what is salamence there for?
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Battle Spot Teambuilding Discussion & Help Thread (read post #453, page 19)
- Thread starter ethan06
- Start date
To be honest, I don't know. Someone pn the PS chat sent me a sample team andinstance I went with it.
tbh salamence seems kind of irrelvent and thats probably why your not bringing it. I'm not the most experieced doubles player, but i would try amoonguss. If you feel that guy try sashed support salamence with tailwind. One thing i'm noticing is a huge weakness to sylveon. Specs/Life Orb Hyper voice hits like a ************* truck. So either way i think you should try both and see what works
I'll try Amoonguss first. Thanks for the suggestion!
By the way, what item should I give to Amoonguss? Sitrus Berry is taken by Rotom.
occa berry (or whatever berry reduces fire type attacks) would be my first choice. Black sludge/leftovers is also an option
Mental Herb is also an option considering that Thundurus or other taunt users will want you to stop using Spore/Rage Powder.
So I just checked the Singles 3v3 top 12 and they are:
Even just taking the top 6 it seems like something with good Edge-Quake coverage, something to handle Rotom's shenanigans and a good solid hitter for the likes of Gengar would be a good place to start.
How is Excadrill faring for people? It seems like it could do well with Mold Breaker and a Choice Scarf against Aegislash, Talongflame and Gengar leaving 2 other options available for the dragons and Rotom.
Aegislash
Garchomp
Talonflame
Salamence
Rotom-W
Gengar
Porygon2
Blaziken
Kanghaskhan
Cresselia
Greninja
Azumarill
Garchomp
Talonflame
Salamence
Rotom-W
Gengar
Porygon2
Blaziken
Kanghaskhan
Cresselia
Greninja
Azumarill
Even just taking the top 6 it seems like something with good Edge-Quake coverage, something to handle Rotom's shenanigans and a good solid hitter for the likes of Gengar would be a good place to start.
How is Excadrill faring for people? It seems like it could do well with Mold Breaker and a Choice Scarf against Aegislash, Talongflame and Gengar leaving 2 other options available for the dragons and Rotom.
I used Excadrill a little in the late XY meta and wrote a write-up for it on the Single VR thread which you can read here. To paraphrase my other post, it does do well for itself, hitting a massive slice of the format really hard with Earthquake alone and most of the Flying-types with Rock Slide. It can also check Clefable and Sylveon with Iron Head, and solidly 2HKOs all but the most physically defensive Rotom-W with Earthquake, meaning you only need a bit of chip damage to defeat it. In teambuilding, you need to bring Pokémon that can take down the Flying-types that Excadrill can't take itself with Rock Slide, chiefly Skarmory and Landorus-T. Having an answer to the odd Chesnaught, Ferrothorn or bulky Breloom would be a good plan as well. Zapdos is a great catch-all answer to most of these Pokémon; it struggles a little with Landorus but beats Skarmory handily and can run Heat Wave to improve it's matchup against the Grass-types I mentioned considerably. If you feel like running three attacks then Hidden Power [Ice] can be thrown in too to cover Landorus and the various Dragons that need slaying, or you can run it over Heat Wave if you already have bulky Grass-types covered. Rotom-W deals with Skarmory and Landorus much better and gets STAB on both moves but doesn't like facing bulky Grass-types (especially if they carry a Lum Berry or are specially oriented). Any floating/very fast Electric type does a decent job of beating Excadrill's counters so I'd experiment with those a little. To tie up the meandering waffle I've written above I'll compress it into a tl;dr:
beat: Skarmory, Landorus-T, Chesnaught, Ferrothorn, faster Scarfers
bring:
priority (be careful not to stack weaknesses)
Zapdos
Thundurus (prio T-Wave beats Scarfed non-Ground mons)
Rotom-W/H
Mega Manectric
Scarf Magnezone/Magneton (Magneton beats Greninja and Talonflame)
Raikou...?
bring:
priority (be careful not to stack weaknesses)
Zapdos
Thundurus (prio T-Wave beats Scarfed non-Ground mons)
Rotom-W/H
Mega Manectric
Scarf Magnezone/Magneton (Magneton beats Greninja and Talonflame)
Raikou...?
I hope this is coherent... As usual I'm posting at 3:30am and it's a terrible habit ;_;
Oh yeah, almost forgot - I've almost come to a conclusion regarding my Rotations team. I'll summarise it here.
Sableye @ Sablenite
Calm
Prankster
252 HP/252 Sp. Def/4 Def
-Calm Mind
-Snarl
-Recover
-Will-o-Wisp
Aegislash @ Air Balloon
Quiet
Stance Change
252 HP/252 Sp. Atk/4 Def
-King's Shield
-Substitute
-Shadow Ball
-Flash Cannon
Thundurus @Focus Sash Life Orb
Timid
Prankster
252 Sp. Atk/252 Spd/4 HP
-Thunderbolt
-Hidden Power [Ice]
-Thunder Wave
-Taunt
Conkeldurr @ Assault Vest
Adamant
Guts
252 HP/252 Atk/4 Def
-Mach Punch
-Drain Punch
-Knock Off
-Ice Punch
Ferrothorn @ Rocky Helmet/Lum Berry (???)
