Battle Maison Discussion & Records

[StarKO]

Uphaze: yes of course, you're fine if you just avoid using the Wish Chansey.

Aircraft: that Walrein is probably the biggest threat to my team as well, always hate seeing it come up. Not sure what kind of Chomp you're running but if it's the standard SD set I'd recommend running it with Substitute and Leftovers. This gives you a pretty solid counter as you can just sub until it misses, making the chance of losing to it absurdly low.

 

[Uphaze]

Okay thank you so much :) I spent my day to have a Counter + Soft Chansey and I'm actually at 49 straight ^^
Good luck to everyone and particulary Aircraft! My new Clefable and my new Chansey are beasts :D
Flamethrower allows me to destroy Foretress, Skarm and other Stealth Rock/Spikes nuisances.
It allows me to destroy Ferro too: the REAL danger for my team :)
And Counter Chansey is useful against Curse/Rest users :)
Thank you so much everyone: I'll come stronger!

 

[Aircraft Cemetery]

Not sure what kind of Chomp you're running but if it's the standard SD set I'd recommend running it with Substitute and Leftovers. This gives you a pretty solid counter as you can just sub until it misses, making the chance of losing to it absurdly low.

Yeah, I'm always on the fence about Fire Fang vs Sub. I definitely can't use Lefties, because I need the Lum on my Chomp. I think I'll try Sub anyway. It's basically the decision between a better solution to Sub-Seeders, which can be quite annoying, and the OHKO move users in general vs a better way to deal with opposing Scizor, Skarmory, Ferrothorn and Bronzong. However, as I've seen very few of those, I'll give Sub a shot. Thanks for the suggestion anyways.

 

[brakerider]

While I was trying to get my 658 streak I went through at least 1000 battles, and for every one I recorded the trainer and what sets came up just to make sure there was nothing inaccurate in the post by R Inanimate here: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/battle-maison-discussion-records.3492706/page-21#post-4990654.

Makes sense. Thanks.

Being a mathematician, when it comes to this kind of thing I take the view that "if it can exist, it does exist". I personally don't have a problem with the Chansey used by Uphaze because theoretically it can exist on a XY cartridge without hacks (whether it was hacked or not).

That being said, it's not up to me and I respect Eppie's decision. Uphaze, I can perfectly understand you being upset, but ultimately you have to respect the topic creator's decision. Also, wouldn't you rather get higher on the leaderboard anyway? :P You were planning on beating that streak regardless. I'm sure you can get a higher streak using Softboiled instead.

Agree

Nothing special really, considering the old Mega + Dragon type + water type teams are apparently the standard of non-Entruantment teams. Mine is Scizor, Garchomp, Azumarill. I'll post the exact sets and my reasoning behind them when the streak is over.

This run is actually only my 2nd or 3rd serious attempt. My last one died to the dreaded Brightpowder Walrein which hit 3/4 Sheer Colds against me and I missed the Superpower...

Nice job. Terrible way to lose.

 

[sasuke-kun19]

Hi all guys! I've been lurking on this thread for a while! here's the description of my super triple streak:) I hit 570 battles today, and it is still going, so (looking at you, eppie) feel free to not add it on the list untill my defeat!
the team I'm currently using is a trick room team based on the famous FEAR strategy, and my team stars are two lovely level 1 pokes, taillow and aron; but let's have a deeper analyse of the composition of the team:

Cresselia (F) @ Lum Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SAtk
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Helping hand
- Rest
- Moonblast
Here we are, my only TR user, Cresselia! This is such an amazing pokemon, because I think there are only 2 or 3 pokemon in the maison that can OHKO this thing (never checked anyway), but I always have a way to play against them; in this case, critical hit nerf helped a lot. Her primary role is setting TR, of course, and the job is accomplished quite easily in most of battles. I think I didn't manage to set up trick room on the first turn in only 10-15 battles of 570, which is very good! this beautiful duck simply sets trick room, and then uses Moonblast to finish off weakened pokemon (I'll be more accurate in the description of taillow), or she uses helping hand on her partner for a good amount of damage, allowing usually at least a kill; this thing lives forever, and when the time has come to die and she has not used her Lum berry, she just rests and heals herself. Of course, on the first turn she can be hit by two attacks, so she need a little support to efficiently set up TR, and the job is left to...

Hariyama (M) @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Def / 4 SDef
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Wide Guard
- Fake Out
- Knock Off
- Close Combat

Hariyama is here mainly to stops threatening pokemon for Cresselia, so fake out is the primary choice to hit pokes with moves that can cause flinch or that can taunt Cress; if I see that the foe is going to use rock slide, which is the most common flinching-move, I use Wide Guard, that has been very useful in lots of situations! Knock Off and Close Combat are self-explanatory, giving him a good coverage and doing a lot of damage; they're frequently supported by helping hand, and after the first turn, they even get the Guts boost, so Hariyama can be deadly. I opted for Toxic Orb because this guy is supposed to die quickly because of Close Combat.
Then we have one of the star of the team, Taillow:

Taillow (M) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Scrappy
EVs: None
IVs: Random
-Endeavor
-Quick attack
-Protect
-Rain Dance

