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Pokémon Tangrowth
- Thread starter thedeafelectrician
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I'll second this. Tangrowth is a very good pivot because Regenenrator / bulk / attacking movepool. I've been using alexwolf's set and have been very happy with the results.
Good thing I saved that in a word document! I'd feel even dumber if I took it out and had to re-write it from scratch....all done. Definitely gave you credit for basically fixing my original set. I slashed HP Fire first just because all of things mentioned switch into tangrowth all the time, but it's hard to go wrong.
Assault vest seems pretty nice, making Tangrowth relying on the surprise factor of EQ and HP Ground, and then awesomely Knock off and Giga Drain.
I'm actually having good success with rock slide as the 4th move on the vest set, talonflame just LOVES to switch into tangrowth, and with talonflame being used at what I (hopefully correctly) remember hovering over 50% usage, it almost makes up for being ferrothorn bait.
I wouldn't say that Tangrowth is Ferrothorn bait, as Ferrothorn relies a lot on its item, especially if we are talking about Leftovers. Same is true for Skarmory, which gets worn down extremely fast from random U-turns with SR down.
So I recently started using AV tangrowth and I love it. Thing is, I was having trouble tanking special hits, take 97% from LO greninja.
I came to this thread for some research and alexwolf 's post says I should run 252 sp def. But I'm uncomfortable giving up defense EV's. Will Tangrowth's physical bulk still be ok after I drop EV's from it?
Also, I gave it knock off, equake, rock slide, and power whip.
I realize now that getting rid of power whip is a good idea, as giga drain is far superior, but I very much prefer keeping the other three moves. Rock slide helps me take out Talonflame and volcarona, or at least, cripple them severely, and equake is my answer to mega luke.
So, tl;dr, how does tangrowth's physical bulk suffer from fully investing in sp def, and do I really need to run the special moves suggested in the OP, even if they're not coverage moves I want my tangrowth to have? (I prefer rockslide and equake, but am very interested in giga drain).
Thanks for any and all info!
I came to this thread for some research and alexwolf 's post says I should run 252 sp def. But I'm uncomfortable giving up defense EV's. Will Tangrowth's physical bulk still be ok after I drop EV's from it?
Also, I gave it knock off, equake, rock slide, and power whip.
I realize now that getting rid of power whip is a good idea, as giga drain is far superior, but I very much prefer keeping the other three moves. Rock slide helps me take out Talonflame and volcarona, or at least, cripple them severely, and equake is my answer to mega luke.
So, tl;dr, how does tangrowth's physical bulk suffer from fully investing in sp def, and do I really need to run the special moves suggested in the OP, even if they're not coverage moves I want my tangrowth to have? (I prefer rockslide and equake, but am very interested in giga drain).
Thanks for any and all info!
I think investing in the special defense is totally worth it. In a pinch, the recommended Assault Vest Tangrowth is able to take around 75-80% from +2 M.Lucario's Aura Sphere and KO back with Earthquake IIRC. Might need a high damage roll though for that KO back.
You're even able to tank things like Lava Plume off of Heatran, which is by far it's most popular fire attacking move. Of course, if you don't need the surprise kill, you could just switch out like usual to keep your HP healthy if you think you'll need Tangrowth later.
You're even able to tank things like Lava Plume off of Heatran, which is by far it's most popular fire attacking move. Of course, if you don't need the surprise kill, you could just switch out like usual to keep your HP healthy if you think you'll need Tangrowth later.
I've been using AV Tangrowth with Knock Off/HP Ice/Focus Blast/Giga Drain with Calm (+SDef, -Atk) nature. I don't care much for the minus attack on Knock Off. FBlast hits M Lucario better than EQ can. The frustrating thing though is that Lucario survives Focus Blast with like... 6% or so HP left. I need something like 130 SpAttack EVs to OHKO Mega Lucario (guaranteed, 70% of the time) and I'm not willing to sacrifice that much bulk. I guess more than likely, it'll switch in on rocks and a resisted Giga Drain. ANY sort of prior damage on Luke gets it killed by FBlast. However, I lose out on Aegislash, who gets free Swords Dances on me.
