Other OU Playstyle of the Week - Hyper Offense

[Jojobobo]

I love the idea of this thread, it's very constructive towards better battling. Anyway, here's some sets:

Aegislash @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SAtk
Quiet Nature
- King's Shield
- Shadow Ball
- Shadow Sneak
- Sacred Sword

This set thrives on the fact that Aegislash is a versatile pokemon, and so it's very easy for you to hide that you have WP on the right team (or at least, it's tricky for your opponent to assume that). Take a ground hit from the vast majority of EQ users and you'll survive it (usually after SR if it's unSTABed), and OHKO with Shadow Ball or at the very least 2HKO with Shadow Ball and Shadow Sneak.

From that initial KO, you can start to play risky. If you've judged that your opponent's the type to boost with their switch in expecting King's Shield, then attack with your boosts and go for the kill with Shadow Sneak. Either that or swap Aegislash out, allowing you to pivot later in the game or if you're lucky get a King's Shield on something that won't enjoy it.

The advantage of this set is you can even take out Aegislash's counters, which are common counters for many pokemon (Ground and Fire namely). Use this to punch a hole in your opponent's team that you can take advantage of. The EVs here are for best possible bulk whilst conserving the power of the ungoldy Shadow Ball, Sacred Sword allowing you to nail Blissey and Chansey switch ins for good damage. An SAtk focus allows you to not be so wary of burns, but don't be too haphazard if you're looking to do some serious damage.

Here's a more risky set, however I don't think it's stupid enough to fall into the camp of a gimmick:

Gothitelle @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 236 HP / 60 SAtk / 212 Spd
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psychic
- Future Sight
- Thunderbolt / Heal Bell / Taunt / Thunder Wave
- Trick

I've got three words (or you know, two with one hyphenated) for you: guaranteed set-up. Bring this in on a defensive pokemon (or if you even see a Deo-D it makes a strong case for a lead) then Trick, then Future Sight to scout its Choice locked move (knowing that the move will hit two turns later), then switch into something appropriate that isn't afraid of its move or whatever status it's offering, set up on the turn where the switch occurs (and bang, here comes Future Sight rack up residual damage - ranging from breaking that all important sash to a full OHKO, your switch in should be able to counter Dark types who feel impervious to these shenanigans), then attack.

Beyond that I've fiddled the EVs to counter offensive variants of Mega-Venusaur so long as no hazards are in play, and provide decent bulk for other revenge killing opportunities from full health (an Adamant Banded Talonflame cannot OHKO, even with SR on Gothitelle's side - and you can KO with Thunderbolt should you pick that variant). The speed is to outspeed invested positive natured 100s when you still have your Scarf, which I think is a reasonable benchmark without crapping out on bulk (a replay of this set in action, but this set has worked favourably for me in many other instances too: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-114719979).

In other words, this set is great.

 

[DaiGuren]

I love the idea of this thread, it's very constructive towards better battling. Anyway, here's some sets:

Aegislash @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SAtk
Quiet Nature
- King's Shield
- Shadow Ball
- Shadow Sneak
- Sacred Sword

This set thrives on the fact that Aegislash is a versatile pokemon, and so it's very easy for you to hide that you have WP on the right team (or at least, it's tricky for your opponent to assume that). Take a ground hit from the vast majority of EQ users and you'll survive it (usually after SR if it's unSTABed), and OHKO with Shadow Ball or at the very least 2HKO with Shadow Ball and Shadow Sneak.

From that initial KO, you can start to play risky. If you've judged that your opponent's the type to boost with their switch in expecting King's Shield, then attack with your boosts and go for the kill with Shadow Sneak. Either that or swap Aegislash out, allowing you to pivot later in the game or if you're lucky get a King's Shield on something that won't enjoy it.

The advantage of this set is you can even take out Aegislash's counters, which are common counters for many pokemon (Ground and Fire namely). Use this to punch a hole in your opponent's team that you can take advantage of. The EVs here are for best possible bulk whilst conserving the power of the ungoldy Shadow Ball, Sacred Sword allowing you to nail Blissey and Chansey switch ins for good damage. An SAtk focus allows you to not be so wary of burns, but don't be too haphazard if you're looking to do some serious damage.

