Resource XY RU Tier List (RU Viability Ranking itt)

[Afro Smash]

Sub Toxic/LO 3 Atks/Scarf all incredibly good sets that're exceedingly difficult to stop, and all can be useful vs all playstyles, though Scarf, due to Protect spam is mildly less useful vs Stall. I don't think Rocks weakness is enough to stop Moltres getting S rank when Gligar can find so many opportunities to Defog, Xatu to Bounce or Hitmonlee/Kabutops can Spin well vs any team lacking Doublade.

The only real Counter to the Life Orb set is Slowking, which loses to Sub Toxic or can be used as an easy momentum grab with Scarf U-Turn.

So yeah here's the plan Molk, make Moltres S rank, then suspect it, then ban it. Thx.

Edit: Also supporting Gligar for A/A+ rank, It fits on p much any playstyle, Access to Knock Off/Taunt makes it a good disruptor vs defensive teams, Defog is always fantastic support, and it can gain momentum for offense with Baton Pass or U-Turn, and has reliable recovery in roost. Its Bulk and typing make it one of the tiers most reliable Defoggers, and allows it to check some of the more threatening Phys Atkrs in the tier such as Hitmonlee/Rhyp/Doublade, this thing can do so much and it does it all well, defo deserves higher than A- imo.

 

[Pearl]

...

Yeah, I've been wanting to make that nomination for a while, but have been hesitant on it because my last nomination to S Rank was a bit of a fluke (and even I can see that now, although Cobalion is still among the strongest A+ ranked Pokemon). But yeah, it has versatility set wise, although most of them are only slight item / move variation, excluding SubRoost, which is godly in its own way. It fits in a lot of team archetypes as well. It's also one of the first Pokemon that come to someone's mind when making a team, both as an option or as a Pokemon that requires checking immediately, and even those are sort of limited. I'm probably slightly biased about it, but S Rank seems like a perfect fit for it.

And speaking of these more important nominations, I think that Gligar could be pushed to A Rank (HnC said A+ even, but it's probably an exaggeration). While it's not as versatile as Moltres, it is a staple for both Stall and Balance, as well as a good Pokemon for more offensive teams, mostly due to its access to the combination of Swords Dance + Baton Pass, which I've been some known people using already. All in all, it has two viable sets, the defensive set with either Stealth Rock or Defog, and the Baton Pass set, which has some variations too (mostly Substitute, Agility, Speed EVs and so on) and checks a huge amount of Physically Offensive threats just through its sheer presence. While this doesn't seem anything spectacular or over the top, it is extremely consistent, even more than Shiftry and Hitmonlee, which are the other two main Hazard Control Pokemon. Oh, and I forgot to mention it can also run a fast Taunt to break stall or guarantee something else can set up by stopping opposing Pokemon from using stuff like Toxic. I think this is all there is to it, but I think this one should be heavily considered.

 

[EonX]

Moltres: Agreeing with this move. It may be blind af sometimes, but if you lack AV Slowking, you better hope it misses. Otherwise, something is almost guaranteed to be KOed or take a ridiculous amount of damage. Standard LO nukes shit, SubToxic bones its best counter, and Scarf can turn its best counter into a liability. There's also Agility Moltres that can turn the tables on would-be revenge killers that see LO recoil / Lefties recovery and think that they're safe, only to be met with a Moltres using Agility as they switch into it. (remember that "oh fuck" button? They press that as it uses Agility) It's easy to form cores with thanks to its solid defensive typing. Yes, I said solid defensive typing. Get over the 4x Rock weakness for a moment, and you'll find a Pokemon with a Ground immunity and resistances to Fire, Fighting, Steel, Bug (4x), Grass (4x), and Fairy, meaning that it's pretty easy to find switch-in opportunities for Moltres. It's a great all-around Pokemon that, much like Meloetta, can fill multiple roles on offense and defense. Blind Burd for S rank.

Gligar: Gligar is definitely a cool Pokemon rn. Its typing is really good and lets it work well with top defensive stalwarts in Alomomola (these two laugh at p. much every physical attacker in RU together) Slowking, Registeel, and Aromatisse. However, Gligar isn't limited to good synergy with defensive Pokemon. It also works pretty well with the likes of Cobalion, Moltres, Virizion, and Clawitzer. Other than that, Pearl. said p. much everything that was needed on Gligar. It's a solid Pokemon that's a staple on balance and bulky offense teams that can also see use on HO teams (I'm skeptical on it being used with stall teams since Defog seems counterproductive on such teams and Defog is one of the main reasons to use defensive Gligar) makes it a solid A rank Pokemon.

 

[Leer]

Supporting Moltres for S. First things first, this thing is absolute power. As if 125 Base Special Attack isn't enough, Moltres is blessed with dual 110 Base Power STAB moves in Fire Blast and Hurricane. Outside of a few things like AV King, not much can even survive a 2HKO from one or both of the moves in this combination. On top of this, Moltres is bulky enough to take neutral hits, so even if it doesn't get the OHKO it can survive to get the kill. This is coupled with recovery, which keeps Tres alive on a sweep. But one big reason on top of these that should put it in S is the ability to Check two out of the three S rank Pokemon. Doublade needs +2 and rocks to KO with Shadow Sneak iirc, and Hitmonlee is destroyed by a Hurricane.

