CAP 19 CAP 19 - Part 9 - Complete Movepool Submissions

[paintseagull]

Here in this thread, users may make complete movepool submissions for CAP19. At the conclusion of this thread, our movepool leader alexwolf will be compiling a slate of Final Submissions for the community to vote on, and the winning submission will become the official movepool for CAP19. We've had discussions on Attacking Moves and Non-Attacking Moves, and our Topic Leadership has compiled lists of Required, Allowed, and Disallowed moves that submitters must adhere to in order to make a legal Final Submission:

Required Moves

Final Movepool Submissions must include all of these moves; those that don't will not be considered for slating.

Thunderbolt
Return / Frustration
Hidden Power
Facade
Hyper Beam
Round
Giga Impact

Rest
Toxic
Sleep Talk
Substitute
Protect
Confide
Attract
Swagger
Double Team

Allowed Moves

These moves are considered optional. It is up to each movepool submitter whether or not to include these moves in their Final Submissions.

Electric moves
Poison moves
Psychic moves
Rock moves
Bug moves
Steel moves
Dragon moves
Fairy moves
Dark moves
Ghost moves
Normal moves
Flying moves
Physical Ice / Grass / Water / Fighting / Ground / Fire moves except for those listed in Disallowed

Defog
Taunt
Thunder Wave
Safeguard
Encore
Clear Smog
Haze
Rain Dance / Sunny Day / Hail / Sandstorm
Attack boosting moves

Disallowed Moves

These moves are banned from inclusion in Final Submissions. Movepools that include any of these moves will not be considered for slating.

Special Ice / Grass / Water / Fighting / Ground moves over 60 BP
All Special Fire moves

U-turn
Acid Spray
Volt Switch
Hurricane
Earthquake
Icicle Crash
Flare Blitz
Blaze Kick
Wood Hammer
Close Combat
Superpower
Hammer Arm
Cross Chop

Stealth Rock
Rapid Spin
Nasty Plot
Quiver Dance
Shell Smash
Tail Glow
Baton Pass
Parting Shot
Recover (and its clones, including Moonlight and friends)
Pain Split
Healing Wish
Memento
Toxic Spikes
Spikes
Sticky Web
Will-O-Wisp
Defense, Special Defense, and Special Attack boosting moves (including Reflect and Light Screen)
Destiny Bond
Roar / Whirlwind / Dragon Tail
Perish Song
Tailwind
Trick Room
Whirlpool / Infestation / Mean Look / Block
Speed boosting moves including Dragon Dance
Magnet Rise
Soak

There are also limits on the number of Restricted Moves and total moves that will be allowed in Final Submissions, as per this discussion. All Final Movepool Submissions must have no more than 28 Restricted Moves (RMs) and 58 total moves in order to be considered for slating. Information on which moves qualify as Restricted Moves, as well as general information on making a complete CAP movepool, can be found here. While this is a submission thread, discussion on work-in-progress (WIP) and Final Submissions is encouraged so that the community can make an informed decision during the polling stage.

This thread will be open for submissions and discussion as soon as alexwolf posts his opening remarks.

-------------------

CAP 19 so far:

Concept:

Name: Einherjar ~Acta Est Fabula~

Description: A Pokemon that dissuades your opponent from fainting it, or can even leave it's presence on the field felt even after it faints.

Justification: When a Pokemon faints, it's usually thought of as the battle having gotten down to a 5-6. However, we've yet to discover if a Pokemon can leave a lasting impression on the battle even after having fainted; be it through moves like Healing Wish and Destiny Bond, placing hazards that the opponent can't remove as their removal has been taken care of, or by leaving an opponent's key member weakened and/or taken out.

Questions To Be Answered:

• How can a Pokemon leave a long-lasting effect on the rest of the battle with just it's moves?
• How the hell is it different from simply ramming a sacrificial martyr into your opponent's team and hoping it punches holes in it?
• Building on the previous question, is it possible to build this Pokemon as a defensive threat rather than a "Glass Cannon"?
• Is it even possible for a Pokemon to leave a lasting effect on on the battle, even after it faints?
• Could changing your opponent's way of thinking even be plausible? From, "I need to take CAP X out!", to, "Damn, if I take CAP X out, I'll be in trouble...!"

Type: Electric/Poison
Abilities: Storm Drain / (Insomnia/Vital Spirit)
Stats: 60 HP / 57 Atk / 119 Def / 131 SpA / 98 SpD / 100 Spe

Leadership Team:

Pwnemon- Topic Leader
ginganinja - Ability Leader
srk1214 - Typing Leader
alexwolf - Movepool Leader
Deck Knight - Stats Leader

 

[alexwolf]

As with most movepool leaders, i am looking for a balance between competitive moves and flavor moves. I don't want people including as many RMs as possible just for the sake of it, or people including every kind of coverage option available for the sake of it. Other than this, i don't have anything else to say as no potentially distracting move has been allowed, so feel free to improvise as much as you want, as long as you keep the aforementioned balance.

Good luck to all submitters!

 

[P3DS]

Final Submission

OK, so here is my first thoughts on my move choices:

• Plasmanta looks like a very cunning pokemon, due to that smirk on one of the original designs, and the fact that quite a few marine animals are quite intelligen. This fact lead me to believe that the duo of Plasmanta and Mega Gyarados would clearly be a brains and brawn duo. This said, I have added a few techy moves to Plasmanta, so to show it is pretty smart. Generally these moves occur in the smart category of contest battles too. Some moves to reflect this are type changing moves. I've included: reflect type and camouflage in my move pool.
• Bioluminescence is quite clear, since I have chosen quite a few light based moves. Also, this could indicate some sort of psychic abilities, so there are a few of these in there too.
• For my choice of egg groups, Water 1 came as my first choice. Water 1 includes pokemon such as Mantine, Kingdra, Stunfisk and Dragalge. They are all aquatic and have similarities, IMO, to Plasmanta. Also, a lot of the egg moves I looked at have at least one user in this egg group. My 2nd is between dragon, flying and amorphous. With it's majesti appearance, it fits both the graceful flying group (manta rays are deemed birds of the sea) and the impressive dragon type, whilst amorphous is usually another option with water and poison types for egg groups. In the end, dragon was the one for me.

Required
Repeat (level up only)
Restricted
= Equivalent

level up

Start: Screech, Eerie Impulse, Charge, Leer, Poison Sting
Lv 3: Poison Sting
Lv 5: Feint Attack
Lv7: Thunder Shock
Lv 10: Smokescreen
Lv 13: Poison Jab
Lv 16: Glare
Lv 21: Parabolic Charge
Lv 24: Encore
Lv 27: Mud Shot
Lv 31: Discharge
Lv 35: Defog
Lv 39: Scary Face
Lv 41: Switcheroo
Lv 43: Cross Poison
Lv 48: Sludge Wave
Lv 51: Wring Out

TMs

TM No.
6: Toxic
9: Venoshock
10: Hidden Power
12: Taunt
15: Hyper Beam
17: Protect
21: Frustration =
24: Thunderbolt
25: Thunder
27: Return =
29: Psychic
32: Double Team
34: Sludge Wave
36: Sludge Bomb
42: Facade
44: Rest
45: Attract
48: Round
62: Acrobatics
63: Embargo
68: Giga Impact
70: Flash
73: Thunder Wave
84: Poison Jab
87: Swagger
88: Sleep Talk
90: Substitute
91: Flash Cannon
99: Dazzling Gleam
100: Confide
HM01: Cut

egg moves

Egg groups: Water 1/Dragon

Topsy-Turvy (from malamar line)
Reflect type (Chain Breed: Tentacruel -> Omanyte -> CAP 19)
Clear Smog (Chain Breed: Koffing/Weezing -> Shellos -> CAP 19)
Confuse Ray (from mantine and lapras)
Camouflage (from Stunfisk and Skrelp lines)
Tickle (from Omanyte line)
Venom Drench (Chain Breed: Seviper -> Skrelp -> CAP 19)
Disable (from slowpoke line)

Move Stats:
Total: 57, with 27 being restricted

justification

Justifications:

My key themes were around Dragalge, Stunfisk and general electric types. Flavor wise I added aspects from dark types like Malamar, due to the tricky, dark, mind game style plays I would expect a smart Pokemon to exploit. Overall, it is meant to have tools to take you down, but be tricky behind it, causing mind games that could potentially be fatal.

