Lapras (QC 0/3)

[Politoad]

QC: / /
GP: /

Overview
########

• Well-rounded stats on the overall.
• Can fill out different succesfully in PU thanks to neutral coverage.
• Has a great ability in Water Absorb that grants it an immunity.
• Good offensive typing.
• Weak to Stealth Rock.
• Bad defensive typing.

Choice Specs
########
name: Choice Specs
move 1: Hydro Pump
move 2: Freeze-Dry
move 3: Ice Beam
move 4: Frost Breath
ability: Water Absorb
item: Choice Specs
evs: 122 HP / 252 SpA / 134 Spe
nature: Modest

Moves
========

• Hydro Pump has great power, but has a more likely chance to miss than Surf, that can be used and grants less base power.
• Freeze-Dry has decent base power and hits Water-types super-effectively that resists Hydro Pump and Surf.
• Ice Beam has greater power than Freeze-Dry and hits anything harder than Water-types.
• Frost Breath can be used to bypass common Calm Mind users, such as Serperior and Musharna.

Set Details
========

• Water Absorb grants Lapras a free immunity, and recovers it when predicting a Water-type move and switching Lapras in.
• Choice Specs, maxed EVs, and a Modest nature boost Lapras' good base 85 Special Attack, but locks it in only one move.
• 134 Speed EVs allows Lapras to outspeed uninvested Poliwrath and Mantine, and also allows it to outspeed max Speed Marowak. The rest is put in HP for optimized bulk.

Usage Tips
========

• Switch Lapras in when predicting a Water-type move, as it recovers from them and since Lapras can't recover by itself it is especially useful.
• Lapras can function as a wallbreaker, so when a physicall wall is on the field, don't hesitate and switch it in.

Team Options
========

• Rain support is useful as it boosts up Lapras' Hydro Pump
• Entry hazards will be useful too, as it allows Lapras to gain a KO earlier.
• Ground-type Pokemon that can get rid of Electric-types, make pretty good teammates as Electric-types threaten Lapras.

RestTalk
########
name: RestTalk
move 1: Rest
move 2: Sleep Talk
move 3: Surf
move 4: Roar
ability: Shell Armor
item: Leftovers
evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
nature: Bold

Moves
========

• Rest allows Lapras to recover and is the only recovering option.
• Sleep Talk allows to use a random move when asleep and can pick Roar without negative priority.
• Surf has good base power, Lapras gets STAB from it and prevents Lapras from being completely stopped by Taunt.
• Roar is a good option to stop set-up, and works well with entry hazards up.

Set Details
========

• The EVs max out Lapras physical bulk.
• Shell Armor prevents Lapras from being hit by a critical hit.
• Bold nature also adds up to Lapras' physical bulk
• Leftovers grant Lapras a little bit of recovery every turn.

Usage Tips
========

• When a physical threat is on the field that doesn't threaten Lapras, switch it in; this way it can outstall it.
• If a Pokemon is setting up on your Pokemon, make sure to switch and use Roar.

Team Options
========

• If you're using Roar, entry hazards are very useful, as they can hurt the opponent on the switch-in. Toxic Spikes are especially good, as they deal damage to the opponent every turn and makes them go down earlier.
• Pokemon that can beat Grass-types, such as Flareon and Rapidash, are really useful as this set is completely walled by Grass-types such as Roselia.

Other Options
########

• Curse to boost up Lapras' offensive power and bulk
• Dragon Dance to up Lapras' physical offensive capatabilities
• Thunderbolt grants decent coverage and may paralyze the opponent, making the opponent slower than Lapras, that is especially useful as Lapras is a bit slow.
• Blizzard can also be used over Ice Beam on hail teams, but shouldn't be used on non-weather teams because the low accuracy.
• Drill Run hits Electric-types.
• Zen Headbutt hits Fighting-types better.

Checks & Counters
########

**Electric-types** Offensively based Electric-types, such as Luxray or Rotom-Frost, can take a hit and 2HKO Lapras.

**Stealth Rock** Stealth Rock kind of cripples Lapras on the switch-in, and as Lapras has no reliable recovery it can't switch-in too often.

**Faster Pokemon with an advantage over Lapras** Faster Pokemon with an advantage over Lapras, can outspeed it and KO it with one of their STABs.