Here's a more risky set, however I don't think it's stupid enough to fall into the camp of a gimmick:

Gothitelle @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 236 HP / 60 SAtk / 212 Spd
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psychic
- Future Sight
- Thunderbolt / Heal Bell / Taunt / Thunder Wave
- Trick

I've got three words (or you know, two with one hyphenated) for you: guaranteed set-up. Bring this in on a defensive pokemon (or if you even see a Deo-D it makes a strong case for a lead) then Trick, then Future Sight to scout its Choice locked move (knowing that the move will hit two turns later), then switch into something appropriate that isn't afraid of its move or whatever status it's offering, set up on the turn where the switch occurs (and bang, here comes Future Sight rack up residual damage - ranging from breaking that all important sash to a full OHKO, your switch in should be able to counter Dark types who feel impervious to these shenanigans), then attack.

Beyond that I've fiddled the EVs to counter offensive variants of Mega-Venusaur so long as no hazards are in play, and provide decent bulk for other revenge killing opportunities from full health (an Adamant Banded Talonflame cannot OHKO, even with SR on Gothitelle's side - and you can KO with Thunderbolt should you pick that variant). The speed is to outspeed invested positive natured 100s when you still have your Scarf, which I think is a reasonable benchmark without crapping out on bulk (a replay of this set in action, but this set has worked favourably for me in many other instances too: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-114719979).

In other words, this set is great.

Gothitelle is a massive momentum stopper after it has trapped and killed something, especially if it runs a choice set, so I don't think Gothitelle fits really well in HO teams.

 

[theV8man]

Azumarill @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 164 HP / 252 Atk / 92 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Play Rough
- Brick Break
- Aqua Jet

Why rely on speedy pokemon like Deoxys-S or Scarchomp when you have +6 priority? Once your HO team has smacked the opposing team for a good number of turns (and removed mega-saur and other problems), simply switch this guy in on something that can't touch it and it should be game. Sometimes, if I don't see any great counters on the opposing team, I simply switch it in right after deoxys-d dies! After all, what's more satisfying than wrecking a team with a psychotic bunny on steroids. I swear the computer shakes when something gets hit by +6 play rough...

This set can also function as a decent hit and run revenge killer, and a emergency wallbreaker. For example, once, a Slowbro was being a total pain as I had nothing that could break past it, so I simply belly drummed and smashed it with play rough.

 

[TaBuu]

#soulcrusher
name: Setup Sweeper
move 1: Play Rough
move 2: Sucker Punch
move 3: Knock Off / Iron head / Focus Punch
move 4: Swords Dance / Substitute
ability: Intimidate
item: Mawilite
evs: 132 HP / 252 Atk / 124 Spe
nature: Adamant
---------------------------------------
Since Mega Mawile takes up the Mega slot, it isn't necessarily the most accessible HO team member. However, should you decide to utilize Mega Mawile, you'll quickly be impressed by its ability to function on such teams.
Mega Mawile fits right at home with the HO style. Pressure and momentum is the name of the game for Mega Mawile and HO teams aim to do just that. With the whole concept of Double Switching, as Halcyon. mentioned, utilized effectively, Mega Mawile can break down countless walls and even neuter them with Knock Off. Sucker Punch in tandem with Swords Dance is a scary sight for many as even common Dark resist Pokémon such as Keldeo may struggle to answer appropriately should the residual damage from hazards build up. Mega Mawile has the versatility to run "tailor-sets" which is something any offensive team loves to have. All in all, HO teams should always consider Mega Mawile as a potential candidate for the team.

 

[theV8man]

Although there are a number of great pokemon that can be used, such as mega-pinsir and mawile, I think it's important to consider options that cover your teammates weaknesses. I'm specifically referring to the fact that the two most common pokemon on HO, bisharp and aegislash, are both weak to fire and ground. What are some examples of sweepers that don't mind moves of this type?

 

[NWL]

Although there are a number of great pokemon that can be used, such as mega-pinsir and mawile, I think it's important to consider options that cover your teammates weaknesses. I'm specifically referring to the fact that the two most common pokemon on HO, bisharp and aegislash, are both weak to fire and ground. What are some examples of sweepers that don't mind moves of this type?

DD Dragonite, Calm mind/Rock Polish Lando-I, LO Latios are some examples (though I am not too sure about Latios' status as a sweeper).

 

[acestriker19]

I find it kind of annoying that not many peopleare talking about what makes HO an effective playstyle in the current meta and how it has changed over time (we have enough sets!) so I'll start with what I believe to be the factors that have changed in the Meta to make HO way better than it was months ago.