Level up: The early levels has a quite dark theme about Plasmanta. It has a lot of tricks to play around with, such as Screech and Eerie Impulse, to assist in aiding Plasmanta. With Screech, it puts the foes at the choice of KOing Plasmanta, but letting Gyarados get a free KO, or switching and not letting it. Eerie impulse is mainly flavor, but is pretty useful to nerf electric types for Gyarados. I chose Poison Sting and Leer for early level moves, as they were the ones that suited it the best flavor wise (The sting ray's main weapon of choice is it's tail, and that is like a sting). Glare is pretty nice for ground switch ins, due to the fact that it hits ground types and paralyses them. Smokescreen and scary face are flavor. Parabolic Charge is nice to give it some recovery, whilst Encore is nice for water type moves (and Disable is nasty with it). Mud Shot gives us a tool vs heatran and co if needed. You get Defog, for hazards, Scary Face for some speed control, Cross Poison and Sludge Wave for poison STABs and even Switcheroo, for the off chance you want a choiced set. Wring Out and Power Whip are mainly flavor, with the whip like tail of Plasmanta, but they do have some cool uses. Wring Out can get a pretty nice 121 BP, special, normal type attack off, if the opponent is fresh on the field, letting it deal some good strong neutral damage. Flavor wise, you can see it using it's tail a lot, which would be how it wrings the pokemon out. Although it would be overlooked, timid LO Wring Out can deal ~61% min to a physically defensive quagsire, a huge threat for Plasmanta.

TMs: I actually put these on last, so that is the reason I have so few compared to other submissions. You have the main ones like return, toxic and hidden power. You have the standard thunderolt and sludge bomb, which is common on pokemon of the respective types, and then added thunder and sludge wave to give it other options. With it's dark like appeal, I gave it psychic and embargo, to give it something for amoonguss (psychic) and to null items (which can be useful). Venoshock is cool on poison types, and has a niche with venom drench, due to both being affected by poison status. Taunt stops setup. Dazzling gleam, flash and flash cannon are flavor on the bioluminescence side of Plasmanta. Acrobatics is the fact it is quite nimble, and as manta rays are seen as birds in the sea.

Egg moves: I wanted this to be more of a mind game than most. I left out haze in return for topsy-turvy. This is a little trickier to play, but the reward is huge. Take for instance a quiver dance volcarona (We have already mega evolved gyarados) and it has boosted. Topsy-turvy would put them at a disadvantage rather than at a blank slate. I added some type control too. Camouflage is due to sting rays having brilliant camouflage, and to disguise themselves against unsuspecting prey. It can be useful to really annoy stuff like landorus, by removing it's ground weakness, in return for no STABs on sludge wave and thunderbolt, but does get STAB on wring out. Reflect type is pretty much the same boat, but it can be devastating. Confuse ray can give us some Parafusion hax, but you mainly want to be attacking. Clear smog is another variant on haze, so it's alright to level the stats out. Venom drench can be devastating to many foes if they are poisoned. That -2 in att, satt and speed will wreck any sweeper, however, they need to be poisoned first, and the lack of toxic spikes means you use toxic, or a toxic spikes setter too. Tickle is cool. -1 att and defense gives an opportunity for gyarados. It then gives the question: Damage gyarados and sacrifice my pokemon here and bring in a counter, or switch out to counter, and go from there.

Overall, a fun, yet tricky pokemon to play with.

 

[Delta Nite]

With CAP 19's typing, Soak is much more than a flavour move. Looking at the first post, it is not on the allowed nor disallowed moves. A move with such huge implications on what checks us and we just forgot discussing it on the last part of the project?

 

[P3DS]

With CAP 19's typing, Soak is much more than a flavour move. Looking at the first post, it is not on the allowed nor disallowed moves. A move with such huge implications on what checks us and we just forgot discussing it on the last part of the project?

Magnet rise isn't there either, but that is a confirmed disallow. Soak wasn't brought up, and I can only say the following about it: It can stop the grass types who can try stall out mega dos, such as ferro and amoonguss, but with slow ground types, Non STAB EQs will still get a OHKO most of the time.

0 Atk Hippowdon Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Abomasnow: 272-324 (83.9 - 100%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Mold Breaker Excadrill Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Abomasnow: 428-504 (132 - 155.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
4 Atk Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Abomasnow: 344-408 (106.1 - 125.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Basically, If it isn't running much bulk, CAP is still stopped by an EQ, and then makes it harder to KO with Mega Dos:

(all have been soaked)

+1 252+ Atk Mold Breaker Mega Gyarados Earthquake vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Landorus-T: 223-263 (69.6 - 82.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 252+ Atk Mold Breaker Mega Gyarados Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 131-155 (31.1 - 36.9%) -- 76% chance to 3HKO after sandstorm damage and Leftovers recovery
+1 252+ Atk Mold Breaker Mega Gyarados Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Excadrill: 307-362 (85 - 100.2%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO

 

[Elite Lord Sigma]

Final Submission

Level Up Moves: I drew upon both the CAP's typing and the behavior of real manta rays to put together the level up move set. Among other behaviors, manta rays are known for breaching and other acrobatic feats, so I added a few flavor moves to represent that (e.g. Bounce). On a side note, I have no idea why Spark is considered a restricted move.

TM and HMs: In addition to carrying on the themes from the level up moves, I decided to put a bit more emphasis on the bioluminescent patterns with certain moves (e.g. Flash, Dazzling Gleam) as well as fill in some important missing moves (e.g. Sludge Bomb/Wave). I also threw in Fly because the mental image of a flying manta ray raining down electricity and Mega Gyarados missiles upon its hapless foes was too funny and awesome to ignore.

Egg Groups: The closest evolutionary relatives to rays and skates are sharks. As such, I chose the two egg groups of Mantine and Sharpedo: Water 1 and Water 2, respectively.

Egg Moves: Here, I elected to add some Water-type moves, as those fit the two egg groups as well as the CAP itself. I also added a few useful support moves (i.e. Defog, Clear Smog) that fit the CAP in terms of flavor as well as typing.

Key
*: Restricted Move
!: Repeated Move
=: Equivalent Move

Level Up

--: Tackle
--: Leer
06: Thunder Shock
09: Acid
12: Charge
16: Thunder Wave*
21: Spark*
26: Sludge
32: Wing Attack
38: Parabolic Charge
44: Take Down
51: Discharge*
58: Bounce*
66: Thunder*

Restricted: 5
Total: 14

TM/HM

TM06: Toxic*
TM09: Venoshock
TM10: Hidden Power*
TM12: Taunt*
TM15: Hyper Beam
TM17: Protect*
TM21: Frustration*
TM24: Thunderbolt*
TM25: Thunder!
TM27: Return=
TM29: Psychic*
TM32: Double Team
TM34: Sludge Wave*
TM36: Sludge Bomb*
TM40: Aerial Ace
TM41: Torment
TM42: Facade*
TM44: Rest*
TM45: Attract
TM48: Round
TM51: Steel Wing
TM62: Acrobatics*
TM68: Giga Impact
TM70: Flash
TM73: Thunder Wave!
TM87: Swagger
TM88: Sleep Talk*
TM90: Substitute*
TM91: Flash Cannon*
TM93: Wild Charge*
TM99: Dazzling Gleam*
TM100: Confide
HM02: Fly

Restricted: 22
Total: 45

Egg Moves

Egg Groups: Water 1/Water 2

Air Slash* (Mantine/Masquerain/Wingull/Pelipper/Ducklett/Swanna)
Aqua Jet* (Psyduck/Golduck/countless others)
Clear Smog* (Psyduck/Golduck/Horsea/Seadra/Kingdra/Wailmer/Wailord)
Defog* (Ducklett/Swanna)
Eerie Impulse (Lanturn/Wooper/Quagsire/Stunfisk)
Ion Deluge (Chinchou/Lanturn)
Poison Tail (Skrelp/Dragalge)
Signal Beam* (Remoraid/Octillery/countless others)
Venom Drench (Skrelp/Dragalge)
Water Pulse (Wingull/Pelipper/countless others)

Restricted: 27
Total: 55

EDIT: Removed Charge Beam.

 

[Gemini Taurus]

This is gonna be a WIP for now...

