RU Analyses Discussion Thread

[g]

I think that access to Taunt is a pretty decent niche for Pyroar too to stop Defog users but because its kinda frail it is probably OO material as well I guess :/

 

[g]

I don't know what does QC think about this but in my opinion Leavanny is not viablenand totally outclassed by kricketune for reasons already known and discussed (just look at the viability rankings :/)

 

[Water Drone]

I dont think anyone has a problem with Pyrorar, so ill write it up.

 

[phantom]

Okay, so I'm going to edit most of the stuff that I brought up on the first page via SCMS sometime later this week, so hopefully there's no objection to that.

I'd also like to bring up another thing: Spritomb's physical attacker set.

I think in its current state it's really bad. Choice Band shouldn't be on the set, considering Spiritomb really thrives on being to alternate between Sucker Punch/Pursuit and Will-O-Wisp and CB just makes Spiritomb the biggest setup bait ever. Furthermore, Shadow Sneak is a poor option that doesn't really hit all that much. The most common filler move I've seen is Foul Play which OHKOs Doublade at +2 and does more to certain physical attackers such as Mega Abomasnow and Rhyperior than Spiritomb's other attacks do. Also, I've tinkered around with Taunt on the last slot and I have to say I like it a lot. Taunt is especially useful if your team is weak to CM Psychics considering it forces Reuniclus and Cresselia to attack instead of Recover stall the Sucker Punches, so Spiritomb can then smash them with Sucker Punch or Pursuit in accordance. Furthermore, if you run enough Speed on Spiritomb to outspeed Rhyperior (which it should be doing on this set) then you can Taunt and prevent it from setting up rocks, then burn it with Will-O-Wisp to completely neuter it. Taunt is also cool to stop an incoming Gligar on the switch that thinks it can get a free Defog on Spiritomb as well as certain Baton Passers such as Togetic and Combusken that think they can just freely boost in Spiritomb's face.

so tl;dr Physical attacker Spiritomb needs an update and this should be the new set:

Offensive Support
########
name: Offensive Support
move 1: Sucker Punch
move 2: Pursuit
move 3: Will-O-Wisp
move 4: Foul Play / Taunt
ability: Infiltrator
item: BlackGlasses
evs: 212 HP / 252 Atk / 44 Spe
nature: Adamant

Also, I know it doesn't show right now, but the set order should be Offensive Support > Defensive > CroTomb

I think I'm probably going to add Dazzling Gleam in Meloetta's other options so that Meloetta can beat its hard counter, I don't think it's too much to ask to have the move in OO.

As for the stuff on the first page, Alomomola should be added to the reservation index as should this Spiritomb set imo. So if Molk or Eonx, if you guys see this, please add these two things to the OP!

 

[Molk]

100% agree with Spiritomb changes tbh, although i might slash leftovers on the offensive support set as well

 

[phantom]

Anyone else think Swords Dance Mega Abomasnow should get a set? I've recently tried it out and it's honestly pretty good. It hits insanely hard and thanks to its good bulk and decent amount of resists, it doesn't have too much trouble setting up. It's a really good stallbreaker too thanks to its amazing power and coverage, and it can even hold its own versus offense thanks to that priority Ice Shard. SD / Wood Hammer / Earthquake / Ice Shard would be the set if it were to be given one. I'm not too sure about the EVs, but I ran enough to Speed creep minimum Speed Rhyperior, and Doublade by extension, then I just maxed out Attack and dumped the rest into HP.

Here's some calcs to show just how strong it is against a lot of top RU physical walls/bulky Pokemon:

+2 252+ Atk Mega Abomasnow Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Registeel: 340-400 (93.4 - 109.8%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Mega Abomasnow Wood Hammer vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Spiritomb: 297-351 (97.6 - 115.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Mega Abomasnow Earthquake vs. 212 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Doublade: 228-270 (73 - 86.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Mega Abomasnow Wood Hammer vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Aromatisse: 385-454 (94.8 - 111.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

And here's some calcs showing how difficult it is to revenge kill:

+2 252+ Atk Mega Abomasnow Ice Shard vs. 236 HP / 0 Def Druddigon: 320-378 (90.3 - 106.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Mega Abomasnow Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Jolteon: 219-258 (80.8 - 95.2%) -- 50% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Mega Abomasnow Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Hitmonlee: 240-283 (99.5 - 117.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Mega Abomasnow Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Moltres: 159-187 (49.5 - 58.2%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

If that weren't enough, it even has the bulk to take super effective hits if need be, so if the Pokemon isn't using a very powerful STAB/coverage attack, it can't even KO:

