Item Assault Vest

[BiFrosty]

Isn't Goodra as you say a special wall, as in it should come into special attackers to wall it down or force it to switch? Most shouldn't be able to do anything unless they have Psyshock.

And that Excadrill example sounds like it could be done with focus sash (if no hazard is up.).

 

[Patrick1088]

Isn't Goodra as you say a special wall, as in it should come into special attackers to wall it down or force it to switch? Most shouldn't be able to do anything unless they have Psyshock.

And that Excadrill example sounds like it could be done with focus sash (if no hazard is up.).

Unless youre going to be shooting off powerful(and i mean powerful) special moves at goodra its a waste to attack from the special spectrum. Can you wear it down with blizzards and draco meteor? Yes but it can return fire and ko you before you have a chance. If you attack its weaker defense then it is much easier to handle.

Can excadrill survive a focus miss from mega alakazam with av? I have to see the calcs but i still think its a ohko unless im mistaken?

Even still recursion is right. Av should help you get the surprise check not become a tank. Av excadrill sounds good imo

 

[Pidgey Airlines]

Call me old fashioned but I think Sword Dance belongs on Exca...

 

[BiFrosty]

Unless youre going to be shooting off powerful(and i mean powerful) special moves at goodra its a waste to attack from the special spectrum. Can you wear it down with blizzards and draco meteor? Yes but it can return fire and ko you before you have a chance. If you attack its weaker defense then it is much easier to handle.

I'm sorry if I interpret what he said is wrong, but I talking about making the attacker is force to switch since it's a special attacker (has choice specs or nasty plot set), indeed they can wear Goodra down and Goodra can fire back and kill. That's the point. Make it pointless to attack it is what I getting with Goodra + AV.

 

[Drybones]

In the early game the following set was doing pretty well on my teams:

Machamp @ Assault Vest
252 hp / 252 atk / 4 spe adamant

dynamicpunch
knock off
stone edge
bullet punch


It allows him to tank all kinds of fun volt switches and at least survive some psychics, etc. He misses the lum berry but can be paired with a fast taunt lead like deoxys-s or noivern, whatever you want. I don't have calcs but I figured assault vest would be well suited to any tank whose attacks do double duty.

 

[Recursion]

I'm sorry if I interpret what he said is wrong, but I talking about making the attacker is force to switch since it's a special attacker (has choice specs or nasty plot set), indeed they can wear Goodra down and Goodra can fire back and kill. That's the point. Make it pointless to attack it is what I getting with Goodra + AV.

I think Goodra, and pretty much any wall, performs better with leftovers. After you reach a certain point, increasing defense becomes less valuable that being able to recover damage, especially when you can use utility moves to stall or force out opponents.

Say Goodra takes 25% from an attack. He could increase his defenses by 50%, reducing the damage to ~16.5%. Or, he could bring leftovers. After one round of leftovers, the assault vest wins out by about 3% damage (compared to 18.75%). However, if Goodra forces the opponent to switch, which I expect he usually can, it gets another turn of leftovers, cutting the damage to 12.5%. In addition, any damage AV Goodra takes can't be recovered except from Wish, while with leftovers he gets to heal every time he switches in. He can also bring protect to stall for more leftovers recovery, although he usually has better moves to bring.

 

[BiFrosty]

I think Goodra, and pretty much any wall, performs better with leftovers. After you reach a certain point, increasing defense becomes less valuable that being able to recover damage, especially when you can use utility moves to stall or force out opponents.

Say Goodra takes 25% from an attack. He could increase his defenses by 50%, reducing the damage to ~16.5%. Or, he could bring leftovers. After one round of leftovers, the assault vest wins out by about 3% damage (compared to 18.75%). However, if Goodra forces the opponent to switch, which I expect he usually can, it gets another turn of leftovers, cutting the damage to 12.5%. In addition, any damage AV Goodra takes can't be recovered except from Wish, while with leftovers he gets to heal every time he switches in. He can also bring protect to stall for more leftovers recovery, although he usually has better moves to bring.

True, Leftovers would help more in walling/stalling when the enemy is not attacking when they knows it's pointless. In the end it maybe is best for that revenge killing strategy you talk about, unless the Pokemon in question is packing Drain Punch, Giga Drain, or any other absorbing attack (Not Goodra).

