ORAS General Discussion - Mark 2 - Spoilers Inside

[stage7_4]

That's true, and I'm glad they are doing something to help out Magma and Aqua. Because let's face it, they used to be the whipping boys as far as pokemon evil teams go.

Flare, Plasma, Cipher, and Galactic all seemed much grander in scale, and either had more sympathetic motives or were just flat out more ruthless (at least, as far as you could go in a pokemon game). Team Rocket had nostalgia factor to be sure, but they also had Giovanni and the rival from Gold/Sliver/HGSS along with actual hostage situations and theft (so they appeared to be the most active team).

Aqua and Magma before now were just those petty eco-terrorists that spouted nonsense and were playing with forces beyond their kindergarten understanding. Both said it was for the greater good of the world, but neither really understood what that meant or how wrong their premise was (habitat destruction, to help you!)

While I still wonder if they can fully shake this and grow out of Captain Planet villain and into something better, this at least seems to be a step in the right direction.

 

[Kurona]

We do know of one plot deviation already, where we seem to end up having a double battle with Tabitha from Magma and Matt from Aqua, which didn't even happen in Emerald, and suggests that we end up fighting both teams to some extent anyway.

I'm pretty sure that was stated to be demo-exclusive?
Regardless I agree completely with what you're saying, there's definite changes being made to emphasize the differences between them. Like actual personalities being given to them. I especially like the contrast between Tabitha and Matt; Tabitha's a Starscream while Matt's a... less intelligent Soundwave. (Lugnut???)

 

[Pikachu315111]

It seems to me that one of the biggest issue people have had with Ruby and Sapphire was that Aqua and Magma were just carbon copies of each other, and did everything identically, despite the promise of two different teams; the only differences were in the color of the sprites, and whether you wanted to fight a Carvanha or a Numel. Game Freak may have taken this into consideration, considering the obvious effort they're putting into the characters. We do know of one plot deviation already, where we seem to end up having a double battle with Tabitha from Magma and Matt from Aqua, which didn't even happen in Emerald, and suggests that we end up fighting both teams to some extent anyway.

I think the Tabitha & Matt double battle is just for the demo. I wouldn't be surprise if there was also a Courtney & Shelly double battle and a Archie & Maxie double battle. They want to advertise both games and the best way to do that is by battling one member of each team.

Ooh! I just remembered something! In BW2 the ex-Rocket Grunt was replaced by a couple who reveal they were an ex-Magma and ex-Aqua grunt but they don't want to tell the other one that. Do you think we'll see them in the game?

 

[Kurona]

I think the Tabitha & Matt double battle is just for the demo. I wouldn't be surprise if there was also a Courtney & Shelly double battle and a Archie & Maxie double battle. They want to advertise both games and the best way to do that is by battling one member of each team.

Ooh! I just remembered something! In BW2 the ex-Rocket Grunt was replaced by a couple who reveal they were an ex-Magma and ex-Aqua grunt but they don't want to tell the other one that. Do you think we'll see them in the game?

I don't think it likely. It was just a cute little reference and it'd be very odd to just shoehorn it in. Unless it was just two random grunts in the game that make some offhand comment like "maybe I should retire to Unova..." after being beaten or something.

 

[Mario With Lasers]

Creating/destroying ENERGY is so far impossible.

Just want to point out Victini is the only pokémon that canonically can create energy, and V-Create is a signature move that represents that.

 

[Pikachu315111]

I don't think it likely. It was just a cute little reference and it'd be very odd to just shoehorn it in. Unless it was just two random grunts in the game that make some offhand comment like "maybe I should retire to Unova..." after being beaten or something.

I imagine it being more of a random male Magma grunt and female Aqua grunt making an off hand comment (after being beaten by the player) that maybe they should leave Hoenn and to start a new life and maybe even find a mate. Sort of like how the Winstrate family makes a big deal about the eldest son in the family being a powerful trainer, yet later in the game you find him as a random Victory Road trainer you beat without much trouble (infact I think you can skip battling him, talk about an anti-climax).

Just want to point out Victini is the only pokémon that canonically can create energy, and V-Create is a signature move that represents that.

Maybe it's just turning atoms into energy? Victini is basically a nuclear reactor.