252+ Atk Drapion Poison Jab vs. 168 HP / 0 Def Mega Abomasnow: 216-254 (59.5 - 69.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Doublade Iron Head vs. 168 HP / 0 Def Mega Abomasnow: 246-290 (67.7 - 79.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Cobalion Close Combat vs. 168 HP / 0 Def Mega Abomasnow: 294-348 (80.9 - 95.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Hitmonlee Mach Punch vs. 168 HP / 0 Def Mega Abomasnow: 172-203 (47.3 - 55.9%) -- 67.2% chance to 2HKO

Granted, Stealth Rock can turn some of the 2HKOs into OHKOs, but the idea is still the same. SD Mega Abomasnow is insanely strong stallbreaker; thanks to its priority, it can be very difficult to revenge kill; and if that weren't enough, it has the capability of surviving even STAB super effective hits if needed. I really think it should get a set.

As far as I know, the only Pokemon on stall that can beat this set are Weezing and Bronzong, and even Weezing doesn't want to switch in immediately for fear of a STAB Blizzard.

 

[Water Drone]

Yeah I definitely agree with sd aboma getting a set. It hits so hard with a boost, and basically nothing can switch in safely. I wrote the uu analysis for it, so I have a bit of experience in that regard. Granted uu and ru are a bit different, so the Speed evs would probably need to be adjusted to speed creep a few more things in this tier.

 

[Molk]

Thoughts on giving Claydol a full update? I honestly think that Claydol's analysis should reflect just how bad of an option it really is (yeah, i don't even think of it as niche/mediocre at this point, all i've seen it be is flat out bad, no matter who's using it and whether it should fit the team in theory or not ;-;), and at this point i'm not sure about how well the current analysis accomplishes that from reading through it, (at points it even implies that its actually a good choice o_O). Not to mention the overall quality of the original analysis isn't really the best imo.

 

[Grey Waves]

Claydol's analysis definitely needs to be updated. The main reason that you would want to use it is because it can 2HKO Doublade and set up Stealth Rock. However, both are done better by Sandslash. The second paragraph of the overview definitely needs work:

However, not all is lost for Claydol. It has a good ability, support movepool, defensive stats, and doesn't care about any kind of entry hazard. It resists Stealth Rock and is immune to Spikes, Toxic Spikes, and Sticky Web, making it easy to switch in and out without taking too much damage. Claydol also has the bonus of being able to fit Stealth Rock and Rapid Spin on the same set, and it has an easier time dealing with Electric-types than Gligar. Just note that Claydol's cons generally outweigh its pros and that its niche is very small, so it should not find a place on many competitive teams.

Despite the last sentence, it sounds like that Claydol actually has uses. However, the only way in which Claydol isn't outclassed as a spinner is it's access to Toxic, which makes it slightly easier for it to get past Spiritomb. Apart from that, it should never be used, and as such the analysis needs to be updated to reflect this.

Edit: Forgot to mention, the EVs on the set are Specially invested, despite the fact that every Spinblocker, with the exception of Cofagrigus and Jellicent, is a Physical attacker.

 

[g]

it has access to Toxic

Just like every Spinner (or Pokemon) in the tier

 

[Grey Waves]

Just like every Spinner (or Pokemon) in the tier

No, what I was saying is because Claydol has so few other options, it runs Toxic. Although other spinners have access to Toxic, they don't use it because they have better options to deal with spinblockers.

The point is, Claydol is terrible, and I agree with Molk, it's analysis needs an update.

 

[Punchshroom]

Yeah I should've done this a long time ago, but Sigilyph should be updated. Aside from obligatory removal of Yanmega and Zoroark mentions, I also missed a huge counter in the C&C section in Meloetta, which is like the most notable RU Poke atm; seems wrong to not include it as a counter.

Ima just prepare this paragraph just in case to be c/ped later if need be:

**Psychic-types**: Versatility in movesets makes Sigilyph tricky to counter, but Psychic-types tend to be a thorn by Sigilyph's side. Meloetta is the greatest counter to Sigilyph, as it isn't weak to any of Sigilyph's attacks, has great Special Defense and Special Attack, and has various attacks such as Shadow Ball, Knock Off, Trick, and Perish Song to mess with Sigilyph. Delphox resists most of Sigilyph's attacks and is immune to burn, while also outspeeding Sigilyph and packs a solid punch; Shadow Ball hurts but only knocks Delphox into Blaze range. Slowking has the bulk to shrug off unboosted super effective attacks, and can use Dragon Tail to prevent Calm Mind Sigilyph from turning the tables on it. Reuniclus is also powerful and immune to burn, while being bulky enough to shrug off repeated assaults and even beats Sigilyph in Calm Mind wars, although switching directly into Life Orb Shadow Ball usually means it loses. Cresselia either annoys Sigilyph with Thunder Wave or Ice Beam, or beats Sigilyph in a Calm Mind war, although Cresselia is annoyed by burn.