Hyper Offense's rise

At the beggining of X and Y it seemed Hyper Offense was struggling. The primary reason being Mega-Kangaskhan whose sucker punch basically tore apart any purely offensive mon and whose checks / counters were more defensive in nature, another factor was the popularity of priority and Aegislash, primarily Stance-Dance (Stance-Dance is actually a very good Aegislash set against HO teams as Aegislash is bulky enough to find time to set up and can sweep pretty well against frail teams with Shadow Sneak). Genesect was also a pain for HO as its scarf set could revenge kill most anything a HO team could throw at it and made balance / offensive volt-turn the one of (if not) the best playstyle at the time. The metagame was more bulky offensive and balanced because of this.

Deoxys-Defense free from being forced to face Genesect leads over and over again was able to spike-stack teams way easier and defiant Bisharp / Thundurus was added to punish defoggers, this is the combo is at the core of the HO playstyle. When Mega-Lucario was banned one of the best checks to Bisharp was lost so the core of Deo-D and Bisharp needed even less support (also Mega-Lucario's priority smashed HO pretty bad too). With the banning of coincidentally some of the best counters to HO it began to thrive as the offensive core of Deo-D and Bisharp (plus Balloon Aegislash) was all the support HO needed to ensure that teams got worn down. This meant HO could pack a very versatile 3 mons allowing it to be an unpredictable team build in the current meta while still being the most effective it could be. This is the rise of HO as but this all kinda theorymon anyways.

Other Stuff I could say...

One thing that is very noticable about current HO is the idea of Immunities > Resistances. On a typical HO team there are usually 2-3 ground immunities (Balloon Aegislash / Landorous / Thundurus / Talonflame / Zard-X pre-mega) one fighting immunity (Aegislash) a Psychic Immunity (Bisharp / Greninja) and an Electric Immunity (Landorous / Excadrill). It might be pretty obvious but the goal with so many immunities is not only to gain easy switch-ins and prevent residual on offensive mons but to play mindgames and to force switches on the opponent. When facing a HO team the opposing player cannot afford to give away free turns which can happen very easily by using immunities, and by packing so many immunites (also lots of HO mons have great defensive typings) HO can more easily force switches on the opposing team which allows it to wear them down more easily. HO teams are also not very good at dealing with Scarfers in the current meta without these immunities especially the ground immunities as the majority of Scarfers in the Current Metagame are Ground Type.

 

[mido_128]

Obviously not in possession of 'Heavy Offense' itself but a useful, underused Heavy Offense supporter -

Whimsicott @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
Evs: 252 HP / 136 Def / 120 Sdef
Bold Nature
- Taunt
- Encore
- Moonblast
- Memento

The idea is to use Whimsicott to foil with opposition setup while enabling your own. Switch in on a predicted setup move and generally encore them. From there you have three options: Switch to a counter, fire off a free (and weak) moonblast or memento to give one of your mons free setup. The given Ev's give a free defense point while providing overall balanced defenses. She can be hard to fit on your average HO team but give her a go as she usually proves useful. That pranskter encore and memento really make this mon and can/has easily setup many a win condition (BD Azumarill, DD CharX, SD Talonflame, Bisharp, Mega Mawile etc) while screwing with opposing setup.

 

[LightningLuxray]

Here's one of my favorite 'mon to use on Hyper Offense :)

Keldeo @ Choice Specs
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
Timid Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Secret Sword
- Scald
- Hidden Power [Flying]

Choice Specs Keldeo is easily one of the best wallbreakers for Hyper Offense. Thanks to its massive 129 Special Attack stat, Keldeo has no problem blasting through common walls on stall such as Ferrothorn, Heatran, Hippowdon, and Chansey. It also has a great 108 Speed stat, which easily helps it outspeed and OHKO Pokemon on more offensive teams, such as Bisharp, Air Balloon Excadrill, and Kyurem-B. Hydro Pump and Secret Sword are obvious STAB attacks, with Secret Sword having the great effect of hitting the opponent's defense. This allows Keldeo to easily break through would-be counters, like Chansey, with Secret Sword. Scald is another great move for Specs Keldeo, as it allows it to possibly burn counters such as Azumarill, wearing them down and making them much less effective overall. Finally, HP Flying is super helpful against Mega Venusar, as it can 2HKO physically defensive variants after Stealth Rock! Some of Keldeo's favorite partners include Deoxys-Defense and Pursuit Bisharp; the former gives Keldeo hazard support, allowing it to wallbreaker easier, while the latter can come in on Defog Lati@s and Pursuit trap them, hopefully allowing Keldeo to more easily do massive damage against the opponent.

