NU Hippopotas

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Overview
########

Hippopotas find its place in NU as a very reliable sand setter, and the only one with Sand Stream. A decent defensive typing, access to Stealth Rock, and reliable recovery in Slack Off makes it a reliable, albeit specific, team supporter. However, due to its low base stats, it's fairly frail even when invested, and is prone to being set up on unless it runs a phazing move. Its typing leaves Hippopotas weak to common special Water- and Grass-type moves. Because of the unique support it gives, it only fits on a certain type of team and fails to do much other than set up sand.

Sand Support
########
name: Sand Support
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: Toxic / Earthquake
move 3: Whirlwind
move 4: Slack Off
ability: Sand Stream
item: Smooth Rock / Eviolite
evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
nature: Impish

Moves
========

Stealth Rock gives Hippopotas entry hazards support, and damages Flying-types, which are immune to Earthquake. Whirlwind can phaze out anything that tries to set up on Hippopotas and racks up hazard damage. Yawn can be used instead of Whirlwind to force switches. It's more unreliable, but it can spread sleep and help bring in team members safely on predicted double switches or on sleeping Pokemon. Slack Off is reliable recovery and ensures that Hippopotas stays healthy thoughout the game. Earthquake hits Rock- and Steel-types decently hard, but it should rarely be used, as Hippopotas has a low Attack stat. Toxic can be used as a more reliable way to damage the opposing team.

Set Details
========

The EVs listed give the most physical bulk possible. Smooth Rock extends the turns of sand from five to eight, which in most situations is preferable over the extra bulk from Eviolite. Sand Stream is mandatory, as it is the only reason to use Hippopotas. Eviolite can be used over Smooth Rock to give Hippopotas better overall bulk. However, Eviolite forces Hippopotas to switch in more to keep up sand.

Usage Tips
========

Hippopotas is used for the support it gives its team, so it should be in as little as possible when sand is already up to avoid wasting sand turns. However, it can still set up Stealth Rock or take on weaker physical attackers if needed. Note that even with defensive investment Hippopotas is fairly frail, so avoid strong attackers and powerful moves. When switching Hippopotas in make sure it will live the entry hazards damage as Sand Stream activates after hazards damage.

Team Options
========

Pokemon that work well with Hippopotas can take advantage of the sand it brings. Sand Rush users such as Stoutland and Sandslash are a must, as they become dangerous sweepers with boosted Speed under sand. Rock-types such as Cradily, Rhydon, and Carracosta get their Special Defense boosted by the sand, allowing them to more effectively do their jobs. Other options to consider are Pokemon with Sand Veil such as Cacturne that benefit from the evasion boost that sand gives it. Specially defensive Pokemon such as Dragalge that resist common Grass- and Water-type moves aimed at Hippopotas can support it. A Pokemon with Sandstorm can be used to relieve the pressure on Hippopotas. While it is not mandatory as Hippopotas can function without it, Rapid Spin or Defog support helps it to switch in more times throughout a game.

Other Options
########

Hippopotas doesn't have much else to offer. A set with Bulldoze is possible to lower the opponent's Speed for a bit more team support. Sandstorm can also be used to beat opposing weather starters that try to remove the sand that Hippopotas sets up.

Checks & Counters
########

**Weather Starters**: Opposing weather starters can replace the sand Hippopotas sets up with a different weather.

**Entry Hazards**: As Hippopotas will be switching in and out a lot, it's easy to wear it down with Spikes, Toxic Spikes, and Stealth Rock as it has no passive recovery.

**Special Attackers**: Any powerful special attacker will take Hippopotas out in a few hits, even with neutral STAB moves. Most Pokemon with a special super effective move can easily deal with it.

**Super Effective Moves**: Both physical and special super effective moves can easily take non-Eviolite Hippopotas out.
 
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Blast

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I don't really think Slack Off is all that necessary tbh. When I used Hippo I literally never even touched it once, and staying in for multiple turns to Slack Off obviously isn't ideal as sand turns are limited. It resists SR anyway so it shouldn't be too hard to keep alive (barring when you need to sack it to get off one last round of sand, and Slack Off is obviously useless then). I would replace it with Sandstorm as it allows you to combat opposing weather teams since you can spam Sandstorm vs opposing weather setters and deny their setup.

