Metagame np: Stage 3 - 9(9) Problems

[soulgazer]

bro most of those are ruined by super fang, and heck most of those die to Explosion too (mostly speaking about those pokemon that you say resist ice but are actually used to handle other threats..)

and rof 'learn 2 adapt' we have been adapting bro, and when its forcing me to run avalugg, walrein, or like torkoal to not lose a pokemon or two to it, theres a problem.

we have been arguing its broken multiple time already. thats why we have been wanting to see good arguments against a M-Glalie suspect test.

 

[Da Raikage]

Super Fang helps whittle down several of them, but it doesn't let it simply outright win. If you Super Fang my Steelix, you're still gonna be forced out, thus taking more rocks damage (assuming they're up). Super fang doesn't turn 3hkos into 2hkos, if you Super Fang Hariyama and then Double Edge, Hariyama is still alive. If you throw Super Fang onto that set, you now forgo priority and your 1for1 in Explosion in an attempt to help Glalie whittle it's checks. And again, Super Fang throws in a 50/50 factor so it isn't exactly the safest move to go for. I feel like the same argument that people are throwing at M-Glalie could be thrown at almost every wallbreaker. Predict right and you get a kill, predict wrong and you're liable to lose M-Glalie. Super Fang is indeed an interesting move, but it's still not letting M-Glalie bust through it's answers until the next time Glalie comes in and it's survivabiltiy isn't the greatest. It's not easy to switch Glalie in more than once since rocks take away 25% of it's health upon switching in and whilst it's bulk isn't bad, it won't appreciate multiple hits. Without Ice Shard, things like Swellow and Rotom-S can Facade/Volt Switch freely and etc etc for giving up Freeze Dry or EQ. People seem to be assuming that Glalie can run: Super Fang EQ Double Edge Freeze Dry Ice Shard Explosion Spikes and Taunt all on one set. Sawk has the ability to hit every mon in NU (Mold Breaker EQ for Weezing, Ice Punch for Vileplume, Poison Jab for Weezing, Stone Edge for Mantine, CC for everything), but it's not considered broken because you can play around it and I feel you just need to deal with M-Glalie in the same way. Also, if you want to throw on Explosion as well, which coverage move are you getting rid of? Explosion means you throw away your Mega to beat its check...which means the check did its job. If there's something I'm missing about Super Fang, let me know because I don't see how it makes M-Glalie broken.

You're not forced to run Torkoal, I put it up as a joke. I listed many other viable mons. I did not mean to offend anyone when I said that nu needs to adapt, but whenever I see people say "why is it still NU omg", it's because they didn't bother to put anything to switch into ice type moves. The more recent arguments seem to be "prove it's not broken" to me as opposed to "Here is why I think it's broken" and I feel like the argument is shifting to an us vs them standpoint. IE taking jokes and making it seem like the user was being serious "Bring back BuskenPass" "Torkoal!" "Stop being stubborn old men"

 

[marilli]

Vanilluxe- Resists stab, has Flash Cannon

252 Atk Glalie Double-Edge vs. 78 HP / 0 Def Vanilluxe: 138-162 (45.6 - 53.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

yeah no

Wow nice cherrypicking and strawman there's like 2 pages of argument all the way from page 10 and your argument for keeping Glalie is "all the ban Glalie arguments are 'oh prove its not broken man'" It's just that no one likes having to post the same shit over and over again

 

[Punchshroom]

bro most of those are ruined by super fang, and heck most of those die to Explosion too (mostly speaking about those pokemon that you say resist ice but are actually used to handle other threats..)

and rof 'learn 2 adapt' we have been adapting bro, and when it's forcing me to run avalugg, walrein, or like torkoal to not lose a pokemon or two to it, theres a problem.

we have been arguing its broken multiple time already, can you read? thats why we have been wanting to see good arguments against a M-Glalie suspect test.

