Ladder Balanced Hackmons

You can also Baton Pass boosts you steal and go on a rampage with one of your offensive mons. You think a Contrary user at +6 Sp. A, Def, Sp. Def, and Spe is scary, wait until your opponent sees your Refrige Boomburster or Moldy Sweeper with those boosts.
 
You can also Baton Pass boosts you steal and go on a rampage with one of your offensive mons. You think a Contrary user at +6 Sp. A, Def, Sp. Def, and Spe is scary, wait until your opponent sees your Refrige Boomburster or Moldy Sweeper with those boosts.
Or you can have an Offensive Prankster and just abuse the boosts yourself, like my Prankster M-Garde that I posted a while ago.
 
Do you guys think that Mega Latios/Latias may be ban-worthy? Such huge stats with abilities such as Protean may make them extremely difficult to wall.

I feel that it would be wise to at least suspect them. They already have huge spdef/spa, a 1.5 boost with no drawbacks isn't even fair. It's probably harder to wall than the M2's. Even though Latios/Latias's Soul Dew can be Knocked Off, any smart player can easily prevent it from happening.

Also, should this even work? We're not even sure Soul Dew exists in X/Y, it would probably be best to remove it or remove its effect to Mega Lati@s.

EDIT: Just found out Soul Dew is proven to be embedded into the game. Still, there's no proof that Soul Dew affects Mega Lati@s, so my point still stands.
 
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Do you guys think that Mega Latios/Latias may be ban-worthy? Such huge stats with abilities such as Protean may make them extremely difficult to wall.

I feel that it would be wise to at least suspect them. They already have huge spdef/spa, a 1.5 boost with no drawbacks isn't even fair. It's probably harder to wall than the M2's. Even though Latios/Latias's Soul Dew can be Knocked Off, any smart player can easily prevent it from happening.

Also, should this even work? We're not even sure Soul Dew exists in X/Y, it would probably be best to remove it or remove its effect to Mega Lati@s.

EDIT: Just found out Soul Dew is proven to be embedded into the game. Still, there's no proof that Soul Dew affects Mega Lati@s, so my point still stands.
To be honest, what I'm most concerned about, moreso than whether the two of them should be banned, is the fact that we have no proof that Soul Dew actually gives a boost to the Mega Latis. In terms of gameplay, Mega Latios shouldn't be too much more difficult to handle than something like a Life Orb Mega Mewtwo Y, (I saw Neverman making this comparison yesterday), while Mega Latias is more like some powerful special attacker with an Assault Vest.

I don't think they've been around long enough for us to consider a ban, is what I'm saying.
 
I can confidently say that we overhyped the latis. Not going to lie haven't tried Latias yet but Latios is rather underwhelming even with Soul Dew Protean is probably the best ability for it as of now. Also the thing is while we have no proof that this is happening ingame, a. soul dew has been hacked in and b. we have no proof it doesn't work.
 
Ikind of used that hype to get people in my side and support my argument about how Soul Dew isn't proven to affect Lati@s. I know they're not exactly amazing.

So honestly, I feel that it was unjust of me to utilise that hype solely for attempting to ban a not-so-great offensive threat. Still, my point about how Soul Dew should not affect them still stands.
 
Mewtwo-Y with Life Orb hits slightly harder than Soul Dew Mega-Latios, i already tested it on the calc (replaced Soul Dew for Choice Spec since the calc doesn't have SD yet, but the boost is the same 1.5x), and has a better speed, so it is a better Protean Sweeper than M-Latios, BUT M-Latios has a huge Sp.Def with SD, this is an advantage over Mewtwo-Y.

The additional Dragon STAB makes M-Latios a better Contrary user too, but for Protean a Life Orb Mewtwo-Y is still faster and more powerful.

I want to try Mega-Latias with Soul Dew, but i haven't decided yet which ability to put on her. The sum of her Base Sp.Atk and Sp.Def is 290, while Latios has a sum of 280, so she will get a slightly better use of SD boosts.

EDIT: Oh and of course, SD M-Latios doesn't suffer from Life Orb recoil, this with his Special Bulk is another advantage over Mewtwo-Y.
 
I don't know why they implemented that when there's no proof of it. Granted, we can use Megas freely when there's little proof of it (we've seen wild megas, but I've not heard of anyone using a mega in-game without the stone), but the little proof of them being usable is still better than no proof.

That said, they're totally going to be Trick/Knock Off bait. While you can predict most Knock Off users, you can't predict them all. Especially support mons carrying Knock Off for utility purposes.
 
