OU Roserade

[Martin]

Roserade is so horribly outclassed as a choice scarf user that I don't think it warrants a set at all. It is setup bait for a ridiculously long list of Pokemon (think Mega Charizard X, Mega Pinsir, Talonflame, Dragonite, etc.) and lacks the attributes that make other Pokemon usable with a Choice Scarf (e.g. the ability to revenge kill +1 boosted threats and good STAB coverage). If I were looking for a good revenge killer or cleaner on a team, I'd prefer to go for something like CS Garchomp or a Pokemon with strong priority); Roserade is just a poor option.

While also not QC, I am going to have to agree with these points. The fact of the matter is that Scarf Roserade is outclasses as a scarfer by most fast offensive pokemon due to better offensive typing, stats, abilities or a combination of multiple of those factors. The only reason I see to run Roserade over another pokemon is for emergency spikes/sleep powder, and even then they aren't great moves to be locked into tbh. Keldeo makes a better scarfer with its better offensive typing and regular Venusaur makes a better fast, specially-offensive Grass-/Poison-type due to Chlorophyll and overall better bulk at the cost of Spikes, wheras Mega Venusaur is a better bulky-offensive Grass-/Poison-type due to its immense bulk (seriously it eats up all of the attacks). Similarly to what Altar said, it struggles to revenge kill in the same way that other scarfers, such as Heracross and Garchomp, can due to its poor STAB coverage leaving it completely walled by the likes of Scizor and Ferrothorn, effectively forcing you to run HP Fire which leaves you walled by Heatran, and being forced out and set up on by the likes of Talonflame - among the top 5-10 most used pokemon in OU - is the final nail in the coffin. While you may think that the aformentioned Heracross is left with the same problem, you soon realise that it can afford to run Stone Edge for coverage, enabling you to hit Talonflame on the switch, and if you take anything out you can get a moxie boost and proceed to sweep. Roserade is a mediocre scarfer at best, and it shouldn't get a set.

 

[Jaroda]

Relatively compared to other scarf users I agree, Roserade is inferior. But the reasons you would pick Roserade depends on what the rest of your team can handle and has trouble with. Roserade's typing and offensive options can help it fill in several gaps your team might need at once. Trust me, a fast Sleep Powder can save your ass if you don't happen to have a usable offensive move, but again Roserade doesn't have coverage issue because Technician Hidden Power can cover any threat you want. Roserade is no more setup bait then a scarf Excadrill locked into Rapid Spin or having Dragonite, Talonflame, etc. switching into a choice locked Earthquake. This is the risk all scarfers have and incidentally Roserade is LESS safe to switch into because of Sleep Powder, unless it's Lum Berry Dragonite. And unless you see the team with a Grass type or Overcoat Mandibuzz then Sleep Powder is a safe move if prediction is an issue. And again, if you're running a HO team with lots of physical attackers than Roserade makes a great pokemon to switch into Scald and again handles many things that can be troubling for HO teams. Leaf Storm for Hippowdon, Rotom-W, Azumarill, Slowbro, Suicune, etc. Hidden Power Fire ruins all Steel types and Ferrothorn. And just put SpD Heatran to sleep. Roserade is also good against Deoxys-D and Smeargle leads because its immune to Spore and can even if Deoxys uses Magic Coat Sleep Powder can't put yourself to sleep so at worst you waste a few turns and you switch to something or you outspeed and put him to sleep before he can set up any hazards at all.

Again, you have to look at Roserade in terms of filling in gaps for your team. Roserade should be one of the last pokemon you add. If nothing else it works really well with Charizard X as Grass/Poison STABs are exactly what Char X wants for getting past Water and Fairy types.

Where Roserade IS lacking is its poor defense, as outside of walls with weak special moves or status attacks it can't switch into much. but again that's similar to many scarf users.

 

[Srn]

Roserade is no more setup bait then a scarf Excadrill locked into Rapid Spin or having Dragonite, Talonflame, etc. switching into a choice locked Earthquake.