How about Intimidate/Shed Skin Scrafty + Drain Punch + AV?

 

[Recursion]

True, Leftovers would help more in walling/stalling when the enemy is not attacking when they knows it's pointless. In the end it maybe is best for that revenge killing strategy you talk about, unless the Pokemon in question is packing Drain Punch, Giga Drain, or any other absorbing attack (Not Goodra).

How about Intimidate/Shed Skin Scrafty + Drain Punch + AV?

That's a pretty good idea. I would run Intimidate to force out both physical and special threats. Crunch can also help force switches.

And that Excadrill example sounds like it could be done with focus sash (if no hazard is up.).

The advantage AV has over focus sash is that it doesn't care about hazards, sandstorm, or hail. Outside of those, FS gives you a guarantee.

 

[aim2game]

Milotic @ Assault Vest
Trait: Marvel Scale
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Hydro Pump / Scald
- Ice Beam
- Dragon Pulse / Hidden Power (Coverage)
- Dragon Tail / Hidden Power (Coverage)

I am not good with EVs so I am sure someone would know of a better split for them. Marvel Scale makes her an even bigger tank if affected by status. Hydro Pump for greater damage, Scald for more accuracy and the chance to Burn increasing her survivability. Ice Beam hits Grass types that would eat your Water type moves and removes Bugs which I think will be more prevalent due to all of the new Megas. Then you can take Dragon Pulse for Dragon types or you can Dragon Tail to phase out a threat that Milotic cannot handle. Hidden Power can fill in for coverage.

 

[BiFrosty]

Milotic @ Assault Vest
Trait: Marvel Scale
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Hydro Pump / Scald
- Ice Beam
- Dragon Pulse / Hidden Power (Coverage)
- Dragon Tail / Hidden Power (Coverage)

I am not good with EVs so I am sure someone would know of a better split for them. Marvel Scale makes her an even bigger tank if affected by status. Hydro Pump for greater damage, Scald for more accuracy and the chance to Burn increasing her survivability. Ice Beam hits Grass types that would eat your Water type moves and removes Bugs which I think will be more prevalent due to all of the new Megas. Then you can take Dragon Pulse for Dragon types or you can Dragon Tail to phase out a threat that Milotic cannot handle. Hidden Power can fill in for coverage.

Dragon Tail can't phase out fairies can it? Hidden Power (Poison (Not Steel because Azumarill) ) for coverage against them. Especially Azumarill who would wall the entire set though might not like that Scald Burn. Mawile doesn't like Scald either.

Which reminds me AV Scrafty, might need Poison Jab/Iron Head because Fairies 4x effective...(Or have someone else take care of them.)

 

[aim2game]

I assume Fairies would be immune to Dragon Tail since they are immune to Dragon type moves, but Hidden Power Poison might help. Dragon Tail can still do a little extra damage since it is Super Effective against them when phasing them. And like I said I am sure my EVs could be better distributed.

Another thought, though not OU but might give the Pokemon a boost is Hypno. He is pretty tanky.

Hypno @ Assault Vest
Trait: Insomnia
EVs: 148 HP / 252 Atk / 148 SDef
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Drain Punch
- Zen Headbutt
- Fire Punch / Ice Punch
- Foul Play / Ice Punch

or

Hypno @ Assault Vest
Trait: Insomnia
EVs: 148 HP / 252 SAtk / 148 SDef
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Psychic / Psyshock
- Focus Blast
- Signal Beam
- Shadow Ball / Grass Knot

He can use a Physical set and get extra sustain from Drain Punch plus Zen Headbutts Flinch. His Attack isn't great but he can use Foul Play for Psychics and Ghosts and use the enemies attack stat. Ice Punch covers more overall though. Fire Punch takes out Steels that might wall it and Bugs who might try to kill it. The Special set has harder hitting moves, but less sustain. Either would work well I think. Someone would still have to test the EVs since I don't know what is the best investment for surviving and killing things.

 

[aim2game]

And another mention might be Florges, highest Special Defense of any Fairy type.