This little bird destroys at least 1/3 of the opponent's team in the most of battles, just sitting there and spamming Endeavor or alterning Endeavor and Protect when needed. Quick Attack is useful in situations in which I have to finish pokes with 1HP (probably because they had been hit on the previous turn by 1HP Endeavor of my Taillow and not finished off by the other mates) and they just happen to have a priority move, but under trick room I'm faster anyway, so that's the crucial point! Rain Dance is mainly a support move to help the incoming Octillery, but can be used also to preserve the sash in situations in which I don't need to use Endeavor. Oh, and Scrappy is there to hit Ghosts, of course:)

General description of the first turn and consequential style of play:
Cresselia's Trick Room is mandatory, so I don't have to discuss much about this.
Hariyama can be played in different ways, depending on the opponent's team; most of the time, he just fakes out the pokes that can be dangerous for Cresselia's set up (so the left on the central one). If they are not dangerous at all AND the left one CANNOT hit taillow with a flying or pulse move, Hariyama uses Fake Out on the centre to allow Taillow to be hit just once (by the pokemon on the right), survive with the sash and retaliate immediately with Endeavor, leaving the target (usually the central one) with just 1HP; finally, Cressellia is able to set up Trick Room.
When I Fake Out the left one, Taillow is played more conservatively, because it is going to be hit by two attacks (central and right pokes) 90% of the time, so I simply go with protect. This is one of the most common situations, and after setting up TR I usually go like this:
Cresselia uses Moonblast on the central pokemon, Hariyama try to kill the left or the right one pokemon (but I prefer the right one, if possible, so that Taillow cannot be hit at all), while Taillow goes for Endeavor to hit the central one, which obviously will be finished by the incoming Moonblast;
the third turn is played similar, if possible, and when I'm able to:
1) set up first turn; 2)take out central and right pokemon with the strategy above described; 3) doing the same on the third turn;
it means that the battle is almost over, because taking out the two remaining pokes is a joke.
Usually, when things don't go as expected, Taillow is the first one to die, but it is replaced by Aron, that has almost the same role, but I'll describe his moveset later.
Finally, there are battles in which Hari is taken out first, and this allows me to use Octillery, that I'm going to describe just right now:

Octillery (M) @ Wise Glasses (any advice? I couldn't find a better one :/ )
Ability: Sniper
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SAtk / 4 Def
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Water Spout
- Energy Ball
- Flametrhower
- Ice beam

this nice octopus is here for one reason: Water Spout. The ideal situation in which Octillery comes in is when Hariyama has been killed; from the centre, he can fire off full HP Water Spouts, almost always boosted in power thanks to Helping Hand and quite often supported even by Rain Dance. In some battles, he just destroys opponent's team on his own; the other moves are just situational.
Then we have:

Aron (M) @ Berry Juice
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: None
IVs: Random
-Endeavor
-Toxic
-Protect
-Swagger (never used it, any suggestion?)


Aron just plays a similar role to the one of Taillow, but he has more "lifes" (with berry juice, he can take 2 hits before dying to the third one, but I'm not going to spend many words about it because Aron FEAR strategy is well know by everyone); Protect is there for obvious reasons, while Toxic can be helpful in some particular situations. I really don't know the utility of Swagger, but I don't know how can I replace it.

Mawile (M) @ Mawilite
Ability: Intimidate -> Huge Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 HP / 4 SDef
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Sucker Punch
- Ice Punch
- Play Rough
- Iron Head

And finally here we have mega-Mawile, whose main task is to simply hit hard and kill as many threats as possible; he's the less-used pokes of my six, but when he's sent into the field, he does his job quite well. I'm opened anyway to suggestions, because if I ever replace someone, it will be Mawile.

some videos:
D5WW-WWWW-WWW7-2BM4:here's a video showing how Octillery can be deadly when Hariyama dies too quickly;
ZTXG-WWWW-WWW7-245X this is a standard battle.
8U4W-WWWW-WWW7-2457 this is a close call, a really bad played match; if you want you can watch till I'm left with only Cresselia, and the opponents with Dusknoir! after that, is just a PP stall war, which I won:)
27MW-WWWW-WWW7-245A this is the worst battle in my entire streak, and I won only because of luck in the final (Rock Slide miss), otherwise I would have lost!

last information about my streak: I play without seeing pokemon sets or trainers; I know it is not a good thing, but checking it for every battle is simply too boring:)

thank you for reading, and sorry for my bad English, it is not my native language:)

here's the proof:

570 and still going ^^

 

[Aircraft Cemetery]

Alright, my Super Singles streak just ended at 485. Hax got me in the end. Not really surprising, because the team did not really have any huge weaknesses that I could lose to.


Onto the team itself:


Scizor @ Scizorite
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SDef
Adamant Nature
- Bug Bite
- Bullet Punch
- Superpower
- Swords Dance