Brave
Iron Barbs
252 HP/220 Atk/36 Sp. Def (??? pure blind guess from Super Training graph :c )
-Leech Seed
-Protect
-Power Whip
-Gyro Ball
Talonflame @ Sky Plate
Jolly
Gale Wings
252 Atk/252 Spd/4 Def (maybe a bulkier spread idk yet)
-Brave Bird
-Flare Blitz
-Protect
-Will-o-Wisp/Roost
Calm
Prankster
252 HP/252 Sp. Def/4 Def
-Calm Mind
-Snarl
-Recover
-Will-o-Wisp
Aegislash @ Air Balloon
Quiet
Stance Change
252 HP/252 Sp. Atk/4 Def
-King's Shield
-Substitute
-Shadow Ball
-Flash Cannon
Thundurus @
Timid
Prankster
252 Sp. Atk/252 Spd/4 HP
-Thunderbolt
-Hidden Power [Ice]
-Thunder Wave
-Taunt
Conkeldurr @ Assault Vest
Adamant
Guts
252 HP/252 Atk/4 Def
-Mach Punch
-Drain Punch
-Knock Off
-Ice Punch
Ferrothorn @ Rocky Helmet/Lum Berry (???)
Brave
Iron Barbs
252 HP/220 Atk/36 Sp. Def (??? pure blind guess from Super Training graph :c )
-Leech Seed
-Protect
-Power Whip
-Gyro Ball
Talonflame @ Sky Plate
Jolly
Gale Wings
252 Atk/252 Spd/4 Def (maybe a bulkier spread idk yet)
-Brave Bird
-Flare Blitz
-Protect
-Will-o-Wisp/Roost
Considering swapping Aegislash out for some bulky Water-type as it feels a little redundant right now, between Ferrothorn and Sableye. I have an eye on Tentacruel as added Azumarill assurance but I'm not sold and I have no concept of it's effectiveness in Rotations - I would appreciate feedback. props to Level 51 for helping me already n_n
Last edited:
Hey hey. Sorry for the new post. Just read the rules and it said "lurk less" so I did.
Anyway, I've been working on a doubles 4v4 team, and I was wondering if anyone could help me point out where I can improve myself (other than the obvious coming up). It's a Trick Room setup, in summary.
Uxie @ Light Clay
A:Levitate
Evs: 252 HP/ 128 Def /128 SDef
Docile Nature
-Reflect
-Light Screen
-Trick Room
-U-Turn
So yeah, this guy is my main setter-upper. Get TR going, screen up, and if he's still going, u turn out for a sweeper.
Hariyama @ Flame Orb
A:Guts
Evs: 252 Atk/ 128 Def /128 SDef
Brave Nature
-Fake Out
-Knock Off
-Close Combat
-Ice Punch
Usually goes out first along Uxie. Fake out to stall so TR can activate and Flame Orb takes effect, then attacking with whatever move works best for a given situation.
Camerupt @ Cameruptite
A:Solid Rock
Evs: 252 HP/ 4 Def /252 SAtk
Quiet Nature
-Heat Wave
-Earth Power
-Hidden Power [Ice]
-Protect
My special attacker. Again, fairly straightforward. Protect to M.Evolve and get speed drop (boost). Then choosing the attack that'll hurt the most.
Dusclops @ Eviolite
A: Pressure
Evs: 252 HP/ 160 Def /96 SDef
Calm Nature
-Night Shade
-Disable
-Trick Room
-Will-O-Wisp
Backup TR setter. Under TR, takes hits like a champ, and is 'fast' enough to Disable enemies, and spread status. Night Shade so it's not Taunt bait, and to chip through any walls.
Sableye @ Leftovers
A:Prankster
Evs: 252 HP/ 252 Def /4 SDef
Impish Nature
-Taunt
-Knock Off
-Will-O-Wisp
-Recover
My general 'F--- with the enemy' Mon. The first three moves for general disruption, and Prankster Recover so I can keep on doing it! Also, I think it's adds a bit of mind games for the opponent (is it going to be mega Sableye, or Camerupt?)
Bellossom @ Choice Specs
A:Chlorophyll
Evs: 4 HP/ 252 SAtk /252 SDef
Bashful Nature
-Moonblast
-Giga Drain
-Sleep Powder
-Petal Dance
I'll be honest - I picked Bellossom for two reasons. One: my team, I've noticed, is otherwise quite weak against water types. And having a 'fast' sleep setter can't hurt. Two: it's the first shiny I caught in the game! It's a male, and his name is RuPauly. So it's of sentimental value to me. But really, what more reason do you need?!
So that's my team. At the moment, I'm winning roughly 40% of matches with it! but I could always use some pointers. Though I'm not sure how much comes down to needing to practice predictions.
Anyway, I hope I haven't taken up all this space inappropriately. I've lurked for a while, so I've got a rough handle on how things go round here. In any event, please don't hate me!
