Latios and Latias

[Lord Wallace]

Very recently a post came out from the same hacker who discovered the event legendaries for Pokemon XY confirming the abilities for Mega Latios and Mega Latias as well as type change.

Latios remains a Dragon/Psychic but gets one of the most devastating offensive abilities in the game, Adaptability.

Latias gets a great typing change to Dragon/Fairy, losing both its U-turn and Pursuit weaknesses and turning them into resistances as well as gaining an immunity to Dragon. As if that werent good enough, it gets the amazing defensive ability Multiscale.

But it is also worth noting that both Latis lose Levitate as a result.

So what does this mean for the future metagame (whichever tier they end up in)? Is it worth using over Soul Dew (if we ever get it)? Is Levitate a huge loss?

However, Lets not begin speculating about stats we dont know yet. Both Latis already have great stats and I wish to discuss the implications of their new abilities and typing based only on their effectiveness last gen in consideration of the confirmed changes.

Also feel free to discuss normal Latios and Latias in the Pokebank OU metagame.

Heres my source:
http://pokemonxandpokemony.com/?p=12544

Okay okay so it doesnt inspire as much confidence as I hoped, but I mean the images are there.

 

[SAGA]

Can you link the source?

 

[Surgo]

Not only do they lose levitate, but equally importantly they lose soul dew! That's a major opportunity cost to use their megas.

Actually, it's worth noting that soul dew hasn't even been confirmed for gen6 yet.

 

[Mocha]

Dragon/Fairy sounds like a nice, defensive typing. Only weak to Steel, Poison, Ice, and ironically enough, Fairy. Even so, with Multiscale, she will be able to survive just about any first hit, barring without some ridiculous boost. In addition, Dragon/Fairy resists Grass, Water, Electric, Bug, Fire, Fighting, Dark, and an immunity to Dragon. Some of these are pretty common offensive types too, so this is a lovely, defensive boon for Latias.

I heard rumors about their stats, but I think it'd be crucial to see some confirmation before I start to analyze potential builds. Rumors stand thus:

Mega Latios is Dragon/Psychic with Adaptability
Base Stats: 80/110/80/180/110/140

Mega Latias is Dragon/Fairy with Multiscale
Base Stats: 80/80/110/110/180/140

As I said, these aren't confirmed, so not going to have an opinion just yet.

 

[Magcargo]

Not only is there any reliable source for this listed in the OP, but this goes against the rules, primarily the one against speculation.

 

[Lord Wallace]

Not only is there any reliable source for this listed in the OP, but this goes against the rules, primarily the one against speculation.

Ah you guys are right my bad. I'll post the link shortly.

 

[Mozilla Fennekin]

Latios with Adaptability and a stat improvement? Just when I thought my bed-wetting days were finally over.

 

[Rein-San]

Latios with Adaptability and a stat improvement? Just when I thought my bed-wetting days were finally over.

Remember that it doesn't have Soul Dew.


We should wait till stats come out to see if it's worth it.

 

[AOPSUser]

Remember that it doesn't have Soul Dew.


We should wait till stats come out to see if it's worth it.

Stats are already out. According to another person that managed to crack the code (not smealum), the stats are:

M-Latios:
80/80/110/180/110/140
M-Latias:
80/80/110/110/180/140

Of course at this point we haven't actually confirmed them ourselves, and since there is no way to legally get them right now, I don't see the point of this thread.

Also Soul Dew is the Mega Stone. Calling it right now.

 

[N1ght123]

Remember that it doesn't have Soul Dew.


We should wait till stats come out to see if it's worth it.

It didn't have Soul Dew last gen either and it still hit like a truck.

Regular Choice Specs Latios:
252+ SpA Choice Specs Latios Draco Meteor vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Blissey: 270-318 (41.4 - 48.8%)

Latios with Adaptability and no Specs:
252+ SpA Adaptability Latios Draco Meteor vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Blissey: 240-284 (36.8 - 43.6%)

With no stat increases it hits 5% less now I believe it's safe to say that there will be an increase of some sort. We at least have a Latios that hits as if it had Specs but without locking itself.

Edit:
With the above posted stats:
252+ SpA Adaptability Latios Draco Meteor vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Blissey: 306-362 (47 - 55.6%)

It hits harder than Specs Latios, the physical bulk of Slowbro, the special bulk of Slowking and outspeeds MegaGengar. If those stats are correct this thing is a monster.

 

[Epikhairz]

Lati@s is not so good in Ubers without its Soul Dew js

both megas look too broken to be OU though

 

[Fireburn]

Stats are already out. According to another person that managed to crack the code (not smealum), the stats are:

M-Latios:
80/80/110/180/110/140
M-Latias:
80/80/110/110/180/140

Of course at this point we haven't actually confirmed them ourselves, and since there is no way to legally get them right now, I don't see the point of this thread.