----------------------------------

Level Up

* = Restricted Move
! = Repeated Move

LV 00: Zap Cannon
LV 00: Tackle
LV 00: Poison Sting
LV 00: Eerie Impulse
LV 07: Charge Beam*
LV 11: Leer
LV 15: Scary Face
LV 23: Water Gun
LV 25: Parabolic Charge
LV 29: Poison Tail
LV 37: Glare*
LV 41: Discharge*
LV 47: Aqua Tail*
LV 53: Mean Look
LV 59: Gunk Shot*
LV 64: Zap Cannon!

Total: 15
Restricted Moves: 5

Justification

For the LV UP moves, I mostly chose based on Manta Ray flavour, with moves such as Poison Sting, and Poison Tail being notable in this department. Another notable set of moves is the moves based on eyes, those being Leer, Scary Face, Glare and Mean Look, which I mostly chose because of the intimidating nature of this pokemon, and it's bright red eyes in general! The rest of the moves are mostly Electric type and there just to show off the electric typing in the movepool.


Justification for some odd moves:

Parabolic Charge has been given to every Gen VI electric-type, so leaving it out would break that.
Water Gun/Aqua Tail were given as a Manta Ray IS an aquatic creature, and many pokemon who aren't water type but ARE water based get such moves in their LC up movepools.

TMs/HMs

* = Restricted Move
! = Repeated Move
** = Equivalent Move

TM 06: Toxic*
TM 09: Venoshock
TM 10: Hidden Power*
TM 12: Taunt*
TM 15: Hyper Beam
TM 17: Protect*
TM 18: Rain Dance*
TM 21: Frustration*
TM 24: Thunderbolt*
TM 25: Thunder*
TM 27: Return**
TM 30: Shadow Ball*
TM 32: Double Team
TM 34: Sludge Wave!
TM 36: Sludge Bomb*
TM 42: Facade*
TM 44: Rest*
TM 45: Attract
TM 48: Round
TM 57: Charge Beam!
TM 68: Giga Impact
TM 70: Flash
TM 73: Thunder Wave*
TM 84: Poison Jab*
TM 87: Swagger
TM 88: Sleep Talk*
TM 90: Substitute*
TM 91: Flash Cannon*
TM 97: Dark Pulse*
TM 99: Dazzling Gleam*
TM 100: Confide

Total: 31 (2 Repeats)
Restricted Moves: 20 (2 Repeats, 1 Equivalent)

Justification

TO COME

Egg Moves

Egg Group: Water 1/Amorphous
* = Restricted Move

Clear Smog*
Ion Deluge
Reflect Type
Signal Beam*
Venom Drench

Total: 5
Restricted Moves: 2

Justification

TO COME

 

[paintseagull]

Looks like there were some moves left out of the post initially (Magnet Rise for example), I've gone back and tried to find the ones that were missed. alexwolf can you double-check the lists please?

Soak isn't a Restricted Move, therefore it doesn't warrant discussion unless the discussion leader deemed it situationally competitive. (I'm almost sure it isn't in this case)

 

[Lunarir]

Final Submission

Level Up

Hide

Start - Eerie Impulse
Start - Parabolic Charge
Start - Leer
Start - Poison Sting
Start - Bubble
Start - Tail Whip
Lv. 5 - Thunder Shock
Lv. 9 - Acid
Lv. 13 - Bite
Lv. 17 - Scary Face
Lv. 21 - Camouflage
Lv. 25 - Water Pulse
Lv. 28 - Spark (Guess it's an RM)
Lv. 31 - Poison Tail
Lv. 35 - Clear Smog
Lv. 38 - Aqua Tail
Lv. 42 - Discharge
Lv. 46 - Bounce
Lv. 49 - Sludge Bomb
Lv. 53 - Ion Deluge
Lv. 58 - Zap Cannon

TM/HM

Hide

TM06 - Toxic
TM09 - Venoshock
TM10 - Hidden Power
TM12 - Taunt
TM15 - Hyper Beam
TM17 - Protect
TM18 - Rain Dance
TM21 - Frustration
TM24 - Thunderbolt
TM25 - Thunder
TM27 - Return
TM29 - Psychic
TM32 - Double Team
TM34 - Sludge Wave
TM36 - Sludge Bomb*
TM42 - Facade
TM44 - Rest
TM45 - Attract
TM48 - Round
TM68 - Giga Impact
TM70 - Flash
TM73 - Thunder Wave
TM84 - Poison Jab
TM87 - Swagger
TM88 - Sleep Talk
TM90 - Substitute
TM91 - Flash Cannon
TM99 - Dazzling Gleam
TM100 - Confide
HM05 - Waterfall

Egg Moves (Water 1/Water 2)

Hide

Defog (Swanna)
Mind Reader (Poliwrath)
Signal Beam (Mantine, Octillery)
Venom Drench (Skrelp)

Justification

Hide

Level Up: Aqua Tail, Poison Tail, Tail Whip, and Poison Sting are due to it's tails (and in Poison Sting's case, the stingers,). Leer and Scary Face come from it's intimidating red eyes. Bounce from the behavior of rays breaching the water and "flying." Camouflage is because sting rays often employ camouflage in the wild. Meanwhile, the rest have to do which the fact that it's an Electric/Poison type, Parabolic Charge is mainly due to fact that every other gen 6 electric-type learns it. Bubble and Water Pulse are due to the fact that it's an aquatic animal. Zap Cannon is flavor because of Magistrum's supporting art for it.
TM/HM: A there is a large focus on the bioluminescence (Flash, Dazzling Gleam, and Flash Cannon), it look intelligent hence Psychic, and the rest are just general TMs that Electric and Poison types learn. Waterfall is added because it's an aquatic animal.
Egg Moves: Defog due to its "wings" and both are moves Mantine has the ability to learn. Signal Beam is because many Electric-types, and close relative Mantine, learn it. Venom Drench is simply just a flavor Poison-type move. Lock-On is due to fact that many Pokemon who learn Zap Cannon also learn some other way.

Total moves: 55
RMs: 27

All in all, I believe that this is a good mix between flavor and competitive. None of its coverage helps this Pokemon too much against its counters, and some super-effective does less than its neutral STAB. Defog and Clear Smog both help Plasmanta's role to help Mega Gyarados set-up.


EDIT: Charge Beam removed
EDIT2: Removed Power Whip and Air Slash, changed level up
EDIT3: Changed level up; added Waterfall; Changed Lock-On to Mind Reader
Feedback is welcome.

 

[NumberCruncher]

Final Submission

* = Restricted
(RP) = Repeated

Level Up

Start: Parabolic Charge (Through Move Relearner)
Start: Splash
Start: Bubble
Start: Poison Sting
Start: Leer
Level 5: Leer (RP)
Level 8: Acid
Level 12: Thundershock
Level 16: Flash
Level 22: Sludge
Level 26: Defog *
Level 34: Poison Tail
Level 39: Scary Face
Level 45: Clear Smog *
Level 49: Aqua Tail *
Level 54: Discharge *
Level 58: Thunder Wave *
Level 63: Signal Beam *

TMs

TM06: Toxic *
TM07: Hail
TM09: Venoshock
TM10: Hidden Power *
TM12: Taunt (RP)
TM15: Hyper Beam
TM17: Protect *
TM18: Rain Dance *
TM21: Frustration *
TM24: Thunderbolt *
TM25: Thunder *
TM27: Return (Pseudo RP)
TM32: Double Team
TM34: Sludge Bomb *
TM36: Sludge Wave *
TM42: Facade *
TM44: Rest *
TM45: Attract
TM48: Round
TM51: Steel Wing
TM68: Giga Impact
TM70: Flash (RP)
TM73: Thunder Wave *
TM75: Swords Dance *
TM84: Poison Jab *
TM88: Sleep Talk *
TM87: Swagger
TM90: Substitute *
TM93: Wild Charge *
TM99: Dazzling Gleam *
TM100: Confide
HM01: Cut
HM06: Dive

Egg Moves

Egg groups: Water 1
Psybeam (From Mantyke family)
Air Slash * (From Mantyke and Ducklett family)
Camouflage (From Stunfisk and Inkay family)
Extrasensory * (From Greninja)
Wring Out (From Kabuto and Remoraid family)

That gives us 51 moves, 25 of which are restricted if I'm not mistaken. We have a decent blend of flavor moves and competitive moves. We have a decent, but not overwhelming, assortment of special moves. This is a moveset that gives CAP enough utility to be worth running without being an answer-or-die Pokemon. Either Air Slash or Extrasensory would have worked against Grass/Poison types and Fighting types that generally keep Gyarados down, but I decided to give it both so it could adjust if the format adjusted to it. Parabolic Charge keeps it from getting just chipped out, while also netting no advantage against our designated counters. Signal Beam helps our match-up against Electric-move wielding Psychics. Clear Smog over Haze because it's more flavorful and keeps damage on the opponent so the opponent doesn't try to PP stall you with Stat buff moves.

