XY UU Beta Discussion (Read post #32)

[soursurfer12]

An anti-lead for you:

Tornadus @ No Item
Prankster
4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature
-Taunt
-Acrobatics
-U-Turn
-Knock Off/Tailwind

Unless you see Weavile in Team Preview you can send this guy out against just about everything. Prankster Taunt blocks rocks, Scolipede shenanigans, and tons of common lead tactics, fearing only Deoxys-D's Magic Coat which has been exceedingly rare in my experience. A lot of folks expect Tornadus to run a special attacking set (probably setting up Rain Dance Turn 1), which can cause some missed predictions and switches. No item has the dual perks of mitigating Knock Off damage and making Acrobatics a strong STAB, which hurts everything that doesn't resist and can net some nifty 2HKO's if the opponent has to retreat with their lead. Tornadus' speed tier means you can U-Turn out of bad matchups if need be. He's also a fantastic scout for Choice Scarfs since so few things naturally outspeed it in the tier at these EVs (though it likely means watching him fall if they are Scarfed). Pick your utility in the last slot. I've found Knock Off best because Tornadus would rather stay in against Deoxys-D and some other Psychic types that are best held at bay with Taunt, and even if they switch out it gives you that wonderful secondary effect. Prankster Tailwind is a great last gasp if Tornadus has been preserved until the late game and you need to setup a revenge kill you couldn't otherwise net.

 

[Patrick1088]

Holy sticky web! Since bisharp bit the dust, i see shuckle everywhere lol. Knock offing and laying that web lol

But seriously sticky web plus mega medicham is really scary...

Also jirachi is pretty good but the nerf to electrix types no longer being paralyzed definitively makes its job harder. But im running t wave iron head body slam and toxic.

With bisharp gone, its almost like a breath of fresh air...

Also, sp def jirachi is a great counter to mega gardevoir. Shadow ball is a 3hko while iron head is a ohko with minimal investment

 

[kokoloko]

Hey guys guess what?

Deoxys-D and Scolipede are now BL as well.

There's also a vote taking place over PM with the council right now to see what other Pokemon will be joining them in about 48 hours.

 

[Swamp Link]

woooo no deo-d

 

[Patrick1088]

Scolipede eh? Hmm thats interesting...

Deo d is very good now well see te rise of froslass roseradevand chesnaught as spike setters! Im especially in favor the latter! Lol

 

[Mozilla Fennekin]

Scolipede?! T_T My team needs some serious revamping now...

 

[Cobalt314]

Landorus is mentioned both in the Banned Pokémon section and the BL Pokémon section...

 

[Oddish is the best]

Scolipede is interesting… I really don't know what will get the boot next since there are so many candidates for BL lol.

 

[perplexingpool]

The ban on Scolipede seemed unnecessary imo, I found that it had a lot of diffuculty breaking through the common physical walls in the tier, and had trouble setting up due to its frailty.

 

[GlassGlaceon]

The ban on Scolipede seemed unnecessary imo, I found that it had a lot of diffuculty breaking through the common physical walls in the tier, and had trouble setting up due to its frailty.

it's coverage, speed boost, the attack buff it got this generation, and swords dance are all assets that most likely led to it's ban from UU. I found it relatively easy to set up personally, and it swept unprepared teams after a couple of speed boosts and an SD

 

[Ash Borer]

kokoloko laying down the law, I like a man of action

 

[Oddish is the best]

Not to mention Baton Pass as well.

 

[Mozilla Fennekin]

The ban on Scolipede seemed unnecessary imo, I found that it had a lot of diffuculty breaking through the common physical walls in the tier, and had trouble setting up due to its frailty.

Eh, I kinda understand it. He's like a lesser variant of Blaziken.

 

[Sergeant Spooky]

Scolipede is a poor man's Blaziken, it's plenty good for things other than Baton Passing.

 

[Oddish is the best]

Shifting gears a little bit.