So um...what exactly do you do to prevent Jynx from putting one of your Pokemon to sleep and denting / outright KOing one of your Pokemon in the process? It still sounds very daunting but we've managed to tolerate Jynx somehow, and suddenly Mega Glalie is such a huge problem just because one needs physical Ice resists now? Or does the problem(s) extend beyond that (<- I still haven't had a solid answer to this question)? All of the Mega Glalie arguments I've seen mention that Mega Glalie counters have no solid recovery, and that nearly all are 2HKOed after a Super Fang (which technically translates to a 3HKO rather than a 2HKO) with little prediction required bar maybe the first Super Fang. However they do not address, or at least go into detail, that Glalie doesn't get to Mega Evolve scot-free every time (there are a good number of offensive mons sitting in between the 80-100 Speed category, all of which don't let Glalie Mega Evolve safely and means that balance teams can still stand a fair chance against it), it also has no recovery (at all), and the fact that most commonly seen defensive Pokemon nowadays aren't exactly huge Mega Glalie bait in the first place.

I'm all for a Mega Glalie suspect test, but it's not something that I'll immediately click 'ZOMG BAN' for. Don't most people deal with Jynx by revenge killing / careful pivot switching anyway, so I don't particularly understand the sudden outcry for Mega Glalie's brokenness based on arguments that can be applied to existing Pokemon.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Regarding my previous Pangoro rants, it wasn't so much a suggestion for a ban/suspect, more so than just a complaint. Pangoro is basically invalidating defensive teams by itself right now, if not forcing them to adopt an incredibly linear structure. And simply because offensive playstyles are favored, Pangoro's centralizing effect gets overlooked and is viewed by several to not be broken as they don't need to adapt as much. I can get behind this, and understand why Pangoro would not get suspected anytime soon. That said, people start complaining about Mega Glalie netting kills against them because its counters have no reliable recovery. Well maybe if you don't run such obvious Mega Glalie bait like a Cryogonal without Hidden Power Fire or something (this would be a classic example of meta adaptation) then you can at least limit the amount of damage Mega Glalie can do to you, and even make its Super Fang plays backfire as a result. Hmmm what's that, if I run Pokemon that are vulnerable to Mega Glalie I can end up losing even my counters in the long run (note: not even immediately)? Well if you run any kind of Pangoro bait (the definition can be found here) on your team, you can also expect to lose Pokemon to Panda because it too can beat down potential counters and doesn't have (m)any appropriate switch-ins found on offense / balance anyway.

 

[Ares]

252 Atk Refrigerate Glalie Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Arceus: 153-181 (34.4 - 40.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Jynx Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Arceus: 85-102 (19.1 - 22.9%) -- possible 5HKO

I mean Punch, just looking at damage output against something that has an even distribution of stats (which is why i chose arceus for the calc) you can clearly see that Glalie almost doubles the damage output that Jynx has. Idk why you are continuing to beat a dead horse here with the Jynx stuff, they're two very different mons when looking at checks / counters. There are a lot more good checks / counters to Ice / Psychic coverage for special attackers than there are for physical attackers. I dont think Mega Glalie is a 'ZOMG BAN' pokemon either, but I do want a suspect test for it...I just really don't get where you are trying to go with these Jynx arguments lol.

 

[Da Raikage]

252 Atk Glalie Double-Edge vs. 78 HP / 0 Def Vanilluxe: 138-162 (45.6 - 53.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

yeah no

Wow nice cherrypicking and strawman there's like 2 pages of argument all the way from page 10 and your argument for keeping Glalie is "all the ban Glalie arguments are 'oh prove its not broken man'" It's just that no one likes having to post the same shit over and over again

This post really annoyed me for multiple reasons. First of all, you completely misread my post. I said, and I quote, "The only argument I can see from YOU (talking about Sickweare) is "Tell me why it's not broken" to which I now refute and say, "tell me why you think it's broken" ". You then used the strawman argument that you accused me of and said I meant that about all my points which I discussed on the last page. But of course, NO ONE looked at that post. They only looked at what I typed whilst irritated because I was forced to repeat myself, and as you said, no one likes having to post the same shit over and over again.

NEXT

You said M-Glalie 2hkos Vanilluxe, so I decided to re-enact the scenario with a pal of mine. http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/nu-191957960 (only 2 turns, not long). As you can see, Vanilluxe comes out on top, and it would be able to take M-Glalie out if rocks were up as well, although it would die in the process that time.