That's not true at all. First off, scarf exca runs mold breaker, and its main attacking move is eq, so in conjunction with its ability, there actually are not a lot of great switch-ins. Some thundurus don't even carry focus blast. But more importantly, I think we can agree that Leaf Storm is more or less the main attack of use on a scarf set. Roserade really has to play hit-and-run with that because its main STAB move is not consistent. That's a huge difference between leaf storm and eq. Not to mention Leaf Storm has a buttload more switch ins than a mold breaker eq does.

Almost everything else you mention can be done better by offensive mega venu, which actually has bulk in exchange for some speed, of which roserade doesn't have much without a scarf regardless.
I'd sooner use amoong to pair with char-x, atleast its spore is more accurate :/ as far as an offensive grass type goes though, roserade is up there, which is what the first set does anyway.

 

[Jaroda]

That's not true at all. First off, scarf exca runs mold breaker, and its main attacking move is eq, so in conjunction with its ability, there actually are not a lot of great switch-ins.

Skarmory, Gliscor, Landorus, Landorus-T, Gyarados, Balloon Aegeslash, Thundurus, Ferrothorn, Balloon Heatran, Mandibuzz, etc. There are plenty of pokemon that can switch into a choice locked Rapid Spin or Earthquake with impunity, and don't particularly mind a predicted Rock Slide. I'm not saying Roserade is a better scarfer than Excadrill, but you aren't making the same critiques of both regarding how scarf sets function.

And no, I'd argue Sludge Bomb to be a more consistent STAB move, but regardless Roserade is a hit-n-run type, that's the point. And even if Sleep Powder misses on the switch with Scarf you'll at least have two shots at landing it more often than not. You're arguing agaisnt Roserade in general terms, when I'm strictly advocating the kinds of opponents you'd want Roserade for. It does have a niche with it's typing, moves and ability and its positive match ups so unless you plan to take advantage of those than why would you pick Roserade in the first place? There's no point in saying that Roserade isn't the best general scarfer (that's arguably Garchomp), but it is particularly effective when all niche criteria for picking it are met.

 

[GatoDelFuego]

This thing is up in the air but I want it off the GP queue. At that point it will be at least ready to go.

Srn9130

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Overview
########

With colorful flowers for hands, a heroic cape, and some really weird hair, Roserade plays a unique role in the OU tier as an offensive Spiker. Access to Spikes and Toxic Spikes along with a solid base 125 Special Attack stat allows Roserade to play this role effectively. Its ability, Technician, effectively gives it access to a Hidden Power special move of any type with a solid 90 Base Power. Thanks to new breeding mechanics, the previously illegal combination of Sleep Powder and Spikes is now legal, letting Roserade shut down a Pokemon while stacking Spikes. Roserade can sponge a special hit or two as well thanks to its decent base 105 Special Defense and Grass / Poison typing, which offers handy resistances to Water-, Fighting-, Electric-, Grass-, and Fairy-type moves.

However, there are several flaws that prevent Roserade from becoming OU's premier entry hazard setter. Base 90 Speed is lackluster for an offensive Pokemon, and it prevents Roserade from beating several threats such as Landorus-T and Manaphy. Roserade is also weak to some very common attacking types in the current OU metagame, such as Ice, Fire, and Flying. This issue is further worsened by its pitiful base 60 HP and base 65 Defense, which leaves it unable to stomach almost any physical STAB move. Roserade also faces plenty of competition for the role of laying hazards from Pokemon such as Deoxys-D, Deoxys-S, and Klefki. Despite these flaws, Roserade's offensive presence, access to Sleep Powder, and ability to stack Spikes make it a great pick for offensive teams.

