Tyrantrum has become a t hr eat now that serebii confirmed rock head as its hidden ability . A dd set with jolly head smash eq and dragon claw I think is the way to go for it in ou. Spamming non recoil stab head smash is gona ve great .vtoo ad its weak to 3 priority moves but mane he can take one with its good natural physical bulk (95/119).
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Pokémon Tyrantrum
- Thread starter JSND
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In early DPPT there was a moment where normal Aggron almost made into OU just because he had CB Head Smash, which was capable of 2HKO on every single targets except like Hippowdon (although Aqua Tail hurted even Hippo). And we look into something with even higher base attack. To put it into perspective, Head Smash had the SAME base power as... water spout. Now imagine physical version of Specs Kyogre, with as good offensive STAB to work with and physical walls being weaker then special ones in Pokemon. And remember, there's nothing which matches the bulk of Blissey/Chansey when it goes to physical walling, so something ends up in the world of pain. Remember, this thing has BETTER typing and POWER behind their Head Smash then old Aggron. To put it into perspective... some damage calcs. All calcs are with Adamant Choice Band:
120 HP Conkeldurr (the bulkiest common Conkeldurr version)
52.49%-61.94%
Clean 2HKO. No chance to survive second hit.
Max HP/Max Def Positive Nature MegaScizor (base physical 70/140, which is great)
63.66%-75.00%
This is the bulkiest possible variant of MegaScizor, which I assure you won't run this many EVs anyway. Let's go with Max HP.
83.72%-98.55%
74.36% for OHKO with SR up. MegaScizor is considered one of the best checks to CB Tyranitar. Well, he certainly can't do the same in case of Tyrantum.
Maybe Gliscor ? Physically defensive version:
67.33%-79.55%
SubToxic
79.26%-93.18%
Ok, let's go with Standard Physical Wall Skarmory.
66.97%-78.90%
Good luck, no chance in hell to take on Head Smash.
Ok, maybe let's go with Tangrowth. Really, really physically bulky Pokemon. Oh well, let's see how he works. Of course standard OU Physical Wall Tangrowth.
58.81%-69.23%
Well no luck here as well.
Well, we still have Cresselia, right ? Well... yeah, we do. Max HP/Max Def version.
55.08%-65.01%
Or not. No chance for her as well, especially with SR up. Without it massive 1% chance to survive two hits counting Leftovers. Well, not the best odds.
Oh well, maybe let's try some resists. Ferrothorn must handle him like a boss ! Ok, let's see. I assume Standard OU set.
37.50%-44.32%
While you indeed survive two hits, those are pretty heavy. If Ferrothorn takes at least 20% of his HP earlier, he goes in two hits. Or you may just use Fire Fang:
87.50%-103.41%
Ok, maybe it's comeback time for Swampert ! Well... who knows. Max HP/Max Def Swampert.
36.91%-43.39%
Yeah, you survive two hits, but those are pretty heavy. The same situation as in case of Ferrothorn - you better don't take any damage before switching in or you'll be in a world of pain. BTW you don't have reliable recovery, so for your own good you better get good Wish support or run RestTalk. So technically you have ONE 100% safe switch. Although at 100% I admit that he counter everything Tyrantum can throw on him.
Well, in case of offense, we also need something that can switch on this guy. Terrakion for example:
64.51%-75.93%
Well yeah. I hardly call this reliable switch if you ask me. Yeah, you survive hit, but you only have one shot to do. And in case of Earthquake...
115.43%-135.80%
Ouch... Yeah, offensive teams may need something different. Like for example MegaMawile. Sounds good, right ? BTW this is Max HP/Max Def Positive Nature version.
38.82%-45.72%
Yeah, this is most physically bulky version. Let's go with more standard Max HP one.
51.97%-61.18%
Nope. No Leftovers to save your butt here, so 2 clean hits. Well, MegaMawile may end up unlucky though and switch on Earthquake...