Overall, Keldeo is a great speedy wallbreaker that fits perfectly on Hyper Offensive teams.

 

[DaiGuren]

Sooo, idk if this is okay to ask, but in an HO team, you usually have suicide lead, a defog-blocker, a spin-blocker and then three other offensive pokemon, consisting of wallbreakers, sweepers, and revenge killers.

Now, my question is, is there a magic number on how many of those mon should you run? For example, running 3 wallbreakers will leave you vulnerable to faster threats, while running 3 sweepers can get you easily walled by a certain mon. I know I'm categorizing these offensive mons quite inefficiently as a pokemon can have multiple roles. I guess what I'm trying to ask is that, what goes in your thought processes when deciding the last three filler pokemon for your HO team?

 

[DiscoPine]

This is one of my favorites to put on HO teams because of his ability to just destroy stall teams.

Crawdaunt @ Choice Band
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Crabhammer
- Knock Off
- Superpower
- Aqua Jet

 

[Shurtugal]

Is the purpose of this thread to a.) discuss HO or b.) offer HO sets?

Not much needs to be said about it really . . . I'll just add an offensive 'mon, one that has pretty much been forgotten by most players . . .

Starmie @ Life Orb
Trait: Analytic
Nature: Timid
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Psyshock
- Rapid Spin

Starmie is one of those Pokemon you don't see around anymore: possibly because Aegislash does a pretty good job of SpinBlocking it; however, with that said, Starmie is still a great Pokemon.

Analytic-boosted Hydro Pumps 2HKO Aegislash, so it either has to Shadow Sneak to prevent you from scoring the 2HKO, or switch out -- you see, it can't switch in twice, at least not safely, so Starmie isn't too bad against Aegislash either. That said, Pursuit Bisharp makes a great partner. Early elimination of Aegislash makes Rapid Spinning such an easy task. Starmie's amazing speed tier allows it to fare well against HO teams, since it outruns Keldeo, Lati@s, and Thundurus, which are some of the biggest threats out there. Of course, it's Psyshock allows it to do 80%+ to Venu and Conk, allowing you to score the KO after some chip damage from hazards or stray VoltTurns.

Starmie is a pretty underrated threat, and while Rain can no longer pump up Hydro Pump's power like it used to, Starmie is still a force to be reckoned with. While Defog has been introduced, fast HO teams don't really have room for the majority of those users (which means you either use balanced with a bulky Defog user, or you use Lati@s, and even they are kind of a hinderance due to the dragon nerf, increase in specially defensive mons, especially with Assault Vest, and the upsurge of Dark-type moves and Pokemon, which makes Defog a bit more slanted in Stall / Balanced's favor then Heavy Offenses'). That said, Excadrill . . . and Starmie, and pretty much the only Spinners left unless you'd use a worse version of Excadrill: Donphan.

Anyway, for HO, Rapid Spin is still much more reliable than Defog. On top of being decently powered and having fast speeds, priority taunts and such can't prevent the Spin. Gengar is pretty much rarely used at all, and even then you outspeed that thing, so the only Pokemon spinblocking you it is (a rather common Pokemon, I admit) Aegislash.

That said, with Hydro Pumps doing 67%+, and Bisharp getting Pursuit, and Aegislash being rather slow, it isn't too much of a hinderance as most players would suspect.

A great core (one I have been using) has been Superpower DeoD + Pursuit Bisharp + LO Starmie, as they make a perfect HO core -- with Bisharp and Aegislash removed, Starmie is free to either a.) go on a suicide rampage and bring down as many Pokemon as possible or b.) spin at its heart's content.

Either way, Starmie is a Pokemon that needs more love, and there is a place for it on HO!

 

[Subject 18]

Shurtugal, the main idea for this thread is to discuss HO as a whole. How its played, proper builds, synergy, applying pressure, how it fares against other playstyles and what pokemon work on HO.

I'll post later about some of the sets that have been posted and address a few things I saw mentioned. Remember, we want don't want to solely just posts sets but make sure to address some of the questions that I mentioned in the OP. For reference the questions were:

What kind of support if needed for the sweepers? What about offensive synergy? And defensive? Do I need entry hazards? What can I do against Magic Bounce? Rapid Spinners? Defog users? Which Pokemon should you be using? And which one shouldn't you be using? What threatens HO? How do you handle stall? Balance? Other Hyper Offense?