My second post, where I listed the counters, should be taken less seriously. I was rather annoyed at the time and it was added on when I had to repeat myself because they found my argument baseless. No one likes having to run specific counters, but most of the answers to M-Glalie are pretty good pokemon. Gurdurr is much better than before since Slurpuff left for instance. I'm not saying that I don't understand where you're all coming from, but what I am saying is that I think some of you think M-Glalie is much more broken than it really is. In all honesty, I see Typhlosion and Sawk as bigger problems; but this isn't about them. I'd really appreciate it if people took my points from my post on page 12 instead of cherry picking my poorly constructed sentence on the second post of this page.

 

[Disjunction]

wanted to share a cool answer to fire spam outside of Hariyama I've been usin. dunno if anyone else has looked into it

Camerupt @ Cameruptite
Ability: Solid Rock
EVs: 252 HP / 44 SpA / 212 SpD
Calm Nature
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Flamethrower
- Earth Power

Spdef camel is really cute and is a great answer to a lot of mons right now. It beats fire spam, most grass types, our premiere ghost types Rotom/Missy, and a handful of other mons.

Archive of cool calcs 8)

252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 212+ SpD Camerupt: 117-138 (34 - 40.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Pyroar Hyper Voice vs. 252 HP / 212+ SpD Camerupt: 141-166 (40.9 - 48.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
44 SpA Sheer Force Camerupt Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Camerupt: 344-408 (100 - 118.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO (opposing mega camels)
252 SpA Life Orb Mismagius Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 212+ SpD Camerupt: 107-126 (31.1 - 36.6%) -- 63.3% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Rotom Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 212+ SpD Camerupt: 76-91 (22 - 26.4%) -- 15.6% chance to 4HKO
28 SpA Vileplume Giga Drain vs. 252 HP / 212+ SpD Camerupt: 66-78 (19.1 - 22.6%) -- possible 5HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Cryogonal Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 212+ SpD Camerupt: 110-133 (31.9 - 38.6%) -- 96.6% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Jynx Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 212+ SpD Camerupt: 126-149 (36.6 - 43.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Jynx Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Camerupt: 156-185 (45.3 - 53.7%) -- 41.4% chance to 2HKO
+1 252+ SpA Life Orb Lilligant Giga Drain vs. 252 HP / 212+ SpD Camerupt: 168-199 (48.8 - 57.8%) -- 94.5% chance to 2HKO (worst case scenario)
44 SpA Sheer Force Camerupt Flamethrower vs. +1 4 HP / 0 SpD Lilligant: 306-360 (108.5 - 127.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Mesprit Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Camerupt: 146-173 (42.4 - 50.2%) -- 1.6% chance to 2HKO

I didn't even include obviously stuff like pawniard and tangela.
It's a very solid mon imo. Even the assorted grass types it switches in on (Lilli, Plume, Tangela, etc) can't abuse sleep because of sleep talk which is always a concern for grass type switch ins. The main problem with the set is bulky water types but that's for, like, every camel set so I don't see why it would be worth mentioning as a downside to using this.
I recommend trying it out if you're looking for an all-around great answer to fire spam, grass types, and most special attackers in general. That is, if you aren't using your mega slot already

 

[Steakburgers]

Hey guys, Uh personally I think the main issue with glalie is simply we just don't have enough right now for it
Literally we gotta dig in the bargain bin for mons just to counter or check these things, cause if we don't, they'll rule the tier
Sure Miltank is a nice ass tank and whatnot, but who's to say they aren't running glalie/sawk or something
Its literally hard to play around the thing, it almost feels like dragalge except glalie is a decently fast mofo
For pangoro I have no qualms with the thing because I feel like while pangoro sorta makes it hard to run defensive teams, its sorta keeping the tier balanced in a weird way
Like if it were to go, stall would be super prevalant again, whereas, if it stays, it sorta keeps some things in check
It's not overpowered by any strech of the means honestly, sure its annoying as all hell to get your butt caved in by a panda knock off, but at the same time, its not as though panda isn't easily handled by most of its checks

Also, I'd like to sorta mention swellow, the bird people forgot somehow in oras. It's still a monster, with its base 125 speed there isn't much that can outpace it, and it still hits like a truck. Pair it with hariyama or something, and boom, you got a nice little core right there.

