NU Dodrio



QC Checks: scorpdestroyer / Punchshroom / Dat Blast

GP Checks: Electrolyte / fleurdyleurse

Overview
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With its high Speed and Attack stats, Dodrio makes for a hard-hitting hole-puncher. Along with its powerful STAB attacks, Return and Brave Bird, it has access to the coveted Knock Off. However, it faces huge competition from other Normal-types, such as Kangaskhan, Swellow, and Zangoose, has low defenses, and is weak to Stealth Rock; it is also completely walled by Rock- and Steel-types.

Choice Band
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name: Choice Band
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Return
move 3: Knock Off
move 4: Quick Attack
ability: Early Bird
item: Choice Band
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
nature: Jolly

Moves
========

Brave Bird is Dodrio's main STAB move, hitting extremely hard with a Choice Band, while Return is the other STAB option that is a bit more reliable, as it doesn't deal recoil damage, and provides decent coverage. Knock Off is one of the only reasons to use Dodrio, as it is a powerful attack and utility move that removes threatening opponents' items, such as Rhydon's Eviolite, as well as hitting Rotom for super effective damage. Lastly, Quick Attack can be used as a hard-hitting priority move to finish off faster, weakened Pokemon.

Set Details
========

The EVs used maximize Dodrio's Attack and Speed, its best and most prevalent stats. Choice Band is the best item to give Dodrio, letting it act as a wallbreaker and clean through teams with its extremely powerful STAB attacks. A Jolly nature is used to allow Dodrio to have a high enough Speed stat to outspeed or Speed tie with relevant Pokemon, such as Rotom, Jynx, Xatu, Typhlosion, Ninetales, Kangaskhan, and Electivire. However, an Adamant nature can be used to hit harder and still lets Dodrio outspeed Jolly-natured base 85 Speed Pokemon such as Sawk. It can also get important OHKOs on Pokemon such as Mesprit and Dragon Dance Feraligatr. Lastly, Early Bird is the ability of choice because it is the only ability that is useful enough to use, and allows Dodrio to wake up quickly if it's ever put to sleep.

Usage Tips
========

Try to remove entry hazards for Dodrio, as it does not appreciate taking Stealth Rock damage. Rock- and Steel-type Pokemon should be removed beforehand so that Dodrio can have an easier time picking off the opponent's Pokemon. Dodrio's most powerful move is Brave Bird; hence, it should be used most of the time. Return is a more reliable STAB move, and should be used whenever Brave Bird's recoil is not wanted. Always predict switch-ins, and use Knock Off to cripple Pokemon such as Rhydon and Rotom, as Dodrio does not want to be caught off guard and helpless. Use Dodrio mid- to late-game for best results, as you'll want Dodrio as a hole-puncher and revenge killer that can easily take out slower opponents.

Team Options
========

Steel-types such as Steelix and Pawniard make for good teammates, as they can beat threatening Rock- and Ice-type Pokemon for Dodrio. Additionally, Steelix can set up Stealth Rock, and Dodrio appreciates its ability to wear down Steel- and Rock-type Pokemon. Ground-types work especially well with Dodrio, as they are able to take out Electric-, Steel-, and Rock-types, which are Dodrio's main counters, with great ease. Additionally, Ground-types appreciate Dodrio's ability to take out Grass-types. Sandslash is one of Dodrio's best teammates, as it can also Rapid Spin away Stealth Rock, which Dodrio dislikes. Water-type Pokemon such as Feraligatr and Gorebyss that can set up on Steel- and Rock-types are good teammates, as they can eliminate Dodrio's biggest threats. In particular, Kabutops and Swanna make for good teammates, as they can help prevent Dodrio from taking Stealth Rock damage with Rapid Spin and Defog, respectively. Finally, Guts users such as Gurdurr and Hariyama make for good teammates, as they can absorb status, and can beat Steel- and Rock-types that give Dodrio trouble.