Scizor and Kangaskhan are the two best Megas for the Battle Maison, so I had to choose between those two. Scizor was the first one I tried out and I never looked back. It has favorable matchups against the vast majority of opposing pokemon and it can easily boost up and sweep teams. The EVs are actually not specifically made for the Battle Maison. It's just the usual Choice Band OU set spread and it is probably possible to use a more efficient spread (like speed creeping some of the bulky waters, for instance). However, max HP and max Atk served me very well. Very few pokemon can 2HKO M-Scizor without any boosts, so even if I had to switch it out at some point, if I could make sure it had over 50% of its health left I could rely on it to switch back in and kill something again.
SD and Bullet Punch are self-explanatory. Bug Bite is also obvious and incredibly useful. So many pokemon carry some kind of berries and Scizor being able to snatch them is often a huge advantage (for example curing myself of confusion after stealing a lum, or forcing Chesto-Rest pokemon to sleep two turns which gives me the chance to boost up to +4, etc). X-Scissor is just so much worse, so I can only advise everyone to RNG their Scizors in Gen 4/5 and transfer them over instead of breeding them in XY. Superpower was my move of choice for the last slot and I was often glad that I had it. Roost is definitely an option there, I believe it just depends on your playstyle which one is best. Roost allows Scizor to get to +6 without losing health against a variety of opponents, however, I think that if you're at +6 it usually does not matter if you have 80% or 20% left. Also, I really didn't want to lose my most important team member to Magnezone. Apart from that, it is very useful against bulky Normal types, such as Porygon 2, Bouffalant and especially Snorlax as well as Aggron and other Rock types (just make sure to Bullet Punch them first in order to break Sturdy without giving them the chance to foil you with Metal Burst).


Garchomp @ Lum Berry
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Swords Dance
- Fire Fang / Substitute

Garchomp was my Dragon of choice for a number of reasons. Most people seem to prefer Dragonite in this spot, mainly due to Multiscale, but I found Garchomp to work better in my particular team. First of all, thanks to Chomp my team is significantly less soft to Aerodactyl and other strong Rock Types. Second, Garchomp is much faster than Dragonite and I think it is a very big advantage to have at least one pokemon on your team that naturally outspeeds base 100s and that hits with a very powerful dual-stab combination (DNite and Haxorus don't have Stab on EQ). If you look at it, Garchomp can easily switch into any Fire or Electric type that threatens Scizor, take minimal damage in the process, outspeed easily and OHKO/2HKO them. Dragonite can't do that. Also, Rough Skin is a great ability, being able to break Focus Sashes and sometimes just getting that last few points of damage in or, if Garchomp dies to the hit, it often makes it easier for Scizor or Azu to finish the opponent off with Priority. Garchomp also outspeeds and OHKOs Jynx, which is a big threat to the DNite teams, as well as the bird trio, Landorus, Medicham, Articuno and a number of other dangerous threats that sit around base 100.
Lum Berry is clearly the best item for Chomp on my team, simply because I need it to switch into anything Scizor can't beat, which in 80% of cases are STAB Fire moves. And I really can't afford to get burned on the switch against those. Also it allows me to run Outrage, which is significantly more powerful than Dragon Claw and which is crucial in a number of situations, i.e against Electivire, who often have both Fire Punch and Ice Punch and who always carry a Shuca Berry, which barely lets them survive an Earthquake. Earthquake and Swords Dance are no-brainers again, but the last slot is really up to personal preference. I used Fire Fang there, which greatly helps against Skarmory, Ferrothorn, Bronzong and a few other steel types, but Substitute is indeed useful against the bulky WoW Ghost types (Cofagrigus, Dusknoir) and it gives me a better chance to beat the dreaded OHKO-move spammers (Walrein, Wailord, etc). Just be cautious when running Sub, because you can't hit Togekiss any more and you actually need both of your other two team members alive to be able to beat Togekiss 4 (which has Heat Wave and which survives one unboosted Bullet Punch).


Azumarill @ Wide Lens
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Aqua Jet
- Play Rough
- Waterfall
- Superpower

Yes, that's right. Wide Lens. Simply because you cannot miss Play Rough. I would go as far as to say that no other item should ever be used on Azumarill for the Battle Maison, unless for some reason you run Azu but don't need Play Rough a lot. It 2HKOes Gyarados, which is otherwise a huge threat to my team, especially if it gets the Intimidate on Scizor, it 3HKOes Rest Suicune, which easily lets me beat it assuming I don't miss (remember Cune has Pressure, so you can't play this game forever). It also OHKOs many dangerous fighting types, including Conkeldurr, Machamp and Poliwrath and it is also my best solution to most dragon types that carry fire moves, such as Noivern, DNite 4, Garchomp, etc. So yeah, you do need Play Rough and those threats are so dangerous that one miss can cost you the game. I have missed two Play Roughs during my 485 streak. Had that been 20 misses, I don't think I would have gotten this far.
The reasoning behind using Azumarill is easy to explain. I had Scizor, and I had Chomp, and I thought about what threats there were that could beat or at least threaten both of them. Dragon types with fire moves, QD Volcarona, Kingdra in Rain, Poliwrath, Speed Boost Blaziken, Infernape, Suicune, Gyarados... Plus strong fighting types, because without Draginite I didn't have a Fighting resist. What do all of those have in common? Yep, Azumarill counters/checks all of them very nicely. Additionally, having access to a second hard-hitting Priority move is a blessing. I generally like Azu's raw power over Suicune's slow and stally playstyle.
The moveset is once again self-explanatory. Superpower is obviously superior to Power-Up-Punch, simply because it hits three times as hard right away. I have considered using Scald over Waterfall to break through freeze, but my team needs to switch its water type into ice attacks way less frequently than the DNite-Suicune teams and Waterfall is too important against Rhyperior and especially Volcarona 3 and 4. The EV spread is standard too, again I simply used my OU Azumarill here and you could probably adjust its Speed and HP EVs a little bit. Speed-creeping on Machamp, for instance, could be a good idea. But other than that it really enjoys max HP.
It might still look weird to use Wide Lens on Azu, but actually it doesn't need any other item. Azu is in that strange place where a lot of crucial attacks deal about 60% to it (Gyara's +1 EQ, Latias' or Starmie's Thunderbolt, Noivern's Hurricane and a ton of other moves), which means that it can't avoid the 2HKO with Leftovery anyway, and it always survives one crit even without any items. I used AV Azu in my previous run, but Wide Lens is just better. As I said, Play Rough must not miss. Ever.