Supporting Gligar for A as well, not much I can say that hasn't been said except maybe that it can also handle Lee and Blade and is basically the premier Defogger (among other things).

I'd make some noms of my own but I'm on my phone so just typing all this was enough :x

 

[g]

I just waited for someone other to make a nomination because lazy but I completely agree with Moltres in S rank. As Molk already said it has a ridiculous amount of offensive potential thanks to its high base 125 Special Attack, very high powered moves that let it break the "not so specially bulky" Rock-types that resist its combination, and free slot to run an Hidden power dedicated just to hitting them. The fact that it can also run U-turn to both hit its best check, Slowking, for decent damage (Life Orb U-turn does up to 45%) and to give a free switch to a teammate to get rid of it/force it out.
While it has a big Stealth Rock weakness I feel like it still deserves S rank because that is surprisingly easy to get around with good Defog and Rapid Spin users that also happen to synergize decently with it like Shiftry, Gligar, and Hitmonlee that can really fit in every team without much trouble.
Additionally, while I am not sure that this can influence the viability rankings, I want to say that Moltres is also very easy to support in terms of removing its checks as they can either be Pursuit trapped (Meloetta, Slowking) or taken out or at least severely weakened by Dugtrio (Slowking after a Life Orb U-turn, Lanturn, Rhyperior).
Totally S.

Gligar is another Mon I supported for a small bump some time ago and I am fine with it being in A (but not higher lol) just because of how easily and reliably it can get the Defog off and for its ability to gain momentum or screw over some of its checks with the free mosveslot it has be it a fast Toxic or Taunt.
SD + Baton Pass is also pretty decent in my opinion :)

 

[Grey Waves]

I can't really comment on Moltres, having never used it, but I do agree with Gligar going to A rank, not only is it the most reliable hazard remover in the tier, it is also the only one (apart from Claydol) that doesn't care about any sort of entry hazard, due to it being a Flying type with a neutrality to Stealth Rock. That gives it a major advantage over other hazard removers such as Hitmonlee and Golbat.

Also, what does everyone think about Escavalier for A+ rank? Despite the popularity of Moltres and Delphox, it checks quite a few top-tier threats such as Meloetta, Reuniclus and Doublade, as well as being incredibly hard to switch into. I also feel as if the meta has 'unadapted' to it; in RU beta and Stage 1 many Pokemon ran Hidden Power Fire (or Fire Punch in Rhyperior's case), to beat Escavalier, but since then RU has shifted and this is not the case anymore, allowing it to counter Pokemon it couldn't before, such as Amoonguss. Thoughts?

 

[Pearl]

Also, what does everyone think about Escavalier for A+ rank? Despite the popularity of Moltres and Delphox, it checks quite a few top-tier threats such as Meloetta, Reuniclus and Doublade, as well as being incredibly hard to switch into. I also feel as if the meta has 'unadapted' to it; in RU beta and Stage 1 many Pokemon ran Hidden Power Fire (or Fire Punch in Rhyperior's case), to beat Escavalier, but since then RU has shifted and this is not the case anymore, allowing it to counter Pokemon it couldn't before, such as Amoonguss. Thoughts?

tl;dr version: No.

long version: Although my experience with Escavalier is slightly limited (I've only used it in a team, and even though I've seen it a lot on the ladder, most people using it had no clue of what they were doing whatsoever, so I'm not going to base my opinion on that), I can safely express that, in my opinion, Escavalier belongs no higher than A, due to:

• The amount of support it requires: It's a slow Pokemon that gets destroyed by every Fire-type move in existence. It's also an Assault Vest user without any form of recovering its HP, which means it benefits from Defog and Wish Support even more than the average A / A+ ranked Pokemon.
• The competition it suffers from: Spiritomb and some more others as a Pursuit trapper, Durant as an offensive Bug/Steel-type and Slowking as a slow Assault Vest user. This last one being arguable, since they're two very different Pokemon.
• 4MSS. It's not too aggressive compared to, say, Scyther, but it'd still like to run Megahorn, Pursuit, Drill Run, Knock Off and Iron Head on the same set, which is obviously impossible. I'd actually use this one more if it got either Horn Leech (flavor related, Horn, hello?) or U-turn, but it doesn't, so.

This doesn't mean Escavalier is a bad Pokemon: It has a solid amount of traits, including the ability to blast through everything with (Choice Band boosted) Megahorn, neat typing and some others, but that's why it's an A rank Pokemon and not A+.

 

[Lemonade]

ok

 

[aVocado]

i agree with moltres to S and gligar to A

 

[Pearl]

^Shit posting was my request so I wouldn't double post, but they did it at the same time.