The reason it was implemented was based on tests I made of mega pokemon and item interactions within the game. It working is the most logical assumption based on our current assumption that pokemon do not need to hold their megastones to maintain a mega form.
 

Lcass4919

The Xatu Warrior
well, since the whole soul dew thing is finally (for the timebeing-and hopefully forever-) happening, i guess ill post a set i've both theorymonned the second protean was announced, and tested back when bhxy just came out (using lugia over latias)

Latias-Mega @ Soul Dew
Ability: Protean
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Curse
- King's Shield
- Recover
- Moonblast/powerful offensive attack

while everyone was like "OFFENSIVE ABILITY HYPE" when protean came out, i immidiately asked "does it work with curse?" and low and behold. it does. now, i used lugia way before, and it was still quite decent at the time, but now that soul dew has a new mechanic, its kinda obvious which to use...lol. you will probably end up asking me "what does this thing do that other protean users cant?" well...first, it can check -ilate abilities with kings sheild plus its redicoulous spc def, and on top of that, cursing walls/sweepers puts HEAVY pressure on your opponent, and it still has offensive power with any offensive move you like. personally, i like moonblast but to each their own. lol. and if soul dew gets kicked to the curb, ill post the lugia version or something.
 

Kit Kasai

Love colored magic
well, since the whole soul dew thing is finally (for the timebeing-and hopefully forever-) happening, i guess ill post a set i've both theorymonned the second protean was announced, and tested back when bhxy just came out (using lugia over latias)

Latias-Mega @ Soul Dew
Ability: Protean
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Curse
- King's Shield
- Recover
- Moonblast/powerful offensive attack

while everyone was like "OFFENSIVE ABILITY HYPE" when protean came out, i immidiately asked "does it work with curse?" and low and behold. it does. now, i used lugia way before, and it was still quite decent at the time, but now that soul dew has a new mechanic, its kinda obvious which to use...lol. you will probably end up asking me "what does this thing do that other protean users cant?" well...first, it can check -ilate abilities with kings sheild plus its redicoulous spc def, and on top of that, cursing walls/sweepers puts HEAVY pressure on your opponent, and it still has offensive power with any offensive move you like. personally, i like moonblast but to each their own. lol. and if soul dew gets kicked to the curb, ill post the lugia version or something.
/hate hate hate hate hate

lolol jk this seams pretty awesome. Lugia was already pretty annoying, now it has offensive presence. Imma try it out a bit.
 
So as I found out today, Soul Dew now works with Mega Lati@s, giving a 1.5x boost to their already high Special Attack and Special Defense stats. Thoughts? Possible uses? Will they even be useful in a Knock Off-dominated metagame?
HOLY! O_O

Do you guys think that Mega Latios/Latias may be ban-worthy? Such huge stats with abilities such as Protean may make them extremely difficult to wall.
There is no reason to jump on another "ban train". I know I did with you when Mold Breaker was fixed, but as with the last big change (Thousand Arrows/Waves) you also deemed them ban worthy yet they fit into the meta just fine and only changed a few things (such as no more Levi Heatran). Just wait and see how it affects the meta.

Edit: Sorry for the double post and yes I'm a SLOWPOKE okay! xD
Arcticblast edit: fixed
 
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It doesn't seem likely for Mega Lati@s to have the same dex number as their respective non-megas.

You could argue that it actually is likely for them to have the same dex number. Still, there's no reason to impact a metagame with something that may not even be true in the games.

I'm sure all of you remember how Parental Bond worked back in the beginning of BH X/Y. Game Mechanic experts went with the safe assumption that Parental Bond had no effect on Super Fang/Night Shade/Seismic Toss and other fixed damage moves.

I believe this decision follows the same logic of not having to impact a metagame without any proof of it working in the games.
 
Dude just quit your bitching for a couple weeks. You wanted the mewtwos banned before they were even programmed. I know you're going to say the lack of in game evidence makes it illegitimate, but the entire tier is pretty arbitrary by now so that argument is getting really annoying. Nobody dislikes the change but you, we need some new meat to play with. They will obviously have the same dex number, and there's no evidence saying this won't work...
 
Dude just quit your bitching for a couple weeks. You wanted the mewtwos banned before they were even programmed. I know you're going to say the lack of in game evidence makes it illegitimate, but the entire tier is pretty arbitrary by now so that argument is getting really annoying. Nobody dislikes the change but you, we need some new meat to play with. They will obviously have the same dex number, and there's no evidence saying this won't work...
There's no need to make a completely reasonable post seem bias and completely wrong.

I'm not complaining, I just feel that it's best to play safe, and try to not impact the metagame without any knowledge wether Soul Dew affects Mega Lati@s in the games or not.