Why Scizor as my lead?

You're probably wondering why I lead with Scizor and not Garchomp, seeing that most people lead with their Dragon types. basically, Scizor has so many favorable matchups that I can often speed up the battles by leading with it, boosting and sweeping the opposing team. This is not the main reason, though. First of all, Garchomp is so good at switching into anything that Scizor loses to that I'm pretty much always in a really good position right away. Either Scizor has a good matchup or I switch into Chomp, take 15% damage and am now in a favorable matchup. Dragonite is significantly worse in doing that because it does not outspeed most of the dangerous fire types (Arcanine, Moltres, etc) and it is hit neutrally by Electric while also being outsped by most electric types. It also can't OHKO many of those with its non-stab EQ. This is a huge advantage of Garchomp.

The offensive and defensive synergy of this team is generally outstanding. Scizor's only weakness is covered by my other two teammembers. Garchomp's only quad-weakness and its dragon weakness is also covered by both other teammembers. And Scizor just uses every Fairy type as setup fodder, so one fairy resist is more than enough. Azu's weakness to Grass is covered by Scizor, which beats every single grass type in the game, its electric weakness is covered by Chomp's resist and Chomp actually beats every single electric type in the game because they luckily didn't give them HP Ice in the Mansion. And Azu's Poison weakness is obviously covered as well. Another advantage of this team over many other teams is its speed. One pokemon that naturally outspeeds base 100s plus two very strong Priority attackers is really useful in a ton of situations.


Of course this team has some weaknesses as well and there are a number of things that the DNite/Cune teams do better. I'll just quickly go through the biggest threats to this team.

Walrein, and to a lesser extent other OHKO-move users: Substitute on Chomp probably helps against those (thanks StarKO for this suggestion), but they can still net some random hax KOs against any team, and if you happen to need the killed pokemon later in the battle, the streak can always end.

Volcarona: Pretty big threat, as it can come in on Scizor. All Volcarona sets are dangerous in their own rights, because Volc 1 has the Power-Herb Solar beam to kill Azumarill while the other 3 Volcs have QD to beat Garchomp. And all of them beat Scizor, obviously. However, Chomp beats Volc 1 easily and Azu beats the QD sets easily, unless they get super lucky with their Hurricane Confusions or with Flame Body.

Gyarados: is problematic if it has Intimidate and if it comes in against Chomp or Scizor. If it doesn't have it, I can just attack and beat them 1on1, but if they Intimidate me I usually have to switch into Azu. If they attack on the switch, I'm fine, but if they DD things might get difficult. Thankfully, if they realize they can't kill me in one hit, they usually just go for another Dragon Dance, at which point I can 2HKO them with Play Rough and call it a day (especially the Rest set is easily beaten this way). If Gyara actually DDed on the switch and then attacked me twice with EQ, I would probably lose. But as I said, the AI doesn't do that.

Noivern: I have to rely on Azu to beat it, and it usually does the job. However, if Noivern ever happens to hit the Hurricane, get the confusion hax, and I hit myself, I can lose.

Starmie / Latios / Latias: Those three are pretty similar in that if Scizor is below 40-45% and they hax me, I can lose (as you will see in the replay below). Scizor takes about 40% from their moves and OHKOes with Bug Bite, which is one reason why you should always keep Scizor at >50% if you're using this team. Azu can also beat all of them 1v1, but if they get the paralysis hax on the TBolt plus I'm fully paralyzed, they 2HKO and kill it.

Garchomp: As long as I know which set I'm up against, I usually beat them. Scizor actually beats 1 and 4 when it's healthy, Azu beats 2 and 3 and my own Chomp either wins the speed tie or survives one DClaw and OHKOes back with Outrage. If I somehow predict the set wrong though, it can become very dangerous.


Alright, so that's it for the team. As I said, I really loved it and I think it's very very solid. It can certainly reach an even higher streak than 485. The way I lost battle #486 was inevitable and it was really neither my own nor my team's fault. Anyway, here is the battle replay:

WFJG-WWWW-WWW7-26YW



Basically, the team I was facing was pretty threatening to start with. I could kill the Braviary without taking any Damage with my Scizor, but I couldn't prevent it from using Tailwind. I then had to stay in and try to beat Chomp with my Scizor, because I expected it to SD (which it did), at which point it could OHKO my other two teammembers easily (it was also faster than my Chomp because of Tailwind). Everything went perfectly against Chomp, but it was inevitable that my Scizor got weakened severely. In comes Starmie, and yeah... You can watch the rest. Nothing I could really do there really. The opponent's team was just perfectly built to set up this scenario where the para-hax plus fully-paralyzed would kill me.