Anyway, I've been working on a doubles 4v4 team, and I was wondering if anyone could help me point out where I can improve myself (other than the obvious coming up). It's a Trick Room setup, in summary.
Uxie @ Light Clay
A:Levitate
Evs: 252 HP/ 128 Def /128 SDef
Docile Nature
-Reflect
-Light Screen
-Trick Room
-U-Turn
So yeah, this guy is my main setter-upper. Get TR going, screen up, and if he's still going, u turn out for a sweeper.
Hariyama @ Flame Orb
A:Guts
Evs: 252 Atk/ 128 Def /128 SDef
Brave Nature
-Fake Out
-Knock Off
-Close Combat
-Ice Punch
Usually goes out first along Uxie. Fake out to stall so TR can activate and Flame Orb takes effect, then attacking with whatever move works best for a given situation.
Camerupt @ Cameruptite
A:Solid Rock
Evs: 252 HP/ 4 Def /252 SAtk
Quiet Nature
-Heat Wave
-Earth Power
-Hidden Power [Ice]
-Protect
My special attacker. Again, fairly straightforward. Protect to M.Evolve and get speed drop (boost). Then choosing the attack that'll hurt the most.
Dusclops @ Eviolite
A: Pressure
Evs: 252 HP/ 160 Def /96 SDef
Calm Nature
-Night Shade
-Disable
-Trick Room
-Will-O-Wisp
Backup TR setter. Under TR, takes hits like a champ, and is 'fast' enough to Disable enemies, and spread status. Night Shade so it's not Taunt bait, and to chip through any walls.
Sableye @ Leftovers
A:Prankster
Evs: 252 HP/ 252 Def /4 SDef
Impish Nature
-Taunt
-Knock Off
-Will-O-Wisp
-Recover
My general 'F--- with the enemy' Mon. The first three moves for general disruption, and Prankster Recover so I can keep on doing it! Also, I think it's adds a bit of mind games for the opponent (is it going to be mega Sableye, or Camerupt?)
Bellossom @ Choice Specs
A:Chlorophyll
Evs: 4 HP/ 252 SAtk /252 SDef
Bashful Nature
-Moonblast
-Giga Drain
-Sleep Powder
-Petal Dance
I'll be honest - I picked Bellossom for two reasons. One: my team, I've noticed, is otherwise quite weak against water types. And having a 'fast' sleep setter can't hurt. Two: it's the first shiny I caught in the game! It's a male, and his name is RuPauly. So it's of sentimental value to me. But really, what more reason do you need?!
So that's my team. At the moment, I'm winning roughly 40% of matches with it! but I could always use some pointers. Though I'm not sure how much comes down to needing to practice predictions.
Anyway, I hope I haven't taken up all this space inappropriately. I've lurked for a while, so I've got a rough handle on how things go round here. In any event, please don't hate me!
Uturn has a lot less utility in doubles. Why not just use Cresselia over Uxie? Its bulkier, can use almost all the same moves, and has better support options in helping hand as well.
Sableye is out of place. You need more than one sweeper on a team to win. You should probably consider adding a second pokemon which can do damage, since if Camerupt goes down, you won't be able to do much.
Speaking of not doing damage, that's something Bellossom probably does a lot of. Its a pretty weak pokemon. Using a better grass type - maybe Breloom, Ferrothorn, Abomasnow, or even the new HA serperior, would make your team significantly more threatening.
Fellow long-time lurker here! I ran a doubles Trick Room team for some of the online tournaments in BW, interesting to see a different take on it!
Have you found that dual screens is very helpful on Uxie? I always found that Trick Room is a hyper-aggressive strategy (since you've only got 5 turns to do most of the beating) so screens took up a lot of time.
I totally understand why you're using the shiny Bellossom - sounds sweet! But if you're set on using Bellossom, sounds like Healer is the better of its two abilities (no sources of sun on your team). Obviously breeding a new one would cost you the shininess though.
I also found having a third TR setter was helpful. In 4v4 you wouldn't usually take all 3, but it prevents you from being locked into bringing two of them into a potentially unfavorable matchup for one. (Or the risk of bringing just one and it getting sniped ruining the whole match.)
In terms of mons I found useful, Cofagrigus was a fun TR setter and could do a decent chunk of damage, but I like weird sets so I'm not 100% sure how "recommendable" it is. It would fit into your Sableye slot, but fulfill a somewhat different role:
Cofagrigus @ Leftovers
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
- Trick Room
- Shadow Ball
- Nasty Plot
- Energy Ball
Alrighty then! Thanks for the tips! I'll see what I can do.
Huh. I hadn't thought of Cofagrigus before. I'll see if I can get one bred up. Thanks for the advice!
You make me want to run Swampert on my rain team (but it's XY league, so I can't)! Have to say that this is an awesome RMT post - very well put together. Also very interesting to see another rain team - I built one recently (RMT pending) - and I'd say yours is definitely superior.