Swellow @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Facade
- Brave Bird
- U-turn
- Protect

 

[Teddeh]

Time for the teddeh comment on the matter:
Glalie is a mon that is neither here nor there for me.
Pros:

• Powerful stab 2 hit ko'ing most of the meta.
• priority
• high base speed
• explosion nuke
• can fit on balance and offense

negatives:

• frail
• shitty typing
• weakness to rocks
• recoil with high damage moves i.e double edge and dies when using explosion.

From personal experience of mega-glalie, it's not the most broken thing. It's typing alone is really off putting as it is really hard to build around with balance as ice has only 1 resist and in general it makes glalie really hard to use effectively unless you get a free switch. It's also not something you can double switch into if there are hazards up like stealth rock and most hyper offense teams can't afford to run hazard removal. There are also plenty of switch ins, water types in general such as prinplup and gatr check it nicely as most glalies can't afford to run freeze dry. There are also a lot of solid mons that force it out easily and check it with mega-steelix being the mvp, along with mega-audino. There is also musharna, uxie and weezing. In general, there are switch ins and i've never felt when teambuilding "I need to counter this mon omg". Yes it does take some clever pivots but it doesn't clearly stand out as something this meta can't handle. Also, its base speed isn't too high which means it can't be forced out or revenge killed by faster mons or even scarfed mons. Pyroar, typhlosion (speed tie i know), liepard, mismagius, scarfed mons such as mesprit aswell which are very common.
It just involves clever thinking too make sure you keep your checks to this mon at a very healthy state. It's self explanatory in my opinion on how to play around something or how to adapt to it. However if used appropriately, it could be an extremely powerful mon with the potential of damage output that it could provide, however I've not seen it at its best in use or used it to its fullest potential I'm sure.
To be quite honest in conclusion, I'm not entirely against a suspect test, but it's something that i feel NU can handle. It's a good mon, but it doesn't make it broken because it requires some prep in team building and requires a little bit of thought to play against it. Yes it is powerful, it does have notable flaws which make it manageable. I think in all honesty the meta has adapted to beat mega-glalie on most teams also, which again means that it is something that is manageable and it isn't overly centralizing like altaria and mega-lopunny were.
Feel free to tell me I'm wrong or whatever but these are just some opinions, i'm trying to be very balanced with this argument but just from use and experience of the mon alone, it's holding me back from deciding to suspect test it since I haven't experienced a moment where I've thought "this mon needs to get out of NU". But again, wouldn't be 100% in disagreement of a suspect test.

 

[soulgazer]

just want to point out that its not hard to build with glalie lol it doesn't exactly need entry hazard removal if you build your team so that you can pressure entry hazards mons (and glalie has taunt ooooooo), like.. any pokemon really.

80/80/80 isn't that frail :( its like close to the same bulk Sawk has. Sawk doesn't even really have the best typing ever either defensively but can still take hits. i know thats where the SR weakness might be huge.. but Glalie can still take a hit!

i've never felt when teambuilding "I need to counter this mon omg".

i agree with most of your post though, but i still personally think glalie is a lil too much

 

[Teddeh]

just want to point out that its not hard to build with glalie lol it doesn't exactly need entry hazard removal if you build your team so that you can pressure entry hazards mons (and glalie has taunt ooooooo), like.. any pokemon really.

80/80/80 isn't that frail :( its like close to the same bulk Sawk has. Sawk doesn't even really have the best typing ever either defensively but can still take hits. i know thats where the SR weakness might be huge.. but Glalie can still take a hit!

i agree with most of your post though, but i still personally think glalie is a lil too much