EDIT: Thinking about it, I might have won if I SD against Braviary, then OHKO it with Bullet Punch. Then I could have 2HKOed Chomp instead of 3HKOing it and maybe would have had enough health left to take Starmie's Surf. I couldn't really know that, though. And the reason I normally go for 2 Bullet Punches instead of 1 SD + 1 BP against that Braviary 1 is that I don't want to get flinched by the King's Rock Rock Slide. It happened to me before that it flinched me 3 times in a row this way, and that would have also put my Scizor into KO range for Starmie.

Anyway, thanks a lot for reading. Have fun and good luck to everyone who's still trying to get a good streak. I probably won't try again in the near future. As I mentioned, this was only my second attempt at a Battle Maison streak and I'm not sure if I'll get back to it soon. Peace!

 

[Uphaze]

Congrats Aircraft, you just did an amazing score :) Welcome to the ranked!

Me, I just did an AMAZING (amazing xD) battle (maybe the most epic I ever did but I bad played). That was my 88th. 73 AMAZING TURNS lol

58NG-WWWW-WWW7-29AN

At my last turn I had a Poisoned + Leech Seed Chansey and it was the only one remaining in my team. I had maybe 10%, The Venusaur went for Struggle, I did a Seismic and killed it. But if the Seismic didn't kill, Poison and Leech Seed would kill my Chansey and I had no more Softboiled so that was EPIC :)

I currently am at 100 Straight Wins and be hasty to come back at 373 :)
What I'm gonna do in YouTube is upload the 350 battles I recorded with my Softboiled Chansey and, if I'm back at 350, I'll make new videos from my 351th until I'm KO with this new team :)

Like that, no Wish Chansey, and proof of Straight wins WITHOUT that Pokemon who costed me my ranking :)

 

[brakerider]

570 and still going ^^

Nice job here. Here are some suggestions:
Cresselia- Maybe mental herb over lum berry? Guess it depends on preference.
Hariyama- Maybe try flame orb, I guess depends on how long he usually stays in battle, but it does less damage after 3 turns I believe. Good choice on wide guard.
Octillery- Yes! This an awesome choice. You could try a splash plate for more of a boost on water spout or expert belt for the boost on coverage moves when you hit for super-effective
Aron- You could try sleep talk or rain dance. Sleep talk for a random hypnosis or lovely kiss. Rain dance for additional support for water spout.

Trick rooms have stopped many streaks and I am glad to see you giving this place a taste of it back. You almost caught up to me, keep it up!

Alright, my Super Singles streak just ended at 485. Hax got me in the end. Not really surprising, because the team did not really have any huge weaknesses that I could lose to.

Good job. Like the team setup.

 

[sasuke-kun19]

Nice job here. Here are some suggestions:
Cresselia- Maybe mental herb over lum berry? Guess it depends on preference.
Hariyama- Maybe try flame orb, I guess depends on how long he usually stays in battle, but it does less damage after 3 turns I believe. Good choice on wide guard.
Octillery- Yes! This an awesome choice. You could try a splash plate for more of a boost on water spout or expert belt for the boost on coverage moves when you hit for super-effective
Aron- You could try sleep talk or rain dance. Sleep talk for a random hypnosis or lovely kiss. Rain dance for additional support for water spout.

Trick rooms have stopped many streaks and I am glad to see you giving this place a taste of it back. You almost caught to me, keep it up!

thank you very much, I appreciate that:D
first of all, lum berry is fundamental to stop random freezes/paralysis, that can be a serious problem for my cresselia, and they are usually more frequent than Taunt, so I had to make a choice and preferred lum berry! Taunters HAVE to be stopped by Hariyama, otherwise I'm in trouble :)
secondly, usually Hariyama doesn't live more than 2-3 turns, so Toxic Orb seems better for me;
then, does splash plate give a better boost than wise glasses (speaking obviously about only water, because I'm using Water Spout 95% of the time anyway)?
finally, I think i'm going to teach aron rain dance, because he has never been put to sleep till now:)

if you liked Octillery's role, here's a video for you showing how this guy can be deadly when Hariyama dies too quickly: D5WW-WWWW-WWW7-2BM4

 

[FogHorn]

What are your guys opinions on Mega-Mawile in the Super Singles? I am starting a streak now and I am using it and was wondering if you guys thought it was a good choice.

 

[StarKO]

What are your guys opinions on Mega-Mawile in the Super Singles? I am starting a streak now and I am using it and was wondering if you guys thought it was a good choice.

I haven't tested it myself, but I did theorymon a team with it a while back when I was looking through the list of mega evos. I think a set like SD/Sucker Punch/Play Rough/Iron Head would do pretty well. The problem is M-Mawile's awful speed is going to force you to rely on non-STAB Sucker Punch a lot of the time (albeit somewhat made up for by its ridiculous attack stat), as well as its main STAB only being 90% accurate. In the end I didn't end up using it because I found that Mega Scizor/Kangaskhan are just generally better choices in most teams. I feel like Mawile might be better used in a Doubles/Triples Trick Room team perhaps, though I still wouldn't be surprised if you could get a decent singles streak going with it.

 

[FogHorn]

I haven't tested it myself, but I did theorymon a team with it a while back when I was looking through the list of mega evos. I think a set like SD/Sucker Punch/Play Rough/Iron Head would do pretty well. The problem is M-Mawile's awful speed is going to force you to rely on non-STAB Sucker Punch a lot of the time (albeit somewhat made up for by its ridiculous attack stat), as well as its main STAB only being 90% accurate. In the end I didn't end up using it because I found that Mega Scizor/Kangaskhan are just generally better choices in most teams. I feel like Mawile might be better used in a Doubles/Triples Trick Room team perhaps, though I still wouldn't be surprised if you could get a decent singles streak going with it.