Offensive Spikes
########

name: Offensive Spikes
move 1: Spikes
move 2: Sleep Powder
move 3: Leaf Storm
move 4: Hidden Power Fire
ability: Technician
item: Life Orb
evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
ivs: 29 HP
nature: Timid

Moves
========

Spikes is one of the main reasons Roserade is used, racking up residual damage and punishing any switch-ins. Sleep Powder is used to incapacitate a Pokemon for a majority of the match and can be very useful in shutting down Pokemon that are difficult for your team to break or handle. Leaf Storm is the strongest move in Roserade's arsenal, doing big damage to any Pokemon that doesn't resist it. Hidden Power Fire nails Pokemon looking to absorb the Sleep Powder or try and take the Leaf Storm. Sludge Bomb is an option over Hidden Power Fire, as it can 2HKO Mandibuzz and Mega Venusaur, both of which are common switch-ins to absorb Sleep Powder. However, the loss in coverage generally isn't worth it. Giga Drain is a more consistent option over Leaf Storm, but the loss in power is very noticeable and Roserade is too frail to sick around long.

Set Details
========

Maximum investment in Speed and Special Attack with a Life Orb helps get down Spikes as fast as possible while giving Roserade the power needed to hit switch-ins hard. Technician's boost to Hidden Power Fire is invaluable, and should always be used over Natural Cure. Without it, Roserade doesn't OHKO Mega Scizor, Skarmory, Mega Mawile, Lucario, Bisharp, Excadrill, Ferrothorn, and Mega Pinsir or 2HKO Aegislash after Stealth Rock. 29 HP IVs are used to minimize Life Orb recoil. Note that the number of HP IVs does not affect the type of Hidden Power.

Usage Tips
========

The first objective when using Roserade is to cripple a Pokemon by putting it to sleep. If there is a Pokemon on the opponent's team that can absorb Sleep Powder, Roserade is better off setting Spikes or trying to nail the switch-in with powerful attacks. Roserade is a powerful but rather frail Pokemon that shouldn't be sacrificed early on, so only set Spikes on predicted switches. It should be switched in only on resisted special hits, as it is frail otherwise. Leaf Storm should always be Roserade's main attacking option, and Hidden Power Fire should handle most Pokemon attempting to cushion the Leaf Storm such as?.

Team Options
========

Roserade's best teammates will generally be offensive threats that offer good synergy and appreciate the residual damage from Spikes. Talonflame is one of these, and Roserade can beat Rotom-W for it. Keldeo applies much more pressure on its checks with the extra entry hazards. Rotom-W checks the Fire-type Pokemon that switch in on Roserade and grabs momentum with Volt Switch. A Defiant or Competitive user, like such as Bisharp, Thundurus, or Milotic, can switch in on a Defog attempt to remove Spikes and punish the opposing team with powerful boosted attacks. Heatran is a more defensive teammates, (RC) that can set up Stealth Rock on Talonflame and damage Grass-types with Lava Plume, while Roserade can set up Spikes on bulky Water-type Pokemon. Skarmory can take on several Pokemon that threaten Roserade, such as Mega Pinsir and Mamoswine, but be sure not to Defog away your own hazards.

Other Options
########

A defensive Spikes-stacking set is an option, but this is mostly outclassed by Chesnaught, as Roserade does not have great bulk and loses to several users of Defog. Shadow Ball can offer powerful neutral coverage and hit Aegislash, but Aegislash is already hit harder by Hidden Power Fire and Shadow Ball leaves Roserade helpless against some Steel-type Pokemon, most notably Bisharp. Roserade can use Aromatherapy or even run a SubSeed set, but it is largely outclassed in these roles by . A 'double Powder' set can be used to catch switch-ins off-guard, but the loss of offensive coverage isn't worth it. A Choice Scarf set can revenge kill Pokemon such as Greninja, Manaphy, and Mega Gyarados, but it is outclassed by Garchomp and Excadrill. Roserade also has access to Rain Dance and Sunny Day, but due to its general frailty, it isn't the best choice for a weather setter. Hidden Power Rock can be used to catch the usual Fire-type and some Dragon-type switch-ins off guard, but the loss in coverage generally isn't worth it.

Checks & Counters
########

**Fire-types**: Strong Fire-type Pokemon, like Heatran, Talonflame, and the Mega Charizard formes, (AC) have little trouble switching in and roasting Roserade with powerful attacks, although the latter two must be wary of Sludge Bomb or Hidden Power Rock.