92.76%-109.87%
While Aegislash (Shield Form) can indeed handle Head Smash (37,09%-43,68%), it doesn't stand a chance against Earthquake (65,93%-78,02%) though. Ok, there is always Eviolite Doublade.
24.93%-29.36%
Impressive. He takes this hit really damn well. Although lack of recovery hurts. Of course this is Max HP/Max Def version with Eviolite. Yay, we have a counter. Yeah... but Earthquake is not something you take with huge comfort.
44.32%-52.63%
17,03% for 2HKO. Well, in the end you may go in two hits. So it's hardly a counter. Great check though.
While physical Hippowdon is indeed 100% counter, in case of Specially Defensive I wouldn't be so sure. Although Slack Off helps. It still hurts though.
39.52%-46.67%
This is with Careful nature. For a resisted hit it hurts like hell. Well, Dragon Claw hurts him pretty hard though.
42.38%-50.00%
A little bit of passive damage (for example from Gengar which this version of Hippowdon is supposed to check) and he goes in two hits.
And to end this Jirachi. Few calcs:
Physically Defensive Wish + Calm Mind:
Earthquake =
61.39% - 72.77%
Head Smash=
34.65%-40.84%
Max HP Jirachi:
Head Smash =
47.52%-55.94%
Earthquake =
84.65%-100.00%
4 HP Jirachi:
Head Smash =
56.30%-66.28%
Earthquake =
100.29%-118.48%
In other words - If you run stall you better have Swampert, Physically Bulky Conkeldurr or Hippowdon with Positive Defense Nature (or physically bulky) if you look for 100% counter or you're screwed. CB Head Smash rip to shreds everything that doesn't resist his hits and good amount of resists as well. Head Smash + Earthquake is literally everything you need to 2HKO or OHKO pretty much all OU tier with those two moves alone (and I would say 80-90% of those happen with Head Smash anyway). More offensive teams if they'll allow this thing to switch it (with decent bulk and some good resistances he should find those free turns, especially with good support like VoltTurn) they will technically need to sacrifice something on switch, it hits THAT hard. And remember - no recoil, so you can't rely on recoil to wear this down. And taking into account that even bulkiest Rock resist take around 35-45% of their hp on switch, I wouldn't call constant switching the smartest idea to counter this. I would say this thing for slower teams is a nightmare unless they use hardcore rock resist. If they don't - oh well, I feel sorry for them. And they really should hope that Tyrantrum won't get Aqua Tail in future or it may look even more grimm...
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Has anyone been able to confirm whether or not Rock head is currently available through legal means?
I must say, Tyrantrum is looking pretty beastly. I'm glad he does in fact get the Elemental Fangs, as he was pretty much created to make use of them. Strong Jaw is a fantastic ability in conjunction with the Fangs, and his gargantuan Attack and critical Speed tier make him one scary monster if used correctly. Rock Head has now been confirmed, but I'm not sure there is a way to legally get it yet. Even still, despite the power Tyrantrum can dish out with Rock Head Head Smashes, Strong Jaw + the Elemental Fangs gives him incredible coverage that dishes out some incredibly beastly damage. Honestly, both of his abilities are great, but I like Strong Jaw more. That STAB on three different types is really good, and offers some incredible versatility, not to mention access to Dragon Dance (and Tyranitar can pass down all four of those moves). That isn't to say Rock Head Head Smash is bad. It is incredibly hard to deny that sheer power that it provides, I just prefer the type coverage that still does some pretty strong damage coming off of Strong Jaws and that massive Attack.
Serebii says it's his hidden ability, and we have an image:
I'm so glad Tyrantrum has Rock Head confirmed. And while I do love the Strong Jaw sets, Rock Head sets are just about fun.