That is the set I am running and it has proven to be decent throughout the first 10 or so battles. Whether it will continue to give me good results, who knows. I am hoping it does a decent job. I am partnering it with Latios and Terrakion. I am using it since my Kangaskhan is locked in my battle box for the April Friendly.

 

[VaporeonIce]

then, does splash plate give a better boost than wise glasses (speaking obviously about only water, because I'm using Water Spout 95% of the time anyway)?

Splash Plate (and Mystic Water, if you want to be cool and mystical) both boost Water moves 20%; Wise Glasses only does 10%.

I'd be really hesitant about Mega Mawile; it just doesn't seem reliable enough to get long streaks; though I'm sure it can get you to 50 wins just fine. Ultimately, relying on moves like Sucker Punch and Play Rough seems like a death sentence. Mega Khan can get away with Sucker Punch because it can boost with PuP and it has pretty good speed; many things that are faster than it are likely to just attack (still like Gengar, Espeon, and Alakazam, for example). But Mawile has to use Sucker Punch against basically everything, and it doesn't have the benefit of Parental Bond to ensure it KOs Focus Sash/Sturdy users it's trying to take down with Sucker Punch. On top of that, 90% accuracy on Play Rough. Ew.

I was actually wondering how the hell Aircraft Cemetery did so well with Azumarill, because it wants to use Play Rough so often. But Wide Lens is effing brilliant, so kudos for that. But since Mega Mawile can't hold Wide Lens, there's going to be some situation where you need to hit with Play Rough and it misses. It may be at battle #78 or it may be at battle #147, but it won't be at battle #325 unless the rest of your team usually wins without Mega Mawile. You just can't make it that far when you depend so heavily on a move that can miss so easily.

 

[Aircraft Cemetery]

I was actually wondering how the hell Aircraft Cemetery did so well with Azumarill, because it wants to use Play Rough so often. But Wide Lens is effing brilliant, so kudos for that. But since Mega Mawile can't hold Wide Lens, there's going to be some situation where you need to hit with Play Rough and it misses. It may be at battle #78 or it may be at battle #147, but it won't be at battle #325 unless the rest of your team usually wins without Mega Mawile. You just can't make it that far when you depend so heavily on a move that can miss so easily.

Thanks! And I totally agree. Basically, if you want to get a really good streak (let's say you want 200 at least, which gives you the rare berry and which gets you near the top 10), you simply cannot use moves with imperfect accuracy. The 1% miss chance of Wide Lens Play Rough almost cost me at around battle 180. 95% is the lowest I would ever want to go, and that only for coverage moves you don't use a lot (like Fire Fang on Chomp or Icy Wind on Suicune).

 

[FogHorn]

Splash Plate (and Mystic Water, if you want to be cool and mystical) both boost Water moves 20%; Wise Glasses only does 10%.

I'd be really hesitant about Mega Mawile; it just doesn't seem reliable enough to get long streaks; though I'm sure it can get you to 50 wins just fine. Ultimately, relying on moves like Sucker Punch and Play Rough seems like a death sentence. Mega Khan can get away with Sucker Punch because it can boost with PuP and it has pretty good speed; many things that are faster than it are likely to just attack (still like Gengar, Espeon, and Alakazam, for example). But Mawile has to use Sucker Punch against basically everything, and it doesn't have the benefit of Parental Bond to ensure it KOs Focus Sash/Sturdy users it's trying to take down with Sucker Punch. On top of that, 90% accuracy on Play Rough. Ew.

I was actually wondering how the hell Aircraft Cemetery did so well with Azumarill, because it wants to use Play Rough so often. But Wide Lens is effing brilliant, so kudos for that. But since Mega Mawile can't hold Wide Lens, there's going to be some situation where you need to hit with Play Rough and it misses. It may be at battle #78 or it may be at battle #147, but it won't be at battle #325 unless the rest of your team usually wins without Mega Mawile. You just can't make it that far when you depend so heavily on a move that can miss so easily.

Makes a lot of sense. I have been really noticing the speed issue with it at the moment. I can usually get myself up a single swords dance, but then I end up relying on Sucker Punch as it is really slow and it usually only nets me one kill, if even that. I will probably sub it out for another a set up sweeper since I have been underwhelmed by it up to this point. Dragon Dance Dragonite is something I am considering, but two dragons on this team is kind of getting me to look away from that, as it gives me a huge fairy weakness with Terrakion as my final poke.

 

[brakerider]

sasuke-kun19
- It is like vaporeonice says, splash plate and mystic water give a 20% bonus to water moves versus a 10% boost to special moves from wise glasses. Also, the expert belt give 20% boost to moves that hit for super effective damage. Good luck. I will check out those battle videos sometime as well.

Thanks! And I totally agree. Basically, if you want to get a really good streak (let's say you want 200 at least, which gives you the rare berry and which gets you near the top 10), you simply cannot use moves with imperfect accuracy.

This is very accurate, anything below 95 might as well be 50% if you are looking to get a super streak going.