Also Soul Dew is the Mega Stone. Calling it right now.

Where was this information obtained?

 

[zferolie]

Oh man, if that Mega Latias stuff is true... My Golden Latias is just going to be AMAZING once pokebank Opens up. A Golden Fairy/Dragon that can tank any one hit, gets Recovery to keep Multiscale active., and can hit hard with a mix of Dragon, hopefully Fairy, and a coverage move. I can't WAIT to use it!!

 

[Rein-San]

Stats are already out. According to another person that managed to crack the code (not smealum), the stats are:

M-Latios:
80/80/110/180/110/140
M-Latias:
80/80/110/110/180/140
Of course at this point we haven't actually confirmed them ourselves, and since there is no way to legally get them right now, I don't see the point of this thread.

Also Soul Dew is the Mega Stone. Calling it right now.

If that's true then wow.

More than Latios it's Latias I'm looking foward too.

 

[AOPSUser]

Where was this information obtained?

https://twitter.com/Parque_Compi/status/397390196708093952

 

[Mozilla Fennekin]

M-Latios:
80/80/110/180/110/140

Soul Dew being the Mega Stone would be way over the top, though, assuming it'll still increase stats. I mean, that's just not right.
But if the stat increase were dropped for it, one stone shared by two would be kinda cool.

 

[farranpoison]

Again. This is cool and all, but this is still unofficial information. As the forum mods have clearly stated, only discuss CONFIRMED information.

Yeah, it's cool. It might certainly be true as well.

Still unofficial.

 

[Flygoner818]

Latias REALLY excites me. It's new (unconfirmed) typing is a great boon, giving it a niche as one of the only Pokes who are immune to the Dragon/Ground combo. Losing Bug and Dark weaknesses in favor of Steel and Poison is a great trade-off, though Gen VI seems to be more favorable to the latter attacking types. However, things get really interesting in its Mega form: it immediately becomes the game's best Rest-Talker. Imagine: base 80/110/180 defenses on a Pokemon with 140 base speed and a Dragon immunity. Now, beef up the 110 Defense to base 165, factoring in Multiscale (not sure if my math is correct) and you're looking at a Pokemon with better overall bulk than nearly the entire OU tier, save for maybe the pink blobs and, like, Tyranitar in Sand. And maybe Hippowdon. With a move set like:

Rest | Sleep Talk | Dazzling Gleam (or Moonblast or w/e) | Roar/Dragon Pulse/Calm Mind/also w/e

It becomes and incredible beast, and a monster to take down on either end. Latias got EVERYTHING on it's wish list from Gen IV, and it's not even her birthday!

 

[EternalZ]

A lot of people thus far are calling instaban on both of these lovely dragons, but I can justify why at least M-Latias (hereon out referred to as Latias) will possibly stay OU.

While Latias has great bulk now, it gains nothing in terms of it's special attack. It's decent base 110 special attack stat won't cut it in the new OU environment, ESPECIALLY with the special move nerfs. Not only this, but Latias's STABs are resisted by Steels, who subsequently ruin her. "Oh, just run HP Fire!" Well, here's the thing, she has sever 4MSS.

She wants to CM. CM/Roost/STAB/STAB. Walled by Steels.
She wants to CM without Roost. CM/STAB/STAB/coverage or CM/STAB/coverage/coverage. Viable, but worn down quickly due to lack of Roost.
She wants to CM with better coverage. CM/Roost/STAB of choice/Coverage move. Walled by something like Ferrrothorn (if water/dragon coverage) or Azumarill (if dragon/fire coverage)
She wants to run her famous SubCM set? CM/Roost/Sub/STAB. If she runs Fairy STAB then she's not getting past steels. If she runs Dragon STAB then the premier Fairies are her own worst nightmare.
Roost+3 Attacks? Roost/STAB/STAB/HP Fire or Surf. Viable, but coming of a base 110 special attack stat is nothing to write home about.
All-out attacker? STAB/STAB/coverage/coverage/ Viable, but again, she's not a stellar special attacker right off the bat.

Now, regular Latias alleviated her power problem with Choice Specs. Mega Latias can't even do that. So it's stuck with that base 110 special attack unless it decides to CM, which then means it either doesn't run Roost and covers more but is quickly worn down, or it runs roost and is walled by certain things depending on her two moves of choice.

The most effective set I can see Latias running is a bulky supporter set. With support moves such as wish, toxic, refresh, healing wish, Screens, roar, tailwind, and three of the weather moves (Rain Dance, Sunny Day, and Sandstorm), she could be a very viable support pokemon and even a special wall. I can see Latias carving out it's niche as a special wall/bulky supportmon, easily.

 

[zferolie]

A lot of people thus far are calling instaban on both of these lovely dragons, but I can justify why at least M-Latias (hereon out referred to as Latias) will possibly stay OU.