 

[cant say]

BTW, if Kyogre and Groudon can actually change the amount of water on the planets surface it means they have the power to create/destroy matter. Just pointing that out cause like physically "drying up" the ocean just makes it so you have a lot of water in vapor form in the atmosphere, and then it would all rain back down anyways. So the water has to actually be disappearing for Groudon to actually be doing anything. And the reverse idea for Kyogre either it's actually making more water or the planets already about as flooded as it'll be (baring the melting of frozen water which is more like what Groudon would do anyway O.o)

creating water explained

You can't tell me they just store that stuff inside them. Water types make water somehow...

Also with Groudon, I always thought he created more land by causing volcanic eruptions rather than just drying all the water up...

 

[stage7_4]

Just want to point out Victini is the only pokémon that canonically can create energy, and V-Create is a signature move that represents that.

...you know I meant in reality, right?

 

[Kurona]

V-Create is a signature move that represents that.

Rayquaza can create energy confirmed???

 

[9 Tales of Ninetales]

...you know I meant in reality, right?

but....... aren't we talking about in the games?


Anywho, it was more like a random thought. I didn't really mean to spark a physics debate with cannon examples of Pokemon doing stuff to matter. cant say gave one of a billion examples of Pokemon creating stuff from nothing.

 

[Noel Lopunny]

I kind of fell out of pokemon after GSC. It wasn't until Emerald when I saw that blue whale known as Wailord Kyogre that got me interested again. I never saw such a cool looking legendary pokemon before. Gen 3 had been out for awhile so I got Emerald and loved it. I'll be getting AS for another shot at Kyogre (this time with a better understanding of IV's and soft resetting) and to experience the different discrepancies in the story I never experienced with R/S.

 

[Mario With Lasers]

...you know I meant in reality, right?

But but ORAS is about in-game!!!!


(nope didn't notice sorry)

 

[Yveltal]

Also with Groudon, I always thought he created more land by causing volcanic eruptions rather than just drying all the water up...

Thank you. :3

You guys kind of got off on a tangent about destruction/annihilation vs construction/creation.

While Groudon can create a hotter, drier atmosphere that is unsuitable for rain to occur regularly, eventually causing rivers to run dry (literally what a DROUGHT is. The water in the air, after evaporating, can do a number of things besides fall back down to the same pond it came from depending on what's going on in the atmosphere.), his first marketed ability is creating more land, which may involve raising up hardened sediment or summoning volcanoes as a primary method to shrinking a coastline. Being in a constant drought is more the icing on the cake.

Same thing with Kyogre. Half of Drizzle may be just magically willing water into existence, but it could also be manipulation of the local air to make the concentration of water in the atmosphere thick enough to generate rainclouds.

They're Pokemon. I mean...you have to keep that in mind. Sacrilege Destruction and creation out of nothing have been possible in the Pokemon universe since the beginning.

 

[Cresselia~~]

Comic? I'm just talking about my interpretation of the official artwork.

Team Magma is all scowls and frowns and evil eyes, but they are wearing goofy turtlenecks and a horned hoodie from an anime convention. Team Aqua meanwhile is living up their Saturday-morning cartoon villain with challenging grins and wetsuits straight out of a Phoenix Wright case.

They're both stupid and ridiculous (in my opinion), just one team seems to be having more fun with it. I mean, doesn't this:

Just scream "I'm a pimp and l love it check out my bling I got mega stone sucka!"

*Edit: I guess my interpretation of the teams is that Aqua is the self-righteous hippies that brought you "Whale Wars" and that team Magma is some oil company marketing team trying to justify Global Warming to children.

lol, I actually think that Team Aqua is somewhat like an eco-terrorist group.

In the Japanese official site, Team Aqua's reason was something like "the ocean was the main source of life, lots of life forms depend on it." and that they "oppose development (of Team Magma) since it destroys lives"
(rough translation by me)

Maybe Team Aqua is like the Sea Shepherd of Pokemon World.
Definitely starting to like them now.

 

[Kurona]

Got some new screenshots today.

This be one of them. Beautiful.

 

[Pikachu315111]

Got some new screenshots today.

This be one of them. Beautiful.

Very beautiful, always wondered why it was called Meteor Falls even though there wasn't any water. Well no need to wonder any longer!

Also double battle with rival in Meteor Falls, that didn't happen in the original games. Looks like they might be adding a bit more to Meteor Falls this time around. Also I don't see the Mega Bangle on any of them which means you might won't be getting the ability to Mega Evolve Pokemon at least before the 4th Gym (Flannery). Actually, considering that I think it was said Steven was going to give you your Mega Bangle and in Emerald this is where Steven can be found, it's possible that this could be where Steven gives you the Mega Bangle.

