Garbodor [QC 1/3]

[Politoad]

done

Tagging Dat Blast

 

[Punchshroom]

• 96 EVs invested in Speed allows Garbodor to outrun threats such as Granbull; this way it can easily kill with a Gunk Shot after

Huh? Not only does Jolly Granbull not exist, but you even managed to overshoot the mark a little (positive base 45 is 207, 96 Spe Garbo is 210); the only base 45 that runs absolute max Speed is Crustle, and it does Garbo no good to outspeed that. 96 Speed EVs does let Garbodor outrun neutral base 55s such as Exeggutor and Cacturne, which are relevant since Garbodor can hit them with Gunk Shot before they can attack, or attack before Cacturne's Destiny Bond. Even then, the Speed EVs are probably only worthy of mention in Set Details and not in EVs, since Gunk Shot only has a miniscule chance of OHKOing 4 HP Exeggutor anyway, while Garbo can set up Spikes alongside Cacturne anyway and still beat it later.

 

[Martin]

ik that this isn't anything big, but how is that a +- point:

+- Does a good job at setting up Spikes

i know it was probably just a typo, and it makes little difference, but whatever idk.

 

[Politoad]

ik that this isn't anything big, but how is that a +- point:

i know it was probably just a typo, and it makes little difference, but whatever idk.

yeh, mistake

Huh? Not only does Jolly Granbull not exist, but you even managed to overshoot the mark a little (positive base 45 is 207, 96 Spe Garbo is 210); the only base 45 that runs absolute max Speed is Crustle, and it does Garbo no good to outspeed that. 96 Speed EVs does let Garbodor outrun neutral base 55s such as Exeggutor and Cacturne, which are relevant since Garbodor can hit them with Gunk Shot before they can attack, or attack before Cacturne's Destiny Bond. Even then, the Speed EVs are probably only worthy of mention in Set Details and not in EVs, since Gunk Shot only has a miniscule chance of OHKOing 4 HP Exeggutor anyway, while Garbo can set up Spikes alongside Cacturne anyway and still beat it later.

will edit

edit: so make Defense 252, and something like Defense/SpDef 4?

 

[Politoad]

bumping hasn't been touche'd in a while

 

[scorpdestroyer]

now that Tops, Toad and Rhydon are getting more and more prevalent I think Seed Bomb could be worth a slash in the fourth slot. What do you think QC?

Dat Blast
Punchshroom

 

[Punchshroom]

Soulblaster You still didn't manage to edit the 'Garbo needing 96 Speed EVs to outrun Granbull' or whatever, that's why no one has touched this. Also mention relevant targets that Toxic hits (such as Rotom), otherwise peopel will believe it is heavily redundant with Toxic Spikes.

scorpdestroyer I'm still not sure about Seed Bomb; it's still doing not much against Rhydon (not a guaranteed 3HKO), and Drain Punch is better against Kabutops due to the recovery, especially with the possibility of Weak Armor. I'm also not too sure if Gunk Shot is important enough to remain unslashed, since Clear Smog does a good enough job at stopping the boosted threats it wants to stop, namely Belly Drum Slurpuff and Bulk Up Gurdurr. On the other hand, Gunk Shot does wreck Lilligant (which Clear Smog doesn't do a great job at stopping) and gives Garbo much needed offensive presence.

 

[Politoad]

edited

Punchshroom

 

[Blast]

Hi so me, scorp, and SG talked about this a while back and I think we came down to this set:

- Spikes
- Gunk Shot
- Drain Punch
- Seed Bomb / TSpikes

with 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe Impish for outspeeding max Speed base 55s. A SpD spread should also be mentioned somewhere for handling Grasses and CM Puff better. Toxic in Set Details for now (Toxic or Clear Smog might deserve a full slash for Gurdurr, but idk)

 

[Politoad]

Hi so me, scorp, and SG talked about this a while back and I think we came down to this set:

- Spikes
- Gunk Shot
- Drain Punch
- Seed Bomb / TSpikes

with 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe Impish for outspeeding max Speed base 55s. A SpD spread should also be mentioned somewhere for handling Grasses and CM Puff better. Toxic in Set Details for now (Toxic or Clear Smog might deserve a full slash for Gurdurr, but idk)

Apart set? Or just the main set. Thanks for the input btw.

 

[boltsandbombers]

Apart set? Or just the main set. Thanks for the input btw.

I'm almost sure he meant the main set.

 

[Politoad]

EDIT: edited

 

[boltsandbombers]

Toxic and seed bomb should be removed from OO, as seed bomb is the main slash in the 4th slot and toxic is in moves.

 

[soulgazer]

Dat Blast I wouldn't mind Toxic slashed with Seed Bomb and Toxic Spikes as it is a really good option if Garbodor doesn't need Toxic Spikes or Seed Bomb. BTW Toxic Spikes > Seed Bomb order wise pls

 

[Politoad]

Dat Blast I wouldn't mind Toxic slashed with Seed Bomb and Toxic Spikes as it is a really good option if Garbodor doesn't need Toxic Spikes or Seed Bomb. BTW Toxic Spikes > Seed Bomb order wise pls

Edited, same counts with boltsandbombers post.