 

[Politoad]

will finish this this midday

 

[Politoad]

ready for QC

 

[Ares]

[Overview]
Not sure what you are trying to get at with your first two points "Terrifying stats on the overall, except for Speed." and "Can fill out different succesfully in PU thanks to a wide, coverage movepool." It has alright stats except for its HP which is pretty big, but these are gonna be shown above anyways, and I have no clue what you are trying to say with the second one. If you are trying to say it fills different roles in PU then say what those roles are and how it fills them.
The last 3 points can be combined into one point about typing and can be used as your transition from good traits to bad. Ex. its typing is good offensively, however it leaves it with poor defensive typing that is also weak to rocks (except in your own words and better written Im really tired lol)
After all of this is done this is leaving your Overview pretty small and lacking so I would expand it out

[Choice Specs]
Is this really the most viable set? I havent tested it out but I have yet to see a choice specs Lapras either all of them have been AV lol
If it is the best set remove the surf slash and then slash freeze dry after ice beam
Also I would run a bit of speed, so put enough to outrun relevant Pokemon, you can look this up

[Set Details]
I would go back through and look at your wording and what not, its not "wrong" its just weird, also 85 isnt good, its alright

[Usage Tips]
This doesnt really tell me much other than to switch in on physical walls and switch in on Water-type attacks, both of which are really obvious
This needs work, expand out and tell me how to use Lapras when I should attack with what moves what to do against walls etc. etc.

[Team Options]
Rain support really doesnt seem necessary, remove this
What KO's does Lapras achieve with Entry Hazards? If you cant find one then remove them as every Pokemon appreciates hazard support.This needs a lot of work, right now it just is Ground-types to absorb Electric-type moves

[Rest Talk Set]
Once again is this actually a good set on Lapras?
idk if I would choose Shell Armor, I think I would still like a water immunity

[Usage Tips]
These dont seem to tell me much other than to Roar out Pokemon trying to setup and to switch in on physical Pokemon who dont threaten Lapras (you dont even say which types of Pokemon to switch into)
Pls expand this out, and if you dont know what to put I would recommend actually trying the set on the ladder

[Team Options]
Your first two options are fine, but you need at least another line if not two more

[Other Options]
Dragon Dance probably actually deserves a set as it gets Ice Shard and Waterfall (idk though ask QC)

[C&C]
This is really empty atm, and a lot more seems to check Lapras than the 3 you have mentioned here, Fighting-types for one and there a couple of others
Stealth rock can be changed to Entry Hazards as all of them affect Lapras
"Faster Pokemon with an advantage over Lapras" This encompasses about half the tier, you dont mention any relevant Pokemon. Either mention relevant Pokemon or expand this out into more categories.


This was a lot, sorry if it came off harsher than intended.

 

[Magnemite]

literally the only pokemon in the entire game that resists water + freeze dry that isn't shedinja is jynx, so thunderbolt is completely useless and shouldn't be mentioned at all outside of oo (only mention it there to tell people that it's useless)

Also Lapras really isn't that great honestly, I would make the overview less positive.

 

[Punchshroom]

Terrifying stats on the overall, except for Speed.

Just say well-rounded.

Can fill out different successfully in PU thanks to a wide, coverage movepool.

Since most of its movepool does not hit much that Water STAB + Freeze Dry do not already, I would just say that it has good neutral coverage on the tier.

• I'd probably remove the Surf slash on the Specs set, since Ice Beam should have Lapras covered in terms of accuracy and Lapras kind of needs all the power it can get.
• You want your Lapras to at the very least outspeed some relevant defensive Pokemon, most notably Mantine; Specs Lapras is meant to wallbreak, after all.
• Magnemite Well Thunderbolt does have one other target: opposing Lapras (and Walrein >.>). Aside from that the last slot is quite filler. Maybe Frost Breath is worth a look since it lets Lapras break through boosted threats such as Calm Mind Musharna and Serperior.

I don't know what physically defensive Lapras is supposed to stop in the tier, given its bad weaknesses and lack of Scald. I don't know if RestTalk Lapras is even worth it.

Montsegur Not QC opinion, but a Hydration Lapras with Rain Dance / Rest / Dragon Dance / Waterfall can be all kinds of annoying to take down if the opponent's Water-immune Pokemon have been disposed of :3

 

[Politoad]

literally the only pokemon in the entire game that resists water + freeze dry that isn't shedinja is jynx, so thunderbolt is completely useless and shouldn't be mentioned at all outside of oo (only mention it there to tell people that it's useless)

Also Lapras really isn't that great honestly, I would make the overview less positive.

What would you run other than Thunderbolt then ?_? Signal Beam? HP Fire?_? that's really bad.

Also, Punchshroom, wouldn't Frost Breath make Ice Beam sorta useless?

 

[Politoad]

okay, double posting to say that i've made some changes, changed the ev spread, removed Surf.

I don't really know what to replace thunderbolt with otherwise, so i'm letting it stay because it also hits Pokemon such as Articuno harder, I believe.

 

[Punchshroom]

Soulblaster Thunderbolt does allow Lapras to hit other Lapras, so that is enough reason for it to stay (if not simply because other options aren't worthwhile). Frost Breath doesn't outclass Ice Beam due to its miss chance; you'd only really use Frost Breath over Ice Beam against boosted threats. Both moves can be slashed in the last slot imo.