For example, Halcyon. and iHop brought up double switching as a way make up for the lack of a true defensive backbone. This works really well in order to put yourself in a position where you can easily setup and sweep while putting your opponent on the defensive to prevent them from dealing damage or not clearly hazards.

These are the posts that I would like more of going forward.

 

[Rhaegar]

Something I feel is overlooked on HO which I've found to be very effective.
Hyper Offense needs a strong check to opposing offensive pokemon that could potentially sweep the lot of fragile pokemon. I find Mega Manectric to check the greatest number of offensive threats to HO aside from being a super fast coverage attacker cum scouter.

Manectric @ Manectite
Ability: Lightningrod
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 SDef
Timid Nature
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Flamethrower

Why it is good on HO particularly as a replacement to Thundurus (especially on DeoSharp teams which use Bisharp as the defog punisher):

• Outspeeds every member of the S and A tiers along with Intimidate which cripples priority.
• Better counter to the Bird Spammers. Takes less damage from Brave Bird/Quick Attack on account of Intimidate, outspeeds Talonflame's Flare Blitz. Not to mention Volt Switch not only OHKOes but scouts in the event of a switch.
• Better counter to Mega Scizor. Takes less from Bullet Punch and OHKOes rather than Thundurus' 2HKO.
• Outspeeds and OHKOes Greninja.
• Can switch in to DDing Mega Gyarados, Intimidate it, and outspeed it at +1 (assuming Gyarados is Adamant, which it generally is).
• Can be paired with Greninja to provide super speedy hard-hitting VoltTurn with excellent special coverage.
• Unlinke Thundurus, does not carry Life Orb. Life Orb Thundurus tends to dish out a lot of predicted hits, and though this wears down the opponent (apart from those wasted HP Ices), it wears Thundurus down as well. Just a few attacks and it can be KOed by Talonflame's Brave Bird. The Leftovers set doesn't hit hard enough for HO without Nasty Plot, which gets revenge killed by Greninja and Talonflame.

Of course Thundurus deserves it's S tier with unpredictable sets, prankster, and ability to run Superpower and Knock Off, but I personally find Megaman to be a better candidate on HO with it's superior check list.

 

[I AM THE JAMAICAN BOBSLED TEAM]

imo the only wallbreaker that should ever be on HO is Landorus-I. It's all you'll ever need, as after knock off+hazard damage focus blast OHKOes chansey. Proof?

4 Atk Life Orb Landorus Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 147-173 (20.8 - 24.5%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Stealth Rock and 2 layers of Spikes (the hazards are realistic, as deo-d generally survives whatever stall throws at it and can taunt its defogger)


Now our chansey is at 54~ health, and a focus blast does this:

252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Chansey: 387-458 (54.9 - 65%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Now that chansey is gone, there are literally no roadblocks for Landorus-I to break the rest of the stall team, or break the walls further.

 

[passion]

ur welcome for postin

Latios (M) @ Life Orb

Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Defog
- Memento
- Thunderbolt / Psyshock

K, hi this is my 100 post aftr wastin a year on this website so kkkkkkkk Imma actually talk about this shit now. Okay not even gonna lie I havent tested Memento Latios yet but I guess it seems p cool lol. Before brief explanation on Memento I guess I should mention the rest if standard Latios Defog to rid you of annoying as hazards and coverage/draco, if for some reason your team depends on Latios to live forever this will not fit on your team. Okay so I guess Memento is pretty obvious on Hyper Offense when you are about to die just Memento and go to a set up sweeper and hurt shit and/or sweep. Some p good partners for this nig include BD Azu, Mega Mawile, ZardX, Mega DD Ttar, Mega DD Gyarados, Bulk Up/SD Tflame, and pretty much any set up sweeper that isnt ass/does not fit on the team.​

 

[KlefkiHolder]

Well... I guess since we're all just talking about staples and other threats, I might as well say a huge omission to this thread so far.