Hi everyone! Although I've been playing Battlespot since the format's conception I never put in the effort to try and create a solid team that I enjoyed playing until now. The release of ORAS has shaken up the metagame introducing powerful threats which show that there is more than just Kangaskhan. After XY's weather nerf, what excited me most is the return of rain teams in the raw power of Mega Swampert. Although rain turns are still limited, this guy can really hurt with the right support and a Politoed to keep up rain. Furthermore, 3v3s mean that it doesn't need as many turns of rain in order to sweep a team compared to 6v6 Smogon Formats. After playing both on Showdown and on cartridge to find my way around the meta this is what I came up with.
As I write this I have peaked at 1430 elo on Showdown and (hopefully) increasing so I'd like to share the team which brought me here! At this point the reason why I haven't been able to hit the elusive 1500 is both a need to practice more and weaknesses in the team. I'd appreciate all and any feedback or ideas :)
The introduction of Mega Swampert is what inspired me to create this team. Once it's raining then he becomes difficult to stop.
Of course, that meant that rain is necessary in the first place. Although I have seen Rain Dance Mega Swamperts, it is not a reliable way of getting it up and it seems like a waste of great natural bulk to have to take a free hit just to set up. Also, using Politoed means that Damp Rock can be used for 3 additional turns of rain.
Since my core has similar typing, they share common weaknesses, namely Grass which isn't all too uncommon. Ferrothorn not only shrugs off Grass attacks but also benefits from the fire nerf in rain, often being able to live an additional turn. It also creates a Def-SpD synergy with Politoed. Something like a cheap version of SkarmBliss.
A tier with bans decided solely by Game Freak is pretty much what you would imagine. Imbalanced. Be thankful for Smogon tiers because in Battle Spot Mega Salamence is everywhere! Porygon2 is my obligatory counter and was chosen over alternatives such as Cresselia and Zapdos because of it's proven effectiveness and the ability to Intimidate opposing Salamence on the switch in.
Battle Spot's bring 6 pick 3 format allows the use of multiple megas in a team. Although Swampert is a beast in his own right, there are still some that hard counter it. That's where Salamence comes in as an alternative win condition.
I have gone through 719 candidates for this last spot and so I'll include a section at the bottom listing some of these which I've tested. Some were effective, some not so effective, and some were pretty fun to play! Many of these revolved me trying to find an answer to incoming status, especially WoW which cripples Swampert badly.
However in the end I settled on Conkeldurr. I was so focused on being able to bounce back or be immune to statuses that it hadn't crossed my mind to just find a Guts user until later. Not only does it help my status paranoia, but Conkeldurr has also filled in some blanks that my team was missing such as an answer to fairies Porygon2 which is on the rise as the premier Mega Salamence counter.
Without further ado I introduce the prototype work-in-progress Lonely Storm!
Politoed @ Damp Rock
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature (+SpD - SpA)
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Rest
- Encore
The staple for rain teams. Being the only legal Pokemon with Drizzle, Politoed is the essential rain setter being able to bring in 8 turns of rain without any risk of being Rain Dance taunted. I have specifically chosen to go with defensive Politoed as it gives me the longevity it needs to make me feel less pressured to switch in my sweepers at poor times and taking unnecessary hits. For the longest time I had used Toxic over Ice Beam but found it a bit silly for two reasons. Firstly, steel types are common and when they switch in to block a Toxic, Politoed can't do much back. Magnezone scares me off with Thunderbolt, Ferrothorn Power Whips, etc. Also Toxic stall simply doesn't work on a Politoed-Swampert core. Swampert so badly needs as many turns of rain as possible and Toxic takes up those turns. Encore prevents both stall and opponents setting up, forcing opponents to switch which works to bring in Swampert safely without sacking Politoed. Sleep Talk could be considered over Encore but the utility of Encore is one of the few answers to stall that I have.
Swampert @ Swampertite
Ability: Damp → Swift Swim
EVs: 100 HP / 252 Atk / 156 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Att -SpA)
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Ice Punch
- Protect
The sole gift to rain teams from ORAS and the reason for me to make this team! 156 Spe allows MSwampert to outspeed max Spe MSceptiles which can be OHKO'd no sweat. Most teams can be swept by the combination of these three moves, although Waterfall will do the most damage in the rain I find myself using Earthquake and Ice Punch just as much. Protect allows me to Mega Evolve in the rain and not take unnecessary damage while my speed is unboosted. It allows me to block a hit from MSceptile as well as other threats which would otherwise OHKO me. Superpower, Hammer Arm or Power Up Punch can be considered over Protect as it gives Swampert amazing coverage but at the same time it gives you less opportune times to Mega Evolve safely. Protect also scouts for moves and makes Lopunny and Blaziken's High Jump Kicks recoil.
Ferrothorn @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature (+Def -SpA)
- Knock Off
- Stealth Rock
- Leech Seed
- Protect
Ferrothorn benefits from the rain through nerfs to fire attacks. Just look at this tank!