 

[Politoad]

Soulblaster Thunderbolt does allow Lapras to hit other Lapras, so that is enough reason for it to stay (if not simply because other options aren't worthwhile). Frost Breath doesn't outclass Ice Beam due to its miss chance; you'd only really use Frost Breath over Ice Beam against boosted threats. Both moves can be slashed in the last slot imo.

done

 

[Punchshroom]

That's not actually what I had in mind (Thunderbolt / Frost Breath), since the last move is generally used as a tech move for Lapras. TBolt is really only for Lapras so it isn't mandatory if u don't have it, while Frost Breath targets specific threats but otherwise isn't generally better than Ice Beam which has superior accuracy.

 

[Anty]

Thunderbolt shouldn't really be mentioned as lapras isnt a note worthy-enough threat it needs to hit. Ice Beam should definitely get its own slot, and frost breath should be slashed in the last slot with maybe perish song, which is a more reliable version of breaking boosters or maybe even surf cuz hydro's accuracy. I would mention in the overview its niches over other ice types (its water dual typing). Also expand a bit more in c&c, mention examples for type advantage and maybe add something to do with specially bulky pokes (licki/throh) or faster pokemon (it takes a ton from most neutral hits)

 

[Politoad]

Thunderbolt shouldn't really be mentioned as lapras isnt a note worthy-enough threat it needs to hit. Ice Beam should definitely get its own slot, and frost breath should be slashed in the last slot with maybe perish song, which is a more reliable version of breaking boosters or maybe even surf cuz hydro's accuracy. I would mention in the overview its niches over other ice types (its water dual typing). Also expand a bit more in c&c, mention examples for type advantage and maybe add something to do with specially bulky pokes (licki/throh) or faster pokemon (it takes a ton from most neutral hits)

being trapped into perish song forces you to switch diectly, giving the opponent a free set up that allows it to ko 2 pokes at Max :/ so not with it

 

[Anty]

being trapped into perish song forces you to switch diectly, giving the opponent a free set up that allows it to ko 2 pokes at Max :/ so not with it

It was just a suggetion as it allows you to beat last poke sweepers, such as clefairy and mush, who could otherwise sweep. It doesnt quite let that amount of set up either lol (i was mainly talking about two specific bulk invested threats). I do agree that it is really niche though

 

[Magnemite]

CM Musharna is about 42,000 times more relevant than other lapras, so frost breath is better. I hadn't thought of it before but surf is also much better than thunderbolt on a choice set like this a la gen 5 scarf keldeo. Also Lapras is neutral to freeze dry anyway lol

So yeah I think the set should be:
-Hydro Pump
-Ice Beam
-Freeze Dry
-Frost Breath / Surf

Perish Song can go in moves

 

[g]

CM Musharna is about 42,000 times more relevant than other lapras, so frost breath is better. I hadn't thought of it before but surf is also much better than thunderbolt on a choice set like this a la gen 5 scarf keldeo. Also Lapras is neutral to freeze dry anyway lol

So yeah I think the set should be:
-Hydro Pump
-Ice Beam
-Freeze Dry
-Frost Breath / Surf

Perish Song can go in moves

Totally agree with Magnemite here.
Thunderbolt literally hits the irrelevant lapras (how sad) so using frost breath/surf/toxic/whatevet is definitely better for the last slot.
And get rid of restalk which is outclassed by poliwrath so badly I can't even

I also don't think that specs lapras is that good anyway as Frogadier hits like every lapras target harder thanks to protean

Some kind of DD set someone mentioned to me on irc a while ago would be more representative of its niche IMO but for now stick with specs only I guess

 

[Politoad]

implemented the new set, put tbolt in OO

 

[WhiteDMist]

No to RestTalk. Crappy defensive typing, lack of Scald, SR weak, outclassed by Poliwrath, etc. Not even sure why you mentioned it in the first place.

QC Reject
1/3

Surf slash with Frost Breath like Magnemite instructed please. I'm also unsure if Specs is really Lapras' best set, it's power is really mediocre, especially since you are mostly hitting stuff neutrally. I'll look into a DD set, but you can keep Specs for now.

 

[Magnemite]

DD seems okay I guess, especially once altaria leaves in ~4 months, but idk if it's better than specs (which isn't great either).

And yeah rest talk seems terrible, rejecting that 2/3

 

[g]

3/3
User looks to have quit too

 

[WhiteDMist]

I've talked to Soulblaster and he says he wants to keep Lapras, which I am fine with as long as he removes the RestTalk set and shows that he does not require QC to give him all the information for stuff like Team Options and Usage Tips.

 

[Politoad]

I've talked to Soulblaster and he says he wants to keep Lapras, which I am fine with as long as he removes the RestTalk set and shows that he does not require QC to give him all the information for stuff like Team Options and Usage Tips.

Ill remove iT Tomorrow due lack of time

 

[WhiteDMist]

OK, so Soulblaster dropped this. Locking.