 

[alexwolf]

Looks like there were some moves left out of the post initially (Magnet Rise for example), I've gone back and tried to find the ones that were missed. alexwolf can you double-check the lists please?

Soak isn't a Restricted Move, therefore it doesn't warrant discussion unless the discussion leader deemed it situationally competitive. (I'm almost sure it isn't in this case)

I disallowed Magnet Rise but probably forgot to include it in the list. Soak makes every Pokemon a Water-type, therefore allowing us to hit everything for super effective damage with Electric STABs, so it's obviously disallowed. Sorry for not dealing with Soak earlier, totally forgot about it.

 

[HeaLnDeaL]

Final Submission

Summary of my Submission
Key Non-Attacking Moves: Encore, Taunt, Haze, Thunder Wave, Rain Dance. No Defog.
Key STAB Moves: Thunderbolt, Thunder, Discharge, Sludge Bomb, Sludge Wave.
Key Coverage Moves: Psychic/Psyshock, Dazzling Gleam, Signal Beam, Flash Cannon. No Dark Pulse/Shadow Ball/Air Slash.
Key Flavor Moves: Parabolic Charge, Ion Deluge, Eerie Impulse = Uncommon Electric Moves to match the unusual type/species of our CAPmon. Aqua Tail, Water Pulse, and Splash for aquatic species flavor. And in general a fair amount of flavorful poison moves.

Level Up Moves

Level Up Moves (3-3-4 pattern up to Lv 29, 4-5-4-5 pattern after Lv 29)
-- Poison Sting
-- Thunder Shock
-- Supersonic
06 Poison Sting –R-
06 Thunder Shock –R-
09 Supersonic –R-
12 Acid
16 Encore *
19 Thunder Wave *
22 Clear Smog *
26 Ion Deluge
29 Poison Tail
33 Aqua Tail *
38 Parabolic Charge
42 Psywave
47 Discharge
51 Cross Poison *
56 Swagger
60 Thunder *
64 Eerie Impulse

Competitive Moves: Encore, Thunder Wave, Clear Smog, Discharge

Competitive Move Justification

-Encore is twofold; it can lock the opponent into a move that Gyarados resists, and it can dissuade the opponent from not taking CAP19 seriously and using it as set up fodder.
-Thunder Wave is a standard move for Electric types. It also potentially cripples speedy threats and helps turn them into something manageable by Gyarados.
-Clear Smog, like Haze, removes stat buffs that the opponent might have netted.
-Discharge is a weaker Thunderbolt with higher paralysis chance, obviously.

Egg Moves

Egg Moves (Water 1 / Water 2 )

Haze *
Signal Beam *
Splash
Wide Guard
Shock Wave
Water Pulse

(As a side note, all of these moves can be obtained through breeding with either Mantine or Gyarados, though some obviously can come from multiple sources.)

Competitive Moves: Haze, Signal Beam, Water Pulse

Competitive Move Justification

-Haze removes stat buffs. Luckily, CAP19 really has no conceivably usable stat boosting moves itself, meaning it won’t mind having its stats reset as well.
-Signal Beam provides bioluminescence flavor while giving Bug type coverage.
252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Signal Beam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Latios: 198-234 (65.5 - 77.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(198, 200, 203, 205, 208, 211, 211, 213, 216, 218, 221, 224, 226, 229, 231, 234)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Signal Beam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Alakazam: 224-265 (88.8 - 105.1%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO
(224, 226, 229, 231, 234, 237, 239, 242, 244, 247, 250, 252, 255, 257, 260, 265)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Signal Beam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Dark Type Greninja: 283-335 (98.9 - 117.1%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO
(283, 286, 291, 294, 296, 302, 304, 307, 309, 315, 317, 320, 325, 328, 330, 335)

Here, Signal Beam is only stronger than Dazzling Gleam against pure psychic types like Alakazam, and it’s much more likely that Alakazam will survive the hit than not if he’s tanking one for whatever reason… I, in part, did NOT choose to include Shadow Ball because of it's greater damage to pure Psychic types (not to mention that 20% Sp Def drop could be devastating if we get lucky).

-Water Pulse isn’t super competitive, but it gives us weak water coverage without using HP. Essentially, the only time I see this being useful is with Rain support.

TMs and HMs

TMs/HMs
TM03: Psyshock *
TM06: Toxic *
TM09: Venoshock
TM10: Hidden Power
TM12: Taunt *
TM15: Hyper Beam
TM17: Protect *
TM18: Rain Dance *
TM21: Frustration *
TM24: Thunderbolt *
TM25: Thunder * -R-
TM27: Return *
TM29: Psychic *
TM32: Double Team
TM34: Sludge Wave *
TM36: Sludge Bomb *
TM42: Façade *
TM44: Rest *
TM45: Attract
TM48: Round
TM68: Giga Impact
TM73: Thunder Wave * -R-
TM87: Swagger –R-
TM88: Sleep Talk *
TM90: Substitute *
TM91: Flash Cannon *
TM93: Wild Charge *
TM99: Dazzling Gleam *
TM100: Confide
HM01: Cut

Competitive Moves: Psyshock, Taunt, Rain Dance, Thunderbolt, Thunder, Psychic, Sludge Wave, Sludge Bomb, Thunder Wave, Flash Cannon, Dazzling Gleam

Competitive Move Justification

Psyshock/Psychic: Without Bounce, Mega Gyarados struggles with Mega Venusaur. Psyshock and Psychic come in to help remedy this.

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Psychic vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Venusaur: 221-260 (60.7 - 71.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(221, 224, 226, 229, 231, 234, 237, 239, 242, 244, 247, 250, 252, 255, 257, 260)

252 SpA Plasmanta Psychic vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Venusaur: 170-200 (46.7 - 54.9%) -- 69.5% chance to 2HKO
(170, 172, 174, 176, 178, 180, 182, 184, 186, 188, 190, 192, 194, 196, 198, 200)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Psychic vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Garchomp: 147-174 (41.1 - 48.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
(147, 149, 151, 152, 155, 156, 157, 160, 161, 162, 165, 166, 168, 170, 172, 174)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Psychic vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Landorus: 173-204 (54.2 - 63.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(173, 175, 177, 179, 181, 183, 185, 187, 190, 191, 194, 195, 198, 199, 201, 204)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Psychic vs. 244 HP / 192+ SpD Gliscor: 118-140 (33.5 - 39.7%) -- 99.6% chance to 4HKO after Poison Heal
(118, 120, 121, 123, 125, 126, 127, 129, 130, 131, 133, 134, 135, 136, 138, 140)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Psychic vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Excadrill: 91-108 (25.2 - 29.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
(91, 92, 94, 95, 95, 96, 97, 99, 100, 101, 101, 103, 104, 105, 107, 108)

So basically I've taken calcs from our threats list and picked the mons that Psychic would actually outdamage our STABs, and I added Mega Venu in as something we actually want to threaten. As you can see, Psychic really doesn’t do a whole lot to the Ground types that we’ve been worrying about killing. The only one that psychic gets a reliable over 50% damage against is Landorus, which definitely outspeeds anyway and will cleanly OHKO so no real worries there. The justification for Psyshock is that it does less damage to all of these threats.

So, in conclusion, I think Psychic/Psyshock help us beat a valuable foes (Mega Venu) while keeping our threat list intact.

