Mega-Salamence: considering a quick ban (Don't ask for the thread to be closed!)

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termi

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suspect test this shit, dont quickban.

thundy checks it since its immune to eq and come in on DD, and resists return, then hp ices or prankster twaves not giving a fuck about its boosts. mega slowbro isnt even 2hkoed by a +1 return to show you how pitfully weak mega mence is, then koes back with ice beam. mega mence is weak to SR and has a subpar base 100 speed when evolving, which limits surviablity and allows it to get picked off my faster threats like latias before it mega evolves.
Thundurus still takes an assload from a Return, and in addition Thundurus has more things to do than check MegaMence, so in addition to its SR weakness it will eventually be weakened enough for Mence to just gib it. Mega Slowbro with Ice Beam is a decent counter I suppose. Calling MegaMence "pitifully weak" because it can't 2HKO something that IIRC has the third highest physical bulk of all mons is not exactly a good testament to its supposed lack of power though. The SR weakness is tough, but easily mitigated by the fact that Mence has Roost and the bulk to use it whenever it gets too low on health. The speed argument is obsolete because you just don't switch it in on something that outspeeds and OHKOs you pre-mega, Mence has the bulk and typing to come in on a lot of things safely so it's much better to assume that when a Latias does come in, Mence is already in and possibly behind a Sub/at +1/instagibbing you with Frustration.

ttar with ice beam is an universal counter to all mence sets, dd and mixed. zapdos with hp ice is a good answer for it as well. stall dgaf about mence, as cress, rhyperior, and even porygon2 are solid answers to it. im pretty sure stall would much rather face a mence than a mega sableye, for example.
What's a counter when Mence sets w/ EQ do an assload at +1? You only need to weaken TTar to OHKO that thing, and it's not like weakening TTar is the hardest thing ever. Also, just like with HP Ice Zapdos, you can run it, but it brings quite a bit of opportunity cost. This is especially the case for Zapdos, which already is hard-pressed for its fourth moveslot betwene Toxic and Heat Wave. Stall dgaf about mence if it chooses to run one of these obscure mons that they probably don't really have room for because stall already has to check a shitton of relevant threats in the current meta and adding something like Rhyperior or Porygon2 simply doesn't really help you with the defensive backbone of the team (Rhyp has too many weaknesses in comparison to its couple of valuable resists, Porygon2 is alright but running that means that you're hard-pressed to fit ultimate stall staple Chansey on the same team due to type redundancy)

weavile and mamo check even slightly weakened ones with priority, mega manectric and mega aerodactyl are also excellent checks to it, both resisting its STAB and doing massive damage in return. excadrill in sand also outspeeds, and rain teams that have kingdra/kabutops revenge mence even when its at +1, assuming an adamant nature.

i just named a whole bunch of viable checks to this off the top of my head, and they're all viable in OU. so its not like im saying use avalugg or something.

so yeah, suspect test this shit
Checks never really are too good of an argument because you still need to sac something before you can bring it in, and do not forget that when Mence manages to end up behind a Sub (which is not very hard), Mamo and Weavile fail to revenge kill it anyway, so they're not even guaranteed checks. MegaMan and Mega Aero are fine checks, although if you face a DD Mence with EQ Mega Manectric dies. Exca outspeeds but can't OHKO, rain sweepers can so they're fine.

See, there are a handful of checks out there, but they are easily worn down, usually can't handle all Mence sets and can't switch in. The counters that are out there are either relatively obscure (pretty viable, but still nothing you'd consider in most cases otherwise) and therefore only are a testament to Mence's centralization, are easily taken care of with team support or are only counters to certain sets.

In the end, no matter how you turn it, you will need multiple Mence checks on a team to really take care of it reliably, and even when you do so, there still is a fair chance Mence will at least get one kill. There is no way any OU-viable team will just not care about Mence, it's always threatening, always centralizing. It's really hard to even prove that it is not broken, and were people able to do so, then the point still stands that Mence is at the very least overcentralizing and unhealthy for the meta. So, no matter how you out it, this things needs to leave, and the fact that pretty much everyone bar a select amount of people are so convinced of it being broken should tell you enough about the outcome of a potential suspect test. There is no need to waste time and effort on a suspect test where the outcome is already predetermined.
 