I happened to be browsing the usage stats for UU beta and since there was no place to comment on them I thought I would leave me thoughts/ curiosity questions on these 2 here:
| 58 | Exploud | 3.52770% | 22871 | 3.780% | 17432 | 3.529% |
I haven't actually seen this on the ladder, but it's getting above cutoff usage (granted this is still extremely early but still over 300,000 battles :p). I was curious as to what sets people were using on it.
Specs? Scarf? Is it actually viable at all?

| 173 | Tornadus | 0.42510% | 2657 | 0.439% | 2183 | 0.442% |
| 168 | Slaking | 0.45652% | 3540 | 0.585% | 2784 | 0.564% |
Lol… Tornadus is actually really good right now and that anti-lead set posted earlier is actually really effective against most common leads. Since no one appears to be using it, most people don't really know what to expect from the genie so it adds a nice element of surprise.

 

[EonX]

Kinda surprised with Scolipede, but I can see where its coming from. It's basically Blaziken with higher starting Speed and a worse (marginally) offensive typing with the coverage to make up for it.

Deo-D was innevitable. It lost a major check/counter in Bisharp and it's p. difficult to keep from setting hazards without Espeon in the tier and Absol having to be used so early when it wants to sweep late-game.

Also, Terrakion is really good. Fantastic offensive typing, enough bulk to take a hit, and one of very few Fighting-types that is capable of denting and/or donking Fairy-types with a STAB move thanks to Stone Edge.

 

[Jvasss]

now that bisharp deo d and scolipede are gone there is almost no reason for me to put taunt cobalion in any of my teams, as i was using it check/counter those three specifically, and terrakion is much better in general

 

[Turtleye]

Hey guys guess what?

Deoxys-D and Scolipede are now BL as well.

There's also a vote taking place over PM with the council right now to see what other Pokemon will be joining them in about 48 hours.

Great now I have to find a replacement on my BP team .-.

 

[perplexingpool]

Great now I have to find a replacement on my BP team .-.

Ninjask maybe? Vastly inferior to scolipede, sure, but can still do its thing

 

[Turtleye]

Ninjask maybe? Vastly inferior to scolipede, sure, but can still do its thing

That 4x stealth rock weakness though.

 

[Limitless]

Maybe these "Council" men should give reasons why things are being banned. Just banning shit and saying it's been banned is jacked up. You have no reasoning then you're just being a douche. This "Council" is made up of bad players anyways. Bad players making choices that affect real game play is an issue.

I'm new; don't kill me.

Since I don't really have that much time to explain this (and the fact that we've gone over this a million times in IRC) I'll just summarize why, at least I voted for these two to be banned.

Deoxys-D has always been a top tier hazard-setter; I don't think anyone would disagree with that. The problem I had with it is that with all the offensive presence that the metagame currently has (Diggersby lol), it was really difficult for any of the metagame to really Defog or Rapid Spin without being seriously set back for the remainder of the match. Obviously, there is the option of keeping Stealth Rocks, and usually Spikes, on the field, but that's really even worse when threats like Scolipede are running around. I may have voted differently if some of the Knock Off users could actually OHKO Deoxys-D before hazard setting to oblivion, but alas that is not the case. Lastly, Zapdos can't even use Defog right away, as Deoxys-D is faster.

In regards to Scolipede, I've been saying it from day one: it's Blaziken 2.0. Simply put, this thing can OHKO an insane amount of the metagame. The coverage also makes it absurdly difficult to counter. And even if you can somehow "counter" it, trying to counter a cleaner is really difficult when entire teams are built around weakening those counters. But that's not really why it's broken, as you can say that about Sharpedo and any other cleaner. So I think to end this ramble of nonsense, I'll just basically conclude with my opening sentiments: its combination of ridiculous power and coverage makes Scolipede too difficult to handle. It's basically a cleaner in a breaker's body.

