Alrighty it's my turn and some of these mons i havent used :I so i'll cover what i know for now and see what i can do about the restYo the OP has been updated. I'd like some discussion on Aipom since Artemis Fowl keeps bringing it up and it probably shouldn't be E-Rank, and people can feel free to start splitting up the 37 Pokemon that currently reside in C-rank.
edit: this isn't a preliminary list, these are just my nominations
amaura - purely because of its ability to beat pretty much all flying types i want it B-. Has pretty good attack, but needs to rely on Hidden Power for coverage which can sometimes be weak which is the only reason it can't go higher than B-. Scarf Amaura beats the FletchDig core with rock support (incase sash). Refrigerate Tri-Attack is pretty fucking strong on anything that doesn't resist.
binacle - Shell Smasher that can perform well as a late game sweeper and sets its side apart as the only Shell Smasher which doesn't worry about Ferroseed, without resorting to Hidden Power Fire.
elekid - outspeeding the entire meta without being choice-locked is a pretty good niche and Mixed sets can be a pain to deal with. Good coverage allows it to get past quite a few threats and can make it unpredictable.
shellder - good smasher, dunno why it's in C. Only smasher to beat Abra as well. Pure Normal typing with Good Defense and Ice Shard to KO bulky Fletchling (after Rocks) means it's the only smasher not easily revenged by one of Timburr or Fletchling. With Knock Off Support, Icicle Spear/Rock Blast should basically KO everything due to multi-hit moves having weird rolls
aron - decent enough sturdyjuice mon can set up rocks and has okay attack + metal burts. deffo one of the top C-rank mons.
axew - nice set up sweeper, completely walled by spritzee, and cottonee is annoying as always but can sweep with some support
bellsprout - chlorophyll puts it C+ imo
bulbasaur - same as bellsprout
corphish - good wallbreaker with adaptability, also gets switcheroo which is cool. Swords Dance and Dragon Dance can be used to pull off a sweep too.
cranidos - fantastic wallbreaker (wouldn't even mind seeing B- tbh) with amazing attack, sheer force+LO and 16 speed isn't bad at all, it just has the ability to hit everything hard
darumaka - similar to Cranidos but Hustle misses are annoying as fuck. access to U-turn is cool but hazard weak and reliance on scarf for speed means it shouldn't be going up to B anytime soon.
lileep - good wall with great bulk but doesn't have much of a place in the current metagame which is why it's not up there in B tier.
magby - Belly Drum, 19 Speed and Mach Punch puts it at the top of C rank, but can easily be stopped by faster priority and scarfers cos Mach Punch isn't always the strongest
oddish - same as bellsprout and bulbasaur
staryu - good spinner just lost its niche with defog mechanics in gen 6 and Drilbur is more suited to the current metagame.
surskit - best sticky web layer which is a niche that should be recognised
tentacool - really unique typing allowing it to wall Fire-types, Grass-types, Fairy-types AND Fighting-types, liquid ooze really pisses off grass/fighting types especially, and toxic spikes is a cool niche. fantastic Special Defense too. (also a contender for B- imo)
dratini - okay set up sweeper and can run mixed LO wallbreaker as well to give it some unpredictability
drifloon - good unburden mon but generally outclassed by other Ghosts+Flyers
frillish - good defensive stats but doesn't wall anything that notable in the current metagame
hippopotas - good physical wall, can take on most physical attackers but its easy to switch in and needs to run coverage to not be a liability against certain pokemon. overreliant on eviolite too.
growlithe - decent physical wall, good option to take on opposing fire-types but most of the time you should be using ponyta
mantyke - can run a cool rain dance set (probably the best RD sweeper) and can also run a bulky restalk set to take on grass/fighting types.
pancham - good niche in partin shot but finds it hard to fit on a team with the amount of viable fighting-types and lack of drain punch
snover - Blizzard is pretty fucking strong tbh but Snover is weak to most of the top metagame threats.
poliwag - belly drummer with 19 speed but lacks coverage and can easy be walled by quite a lot.
purrloin - pretty good support mon with prio encore, taunt along with u-turn and knock off. doesn't have too much of a notable niche to allow it to be higher imo.