I personally find that when building balance with it, it's really a mon that doesn't switch in on many attacks with its typing and moves that kill itself anyway, you're just shortening a life span that's already short unless you're running frustration over double edge, by which you really find it out to get the 2 hit kos that you need with this mon. And 80-80-80 bulk is really not that great either.
Just a random calc from a few defensive mons that could try and take it on:
8 SpA Prinplup Scald vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Glalie: 88-105 (29.2 - 34.8%) -- 8.6% chance to 3HKO
4 SpA Weezing Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Glalie: 136-162 (45.1 - 53.8%) -- 38.7% chance to 2HKO
0 SpA Musharna Psyshock vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Glalie: 109-130 (36.2 - 43.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
It can take hits like you said, but it certainly doesn't switch in at all and it's hard keeping stealth rock off the field for the whole battle, so personally I think it is something that isn't too hard to handle ^_^
As for your second post, I for the most part like where you're coming from. I don't think we're running anything different to counter mega glalie since common nu walls and mons beat it since weezing, musharna, uxie, steelix can all sit there and take 2 hits where as it is outsped by quite a few things such as fire type mons and common scarfed pokemon like mesprit, which is why in the team builder I don't think I need to counter it.
Mega camel maybe perhaps a little different? I haven't seen any lunatone or vibrava though, the only slight change would be mantine in the meta which has been waters using some innovation which is great. I don't think camel is broken by any means since its base speed is crippling enough but i won't get into that.
In conclusion, I just think glalie can be handled by standard NU stuff ^_^ But I could understand why you would think it's a little too much.

 

[Punchshroom]

is m-camel and m-glalie making obscure mons get usage good? like they arent 100% necessary (well, maybe for camerupt (VIBRAVA LUNATONE), but not rly for Glalie) and it gives you more options when teambuilding (not the best ever, but hey those mons can do other stuff than just wall the megas too)

I've always had a soft spot for Lunatone since it always had a knack for walling specially offensive Fires (even in BW, where it countered all Charizards bar Solar Power variants). And I've said before that having the meta take notice of physical Ice resists is not necessarily a bad thing; it usually comes down to the competency of said physical Ice resists, which would require greater in-depth looks and exploring.

is panda actually broken? like for exemple lets compare it to gothorita in bw2 nu: both makes stall or slow bulky teams less good and force them to overprepare for them or to simply ignore them and lose just to focus on other threats. sorry if they are not the same things but thats like the closest thing we could think of Oo. Gothorita wasn't really considered 'broken' in smogon bw2 nu. Pangoro is easier to put on teams though, so theres that.

Isn't Gothorita usable in XY NU at one point, so why even compare it way back to BW2 Goth? Even if it was not necessarily 'broken' in the traditional sense, I don't think I have heard much of anyone complain about Shadow Tag Goth's forced departure from XY NU as it truly invalidated many kinds of defensive teams if not stunt their versatility completely, (which is somewhat relatable to Pangoro in a way; you run Shed Shell for Goth, you run Poison + Fairy for Panda), even though it had very limited uses against offense overall bar picking off one / two Pokemon (also like Panda).

To add onto iTeddeh's points, Glalie's initial speed combined with all of the issues Teddeh mentioned means that Glalie doesn't actually find safe Mega Evolving opportunities as often as it would like, particularly against Pokemon sitting in the 80-100 tier that is just out of safe reach. Again, I can get behind why a Pokemon that can throw out attacks equivalent to Selfdestruct / Explosion damage willy-nilly, in the form of Refrigerated Return (198.9 BP) and Refrigerated Double-Edge (234 BP) respectively, as well as packing its exclusive "pre-Gen 5" Explosion which hits 487.5 BP, would cry out for suspect-worthy or even quickban-worthy.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

One Pokemon I have noticed to subtly improve in the new meta is Tauros. That 110 Speed is looking incredibly sexy right now, and that Sheer Force Fire Blast is looking better than ever due to the rise and buffs of defensive Pokes such as Mega Steelix, Gourgeist, Avalugg, as well as hitting existing walls such as Tangela and Ferroseed. Sheer Force + Life Orb means it can hit like a truck and still smash apart the fast but frail meta while not taking any residual damage in the process, making it remarkably hard to wear down, and it has the coverage to hit all it (or your team) needs to. It also is interested in Huntail's ability to pass Coil boosts to it :P Good things come Tauros's way in this shift.