Other Options
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Dodrio has quite a varied movepool that includes support moves, boosting moves, and even reliable recovery. Agility can be used to allow Dodrio to outspeed any unboosted threat, though such a set would miss the sheer power of Choice Band. Baton Pass can be used if Dodrio uses boosting moves such as Acupressure or Agility. Taunt can be used to effectively stop walls, but Dodrio is too frail to utilize it properly. Pursuit can be used to catch Pokemon switching out off guard, but Knock Off is usually the superior choice. Roost can be used for a reliable source of recovery, but Dodrio would almost always rather just punch holes in its opponents. Dodrio can use some other items effectively. A Life Orb can be used to hit almost as hard as Choice Band, while allowing it to switch moves. Its recoil, however, is almost always detrimental for Dodrio. Finally, a Choice Scarf set can be used as a revenge killer, but that role is typically done better by other Choice Scarf users, such as Rotom and Pyroar.

Checks & Counters
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**Steel-types**: Steel-types such as Bastiodon, Probopass, Steelix, and Klinklang can all switch in on Dodrio, and take relatively little damage from any of its moves. Bastiodon and Probopass can status it and wear it down, while Steelix can quickly take it out with an attacking move. Additionally, Klinklang can even render it setup bait, and proceed to sweep.

**Rock-types**: Rock-types such as Kabutops, Carracosta, Regirock, Rhydon, and Golem can switch into and tank any of Dodrio's attacks. Carracosta can use Dodrio as setup bait, while the other three can either set up Stealth Rock or quickly dispose of it with a STAB Rock-type move. Kabutops and Golem cannot switch in too many times, however, as they are worn down quite easily.

**Faster Pokemon**: Faster Pokemon such as Archeops, Swellow, Scarf Typhlosion, Choice Scarf Rotom, and Sneasel can all outspeed Dodrio and easily revenge kill it with their hard-hitting respective STAB moves. They cannot switch in most of the time, however, as they take loads of damage from Dodrio's attacks.

**Status**: Burns from Pokemon such as Weezing, paralysis from Pokemon such as Lanturn and Granbull, and poison from any walls all hinder Dodrio, halving its Attack, drastically cutting its Speed, and wearing it down gradually, respectively.
 
Last edited:
Move Pursuit to OO, make Knock Off the only slash. Knock Off is Dodrio's niche.

mention that Dodrio has a lot of competition for a teamslot. Usually I would rather use Swellow / Kangaskhan over Dodrio on most teams. Its access to Knock Off is the one thing that seperates it.

You should also be a bit more specific in your team options section

Also, most Electric types arent a big problem for Dodrio (aside from revenge killing). As it can 1 or 2HKO them with Return, and when I used Dodrio, I found myself using return just as often as Brave Bird. ALso Dodrio is still an iffy Vileplume check, because Sludge Bomb still does a lot.

Try to fix this up a bit and make it clear that Dodrio is a niche Pokemon that competes with lots of things for a team slot. Once thats done ill check this again / likely stamp it
 

jake

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make a tiny mention of adamant, which outruns up to jolly sawk. power change isn't too big but it does hit harder than speedybird in any case:

252+ Atk Choice Band Dodrio Brave Bird vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Feraligatr: 288-339 (92.3 - 108.6%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Dodrio Brave Bird vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Feraligatr: 262-309 (83.9 - 99%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Guts Swellow Facade (140 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Feraligatr: 256-303 (82 - 97.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Dodrio Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mesprit: 296-350 (98 - 115.8%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO !

it's worth using, esp if you consider that a very large majority of pokemon can't OHKO mesprit turn one (it can OHKO with BB too).

--

your checks and counters feel weird. don't mention electrode, it should probably never see much use. point out that it only has quick attack to hit pokemon that are faster and it's relatively frail. idk what header you'd put it under, but SR support + something that can tank at least one hit will put it out for good thanks to bleh defenses and BB recoil. bastiodon isn't really an ideal sr setter for any pokemon; probably don't mention it as a teammate (it's ok for a counter i suppose). please don't mention armaldo.. it gets ohkoed by BB after SR.

probably will have more later
 

scorpdestroyer

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Set Details: Adamant only guarantees the KO on Feraligatr after Stealth Rock and only if it's DD Gatr, so mention this (DD Gatr isn't so common so it isn't "critical" IMO :o). Mesprit is also only KOed after Stealth Rock.