Kyurem B @ Life Orb
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd / 4 Atk
Naive Nature
- Dragon Claw/Outrage
- Fusion Bolt
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power​

This thing runs a few different sets you might see on Hyper Offense, but I'm going to focus solely on the Life Orb set. This thing just destroys so many things and has a perfect spot in Hyper Offense. It takes down physically defensive threats, specially defensive threats, and an absolutely amazing plethora of other offensive threats. His insane power comes not only from his inflated stats, but also from his incredible coverage. It is an amazing stallbreaker and just breaker overall. The combination of BoltBeam + a Mold Breaker Earth Power along with his amazing 170/120 attacking stats, okay speed, and a Life Orb absolutely rocks most of the meta right now, with Dragon Physical STAB being there for things like Chansey. Now, it does require some hazard support defensively, usually from something like Excadrill, but its respectable bulk allows it to take some crucial hits, like a Bisharp Sucker Punch or Talonflame Brave Bird late game. This thing has a huge role in Hyper Offense, and it does not look like that is changing any time soon.

 

[Knight of Cydonia]

The key to HO for me is assessing what you need to win and then from that knowing when to sac your pokemon. The best HO players know which pokemon are needed for the win and which ones can be used as death fodder or left in to take the super effective hit etc. Since you don't have defensive pokemon to take hits you can only rely on resists/immunities to switch to which brings a lot of risk into switching. For example it might be tempting to save your 90% Keldeo, but before switching out you have to consider the risks of getting predicted and the actual importance of Keldeo for your win.

I think this is a problem a lot of balanced players have when they try HO, they are not used to having no defensive switch ins and try and save pokemon unnecessarily. You can watch good hyper offense players and it may seem strange when they sac a near full health pokemon but this will be because it is the safest/best play. Basically don't be scared to sac your pokemon if you don't need it.

 

[Starfall11]

Yes, yes, and more yes to Knight of Cydonia's post. HO is about sacrifice and utilizing the pokemon which will give your opponent's team a difficult time. I think an underrated and important aspect of HO that no one is talking about are lures.

Lures can dramatically put HO at an advantage with the amount of Momentum it creates. HP Flying Keldeo is one of many lures that works effectively on HO.

The question I had for other fellow HO users is how to utilize Deoxys-D effectively? I run SR, Spikes, Thunder Wave, and Taunt with Red Card. But I often have trouble setting up more than SR. It seems that people can just Defog them away. I'm not finding that Defiant Thundurus is putting in enough work after a Defog Boost. Maybe I should try harder to prevent my opponent from defogging by double switching?

I just want to know if it's generally best to lead with Deoxys-D and set up if your opponent has hazard removal. Or is it smarter to wait until an opportune time later? Thanks guys,

 

[Sweep]

I play rain a lot, and while it isn't godly & is very reliant on match-ups, it can still be extremely effective in this metagame...especially against opposing HO.

Helix God (Omastar) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 Def
Modest Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Surf / Scald
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power Flying / Hidden Power Psychic

Shell Smash Omastar isn't too rare, but I don't like it much since Omastar struggles to find opportunities to set up with its 4 common weaknesses. Instead, I use Specs Omastar to terrorize both Hyper Offense and Balanced teams alike with its ridiculously powerful attacks under rain. To illustrate just how brutally powerful this thing is, Chansey can't check Omastar at all after a few hazards OR a small amount of prior damage. Omastar also cruises around at 418 speed, enough to outrun anything that isn't a Choice Scarf user or Deoxys-S (both of which are dealt with just fine by a faster Swift Swimmer). Hydro Pump is the main STAB of choice and after a boost from Rain, STAB, and Choice Specs it can quick devastate the opponent (calcs below). Double STAB is needed for reliability mid to late game and while I prefer Surf, Scald still hits like a truck and can cripple specially defensive Ferrothorn. Ice Beam murders Dragonite and Grass types while either Hidden Power works to 2HKO Mega Venusaur after Stealth Rock; HP Psychic also beats up Toxicroak if your opponent uses it for some reason. Earth Power sucks against anything not named Tentacruel, don't use it. Steel types take more from Water STAB moves in the rain anyway. Watch out for random shit like Jellicent or Gastrodon I guess, though they are rare enough in this metagame and easy enough to break with team support (Ludicolo?) so that I wouldn't worry about it. This also wrecks birdspam teams (rip Talonflame). Use this.