Tangrowth is able to take hits that I never thought it would be able to take. Fire Blasts from the likes of Salamence and Garchomp just get shrugged off. They then get HP Iced, which usually doesn't kill but they're not gonna wanna stick around for another one. Tangrowth then regenerates HP back, glad to have worn down the dragons. Against DNite, you first go Knock Off to break scale and get rid of weakness policy, then HP Ice. I'm constantly surprised at how Tangrowth can stand toe-to-toe with these dragons. Unfortunately it's not quite as good against the X2 weak dragons, but those can still get knocked off and worn down
I don't know how relevant this is, but I run speed EVs for Trevenant. It allows me to get a fast Knock Off, but it's probably not relevant since it'll just sub anyway. So I thought maybe I just need enough for Azumarill (4 speed EVs), but I'm peeking over at the Azumarill thread and the set there runs 84 speed EVs for Jellicent. Jellicent is nice but not as relevant for Tangrowth as it is for Azumarill
So I may just go the other way and run a minus speed nature as suggested in this thread. I may even do the bizarre thing of not running STAB in favour of EQ. I lose out on stuff like Gastrodon, Vaporeon and Rotom-W, but I'd rather let the annoying waters continue to annoy me than have Aegislash destroy me. I'm thinking of outslowing MINIMUM speed Aegislash to ensure I get a hit off on Aegis-Blade
Tangrowth is able to take hits that I never thought it would be able to take. Fire Blasts from the likes of Salamence and Garchomp just get shrugged off. They then get HP Iced, which usually doesn't kill but they're not gonna wanna stick around for another one. Tangrowth then regenerates HP back, glad to have worn down the dragons. Against DNite, you first go Knock Off to break scale and get rid of weakness policy, then HP Ice. I'm constantly surprised at how Tangrowth can stand toe-to-toe with these dragons. Unfortunately it's not quite as good against the X2 weak dragons, but those can still get knocked off and worn down
I don't know how relevant this is, but I run speed EVs for Trevenant. It allows me to get a fast Knock Off, but it's probably not relevant since it'll just sub anyway. So I thought maybe I just need enough for Azumarill (4 speed EVs), but I'm peeking over at the Azumarill thread and the set there runs 84 speed EVs for Jellicent. Jellicent is nice but not as relevant for Tangrowth as it is for Azumarill
So I may just go the other way and run a minus speed nature as suggested in this thread. I may even do the bizarre thing of not running STAB in favour of EQ. I lose out on stuff like Gastrodon, Vaporeon and Rotom-W, but I'd rather let the annoying waters continue to annoy me than have Aegislash destroy me. I'm thinking of outslowing MINIMUM speed Aegislash to ensure I get a hit off on Aegis-Blade
The return of the old sleep mechanics is awesome for Tangrowth. I almost killed a mega scizor with sleep and leech seed. (if only I had thought to have infestation then I probably would have killed it). instead of switching out my opponent kept trying to use u-turn it turns out. Sadly it woke up and pulled it off but Doing that much harm to something with more of an advantage against me was really satisfying. :D
It's nice to see Assault Vest Tangrowth is getting the love it deserves. The utility set, with Knock Off, Infestation, Giga Drain/Power Whip and one of Rock Slide/EQ/Poison Jab is amazing.
Iv'e had great success with AV Tangrowth in OU and iv'e seen quite a few too. Assault Vest Tangrowth and Slowbro work the same way. Both has really good HP,Defense, and Sp.atk/atk but mediocre Sp. Def stats so AV makes those Sp. Def stats stellar and with regenerator and a skillfully built team behind them both Tangrowth And Slowbro are huge threats in OU.
If you're going to use infestation on Tangrowth (not really it's best option), you'd be best running sleep powder, since sleep powder + infestation allows you to trap and sleep, essentially subverting the sleep clause. It's really not his best option though, as he traps *after* the switch, and unlike other infestation users, he's too slow to reliably get a sleep powder off fast, so you're stuck tanking a hit from something that was just switched into you (meaning it usually has special super effective coverage; think Charizard-Y's Fire Blast or Noivern's Hurricane).