While Latias has great bulk now, it gains nothing in terms of it's special attack. It's decent base 110 special attack stat won't cut it in the new OU environment, ESPECIALLY with the special move nerfs. Not only this, but Latias's STABs are resisted by Steels, who subsequently ruin her. "Oh, just run HP Fire!" Well, here's the thing, she has sever 4MSS.

She wants to CM. CM/Roost/STAB/STAB. Walled by Steels.
She wants to CM without Roost. CM/STAB/STAB/coverage or CM/STAB/coverage/coverage. Viable, but worn down quickly due to lack of Roost.
She wants to CM with better coverage. CM/Roost/STAB of choice/Coverage move. Walled by something like Ferrrothorn (if water/dragon coverage) or Azumarill (if dragon/fire coverage)
She wants to run her famous SubCM set? CM/Roost/Sub/STAB. If she runs Fairy STAB then she's not getting past steels. If she runs Dragon STAB then the premier Fairies are her own worst nightmare.
Roost+3 Attacks? Roost/STAB/STAB/HP Fire or Surf. Viable, but coming of a base 110 special attack stat is nothing to write home about.
All-out attacker? STAB/STAB/coverage/coverage/ Viable, but again, she's not a stellar special attacker right off the bat.

Now, regular Latias alleviated her power problem with Choice Specs. Mega Latias can't even do that. So it's stuck with that base 110 special attack unless it decides to CM, which then means it either doesn't run Roost and covers more but is quickly worn down, or it runs roost and is walled by certain things depending on her two moves of choice.

The most effective set I can see Latias running is a bulky supporter set. With support moves such as wish, toxic, refresh, healing wish, Screens, roar, tailwind, and three of the weather moves (Rain Dance, Sunny Day, and Sandstorm), she could be a very viable support pokemon and even a special wall. I can see Latias carving out it's niche as a special wall/bulky supportmon, easily.

I don't get why 110 SpA is nothing special? Yes, you have some harder hitting pokemon, but those harder hitting pokemon can take attacks likeMega latias can. I was thinking of running this with my Kiganehime(Golden Princess) my golden latias.

Modest(since mine is modest. Timid might be better, but I am talking about mine)
Roost/Recover
A Fairy Move
Dragon Pulse
Shadow ball.
252 SpA, Mix of HP, SpD, or Speed.

With Multiscale, a fast speed to recover back up, and that insane SpD, she will be tanking everything. With 110 SpA, she will be hitting decently hard. Not as hard as some sweepers, but harder then any other tank out there, and fast as well.

 

[Judicator]

Latios remains a Dragon/Psychic but gets one of the most devastating offensive abilities in the game, Adaptability.

Well, there goes Dragalge's niche...

 

[EternalZ]

I don't get why 110 SpA is nothing special? Yes, you have some harder hitting pokemon, but those harder hitting pokemon can take attacks likeMega latias can. I was thinking of running this with my Kiganehime(Golden Princess) my golden latias.

You also have to take into account the fact that she's using up a mega slot. You could easily use something like Specs Latias or even LO Reuniclus and hit harder than a M-Latias while still retaining bulk. She has to compete for a Mega slot, and my prediction is until the hype over megas calm down and people start utilizing more defensively oriented megas, she will be over shadowed by powerful attackers such as M-Lucario and M-Manectric. Hell, M-Manectric has base 135 special attack, and even his attacks are considered weaker/less than desirable. That's 25 points higher than M-Latias. Sure, they have different niches but the main idea is that base attacking stats can only go so far without an item or a good ability. Latias has a good defensive ability, making it better defensively. M-Latios, on the other hand, is a freaking nuke even without an item thanks to his godsend ability in the form of Adaptability. I still stand by my prediction of M-Latias becoming an amazing supporter/special wall rather than a limited special sweeper.

 

[StallMandibuzz]

As much as Dragon/Fairy sounds super sex-tastic, I'm really not liking their sprites. :/ they just look overly rushed, IMO, but Adaptibility and Multiscale are two amazing abilities, for certain. If these two Megas are confirmed, they could be a huge nightmare for all of OU and beyond.

 

[GoldenSandslash15]

Actually, it's worth noting that soul dew hasn't even been confirmed for gen6 yet.

Yes it has. At the Battle Maison, the Soul Dew is listed in their banlist, indicating that it does, in fact, exist.

It is unreleased to the player to use (at least, at the time of this post), but I don't doubt that we'll get it eventually.

 

[Ash Borer]

Not only do they lose levitate, but equally importantly they lose soul dew! That's a major opportunity cost to use their megas.

Actually, it's worth noting that soul dew hasn't even been confirmed for gen6 yet.

I honestly think soul dew simply wont exist now, I mean, it's practically a mega evolution, an item specific to a mon that confers a stat boost and that's it. It would be redundant with a mega stone.