ROCK WITH EYES from D to C-/C

First of all; don't expect Carbink to be a top threat or anything like that. In fact, it's completely lacking in offensive pressure whatsoever, only having Rock Slide to hit Moltres, Delphox, and other Pokemon "decently hard". However, the myriad of threats it keeps on check single handely make it a better Pokemon than Ambipom and the niche Sun sweepers in there. It's a solid switch in against Meloetta (S), Moltres (A+, possibly S), Delphox (A+), Druddigon (A), Jolteon (A-), Spiritomb (A-), Fletchinder (B+), Exploud (B+), and the list most likely goes on. It can win 1v1 against Gligar with a combination of Toxic + Protect, guaranteeing Stealth Rock for its team. It fits well in balance that can't afford to run Slowking (due to the presence of another Water- or Psychic-type) as a Moltres counter, which are a lot probably, due to the existance of Alomomola, Reuniclus, Cresselia, and other Pokemon that dominate the tier but are lacking in synergy with Slowking. Here are some damage calculations involving Carbink, using a Specially Defensive EV Spread:

252 SpA Life Orb Moltres Hidden Power Grass vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Carbink: 91-109 (30 - 35.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Exploud Boomburst vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Carbink: 80-94 (26.4 - 31%) -- 13.9% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Exploud Surf vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Carbink: 136-162 (44.8 - 53.4%) -- 1.2% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Life Orb Jolteon Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Carbink: 94-110 (31 - 36.3%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Meloetta Hyper Voice vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Carbink: 59-69 (19.4 - 22.7%) -- possible 6HKO after Leftovers recovery

Keep in mind that Carbink is lacking in sustain for the most part, having to rely on the combination of Leftovers + Protect, but those calculations are still pretty strong, and you can always pair it with one of the many Pokemon which can provide Wish support, but that's not really relevant to Carbink's ranking.

If you're still in doubt about this nomination's credibility, I can provide some replays, but for now, I'll just dump an image here:

ROCK WITH EYES

EDIT:

19:21 funbro carbink can also beat mixed pig and cb/lo brav w/physical spread, pearl
19:21 funbro ;o
19:22 funbro also v strong spiritomb check etc

 

[Molk]

Alrighty, time to update this!

Updates

Moltres up to S rank
Gligar up to A rank
Rotom-F added to C- rank

I'd like to see more support for Carbink, Sandslash and Togetic before i move them up. Carbink actually sounds pretty cool in theory, but i've gotta say that lack of offensive presence really seems like it'd screw it over a lot in practice (even with Toxic+Protect. I'd like to see some replays to prove me wrong on that before moving it higher than D ;-;.

I decided to move add Rotom-F on a little higher than D simply because Electric/Ice Coverage is really awesome in the current RU metagame, and i can really see that thing doing a shitton of damage as long as those Blizzards hit (if Moltres can get to S rank then this can get to C-).

Anyways, if you disagree with some of the changes i made just feel free to post here explaining why =).

 

[Mew2]

I haven't posted here in a while so I'm sorry if this noms are outdated / flawed;

Noms most people will agree with:

A- to A: Let's face it this is the best counter to any CM Psychic type (Cresselia, Reuniclus, etc) and can Pursuit trap most of them thanks to his amazing Dark/Poison typing coupled with great defenses. It can also phaze set up sweepers with Whirlwind and set up Toxic Spikes as well as Taunting most defoggers and other hazard setters. Drapion also has access to a more offensive set with SD and STAB Knock Off in his arsenal as well as base 95 speed (outspeeds Moltres, Htimonlee and friends) and has plenty of opportunities to set up. In conclusion I think that this guy deserves A because he can perform great on both the offensive and defensive.

Give this thing a rank: Zwelous is a really interesting pokemon atm; having the second most powerful Outrage in the game as well as an equally powerful Crunch makes this thing a total threat for unprepared teams. Dark/ Dragon is an amazing typing both offensively and defensively and it checks and counters a lot of top tier threats like Cresselia (Lacking Moonblast), Reuniclus (Lacking Focus Blast), Doublade, Slowking, Sharpedo, Delphox, etc. His coverage, although limited, can help to smack his supposed counters with interesting options like Iron Tail and Fire Fang. So I think this guy has a nice niche in the current meta but I want your thoughts on which rank should it be.

B to B+: Infiltrator Toxic is amazing and has a nice typing not to mention how easily he counters the musketeers, Hitmonlee and most fighting types. Base 90 speed is another great feature especially for a wall and a 120 BP STAB move lets this thing hit decently hard. Finally it has reliable recovery as well as Defog and other interesting moves in his arsenal like Haze, Taunt and Super Fang so I think he deserves B+ easily.

C to C+: He just can't be in the same rank as Audino; it's bulkier than Audino and Aromatisse, has access to both Wish and Heal Bell and has interesting niche moves like Dragon Tail and Knock off. It's ability blocks Taunt, can use CB with decent success and is the only poke with STAB Explosion, IMO decent cleric deserves C+.

B- to C+: I see C+ as the rank where we find decent pokemon that are heavily outclassed by other things in the tier like Cofagrigus and Skuntank so naturally Sceptile fits perfectly into this definition; "decent poke but there are simply better grass types in the tier".