I'll post more later probably
 

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I have found something similar myself, but I don't like removing slack off entirely because it does help when you're up against spikes, which will happen more than opposing weather teams (most likely). Slashed with Slack Off for now, I'd like some other opinions on this though.

This is QC ready I guess.
 
Its bulk is not really that incredibly bad and its more than enough to reliably get SR up and fire off an eq against most lead mons so I think "terrible" is a stretch :/
 

Quite Quiet

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Changed the wording describing its bulk. I might have been a bit too harsh on it. Also added a mention of sandstorm in Moves.

Dat Blast did you have anything else?
 

Ares

Fool me...can't get fooled again
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Its bulk galbia is severely lacking without running eviolite and on a sand team getting max amount of sand turns is ideal, so smooth rock is the superior option. When I was using it I found that I never really ended up using slack off, but at the same time I dont think I would of used Sandstorm either. That being said weather teams are on the rise so I could see how that might be useful.
Since Sandstorm is being mentioned as a move under C&C I would mention other weather setters.
Under team options mention things like Cacturne that can abuse sand veil.
When mentioning Dragalge in team options say it can take powerful grass/water mons so that way you arent completely beat by them
 

scorpdestroyer

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I think WW / Yawn should be moved to the third or even the second slot and EQ shifted to fourth because EQ is lame; realistically you're not hitting anything with it for much damage anyways and phazing or switching out is probably a better option in many cases. As for why it deserves second slot is because Hippo is huge setup fodder otherwise and really likes phazing.

Regarding the slashes, what does QC think of this:

Sand Support
########
name: Sand Support
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: Whirlwind / Yawn
move 3: Slack Off
move 4: Sandstorm / Earthquake
ability: Sand Stream
item: Smooth Rock
evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
nature: Impish

I feel that Slack Off is quite a useful move and deserves its own slot. This is because sand teams are quite heavily dependent on it for sand and it needs to be alive. Slack Off may be situational but it helps when Hippo is trying to pivot switch or has multiple hazards on its side. Sandstorm helps against opposing weather but realistically it'll only be temporary because they can just send in their prankster immediately after a sweeper dies; sand has a terrible matchup vs opposing weather and sandstorm in this slot only helps a little bit. EQ can sorta get a spot I guess, if only because it's an attacking move, but I would be fine with dropping it altogether and mentioning it in OO as well.

Thoughts?

Edit: EQ 2HKOs weather Liepard so it's probably ok. What about the set order?
 
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CanadianWifier

Run Away With Me
I think EQ is worthy of a slot by itself, hitting stuff with a 100BP STAB move is nothing terrible, and prevents it from being taunt fodder.

will check later more thoroughly quite quite, super duper tired atm and would probably miss a lot. n_n
 

Ares

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I agree that EQ is deserving of a slot of its own because once you run into a taunt user then it can be quite frustrating when all you can do is struggle.
 

CanadianWifier

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I mean in the case that you did get taunted, you'd switch out and not waste sand turns using struggle, but this at least gives it a fighting chance against the [only?] two taunt users in the whole tier; Qwilfish and Liepard. [srsly, what the hell else gets taunt in nu this gen]
 

Ares

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There is actually 55 taunt users, and 92 in the NFE section. The issue is that pretty much every one of them has something better to be doing even Liepard, I would say Missy and Qwil are probably the best users.
But EQ still deserves a move slot as there are plenty of situations where you might need to get damage or kill something that could threaten one of your sweepers. Not being able to attack seriously hurts a lot of pokemon and I try to avoid it unless I'm doing something gimmicky with Smeargle lol.
 

scorpdestroyer

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Made you do some changes on PS chat. In addition to those,
- Add Carracosta when mentioning Rock-types as teammates

I feel like checks and counters should be more specific but then Hippo has a lot of counters... If other QC members know how to improve this please post here. I'll approve it for now because everything else is ok

QC 1/3
 

Ares

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Perhaps mentioning a few common users under super effective could help, even though that encompasses at least half of the tier. Along with some powerful special attackers, pretty much ones of your choice as once again half the tier KO's hippo without evio.
 