Srn

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I think what a lot of people forget when they carelessly call mons like mega aggron (w/ice punch or curse+recovery) and rhyperior counters to mmence is the mixed set.
Its basically just draco/fire blast/eq/return and draco easily blows to bits several "counters" to mmence that have been mentioned, like defensive zapdos (draco does 46%-54%, can easily 2hko with fire blast then draco after rocks), rhyperior (draco does 62%-73%, eq after rocks kills), and mega aggron (gauranteed 3hko on sdef versions). By the way, the calcs i used assume no investment in special attack.
So you can roughly divide the sets into something like subdd / offensive dd / mixed, and between all 3 not many pokemon can remain standing.
And we all know how stupidly easy it is to set up subDD, i can literally get hit by two stone edges from scarf lando-t, dd twice, and roost stall the rest as it fails to 2hko even if it does hit the first two. That's just unfair. Quickban Pls
 
I never post here on the forum, but I must post here. Why is this even being considered, and not just flat-out done?
MegaMance has insane stats, combining with the Intimidate ability before it goes Mega, has almost no real counters (Greninja is only viable with a Scarf because this thing is around). The lack of good Ice types in the game doesn't help either, and supposed counters, like highly defensive Pokemon, like M-Aggron, M-Steelix, M-Slowbro, Cloyster or ever Regirock/Registeel can barely touch him, due to his diverse wallbreaking movepool, insane attack power and most times having a substitute intact.
Please, just ban this thing already. It's way more broken and overcentralizing than Genesect and all the other banned Megas.
 

Dread Arceus

total cockhead
At the time of this post, there is 1 person who doesn't want to see Mence banned at all (his reasoning is that he won't be able to use his shiny Mega Salamence in OU if it's banned), 6 that want to see it suspected, and a ridiculous 84 people that want it quickbanned.
Is 92% in favor of a quickban and a mere 1% against Salamence being broken good enough to quickban it yet?
 
Nothing should be so broken that an entire tier's user base has to tailor all their teams around it. It's a game breaking pokemo and is pretty much impossible to stop if you're not willing to give up 1 or 2 pokemon.

Also suspect testing won't change the result so it doesn't make sense to waste like a month of ORAS time

Quick ban
 
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Gary

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LOL I love how when I finally decided to get back into OU again, this thing is in the tier. zzzzzz

Anyways, I've watched dozens of battles, played quite a few myself, and attempted to team build multiple teams without having to completely overprepare for Mega Mence, and in all honesty, it's not possible because it's incredibly broken. All of its sets have the potential to completely dismantle almost any team that's "well" prepared for, simply because of how powerful and versatile it is. Much like Mega Luc, each of its sets have different answers to them, which means that there really isn't a universal counter to this thing. The offensive DD sets have to watch out for priority status and revenge killers (which there aren't any good ones really), but these sets can beat out Skarmory, Tyranitar, Heatran, and Mega Metagross. Most of the status users that beat the offensive DD sets are now set up fodder for the Sub DD sets. The physical walls that can take hits from the physical sets such as Landorus-T and Rotom-W are slaughtered by the special sets and don't give a fuck about burn. And even then, nearly all of its counters can be dealt with by a teammate, like Magnezone for example.

It's so easy to just lead with this thing and start wrecking havoc turn 1, despite the fact that the opponent may have an answer to it. Reason being, it has no reliable answer to it, so it's no wonder that even well built teams can find themselves losing to Mega Mence. Its incredible bulk for an offensive Pokemon and Intimidate ability before Mega evolving allows it to set up on nearly every common defensive threat as well as many offensive threats. The fact that it can set up on something like Landorus-T is just sickening, and that alone should prove just how dumb it is. As many people have said, even LO Ice Shards from Mamoswine fail to even coming close to killing it, and if it's Intimidated then Mega Mence can even live one after SR. Scarfed Greninja sucks, but I'm starting to see it being used simply because it actually does a great job at revenge killing it. Too bad the opponent can just switch out into something else and use the choice locked Ninja as set up fodder. I hate to sound like a (BAN ME PLEASE), but aim used a team which paired Mega Mence with Healing Wish Latias. This allowed him to basically lead with Mega Mence turn one and just start spamming Return in order to weaken its checks and counters, so later on it can heal back up and clean the rest of the team. Any decent player can basically win with this strategy every time as long as you play smart. It's just that good.