 

[C AllStar]

Deo-D, from my experience of using it, is pretty broken imo. Yes, it is true that you can kill it (it SHOULD die quick if used in HO), but that does not mean you can clear is hazards away when HO focus so much on offensive pressure. Personally, I am running a set with t-wave, taunt, sr and spikes with mental herb. It is simply amazing. Those Crobats, Tornadus-T trying to taunt me falled to t-wave+taunt and Defoggers are all outsped and taunted after t-wave (not mindlessly using t-wave though). While this set loses straight to spinners, spinners hates the sr, spikes, toss, taunt set with rocky helmet. Basically, this thing is so verstile that nothing can stop it from doing is job. Saying about clearing hazards afterwards is not a good arguement seeing that in Ubers, where the single best defogger named Arceus, spikestacking is still a dominant playstyle. While there are plenty of good defoggers in UU, things like Latias and Crobat can be lured in and neutered by t-wave Deo-d while every defogger and spinner can scrumble to the huge offensive pressure in UU (seriously? shit like LO Diggy isn't banned?). Deo-D existing pretty much limits the playstyle of UU being HO domminant. It should definitely be banned.

I never used Scolipede in UU and isn't troubled by it too much, but that's because I often use stall team that have a good phazer while my offensive teams use multiple strong priority. Though I always want to try a set with spikes, t-spikes, endeavor an megahorn with sash which is used by some good uber players. I can't say much about it now though.

I remember someone (i remember being treecko) saying about fake out + bullet punch being bad in Medicham before. No, it isn't. While Megacham had severe 4MSS and may not be able to break through stall teams with only dual stab, fake out + bullet punch is invaluable against offenive teams. There isn't much things that can switch in and take advantage of the 'free turn' in an offensive team while the dual priority allows cham to be an awesome revenge killer like last gen's Kangaskhan. While it might be walled hard by things like Slowbro and Doublade, HO team can actually get past them with heavy hazards and offensive pressure. Not to mention that High jump kick actuallg deals a huge chunk to Slowbro. Which four moves Medicham use should be dependant on your team's need. Fake out + bullet punch is never a bad option.

 

[Mattiator]

Goddammit, and my teams's centerpiece goes to BL. Back to trash like Ninjask I suppose.

 

[Magolor]

I'm kinda curious as to see what you guys use for Hazard Setters, currently I'm settling for Mew, who's doing alright for himself as a Stealth Rock setter

Mew @ Leftovers
Ability: Synchronize
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 SDef
Timid Nature
- Psyshock
- Aura Sphere
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock

He has a surprising amount of bulk even when uninvested and can set up Stealth Rock on the majority of Pokemon, Taunt is to help deal with opposing Hazard setters and Psyshock/Aura Sphere are your standard attacks. The main problem with this set though is that it's kinda weak due to the low BP of the attacks. There's probably a much better set considering that Mew has a crapton of moves and I made this in like 10 seconds so yeah.

Also Diggersby has been a somewhat decent Substitute for Bisharp on my team, both of them being Swords Dancers that are very strong and come with Priority. However I also find it harder to set up but eh that's what you get for using such an OP Pokemon.

 

[EonX]

A couple that I have used. One that is obvious and one that isn't quite so obvious:

Hippowdon (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Stealth Rock
- Slack Off
- Whirlwind
- Earthquake

Pretty standard fare, but it works really well. Hippo is able to handle the vast majority of physical attackers in the tier, and it's able to provide ample team support. It has reliable recovery, provides Rocks, and can also phaze and provide Sand. Great 'mon and can fit onto many teams, whether you want to focus on Sand or not. The other is something you may not expect at first, but it can be quite effective:

Terrakion @ Focus Sash / Life Orb
Trait: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Stealth Rock
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat
- Taunt

Great Speed, dual STABs, and high Attack allows Terrakion to be an offensive Rocks user. It also has access to Taunt to stop slower hazard users from getting hazards up early (read: all of them) Stone Edge and Close Combat hit most of the tier for heavy damage, meaning that Terrakion isn't a sitting duck after it sets up Rocks. Focus Sash is the primary item to ensure Terrakion can take a hit, but due to its decent 91 / 90 / 90 bulk, Life Orb is viable since only super effective moves will have a strong chance of OHKOing Terrakion. If you don't think Taunt is necessary, X-Scissor can be used to deal with Celebi, Latias, and others.