tyrunt - okay defensive typing but no recovery and i'd rather use onix or some other rock-type
froakie - gets STAB on everything but it's still kind of underwhelming and there are much better revenge killers/wallbreakers out there
goldeen - lightningrod is a cool niche and it has okay physical offense but it's not really strong enough most of the time and Chinchou usually outclasses it due to its better defensive typing.
grimer - sticky hold is cool but no recovery and there are better physical tanks
honedge - since meditite went honedge struggles to find a niche and the current metagame isn't friendly to it
inkay - contrary superpower is overated as fuck, but inkay isn't too bad that it doesn't deserve c-
meowth - idk why you'd put this on a team tbh, it's quite weak and only a strong fake out alongside technician thief and covet give it a tiny niche. not worth it most of the time
shellos - sticky hold could make it a good mon for a stall team, but it needs a lot of support with hazard removal otherwise it could find loads of 3hkos turning into 2hkos. massive momentum loser as well.
spinarak - sticky web+tspikes is cool and it probably has a better defensive typing than surskit but if you want sticky web, go for surskit 9 times out of 10
I agree with you about Fury Swipes being overrated, but Aipom is stronger in any other moves comparing with Minccino. Comparing it to Aipom makes me sad lol. Minccino does have better coverage moves, but Aipom has Brick Break which KOes Pawniard. Minccino is just murdered by Pawniard. Aipom has access to Taunt, so Aipom isn't just a wallbreaker; it is also an effective anti-lead. Aipom bulk is usable (again, comparing with Minccino, both holding Eviolite, and giving 76 HP EVs for both, Aipom gets 23 HP 18 Def, 18 Special Def while Minccino only gets 23 HP, 15 Def and 15 Special Def. Any decent Fighting-type attack KOes Minccino, while Aipom survives.) and Fury Swipes does the amount of damage needed without Life Orb. Speed tying with Misdreavus is very useful. Man, there are a lot of reasons you would use Aipom over Minccino (btw, most Minccino runs Adamant.).Aipom AT BEST deserves C+. Fury Swipes is extremely overrated as it I'd just weak without a Life Orb (Honestly though just use Mincinno for that. It's got a wide movepool for covering many threats, but the buck really ends there. Tbh there's not much of a reason to use It over chilla outside of a speed point
196 Atk Aipom Fury Swipes (5 hits) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Staryu: 15-20 (78.9 - 105.2%) -- approx. 6.3% chance to OHKOAipom AT BEST deserves C+. Fury Swipes is extremely overrated as it I'd just weak without a Life Orb (Honestly though just use Mincinno for that. It's got a wide movepool for covering many threats, but the buck really ends there. Tbh there's not much of a reason to use It over chilla outside of a speed point
(Bolded Text is what I'm addressing)I agree with you about Fury Swipes being overrated, but Aipom is stronger in any other moves comparing with Minccino. Comparing it to Aipom makes me sad lol. Minccino does have better coverage moves, but Aipom has Brick Break which KOes Pawniard. Minccino is just murdered by Pawniard. Aipom has access to Taunt, so Aipom isn't just a wallbreaker; it is also an effective anti-lead. Aipom bulk is usable (again, comparing with Minccino, both holding Eviolite, and giving 76 HP EVs for both, Aipom gets 23 HP 18 Def, 18 Special Def while Minccino only gets 23 HP, 15 Def and 15 Special Def. Any decent Fighting-type attack KOes Minccino, while Aipom survives.) and Fury Swipes does the amount of damage needed without Life Orb. Speed tying with Misdreavus is very useful. Man, there are a lot of reasons you would use Aipom over Minccino (btw, most Minccino runs Adamant.).
