Tyranitar [QC 0/2]

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Martin

A monoid in the category of endofunctors
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I couldn't change the title of the old thread (dispite having the OP) so, after about a week of waiting for Laurel to change it (dispite the wallpost I gave him), I just deemed it easier to copy/paste it into a new thread. If someone could lock the old thread that'd be great.

Overview
########

Tyranitar is currently in the top ten most used pokemon in the VGC'14 format, and for good reason. It is one of the best available, walling common threats like Talonflame and filling many roles on teams, making it a huge threat every team must prepare for.

[Pros]
-Well rounded
-Large Movepool
-Good mixed-attacking stats
-Good defensive stats
-Good offensive and, to an extent, defensive typing
-Access to Sand Stream, making it a good weather disrupter
-Gained a mega evolution
-Versatile

[Cons]
-Weak to some common moves including Mach / Bullet Punch
-Weak to some common types such as Fighting-, Water- and Grass-type moves.
-Slow
-4MSS
-Common victim of double-targeting

Physically-Based Mixed Attacker
########
name: Mixed Attacker
move 1: Crunch
move 2: Rock Slide
move 3: Fire Blast / Ice Beam
move 4: Protect
ability: Sand Stream
item: Life Orb
evs: 252 HP / 244 Atk / 4 Def / 4 SpA / 4 SpD
nature: Brave

Moves
========

-Dark Pulse is the Dark-type STAB of choice, hitting Ghost- and Psychic-types hard
-Rock Slide is a powerful spread move, notable for hitting Talonflame and Mega Charizard Y hard
-Fire Blast is there to deal with Ferrothorn and Amoongus
-Ice Beam can take care of pokemon like Garchomp and Salamence
-Protect is the standard turn waster, scouting the opponent and protecting the user.

Set Details
========

-The EVs give Tyranitar enough bulk to survive both modest mega charizard Y's Solar Beam and Adamant Azumarill's Play Rough. 244 EVs are put into attack as that is the highest highest number left that are not divisible by 8, and the remaining four are put into special attack to get that extra stat point. Provided you are holding Life Orb, you can OHKO non-Occa Berry varients of Ferrothorn and non-Yache Berry varients of Garchomp 100% of the time with no special investment using Fire Blast or Ice Beam, respectively.
-Needs to maximize Attack without lowering its special attack stat and therefore runs Brave
-Life Orb is the preferred item for the power
-Chople Berry can be used to help weaken Fighting-type moves, surviving all but Mienshao's High Jump Kick, Mega Lucario's Close Combat and the rare Sawk's Close Combat.
-A bulkier spread with 252 HP / 88 Atk / 76 Def / 92 SpD can be used to survive Mega Garchomp's Sand Force-boosted Earthquake and Rotom-W's Hydro Pump when sandstorm has worn off (or be 3HKOd inside sandstorm) can be used if you feel that you don't need the extra power of the given spread. However, Mega Garchomp isn't very common and if Sandstorm wears off you shouldn't be staying in in the first place. Please note that you need to run the inferior Chople Berry with this spread.
-Sand Stream is recommended as as it boosts Tyranitar's special defense and chips away at the opponent with a Sandstorm
-Unnerve can be used if you don't want weather interference. It also has the perk of stopping your opponent's pokemon from eating the omnipresent berries. However, it leaves Tyranitar a little lacking in special defense, so must only be used in this situation.

Usage Tips
========

-Generally speaking, bring it in early and keep it alive for most of the match
-Could also bring in a few turns in to win the weather war, if applicable
-Be wary of Will-O-Wisp and Intimidate

Team Options
========

-Talonflame can take care of Fighting-type pokemon like Conkeldurr. It also protects Tyranitar from incoming Mach/Bullet Punches with Quick Guard.
-Garchomp, both mega and normal, are good teammates under sand
-Amoonguss is always nice with that Rage Powder and Spore support
-Safety Goggles Rotom-H as the best counter to the common Mega Charizard Y/Venusaur core due to it being immune to Sleep Powder, resistant of Giga Drain, Heat Wave and Solar Beam and it can take advantage of the opponent's sun
-Anything that can absorb burns, intimidate or King's Shield, such as Conkeldurr, Bisharp and (while often overlooked) Wigglytuff, respectively, are helpful