Noms most people won't agree with:

A+ to A: I feel that the meta has slowly adapted to this thing for example you see most Durddigons with Iron Tail or Gunk Shot nowadays and choiced Delphox almost always carry Switcheroo. I just feel it has trouble with most of the top tier threats ATM like Specs Meloetta, Moltres, Doublade, Delhpox and she even needs a large amount of defense EVS to avoid being 2HKOed by Hitmonlee. She also has a sub par ability; while Aroma Veil sounds nice in theory, she would rather have something like Regenerator like Slowking or Audino or Natural Cure like Chansey and therefore most good players can easily apply pressure with strong attacks or with status moves. I'm not saying Aromatisse is a bad pokemon but when the top tier threats beat her and / or are adapting to her, she doesn't deserve her current rank.

B+ to A-: Before you start trashing Weezing hear me out, he is one of the best anti meta pokemon in the tier; having only one weakness and amazing bulk makes Weezing a phenomenal wall capable of burning most physical attacks or severely hurting them with STAB Sludge Bomb or Flamethrower. He also has a semi reliable recovery move in the form of Pain Split and can support his team even more with Toxic Spikes which is a very valuable hazard in today's meta. In conclusion when you fully counter Doublade, Hitmonlee and Rhyperior and can hold your own against most Fighting types in the tier you definitely deserve more than just B+.

A to A+: Mega Abomasnow is one of the most underrated Pokemon of the tier; with amazing offenses and good STAB options Mega Abomasnow easily plows through most defensive cores and thanks to the lack of steel types it has very few true counters. Add this monster a 100% accuracy Blizzard and the ability to negate Leftovers and you got yourself a true A+ pokemon. He does require hazard removal but he has good synergy with most of them anyways again something worth mentioning is that he doesn't need to compete for a Mega Slot like other megas do in other tiers.

So yea those are my noms like I said I haven't played a single RU match in 2 weeks so if any of this noms are inaccurate or flawed tell me in a polite way :)

 

[Meru]

C --> B-
With the departure of Yanmega, Cradily now has many more perks over Registeel, and is able to shine much more in this metagame. Cradily's biggest perk over Registeel is probably reliable recovery, making it much less susceptible to being worn down, usually by Spikes. After that, its next biggest perk is its insusceptibility to Dugtrio, preventing your opponent from beating you through sheer match up. It counters quite a few top threats, namely Moltres, Exploud, Jolteon, Rotom-Mow, and Specs Meloetta. After that, it can check many more, including Clawitzer, Delphox, Rhyperior, Sharpedo, and various SS/Rain mons.

It definitely needs to rise, it's much better than anything residing in C at the moment.

 

[Expulso]

C to C+: He just can't be in the same rank as Audino; it's bulkier than Audino and Aromatisse, has access to both Wish and Heal Bell and has interesting niche moves like Dragon Tail and Knock off. It's ability blocks Taunt, can use CB with decent success and is the only poke with STAB Explosion, IMO decent cleric deserves C+.

tbh I feel like Audino is actually better than Lickilicky on anything other than dedicated stall, where both are outclassed by Aromatisse. While Lickilicky does have a Taunt immunity and phasing, it loses tremendous amounts of momentum when Wish passing to itself, which becomes necessary eventually; on the other hand, Audino just uses Wish and gets out. This solves the problem of Taunt and (a lack of) phasing, as Audino can use Wish on the turn the taunter / sweeper comes in and go out to a counter. Taunt + Pursuit Drapion is uncommon (hmm, I really want to try that now rofl), so nothing can really stop Audino from doing its job of pivoting. Sure, Lickilicky is more specially bulky, but this bulk is offset by Audino's Regenerator recovery.

:>

 

[Molk]

alrighty so i got a piratepad earlier mentioning a bunch of changes people on irc wanted on the viability thread. I agree with some (sceptile, granbull, audino), disagree with a few others (golbat, actually explained this one before, hitmontop, skuntank). I decided to edit out the commentary and post the basic jist of what was on the piratepad to see what everyone here though of them, :o.

TL;DR: http://pastebin.com/JyXjnNzC

Also if any of you guys who contributed to the initial piratepad want to write down your reasoning here for everyone else, go ahead!

I might make a post on Abomasnow in particular later, whether i edit this one or make an entirely new one.

 

[aVocado]

okay, why THE FUCK isnt qwilfish B+?

this thing is fucking just as good if not better than Omastar simply because of its access to Taunt and T.Spikes. T.spikes are that good, and Taunt allows it to shut down the likes of Omastar, and all Defoggers. It also has explosion to block rapid spin, and t.spikes + spikes are just really good especially considering how annoying t.spikes can be to mons like exploud and offense in general, and seeing as how there are barely any poison-types that go on offense, it's pretty good. t.spikes + something like SD shiftry, SD cobalion, SubSeed gourg-s (double points cuz blocks spin) etc is really good.

also, theres the fact that it can run a bulky set which actually has some synergy with some mons, but i don't have much experience with it so i'm not gonna talk much about it.

as for gallade to c+, i'm not sure. gallade isn't bad, but it is kind of outclassed by other mons a lot of the time so... yeah, idk.

clawitzer for a-, agree. very threatening mon.