Florges @ Assault Vest
Trait: Flower Veil
EVs: 148 HP / 252 SAtk / 148 SDef
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Psychic
- Moonblast
- Hidden Power (Fire)
- Energy Ball / Grass Knot

Psychic takes out Poisons, Moonblast has a chance to lower the enemy's Special Attack making her high Special Defense even greater, Hidden Power (Fire) for Steel types and then Energy Ball (got boosted to 90 BP) or Grass Knot. Depends if you want the guaranteed BP of Energy Ball or the higher potential BP of Grass Knot. Energy Ball can also lower the enemy Special Defense possibly increasing the damage Florges can do. Overall it seems like she lacks coverage, and her move pool is very shallow in terms of attacks. Plus she gets mostly Fairy and Grass support moves and no Grass STAB which is a shame!

 

[Littha]

Dragon Tail can't phase out fairies can it? Hidden Power (Poison (Not Steel because Azumarill) ) for coverage against them. Especially Azumarill who would wall the entire set though might not like that Scald Burn. Mawile doesn't like Scald either.

Which reminds me AV Scrafty, might need Poison Jab/Iron Head because Fairies 4x effective...(Or have someone else take care of them.)

Problem with hidden power: poison is that klefki and mawile are immune and they are a good portion of the actually good fairies. Hidden power steel at least hits them neutrally.

 

[AOPSUser]

And another mention might be Florges, highest Special Defense of any Fairy type.

Florges @ Assault Vest
Trait: Flower Veil
EVs: 148 HP / 252 SAtk / 148 SDef
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Psychic
- Moonblast
- Hidden Power (Fire)
- Energy Ball / Grass Knot

Psychic takes out Poisons, Moonblast has a chance to lower the enemy's Special Attack making her high Special Defense even greater, Hidden Power (Fire) for Steel types and then Energy Ball (got boosted to 90 BP) or Grass Knot. Depends if you want the guaranteed BP of Energy Ball or the higher potential BP of Grass Knot. Energy Ball can also lower the enemy Special Defense possibly increasing the damage Florges can do. Overall it seems like she lacks coverage, and her move pool is very shallow in terms of attacks. Plus she gets mostly Fairy and Grass support moves and no Grass STAB which is a shame!

This set is like using Choice Scarf Blissey in OU.

Florges's movepool is practically nonexistent, you just listed the five actual attacking moves it gets. It does zilch against most Steel-types (Registeel DGAF about your HP Fire), and while those would still beat you normally, at least with a normal set you can use Aromatherapy or Wish before you have to switch. Also Assault Vest doesn't actually help Florges since the boost it provides is completely irrelevant-Leftovers provides more bulk on a lot of attacks, and Wish is 100 times better than any AV set can hope to be.

Problem with hidden power: poison is that klefki and mawile are immune and they are a good portion of the actually good fairies. Hidden power steel at least hits them neutrally.

It's not like AV Milotic is a good idea in the first place, since it misses out on the moves that actually make it viable, like Recover, etc. Also Mawile is not going to be taking Scalds anytime soon, and Milotic can simply Recover stall it, so it won't actually switch in in the first place.

 

[Littha]

It takes 3+ scalds to take out mawile from full hp (assuming no burn) and mawile has a chance to one hit you in return.

0 SpA Milotic Scald vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mawile: 91-108 (29.93 - 35.52%) -- 27.29% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Mawile Play Rough vs. 248 HP / 8+ Def Milotic: 306-360 (77.86 - 91.6%) -- 31.25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Not the worst matchup I have ever seen but I would have to be pretty desperate to risk my mawile getting burned.

 

[Anartya]

Putting it on something like Goodra isn't going to help much because a smart opponent is using physical attacks to take it down anyway. Putting it on a physical wall is counterproductive it removes access to recovery. You don't need to diversify your wall - it has 5 team mates to do what it can't.

Trying to find a pokemon that can use this item well is the wrong way to go about it. I think it's better suited to patching holes in your team. Take this example: the only pokemon on your team that can OHKO Mega Alakazam is Excadrill, but it can't outspeed it and it can't survive a Focus Blast. But if you give it AV, suddenly you have the bulk to survive a hit and kill it with an Earthquake. You've created a check to a major threat, and your opponent doesn't know it's a check. You should put assault vest on a pokemon that can get unexpected KOs against major threats because it's usually checked by those threats.