Special Attacker
########
name: Specialtar
move 1: Rock Slide
move 2: Fire Blast
move 3: Ice Beam
move 4: Protect
ability: Sand Stream
item: Life Orb
evs: 252 SpA / 36 SpD / 220 Spe
nature: Modest

Moves
========

-Rock Slide is important for dealing with threats such as Mega Charizard Y and Talonflame, OHKOing both excluding Charti Berry varients of the latter dispite the negative attack nature
-Fire Blast deals with Ferrothorn and other Steel-types
-Ice Beam hits Garchomp and Salamence, among other Dragon-types, hard
-Protect is useful for scouting. Reliant on this to tackle it being a common target of double targetting.
-Dark Pulse can be used for Dark-type STAB, hitting Meowstic-M hard, but its use is limited to that and it isn't powerful enough to warrent its use.
-Rock Polish can be used to boost Tyranitar's speed, but it is difficult to set up in doubles, made even harder as Tyranitar is a common victim of double targetting

Set Details
========

-Life Orb boosts attacks' power
-EVs maximize power, give you enough bulk to survive Mega Charizard Y's Solar Beam in the sun 75% of the time.
-Modest for power. Rock Slide doesn't lose any KOs with negative nature due to Life Orb boost
-A faster spread of 252 H

Usage Tips
########

[WIP]

Team Options
########

[WIP]


Choice Scarf
########
name: Choice Scarf
move 1: Dark Pulse
move 2: Rock Slide
move 3: Fire Blast
move 4: Ice Beam
ability: Sand Stream
item: Choice Scarf
evs: 20 HP / 4 Def / 220 SpA / 28 SpD / 236 Spe
nature: Mild

Moves
========

-Dark Pulse hits Ghost- and Psychic-types like Chandelure and Aegislash hard. Main move you will clean with.
-Rock Slide hits Mega Charizard Y and Talonflame hard
-Fire Blast hits Ferrothorn and other Steel-types hard not called Aegislash harder than any other moves
-Ice Beam hits Ground-types such as Garchomp hard, as well as getting the hardest hit on Salamence.
-Protect can be used to bluff an un-choiced set.
-Snarl can be used over Dark Pulse as it has utility and is a spread move, but it is too weak to recommend.

Set Details
========

-EVs OHKO 4 HP Garchomp with Ice Beam 100% of the time, underspeed max speed Choice Scarf Abomasnow by a point so sandstorm is set up instead of hail, preventing Blizzard spam, and maximizes the chances of surviving a Timid Mega Charizard Y's Solar Beam in the sun (81.2% chance to survive) while still maximizing Tyranitar's mixed bulk. Remaining 4 in Def for extra stat point.
-Mild so as not to lower either offensive stat. Special Defense lowered due to Sand Stream boosting it anyway and speed being a vital stat.
-Sand Stream as this set is too frail otherwase
-Choice Scarf because choice scarf set. Boosts Tyranitar's speed
-You can run a spread of 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe, but loses a large amount of bulk and it misses out on that niche of underspeeding Choice Scarf Abomasnow by one stat point.

Usage Tips
========

-As this set is frailer than the others, you need to play it a little more conservatively than Tyranitar's other sets
-Think ahead before locking yourself into Fire Blast or Ice Beam in order to KO that Ferrothorn or Garchomp, respectively. It will often come back to bite you
-Due to the frail nature of the set, it will often be best to come in later to clean up weakened foes once you have deemed what will be able to outpace you
-Tyranitar is usually used as a good weather disruptor. Be careful about when you bring it in when you are against opposing weather-based teams

Team Options
========

-Talonflame deals with Scrafty
-Amoonguss deals with Rotom-Wash and opposing Tyranitar
-Rotom-Wash deals with Azumarill and other Water-types
-Safety Goggles Rotom-H as the best counter to the common Mega Charizard Y/Venusaur core due to it being immune to Sleep Powder, resistant of Giga Drain and Solar Beam and taking advantage of the opponent's sun