Its a chance to be a bit more creative since you got your recoilless Head Smash and have to fill the blanks. Obviously Dragon STAB would be nice but Tyrantrum doesn't have good options. Dragon Claw is decent, Dragon Tail is nice since Tyrantrum is pretty slow anyways and has nice Defense. QuakeEdge for something to fall back on. Fangs for coverage I suppose. I'd make a set in standard format but I'm worried I might look stupid. D:
Rock Head is absurd, but I still don't know of any way to obtain one, in the meantime, Strong Jaws is a great ability, giving T-trum pseudo stab. With the ability to pass two parent's egg moves in this generation, We can pass down a fang move or two AND Dragon Dance. I've heard a lot of argument about T-Trum not having good enough typing for OU, but T-tar has an ever bigger list of weakness than this guy and still saw a lot of play. To be fair, Tyrantrum doesn't set up a sand stream, which is one of the biggest reasons he saw play, but still, Tyrantrum comes in to sponge quite a decent chunk of coverage, and coming in on a 4x Resist fire attack can be pretty nice..
What I'm looking at now as far as my moveset is going
Adamant/Jolly Life Orb
Ice Fang/Dragon Claw
Dragon Dance
Earthquake/Crunch/Dragon Claw
Stone Edge
With the Ice Fang, and Strong Jaw, you get psuedo STAB coverage against the same thing you might use Dragon Claw against, but I may want to run both/the other because Dragon isn't worried about being uneffective except against Steel and Fairy, it's still a good attacking type. Went with Stone Edge to avoid recoil damage, and Earthquake is just part of my bread and butter. Tossed up trying to fit Dragon Claw or Crunch on to this build, but I feel Crunch doesn't help enough even with stab, it's just redundant coverage and dead weight on this build.
Also a toss up between Adamant and Jolly, his speed is miserable, but if I run DD, I'm leaning towards Jolly to get him there, well, faster.
What I'm looking at now as far as my moveset is going
Adamant/Jolly Life Orb
Ice Fang/Dragon Claw
Dragon Dance
Earthquake/Crunch/Dragon Claw
Stone Edge
With the Ice Fang, and Strong Jaw, you get psuedo STAB coverage against the same thing you might use Dragon Claw against, but I may want to run both/the other because Dragon isn't worried about being uneffective except against Steel and Fairy, it's still a good attacking type. Went with Stone Edge to avoid recoil damage, and Earthquake is just part of my bread and butter. Tossed up trying to fit Dragon Claw or Crunch on to this build, but I feel Crunch doesn't help enough even with stab, it's just redundant coverage and dead weight on this build.
Also a toss up between Adamant and Jolly, his speed is miserable, but if I run DD, I'm leaning towards Jolly to get him there, well, faster.
A Rock Head set would probably have DD or RP with Dragon Claw, Fire Fang, and Head Smash. No Ice Fang because you don't get the Strong Jaw boost so DC will be a lot better for taking out enemy Dragons. Fire Fang just for coverage. I guess you could run Ice/Thunder Fang even without Strong Jaw since the boltbeam combo is good, but that leaves you open to bulky steel types (Your main weakness). Also,
ಠ_ಠ
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If this thing had Outrage, I would say even Hippowdon would struggle against it with a little bit of residual damage. While he misses it alot, I think even GameFreak realised that switching to this thing would be hard if he had 2 incredible STAB attacks to work around. Although Dragon Dance on Tyrantrum is brilliant thing - the pure power of Head Smash forces switches like mad, especially when they don't know your set, as Choice Band is something you better switch out against if you can't handle hit or KO right back. Finding free turn for this should be an easy pie. BTW some little calcs for DD. Assuming Jolly + Life Orb.
Max HP/Max Def Cresselia
65.01%-76.75%
Standard UU Defensive Swampert
43.39%-51.37% (Yes, there is a chance for 2HKO with SR up, with Spikes secured)
Standard Physically Bulky Gliscor
79.77%-94.30% (2,56% chance to OHKO with SR up)
Etc. etc. Anyway when you realize that you have a chance to KO back (or at worst 2HKO) back even the sturdiest walls with DD set (now imagine what happens to physically squishy targets like Florges or Gengar), late game you should have automatic win button unless they still can outspeed you or use strong priority. Otherwise it's GG. Heck, why not use this set mid-game for example for Hyper Offense, open 1-2 holes in opponents team and allow something like MegaLucario to clean up after so much easier. Both DD and CB Sets are beastly at wallbreaking (except Hippowdon, damn you!). While Strong Jaw is cool ability, no recoil Head Smash brings so much ridiculous power that passing this up is if you ask me is straight up foolish. BTW I forgot to include few more calcs for Adamant Choice Band Head Smash. I'm just looking for things which are capable of countering this.