Assault Vest definitely needs to be the primary set imo, its absolutely amazing. Giga Drain and Regenerator are all the recovery this thing needs and with Rock Slide (Talonflame and Volcarona), Earthquake (Heatran and Aegislash), Hidden Power [Fire] (Scizor and Genesect) hitting everything it needs to on the switch in, its godly on bulky offence. Do keep in mind that you will be taking Will-o-Wisp from Rotom-W and random Scalds, two of your coverage moves are physical and hit vital targets. This can be dealt with using team support (my primary Rotom-W switch in is Latias because it doesn't care about burn) and it still pivots remarkably well even when burned. Deserves to be OU this gen imo.
I had a Tangrowth/Heatran/Milotic core in BW OU, and it was phenomenal. Now, with AV Tangrowth tanking left and right from the attacking spectrum, it's become an invaluable team member and this core is stronger than ever. I generally run a similar set to yours, infestation over HP Fire when I feel like it. Status still poses a bit of a bother to Tangy, but Heatran and Milotic both absorb it fantastically. Becoming well-rounded with AV has done wonders for Tangrowth and I doubt we'll see him around RU this gen.
IMO this is a good tangrowth set
Tangrowth
N: Relaxed
I: Leftovers
A: Regenerator
M1: Giga Drain
M2: Leech Seed
M3: Earthquake
M4: Infestation
252 def 252 hp 4 sp.atk
I like this set you can restore hp while literally walling and residual damaging this poor Pokemon to death. If any one knows any Pokemon that could 2 hit KO this set or any opinions on this set reply to this comment
Tangrowth
N: Relaxed
I: Leftovers
A: Regenerator
M1: Giga Drain
M2: Leech Seed
M3: Earthquake
M4: Infestation
252 def 252 hp 4 sp.atk
I like this set you can restore hp while literally walling and residual damaging this poor Pokemon to death. If any one knows any Pokemon that could 2 hit KO this set or any opinions on this set reply to this comment
I would like to point out that Talonflame absolutely shits all over this set, which is a major problem since it seems like it's EVERYWHERE. 4x resistance to both of Tangrowth's attacks is going to minimize its effectiveness. Seems better to run Rock Slide instead of Infestation, since it hits a lot more things a lot harder.
+1 252 Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Tangrowth: 396-468 (98 - 115.8%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO
+1 252 Atk Life Orb Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Tangrowth: 343-406 (84.9 - 100.4%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
You won't be healing enough to take 2 hits from Talonflame, unless you're extremely lucky and keep him asleep for the maximum turn count. Even then it seems unlikely that you won't die to another Brave Bird.
If you're running Assault Vest instead of Big Root/Leftovers then there's no chance of living that second Brave Bird.
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Minor nitpick: Your calcs are for a Choice Band/Life Orb Talonflame at +1, when in reality it really should look something like:
252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Tangrowth: 290-344 (71.7 - 85.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Life Orb Talonflame Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Tangrowth: 252-299 (62.3 - 74%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Not quite as dismal as your estimations, and Tangrowth w/ Rock Slide actually stands a chance:
0 Atk Tangrowth Rock Slide vs. 48 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 288-340 (93.2 - 110%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
All things considered, Tangrowth really is a defensive behemoth with potent offensive stats. Just some food for thought.
I did that deliberately because most Talonflames run some sort of attack boost (not counting the Banded version), whether it be Swords Dance or Bulk Up. Granted there's no guarantee of a +1 or +2 but for this situation it seems relevant.
How is CB Talonflame going to use Bulk Up...
Already fix'd.
This Pokemon is amazing. I use the Infestation set and it does wonders.
252 Def/252 Hp/4 SpAtk
Nature: Bold
Ability: Regenerator
Moves
Infestation
Leech Seed
Giga Drain
Sleep Powder
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-90348730
This is a new alt I started laddering with a couple days ago, adding Tangrowth to a very stall team and in the replay you can see that other than the Mega Gardevoir, Tangrowth could have handled all of his pokes, it's just that good.
252 Def/252 Hp/4 SpAtk
Nature: Bold
Ability: Regenerator
Moves
Infestation
Leech Seed
Giga Drain
Sleep Powder
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-90348730
This is a new alt I started laddering with a couple days ago, adding Tangrowth to a very stall team and in the replay you can see that other than the Mega Gardevoir, Tangrowth could have handled all of his pokes, it's just that good.
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When it predicts a Knock Off from Tangrowth, of course.
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