 

[StarKO]

Also, congrats on your 485 streak, Aircraft. That's a really solid team so I'm not surprised you got that far so quickly. That's the thing about the maison though, when you're going for streaks as long as we are it's only a matter of time until that one opposition team appears that can cause you severe problems. Seems like Starmie4 is kind of a problem for this team in general if Scizor is within range of a CH Surf.

Speaking of which, I want to take a minute to rant about Starmie4. Why the hell would they give it King's Rock? That annoys the hell out of me lmao. At least when they use haxy items on other sets it kind of makes sense (Quick Claw on slow pokes, King's Rock with Air Slash/Rock Slide, Brightpowder with DT). But why wouldn't you give Starmie4 a standard special attacker item like Expert Belt/Wise Glasses/Specs? Gah. Stops my Dragonite getting a guaranteed DD and all.

About the battle you lost, I just looked at the video. "Artist Linteum"? I'm guessing there are different names depending on the version? But yeah artists only use set 4 (bar Azure's random Regirock 2) so it wasn't the King's Rock Braviary and you could have SDed safely. Sorry to be a downer :P

 

[FogHorn]

Thanks! And I totally agree. Basically, if you want to get a really good streak (let's say you want 200 at least, which gives you the rare berry and which gets you near the top 10), you simply cannot use moves with imperfect accuracy. The 1% miss chance of Wide Lens Play Rough almost cost me at around battle 180. 95% is the lowest I would ever want to go, and that only for coverage moves you don't use a lot (like Fire Fang on Chomp or Icy Wind on Suicune).

Good point. After I finish the April Friendly, I am definitely subbing my Mawile out for Kanga.

 

[Aircraft Cemetery]

StarKO

You're totally right, I should have realized what set it was beforehand and it may have won me the battle in the end. That's kinda the problem with such a streak... after almost 500 battles in only a few days you get kinda lazy and sloppy when you should really check every trainer you see for the possible sets he/she could have. I have to admit that I rarely did that towards the end of my run, because I was so familiar with all the different sets and my team could usually easily beat my opponents anyway, even if I didn't know exactly which sets they had.


It might also just have been my general playstyle in the mansion. I often opt to kill something in two hits rather than boost and OHKO and my team allowed me to play this more switching-based game with its good defensive synergy.


Oh, and not sure why the names are different, maybe because I play the game in German? Idk if that makes any difference.

 

[Pikiwyn]

Sasuke-kun19
Nice streak! I'll hopefully reach 500 today if I don't lose. You could consider Rest or Dig on Aron, it can come in handy to draw two extra attacks to Aron while your other Pokemon attack it's really situational and Rain Dance is probably better for your team but Rest/Dig seem to work pretty well when it's used.

 

[SimicCombine]

I'm up to 482 on Super Triples using a slightly modified variant of Eppie's team. More informative update to come after I've successfully jinxed myself.

 

[atsync]

I've been doing some testing on the trainers that appear before battle 31 in the super modes just out of curiosity. This information probably isn't overly useful for most of us but I figured I might as well share.

Here's the list of trainers that appear early on in the Maison, along with the teams they use.

Set 1 Trainers

These trainers always use Pokemon with IVs set to 19. I've separated the list with a line. Trainers above the line only appear during the first 10 battles. Trainers below the line can appear from battles 1-20.

Backpacker Erroll (1st set B)
Backpacker Seamus (1st set A)

Garcon Basim (1st set A)
Garcon Caleb (1st set B)

Hiker Abseil (1st set Rock, Ground, and Steel types)
Hiker Deck (1st set Rock, Ground, and Steel types)

Lady Aline (1st set B)
Lady Francoise (1st set A)

Lass Eva (1st set Normal and Fairy types)
Lass Lauren (1st set Normal and Fairy types)

Poke Fan (M) Antony (1st set B)
Poke Fan (M) Rhett (1st set A)

Poke Fan (F) Dierdre (1st set B)
Poke Fan (F) Ophelia (1st set A)

Preschooler (M) Cody (1st set B)
Preschooler (M) Preston (1st set A)

Preschooler (F) Ava (1st set B)
Preschooler (F) Madison (1st set A)

Rich Boy Auric (1st set A)
Rick Boy Kasper (1st set B)

Schoolboy Fritz (1st set B)
Schoolboy Schuyler (1st set A)

Schoolgirl Athena (1st set A)
Schoolgirl Kaya (1st set B)

Tourist (Old) Edirne (1st set B)
Tourist (Old) Marbella (1st set A)

Waitress Char (1st set B)
Waitress Tilapia (1st set A)

Youngster Nathan (1st set Normal and Bug types)
Youngster Pablo (1st set Normal and Bug types)

---------------------------------

Butler Elias (1st set A)
Butler Joshua (1st set B)
Butler Jude (1st set Mixed)

Chef Dariole (1st set Water, Fire, and Grass types)
Chef Florentine (1st set Water, Fire, and Grass types)
Chef Jus (1st set Water, Fire, and Grass types)

Fairy Tale Girl Aurore (1st set Normal, Psychic, and Fairy types)
Fairy Tale Girl Jeanette (1st set Normal, Psychic, and Fairy types)
Fairy Tale Girl Sylvia (1st set Normal, Psychic, and Fairy types)

Maid Beth (1st set B)
Maid Joelle (1st set Mixed)
Maid Paige (1st set A)

Punk Guy Oberon (1st set Poison and Dark types)
Punk Guy Pan (1st set Poison and Dark types)
Punk Guy Triton (1st set Poison and Dark types)

Punk Girl Ariel (1st set Poison and Dark types)
Punk Girl Rhea (1st set Poison and Dark types)
Punk Girl Titania (1st set Poison and Dark types)

Rising Star (M) Jamie (1st set B)

Rising Star (F) Tilde (1st set A)

Set 2 Trainers

These trainer always use Pokemon with IVs set to 23. They appear during battles 11-30.