 

[Molk]

Alrighty, time to post my thoughts on Mega Abomasnow.

I honestly disagree with moving this thing up to A+ rank. It's a great wallbreaker, there's no doubt about that: dual 132 base offenses, an ability that negates Leftovers recovery, and some great Ice/Grass/Ground coverage that happens to hit many of the most common defensive Pokemon in RU super effectively goes a long way in that regard. However, there are two undeniable flaws that keep it from moving up imo, and those are its terrible Speed stat and poor defensive typing. Mega Abomasnow might be able to nuke things pretty effectively, but pretty much the entire tier outruns the thing: if it wants to go mixed without sacrificing its defenses it even needs speed creep to get outpace fking Slowking and Amoonguss ._. (although SD Mega Abomasnow doesn't have to do so). Ice Shard comes in handy a little bit, but it's not nearly strong enough to offset the Speed issue.

Now, speed obviously isn't everything: plenty of Pokemon in RU are slow and still do quite well, but its when you pair that low Speed with Mega Abomasnow's defensive typing that things go downhill. This thing is tied with Celebi and Exeggutor for the most weaknesses of any Pokemon in the entire game, let alone RU (Fire-, Flying-, Fighting-, Poison-, Bug-, Steel-, and Rock-type moves all hit it super effectively), most of these types see plenty of use in RU, and to make matters even worse it makes Mega Abomasnow weak to Stealth Rock too, limiting its ability to switch in/out a bit as long as they're up Combine this poor defensive typing with the aforementioned Speed stat, and you have a Pokemon that's both a pain to get into the game and easy to revenge kill, even if the Pokemon being used to do so isn't all that fast.

To make matters worse, most of Mega Abomasnow's resistances are situational imo because a lot of the Pokemon that use those types of moves in the first place have coverage to keep hit Abomasnow super effectively, ensuring that they *still* aren't helpless against it (Slowking has Fire Blast, Clawitzer has Aura Sphere, Amoonguss has Sludge Bomb, Rhyperior has Rock Blast, etc), and a lot of the ones that don't often have U-turn or Volt Switch (Jolteon, Heliolisk, Rotom-C, Gligar), which lets them just zap right out of Mega Abomasnow as it comes in and put it in a very bad spot, and because of the Stealth Rock weakness and chip damage from the moves themselves, that residual damage can really add up.

Of course there's going to be the inevitable comparison to Rhyperior here, but i'd argue that Mega Abomasnow has it much worse off in this department. Most obviously, Mega Abomasnow doesn't have Solid Rock to weaken the blows from these attacks like Rhyperior does. Taking 3/4 damage from super effective moves might not seem like a huge deal, but damn does it make a difference.

252+ Atk Escavalier Iron Head vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Solid Rock Rhyperior: 177-208 (40.8 - 48%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ Atk Escavalier Iron Head vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Rhyperior: 236-278 (54.5 - 64.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Mega Abomasnow doesn't have the luxury of any of that padding, it has to take the full blunt trauma from every super effective attack that it gets hit with, at least Rhyperior's ability protects it from them a little bit.

Secondly, Mega Abomasnow doesn't have nearly as much longevity even outside of the typing. It doesn't have the luxury of holding Leftovers to slowly regain health back; any damage Mega Abomasnow takes throughout the game is 100% permanent bar Wish support or Giga Drain recovery, and it's of course going to be taking 25% from every switch in to Stealth Rock as an Ice-type.

Now compare this to Rhyperior, who has full access to Leftovers to (slowly) recover off damage from hits taken, the little bits of recovery might seem small, but they really go a long way if you play well with Rhypy, and can keep it going for quite a while. Also, Rhyperior doesn't have to deal with that nasty Stealth Rock weakness like Abomasnow does it all: in fact between its Ground-type and the aforementioned Leftovers, it's practically immune!

Overall, i agree that Mega Abomasnow is a pretty solid wallbreaker and the SD set is pretty cool too, but that Speed stat and defensive typing are just too much of an obstacle to move it up imo, A is perfect.

 

[Afro Smash]

skunk to b- - Yh with The rise of Psychic types after Zoro left, Skunatnk gained some more viability, and it has a niche over Drapion with access to Defog and Sucker Punch, so I agree with the rise to B-.

tyrantrum to c - >best check to Moltres in the tier with assault vest, Ice Fang/EQ/Head Smash breaks the whole tier, keep it C+ smh

gallade to c+ - 125 Atk, really good coverage and access to a myriad of boosting moves. this thing should be at least B hello? CC/Knock Off/Zen Headbutt breaks through everything in the tier at +2, or u can add in Sneak over something else to be a bigger threat to offense.