252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 300-352 (165.7 - 194.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn in Rain: 144-172 (79.5 - 95%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Of course Ferrothorn wouldn't be able to OHKO back, but this allows for an additional turn to Stealth Rock, Thunder Wave, or Leech Seed. Also the Rocky Helmet + Iron Barbs residual damage really does a number against contact damage which can be switched into. Namely incoming Fake Outs, Power Whips, Close Combats, and any priority move which threaten Ferrothorn's teammates. If I see the opportunity to lead with Ferrothorn as well as see potentially Focus Sashed enemies, Stealth Rock allows them to be broken giving Swampert an easier time to sweep. It's rare that I get to use all of Ferrothorn's moves in the one game but they are all situationally useful! The percentage damage of Leech Seed prevents setting up and stall to some extent and Protect can scout for moves, give additional turns of Leech Seed, and make Lopunny and Blaziken miss High Jump Kicks so that they take massive recoil damage. The only problem that I have with Protect is that it could potentially take up turns of rain. Knock Off gets rid of Eviolites and other key items.
Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Ability: Trace
EVs: 252 HP / 164 Def / 92 SpA
Bold Nature (+Def -Atk)
IVs: 0 Atk
- Ice Beam
- Thunder
-Toxic
- Recover
I posted my opinion of Porygon2 here and this is the spread that I came up with! Most of my explanation for Porgyon2 are in those two posts so I won't go into detail here but 92 SpA specifically OHKO's 4HP Salamence which Porygon2 has no trouble switching into. Trace was chosen for the utility of switching in and out of Arena Trap/Shadow Tag, Intimidate Salamences, as well as many other situational uses.
92 SpA Porygon2 Ice Beam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Salamence: 172-204 (100.5 - 119.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Aerilate Salamence Return vs. 252 HP / 164 Def Eviolite Porygon2: 84-99 (43.7 - 51.5%) -- 8.6% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Mega Salamence Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Porygon2: 81-96 (42.1 - 50%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Aerilate Mega Salamence Hyper Voice vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Porygon2: 73-87 (38 - 45.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Ice Beaming Salamences for the OHKO feels so satisfying. Thunder was chosen over Thunderbolt and Tri Attack for it's BoltBeam coverage and perfect accuracy in the rain. Recover allows Porygon2 to keep up it's phenomenal bulk and force switches. Toxic is a solution to defensive/stall teams such as Mega Slowbro without Rest. Knock Off hurts P2's bulk by removing Eviolite but Ferrothorn can punish them if switched into.
Salamence @ Salamencite
Ability: Intimidate → Aerialate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature (+Spe -SpA)
- Double-Edge
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
If you can't beat them, join them. I'm almost ashamed to use MSalamence but it's power and ridiculous BST is something to be feared. Although teams are often prepared (and even over-prepared) for the beast at this point of time, Salamence still finds the occasional enemy team with no sufficient counter. Just the sight of Salamence in team preview turns the game around in my favour. I expect opponents to bring their own checks/counters and can plan my teams accordingly, often not even bringing Salamence. This was the primary reason for it's inclusion for my team and was in fact originally Choice Scarf Salamence which can revenge kill opposing Salamences not behind a substitute. One DD boost and MKangaskhan 2.0 goes to town. Max Speed outspeeds key threats such as Raikou and speedties opposing Max Spe Salamence. Dragon Claw is chosen over Outrage so that I don't get locked into outraging meddlesome fairies, while still being able to do big damage against Dragon-Types.
Conkeldurr @ Assault Vest
Ability: Guts
EVs: 252 Atk / 236 SpD / 20 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Atk - SpA)
- Drain Punch
- Mach Punch
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab
The still tentative Slot 6 of my team. This has been the most contested place in any of my teams so far and in these weeks I have been testing out countless ideas to put the team together, both offensive and defensive. My team lacked something to do considerable damage to fairies, a status absorber and a strong fighting move since I opted out of one for Swampert. Cokeldurr has filled that spot quite nicely without being too reliant on rain which was a problem I faced in previous iterations for this slot. A solid mix of power and bulk, Conkeldurr doesn't mind Toxics or Will-O-Wisps coming his way and can often retaliate with force. Mach Punch gives Conkeldurr the only priority in the team which felt needed for those priority users that Ferrothorn can't stay around forever for, and Poison Jab knocks out fairies which was something else this team lacked. Knock Off hurts Aegislash and Latias both of which are common on the Showdown ladder. 20 Spe EVs outspeed Hippowdon which likes to switch in when rain is up to change the weather. The ever increasing Porygon2 is often brought versus this team since opponents see Salamence in the team preview and Conkeldurr lols at it as Toxic only activates guts and Drain Punch out-damages Recover.
Espeon @ Light Clay
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spe -Atk)
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psyshock
- Rain Dance
- Light Screen
- Reflect
Espeon sits at the most uneasy spot in my team, being the most likely to be replaced. The utlity of Magic Bounce as well as Dual Screens is cool but I don't often bring Espeon to games other than specific match-ups due to it's lack of viability otherwise.