To get the most out of this item, you need to put it on something your opponent won't expect. It gives your pokemon extra bulk, but it's only valuable if it surprises your opponent.

Agreed. I feel assault vest is better suited for pokemon that have high HP, high Atk/SpAtk, and good movepool that is mainly offensive with little to no support or recovery moves, like Excadrill in your example.

This is an example post-bank:

Emboar @Assault Vest
Fire/Fighting
Ability: Blaze
Evs: 252 Atk / 252 Sp.Def / 4 HP
Brave Nature
~ Hammer Arm
~ Fire Blast/Overheat
~ Stone Edge
~ Earthquake

Makes a solid pivot in RU.

 

[Cherub Agent]

Its late so i'll come back to edit this post later, but if youre looking for an AV mon with amazing offensive presence you should try meloetta. It can act as a pivot with u-turn, pretty much fully counter all gengars, and get through other spdef mons with serene grace shadow ball

 

[Direwolf12]

Given that with Assault Vest, you lose the ability to use reliable recovery and Leftovers, has anyone considered its application with Drain Punch or Giga Drain users? When it’s available in December, I think Conkeldurr could run a pretty effective Assault Vest set. He has pretty impressive offensive presence with no boosting item and his high base HP and Def usually mean its efficient to invest some EVs in SpD. You can take most unboosted neutral Special hits very well, then heal the damage off with Drain Punch. Payback, Poison Jab , Stone Edge and Elemental Punches are all good coverage moves to bait Psychics/Ghosts/Fairies in, or hit your counters hard. Honestly, Assault Vest just seems to be made for Bulky Offensive Pokemon that don’t really offer too much in the way of support.

You can get the Timburr line already they're in the Mountain Dex

 

[Lovelace]

Its late so i'll come back to edit this post later, but if youre looking for an AV mon with amazing offensive presence you should try meloetta. It can act as a pivot with u-turn, pretty much fully counter all gengars, and get through other spdef mons with serene grace shadow ball

Having used AV Meloetta extensively I can second this. I often switch it into Greninja Dark Pulses just because with its great bulk it can avoid the 2HKO.

I've been using it Max HP / Max Special Attack but with all around decent stats and a versatile movepool you can do tonnes of stuff. Base 90 speed means you can outpseed a lot of mons with enough investment and its defense is good to enough to live a few hits on that side too (Max HP is enough to survive +2 252+ Sacred Sword from Aegislash). With a physical movepool containing stuff like U Turn and Close Combat you can invest there and obliterate incoming TTar and Chansey.

 

[RaRaRabbit]

so. i have been spending awhile trying to think of my 6th for my team.... needed a tank that could hit back with decent recovery. i dont know why i finally came to this conclusion, and i dont know if it was mentioned yet....


tangrowth ~ assault vest ~ regenorator
sassy
hp 252 ~ def 28 ~ sp def 224

gigadrain
earthquake
knock off / rockslide
poison jab / sludge bomb / payback


so the EVs and nature can be played with however. i did them in that spread to test some variations of things.... quickly.

with the current spread, i did some calcs. im going to repeat it from memory as best i can.... and it looks like
heatran is a 3hko to 4hko with fireblast.
kingdra is a 3hko with outrage.
bulky rotom w is a 5hko with ice beam.
swampert with choice band and ice punch is a 3hko. (maybe he was 2hko but who cares because giga drain).

i feel like tangrowth with regenorator and assault vest is going to be a pretty consistent threat. as said in its 5th gen ou page, he takes choice hits to scout moves, and then switches out to the appropriate counter and heals with regen. now he can do this better by being able to do it on the special side. not to mention, he basically sits with a great movepool, and solid attacking stats.

 

[DTC]

I see a lot of people suggesting Assault Vest on random walls. I advise against it in almost every case; walls WANT recovery as well as utility moves. Assault Vest is an item made for tanks, not walls, as walls are supposed to last for a while. Regenerator Pokemon (specifically Slowbro / Slowking / Tangrowth) may be able to get away with a wall using Assault Vest, but even then, they should probably be tailored to a more bulky offensive set.