Standard OU Offensive Pivot Landorus-T (counting Intimidate) Bulkiest OU Standard Set
61.42%-72.44%
Uber Defensive Landorus-T (+Intimidate)
55.24%-65.18%
Max HP/Max Def Landorus-T (+Intimdate)
56.81%-67.02%
Well no luck here as well. BTW Dragon Dance version hits even harder with Life Orb, so no, he has no business here. BTW I don't think Fairies have any business with this guy either. Most physically bulky Fairy Granbull (of course with Intimidate, Max HP/Max Def Positive of course).
52.34%-61.72%
I still think Granbull is really underrated, he can't handle this one. Not even close. Certainly Fairies can't counter this Dragon, no matter how ironically it sounds. Oh yeah, when we look for Rock resists, I forgot to mention Rhyperior. With Talonflame everywhere and maybe Tyrantrum being new monster to handle, Rhyperior may see some light in OU again after all. BTW the bulkiest versions of Rhyperior use 248 HP Evs with zero boosting natures to defense.
35.33%-41.57%
Oh wow, good Rock resist, although I would still be worried if he took some residual damage earlier. But yeah, he is really capable of switching more than once, so offensive teams have something to work with. Well, Earthquake is still a problem though (even with Solid Rock).
47.11%-55.66% (74.10% chance for 2HKO with SR up counting Leftovers, without Lefties clean 2HKO)
Although if you invest at least a bit of EVs in defense, he indeed counters Tyrantrum.
But yeah, there's still Garchomp. Good Rock resist actually. And he outspeeds.
Standard Support Garchomp
39.29%-46.19%
This still hurts, but he outspeeds 100%, so here it is. Good check so far. Although Dragon Dance Jolly + Life Orb gets him cleanly in two hits. After DD + Life Orb DD set has 20% more power than Choice Band, which is big amount.
4 HP Garchomp Offensive Garchomps
55.87%-65.92%
Well this hurts. But Garchomp sounds like a decent switch-in and more defensive version is indeed good check, although... we have one filler slot for Tyrantrum. And this slot is Ice Fang.
91.43%-107.62% (79.49% chance for OHKO with SR up)
Ahhh I also forgot Lucario. x4 Rock Resist after all ;).
45.39%-53.55%
Does this damage calculation remind you of something ? For me it kind of reminds me how hard Kyogre hits Palkia with Water Spout even with x4 resistance. Well, impressive hit taking into account x4 Rock Resist ;).
Well anyway Head Smash/Earthquake/Fire Fang/Ice Fang technically cover everything you want to. I would be surprised if Tyrantrum didn't end up as one of top-tier threats to take into account all of this, especially if Hyper Offense indeed will be dead with Defog buff and Bulky Offense/Balance/Stall start to dominate in Gen 6. Yeah, he is alow, he has some bad weaknesses, but also good resistances from Dragon type, and great tools to work with (CB, Dragon Dance, Rock Polish, No-Recoil Head Smash) which IMO should secure his OU spot easily if not top20. No-Recoil Head Smash is just that good.
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Yeah, I saw that. How do you know whether or not this image is legit? Don't get me wrong, I want rock head asap, but I've yet to hear of/find a single soul, aside from this single image, who actually has this. Can anyone back this up? :o I wasn't even aware tyrunt could be found via friend safari.Serebii says it's his hidden ability, and we have an image:
Battle Maison Multi-Battles. Sometimes parter's Tyrantrum appears with Rock Head.
Ok, So i'm a competitive breeder and i'm looking for consensus on what people WANT from their tyrantrums. So far these are the variables i am looking at when breeding tryrantrums;
This is for strong jaw sets, because we have not yet confirmed how to get rock head. Once rock head comes into play i will have to start breeding a different set.