 

[Raseri]

This analysis still doesn't really help me understand Garbodor very well. The usage tips section in particular is not up to par. I know Soulgazer has lots of comments on it, but this would need to be worked on a lot in order to get it to the quality we want, especially since Garbodor plays a very important role in the NU metagame. You would need to cut down on fluff and add a whole lot of information on how Garbodor actually functions. Do you have enough experience Soulblaster to do this?

 

[Politoad]

This analysis still doesn't really help me understand Garbodor very well. The usage tips section in particular is not up to par. I know Soulgazer has lots of comments on it, but this would need to be worked on a lot in order to get it to the quality we want, especially since Garbodor plays a very important role in the NU metagame. You would need to cut down on fluff and add a whole lot of information on how Garbodor actually functions. Do you have enough experience Soulblaster to do this?

I think so, I cccoud testtest it some more and put it back in wip Raseri

 

[Politoad]

I really don't think that would be the best choice. Putting the analysis back in wip would only slow down the process, and as raseri said garbodor is a very important pokemon in the metagame. If you don't think you can finish it, someone else should.

I think I can. I have all time in the world, just got holiday

 

[soulgazer]

Time isn't the issue here: It is your experience with Garbodor. I plan on checking this tomorrow, but as Raseri said we don't learn much when reading your skeleton (mainly the UT and TO, which is why we wonder if you have used it enough to know what it can do).

It can be hard to teach / explain readers what a Pokemon does in NU when the writer himself doesn't know either (no offense).

 

[Raseri]

Alright lets try to make things as clear as possible. If by Thursday, October 23rd at 11:59PM EST, Soulgazer and myself dont think this is QC ready, it will be reassigned. I don't expect the skeleton to be perfect, but I want it to be at a point where QCing it isnt a burden

 

[sickweare]

Also it isn't really worth mentioning Feraligatr as a target for Seed Bomb, as Gunk Shot does more to it. Rock types and ground types are main targets for seed bomb, as they resist garbodor's stab. Not a huge contribution but I figured you should actually say that seed bomb has specific targets, including rhydon, seismitoad, and kabutops.

 

[soulgazer]

OK so you told me that you fixed your stuff and to check it..

Overview
########
+ Can take hits from threats such as Slurpuff and kill it directly after with Gunk Shot ye not a lot of things can take hits from a unboosted Slurpuff!1!
+ Solid Spiker that has access to the two different formes of entry hazards
+ Aftermath leaves a last mark on the opponent when hit by contact
+ Does a good job at setting up Spikes ok you say it twice
- Faces competition from Pokemon such as Qwilfish, that does the same job ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
- Lacks reliable recovery

Spikes
########
name: Spikes
move 1: Spikes
move 2: Gunk Shot
move 3: Drain Punch
move 4: Toxic Spikes / Seed Bomb / Toxic
ability: Aftermath
item: Rocky Helmet
evs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe
nature: Impish

Moves
========

• Spikes limits switches, and helps teammates KO easier.
• Gunk Shot is a powerful STAB move that deals a lot of damage to anything that doesn't resist it.
• Drain Punch grants coverage and can stop Pokemon such as Klinklang from using Substitute or Pawniard from setting up Swords Dance.
• Toxic Spikes wears down offensive teams. huh
  
• Seed Bomb is a coverage option, for example against Ground and Water-types such as Rhydon, Golem and Seismitoad,that are pretty common in the tier. This can replace either Toxic Spikes or Gunk Shot. However, it is kinda frail since it gets no STAB from the attack and still does little damage against Rhydon and Feraligatr. Gunk does more to Gatr and wheres Kabutops?
  
• Toxic is an option that hits bulky Pokemon and wears them down.
• Pain Split is a way Garbodor can recover, as long as it has less HP than the opponent where it's against on.
• Clear Smog is used to prevent the opponent from setting up properly, but can be replaced with Haze as it goes through Substitute.

Set Details
========

• The EVs invested in HP and Defense in combination with an Impish nature add up to Garbodor's decent bulk.
• 96 Speed allows Garbodor to outrun Pokemon with maxed Speed at a base stat of 55. such as?
  
• Aftermath makes Garbodor capable of leaving a last mark when the opponent kills it with a contact move.
• Rocky Helmet hurts any opponent using contact moves everytime they use as well'
• Black Sludge can be used to recover Garbodor a little bit and puts the hurt on non-Poison types who can use Trick or Switcheroo.
• Garbodor can also run a Specially Defensive set, that handles Pokemon such as Calm Mind Slurpuff or Grass-types better. You could, you know, give them a spread?