Cinccino to c+ - This thing as well could be B rank tbh, I know Doublade exists but it gets access to Knock Off, has a very powerful STAB then nice Bullet Seed/Rock Blast coverage to break through walls.115 Speed is also very nice.

tangrowth to c+ - Mixed Assault Vest is a nice pivot and very difficult to switch in to, SD can be a good StallBreaker with Power Whip + Knock Off, obviously has big competition form other Grass types but its niche is big enough for B- imo

clawitzer for a- - can get behind this

Also Arikado Omastar does get T Spikes too, it just opts to run Ice Beam instead the majority of the time. And whilst Qwilfish having Taunt would seem to make it better since it can prevent Defog, Omastar generally stops them just as handily by scaring them Scald + Ice BEam. Gligar/Shiftry/Golbat all hate burns and are hit SE by Ice Beam. Omastar also has respectable Sp Atk in the first place so isnt easy to come in on, and finally Weak Armor allows it to sometimes get up an extra layer. I'd say Omastar is 1 rank better than Qwilfish.

Also Molk Abomasnow gets Giga Drain!

 

[aVocado]

Cinccino to c+ - This thing as well could be B rank tbh, I know Doublade exists but it gets access to Knock Off, has a very powerful STAB then nice Bullet Seed/Rock Blast coverage to break through walls.115 Speed is also very nice.

i agree with this also. cinccino has actually surprised me when I used it, its coverage is good and knock off is pretty awesome. yes its walled by cobalion, but it is stilly pretty good imo, because fast + powerful + knock off = not bad at all.

also it has based sing for doublade lol

b- imo

 

[ScraftyIsTheBest]

Alright, since I'm in the mood atm I guess I'll reply to this list of proposals.

I think Skuntank should go up, C+ is pretty insulting for its capabilities. It's a cool Defogger that provides decent defensive synergy and packs a decent punch too. It checks quite a few threats such as Reuniclus (!!), Meloetta, etc. and can use Defog reliably. It also has extra nifty utility with Sucker Punch and Pursuit which allow it to get in some mindgames with some Pokemon and can revenge kill or trap: it's sort of weak, but it hits hard enough for what it does. I know Drapion has the same typing, but it doesn't have Defog or Sucker Punch like Skunk and actually plays somewhat differently from it. It's a pretty good Defogger and should be at least B- imo.

Not commenting on Granbull, but B- wouldn't be a bad idea at all given it's one of the most reliable Hitmonlee answers in the tier and is more bulky than the other Fairies in RU with Intimidate factored in and it's also one of the few physical Fairies other than Slurpuff who plays differently: it has a nice movepool to use on both worlds too.

No comment on Seismitoad

Sceptile...ah the poor thing I haven't really used much since like the beginning of the generation. It kinda faces really stiff competition from Virizion these days, and it's rather easy to deal with by using stuff like Escavalier, Druddigon, etc. It's kind of weak and it's not really as impressive as Virizion. I guess C+ would be okay since it's not really bad but Virizion gives it pretty stiff competition.

Not commenting on Audino or Gastrodon because I don't have much experience with them, Gastro is a pretty good Doublade answer though and it also takes on HP Water variants of Jolteon quite well unlike Rhyperior or Slowking so that's a pretty strong niche for it.

Tyrantrum...I dunno man...I kinda like it. It's a decent physical sweeper that hits hard at +1 and has an okay Speed to sweep with Dragon Dance. It has nice coverage too in EdgeQuake as well as Ice Fang, so it's one of those physical attackers that has a fighting chance against Gligar. Only problem is that it kinda has trouble setting up and depending on its nature it kinda is either a bit slow or a bit weak (I prefer Jolly though). It also checks Moltres and Fletchinder which is totally awesome, and it's a fine sweeper. I want it to stay in C+ tbh. It shouldn't be in the same rank as Barbaracle, Tyrantrum is honestly quite a bit better than Barbaracle at sweeping and it checks bird.

Gallade is kinda okayish, it's pretty decent but just kind of outclassed. It's pretty good at what it does tbh and SD and other sets are kind of cool. I'm not really a huge fan of dropping it since I feel like the B Ranks suit it pretty well.

I'm really not a huge fan of dropping Cinccino down. Cinccino is honestly actually a pretty decent Pokemon and is not really a C+ Pokemon in my eyes. It's very fast, and has three high BP moves that are multi-hit, so it hits pretty hard and bypasses Substitutes and Focus Sashes. It circumvents Rhyperior, Moltres, Fletchinder, and a myriad of other Pokemon thanks to its decent coverage and power. It's quite tricky to handle for all of offense, balance, and bulky offense. For that last moveslot, Cinccino can always run something to be all the more tricky. It can run U-turn to nab momentum, Knock Off to cripple Doublade, and let's not forget the mighty Sing which cripples Doublade and renders it useless (it will always hit thanks to No Guard!!), and from there Cinccino can proceed to pester the opposing team. It's hardly a bad Pokemon and shouldn't drop imo, when played correctly it is quite tricky. Did I not mention this thing is the cutest thing ever!!!

Tangrowth I have no opinion about but it's a bulky thing and even though it doesn't have that many resists, it tanks nicely by sheer bulk alone, it has Regen and solid offensive presence too so that's a bonus.