Artist (M) Gray (2nd set A)
Artist (M) Jasper (2nd set B)
Artist (M) Rufous (2nd set Mixed)

Artist (F) Carmine (2nd set B)
Artist (F) Scarlet (2nd set Mixed)
Artist (F) Sienna (2nd set A)

Beauty Lucinda (2nd set Normal, Dark, and Fairy types)
Beauty Lucy (2nd set Normal, Dark, and Fairy types)

Rising Star (M) Giacomo (2nd set B)
Rising Star (M) Guillaume (2nd set A)

Rising Star (F) Carol (2nd set B)
Rising Star (F) Lena (2nd set A)

Roller Skater (M) Manuel (2nd set Electric and Flying types, Empoleon, Flygon, and Floatzel)
Roller Skater (M) Rory (2nd set Electric and Flying types, Empoleon, Flygon, and Floatzel)

Roller Skater (F) Cleo (2nd set Electric and Flying types, Empoleon, Flygon, and Floatzel)
Roller Skater (F) Sierra (2nd set Electric and Flying types, Empoleon, Flygon, and Floatzel)

Worker (Blue Hat) Arnau (2nd set Rock, Ground, and Steel types)
Worker (Blue Hat) Leo (2nd set Rock, Ground, and Steel types)

Worker (White Hat) Esteban (2nd set Rock, Ground, and Steel types)
Worker (White Hat) Jules (2nd set Rock, Ground, and Steel types)

Set 3 Trainers

These trainers always use Pokemon with IVs set to 27. They appear during battles 21-40

Beauty Apollo (3rd set Water and Ice types)

Chef Dylan (3rd set Water and Ice types)

Furisode Girl (Pink) Fleur (3rd set Eeveelutions)
Furisode Girl (Blue) Marilla (3rd set Eeveelutions)

Gardener Florian (3rd set Grass and Bug types)
Gardener Giorgi (3rd set Grass and Bug types)

Madame Elizabeth (3rd set B)
Madame Marie-Noelle (3rd set A)

Monsieur Frederik (3rd set A)
Monsieur Harris (3rd set B)

Pokemon Breeder (M) Ewert (3rd set B)
Pokemon Breeder (M) Jovann (3rd set A)

Pokemon Breeder (F) Noemie (3rd set B)
Pokemon Breeder (F) Zoe (3rd set A)

Tourist (M) Heathrow (3rd set A)
Tourist (M) O'Hare (3rd set B)
Tourist (M) Sydney (3rd set Mixed)

Tourist (F) Florence (3rd set Mixed)
Tourist (F) Odessa (3rd set A)
Tourist (F) Valencia (3rd set B)

General Notes

• Refer to R Inainmate's post to understand the As and Bs. Mixed means that they use Pokemon from both groups. I'm not sure if they can use literally all the Pokemon from those groups, but I don't think I've ever seen any of them use any 6th gen Pokemon, or any starters, so take that as you will.
• Many of the "specialised" trainers are similar to some of those seen in battles 41 and over (Chefs, Furisode Girls, Workers, etc.). However, there are some unique ones too, like the Gardeners, Fairy Tale Girls, Youngsters, and Lasses.
• The 1st set Punks are Dark/Poison specialists. They don't specialise in Fire like the 4th set ones do, and the only Fire-type you'll see them use is Houndoom.
• The 1st set Hikers don't specialise in Fighting-types like the 4th set ones. They are Rock/Ground/Steel, like the Workers.
• The 2nd set Roller Skaters are odd. Most of the time they use Electric/Flying as expected. However, I've also seen them use Empoleon, Flygon, and Floatzel occasionally, similar to how Chef Andrei uses a Meganium on his Hail team. Those are literally the only non-Electric/Flying types I've seen from them. I don't know why they use those ones in particular. I guess Flygon can be explained away with Levitate, and Empoleon 2 has some Flying moves in its moveset (Drill Peck and Featherdance). I have no explanation for Floatzel though.

So that's that. Hopefully I didn't miss anything.

 

[StarKO]

Great work, atsync. It's always interesting and useful to have more information.

I wonder why they didn't make those trainers keep appearing later on with maxed IVs. Would certainly make it more challenging/interesting to fight a greater variety of sets. It's close to 90% set 4 trainers after battle 40..

 

[Uphaze]

Hey, everyone! Do you know if Tyrantrum 4 is max speed or not? Because it can (18.8%) OHKO Clefable with Choice Band Head Smash and I just want to know if it is max speed. If it's not, I'll just put some EV's in Skarm and Roost spam him. Thanks so much :)

 

[StarKO]

Hey, everyone! Do you know if Tyrantrum 4 is max speed or not? Because it can (18.8%) OHKO Clefable with Choice Band Head Smash and I just want to know if it is max speed. If it's not, I'll just put some EV's in Skarm and Roost spam him. Thanks so much :)

It has 123 Speed (Adamant, 252 EV's)