 

[Pooch13]

I also think glalie can be beneficial to the tier evolution. After all if M glalie and pango were to be banned the meta would look kinda similar to late xy nu where puff, galge an sceptile werent as good as they were at some point. I can definitely see how it can cause a lot of troubles to some teams but isnt part of the fun getting around troublesome mons ? Typhlo gives many people the same amount of trouble but it still was a fun mon to use or face. (Probably glalie gets hate cuz it looks like abomasnows left testy, jk jk)

 

[Teddeh]

After using mega-rupt in NU, its base speed is horrific aswell as a massive rise in popularity in water types in nu, meaning that it's easily forced out. Pokemon such as steelix which are slow steel types aren't being forced out because it's too slow and this basically means any rock type, ground type, anything with access to eq or a water move in general beats mega rupt and it's really crippled. It's a pokemon that has to rely on being at a very high number of health to function properly and to force pokemon out, since they won't stay in if they can't kill you. In general it's viability is below typhlosion which i have been using a lot more, the fact that typhlosion is faster than the walls which it is breaking gives it the edge on mega-rupt and then some. I think as a wallbreaker in nu, mega-rupt is less viable than pyroar, typh and magmortar. In general, i'm not very impressed by its ability to get the job done as it needs far too many free switches which requires team support.

Furthermore, I've only tried it on balance teams, however I've used it in PU as well as NU where it is extremely similar, except it still has the same issues. I think as far as a wallbreaker is concerned, mega-rupt's roll should need a lot of assistance on balance, not so much trickroom, which is obviously where it shines. I've also not seen it as a defensive wall yet and will try it soon, however as a wallbreaker although it has some amazing power that is simply hard to switch into, it very rarely gets the opportunities to fire off these nukes against most teams and even then it has some switch ins.
It as a defensive pokemon may offer far more opportunities however I still need to try it, but for now I'm not too impressed with its wall breaking capabilities as it is forced out far too easily and cannot complete this role consistently.

 

[soulgazer]

iTeddeh stop looking at camerupt as a wallbreaker. look at it as an offensive tank / pivot with a cool typing that lets it switch on a bunch of things and is able to punish the opponent really hard if he let Camerupt come in for ''free'' (aka it wasn't 2 or 3HKOed). high SpA =/= wallbreaker.

one of the common mistake is that people run max spa max hp. Camerupt still has the same issue it had when its not Mega: its not THAT bulky. it needs to abuse its typing to come in on resistances/immunity or on weak neutral moves (which aren't rare). Usually what you want to do is to invest in bulk a bit to avoid being 2hkoed by Klinklang's Return and/or Lilligant's Giga Drain (this is also why I think the really specially defensive spread is probably one of its best spread on balance). camerupt usually still get the 2HKOs and OHKOs vs the important targets with and without max spa.

 

[Karane]

Please suspect Glalie. People have already made comments regarding its dominance right now so I won't go writing essays. I hopped on the ladder today to try out some creative stuff but always seemed to get bopped by Mega-Glalie without using the same boring shit like Hariyama. That thing gets 2 easy kills per game or even three. Just like that. This cancer has made NU not fun to play at all. I don't think there has been such an dominant mon in NU history except like Magmortar in BW NU.

 

[boltsandbombers]

Agreeing with the pro-ban arguments for Mega Snowball. Just about everything has been said so far, but I'd like to share a replay of a really good battle I had with HJAD where Mega Glalie cleaned up half of my team late game. Basically, he did a good job of weakening and eventually KOing prinplup from repeated hits, which is my main check to Mega Glalie. Thankfully I had two faster Pokemon that managed to revenge kill it due to the fact that he didnt have ice shard, and if he did have it I certainly would have lost.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/nu-193490492

 

[HJAD]

Personally, my experience of playing against Mega-Glalie has always been terrifying. There are of course several counters like Avalugg where you can slap on a team to have no worries. My problem will be an overcentralized meta going into SPL, where people will be forced to be running PU (unfortunately, its the case) mons that aren't worth much when compared to pure NU mons.
I have now resorted to running numbers of priority on teams in order to keep it in check and have found it effective at times, especially when the opponent has no hazard removal, which Makes Stealth Rock on every team vitally important and if said hazard setter is removed via sleep or taunt or whatever. Glalie is certain to wreck havock on teams without a fully fledged counter. Stuff like prinplup die to super fang + freeze dry + tiny residual anyway.
I do think, although people say its typing is a weakness, it can also turn out to be its strength. STAB Ice moves are extremely dangerous in the current meta and always has been, coupled with powerful offensive stats, refrigerate for a further boost and a good/usable speed and quite a diverse movepool; I can agree with Mega-Glalie suspect test right now; there are counters; but they are oh so obscure and uncommon that they are not worth running for any reason other than check M-Glalie.
I think for the benefit of SPL and the NU tiers health, it would be a good idea to suspect m-glalie. For me, its way to centralising and easy to support. Add a typhlosion, a hazard remover, some hazard stackers and something else and bang. You have a completely viable team which works by weakening each others checks. Its far too strong and versatile for this tier in its current state.