In Usage Tips, your writing sounds like Dodrio should avoid switching in at all costs as long as hazards are up, which isn't very true. Reword this a little to reflect that Dodrio appreciates a clear field, but not to the extent where it absolutely requires them removed as if it were Shedinja

Under Team Options, explain more clearly why Steel-types are good teammates. Also when saying Stealth Rockers / hazard setters are good, you might want to list a more significant purpose of hazards (Spikes wears down Rocks and Steels, list a KO it gets with SR if possible)

TO: Mention Pokemon that have a good matchup vs Rock- and Steel-types and can potentially set up on them if you double out correctly (eg. Gorebyss, Feraligatr)

OO: remove Accupressure, Haze, Endeavor Sash (I don't mind SubEndeavor but Sash is a little gimmicky) and Drill Peck -- they're either worthless or done better by other Pokemon. Also I guess you can keep Steel Wing but state that you should almost never use it because its primary target, Rhydon, takes jack from it.

252 Atk Choice Band Dodrio Steel Wing vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Eviolite Rhydon: 116-138 (28 - 33.3%) -- 0% chance to 3HKO
 

Quite Quiet

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Firstly, you still didn't remove Drill Peck like Scorpdestroyer said and personally I want Steel Wing removed as well, it removes way more useful moves for very little benefit (Brave Bird does 2/3 of the damage Steel Wing does, for example).

Secondly, Ferroseed is actially a really really shaky check to Dodrio so I'm not sure it deserves a mention.
(252 Atk Choice Band Dodrio Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Ferroseed: 135-159 (46.2 - 54.4%) -- 97.7% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock)
Floatzel is also weird to mention, it's not a very relevant Pokemon in the metagame at all. At least make it Liepard/Sneasel/Pyroar/Mismagius or something would be better (not Cryogonal, it dies to QA).

The entire C&C needs fleshing out with descriptions too, just listing pokemon isn't enough.

Also make an example of spinners/defoggers when you list them as good team mates.

Lastly, you don't spell appreciate with a w. ._.
 
Firstly, you still didn't remove Drill Peck like Scorpdestroyer said and personally I want Steel Wing removed as well, it removes way more useful moves for very little benefit (Brave Bird does 2/3 of the damage Steel Wing does, for example).

Secondly, Ferroseed is actially a really really shaky check to Dodrio so I'm not sure it deserves a mention.
(252 Atk Choice Band Dodrio Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Ferroseed: 135-159 (46.2 - 54.4%) -- 97.7% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock)
Floatzel is also weird to mention, it's not a very relevant Pokemon in the metagame at all. At least make it Liepard/Sneasel/Pyroar/Mismagius or something would be better (not Cryogonal, it dies to QA).

The entire C&C needs fleshing out with descriptions too, just listing pokemon isn't enough.

Also make an example of spinners/defoggers when you list them as good team mates.

Lastly, you don't spell appreciate with a w. ._.
I was actually pondering this myself, and I really dont think Steel Wing deserves oo either. Removed.

As for C&C, yeah I put some more relevant threats. Thanks.

I usually do this after around the second check, so it will get done obviously.

Sure ill add exmples of hazard removers.

lol at last comment.

Thanks for your overal input Quite Quiet!
 

Blast

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Overview doesn't need so many points. First point is fluff and a lot of points just state obvious stuff that's already visible straight from the analysis page (i.e. stats, movepool, etc).

Brave Bird is definitely far more reliable then Return in terms of spammability. Return's advantage is no recoil and hitting non-Rotom Electric-types harder. Speaking of which, Knock Off isn't really for Ghosts as BB hits most hard enough barring Rotom (which you should take note of). It's also for crippling counters like Rhydon and removing Eviolite / Leftovers.