Anyways, has anyone here tried Assault Vest Snorlax? I know Treecko used it to good results. It seems pretty nice, as Snorlax is a pretty good tank with a moveset of Return (or Body Slam) / Earthquake / Pursuit (or Crunch) / Selfdestruct. Note that Selfdestruct + Pursuit is now legal (well, post Pokebank), unlike in BW.

 

[ryan]

Yeah, Assault Vest Snorlax is really, really good. Assault Vest was pretty much built for a Pokemon like Snorlax, which has good offenses, some utility in Pursuit trapping, nice offensive coverage, and fantastic bulk. I've been using Return and Pursuit and testing out any two of Fire Punch, Superpower, and Earthquake. Fire Punch is really great for stuff like Ferrothorn and Forretress, while Superpower nails Steel-types along with Tyranitar. Earthquake is good for Aegislash, especially now that people are finally starting to use the mixed sets. VestLax gives you a check to just about every special attacker barring Keldeo, which has been really rare in PokeBank. The main problems with VestLax are a total lack of recovery and thus a huge weakness to passive damage—Sandstorm, Hail, and hazard damage all really add up on Snorlax, making it a bit harder to switch into some things than you'd like. I paired Snorlax with a nice Wish / U-turn Jirachi to make up for this a bit.

Also echoing what DTC said; walls aren't going to care for Assault Vest. Ideal users of Assault Vest shouldn't miss out on reliable recovery, really important support moves, etc. Snorlax and Goodra are prime candidates for this reason. I've also seen some Assault Vest Conkeldurr, and it usually seemed to pull its weight. Great physical bulk backed up by good special bulk with Assault Vest, recovery in Drain Punch, priority Mach Punch, and good coverage with Ice Punch / Payback is awesome.

 

[Mkushrom]

I'm running Slowbro with Assault Vest:

Slowbro@Assault Vest
Regenerator
Bold Nature
252 HP / 252 Def / 6 SpAtk
- Fire Blast
- Scald
- Icebeam
- Psychic

It's really nice most of the matchs, but sometimes I really miss Leftovers.

 

[Leafshield]

I've been testing Assault BVest on a lot of mons as of recent, and the two that I've found the most success with are Conkeldurr and Snorlax.

Conk's good bulk, great Attack, and STAB Drain Punch mean that it can take hits and keep himself healthy relatively easily. It's coverage is pretty fantastic, and it can absorb status with Guts or boost its Drain Punch (as well as Ice / Fire / Thunder Punch) with Iron Fist. I've been using the old standard All-Out Attacker Conk spread, and I haven't had any complaints:

Conkeldurr @ Assault Vest
Trait: Guts / Iron Fist
EVs: 120 HP / 252 Atk / 116 SpD / 20 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Ice Punch
- Mach Punch
- Thunder Punch / Facade (I prefer TPunch because Azumarill)

On Snorlax, it's pretty incredible with an Assault Vest. As mentioned above, it's great special bulk, offensive coverage, and awesome utility in Pursuit-trapping (which makes it a phenomenal answer to Mega Gengar) make it pretty awesome for bulky offense and as a pivot on more offensive teams, who often have some issues with Mega Gengar from my experience. It's not often that you get the impression that an item was made especially for a Pokémon, but I get that feeling with Assault Vest Lax.

Snorlax @ Assault Vest
Trait: Thick Fat
EVs: 252 Atk / 52 Def / 200 SpD / 4 (yeah I use Smogon EV spreads, sue me :P)
Adamant Nature
- Return
- Earthquake
- Pursuit
- Fire Punch

 

[Flamebot]

Why would anyone even put AV on a pokemon that already has good Sp.defence?
If you have high Sp.defence, you will likely be hit by physical attacks more so it makes little sense.

Now putting it on a Tank or Physicaly defensive pokemon would be more Viable(imo) here is why.

Physicaly defensive pokemon are more likely to be hit by Sp.Attacks.

Tanks can take both kinds of hits fairly well, so using AV will increase thier Sp.defence, while still having notable defence.

Pokemon with a even BST in both areas can also use this item well.

If I'm wrong can someone explain why?...