Mega Mence is the epitome of a perfect sweeper. It has the Speed, ability, offensive presence, movepool, and typing to nearly always succeed at what it wants to do. We'd be wasting our time suspecting Mega Mence. I can't believe that some people think that there is a slight possibility that the meta could adapt to this thing. No. I'm telling you right now there isn't. People are coming up with all these obscure checks and counters such as Scarf Ninja, Noivern, and Cress, yet they're still losing to it. It's just dumb. With all these other Megas that could potentially need a suspect in the future, why waste our time on a Pokemon that's so undeniably broken just to see if MAYBE the meta can handle it without dedicating 75% of their team to beating it or using obscure shit. Do what needs to be done; Quick ban Mega Mence so we can actually start making this tier balanced again.
 
I've never posted before as I am a perennial lurker, but I've decided to pop by to say that MegaMence might be the most broken 'mon I've ever seen, even with the fiasco of Mega Kanga fresh in my memory. Others have already made excellent and detailed points on exactly why it's so hard to handle, and I think it really is fair to call it over-centralizing to the OU metagame. It's like all of OU had a drunken one-night stand and Megamence is the hellspawned result. We have a Pokemon that can do almost anything you'd ever want it to. Bulky Attacker? No problem. Tanky special attacker? Yawn. Mixed? Bring it on! The fact that it can damn run Sub+Recover+Roost with one attack just shows how ridiculously strong this Pokemon has become. Nothing should be able to get away with that, yet here we are. And the few Pokemon that can even give it pause are still susceptible to its legitimately nightmarish coverage, and even they have to have some luck on their side to take MegaMence out. Scarfed Greninja is now a common thing because of this Pokemon. SCARFED GRENINJA. Powerhouses like Lando-T are laughed at, it can even shrug off 4x damage in some cases. There are a few things that can reasonably check it here and there, but there aren't really any counters for every build, and there's still a risk even with the Pokemon who check it that Megamence will be able to survive and retaliate. Having to carry multiple checks for a single Pokemon (which might still fail you!) is definitely over-centralizing, to me.

The metagame could probably adapt, eventually, over time... but it wouldn't be the same, in a negative way. It would be less about building teams that flow well together to accomplish their own goals and bring a win, and more about building teams around Megamence -- how to beat it and how to complement your own (ala Gen 4 Garchomp on steroids.) As long as it's allowed to stick around, it's going to be heavily prevalent, and even if people were to say, stop using it of their own accord because it took the fun out of battling, there would still be newcomers spamming Aerialate Returns and marveling at their win streak. It's the most flat-out broken thing I've seen hit the metagame in a long time.

I'm usually in favour of suspect-testing things before jumping to any conclusions, and if the Council wishes to go that route I will certainly respect it; but I am honestly in favour of of a Quickban, and may Arceus have mercy on Ubers when it gets there.
 
After playing the current ORAS ou it does seem that megamence is far too powerful, also because of it's great move pool when expecting the conventional set of d dance, substitute, roost and return, common checks, key word checks, still don't always measure up and if their is the occasional version that carries a secondary attacking move such as fire blast for skamory or earthquake for heatran if the team built around mence can't deal with such a poke then you literally are proceeded to get swept. The bulk it has is also a problem because it means with certain sub bulk variations trying to get past a sub and get in your mence revenge killer can sometimes just be too late, furthermore forcing people to run specific pokemon with certain moves just to counter one pokemon is unfair. Usage of pokemon such as mamoswine, tundurus, skamory, choice scarf greninja and so on are becoming increasingly common to attempt to deal with megamence, key word again attempt. Hazards also don't pose a threat since it is bulky enough to just roost up damage and status moves are easily counterable thanks to the use of substitute and even switching not to mention the synergy mence has with heal bell users. The fact mence has no real check, switch in or counter pokemons means you often have to sack a mon to be able to deal with it appropriately, not to mention the lack of such pokemon to help stop it meaning the use of such pokemon severely hinders team building as you find a lot of teams being built around mence, trying to contain mence as nothing can really outright stop it (and believe me i've tried by even using pokemon like aggron that 4x resist mence's return) and if a team is trying to do the things mentioned it often find it can outright lose to other teams such as rain swampert team as just an example.
For megamence to continue on in the current ORAS OU we got to play with recently is severely unhealthy and their are possibly two solutions to help rectify it. The first is outright banning it which I feel would be the case, or leave it about 2-4 weeks before giving it a suspect test.
The last solution is that the reason mence is so powerful in the current ORAS OU is literally cause of the powercreep. It certainly appears mence is arguably the best mega created. The fact many megas and other pokemon have already been banned means mence is able to come in to a tier that is truly not prepared for it along with potentially some of the other megas, such as mega slowbro which at times I feel is far more unhealthier than salamence (I know I may get ridicule for my statement but I do have my reasons but they are not relevant as the topic matter at hand is more about mence than comparing it to potentially other problem megas right now). Unbanning certain pokemon that have been sent to ubers such as aegislash, mega mawile, even potentially mega lucario, genesect and so on could be a way to balancing out the OU tier whilst bringing back pokemon that could now qualify for OU and possibly bring a fresh take to team building again. For instance genesect is an interesting one to touch upon for a second, because choice scarf was the common item innovation in focus sash with ice beam might be the way to play the pokemon more effectively for salamence, aegislash's king shield for instance could see salamence having to alternate it's sets making it somewhat less hard to deal with (less hard not really easier). However this line of thought could also limit team building which is something I've said is already an issue and could be made worse if all these threats were just brought back because of the power creep.
Ultimately I feel the second solution I present would be far more fun to start off with the tier and then suspect testing appropriate pokemon accordingly because the power creep literally makes some pokemon that were banned potentially less problematic as those that should see a ban originating in ORAS.
However I would be happy to play with the current OU we have adding in the ORAS mons and then suspect testing those that seem fit for suspecting accordingly, however until the tier seems to define itself a bit further and decisions are made regarding the banning of mence and other mons or unbanning of certain mons I probably will stay away for showdown and OU which I think itself shows how problematic such threats as mence are when it causes a player to take a break for the time being. That being said taking a break does seem for personal reasons and not just cause the game sucks due to it allowing me to focus on university work and then play the games slowly but surely when they are eventually out in my region.
Anyways for those that take the time to read my lengthy post hope you the the points I make and they help influence the decision made accordingly and I'm sure in time the correct decision will be made by Smogon.
PS First give away should be mega mence, considering it probably will get banned very soon
 