Taunt: Prevents hazards and a horde of other things Gyarados would rather avoid taking.
Rain Dance: Boosts Gyarados’s STAB, makes Thunder viable.
Thunderbolt: Primary electric STAB and required move. Not much else to say since every other submission must have this move.
Thunder:

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Thunder vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD MUTISCALE BROKEN Dragonite: 235-278 (72.7 - 86%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(235, 238, 242, 243, 247, 250, 253, 255, 257, 261, 263, 266, 269, 273, 274, 278)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Thunder vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Multiscale Intact Dragonite: 118-139 (36.5 - 43%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
(118, 119, 121, 122, 123, 125, 127, 127, 129, 131, 131, 133, 135, 136, 137, 139)

252 SpA Plasmanta Thunder vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Dragonite: 181-214 (56 - 66.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(181, 183, 186, 187, 190, 192, 195, 196, 198, 201, 202, 205, 207, 210, 211, 214)

Here we have some calcs against Dragon Dance Dragonite. Basically, Dragonite only has to worry about switching into thunder rocks are up. If rocks aren’t up, than Dragonite can revenge kill by either coming in safely, dragon dancing while taking damage, and then outspeeding and OHKOing with Earthquake. Alternatively, he could just get smacked with a Thunder, and then just OHKO with Earthquake and not Dragon Dancing (which might be useful if wishing to avoid parahax or something).

I think there’s very much some good news here though. We want Dragonite to be somewhat of a threat (he’s on our threats list), but I don’t think we want to leave his multiscale intact, because then it’s harder for Mega Gyarados to deal will. Thunderbolt helps with this, but clearly Thunder does it a bit better.
252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Thunder vs. 248 HP / 100 SpD Mega Scizor: 212-251 (61.8 - 73.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(212, 214, 218, 220, 222, 226, 227, 230, 231, 235, 238, 239, 243, 246, 247, 251)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 100 SpD Mega Scizor: 175-207 (51 - 60.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(175, 177, 179, 181, 183, 185, 187, 188, 191, 192, 195, 196, 199, 200, 203, 207)

With a life orb attached, both Thunder and Thunderbolt will be a 2HKO on Scizor, so there’s not a ton of harm with Thunder on this end either.

Sludge Wave/Sludge Bomb: These moves were already assumed when doing damage calcs for my stat submission. They let us kill fairies but won’t allow us to KO a fully healthy Alakazam.
Thunder Wave: Standard move for Electric types. It also potentially cripples speedy threats and helps turn them into something manageable by Gyarados.
Flash Cannon: Not a super powerful move with its only use really being able to hit Rock and Ice types. Our neutral STAB does almost as much as a super effective Flash Cannon. Overall, this is a move that isn’t super useful, but it included for flavor.
252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Flash Cannon vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Tyranitar in Sand: 133-156 (39 - 45.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
(133, 133, 135, 135, 138, 140, 140, 143, 143, 146, 148, 148, 151, 151, 153, 156)

So yeah, Flash Cannon isn’t helping us break any major threats anytime soon, which is to be expected.

Dazzling Gleam: This is sort of in the same boat at Flash Cannon, but is potentially more useful. Maybe.
252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Dazzling Gleam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Tyranitar in Sand: 133-156 (39 - 45.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
(133, 133, 135, 135, 138, 140, 140, 143, 143, 146, 148, 148, 151, 151, 153, 156).
252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Dazzling Gleam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Latios: 211-250 (69.8 - 82.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(211, 213, 216, 218, 221, 224, 226, 229, 231, 234, 237, 239, 242, 244, 247, 250)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Dazzling Gleam vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Keldeo: 250-294 (77.3 - 91%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(250, 252, 255, 257, 260, 263, 265, 268, 273, 276, 278, 281, 283, 286, 289, 294)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Dazzling Gleam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Terrakion: 250-296 (77.3 - 91.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(250, 255, 257, 260, 263, 265, 268, 270, 276, 278, 281, 283, 286, 289, 291, 296)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Dazzling Gleam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Multiscale Dragonite: 114-135 (35.2 - 41.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
(114, 116, 117, 118, 120, 121, 122, 123, 125, 126, 127, 129, 130, 131, 133, 135)

Essentially this move allows us to hit Dragons harder than Flash Cannon. It does similar damage as Thunder does, which means a well-played Dragonite should still beat Plasmanta.

* = RM
-R- = Repeated Move

RMs: 25
Total Moves: 50
Coverage Options: Signal Beam, Psychic/Psyshock, Flash Cannon, Dazzling Gleam, and... Water Pulse? Of these, Psychic is the only one with solid competitive justification to be used on an actual moveset, and the other coverage options might not be used too much in actual play. See above for calcs.

Edit: Added in damage calcs.
Edit 2: Made Final.

 

[capefeather]

So hey, this is my first movepool submission since... wow, Aurumoth. Guys should have picked it imo! Haha, nah, what's past is past. Here's my movepool submission for our electric ray Pokemon!

Final Submission

Specifically chosen moves

Aerial Ace
Confuse Ray
Haze
Headbutt
Hyper Beam
Pin Missile
Poison Sting
Poison Tail
Psybeam
Psychic
Rock Slide
Rock Tomb
Safeguard
Scary Face
Signal Beam
Sludge Wave
Spark
Sunny Day
Supersonic
Take Down
Taunt
Thunder Shock
Twister
Water Pulse
Wild Charge

So to explain what I mean by "specifically chosen moves": Some of you may know that I like picking moves based on their relations to other moves insofar as they appear in similar Pokemon's movepools. What I'm basically doing is three things. First, for each ability that CAP 19 has (I'm counting both sleep immunity abilities here, to make things easier), I find the common moves between all Pokemon with that ability. Second, for each type (i.e. Electric and Poison), I find the common moves between all Pokemon that have that type as well as the Water type or one of the Water egg groups. Finally, I find the set of Pokemon who share typing or ability with CAP 19, and when I pick a move, I select the subset that has that move and see which moves they share. Thus, from CAP 19's competitive properties and the list above, I have generated this movepool submission.

Some people may remember that, when I did this in Generation V, I restricted my searches to Generation V Pokemon. Part of the reason for this was so I wouldn't have to account for pathological cases, but another reason was that in-game BW was initially restricted to Generation V Pokemon. I decided not to do that here, mostly because Kalos has a mix of old and new Pokemon, so it doesn't make as much sense to restrict to Generation VI Pokemon for flavour purposes. I guess I could have tried to pick out the Kalos natives, but eh, too lazy at that point... Instead I simply took Tynamo out of my "similar Pokemon" group.

I'll explain these moves in the sections in which they appear.

! RM
* Repeated move

Level

00 Water Pulse
!00 Pin Missile
00 Psybeam
00 Poison Sting
00 Thunder Shock
00 Supersonic
!00 Thunder Wave
*04 Supersonic
*08 Thunder Wave
12 Confuse Ray
14 Poison Tail
!16 Spark
!19 Signal Beam
23 Endure
!28 Wild Charge
32 Scary Face
36 Twister
!38 Discharge
!46 Sludge Bomb
!48 Thunder
Moves: 18
RMs: 8

This is mostly a remix of Mantine's movepool, with a bit of Dragalge and Lanturn thrown in. Poison-types tend to have Bug-type moves, so CAP 19 has Pin Missile instead of Bullet Seed. Another distinguishing feature is that, instead of relying on pure physical force like Mantine's Tackle + Headbutt + Take Down trifecta and Wing Attack, CAP 19 uses electrified tackles (i.e. Spark + Wild Charge) and its venomous stingers (i.e. Poison Sting + Poison Tail). CAP 19 shares its reliance on confusion with Mantine, though CAP 19 mostly prefers paralysis over flinching.

One major theme is that CAP 19 is less interested in defensive tactics than Mantine is. There is no Wide Guard (Endure is there instead), no Agility (using Scary Face instead), and no Aqua Ring (Twister and Discharge are used instead of Air Slash and Aqua Ring). There are somewhat precedent-based reasons for this. Nothing similar to CAP 19 has Wide Guard, and I considered having Quick Guard instead but Croagunk is the only similar Pokemon with it. Agility is obviously disallowed, and everything with Aqua Ring is a Water-type. By the way, if you're wondering why there are hardly any Water-type moves in this movepool submission, this rationale is why.

The most notable competitive move on this list is Signal Beam. It does a bit more than Sludge Bomb against Lati@s, to the point of a guaranteed 2HKO on Latios without any boost or prior damage: 252 SpA CAP 19 Signal Beam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Latios: 152-180 (50.3 - 59.6%)

(Also I know Thunder tends to be animated as summoning a bolt from the sky, but it doesn't have to be like that if we take the anime into account. I don't know, I guess I just feel like I'd have to wreck the pattern of the movepool to realistically replace it with Zap Cannon or something...)