Also, care to elaborate why they will "obviously have the same dex number"? There have been many cases of game mechanics experts being wrong.

You should probably try to be more reasonable instead of being biased.

Sent via tablet.
 
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Monte Cristo

Banned deucer.
Dude just quit your bitching for a couple weeks. You wanted the mewtwos banned before they were even programmed. I know you're going to say the lack of in game evidence makes it illegitimate, but the entire tier is pretty arbitrary by now so that argument is getting really annoying. Nobody dislikes the change but you, we need some new meat to play with. They will obviously have the same dex number, and there's no evidence saying this won't work...
they probably will have differing index numbers because Index numbers account for things like form and dex number. Please do not try to talk about things like this that you are not sure of. And yes we all know for sure soul dew is index number based because if imposter ditto w/ soul dew imposters latias it doesn't gain the boost because ditto does not copy index #
 
Let's say some guy playing in-game can hack a Mega-Lati@s into having Soul Dew instead of his/her Mega-Stone, and then this guy realizes that Soul Dew doesn't work for the Mega-Formes of their respective owners, then of course this should change in BH metagame, but until such thing happens, let's enjoy the Mega Lati twins boosted by Soul Dew lol
 
They will obviously NOT have the same index number: all the forms have different numbers, in fact it's in this way we got information about the two kyurem formes even before they got implemented during the B/W era.
While I enjoy the boost MegaLati@s got, I don't think we should've implemented it until we were sure about how Soul Dew interacted with them and I support Adrian.
Considering Megas are not supposed to hold items other than their stones, it's hard to believe Game Freak coded SD to work for the Mega Evolutions.
 
Still, there's no reason to impact a metagame with something that may not even be true in the games.

I'm sure all of you remember how Parental Bond worked back in the beginning of BH X/Y. Game Mechanic experts went with the safe assumption that Parental Bond had no effect on Super Fang/Night Shade/Seismic Toss and other fixed damage moves.

I believe this decision follows the same logic of not having to impact a metagame without any proof of it working in the games.
I just want to remind you that based on this logic mega pokemon cannot maintain their form without holding a megastone and they cannot start a battle mega evolved. Unless you're willing to champion that cause as well, you're just whining about the change because it doesn't favor stall very much.
 

Lcass4919

The Xatu Warrior
It doesn't seem likely for Mega Lati@s to have the same dex number as their respective non-megas.

You could argue that it actually is likely for them to have the same dex number. Still, there's no reason to impact a metagame with something that may not even be true in the games.

I'm sure all of you remember how Parental Bond worked back in the beginning of BH X/Y. Game Mechanic experts went with the safe assumption that Parental Bond had no effect on Super Fang/Night Shade/Seismic Toss and other fixed damage moves.

I believe this decision follows the same logic of not having to impact a metagame without any proof of it working in the games.
to be completely fair, the fact that you cant knock off megas items prior or after mega evolution strongly hints at the pokemon being a different form of the original (like giratina forme is to a lesser extent) rather then a new pokemon entirely, especially since they revert back to their normal forms AFTER the battle(Again, like giratina does) which further suggests that they are the same. now, dont get the wrong idea adrian, i'm perfectly fine with mega lati's losing their soul dew, because i do believe we shouldn't "do something before knowing first hand" but i feel its just as possible as it is impossible unlike what your trying to convince everyone lol.

however, this statement makes me ask...do we even have proof that NON megaed...mega evolutions prevent knock off/trick from working? if not, then should we revert that too? or is it a safe assumption/been officially confirmed? well... giratina DOES act the same way in alternate forme.(further prooving my point of the possibility of lati and mega being the same :V)
 
I've been using this set to some degree of success. Feedback, please?
Blaziken-Mega @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Adaptability
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Rash Nature
- Blue Flare/V-Create/Sacred Fire
- Drain Punch/Mach Punch/Close Combat
- Icicle Crash/Diamond Storm
- Shell Smash/Shift Gear
 
I've been using this set to some degree of success. Feedback, please?
Blaziken-Mega @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Adaptability
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Rash Nature
- Blue Flare/V-Create/Sacred Fire
- Drain Punch/Mach Punch/Close Combat
- Icicle Crash/Diamond Storm
- Shell Smash/Shift Gear
The set hits really hard, but has one main flaw. You can likely take out Shed, which is nice, but you have no way of dealing with Imposters. It doesn't help that you're also completely walled by Flash Fire Aegislash, by Mega Scizor if you use Mach Punch, and by Giratina if you use Diamond Storm.
 

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