Physically-Based Mega
########
name: Mega Tyranitar
move 1: Crunch
move 2: Rock Slide
move 3: Earthquake / Dragon Dance
move 4: Protect / Dragon Dance
ability: Unnerve / Sand Stream
item: Tyranitarite
evs: 252 Atk / 108 Def / 20 SpD / 128 Spe
nature: Adamant

Moves
========

-Crunch provides a solid STAB
-Rock Slide provides another solid STAB, hitting both opponents
-Earthquake is a hard-hitting attack that provides SlideQuake coverage. Prevents Aegislash from King's Shielding you
-Protect for scouting and getting sandstorm chip damage
-Dragon Dance can be used to boost up to monsterous levels

Set Details
========

-Adamant boosts Attack to monsterous levels
-EVs max out attack while letting you survive max spec. attack modest Megazard Y's Solar Beam in the sun and max attack, adamant Scrafty's Drain Punch, both as mega. The rest are dumped into speed, happening to give you the perk of outpacing neutral, uninvested Rotom-A (not relevant, but, then again, not everyone runs smart spreads
-Tyranitarite for mega
-Unnerve because mega has Sand Stream anyway and blocking opponents' berry-use is helpful, but Sand Stream gives you more momentum-gaining oppertunities, making switch-ins against special attackers easier.

Usage Tips
========

-If facing a Charizard, use Protect on the turn it mega evolves and then mega evolve yourself to lock them into a weakened, 2-turn Solar Beam and proceed to KO them while taking no damage from them.
-Make sure that you mega evolve at the right time, and make sure that you take as little damage as possible before you mega evolve as Tyranitar is a frail before mega evolving.
-Dont forget that it isn't always the best idea to mega evolve immediately
-Beware Intimidate and Will-O-Wisp as they may cut your sweep short

Team Options
========

-Talonflame hits Fighting-types and Amoonguss
-Rotom-Wash hits opposing Rock and Ground types
-Mat Block, Quick Guard and Wide Guard users, such as Greninja and Mienshao, are all helpful for protecting Tyranitar
-Anything that can absorb burns or intimidate, such as Conkeldurr, Bisharp and (while often overlooked) Wigglytuff, respectively, are helpful
-Assault Vest can be used, but, when Tyranitar isn't holding a Choice Scarf, Tyranitar basically needs Protect as it is commonly double-targetted

Other Options
########

-Roseli Berry
-Weakness Policy
-Specially-Based Tyranitarite
-Tyraniboah
-Dragon Dance
-Rock Polish Specialtar
-Stone Edge
-Brick Break or Focus Blast

Checks & Counters
########

-Fighting-type moves most notably Mienshao's High Jump Kick, completely destroy T-Tar
-Fairy-types, most notably Mega Mawile, can deal heavy damage to Tyranitar
-Scizor can wreak Tyranitar with STAB Bullet Punch and X-Scissor
-Steel-types, like the two I just mentioned and Ferrothorn deal heavy damage
-Grass-types like Chesnaught, Ludicolo and Ferrothorn can deal heavy damage to Tyranitar
-Water-types like Azumarill and Ludicolo can deal heavy damage to Tyranitar
-Intimidate severely weaken it barring the special set
-Burn and Intimidate have big effects on all sets barring Scarf
 
Last edited:
Mixed Attacker
########
name: Mixed Attacker
move 1: Crunch
move 2: Rock Slide
move 3: Fire Blast / Ice Beam
move 4: Protect
ability: Sand Stream / Unnerve
item: Life Orb / Chople Berry
evs: 252 HP / 244 Atk / 4 Def / 4 SpA / 4 SpD
nature: Brave

[...]

-The EVs give Tyranitar enough bulk to survive both modest mega charizard Y's Solar Beam and Azumarill's Play Rough. 244 EVs are put into special attack as that is the highest highest number left that are not divisible by 8, and the remaining four are put into attack to get that extra stat point.