It definitely should. It makes the metagame unhealthy, as people need to carry counters to Mega Mence on every team, limiting your options with team building. If you do not want to run Cresselia, Porygon2, scarf Noivern, Mega Altaria with Hyper Voice(which would need to be behind a sub to even be useful against Mega Mence), you're going to lose. Unless your opponent chokes, or you hax Mega Mence to death, you're more than likely going to lose your match. Although I have a hell of a lot fun using Mega Mence in the ORAS OU tier, it needs to be banned right away.
 

pancake

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Even the ice shard pokes can't revenge kill it unless if it's a Weavlie and he has no DD's up and he's not behind a sub and the Weavile is banded. This is thanks to the defense boost. It's even hard to kill with ice types and it can retaliate back with an OHKOing Return or Double Edge. Most of all, it makes the tier NOT FUN. Pokemon is supposed to be fun, as competitive a you are. Besides a few others, you are getting swept by a mega Salamence if you don't have one. I think there is no doubt in my mind that it should be banned. (As much as I hate banning things.)
 
Mega Salamence is more broken of a lot of pokemon in uber.
Until u don't know is set (ddance + fblast? full physical ddance? stallbreaker with double edge? Roost?) u can't check it. Intimidate before the mevo help to get a free set up on a physical mon, aaaand is gg at that point.
With that bulkyness is hard to revenge kill with a priority (but in any case, he has 130 base def) is fast with 120 base speed, so at +1 in speed is hard for normal scarfed mons to outspeed him (scarf greninja? Don't make me laught) sooo what is the point to keep that monster in OU for a month, then decide to suspect him, and wasting another month for a suspect?
U don't even need the support of a pokemon for swipe, why using other mevo when u have mega salamence? This pokemon can centralize the metagame even better than aegislash in xy. 70% of players will choose this mevo, so u are forced to run a pseudo check for him in every team. And he has less pseudo checks than aegislash.

Please quick ban monster.
 

mags

Banned deucer.
I have to say in all the games i played whoever got salamence boosted with a dragon dance first wins. Yes there are some counters but salamance will rip apart a team and the counters with that speed and attack. The defense boost helps with the priority attacks. I also tested some techniques with salamence. He was one of the best late game sweepers i've ever played with. Even if he was my last and the other team had 3 left he would get a dd off and then go ham. Another technique was so interesting and op that I laughed when I used it. I used mew to iron defense once and amnesia once. Then I baton to salamence. This allows him to take ice type attacks without getting ohko. He can roost then dd then roost again and he will eventually sweep the whole team. I used this technique mid game when they didnt expect. I throw mew out use a boost that will help against the enemy pokemon. amnesia if a special iron for the physical. Then they switch next turn while i get the last boost up then they get a hit on salamence and i roost stall until I can dd. Over all I think it should be quick banned or a suspect test. In all reality if mega ray wasn't a thing than sallly would be used and it probs will be used to some extent in ubers but in ou its to op. Its bst is more than a lot of pokemon in ubers lol. And one last thing lol it's niche would be great for oras ubers because with the primals and mega ray every team will be hyper offensive so salamence will fit in and let me just say this mega mence would be op in xy ubers nvm ou it couldve been one of the best pokemon in ubers in xy.