 

[g]

Yeah I should've done this a long time ago, but Sigilyph should be updated. Aside from obligatory removal of Yanmega and Zoroark mentions, I also missed a huge counter in the C&C section in Meloetta, which is like the most notable RU Poke atm; seems wrong to not include it as a counter.

Ima just prepare this paragraph just in case to be c/ped later if need be:

Someone already edited in Meloetta in C&C through SCMS but i submitted another update with yanmega and zoro mentions removed

 

[Molk]

Does anyone have any experience with offensive SD Gallade? If so do you think it deserves more than an OO mention or no?

 

[skies]

I've been playing a bit with Sash Archeops lead and it's a really neat Pokemon. Here's the set:

Sash Lead
########
name: Sash Lead
move 1: Taunt
move 2: Stealth Rock
move 3: Endeavor
move 4: Knock Off
ability: Defeatist
item: Focus Sash
evs: 252 HP / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
nature: Jolly

Molk do you think this is worth an analysis of its own? The basic premise of the set is to come in against a lead, use Taunt, then Stealth Rock, and finally Endeavor to bring something down with it. This works well because Archeops is weak when it is in Defeatist range, which Endeavor ignores; it's also especially effective because it has such a high base Speed. Works well to take down a Defog user or something like that, ya know? Thoughts?

 

[phantom]

Just for clarification, this thread is solely for completed/GP stage analyses. If an analysis does not have the three QC checks, then you can still hop on over to the thread and make your suggestion(s). Also, I'd much rather use that Archeops set than the current one listed tbh. That one you posted at least has a niche...

 

[Water Drone]

Just for clarification, this thread is solely for completed/GP stage analyses. If an analysis does not have the three QC checks, then you can still hop on over to the thread and make your suggestion(s).

If this is the case, do you think the eviolite magneton should just be incorporated into Magnemite's analysis? It has been reserved but theres no thread posted yet.

 

[Magnemite]

If this is the case, do you think the eviolite magneton should just be incorporated into Magnemite's analysis? It has been reserved but theres no thread posted yet.

No, I specifically asked for someone else to write it since I haven't used that set before.

 

[Molk]

I've been playing a bit with Sash Archeops lead and it's a really neat Pokemon. Here's the set:

Sash Lead
########
name: Sash Lead
move 1: Taunt
move 2: Stealth Rock
move 3: Endeavor
move 4: Knock Off
ability: Defeatist
item: Focus Sash
evs: 252 HP / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
nature: Jolly

Molk do you think this is worth an analysis of its own? The basic premise of the set is to come in against a lead, use Taunt, then Stealth Rock, and finally Endeavor to bring something down with it. This works well because Archeops is weak when it is in Defeatist range, which Endeavor ignores; it's also especially effective because it has such a high base Speed. Works well to take down a Defog user or something like that, ya know? Thoughts?

If you want to post a set for this go for it, its a bit too late to add it to the initial analysis though

 

[LightningLuxray]

It already has an analysis

http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/sneasel-qc-3-3-gp-2-2.3515541/

 

[Molk]

Hey QC members, would you guys be okay with me removing Crustle's RU analysis? It's really completely outclassed by Omastar imo, and the set that's currently onsite just looks really silly to me considering that it goes even as far as to run Hidden Power Ice with Maximum Special Attack investment just to accomplish something Omastar can do easily o_O (Beating Gligar).

 

[atomicllamas]

Hey QC members, would you guys be okay with me removing Crustle's RU analysis? It's really completely outclassed by Omastar imo, and the set that's currently onsite just looks really silly to me considering that it goes even as far as to run Hidden Power Ice with Maximum Special Attack investment just to accomplish something Omastar can do easily o_O (Beating Gligar).

yes

 

[termi]

yea im ok w/ it

 

[Molk]

alrighty, Crustle's removed unless someone is willing to update it with a new unseen niche or smth

 

[Punchshroom]

I feel tempted to revamp my Sigilyph analysis, as it feels a bit unpolished to me atm. Aside from needing to remove mentions of Yanmega and Zoroark, I also need to mention Meloetta in the Counters section and replace Shadow Ball with Dark Pulse (I didn't even know it learned that). Maybe a possible mention of priority moves in C&C, since popular attacks such as Sucker Punch, Ice Shard, Shadow Sneak, and even Gale Wings Acro can bother Sigi.