Regirock and ROCK WITH EYES can move up, the former is a nice Moltres answer and also beats a few other Pokemon like Cinccino, DRUDDIGON, etc by its resists as well as its sheer bulk. Carbink I'm not completely solid about but it's nice for stall and handles a horde of common Pokemon that otherwise pester stall.

Golbat can be B+, since it's a pretty good Defogger that has very nice bulk and it takes on Hitmonlee and Aromatisse quite nicely. It's vulnerable to Knock Off but its typing, Defog, bulk, and okay offensive presence make it quite solid.

Hitmontop I have no opinion on, though it can be B-. Intimidate is a really cool ability and allows Hitmontop to check and lessen the threat level of many physical attackers in the tier, and with Foresight it can both get a spin on Doublade and stand a fighting chance against the two swords by hitting with Close Combat. It has fine bulk to spin with and Foresight is nice for something with its bulk, it's a more bulky spinner compared to Hitmonlee and Kabutops so if you need a more defensive spinner Hitmontop is definitely up there.

I definitely think Clawitzer should move up. I've used it since the beginning of XY RU, and it's really awesome. It packs a real punch with 120 Special Attack and Mega Launcher, plus awesome coverage in Scald, Aura Sphere, Dark Pulse, and Ice Beam. It packs a lot of power with these three moves, and is very hard to switch into. This makes Clawitzer a really good breaker that can also provide incredible offensive pressure to the opponent's team, and it has okay bulk to use as well. Every slower mon is basically going to have trouble facing Clawitzer and this thing hits hard. Even though it's rather easy to wear down and revenge kill, Clawitzer is really good at wallbreaking and applying offensive pressure so it should be A- imo.

Idk about Registeel, it's kinda not as good without Yanmega but it's still a great wall, and Emboar is still a decent breaker so I don't really know what to say.

I said this before but Bronzong should move up. B- is less than it really deserves. It's a very good bulky Steel-type that makes for a reliable SR setter, and packs a decent offensive presence with Gyro Ball and Earthquake. It's a great Abomasnow answer and it takes on Rhyperior decently and in general has a horde of resistances to switch into quite a few things. It should definitely be B Rank if not up there in B+, very undervalued Pokemon.

Won't comment on the others though I'm really not a big fan of dropping Durant, it doesn't require much support to function and it's really freaking scary, if you let it set up once (which isn't that hard), it will basically destroy you.

Just some thoughts.

 

[phantom]

Just gonna comment on some things:

skunk to b- - Yes, I underestimated this thing at first but a Defog user that can beat CM Psychics and not be trapped by Dugtrio is a pretty sweet niche, so it should rise

granbull to b- -- Yes, more physically bulky than Aromatisse when factoring in Intimidate and access to cool moves like Thunder Wave and Earthquake to keep Steels from switching in too easily, can do a CB set as well

seismitoad to b- Yes, a SR user that can beat Gligar is pretty good in this meta, it's also a swell doublade check, among other things, could use a rise

sceptile to c+ - Yes, this thing is just very niche and doesn't do much that other Grass-types can't

gastrodon to c+ - Same as above but for Waters, it lacks SR unlike toad and Wish unlike Mola, instant recovery is great, but it doesn't offer its team all that much utility

audino to c+ - Yes, it's a proficient Wish passer thanks to regen and can check a shit ton of special attackers, could use a rise

tyrantrum to c - It's a moltres check, but otherwise it's kinda hard fitting this thing on a team

gallade to c+ - I don't feel like it has all that much over other Fighting-types and the fact that it doesn't resist Knock Off makes it worse, should be in the same rank as sawk

Cinccino to c+ - It's problem is that it's too predictable, so it can't capitalize on using multi-hit moves to smash hazard leads when they all can see what it's going to do from a mile away

ROCK WITH MANY EYES (REGIROCK) C+ - This should be B- imo, it has greater overall bulk than Rhyperior and lacks the exploitable 4x weaknesses (3x if you want to get technical), while still having good offensive presence, it lacks roar and solid rock, but that's why rhy is in A+, putting Regirock in B- wouldn't hurt

ROCK /W EYES C- / C - Yes, it lacks offensive presence, but it otherwise has gr8 bulk and a godly typing

Bronzong to B - Yes, Mega Abomasnow getting more popular makes this thing a lot better, and I'm not sure why it moved down in the first place, especially when it can deal with a lot of top threats like other steels but not take spike damage or get trapped by dugtrio

regi to b+ - Nah, I think it's fine where it is, it's still very bulky and can check a shit ton of Pokemon, there's also the underrated Curse set which sweeps certain teams with ease

durant to a- - Yes, not on the same level as other threats and the initial accuracy of its moves really take away from the appeal of its hard-hitting attacks

 

[Bouff]

ok so now tht funbro made his descriptions guess i have tooXD

skunk- definitely has to move up, this is probably one of the most underrated things in the tier. access to decent defensive typing, has a niche over drapion with access to defog, but imo the most underrated part about it is its access to punishment, which shits on the setup sweepers (cress, reuni) that otherwise plague stall / semi-stall.