Hide

252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hydro Pump vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Garchomp in Rain: 424-501 (118.4 - 139.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hydro Pump vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Pinsir in Rain: 444-523 (163.2 - 192.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Rotom-W in Rain: 191-225 (62.8 - 74%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Keldeo in Rain: 221-261 (68.4 - 80.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hydro Pump vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Rain: 207-244 (32.2 - 38%) -- 95.8% chance to 3HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Ferrothorn in Rain: 179-211 (50.8 - 59.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hidden Power Flying vs. 252 HP / 68 SpD Mega Venusaur: 160-190 (43.9 - 52.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Tornadus-Therian (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 Atk
Hasty Nature
- Focus Blast
- Hurricane
- Knock Off
- Taunt

Tornadus-T terrorizes the Stall teams that can frustrate rain HO teams otherwise. Tornadus does not have great power by OU standards at all, so do not expect it to break walls by itself. However, the combination of Knock Off to get rid of Leftovers/Eviolite, Taunt to stop recovery, and reasonably strong Hurricanes (100% accurate in rain) will do a number on Stall teams so long you take advantage of Regenerator. Focus Blast misses but is necessary to hit stuff like Ferrothorn, Tyranitar and Excadrill (I don't like Superpower because Ferrothorn tend to be physically defensive in this metagame and Rocky Helmet recoil sucks). Its high 121 base Speed ensure that it can outrun and smack stuff like Latios and Keldeo, who aggravate rain otherwise. It also allows Tornadus to function outside of rain, something that Swift Swim sweepers struggle to do. Basically, Tornadus attempts to help rain deal with Stall teams while matching up reasonably well vs. other team archetypes.

Edit @ below, thanks, should have calced hydro! A shame Omastar doesn't get better coverage moves, Earth Power sucks in this metagame.

 

[CPU]

I'd just like to point out that a Rain-booted Hydro Pump does more to Mega Venusaur than a super-effective Hidden Power.

252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 68 SpD Mega Venusaur in Rain: 164-193 (45 - 53%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hidden Power Flying vs. 252 HP / 68 SpD Mega Venusaur: 160-190 (43.9 - 52.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Hidden Power does have the bonuses of not being reliant on Rain and being perfectly accurate, though.

 

[DuskSoul]

This tread has inspired me to try an HO team, since I'm completely new to this particular play style I'm not sure if I should run a Deo-S or Deo-D for my hazard setter/lead.

 

[I AM THE JAMAICAN BOBSLED TEAM]

use a deo-d for hazards and deo-s for screens
you can only choose one tho

 

[Shurtugal]

Deo-S can use hazards as well. Deo-S can also be a LO attacker (3 attack + SR) since it forces out a lot of threats.

The user could choose either.

 

[doughboy]

Instead of just talking about a specific Pokemon that fits on HO, I think it's more valuable to talk about the style as a whole. One of the key elements to playing successfully with HO is double switches. Watch some of the best offensive players like CTC, Tox, etc., and you'll find that they will make lots of double switches to give themselves advantageous match ups. People often complain about how HO has no backbone and can't function because of a lack of defensive synergy, but double switching takes that out of the equation. Of course, sometimes this boils down to getting a 50/50 right, but especially against stall teams, people will feel very pressured against HO to switch to their best counter. When combined with hazard damage, this can make things a lot easier when fighting defensive teams that you can't necessarily break without it (think breaking Quagsire for a Charizard).

Another key element of playing HO is knowing when to sacrifice certain Pokemon. Oftentimes, newer players are reluctant to see one of their Pokemon go down, but sacrificing a Pokemon is another way to keep switch initiative and momentum. To identify what to sack, ask yourself in the current situation "what Pokemon is the least helpful on my team?" and "what Pokemon is my win condition?" The latter question is just as important as the former question because all of your Pokemon could be equally useful, but depending on which way gives you the best chance of winning, one or the other Pokemon might not be necessary. In addition, offensive teams should build around planning to sack a certain Pokemon. The revenge kill of one Pokemon can act as the set up opportunity for a secondary sweeper. An example of this concept is pairing a Pokemon weak to Pursuit, such as Latios, with a sweeper that reists dark or sets up easily on most Pursuit trappers; such as Mega-Gyrarados, Mega-Mawile, Bisharp, Azumarill, or Calm Mind Keldeo. A more abstract example is pairing an Electric-type, Ground-type sweeper, or Lum Berry Pokemon such as with a Pokemon that often has their sweep cut short by Thundurus-I's priority Thunder Wave and attacking moves. In this case, that would be CM Raikou with Mega-Pinsir. Sacking, double switches, and pivot moves such as U-turn are key to playing hyper offense potently because without a defensive presence you won't be able to respond to an opponents threats easily, especially with frail sweepers.