Jolly Nature (80% seem to want this) And Adamant (20% seem to want)
All 31 IV's barring special attack
Fire/Ice/Thunder/Poison Fangs available (which ones should i prioritize?)
Dragon Dance
I have not passed down dragon dance or poison fang yet.
Just hazarding a guess, bur for strong jaw sets i will want to do something
Dragon Dance
Ice Fang
Fire Fang
Thunder Fang (should one of these be replaced with poison? To early to tell i would assume)
Jolly Nature
5 Perfect IV's
So far i have 4 perfect IV's, jolly natures, and three fangs. Is there anything esle i am missing for the typicle SJ setup? As a breeder i leave the fangs ON the set so that each battler can choose which fangs they want and erase the ones they don't need with EQ or any other move they chose, i understand that the competative battle sets will differ from what i breed, i'm doing this to benefit the battler the most by offering them the most options, because most of tyrantrums other moves are TM's learned.
So from a breeding point of view, i suppose my questions are,
1. are my breeding assumptions mostly correct as far as the moves to pass down? If not, what would be suggeste to be better? Which bite should be replaced with poison if any at all?
2. How often will people want adamant tyrantrums for SJ sets?
2.1 How often will they want adamant for Rock Head sets? (it will be a pain in the ass to chnage a perfect 5 IV breeding setup to adamant from jolly, i'll probably have to do two separate breeding chains x_x)
3. What type of item would a RH tyrantrum use and what nature?
4. what coverage moves would a RH tyrantrum need (so i can pass those down early, once i we figure out how to get the ability)
This is for strong jaw sets, because we have not yet confirmed how to get rock head. Once rock head comes into play i will have to start breeding a different set.
Jolly Nature (80% seem to want this) And Adamant (20% seem to want)
All 31 IV's barring special attack
Fire/Ice/Thunder/Poison Fangs available (which ones should i prioritize?)
Dragon Dance
I have not passed down dragon dance or poison fang yet.
Just hazarding a guess, bur for strong jaw sets i will want to do something
Dragon Dance
Ice Fang
Fire Fang
Thunder Fang (should one of these be replaced with poison? To early to tell i would assume)
Jolly Nature
5 Perfect IV's
So far i have 4 perfect IV's, jolly natures, and three fangs. Is there anything esle i am missing for the typicle SJ setup? As a breeder i leave the fangs ON the set so that each battler can choose which fangs they want and erase the ones they don't need with EQ or any other move they chose, i understand that the competative battle sets will differ from what i breed, i'm doing this to benefit the battler the most by offering them the most options, because most of tyrantrums other moves are TM's learned.
So from a breeding point of view, i suppose my questions are,
1. are my breeding assumptions mostly correct as far as the moves to pass down? If not, what would be suggeste to be better? Which bite should be replaced with poison if any at all?
2. How often will people want adamant tyrantrums for SJ sets?
2.1 How often will they want adamant for Rock Head sets? (it will be a pain in the ass to chnage a perfect 5 IV breeding setup to adamant from jolly, i'll probably have to do two separate breeding chains x_x)
3. What type of item would a RH tyrantrum use and what nature?
4. what coverage moves would a RH tyrantrum need (so i can pass those down early, once i we figure out how to get the ability)
Poison Fang is kinda useless. If you run Stone Edge it would be as strong as a SE Poison Fang even with the 50 % boost from Strong Jaw (unless Stone Edge is NVE and PF SE and stuff like that). Not saying it's totally useless, but Tyrantrum likes many moves and already has 4MSS so PF is/should be the first thing you'd ditch for more coverage...
Fire/Ice/Thunder Fang
Dragon Dance
Those are and should be the only things (that we know of) that would be relevant /needed. Everything else is from TMs (EQ, Stone Edge/Rock Slide, ...) or level up moves (Head Smash, Crunch, ...).