granbull to b- ya, good defenses, has a cool support movepool with access to heal bell, thunder wave, and isn't a slouch offensively

seismitoad to b- - ya, has a pretty cool niche as an offensive sr setter, shits on other opposing sr setters, etc

tile to c+ - wish this thing wasnt so bleh but it pretty much doesnt have much to offer that other grass-types dont

gastro to c+ - maybe? idk what this thing does but people jerk off to some gay offensive lo set so iunno

audino - ya, pretty cool wishpasser on stall teams, checks moltres p well, kinda like mola in the sense that it can wishpass while it keeping itself healthy at the same time

tyrantrum to c- ...eh. i still feel like dd is really unexplored in this meta, is a pretty cool molt check, and like afro said it has good coverage coupled with a nice ability and offensive stats, might deserve to stay

gallade to c+ - ive been using a swords dance set lately and while i keep missing zen headbutt which is gay as fuck i still feel like it has potential, people are just slapping av on it which they shouldn't as stated multiple times before

cincilla pokemon, evolution, with the dream world ability to c+ - see spirit. reuben will win whenever he uses this though

regirock to c+ - like spirit said, definitely deserves more credit than its given. has a pretty decent movepool and checks fire-types arguably better than rhyperior

binky to c- / c - ive never used this but it seems ok on paper, 4x weakness to steel and lack of offensive pressure sucks ass tho

zong to b / b+ - yes, criminally underrated (fuk u molk), not much to say that spirit didnt other than it arguably has better offensive presence than non-curse regi and checks rhyp better than regi ever could l0l

durant - idk about this thing, i guess it could move down because it really hates the growing popularity of scarf molt (or the fact that +1 ant doesnt kill it at full health unless its using stone edge or some shit)

edit: cradily aka meru fetishmon : has a pretty cool ability, reliable recovery, ok offenses, i think it seems pretty cool to use in the current meta and should get more recognition

 

[FAJI]

I support Tyrantrum to C+, it comes in on the most powerful and threatening mon in the tier with AV and can destroy teams with it's great attack and coverage.

I don't agree with moving gallade down, has many great sets and can destroy some certain types of teams given the right support.

 

[g]

Skuntank to B-It is a Defog user that, unlike Gligar, doesn't give a free switch-in to Psychic types, in fact it checks them. It also has a decently cool movepool with niche moves such as Punishment and Foul Play (that lets it act as a 10/10 Doublade check) in addition to Taunt/Defog/Sucker etc. The rise of support cobalion isn't that nice but this surely believes to B (esp with shit like Sceptile there)

Granbull to B-It has a bit more offensive presence than Aromatisse that doesn't let stuff like Moltres, Magneton, and Doublade somewhat switch in for free. It also has Intimidate and Thunder Wave to support more offensive teams

Seismitoad to B-
I love this Pokemon. Phenomenal Doublade check and Stealth Rock setter. It can also beat some Moltres variants and is quite fast for a defensive Pokemon

Sceptile to C+Too much competition and is not that threatening

Gastrodon to C+I mean it checks Moltres i guess and has Clear Smog and Recover over other Bulky water types (and Electric immunity) but it doesn't belong to B imo

Audino to C+Underrated as hell. Can pass wishes and heal defensive teams on a lot of Pokemon. It also has a slot for Knock Off to remove boosting items

Tyrantrum to CNever been threatened by this mon but i guess it checks moltres, not sure

Gallade to C+Unlike other Fighting types (bar Virizion i guess) it beats Gligar+Slowking quite easily thanks to Ice Punch and it can also stallbreak with Bulk Up i guess. Cute mon

Cinccino to C+Ok it is quite predictable but seriously a moveset of Knock Off/Tail Slap/Bullet Seed/Sing|Rock Blast|U-turn is very threatening for many teams if priority users are gone. I guess that Cobalion and Gligar being popular is bad for it but i can see it both in B- and C+

Tangrowth to C+I have already shown support for this one

ROCK WITH MANY EYES (REGIROCK) to C+
One of the best Moltres and Exploud checks in the tier. Very reliable Stealth Rock setter and incredibly bulky on both sides. Thunder Wave is very good

ROCK W/ EYES C- / C -
Does the niche things Regirock does a bit better but it is mostly inferior overall and gives free switches to a lot of mons. This should be outside of D however.
I also think Abomasnow should stay the same rank for the reasons Molk already pointed out
On the other mons i don't have a strong opinion

 

[Dillon~]

I've seen people ask why delphox dropped, main reason I feel is that it has many flaws such as that it is a Fire-type that loses to Doublade (after Stealth Rock), and while it does very good against defensive and stall teams, it isn't all that hard for an offensive team to check. 104 Speed is not the best in this tier, Slowking is also a great pokemon that has no problem dealing with Delphox, and AV Slowking has only become more and more used. Also Meloetta has risen to prominence in the new meta which is both competition for a team slot and the increase in usage of a pretty good counter / check depending on the sets being used. I have begun to see more ROCK WITH EYES around, maybe as a counter to druddy. I would also like to see barbaracle used a little more, with sash Shell smash, however it can be killed by gurdurr with mach punch