CanadianWifier

Run Away With Me
Finally getting around to a full rate that you asked for like 12151 times:]

Overview
########
  • I'd remove the mention of Roar, there's no reason to run it with Whirlwind being better in every way.
  • "Needs the team built around it to function at its best" makes it sound like you build around Hippo. you dont, you simply use it for the sand. maybe re-word?
  • idk how relevant it is to mention there's only 2 weather starters. just say that it provides auto-sand for its teammates.
Moves
########
  • If yawn is more unreliable than whirlwind, why does it deserve a slash? Either explain how it can give free switches into a sweeper, or move it to OO / moves.
  • mention that the reason you use Smooth Rock over eviolite is because the set is used for Sand and sand only, not trying to wall. Newer players might be tempted to try eviolite and you should explain why not to :]

Usage Tips
########
  • idk if shying players away from bring it in is the right thing to do. Maybe re-word it to something along the lines of, "Don't expect it to take many strong hits, so be wary of bringing it in vs powerful attacks." I just don't want people to avoid bringing it in in fear of letting it die, when it might be the best play.

I'd also be okay with slashing EQ over Slack off. As Dat Blast said, you vary rarely use it, and EQ at least prevents you from being Taunt bait - and most of the taunt users in NU are eitehr frail or weak to ground [liepard, qwilfish]. Sandstorm as a move seems at least useful enough to be a main slash.


Implement all these and you got yourself a shiny new [QC 2/3]
 
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Finally getting around to a full rate that you asked for like 12151 times:]
I asked twice smh

Edited everything above I think, although I'm kind of conflicted with slack off because it helps about as much as sandstorm and earthquake does.

Should the slash be like:

move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: Whirlwind / Yawn
move 3: Slack Off / Earthquake
move 4: Sandstorm

or should earthquake get slashed before slack off?
 

soulgazer

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Sand Support
########
name: Sand Support
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: Toxic / Earthquake
move 3: Whirlwind
move 4: Slack Off
ability: Sand Stream
item: Smooth Rock / Eviolite
evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
nature: Impish

that should be the set. Yawn mentionned in Moves. Oh and Eviolite should be mentionned in Set Details as it is better than just OO as Eviolite gives you a more reliable Stealth Rock setter and now an answer to Rotom if the team needs Hippopotas to be able to switch into it.

252 SpA Rotom Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Hippopotas: 138-163 (40.5 - 47.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

It might even deserve a slash on the set imo. Yes the main drawback of using Eviolite is that you will get less turns of Sandstorm than with Smooth Rock, but you gain better overall bulk by doing so. Stoutland only really need two or three turn to do its job before being forced out, so the lack of 8 turns shouldn't be an issue (especially when it will also be easier to keep Hippopotas alive during the game).

Dat Blast Sandstorm is bad and you should feel bad tbh
 

Punchshroom

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If Hippo does manage to get Taunted, it would probably be in its best interest to gtfo instead of sticking around EQing and waste precious Sand turns.
 

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You can argue all moves are useless because it's just supposed to get sand up

Unless QC want to change the moveset one more time, this should be ready for QC 3
 
I have to question the viability of Hippopotas without Smooth Rock.
Considering the whole point of Sand is activating Sand Rush (and Sand Force I guess?) wouldn't you be better off running a manual Sandstorm user in that case? It's less predictable and can accomplish more than just setting up Sand and then getting KO'd/forced out/become set-up bait.
 
I have to question the viability of Hippopotas without Smooth Rock.
Considering the whole point of Sand is activating Sand Rush (and Sand Force I guess?) wouldn't you be better off running a manual Sandstorm user in that case? It's less predictable and can accomplish more than just setting up Sand and then getting KO'd/forced out/become set-up bait.
But taking a turn to setup sandstorm kills momentum. Being able to switch in and immediately is a great thing that only Hippopotas can do.
 

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