Machines

!06 Toxic
09 Venoshock
!10 Hidden Power
11 Sunny Day
!12 Taunt
15 Hyper Beam
!17 Protect
!18 Rain Dance
20 Safeguard
21 Frustration
!24 Thunderbolt
*25 Thunder
!27 Return
!29 Psychic
32 Double Team
!34 Sludge Wave
*36 Sludge Bomb
39 Rock Tomb
40 Aerial Ace
!42 Facade
!44 Rest
45 Attract
46 Thief
48 Round
68 Giga Impact
70 Flash
*73 Thunder Wave
!80 Rock Slide
87 Swagger
!88 Sleep Talk
!90 Substitute
*93 Wild Charge
100 Confide
Moves: 29
RMs: 14

Unfortunately, CAP 19 doesn't get Surf or Waterfall, because the former is banned. Maybe we should have picked Golurkyourself's creepy worm thing... Anyway, the notable competitive moves here are Taunt and Psychic. Psychic is basically there for Amoonguss; I guess it isn't terribly important, but it does help for CAP 19 variants without a Life Orb. Taunt is really pro-concept and I bet every good submission is going to have it. Safeguard is also here, though practically speaking, it will probably be shafted in favour of Taunt in team building. There are also some Rock/Ground-type moves and Aerial Ace, based on the fact that Mantine learns them (but not Acrobatics because CAP 19 isn't actually a Flying-type).

Egg group: Water 1

Haze
Headbutt
Mud-Slap
Shock Wave
Snore
Take Down
Moves: 6
RMs: 0

I actually have no idea of how the illegalities would play out here, but the egg group is sufficient for implementation and there's only maybe one competitively important move here. That move is Haze, which could come in handy if the opponent is setting up something big so that Gyarados doesn't have to feel useless... So basically there's Headbutt and Take Down available as "normal" versions of Shock / Wild Charge, Mud-Slap because apparently everything with Vital Spirit has Mud-Slap, Snore because it's a fairly common move, and Shock Wave because most Electric-type sea creatures have it.

Total moves: 53
Total RMs: 22

A notable exclusion is Defog. I know this might cost me votes, but I don't see any pressing need for this thing. Again, we're not doing "Perfect Mate" and people already carry Lati@s and/or Excadrill and/or whatever else for hazard control. While Dragon Dance users especially appreciate this, it's just a generically good thing to have. Plus, Defog isn't even good flavour. Practically everything with Defog is a Flying-type, the exceptions being Seedot and a bunch of old Pokemon that get it from a Generation IV HM. CAP 19 should stick to its concept job.

So yeah, rate and subscribe.

 

[Amitghosh]

Final Submission

*: Restricted Move
= : Equivalent Move
** : Repeated Move

Level Up

Level Up moves
-- Poison Sting
-- Clear Smog*
-- Toxic*
-- Splash
02 Thunder Shock
09 Supersonic
09 Acid
13 Encore*
15 Body Slam
21 Crunch*
25 Thunderbolt*
25 Thunder Wave*
38 Venoshock
39 Psyshock*
40 Hyper Beam
40 Sludge Bomb*

Total Moves: 16
Total RMs: 8

Justification: Stingrays are not that aggresive, but nevertheless scary creatures. STINGray literally shows it has a sting, so Poison sting can be a starting move. Clear Smog is related to smoke and fog, and as the pollution is increasing, smogs will too, so Clear Smog is an option for the start. Toxic is essentially poison, and Poison sting Poisons too, so I put in toxic there too. Theres not much Manta's or stingrays can use as weapons so youll generally see these movepools short. Thunder Shock is literally a move that electric types get very early. Acid also means Poison, so you can tell why I put it there. I put Crunch there because stingrays are skilled predators and eats even Molluscs. Thunder Bolt is required, and Thunder Wave is generally seen on all electric types. Venoshock has both poison and shock in it so it is perfect for CAP 19. Psyshock has similar logic. I also gave this CAP Hyper Beam as level up because Stingrays are scary, related to shocks and electricity, which is related to light, which is related to beams, which is related to Hyper Beam.

TM and HM

TMs and HMs

06 Toxic**
09 Venoshock**
10 Hidden Power*
15 Hyper Beam**
17 Protect*
18 Rain Dance*
20 Safeguard
21 Frustration
24 Thunderbolt**
25 Thunder*
27 Return =
32 Double Team
36 Sludge Bomb**
42 Facade*
44 Rest*
45 Attract
46 Thief
48 Round
68 Giga Impact
70 Flash
73 Thunder Wave**
87 Swagger
88 Sleep Talk*
90 Substitute*
100 Confide*

Total Moves (Discounting the repeats, of course): 35 (if I counted properly)
Total RMs: 17

TMs are something most Pokemon learn in plenty, so a lot of moves are here due to that. Most of them are pretty straightforward and have normal logic, logic related to typings and required moves. Not much to explain here.

Egg group: Water 1

Psybeam from Mantine
Bullet Seed from Mantine*
Wide Guard from Mantine
Aqua jet from Kabutops*

RMs: 19
Total Moves: 39

Not many egg moves here, any other ones could make the CAP counter its counters.

 

[Jho]

*=RM

Level Up Moves:

Hide

start: bubble, tail whip, poison sting
-Level 4: Thundershock
-Level 7: Supersonic
-Level 10: Thunderwave*
-Level 17: Scary Face
-Level 22: Encore*
-Level 26: Clear Smog*
-Level 29: Aqua Tail*
-Level 31: Taunt*
-Level 35: Poison Tail
-Level 38: Defog*
-Level 42: Discharge*
-Level 45: Glare*
-Level 48: Gunk Shot*
-Level 51: Singal Beam
-Level 55: Bounce*
Total: 13 Restricted: 10

These are pretty much based on it being a manta ray with a flavour moves such as Poison Sting, Bounce and Aqua Tail etc.
Competitive Moves :Thunderwave, Taunt, Encore, Clear Smog, Discharge

TMs

Hide

TMs:
TM06: Toxic*
TM09: Venoshock
TM10: Hidden Power
TM12: Taunt* (repeat)
TM15: Hyper Beam
TM17: Protect*
TM21: Frustration
TM24: Thunderbolt*
TM25: Thunder*
TM27: Return*
TM32: Double Team
TM34: Sludge Wave*
TM36: Sludge Bomb*
TM42: Facade*
TM44: Rest
TM45: Attract
TM48: Round
TM51: Steel Wing
TM68: Giga Impact
TM73: Thunderwave* (repeat)
TM84: Poison Jab*
TM87: Swagger
TM88: Sleep Talk*
TM90: Substitute
TM100: Confide
HM01: Cut
HM09: Dive
Total:27 Restricted:10

The TMs in here are a) the required moves and b) offensive and or flavour moves for CAP. Everything in here should be pretty self explanatory, standard moves for the types as well as some flavour moves

Competitive Moves: Taunt, Thunderwave,Toxic, Thunderbolt, Thunder, Sludge Bomb, Sludge Wave

Hide

Egg Moves: Water 1
Haze
Mirrot Coat*
Mudslap
Shockwave
Camouflage
Water Sport
Snore
Haze
Air slash*
Total: 10 Restricted: 2

More flavour based moves in here, some moves it can get from breeding are either banned or would help us beat our checks and counters. Chose these few specifically because they fit in with our checks and counters, aren't banned and have decent flavour to fit the CAP.

So that's that, I've tried to give CAP everything it needs and then flavour, and not much else. It really doesnt need much to fulfil its role, it just needs to be there.