Archeops shouldn't be mentioned in the Rock-types section imo cause that gives off the idea that it can outright wall Dodrio. Just mention it in faster mons
 
stuff that has Healing Wish is pretty good in team options *hint hint Mesprit/Lilligant. SO that it can wreck shop[ with brave Bird two or three times onlky to come back and fdo it again!
 

scorpdestroyer

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As Dat Blast said: Knock Off isn't really for Ghosts as BB hits most hard enough barring Rotom (which you should take note of). It's also for crippling counters like Rhydon and removing Eviolite / Leftovers.

Implement this ^ and QC 1/3
 
Just wondering, but couldn't Return be replaced with Thrash and Early Bird with Tangled Feet? Thrash grants more base power and after 2-3 turns Dodrio's evasion is doubled due Tangled Feet.

this worked quite well for me.
 

Blast

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Thrash is bad. It forces you to stay in after using it which makes you easy pickings for anything that can live it, and Tangled Feet is luck-based. Also, you have to be confused to activate Tangled Feet, so it's not like you're in the clear from getting haxed lol (it ~can~ go into OO but I wouldn't ever use it)

Anyway Usage Tips are kind of weird. You focus too much on how its teammates should play rather than Dodrio itself; talk about what it does when it's actually on the field, what it can do against counters, etc etc etc.
 

Punchshroom

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Completely walled by Steel
Dodrio has a hard time against Rock-types as well.

-Knock Off is one of the only reasons to use Dodrio, as it is a powerful attack and utility move that removes threatening opponents items such as Rhydon's Eviolite, as well as hitting Ghost-types such as Rotom.
You didn't implement scorp's changes.

-Jolly is the nature of choice as it allows Dodrio to have a high enough speed to break through teams.
You need to phrase this correctly, otherwise people will misinterpret this and assume Adamant is better for "breaking through teams". Mention that Jolly is important to allow Dodrio to outspeed / speedtie relevant Pokemon such as Rotom, Jynx, Xatu, Typhlosion, Ninetales etc.

-Early Bird is the ability of choice because it is the only ability that is useful enough to use, and allows Dodrio to really check Vileplume well.
You did not implement FLCL's mentions of Dodrio being an iffy Plume check. You could say Early Bird allows Dodrio to absorb sleep for the team (thus preventing other teammates from being put to sleep) and can wake up quickly if it needs to attack

Usage Tips really needs to touch upon Dodrio's holepunching capabilities, as Flying is a powerful offensive type.

Mention Return's lack of recoil.

Implement this & Dat Blast's changes and consider this QC 2/3.
 

Ares

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Please fill out the C&C section, do this tag me back and I'll check it.
 

Ares

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252 Atk Choice Band Dodrio Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Ferroseed: 135-159 (46.2 - 54.4%) -- 53.1% chance to 2HKO Remove Ferroseed, it cant switch into Dodrio. Remove Pawniard for the same reason, as it is 2HKOd by brave bird. Remove the point about Knock Off hurting, doesnt really make to much sense. Give a couple of scenarios for Steel- and Rock-types.
Mention how Faster Pokemon can not switch in on Dodrio and give a scenario of it switching in.
Give examples of Pokemon that like to run each status.
 

Blast

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Mention LO somewhere, I know Brawlfest used it to decent success since switching up moves is nice. Recoil stacked with BB probably isn't worth it most of the time though it should at least be mentioned.

Your description of Early Bird is still kind of weird. Dodrio doesn't "absorb" sleep and it's already kind of risky switching it into Vileplume's Sludge Bomb or Jynx's anything. Just say it allows it to wake up faster if it's ever put to sleep

Usage Tips are still kind of dry, remove the point about "switching it in when necessary" and add more detail into explaining when and what moves Dodrio should lock itself into.
 

Ares

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After you implement the changes I mentioned in PM about Kabutops and adding Rhydon to C&C I give my go ahead, but I'm going to let Dat Blast give the final check so he can look over the changes, which you said you implemented.
 

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