Usage Tips
========

• Garbodor can be switched into contact moves that don't affect it much, U-turn users, for example, get punished by the damage given by Rocky Helmet.
• To deal extra damage, you can also sacrifice Garbodor to activate Aftermath and Rocky Helmet when a physical threats goes out of control and inflicts a lot of recoil. ok you fixed this
  
• Set up Spikes and Toxic Spikes depending on opposing teams. If the team is based on defense, set up Spikes, and when the team is offensively-based, lay down only 1 layer of Toxic Spikes. huh
  
• Don't use Toxic Spikes if the opponent has a Poison-type without an immunity to Ground-types on the field. hello? even if they have a Poison-type you can pressure their team with tspikes and a Pokemon able to OHKO Poison-types like Mesprit, so they either have to let their mons get poison'd or they lose their toxic spikes absorber
  
• Toxic cripples Defensive Pokemon without cleric support, so make sure you use Toxic when a wall comes in. idgi, you can cripple walls even if they have cleric support

You don't even have a UT for everything in Moves either.. wtf

Team Options
========

• Spinblockers will make good partners, such as Mismagius and Golurk, as the set up hazards won't be removed this way. nice and uncommon Golurk.. Rotom Mismagius Gourgeist are better ghosts for that
  
• Offensively-inclined allies that can take advantage of the hazards in order to get off a KO earlier, such as Magmortar and Electivire, will be good teammates. the famous MagVire core lol...
  
• Bulky Dark-types that take care of bulky Psychic-type Pokemon, such as Pangoro, will be good partners as Garbodor can't do much against these Pokemon. yea well they either are so weak that you dont even need pangoro to handle them, or they are powerful and can 2HKO pangoro or even OHKO with dazzling gleam anyway..
  
• Teammates with good defensive synergy are good as well, especially Seismitoad, as it is capable of setting up Stealth Rock and checks a lot of Pokemon that Garbodor struggles against.

so few teammate..


Other Options
########

• Weak Armor and Focus Sash allows Garbodor to prevent being OHKOed, and may raise it Speed after. An offensive set could be used along with these options, however, Garbodor's offensive power is bad.
• Rock Blast destroys common Focus Sash users on set up, such as Ninjask.
• Giga Drain hits physically defensive Pokemon better, such as Rhydon.
• Explosion has terrifying base power but isn't really worth it as Garbodor should only use it when it's done setting up.

stuff in italic should be together I dont even know why you would separate them

Checks & Counters
########

**Taunt** Taunt can really wear down Garbodor, as it completely stops it from setting up hazards, what is Garbodor's main use. it's not just Taunt that shutsdown Garbodor, its that Mismagius and Archeops (there's some more) can shut it down AND resist Gunk Shot + Drain Punch doesn't do much..

**Xatu** Xatu can bounce back all entry hazards back and can quickly get rid of Garbodor with a Psychic attack.

**Bulky Psychic Pokemon** Psychic Pokemon that can take hits without effort, such as Musharna and Mesprit, have no problems taking Garbodor down. ok so Mesprit, which doesn't have reliable recovery, enjoy taking 120bp Gunk Shot now? Where the heck is UXIE

**Bulky Ground types** Bulky Ground-type Pokemon that can take a hit, such as Rhydon and Sandslash, can take a hit from Garbodor and KO it with Earthquake.

Strong attackers? Ghost-types? ¿?¿?

.. yeah. I don't remember when Raseri's deadline ends, but when you told me you fixed everything I expected more lol. you did fix the recoil thing in UT a bit I guess =/. Still doesn't shows that you have experience with it or knowledge of the tier. So yeah unless you do a miracle I would prefer if this gets reassigned.

 

[Politoad]

OK so you told me that you fixed your stuff and to check it..



.. yeah. I don't remember when Raseri's deadline ends, but when you told me you fixed everything I expected more lol. you did fix the recoil thing in UT a bit I guess =/. Still doesn't shows that you have experience with it or knowledge of the tier. So yeah unless you do a miracle I would prefer if this gets reassigned.

i said i didn't edit anything...

but yeah.. fine..

 

[soulgazer]

ok you told me to check again

BTW something I forgot to talk about: Remove the Seed Bomb slash and keep Seed Bomb in moves.

Usage Tips
========

• When predicting Ground-types to come in, use Seed Bomb, as most Ground-types with an exception for Rhydon cannot live 2 Seed Bombs.

Nah nah nah. Seed Bomb actually doesn't do much to most Ground-types. Your targets are Seismitoad and Kabutops while being able to do a decent chunk to Rhydon and Sandlash. Rewrite it so that it doesn't sound like every Garbodor run Seed Bomb (something like: If Garbodor is using Seed Bomb...)

you still don't have a usage tips for every moves mentionned in Moves. =/

Please re-read the whole check i did yesterday since you still didn't fix everything. You did make UT and TO better though (I would like more TO, but I guess its fine as it is right now).

 

[Politoad]

ok you told me to check again

BTW something I forgot to talk about: Remove the Seed Bomb slash and keep Seed Bomb in moves.


Nah nah nah. Seed Bomb actually doesn't do much to most Ground-types. Your targets are Seismitoad and Kabutops while being able to do a decent chunk to Rhydon and Sandlash. Rewrite it so that it doesn't sound like every Garbodor run Seed Bomb (something like: If Garbodor is using Seed Bomb...)

you still don't have a usage tips for every moves mentionned in Moves. =/

Please re-read the whole check i did yesterday since you still didn't fix everything. You did make UT and TO better though (I would like more TO, but I guess its fine as it is right now).

edited, i suppose?