would be worth it, but Lucario should still be able to solo (and you can always Mega only when you really need to).

 

[GameMaster0000]

Even select Fennekin it is still a bit hard on Viola.

Her Surskit have water sport and bubble. If water sport still up when Vivillon appear you will be torn by her Infestion.

Still need leveling a bit before a fight her.

Edit : Well, I finished game in 20 hours, it's in game time count not count time that SR for good Yveltal.

To be noted first I didn't truly speed run. I fight most trainer that I see for leveling. But try to not go place that not need to past like Terminal Cave.

I used Delphox, Lucario, Blastoise, Roserade

- Delphox - She is best starter for speed run she can wreck everything and bulk enough.
- Lucario - Even Mega, He didn't do dmg as I think most time he miss OHKO if not use CC and CC not have much PP to use and not bulk like Delphox mostly he get large Dmg on counter attack. Even that, he still need foe speed run, He still mostly nuke every think that not resist fighting.
- Blastoise - Fail, he not good on rock gym, that some of them get natural dmg on water. Didn't use him again until Elite 4 Fire and Dragon. I will use Lapras on another run
- Roserade - I use guy to wreck rock gym instead. But on late game If he miss OHKO is same situation as Lucario, But we need him to kill Fairy Gym. I will try next time with Venus saur, but he lag good glass move until get Grass Pledge while Roselia has Giga Drain

Even I use EXP. Share LV at end is about 65 even that It's a bit hard to fight elite 4

 

[Lord Ghetsis]

IDK if any of you noticed, but X and Y are bloody long btwn 1st and 2nd gym.

 

[Cheatingtaco]

IDK if any of you noticed, but X and Y are bloody long btwn 1st and 2nd gym.

I noticed that too. After the 2nd gym it only takes ~10 hours w/o speedrunning. I believe that the most efficient speedrun would consist of the pokemon that could get through that gap best.

 

[Rokinlobster]

Has anyone tried using the quacklin(farfetched) you get in the second town by trading? The boosted exp is really helpful, and he has good ivs. I have not even beaten the game yet, but i completely ditched my starter after getting this farfetched and have been breazing through the game with him

 

[Cheatingtaco]

Has anyone tried using the quacklin(farfetched) you get in the second town by trading? The boosted exp is really helpful, and he has good ivs. I have not even beaten the game yet, but i completely ditched my starter after getting this farfetched and have been breazing through the game with him

Maybe because he sucks?

 

[Careful Houndoom]

Maybe because he sucks?

People on Twitch doing Speedruns seem to be using him and doing pretty well. They have their own catch Bunnelby timer :/.

 

[Cheatingtaco]

People on Twitch doing Speedruns seem to be using him and doing pretty well. They have their own catch Bunnelby timer :/.

Maybe using him as a backup poke, sure. But instead of a starter? Definitely not.

 

[Careful Houndoom]

Maybe using him as a backup poke, sure. But instead of a starter? Definitely not.

MoneyHypeMike (current record holder) used him exclusively once he got him at 13:25 until he got Hawlucha around 54:32.

Used both for the second gym.

Then switched to just Hawlucha.

 

[Pika25]

I got sub 8:30 on Y (with animations). My Chespin had 31 IVs in Attack and Defense with a +Attack nature (I saw 15 Attack and 13 Defense at level 6) and went mono Chespin/Quilladin until getting Lucario and Lapras after Korrina. Chesnaught didn't see anymore action afterward, until Siebold's Barbaracle. Fletchling/Fletchinder was my flyer.