Total: 9 Restricted: 2

Pun of the day: It has a really shallow movepool. hue

49 Total, 22 RM's

 

[Ignus]

TO EVERYONE INCLUDING CHARGE BEAM IN THEIR SUBMISSIONS:
Don't. One of the disallowed things are moves that increase special attack. Charge Beam does this. That means it will make your movepool illegal, and can't be submitted.
Tagging everyone with it in their submission.
SubwayJ

 

[MQJinx]

Final Submission

*RM

Level Up

1 Thunder Shock
1 Supersonic
1 Poison Sting
1 Acid
5 Poison Sting (REPEAT)
9 Acid (REPEAT)
12 Spark*
14 Confuse Ray
22 Air Cutter
23 Screech
26 Hex
33 Poison Tail
36 Discharge*
43 Clear Smog*
49 Mind Reader
52 Eerie Impulse
56 Take Down
60 Cross Poison*
70 Electric Terrain
75 Zap Cannon

This level up movepool is a cross between Mantine, Tentacruel, and Electric-types. Acid, Thunder Shock, Supersonic, and Poison Sting are standard for low level moves, and are fitting because they either are STABs or in Supersonic's case, having a feature of rays. Confuse Ray, Screech, Eerie Impulse, Electric Terrain, and Zap Cannon are performed by using the tesla rods or the tails on Plasmanta. Spark is an electric tackle, Take Down is it diving down at the opponent, Air Cutter is created by the wings, Mind Reader is from the awareness level Plasmanta has, Discharge comes in later to provide mid- to late-game attacks, Clear Smog comes from the stingers on the tail that would detach and regenerate, and Cross Poison and Poison Tail use its tail. Hex is when Plasmanta lights up the fake eyes on its back in an ominous light.

Discharge provides paralysis to hinder anything that Gyarados can't set up on. Clear Smog opens a hole for Gyarados against setup sweepers.

Egg

(Water 1, Water 2)

Wide Guard (Alomomola, Mantine, Tirtouga, Carracosta, Mudkip, Marshtomp, Swampert, Wingull, Pelipper)
Air Slash* (Ducklett, Swanna, Mantine, Wingull, Pelipper, Masquerain)
Shock Wave (Stunfisk, Chinchou, Lanturn, Bidoof, Bibarel, Dratini, Dragonair, Dragonite, Lapras, Wingull, Pelipper, Qwilfish)
Haze (Surskit, Masquerain, Wooper, Quagsire, Greninja, Feebas, Milotic, Goldeen, Seaking, Mantine, Omanyte, Omastar, Poliwag, Poliwhirl, Poliwrath, Politoed, Qwilfish, Remoraid, Octillery, Skrelp, Dragalge, Squirtle, Wartortle, Blastoise)
Encore* (Spheal, Sealeo, Walrein, Seel, Dewgong, Poliwag, Poliwhirl, Poliwrath, Politoed, Psyduck, Golduck, Wooper, Quagsire
Defog* (Ducklett, Swanna, Delibird, Mantine, Piplup, Prinplup, Empoleon, Finneon, Lumineon, Masquerain, WIngull, Pelipper)

Air Slash hits Grass-types slightly harder than Sludge Wave, though less than Psychic (or Dark Pulse for Gourgeist). Defog and Encore both support the team; Defog removes hazards for Gyarados while Encore discourages setup, and can help lock foes into a resist for Gyarados. Haze resets stats to discourage setup. Wide Guard and Shock Wave are pure flavor; Wide Guard supports the ray-cleaner fish symbiosis while Shock Wave is there to check evasion.

TM/HM

TM03 Psyshock*
TM06 Toxic*
TM09 Venoshock
TM10 Hidden Power*
TM12 Taunt*
TM15 Hyper Beam
TM17 Protect*
TM18 Rain Dance*
TM20 Safeguard
TM21 Frustration*
TM24 Thunderbolt*
TM25 Thunder*
TM 27 Return*
TM29 Psychic*
TM32 Double Team
TM34 Sludge Wave*
TM36 Sludge Bomb*
TM42 Façade*
TM44 Rest*
TM45 Attract
TM48 Round
TM68 Giga Impact
TM70 Flash
TM73 Thunder Wave*
TM84 Poison Jab*
TM87 Swagger
TM88 Sleep Talk*
TM90 Substitute*
TM93 Wild Charge*
TM97 Dark Pulse*
TM100 Confide

Psyshock and Psychic hit Mega Venusaur and Amoonguss which wall Gyarados, Taunt forces opponents to KO Plasmanta, Rain Dance boosts Gyarados's Waterfall and makes Thunder viable, Sludge Wave and Sludge Bomb take out fairies, Breloom, and Chesnaught, Thunder Wave cripples everything but the threats that we want to KO Plasmanta, all other special RMs provide redundant coverage. Physical RMs are for flavor reasons, as well as all other non-required non-RM move. Dark Pulse is if you badly want to take out the rare Gourgeist, while Excadrill can tank a hit and can KO back especially if it runs AV. Thunder cannot OHKO Dragonite with Multiscale intact, while it KOs back with Earthquake. The damage difference between Thunder and Thunderbolt is slim to the point where both will usually 2HKO.

calcs

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Psychic vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Venusaur: 221-260 (60.7 - 71.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(221, 224, 226, 229, 231, 234, 237, 239, 242, 244, 247, 250, 252, 255, 257, 260)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Psychic vs. 252 HP / 120 SpD Amoonguss: 268-317 (62 - 73.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Black Sludge recovery
(268, 270, 276, 278, 281, 283, 289, 291, 294, 296, 299, 304, 307, 309, 312, 317)

252 SpA Plasmanta Psychic vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Venusaur: 170-200 (46.7 - 54.9%) -- 69.5% chance to 2HKO
(170, 172, 174, 176, 178, 180, 182, 184, 186, 188, 190, 192, 194, 196, 198, 200)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Psychic vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Garchomp: 147-174 (41.1 - 48.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
(147, 149, 151, 152, 155, 156, 157, 160, 161, 162, 165, 166, 168, 170, 172, 174)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Psychic vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Landorus: 173-204 (54.2 - 63.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(173, 175, 177, 179, 181, 183, 185, 187, 190, 191, 194, 195, 198, 199, 201, 204)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Psychic vs. 244 HP / 192+ SpD Gliscor: 118-140 (33.5 - 39.7%) -- 99.6% chance to 4HKO after Poison Heal
(118, 120, 121, 123, 125, 126, 127, 129, 130, 131, 133, 134, 135, 136, 138, 140)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Psychic vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Excadrill: 91-108 (25.2 - 29.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
(91, 92, 94, 95, 95, 96, 97, 99, 100, 101, 101, 103, 104, 105, 107, 108)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Dark Pulse vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Gourgeist-Small: 291-343 (92.6 - 109.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
(291, 294, 296, 302, 304, 307, 312, 315, 317, 322, 325, 328, 333, 335, 338, 343)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Dark Pulse vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Excadrill: 162-192 (44.8 - 53.1%) -- 66.8% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
(162, 165, 166, 169, 170, 173, 174, 177, 178, 181, 182, 185, 186, 188, 190, 192)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Thunder vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Dragonite: 235-278 (72.7 - 86%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(235, 238, 242, 243, 247, 250, 253, 255, 257, 261, 263, 266, 269, 273, 274, 278)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Thunder vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Multiscale Dragonite: 118-139 (36.5 - 43%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
(118, 119, 121, 122, 123, 125, 127, 127, 129, 131, 131, 133, 135, 136, 137, 139)

252 SpA Plasmanta Thunder vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Dragonite: 181-214 (56 - 66.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(181, 183, 186, 187, 190, 192, 195, 196, 198, 201, 202, 205, 207, 210, 211, 214)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Thunder vs. 248 HP / 100 SpD Mega Scizor: 212-251 (61.8 - 73.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(212, 214, 218, 220, 222, 226, 227, 230, 231, 235, 238, 239, 243, 246, 247, 251)

252 SpA Life Orb Plasmanta Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 100 SpD Mega Scizor: 175-207 (51 - 60.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(175, 177, 179, 181, 183, 185, 187, 188, 191, 192, 195, 196, 199, 200, 203, 207)

TOTAL MOVES: 55
TOTAL RMs: 28

 

[Psychic Daryl]

WIP
Thunderbolt (duh), Toxic, Ice Fang, Fire Fang, Thunder Fang, Poison Fang, Sludge Bomb, Sludge Wave, Thunder Wave, Agility, Rest, Water Pulse.

 

[P3DS]

I saw mean look in subwayJ's move pool, and would mean look be like whirlpool and co.? It means that you would have to KO CAP 19 to escape, and that you can switch gyarados in safer is a bit more annoying. Yes it stops as you switch out, but CAP can just trap you in and pick you off easier.

 

[HeaLnDeaL]

SubwayJ, P3DS is right and mean look is not allowed in your movepool submission. It was mentioned in the non-attacking moves discussion but for whatever reason didn't make the list here.