If both Aipom and Minccino are running Jolly Life Orb, Tail Slap will will always be at least as strong (and more accurate I guess) and can deal more damage on targets with Eviolite intact. Adamant Life Orb Aipom can simulate this damage, and still keep the the extra bulk, though it basically just becomes a slightly better Minccino.196 Atk Aipom Fury Swipes (5 hits) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Staryu: 15-20 (78.9 - 105.2%) -- approx. 6.3% chance to OHKO
236+ Atk Mienfoo High Jump Kick vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Staryu: 15-18 (78.9 - 94.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 16, 18)
Yes, aipom is "weak"
It plain outclasses minccino, tail slap is sometimes weaker than aipom's fury swipes... minccino has nothing over aipom
I don't see how listng Chilla as Adamant makes much sense when it hardly makes a difference to use adamant. Jolly did the same damage. I don't know why you're doing Fighting calcs either because you shouldn't be keeping either of them in on those.I agree with you about Fury Swipes being overrated, but Aipom is stronger in any other moves comparing with Minccino. Comparing it to Aipom makes me sad lol. Minccino does have better coverage moves, but Aipom has Brick Break which KOes Pawniard. Minccino is just murdered by Pawniard. Aipom has access to Taunt, so Aipom isn't just a wallbreaker; it is also an effective anti-lead. Aipom bulk is usable (again, comparing with Minccino, both holding Eviolite, and giving 76 HP EVs for both, Aipom gets 23 HP 18 Def, 18 Special Def while Minccino only gets 23 HP, 15 Def and 15 Special Def. Any decent Fighting-type attack KOes Minccino, while Aipom survives.) and Fury Swipes does the amount of damage needed without Life Orb. Speed tying with Misdreavus is very useful. Man, there are a lot of reasons you would use Aipom over Minccino (btw, most Minccino runs Adamant.).
This is just an example: 196 Atk Aipom Fury Swipes (5 hits) vs. 0 HP / 36 Def Eviolite Mienfoo: 15-20 (71.4 - 95.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO while 196+ Atk Minccino Tail Slap (5 hits) vs. 0 HP / 36 Def Eviolite Mienfoo: 15-20 (71.4 - 95.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO. Yes this is Aipom without Life Orb and Jolly. Comparing bulk: 236 Atk Mienfoo Drain Punch vs. 76 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Aipom: 18-24 (78.2 - 104.3%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO while 236 Atk Mienfoo Drain Punch vs. 76 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Minccino: 20-26 (86.9 - 113%) -- 75% chance to OHKO. Again, only examples, but most neutral hits only 3HKO Aipom. Minccino, due to its bulk and usually less speed is easily revenge killed. While Minccino Tail Slap is indeed very powerful, it doesn't have its power its other moves without Life Orb.
Finnaly, let's see the 3 S-rank mon. Mienfoo usually wins against both, tho Evio Aipom has a 47% chance to beat offensive one. Pawniard murders Minccino, but Aipom wins against Pawn. Missy can just burn Minccino and done while Aipom threatens Misdreavus due to the speed tie. That's it, Aipom has solid chances to beat two of the most common Pokemon in the tier, while Minccino can't beat none of them. So I am supporting Aipom for B+ due to A) It's an effective anti-lead, with Taunt and outspeeding all common leads. Btw, it stops any kind of set up sweeper. B) Incredible wallbreaker, 2HKOing all the meta which doesn't resist Fury Swipes, while outspeeding it too. C) Has all its coverage moves it needs with elemental punches, Brick Break and even Gunk Shot to aim Spritzee. Access to U-turn allows Aipom to create momentum, specially due to its causing a lot of switches D) Has a extensive movepool with a lot of fun options that could work such as Hone Claws and Baton Pass. Shame on Aipom that it doesn't get Tail Slap or a better typing, but it's better than Minccino, that's it. I will latter make a C-rank list too.
Finally, I would like to nominate Buizel for D. It's incredibly frail and its offensive stats aren't even that impressive, but it's quite fast and can pass Bulk Up. Mienfoo and, to a lesser extent, Torchic might appear to outclass it in such a role, and they are honestly probably more reliable, but Buizel is faster than Mienfoo, and can actually use its boosted attacks by firing off powerful Waterfalls before passing them off, unlike Torchic. Buizel also has a weak and mostly irrelevant Aqua Jet, and has a very small niche over other Rain Dance sweepers such as Kabuto and Omanyte through its neutrality to Mach Punch and Vacuum Wave in exchange for a neutrality to Acrobatics and Fake Out, as well as greater base speed for when the rain runs out.I think Corphish deserves a mention simply due to its raw power; if something doesn't resist Crabhammer, it dies.