[...]
I think you got those numbers mixed.
 

Martin

A monoid in the category of endofunctors
is a Smogon Discord Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
Ah. Thanks for pointing that out. I edited it after testing so that explains the mixup in set details.
 
Gamer Boy

The first set should be a Special attacker:

Special Attacker
########
name: Special Attacker
move 1: Rock Slide
move 2: Fire Blast / Ice Beam
move 3: Dark Pulse / Ice Beam
move 4: Protect
ability: Sand Stream / Unnerve
item: Life Orb
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
nature: Modest / Timid

Rock Slide doesn't need a positive or even a neutral nature to OHKO both Charizard and Talonflame. The coverage that Tyranitar's special movepool gets is huge and you are achieving very little by not investing in it. Being physically orientated does allow you to hit off your higher physical Attack, however given the omnipresence of Will-O-Wisp and Intimidate you will often be hitting harder off your Special Attack.

Mega Tyranitar's set should be Dragon Dance with Crunch and Rock Slide.

Dragon Dance
########
name: Special Attacker
move 1: Rock Slide
move 2: Crunch
move 3: Dragon Dance
move 4: Protect
ability: Sand Stream
item: Tyranitarite / Weakness Policy
evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
nature: Jolly / Adamant

Weakness Policy can be used for the extra boosts as Tyranitar has good bulk. I would mention an alternate spread for Mega Tyranitar of 180 HP / 12 Atk / 132 Def / 4 SpD / 180 Spe with a Jolly Nature this spread is never 2HKOed by Jolly Garchomp, or OHKOed by Ray Rizzo's Mega Mawile whilst 252 Adamant has a 3/16 chance to OHKO with Iron Head. At Plus one you outspeed Choice Scarf Tyranitars, and 2HKO Garchomp with Crunch.

I would list the Choice Scarf set above Mega Tyranitar simply because it is easier to use and doesn't require set up. I would also list the EVs as 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe with a Timid nature.

I wouldn't include the last set as it is too slow and is completely outclassed by any of the special attacking set.

I would add Assault Vest to other options. Also Ancient Power, Mega Charizard Y and Talonflame EV to survive the weaker and physical Rock Slide so they can be caught off guard by it.
 

Martin

A monoid in the category of endofunctors
is a Smogon Discord Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
Gamer Boy

The first set should be a Special attacker:

Special Attacker
########
name: Special Attacker
move 1: Rock Slide
move 2: Fire Blast / Ice Beam
move 3: Dark Pulse / Ice Beam
move 4: Protect
ability: Sand Stream / Unnerve
item: Life Orb
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
nature: Modest / Timid

Rock Slide doesn't need a positive or even a neutral nature to OHKO both Charizard and Talonflame. The coverage that Tyranitar's special movepool gets is huge and you are achieving very little by not investing in it. Being physically orientated does allow you to hit off your higher physical Attack, however given the omnipresence of Will-O-Wisp and Intimidate you will often be hitting harder off your Special Attack.
Adding, but without Dark Pulse. It hits nothing notable aside from Meowstic (Aegislash is hit by Fire Blast) and isn't powerful enough to deserve mention on non-Choice Scarf sets, which need it as a solid, accurate cleaning move. I am adding it second. Also making the EV spread 252 SpA / 36 SpD / 220 Spe as that is what you need to outpace 60 Spe, Adamant Mamoswine (the set on Smogon)
Mega Tyranitar's set should be Dragon Dance with Crunch and Rock Slide.