Whirlpool, Infestation, Mean Look, and Block are disallowed. We want to put the opponent into a tough decision not force him into one. The opponent having a choice on whether to KO us or not is essential for this to happen, so we can see if the threat of Mega Gyarados can keep the CAP alive. If the opponent has not choice but to attack, then the concept just turns into perfect mate for Mega Gyarados.

 

[paintseagull]

Sorry guys, I fixed the above error. If anyone else notices another omission please let me or another mod know and we will put it in the OP.

 

[Ignus]

Final Submission
RMs: 23
Total Moves: 49

Key:
Bold = RM
Underlined = Repeat

Level Up

Level up pool:

Level Learned | Move Name
Start | Sludge Wave (repeated in TMs)
Start | Thunder Wave (repeated in TMs)
Start | Leer
Start | Acid
Start | Charge
4 | Charge
8 | Leer
11 | Acid
14 | Focus Energy
18 | Poison Tail
23 | Spark (useless physical move)
26 | Sludge
30 | Shock Wave
40 | Venoshock
48 | Thunder (repeated in TMs)
57 | Venom Drench
63 | Thunderbolt (repeated in TMs)

Based closely off Kingdra (who has a quite close BST and only learns specially attacking moves through level up), This movepool in part tries to tell a story. Notice that literally no attacking electric moves are learned until level 23 - representing the fact that Plasmanta doesn't use electricity to attack until it figures out it can do it on accident by literally ramming an enemy while electrified. This is followed by it refining it's poisonous hunting skills at 26, and then finally figuring out how to shoot electricity in to it's opponent at level 30. Eventually, our favorite manta ray even figures out how to poison it's own poison at level 40, and learns that "more electricity is better" at level 48. The final two moves just come from Plasmanta learning to spew more poison to drench it's opponent and figuring out how to actually aim it's electricity.
Despite the fact that it has a high special attack, which can be associated with a high intelligence, I chose the route of a long-range predator. This is because poison and electricity don't naturally connotate a high intelligence or mystic powers, meaning Plasmanta is treated in this movepool as closer to the intelligence of a heat-seeking rocket launcher then a manipulative almost-human creature.

Competitively, there's close to nothing important here. Plasmanta has a straightforward mind and therefore only learns straightforward attacking STABs and Debuffing moves. Venom Drench is included as an option for the player to not make Plasmanta setup bait. Everything important will either come in HMs and TMs, or from egg moves.

TM/HM

LET'S TALK TMS!

TM no. | Move Name
06 | Toxic
09 | Venoshock
10 | Hidden Power
12 | Taunt
15 | Hyper Beam
17 | Protect
18 | Rain Dance
20 | Safeguard
21 | Frustration (Repeat of Return)
24 | Thunderbolt (Repeated in level up)
25 | Thunder (Repeated in level up)
27 | Return (Repeat of Frustration)
29 | Psychic
30 | Shadow Ball (read end stuff for justification)
32 | Double Team
34 | Sludge Wave (Repeated in level up)
36 | Sludge Bomb
41 | Torment
42 | Facade
44 | Rest
45 | Attract
48 | Round
60 | Quash
68 | Giga Impact
70 | Flash
73 | Thunder Wave (Repeated in level up)
84 | Poison Jab
87 | Swagger
88 | Sleep Talk
90 | Substitute
93 | Wild Charge
100 | Confide

Hey, notice anything interesting on this part of the movepool? Like how it almost utterly lacks coverage moves? This is intentional. Coverage is something I would preferably avoid: We've already banned water, grass, ice, fire, ground, AND fighting moves; and with good reason: 131 special attack is already enough to break through our checks. Shadow Ball and Psychic are the only moves that don't effect our predetermined checks but that still help towards other Pokemon such as Mega-Venu, who always is in the way for Gyara, and L@tios, who can situationally hit our sweeper depending on the coverage it's carrying.

On the non-competitive end, TMs can be likened to 'taught' behaviors; Protect, Rest, and Taunt are not things you would ever see a wild Plasmanta do. If it were wild, it's thoughts would be limited to shoot electricity, shoot poison, and stop the moving things from moving. This is shown through the TMs I chose in this section: All manipulative, mindgame-y moves come from the trainer, not the Pokemon.

More on why I didn't include Dark Pulse:
Did you know that there are only three Evolution chains that are both electric type and learn dark pulse?
They are:
Thundurus (Evil Genie)
Rotom (Evil Lightbulb)
Heliosk (Conceptually confused lightning lizard)
Does a stingray, that hunts UNDER WATER where IT'S DARK ENOUGH ALREADY need to shoot pulses of darkness? No.

Egg

Water 1 and Monster Groups:

Encore
Disable
Clear Smog
Defog
Water Pulse
Splash
Water Gun
Metronome (If there was ever a reason to vote for my movepool, here it is)

The most important thing to note here is that Defog, with these egg groups, is illegal with practically any sort of other utility counter I could block. Taunt and Torment, which are TMs, can't be stopped by egg move restriction.
The reason I chose to place these restrictions on defog where really just to help push Plasmanta away from a Utility Counter role. While Defog does help our sweeper do it's job, It's an extremely powerful move on a Pokemon who doesn't have the typing of a standard Defogger; and while CAP already lacks any sort of recovery in the first place which makes it unlikely to ever have a place as a purely utility Mon, I tried to limit it's ability to completely chew on stall teams.
The above no longer applies, and, after thinking about it more, I've decided to utterly remove Defog. Not only does it not apply very well as a flavor move, but it's relatively unnecessary for CAP to have; Most of it's support to our sweeper comes directly from it's STABs and ability to handle things that would ordinarily shut down our sweeper.
#strikethroughs for days
Readding defog as it was brought up in IRC that not only does defog help keep our sweeper healthy, but it also allows for CAP to better bait out many of the SR users we can have our sweeper set up on, as your opponent will want to reapply Stealth rock as quickly as possible.

Uncompetitively, I treated egg moves as an extension of the TM's 'learned behavior' theme. However, unlike the TM section, the moves chosen were mainly related to the environment around Plasmanta. A Plasmanta born of pokemon who live closer to water are generally going to be closer to a water type, and therefore can learn to be closer to a water type then a regular Plasmanta.

IGNUSMOVEPOOL2014

 

[P3DS]

Encore (Illegal with Defog)
Defog (Illegal with Encore)
Disable (Illegal with Defog)

How would these egg moves be illegal as a combination? You'd just breed to get all three if they are all egg moves. The only way to still have egg move illegalities is either the azurill route: Have egg moves the baby pokemon can get, that the evolved one can't, but here, we don't know if CAP 19 will have a pre-evolution, or via the pikachu route: Have an item that affects breeding, like pikachu's light ball gives out volt tackle

Also, paintseagull chuck wrap under there too, as it basically a normal whirlpool.

 

[alexwolf]

On a side note, I have no idea why Spark is considered a restricted move.

It's not.

P3DS Most of the explanation for your movepool is pretty solid, what i don't get is the inclusion of Wring Out and Power Whip, especially Power Whip. Power Whip has no apparent connection with Plasmanta, so given that your only reasoning for including it was ''i added some themes from Serperior'', i would like to see a more substantiated reasoning. Not that this is anything big, just flavor nitpicking.

You guys have 30 hours to finalize your submissions!

 

[Ignus]

How would these egg moves be illegal as a combination? You'd just breed to get all three if they are all egg moves. The only way to still have egg move illegalities is either the azurill route: Have egg moves the baby pokemon can get, that the evolved one can't, but here, we don't know if CAP 19 will have a pre-evolution, or via the pikachu route: Have an item that affects breeding, like pikachu's light ball gives out volt tackle

I agree that right now It's much, much harder to get such illegalities, but honestly justifying the first route you mentioned isn't really that hard. Furthermore, I already checked the breeding groups water1 and monster, and within those groups there are no potential parent that learns both defog and encore/disable as of right now, meaning the actual illegality would be relatively easy to isolate to CAP. Even if we somehow can't figure out how to include these illegalities, they are relatively unnecessary, anyhow, and could be left out of the set if needed. And, while we don't know if CAP will have a pre-evolution, remember that the competitive side of CAP comes first - if something flavor related gets in the way (like not having a pre-evolution and thus stopping the illegalities) of the competitive aspect, we're doing our jobs incorrectly.