Finally I think this is the old couple on My. Pyre:

 

[cant say]

Very beautiful, always wondered why it was called Meteor Falls even though there wasn't any water. Well no need to wonder any longer!

You're kidding right?

Not having the Mega Bangle or whatever it is by then isn't too strange. In XY you get it after the third gym, and since mega evolution was introduced in those games it makes sense to have it available that early. I think we may not even get access to it until Mossdeep City, you may have to visit Steven at his house where all his valuable stones are which is where he explains it all to you. Of course this would mean not being able to use mega evolution for the bulk of the story but it's just in time for fighting Team Aqua/Magma and the Legendary battle...

 

[Rezileen]

But X/Y also had that long stretch between the first and second gym. By the time you reached the Tower of Mastery in X/Y, you would have already reached the 4th gym leader in any other Pokemon game.

I think a reasonable assumption is to assume that we're going to get the Mega Bangle around the time our starters evolve into their final forms. Both the meeting with Steven on the route east of Mauville or the route east of Fortree are possible points where we could get the bangle, and they're both after the 5th gym, so our starters would be nearing or already in their final forms by then.

I think a bigger question is going to be how we're going to be introduced to Mega Evolution in ORAS. In X/Y, they forced a Pokemon on us and made us Mega Evolve it. I can't really see them doing that in ORAS. Maybe it'll be like the catching wild Pokemon tutorials and Steven will show us personally?

 

[Pikachu315111]

You're kidding right?

Not having the Mega Bangle or whatever it is by then isn't too strange. In XY you get it after the third gym, and since mega evolution was introduced in those games it makes sense to have it available that early. I think we may not even get access to it until Mossdeep City, you may have to visit Steven at his house where all his valuable stones are which is where he explains it all to you. Of course this would mean not being able to use mega evolution for the bulk of the story but it's just in time for fighting Team Aqua/Magma and the Legendary battle...

Oh right, hmm, I have no idea what I'm thinking. Well eitherway it looks more beautiful now with the waterfalls going over the crater formations.

But X/Y also had that long stretch between the first and second gym. By the time you reached the Tower of Mastery in X/Y, you would have already reached the 4th gym leader in any other Pokemon game.

I think a reasonable assumption is to assume that we're going to get the Mega Bangle around the time our starters evolve into their final forms. Both the meeting with Steven on the route east of Mauville or the route east of Fortree are possible points where we could get the bangle, and they're both after the 5th gym, so our starters would be nearing or already in their final forms by then.

I think a bigger question is going to be how we're going to be introduced to Mega Evolution in ORAS. In X/Y, they forced a Pokemon on us and made us Mega Evolve it. I can't really see them doing that in ORAS. Maybe it'll be like the catching wild Pokemon tutorials and Steven will show us personally?

True, the time between the 1st and 2nd Gym was oddly long in XY and we'd probably have battled the 3rd Gym in the other games by the time we got to the 2nd in XY.

Wanting to wait till the player's starter probably is/near their final evolution before being given the Mega Bangel, that makes sense.

Hmm, well if they're going to do what they did with XY concerning Mega Evolutions then that would mean Steven would also be giving us a Pokemon and its Mega Stone as a gift. Though if I do recall, in the trailer Steven Mega Evolved a Charizard into a Charizard X so it could be he just shows us how to do it instead of giving us a Pokemon which can.

 

[Rilan]

But X/Y also had that long stretch between the first and second gym. By the time you reached the Tower of Mastery in X/Y, you would have already reached the 4th gym leader in any other Pokemon game.

I think a reasonable assumption is to assume that we're going to get the Mega Bangle around the time our starters evolve into their final forms. Both the meeting with Steven on the route east of Mauville or the route east of Fortree are possible points where we could get the bangle, and they're both after the 5th gym, so our starters would be nearing or already in their final forms by then.

I think a bigger question is going to be how we're going to be introduced to Mega Evolution in ORAS. In X/Y, they forced a Pokemon on us and made us Mega Evolve it. I can't really see them doing that in ORAS. Maybe it'll be like the catching wild Pokemon tutorials and Steven will show us personally?

By the looks of the early screenshots, I'd agree that a bit east of Fortree seem like a good candidate for Steven to show up. Challenging Winona's Gym was about the time my Pokémon evolved to their final forms. Although west of Fortree might work as well despite the rainy atmosphere. Your rival also challenges you there, so that could mean that you'll experience Megas together.