**Strong Physical Attackers**: Roserade's Defense is very low, so physical attackers such as Dragonite, Excadrill, and Garchomp can easily 2HKO Roserade with almost any move.

**Special Walls and Assault Vest Users**: Roserade cannot hope to dent special walls such as Chansey or Heatran, and Assault Vest users like Goodra and Conkeldurr can handle Roserade's attacks as well. Assault Vest Excadrill can also remove Spikes that Roserade sets with Rapid Spin.

**Dragon-types**: Dragon-types that resist Grass-, such as Latias, Latios, Dragonite, Kyurem-B, Goodra, and Mega Charizard X, (AC) remember to close these asides that you set with a final comma can generally do a good job against Roserade, although they must be wary of a powerful Sludge Bomb.

**Powder-Immune Pokemon**: Mega Venusaur and Mandibuzz can absorb a Sleep Powder and sponge any other attacks Roserade can use, but both must watch out for Sludge Bomb, which can 2HKO them.

2/2

 

[Srn]

This thing is up in the air but I want it off the GP queue. At that point it will be at least ready to go.

Srn9130

REMOVE CHANGE COMMENTS

Hide

Overview
########

With colorful flowers for hands, a heroic cape, and some really weird hair, Roserade plays a unique role in the OU tier as an offensive Spiker. Access to Spikes and Toxic Spikes along with a solid base 125 Special Attack stat allows Roserade to play this role effectively. Its ability, Technician, effectively gives it access to a Hidden Power special move of any type with a solid 90 Base Power. Thanks to new breeding mechanics, the previously illegal combination of Sleep Powder and Spikes is now legal, letting Roserade shut down a Pokemon while stacking Spikes. Roserade can sponge a special hit or two as well thanks to its decent base 105 Special Defense and Grass / Poison typing, which offers handy resistances to Water-, Fighting-, Electric-, Grass-, and Fairy-type moves.

However, there are several flaws that prevent Roserade from becoming OU's premier entry hazard setter. Base 90 Speed is lackluster for an offensive Pokemon, and it prevents Roserade from beating several threats such as Landorus-T and Manaphy. Roserade is also weak to some very common attacking types in the current OU metagame, such as Ice, Fire, and Flying. This issue is further worsened by its pitiful base 60 HP and base 65 Defense, which leaves it unable to stomach almost any physical STAB move. Roserade also faces plenty of competition for the role of laying hazards from Pokemon such as Deoxys-D, Deoxys-S, and Klefki. Despite these flaws, Roserade's offensive presence, access to Sleep Powder, and ability to stack Spikes make it a great pick for offensive teams.

Offensive Spikes
########

name: Offensive Spikes
move 1: Spikes
move 2: Sleep Powder
move 3: Leaf Storm
move 4: Hidden Power Fire
ability: Technician
item: Life Orb
evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
ivs: 29 HP
nature: Timid

Moves
========

Spikes is one of the main reasons Roserade is used, racking up residual damage and punishing any switch-ins. Sleep Powder is used to incapacitate a Pokemon for a majority of the match and can be very useful in shutting down Pokemon that are difficult for your team to break or handle. Leaf Storm is the strongest move in Roserade's arsenal, doing big damage to any Pokemon that doesn't resist it. Hidden Power Fire nails Pokemon looking to absorb the Sleep Powder or try and take the Leaf Storm. Sludge Bomb is an option over Hidden Power Fire, as it can 2HKO Mandibuzz and Mega Venusaur, both of which are common switch-ins to absorb Sleep Powder. However, the loss in coverage generally isn't worth it. Giga Drain is a more consistent option over Leaf Storm, but the loss in power is very noticeable and Roserade is too frail to sick around long.

Set Details
========

Maximum investment in Speed and Special Attack with a Life Orb helps get down Spikes as fast as possible while giving Roserade the power needed to hit switch-ins hard. Technician's boost to Hidden Power Fire is invaluable, and should always be used over Natural Cure. Without it, Roserade doesn't OHKO Mega Scizor, Skarmory, Mega Mawile, Lucario, Bisharp, Excadrill, Ferrothorn, and Mega Pinsir or 2HKO Aegislash after Stealth Rock. 29 HP IVs are used to minimize Life Orb recoil. Note that the number of HP IVs does not affect the type of Hidden Power.