I say quick ban or suspect test but it needs to be banned
 
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Everyone has said more or less everything about mence: it's versatility, it's sheer power, and it's ability to adapt at far less an opportunity cost than the cost for the meta to adapt.
Its pretty clear that for too many offensive teams, adding mega mence improves them completely. By adding mence, your opponent is forced to play around it awkwardly--revenge killing very often gives mence a free set up.
I don't know the criteria for insta banning, but as for banning, it is definitely over centralizing based on the fact that teams need to reserve usually two members to deal with mence. Usually this is covered inherently by a few offensive mons, but a large majority of offensive mons become set up fodder. In other words, the Meta becomes far too limited with mega mence.
Imo, suspect testing this mon really feels pointless since this is merely delaying the inevitable. As stated, i believe the mon to be so over centralizing that there is no doubt in my mind that it will be banned. So why wait and make the meta take even longer to adapt and to innovate new playstyles that would be relavent to more permanent-esque threats?
 
Alright,MegaMence has great bulk,abilities,moves,recovery and stats.It has all the needed juice to be in Ubers,nothing can check it because of the amount of sets that this thing can run.So why not ban it?It's given Ice type Pokemon a chance to shine,I'm not saying it's OU worthy,hell no.I'm just saying that give it some time,we've already got Weaviles and Mamoswines and ScarfNinjas running around like nobody's business and,we've still to see MegaGlailie who looked quite threatening on paper imo.

Do not quickban MegaMence.
Give the meta sometime,I'm sure we'll find ways of dealing with this thing.If not,well,we can always put it through a suspect test :)
 
To the people that are for suspect testing, are you putting aside the ORAS OU ladder thats been established for over a month as an insufficient source to analyze M-Mence's capabilities? This is, by no means, to belittle your opinions. I'd just like some clarifications.
 
Alright,MegaMence has great bulk,abilities,moves,recovery and stats.It has all the needed juice to be in Ubers,nothing can check it because of the amount of sets that this thing can run.So why not ban it?It's given Ice type Pokemon a chance to shine,I'm not saying it's OU worthy,hell no.I'm just saying that give it some time,we've already got Weaviles and Mamoswines and ScarfNinjas running around like nobody's business and,we've still to see MegaGlailie who looked quite threatening on paper imo.

Do not quickban MegaMence.
Give the meta sometime,I'm sure we'll find ways of dealing with this thing.If not,well,we can always put it through a suspect test :)
I feel like laughing, but what's the reason to run any other mega that isn't Salamence other than feeling unique? The advantages of opportunity cost that comes with him being on your team are enough to discard every other mega.

Want to see mega glalie shine? Ban this thing so the meta can actually grow without this overcentralizing lizard.
 
Mega Salamance needs to go and it needs to go now. Allowing something that has been proven to bend the tier over and beat most of it 1 v 1 is incredibly unhealthy to the development of the metagame and makes it borderline unplayable. Its fantastic bulk coupled with great speed, offenses, and a pre-evo Intimidate affords it ample opportunities for set-up. The extent to which the metagame becomes centralized around it is clearly visible with the creation and rise of things like HP Ice Rotom-W, SpA-invested Zapdos, and Scarf Greninja of all things. It places constraints on teambuilding and forces you to run several checks to avoid getting swept, which is made even harder by the fact that Mence can and does run multiple sets. This isn't a bad thing in and of itself, since this is how most teams prepare for top-tier threats, but the pool of viable checks for Mence is incredibly slim and entirely subject to what set Mence opts to run. Its traditional SubDD checks are manhandled by a specially offensive set, for instance, and the Refresh set hinders status spreaders like Prankster T-Wave users, allows for Mence to play more aggressively, and limits the number of ways to beat it. People have to realize that throwing more ice at it isn't going to solve the problem, and the fact that Mence facilitates that rise, among others, alone shows how blatantly centralizing it is.