Dragonite @ Life OrbPerfect accuracy Thunder! Perfect accuracy Hurricane! Rain-boosted Surf! Dragonite makes perfect sense on a rain team right!? Well yes and no. Even with as much speed as possible to give is sweeping capabilities, Dragonite's 80 Spe feels so pitiful and leaves it an open target for the multitude of fast and powerful checks, especially since Ice-Type attacks are almost always in teams. Even switching up to a 252 HP / 252 SpA spread didn't help because it didn't do as much damage as I'd hoped. Dragonite also limited the use of rain, making him too situational. I have 8 turns of rain so why use him over Swampert if I wanted a sweeper? It was hard for me to find a reason to keep him.
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spe -Atk)
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunder
- Hurricane
- Surf
- Agility
Gorebyss @ White HerbSmash-Pass Gorebyss to Salamence is fun. Not effective or reliable, but fun.
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Shell Smash
- Baton Pass
- Substitute
And so there it is, my interpretation of a Battle Spot rain team! I don't claim for this team to be the best as there are still some glaring faults and weaknesses but it's been a fun run with this team. So for this I'd like to ask for feedback from anyone and everyone! The team definitely could use some improvement so yeah.
Ferrothorn: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battlespotsingles-189890997
I don't care about no Chansey: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battlespotsingles-189906044
Porygon2: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battlespotsingles-189969007
Ferrothorn again/Game to get 1400: elo http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battlespotsingles-190761677
Bonus Battle. It's not even this team: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battlespotsingles-191741361
Politoed @ Damp Rock
Ability: Drizzle
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Encore
- Rest
Swampert @ Swampertite
Ability: Damp
Level: 50
EVs: 100 HP / 252 Atk / 156 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Ice Punch
- Protect
Ferrothorn @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Knock Off
- Stealth Rock
- Leech Seed
- Protect
Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Ability: Trace
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 164 Def / 92 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Ice Beam
- Thunder
- Recover
- Toxic
Salamence @ Salamencite
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Double-Edge
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
Conkeldurr @ Assault Vest
Ability: Guts
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 236 SpD / 20 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Mach Punch
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab
Special thanks to everyone who tested the team with me, gave me feedback as it was in building process, or even just chatted to me as I theorycrafted and laddered. Especially everyone who is on the Battle Spot Forum/PS Lobby/IRC. Won't name people because I know I'll forget someone.
I doubt that you read the whole RMT. No one reads the whole RMT. I know that you just scrolled straight down here. 100th post yay.
Have you found the all-support moveset on Ferrothorn to be good in 3v3? I feel like it Power Whip has been useful quite often. And how do you deal with Taunt there?
Very, very good point about Ice Beam vs Toxic on Politoed. Thinking about changing over to use Ice Beam now myself as well - it hits a lot of things that I've been having difficulty with quite well.
Do you find yourself in many weather wars with Mega Charizard Y? Also, you mentioned playing on cartridge, but your ratings all seem to be Showdown-y - have you played much of the WiFi in-game with this team?
Also, do you mind if I totally rip off your format when posting my own RMT?
Sergeus Thanks! Feel free to use my team as it is or as a base for your own to see how rain plays out, I like seeing replays of how people use them :) This team is still far from perfect though and I hope to keep improving it.
Haven't tried no attacking moves on Ferrothorn if that's what you mean, but that main taunt users I see are Sableye and Heatran both of which Ferrothorn shouldn't be staying into anyway. There's a good reason as to why Power Whip is used more often than Knock Off on Ferrothorn, it does massive damage against some of the bulky water types going around.
I'd definitely use Toxic on Politoed if it was Smogon OU but in the 3v3 format it loses a lot of it's purpose.
I generally don't bring Politoed if I see a Charizard on the opposing team because it's too easy for Charizard Y to have the dominating weather as I fear switching into Solarbeam. Outside of rain it then decimates Politoed/Swampert.
I've played some Wi-Fi with it but I'm definitely not experienced enough to talk about my team in that environment yet. The meta is somewhat different from Showdowns!
The sprite thing was something I remember seeing a long time ago so it's not my format. No idea who's it was anymore. But yeah go ahead and use it!
Haven't tried no attacking moves on Ferrothorn if that's what you mean, but that main taunt users I see are Sableye and Heatran both of which Ferrothorn shouldn't be staying into anyway. There's a good reason as to why Power Whip is used more often than Knock Off on Ferrothorn, it does massive damage against some of the bulky water types going around.
I'd definitely use Toxic on Politoed if it was Smogon OU but in the 3v3 format it loses a lot of it's purpose.
I generally don't bring Politoed if I see a Charizard on the opposing team because it's too easy for Charizard Y to have the dominating weather as I fear switching into Solarbeam. Outside of rain it then decimates Politoed/Swampert.
I've played some Wi-Fi with it but I'm definitely not experienced enough to talk about my team in that environment yet. The meta is somewhat different from Showdowns!
The sprite thing was something I remember seeing a long time ago so it's not my format. No idea who's it was anymore. But yeah go ahead and use it!
Ah, I got confused and wasn't thinking of Knock-Off as an attacking move - woops!
Why do you fear switching into Solar Beam? Drizzle activates when Politoed switches in and then Charizard's Solar Beam needs to charge. If you see the charge (your opponent predicted the switch), then you switch back to something that resists grass, and now his Charizard is fighting under rain. If they didn't predict and start the Solar Beam, then you just whack him with Scald if he tries to charge up the following turn, but more likely they'll switch out. That's how I've played it on the Wi-Fi ladder and have had success in those matches.