Dragon Dance
########
name: Special Attacker (Me: Don't you mean Dragon Dance?)
move 1: Rock Slide
move 2: Crunch
move 3: Dragon Dance
move 4: Protect
ability: Sand Stream
item: Tyranitarite / Weakness Policy
evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
nature: Jolly / Adamant

Weakness Policy can be used for the extra boosts as Tyranitar has good bulk. I would mention an alternate spread for Mega Tyranitar of 180 HP / 12 Atk / 132 Def / 4 SpD / 180 Spe with a Jolly Nature this spread is never 2HKOed by Jolly Garchomp, or OHKOed by Ray Rizzo's Mega Mawile whilst 252 Adamant has a 3/16 chance to OHKO with Iron Head. At Plus one you outspeed Choice Scarf Tyranitars, and 2HKO Garchomp with Crunch.
Why would Mawile use Iron Head on Tyranitar when Play Rough will do more? Also, the main reason that I wouldn't force it into Dragon Dance is that it needs to have a surefire way of hitting Aegislash without risking an attack drop. I included it in moves before as it is difficult to set up in VGC and it leaves you voulnerable to King's Shield. I am inclined to leave it there tbh, and, while after a DD you can outpace opposing Choice Scarf Tyranitar, without EQ what are you going to do to them?
I would list the Choice Scarf set above Mega Tyranitar simply because it is easier to use and doesn't require set up.
Done and done.
I would also list the EVs as 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe with a Timid nature.
The EVs on the scarf set were to underspeed Choice Scarf Abomasnow by 1 point to prevent it from spamming Blizzard when you both switch in on the same turn/both lead with it. I can also take a hit or two with the spread, making it a little more ideal. I will put your spread in set details, but it has no business running Timid as it lacks power with it, especially on Rock Slide which is incredibly weak unboosted
I wouldn't include the last set as it is too slow and is completely outclassed by any of the special attacking set.
I was a bit iffy on it anyway. Will do.
I would add Assault Vest to other options. Also Ancient Power, Mega Charizard Y and Talonflame EV to survive the weaker and physical Rock Slide so they can be caught off guard by it.
I tested Assault Vest and to be completely honest it wasn't very good as Tyranitar needs Protect to function properly as it was a common target of double targetting. I will add it at the very bottom of OO as it isn't completely useless, but it is by far Tyranitars worst usable(ish) set. Also I think that, even when Rock Slide isn't more powerful/just as powerful, the damage difference is pretty marginal. Using the two examples you provided...
  • 0- Atk Tyranitar Rock Slide vs. 84 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 196-232 (119.5 - 141.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO --> 252+ SpA Tyranitar Ancient Power vs. 84 HP / 0 SpD Talonflame: 244-292 (148.7 - 178%) -- guaranteed OHKO - ~40% more damage on a pokemon that is 4x weak to it (divide the difference by 4 to get the difference if it is neutral damage = 10%: marginal) in exchange for lacking spread damage, lower PP and trading a 20% flinch rate (plus the way spread damage affects secondary effects of moves) for a 10% chance to raise all stats - not going to happen very often, making fishing for it pointless.
  • 0- Atk Tyranitar Rock Slide vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Charizard Y: 180-216 (116.8 - 140.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO --> 252+ SpA Tyranitar Ancient Power vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Charizard Y: 168-196 (109 - 127.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO - Ancient Power is actually outdamaged by Rock Slide
Overall, Ancient Power isn't worth its salt as the only time when those either of those two pokemon might EV to take Tyranitar's Rock Slide is when it is Charti Berry Talonflame which can take an Ancient Power for the same NHKO rate (252+ SpA Tyranitar Ancient Power vs. 172 HP / 0 SpD Charti Berry Talonflame: 122-146 (69.7 - 83.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage --> 0- Atk Tyranitar Rock Slide vs. 172 HP / 0 Def Charti Berry Talonflame: 98-116 (56 - 66.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage). Otherwise, they would have to invest an abnormal amount into its defenses to take the hit (252 HP / 108 Def for Mega Charizard Y - more efficient than EVing 252 into defense and 124 into HP (I checked) - and 156 HP / 252 Def for Talonflame). Not adding: even to OO.

Changes Made
  • Added Specialtar set
  • Moved Choice Scarf above Mega
  • Added Weakness Policy to OO
  • Added set details spread to Choice Scarf
  • Removed Chople Berry from mixed set and added it to OO
  • Removed Physical Attacker
  • Added set details spreads
  • Split overview into [Pros] and [Cons] as it is easier to read for the skeleton
  • Added to overview
  • Removed Unnerve from all sets excluding Mega
  • Added AV to the very bottom of OO
Questions
  • In VGC'12, the specitar set had Unnerve. Is it still viable on specitar or does it need Sand Stream?
 