196 Atk Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. 212 HP / 196+ Def Eviolite Spritzee: 10-14 (37 - 51.8%) -- 88.7% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
+1 196 Atk Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. 36 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Misdreavus: 22-26 (95.6 - 113%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 196 Atk Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. 0 HP / 236 Def Eviolite Mienfoo: 18-22 (85.7 - 104.7%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
196 Atk Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. 156 HP / 92 Def Fletchling: 22-26 (95.6 - 113%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
Now, regarding Chinchou -
196 Atk Corphish Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 76 HP / 212+ Def Eviolite Chinchou: 6-8 (24 - 32%) -- 11.7% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock
(6, 6, 6, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 8)
196 Atk Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. 76 HP / 212+ Def Chinchou: 9-11 (36 - 44%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
(9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 11)
196 Atk Adaptability Corphish Aqua Jet vs. 76 HP / 212+ Def Chinchou: 4-5 (16 - 20%) -- possible 5HKO after Stealth Rock
(4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 5)
This means that on average, if Stealth Rock is up, even defensive Chinchou will actually only be able to switch into Corphish once; a combination of Knock Off and switching into Stealth Rock twice will usually put Chinchou within KO range of Crabhammer and Aqua Jet; more offensive variants of Chinchou will be even less reliable switch-ins.
Foongus is able to repeatedly switch into Eviolite Corphish with impunity, but dealing with Life Orb Corphish will be much more troublesome once Foongus's Eviolite is gone.
196+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. 124 HP / 160+ Def Foongus: 13-16 (52 - 64%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Now, Corphish doesn't really have a ton of options to get past Croagunk except for the fairly gimmicky Aerial Ace, but the same applies to Carvanha (who can certainly run Zen Headbutt, but that's also a bit niche). However, although Carvanha is the far better cleaner, Corphish is actually able to take a hit or two, on top of possessing Knock Off to permanently cripple specific Pokemon to compensate for a lack of Destiny Bond.
+2 196+ Atk Fletchling Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 0 HP / 76 Def Eviolite Corphish: 16-21 (80 - 105%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
+2 196+ Atk Fletchling Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 0 HP / 36 Def Carvanha: 39-46 (185.7 - 219%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 156 Atk Scraggy High Jump Kick vs. 0 HP / 76 Def Eviolite Corphish: 16-19 (80 - 95%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 156 Atk Scraggy High Jump Kick vs. 0 HP / 36 Def Carvanha: 72-86 (342.8 - 409.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
I understand that using Stealth Rock for Corphish's offensive calculations but not its defensive calculations is unfair, but I'm just trying to make a point here; although boosted and super-effective hits can be troublesome, Corphish is usually able to survive physical attacks that are neither with ease.
Even outside of the sheer power of Crabhammer (recalling how it OHKOs bulky Fletchling after any prior damage), Corphish still has a fairly potent Aqua Jet, a good utility move in Knock Off, and solid set-up options in Dragon Dance and Swords Dance. Corphish might not be the most notable Pokemon in the current metagame, but I don't think it should be discounted as a threat.
tbh Honedge isn't as bad as what people are making it out to be. Birdspam's popularity gives it a niche, as it can very well find an opportunity to come in and get a hit in. Look at what is currently being used. Fletchling and Misdreavus will hate taking a Shadow Sneak or a Rock Slide. The common check to Ghosts, scarf Pawniard, hates taking a Sacred Sword from an Automatized Honedge.
It's true that Honedge does have 4MSS, but it's still capable of being a threat to some top pokemon. Should we really ignore that?
Fairies are a major part of LC right now, along with Fletchling and Misdreavus. Let's not count Honedge out because of FMSS And common weaknesses.Honedge is one of the most underrated Pokemon of all time, even without Meditite around.
1) Counters Fletchling; it can easily be EV'd to take Overheat + Acrobatics. Sets up SD on non Overheat variants.
2) Counters Spritzee and is a good alternative to poisons/other steels since unlike Magnemite, it doesn't need Sturdy to retain bulk etc.
3) Great sweeper late game, with Abra and Misdreavus everywhere Shadow Sneak becomes an excellent cleaning tool.
4) BULK like can take a Knock Off and Archen EQ (iirc) among other things. Even takes a Missy Shadow Ball most of the time (SD + Sneak is awesome).
5) Offensive pressure, not many things can switch in, especially if paired with a Knock Off user who can do work on Mienfoo and Timburr.