You are right, thanks for telling me! I still need to learn these mechanics! I think I was thinking of how the Grass-Type resist in Ferrothorn wouldn't be able to take a Flamethrower but I could use someone else.
Yeah, another grass resist aside from Ferrothorn is definitely your better option. But Ferrothorn can do in a pinch - you can switch back to Politoed expecting the Flamethrower and take very little damage - no risk of Solar Beam since it has to charge first. And if all else fails, you could Seed Charizard - he only has a 2HKO on Ferrothorn under rain (depending on your and their EV spreads). (Though Fire Blast does have a small chance to OHKO) I have Thunder Wave on my Ferrothorn which comes in handy in these situations.
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Flamethrower vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Ferrothorn in Rain: 124-148 (68.5 - 81.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Mega Salamence is one of Battle Spot's most destructive pokemon and will be for years. Over the past month i'm noticing a lot of them running Facade. Now Facade takes advantage of a burn pokemon like Sableye will bring and stop this thing. Overall i expect all most all megamence's to run facade over time. Another thing that i noticed is almost all Mega Salamence's are fully physical. This may be because there physical coverage is a bit better and can hit almost everything, as with special or mixed you can use the moves but get the same/less results as you can with physical.
Hi there!
I have been working on this team for 3v3 Singles. I'm quite happy with te results but I'd like some feedback
Greninja @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
EVs: 40 Atk / 218 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Gunk Shot
- Low Kick
My main lead, adds some coverage to the team. Hydro Pump is my main move since it hits pretty hard even if it's neutral. Ice Beam for Salamence/non-scarfed Landorus/other 4x weakness to ice. Gunk Shot for faeries and Low Kick for TTar, Heatran, Bisharp and Hydreigon. 40 Atk evs allow a 0KO to Azumarill and Mega Altaria while Bold Sylveon can be easily revenge-killed.
Gengar @ Focus Sash
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Bomb
- Destiny Bond
- Taunt
My second lead. Taunt+DBond+Sash to deal with problematic pokemon (if they are non-scarfed). Taunt is also useful against Breloom leads or to deal with some walls. Shadow Ball and Sludge Bomb for STAB. I might change SBomb for Sludge Wave though but I'll need to get an event Gengar. Disable is another attack I'd like to try. Levitate is also such a great ability since it can sponge EQ for Aegislash and Charizard (after mega)
Slowbro @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 222 Def / 36 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Thunder Wave
- Slack Off
Slowbro is such a great physical wall. It can deal with Garchomp, T-Flame, Blaziken, MMence and even MKanga. Thanks to T-Wave it acts as a support pokemon too, allowing MegaZard to sweep with ease.
Aegislash @ Leftovers
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 244 HP / 12 SpA / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Toxic
- Substitute
- King's Shield
I have been trying specially defensive Aegislash for some time with decent results. SubShield + Leftovers for recovery and Toxic to slowly kill the opponents. Shadow Ball has such a good neutral coverage and STAB. I choosed Relaxed over Calm to try to guarantee attacking after my opponent.
Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Dark Pulse
- Will-O-Wisp
- Calm Mind
- Recover
One on my two megas, Sableye can sponge many attacks with ease. CM boost its SpDef while WoW allow it to deal with physical attackers. Dark Pulse seems better than SBall since I already have two ghost moves and DP can at least deal with Chansey.
Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 HP / 136 Atk / 120 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Outrage
- Dragon Dance
- Roost
A regular bulkyDDZard. This is the pokemon I'm less happy with, though, but I'd like to have a powerful physical sweeper that is not shouted down by WoW or Lava Plume. Roost for durability and Outrage over DClaw for power.
I have been working on this team for 3v3 Singles. I'm quite happy with te results but I'd like some feedback
Greninja @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
EVs: 40 Atk / 218 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Gunk Shot
- Low Kick
My main lead, adds some coverage to the team. Hydro Pump is my main move since it hits pretty hard even if it's neutral. Ice Beam for Salamence/non-scarfed Landorus/other 4x weakness to ice. Gunk Shot for faeries and Low Kick for TTar, Heatran, Bisharp and Hydreigon. 40 Atk evs allow a 0KO to Azumarill and Mega Altaria while Bold Sylveon can be easily revenge-killed.
Gengar @ Focus Sash
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Bomb
- Destiny Bond
- Taunt
My second lead. Taunt+DBond+Sash to deal with problematic pokemon (if they are non-scarfed). Taunt is also useful against Breloom leads or to deal with some walls. Shadow Ball and Sludge Bomb for STAB. I might change SBomb for Sludge Wave though but I'll need to get an event Gengar. Disable is another attack I'd like to try. Levitate is also such a great ability since it can sponge EQ for Aegislash and Charizard (after mega)
Slowbro @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 222 Def / 36 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Thunder Wave
- Slack Off
Slowbro is such a great physical wall. It can deal with Garchomp, T-Flame, Blaziken, MMence and even MKanga. Thanks to T-Wave it acts as a support pokemon too, allowing MegaZard to sweep with ease.