Usage Tips
========

The first objective when using Roserade is to cripple a Pokemon by putting it to sleep. If there is a Pokemon on the opponent's team that can absorb Sleep Powder, Roserade is better off setting Spikes or trying to nail the switch-in with powerful attacks. Roserade is a powerful but rather frail Pokemon that shouldn't be sacrificed early on, so only set Spikes on predicted switches. It should be switched in only on resisted special hits, as it is frail otherwise. Leaf Storm should always be Roserade's main attacking option, and Hidden Power Fire should handle most Pokemon attempting to cushion the Leaf Storm such as?.

Team Options
========

Roserade's best teammates will generally be offensive threats that offer good synergy and appreciate the residual damage from Spikes. Talonflame is one of these, and Roserade can beat Rotom-W for it. Keldeo applies much more pressure on its checks with the extra entry hazards. Rotom-W checks the Fire-type Pokemon that switch in on Roserade and grabs momentum with Volt Switch. A Defiant or Competitive user, like such as Bisharp, Thundurus, or Milotic, can switch in on a Defog attempt to remove Spikes and punish the opposing team with powerful boosted attacks. Heatran is a more defensive teammates, (RC) that can set up Stealth Rock on Talonflame and damage Grass-types with Lava Plume, while Roserade can set up Spikes on bulky Water-type Pokemon. Skarmory can take on several Pokemon that threaten Roserade, such as Mega Pinsir and Mamoswine, but be sure not to Defog away your own hazards.

Other Options
########

A defensive Spikes-stacking set is an option, but this is mostly outclassed by Chesnaught, as Roserade does not have great bulk and loses to several users of Defog. Shadow Ball can offer powerful neutral coverage and hit Aegislash, but Aegislash is already hit harder by Hidden Power Fire and Shadow Ball leaves Roserade helpless against some Steel-type Pokemon, most notably Bisharp. Roserade can use Aromatherapy or even run a SubSeed set, but it is largely outclassed in these roles by . A 'double Powder' set can be used to catch switch-ins off-guard, but the loss of offensive coverage isn't worth it. A Choice Scarf set can revenge kill Pokemon such as Greninja, Manaphy, and Mega Gyarados, but it is outclassed by Garchomp and Excadrill. Roserade also has access to Rain Dance and Sunny Day, but due to its general frailty, it isn't the best choice for a weather setter. Hidden Power Rock can be used to catch the usual Fire-type and some Dragon-type switch-ins off guard, but the loss in coverage generally isn't worth it.

Checks & Counters
########

**Fire-types**: Strong Fire-type Pokemon, like Heatran, Talonflame, and the Mega Charizard formes, (AC) have little trouble switching in and roasting Roserade with powerful attacks, although the latter two must be wary of Sludge Bomb or Hidden Power Rock.

**Strong Physical Attackers**: Roserade's Defense is very low, so physical attackers such as Dragonite, Excadrill, and Garchomp can easily 2HKO Roserade with almost any move.

**Special Walls and Assault Vest Users**: Roserade cannot hope to dent special walls such as Chansey or Heatran, and Assault Vest users like Goodra and Conkeldurr can handle Roserade's attacks as well. Assault Vest Excadrill can also remove Spikes that Roserade sets with Rapid Spin.

**Dragon-types**: Dragon-types that resist Grass-, such as Latias, Latios, Dragonite, Kyurem-B, Goodra, and Mega Charizard X, (AC) remember to close these asides that you set with a final comma can generally do a good job against Roserade, although they must be wary of a powerful Sludge Bomb.

**Powder-Immune Pokemon**: Mega Venusaur and Mandibuzz can absorb a Sleep Powder and sponge any other attacks Roserade can use, but both must watch out for Sludge Bomb, which can 2HKO them.

2/2

Implemented, thanks!
This is FINALLLLYYYY done!!