I sure can see the tutorial happening again. These games have a bad tendency to force you into tutorial modes such as the ones for catching Pokémon or the one where some old guy escorts you through town and shows you what every building in town represents. Where is the option to say "No, I don't need your damn help. I've been doing this for years"? Having ORAS following this pattern won't surprise me.

Also, have we seen anything on Scott yet. I know he's an Emerald character, but he seems like a great factor on determining whether or not the Battle Frontier is coming back 100%. Besides, Esuine was Crystal exclusive, but he returned in HGSS.

 

[Maniacr]

The current portrayals of Aqua and Magma seem to just be another level to the central theme of the weather trio, Balance. Namely, Team Magma now seems to represent Order, and Team Aqua seems to represent disorganization, or Chaos. If this really is a prevalent theme within the characters, we could easily see some slight differences in the plots; not enough to really change the base plot line, but enough to give AS some uniqueness from OR.

It seems to me that one of the biggest issue people have had with Ruby and Sapphire was that Aqua and Magma were just carbon copies of each other, and did everything identically, despite the promise of two different teams; the only differences were in the color of the sprites, and whether you wanted to fight a Carvanha or a Numel. Game Freak may have taken this into consideration, considering the obvious effort they're putting into the characters. We do know of one plot deviation already, where we seem to end up having a double battle with Tabitha from Magma and Matt from Aqua, which didn't even happen in Emerald, and suggests that we end up fighting both teams to some extent anyway.

Order and Chaos...isn't that Assassin's Creed? So Team Magma are the Templars and Team Aqua are the Assassins? Also that double battle is exclusive to the demo. It's a unique scenario that isn't actually going to be in the game.

 

[Patrick1088]

Did anybody else notice that the number of pre release megas is the same # now as it was before xy? 13 were released before XY and we ended up with a total of 28 (not counting mega lati@s). 13 pokes have been pre released in ORAS already (not counting primal kyogre or groudon). Do you think we may get a similar number of megas as in XY?

Eh just something i noticed! And woot for 2 months to go!

 

[Pikachu315111]

Order and Chaos...isn't that Assassin's Creed? So Team Magma are the Templars and Team Aqua are the Assassins? Also that double battle is exclusive to the demo. It's a unique scenario that isn't actually going to be in the game.

When he said Order and Chaos my mind went immediately to Catherine, lol.

Did anybody else notice that the number of pre release megas is the same # now as it was before xy? 13 were released before XY and we ended up with a total of 28 (not counting mega lati@s). 13 pokes have been pre released in ORAS already (not counting primal kyogre or groudon). Do you think we may get a similar number of megas as in XY?

Eh just something i noticed! And woot for 2 months to go!

28 seems a bit too much, reason we got 28 in XY because they were introduced there so we needed a good amount to start off. I honestly think we're only in for just a few more Mega Evolutions, I don't think we'll be going over 20 for ORAS, But it all depends on how many Pokemon GameFreak sees potential in, and considering Mega Ice Cream Cone Slowbro, I think they might be starting to reach.

 

[thelandlordsmm]

When he said Order and Chaos my mind went immediately to Catherine, lol.



28 seems a bit too much, reason we got 28 in XY because they were introduced there so we needed a good amount to start off. I honestly think we're only in for just a few more Mega Evolutions, I don't think we'll be going over 20 for ORAS, But it all depends on how many Pokemon GameFreak sees potential in, and considering Mega Ice Cream Cone Slowbro, I think they might be starting to reach.

I think, at the very least, Mega Dragonite needs to be a thing. Dragon/Fighting pls Gamefreak.

However, even if we don't get anymore Megas than what were already revealed, I'd be happy with what we're getting. Seriously, just seeing Mega Gallade's mega animation was enough to make it one of my favorite megas. Inner Focus? Who cares when you have a cape!

 

[Pikachu315111]

I think, at the very least, Mega Dragonite needs to be a thing. Dragon/Fighting pls Gamefreak.

However, even if we don't get anymore Megas than what were already revealed, I'd be happy with what we're getting. Seriously, just seeing Mega Gallade's mega animation was enough to make it one of my favorite megas. Inner Focus? Who cares when you have a cape!

Why would Dragonite be Dragon/Fighting? If anything it'll become Dragon/Fairy. If any Dragon-type were to become Dragon/Fighting I would think it would be Druddigon (though I think it would become Dragon/Rock since it's based on a gargoyle).