Aegislash @ Leftovers
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 244 HP / 12 SpA / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Toxic
- Substitute
- King's Shield
I have been trying specially defensive Aegislash for some time with decent results. SubShield + Leftovers for recovery and Toxic to slowly kill the opponents. Shadow Ball has such a good neutral coverage and STAB. I choosed Relaxed over Calm to try to guarantee attacking after my opponent.
Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Dark Pulse
- Will-O-Wisp
- Calm Mind
- Recover
One on my two megas, Sableye can sponge many attacks with ease. CM boost its SpDef while WoW allow it to deal with physical attackers. Dark Pulse seems better than SBall since I already have two ghost moves and DP can at least deal with Chansey.
Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 HP / 136 Atk / 120 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Outrage
- Dragon Dance
- Roost
A regular bulkyDDZard. This is the pokemon I'm less happy with, though, but I'd like to have a powerful physical sweeper that is not shouted down by WoW or Lava Plume. Roost for durability and Outrage over DClaw for power.
Mkushrom looks like a pretty nice team so far. Since you're not happy with Charizard I'll focus on that. Half your team is weak to Ghost+Dark (Gengar, Slowbro, Aegislash), and since you want a strong physical fire type / immunity to burn, why not use Mega Blaziken? It has fighting STAB to deal with the Dark types, and can run Knock Off to help with the Ghosts / everything running an item (Knock Off is so good). Maybe something like:
Blaziken @ Blazikenite
Ability: Speed Boost
Adamant / Jolly Nature
EVs: can alter speed to hit certain benchmarks with Speed Boost, allowing some EVs in HP
- Protect / Swords Dance
- Flare Blitz
- Low Kick / Hi Jump Kick
- Knock Off / Protect
There's a few slashes in there because it really depends on what you want to run. Are you playing on sim or cart? I'd love to know your rating since you said you've been getting results
Blaziken @ Blazikenite
Ability: Speed Boost
Adamant / Jolly Nature
EVs: can alter speed to hit certain benchmarks with Speed Boost, allowing some EVs in HP
- Protect / Swords Dance
- Flare Blitz
- Low Kick / Hi Jump Kick
- Knock Off / Protect
There's a few slashes in there because it really depends on what you want to run. Are you playing on sim or cart? I'd love to know your rating since you said you've been getting results
Thanks for the feedback. I have been using this team on Showdown since I still have to rebuild my pokemon's evs on cart, but I'll start posting results on BS as soon as I can.
I have been thinking on Blaziken as an option but since it cannot tank many hits and doesn't have recovery I think M-Altaria might be a better choice.
Altaria @ Altarianite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 248 HP / 36 Atk / 224 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Return
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
- Roost
Altaria can absorb status before mega evolving, tank some attacks thanks to its typing and hit like a truck with Return+Pixilate. 224 Spe is to outspeed Greninja at +1, 248 in HP for durability and the rest in attack. It can also absorb dark type moves even better than Blaziken and being a Dragon is a blessing when dealing with electric moves (a real pain for my team). I'd need a fire move for Ferro and Scizor though. Maybe HP Fire on Greninja.
However I'll test both Blaziken and Altaria before using them on cart.
I wouldn't say Altaria can absorb status since Natural Cure will only work if you switch while still in non-mega forme, and how long do you plan to leave Altaria unevolved? The way I see it would be switching Altaria in on a predicted WoW / Thunder Wave and immediately switching out, which just gives your opponent momentum... It also can't tank Dark moves better than Blaziken as it is only a fairy type after evolving (Blaze is always Fighting). I can't imagine you having Altaria evolved, switching out, and then switching back in on a predicted Dark move (the only situation where someone would be aiming a Dark move at Mega Altaria)... It also won't deal with Electric type moves as well as you think due to it being part Flying pre-mega. I also think you're over-estimating Altaria's offensive potency, with that little investment in Attack it will really need the Dragon Dance boost before doing any damage... It sounds like I'm being overly negative, Mega Altaria is good, it's just that your ideas of how it will be used are a bit off...
I'm not experienced at all really so take this suggestion with a (huge) grain of salt, but what about something like Scrafty?
Scrafty @ Assault Vest / Chesto Berry
Ability : Shed Skin
Adamant / Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch / Rest
- Bulk Up / Dragon Dance / High Jump Kick
- Bulk Up / Dragon Dance / High Jump Kick
Honestly, I've never run Scrafty myself so I'm not sure what would work best for your team in those last 2 slots, Poison Jab and Ice Punch are also considerations. Scrafty is obviously not the physical sweeper Blaziken or Charizard X are but it does give you a Knock Off user and another pokemon that can soak up some hits. Although, adding Scrafty does add a bit of a fairy weakness to your team so who knows.
Also, just wanted to say I do really like your team and will probably try this out myself on my cartridge when I get around to breeding a few of the mons I'm missing.
EDIT : After posting I realized you could just run Guts Conkeldurr with assault vest instead...so yeah...
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