Fire/Ice/Thunder Fang
Dragon Dance
Those are and should be the only things (that we know of) that would be relevant /needed. Everything else is from TMs (EQ, Stone Edge/Rock Slide, ...) or level up moves (Head Smash, Crunch, ...).
No he can't, so no rock head isn't available. He's not in friend safari, you can't use an ability capsule on it, and you can't breed for it.
The battle mansion is full of cheaters that have hidden abilities that we don't have access to yet. While we can speculate and ponder their future impacts, the bottom line is that you can't use it.
While that is true, it's also incredibly likely that the ability will become available to us in the future. I haven't heard a single mention yet of a pokemon in Battle Mansion that had an ability it couldn't get (Like a pokemon with 3 abilities having a fourth in BM, obviously that 4th ability is fake because we've never seen a pokemon with 4 abilities in one form). Another valid observation is that Aurorus gets a hidden ability, and since it is the literal counterpart to Tyrantrum it is safe to assume that Tyrantrum would get one as well. We also have the picture and Serebii.
So it's a bit more than speculation right now, and I feel it is fair game to legitimately discuss sets with Rock Head involved. Just because he isn't available yet as far as we know doesn't mean there is no room for discussion about it.
He's not saying that the Battle Maison is giving out abilities we can never ever get and are straight up cheating to have them
He's saying that the Battle Maison has abilities that we can't get currently. Things like Snow Warning Aurorus, Rock Head Tyrantrum, Adaptability Dragalge, Contrary Superior, etc
And he's right. None of those Pokemon are in any of the Friend Safaris or Hordes and you can't use the Ability Capsule to shift them to it. For the time being, they're unreleased until gamefreak gives them away or they become available in a future game's mechanic.
Which who knows when that could happen.
I'm not going to lie, I'm pretty stoked that the T-Rex 'Mon turned out to be a beast.
Strong Jaw is a cool ability, but Head Smash + Rock Head? lol.
Like others, I think that Head Smash, Dragon Claw, Earthquake, and Crunch is his best set. I'd take Rock Head in a heartbeat, but Strong Jaw biting attacks are still pretty dang good. Also strangely fitting.
Strong Jaw is a cool ability, but Head Smash + Rock Head? lol.
Like others, I think that Head Smash, Dragon Claw, Earthquake, and Crunch is his best set. I'd take Rock Head in a heartbeat, but Strong Jaw biting attacks are still pretty dang good. Also strangely fitting.
Why forego a boosting move? We've been saying again and again how hard this thing hits at +1. I could just imagine a SubDD set with Dual STAB (and Rock Head). 2 boosts or a boost + a Sub...*faints*
You could forgo a boosting move if you Baton Pass to him and trade Dragon Dance/Rock Polish for a coverage move. I've done it on Showdown to sweep whole teams, and the only reason I'd want a boosting move is to fool Aegislash King Shield. And even then you could use something like EQ (I'm currently using Crunch, Dragon Claw, and Stone Edge because Showdown hadn't updated his moveset to include the fangs).
You mentioned the fangs, could Strong Jaw be useable with them? You could just use Stone Miss over Head Smash (and I also want to do something with the only legal ability...)
Yup, you can breed the fangs and Dragon Dance onto him, and the fangs benefit from Strong Jaw.
On that note, Scolipede might make a good teammate for Tyrantrum.
Scolipede isn't likely to attract the Fighting and Fairy moves that Tyrantrum is weak to (though Ground and Ice remain a concern). Pass an SD and a speed boost or two, then Start hitting hard with something like Stone Edge/EQ/Your favorite 2 fang moves. I probably wouldn't use Dragon Claw.
DClaw is for neutral coverage, mostly. Problem is Scolipede is Scizor bait, and Scizor (especially the SD Mega Scizors) might be what makes Tyrantrum not be top tier OU. Scolipede cannot touch Scizor outside of the weak Rock Slide/Aqua Tail (if that is legal with speed boost and Baton Pass). Mega Scizor is worse since it carries Roost 90% of the time and is a LOT bulkier.
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