Last edited:

Martin

A monoid in the category of endofunctors
is a Smogon Discord Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
Special defensive tyranitar with either smooth rock(keep sand up longer) or leftovers can be a very good pursuit trapper

Stealth rocks
Fire Blast
Pursuit
Crunch
No offense, but that set really, REALLY sucks in doubles as peole don't tend to switch much and, as such, Stealth Rock and Pursuit are horribly bad moves on it. Furthermore, hazard setting and pursuit trapping are bad strategies in VGC as chip damage doesn't get you as far in such a fast paced metagame as VGC game (4v4 doubles) will last around 10-15 turns on average rather than 25-30, and even in 6v6 doubles it is still more like 15-20 turns on average per match. Doubles is very different to singles. Make sure you learn the metagames before commenting on analyses for them.
 
No offense, but that set really, REALLY sucks in doubles as peole don't tend to switch much and, as such, Stealth Rock and Pursuit are horribly bad moves on it. Furthermore, hazard setting and pursuit trapping are bad strategies in VGC as chip damage doesn't get you as far in such a fast paced metagame as VGC game (4v4 doubles) will last around 10-15 turns on average rather than 25-30, and even in 6v6 doubles it is still more like 15-20 turns on average per match. Doubles is very different to singles. Make sure you learn the metagames before commenting on analyses for them.
My bad I didnt read that this was VGC I thought it was an OU analyze I'll delete my post right now
 

Martin

A monoid in the category of endofunctors
is a Smogon Discord Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
Ok. I'm giving the thread to Chenkovsky as I feel that he will keep this alive a little better. Locking now.

edit: hmm. It seems that I am unable to lock it. It will be left open, but is not to be responded to.
 
gamer boy

I just read this "I couldn't change the title of the old thread (dispite having the OP) so, after about a week of waiting for Laurel to change it (dispite the wallpost I gave him), I just deemed it easier to copy/paste it into a new thread. If someone could lock the old thread that'd be great."

I never saw this I'm sorry lol, but I don't actually have the ability to do that. Next time message TheMantyke

Since he is going to be flashed please lock this thread ;) :http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/tyranitar.3501665/

(Didn't see it earlier when I gave you the list of finished and ones to lock)
 

Martin

A monoid in the category of endofunctors
is a Smogon Discord Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
gamer boy

I just read this "I couldn't change the title of the old thread (dispite having the OP) so, after about a week of waiting for Laurel to change it (dispite the wallpost I gave him), I just deemed it easier to copy/paste it into a new thread. If someone could lock the old thread that'd be great."

I never saw this I'm sorry lol, but I don't actually have the ability to do that. Next time message TheMantyke

Since he is going to be flashed please lock this thread ;) :http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/tyranitar.3501665/

(Didn't see it earlier when I gave you the list of finished and ones to lock)
I can't. I tried. Also, I did message the mantyke and he didn't lock it so...
 
Physically-Based Mixed Attacker
########
name: Mixed Attacker
move 1: Crunch
move 2: Rock Slide
move 3: Fire Blast / Ice Beam
move 4: Protect
ability: Sand Stream
item: Life Orb
evs: 252 HP / 244 Atk / 4 Def / 4 SpA / 4 SpD
nature: Brave

Moves
========

-Dark Pulse is the Dark-type STAB of choice, hitting Ghost- and Psychic-types hard
-Rock Slide is a powerful spread move, notable for hitting Talonflame and Mega Charizard Y hard
-Fire Blast is there to deal with Ferrothorn and Amoongus
-Ice Beam can take care of pokemon like Garchomp and Salamence
-Protect is the standard turn waster, scouting the opponent and protecting the user.
 
Unowninator
This isn't the current analysis for Tyranitar, I'm working on it, this version is only higher than it because of the discussion into locking this thread.
 
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