I don't feel the need to echo what everyone else has already said, but I can certainly say that the metagame will be much better off without Mega Mence. Quickban this thing.
 
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Alright,MegaMence has great bulk,abilities,moves,recovery and stats.It has all the needed juice to be in Ubers,nothing can check it because of the amount of sets that this thing can run.So why not ban it?It's given Ice type Pokemon a chance to shine,I'm not saying it's OU worthy,hell no.I'm just saying that give it some time,we've already got Weaviles and Mamoswines and ScarfNinjas running around like nobody's business and,we've still to see MegaGlailie who looked quite threatening on paper imo.

Do not quickban MegaMence.
Give the meta sometime,I'm sure we'll find ways of dealing with this thing.If not,well,we can always put it through a suspect test :)
Its been a month, I'm sick of running scarf Noivern to kill this thing and when a non mega salamence is around I have a Scarfed Noivern on my team which is only used. It's even more annoying that the opponent can sack a pokemon on rotom (mainly a ground type to stop volt switching) and you either voltswitch out which doesn't break his sub giving him a free DDance or OHKO his checks like weavile as he has a sub, you switch which is the same as point 1, or you sack off Rotom and hope your hydro pumps don't miss. This is a pokemon that is being used more because it's better in this meta yet Salamence destroys it by just sacking that Rotom and then you either have a salamence behind a sub that has killed your volt switch in/switch, a salamence that has ddanced and killed one of your pokemon or behind a sub and DDanced.

Plus we can see it's centralising because good stall mons like venusaur and amoongus have dropped in usage greatly because salamence destroys them (you could argue new toy syndrome but 1 year in the meta I would guarantee their usage to be as low as it is now because of salamence).

Quick ban it
 
Alright,MegaMence has great bulk,abilities,moves,recovery and stats.It has all the needed juice to be in Ubers,nothing can check it because of the amount of sets that this thing can run.So why not ban it?It's given Ice type Pokemon a chance to shine,I'm not saying it's OU worthy,hell no.I'm just saying that give it some time,we've already got Weaviles and Mamoswines and ScarfNinjas running around like nobody's business and,we've still to see MegaGlailie who looked quite threatening on paper imo.

Do not quickban MegaMence.
Give the meta sometime,I'm sure we'll find ways of dealing with this thing.If not,well,we can always put it through a suspect test :)
I think we've given it enough time. We've all seen how good this thing is on the ladder, and the release of ORAS hasn't and isn't going to change anything. Regardless of how much time we give this thing, if someone hasn't found a way to make it less broken over the past 2 months or so, what difference is a few weeks of testing going to do? We're going to reach the same conclusion of it being banned anyway and there's no argument against that.


Subject 18 Edit: That was unnecessary...
 
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do i really need a reason at this point... it's an uncomparably devastating sweeper with an unholy amount of bulk, an unnecessary op ability and an uncounterable movepool. send this fucker to ubers, where it'll be overshadowed by mega ray and never seen again god bless. Quickban the bastard
 
This thing is good. The only possible reason it would deserves a suspect is because of the few viable pseudo checks it has i.e zapdos, heatran, tyranitar. That being said even if it does get a suspect test it will be banned almost definately. It can sweep teams afer just one dd meaning every member of you team needs to be able to prevent it from setting up which severly limits reambuilding.

Also mixed mence be scary. If the purpose of this thread is to make sure no one complains when it is quickbanned then don't worry no one will (except for greedy people who want to use it even though its broken)
 

MANNAT

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IMO Salamence is the most broken Pokemon that has wandered into ou RBY mewtwo, and there wasn't even smogon back then. If SR is up, then Salamence can take down almost any Pokemon in the tier one v one. It is incredibly over centralizing and every team is forced to run 2-3 Pokemon that counter it.

BANHAMMER
 
There really isn't much more to be said at this point, Mega-Salamence is simply ridiculously overpowered as anything ever seen in OU. I'll just recap all the points I've heard.

It hits really hard.
It is really fast
It is really bulky
It is incredibly easy to set up with
It has very few checks
All of it's set have different checks
Most of it's checks are very easy to wear down
It can absolutely destroy teams with 1 turn of set-up, and can easily obtain many more boosts
It forces teams to run sub-optimal pokemon to even stand a chance

I've probably missed some, but this list is more than enough to justify an Insta-Ban. It's such a blatantly negative effect on OU that I thought the OU council wouldn't hesitate a second to ban it the moment the games came out.
 
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