 

[Punchshroom]

Camerupt @ Cameruptite
Ability: Solid Rock
EVs: 252 HP / 44 SpA / 212 SpD
Calm Nature
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Flamethrower
- Earth Power

I can't believe it took me this long to notice, but your EVs are actually slightly inefficient. For one, you just barely missed the jump point in Special Defense which is 216 EVs, so a better spread would be 248 HP / 44 SpA / 216 SpD, as the reduced HP means that MegaRupt would also take less damage from entry hazards (max HP is divisible by 8), while still retaining superior bulk over a max HP / 212 SpD variant.

252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 212+ SpD Camerupt: 117-138 (34 - 40.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 248 HP / 216+ SpD Mega Camerupt: 116-137 (33.8 - 39.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

 

[soulgazer]

Raseri Zebraiken hey nerds are we suspecting stuff soon or are we gonna let potentially broken mons be usable in spl?

and what about the tier shift on jan 1st (if theres one), will we quickban stuff if broken mons drop from ru?

 

[Raseri]

There are currently no plans for quickbans or suspects before January 1st.

As for the tier shifts, that depends on the "brokenness" of the Pokemon that drop, and will be dealt with on a case by case basis, just like we always have done. But because SPL starts in January, we will act quicker if something broken does drop.

 

[Cased]

I think the players planning on playing in the upcoming competitive tournament (SPL) would appreciate there to be some sort of suspect regarding the very powerful Pokemon currently in the NU Tier. UU and RU are doing their clean-ups currently for their tier (Lopunnite and Galladite recently banned) and NU should follow suit and try to "clean" up the tier before a tournament as big as SPL starts.

Mega Glalie is clearly one of (if not) the most controversial Pokemon in the tier and I think the majority of us would like a suspect coming soon before SPL, mainly because of the strain it puts on teambuilding, the games definitely won't be as good as they possibly could be with the aforementioned strain Mega Glalie puts on teambuilding. Pangoro is another controversial Pokemon obviously and if the playerbase agrees then it could be added to a suspect test

I can't imagine Zebraiken being fine with no suspects going into SPL... Considering he's the host of the entire thing, I know as the host and Co-Tier Leader, he wants the cleanest tier imaginable for games that will basically represent the tier throughout the tour. You guys saw what happened to Little Cup during last SPL, nobody took it seriously because of how bad the tier was (is lol).

I'd reconsider your stance regarding suspect tests right now, since it would be beneficial to anybody wanting to make a name for themselves during SPL. This is a tournament that basically makes players into elite guys, and I think a lot of the current players really want to take that "next step" and join and test their ability in SPL. And a clean tier allows players to feel motivated to do that :]

 

[Saria]

I would add Mega Camerupt to the list of controversial Pokemon. Might not be as "big" as Mega Glalie and Pangoro, but it definitely potentially broken. But this is just my personal opinion.

I understand being against quickbans, but there has been more than enough time to test Mega Glalie and Pangoro and see their effect on the tier, so why not suspect them. Pretty much every NU player believes they are at least suspect worthy, and basically everyone who's planning to play NU in the SPL is not looking forward to dealing with those Pokemon.

NU is already considered a bad tier by many people involved in the SPL and things like this do not help. That alone isn't a good reason to do anything, but combined with the fact the general playerbase seem to want these Pokemon suspected and that well known tournament players believe they are extremely controversial, is a big deal.

 

[The Goomy]

I personally find that when building balance with it

Why the hell are you trying to build balance around a mon that fits on hyper offense? That's like saying mantine sucks on HO, so it obviously can't be good on stall.

 

[boltsandbombers]

Why the hell are you trying to build balance around a mon that fits on hyper offense? That's like saying mantine sucks on HO, so it obviously can't be good on stall.

I think the problem is that teddeh is somewhat biased towards balance as a playstyle since that is basically all he uses. Nothing wrong with that, it just changes his outlook and not realizing that Glalie doesn't fit on that playstyle hurts your argument.