Mix-and-Mega — Now with Primals!

[Ghoul King]

That's nice. "Outclasses other choices" isn't the same thing as "ban-worthy". You only get one copy of a given Mega Stone, remember?

That Pidgeotite comparison is also ridiculous, since the most obvious thing to do with Pidgeotite is slap it on something with powerful but inaccurate moves, like Noivern with Hurricane and Focus Blast.

Using Mew as a "neutral" comparison point is also pretty useless when a given Mega Stone is going to be fitted to the Pokemon that get disproportionate benefit out of it. Mew as a baseline comparison point doesn't clarify much of anything useful: it's self-evident that Parental Bond provides a better boost than the 30% boosts since it's a 50% boost. If that was a convincing argument I wouldn't be talking at all.

And, again, several Mega Stones provide more Speed, which can be crucial.

Do you have any examples of Kangaskhanite producing a Pokemon that actually breaks the meta?

 

[jordanthejq12]

It should be noted that Kangaskhanite Chomp does beat Slowbronite Blissey 1v1 (3HKO with EQ), but cannot come in on it because that Blissey can 3HKO with Hyper Voice. (Blissey should run Bold; Modest turns that into a possible 2HKO, for example.)

I will have to say that I think Kangaskhanite should be subject to a formal suspect rather than a quickban. As noted, you only get one of each stone, and of course Kangaskhanite would likely be on every team, but then again, Pidgeotite would, too. Imagine having that on Noivern, or Victini. Heck, Pidgeotite Victini is terrifying; with perfect accuracy Blue Flare, Focus Blast, and Thunder off 165 SpA, it has no need to nuke its stats with V-Create.

And that is perfectly normal.

The point is, the statistics we are seeing may look like nothing we've ever seen, but this is an Ubers-based meta, and keep in mind that literally every Mega Stone (including the ones you can't use) improves attack in some capability. Not to mention that every poke OU and below will have a Stone. There's no other option. So, when running calcs, be sure to factor in stones the defending poke would be likely to use, as Ghoul King did. You'll more than likely have a completely different worldview. I do think Keldeo is a good point in favor, but it is ranked S in OU for a reason.

 

[Throbulator36]

I should say that if calcing for special attackers etiolate chansey is still the most specially bulky

 

[jordanthejq12]

Actually, that would be Shuckle with a stone that gives +20 SpDef without a Def boost of over +25 (of which several stones fit that description).

And on the subject of Kangaskhanite and possible brokenness, try Rampardos or Slaking. Those could get pretty up there.

 

[Ghoul King]

I should say that if calcing for special attackers etiolate chansey is still the most specially bulky

Actually, Audinite's +40 Special Defense is enough to push Blissey ahead of Eviolite Chansey, going with a test calc. (I just gave them both Hyper Voice and identical Special Attack: Blissey did more damage, albeit only slightly) Sablenite provides +50, +50 to Defense, and grants the wondrous Magic Bounce, so Eviolite Chansey is pretty badly outclassed by Blissey, never mind the possibility of some other, more surprising Special wall.

Actually, that would be Shuckle with a stone that gives +20 SpDef without a Def boost of over +25 (of which several stones fit that description).

And on the subject of Kangaskhanite and possible brokenness, try Rampardos or Slaking. Those could get pretty up there.

You can't give Slaking a Mega Stone. Nor Regigigas, nor Kyurem-Black. (You can currently give Archeops one, though this might not stay true long once the meta is actually being played) Not even I am so give-it-a-try to think those might be balanced!

Rampardos would certainly hit really, really hard, but it would also be slow and lack priority, and still be fragile. There's probably better options, like Bisharp, or maybe Conkeldurr.

Altarianite Entei seems interesting, now that I think about it. STAB Pixilate Extreme Speed paired with the unusual Fire/Fairy typing, which is actually a pretty OK typing. And of course Sacred Fire.

 

[Da Pizza Man]

An example of a Kangaskhanite Pokemon who breaks the meta? Let's look at one

Victini @ Kangaskhanite
Abillity: Victory Star
4 Def / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- V-Create
- Bolt Strike
- Zen Headbutt / U-Turn
- Power-Up Punch

100/130/120/120/120/110

Do I even need to explain how this is broken? Well I guess I do. This thing is increadibly broken and anybody should be able to see that, great 100/120/120 bulk, access to the nitorious Power-Up Punch boosting move, making this pretty much a Swords Dance with 75 BP, and access to one of the most frieghting things I have ever seen, Parental Bond V-Create, now even before considering STAB this attack has a grand total of 270 BP, which is absolutly insane, I really don't see how this isn't broken

It can also run a special set if it wants too

Victini @ Kangaskhanite
Abillity: Victory Star
4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Blue Flare
- Psyshock
- Glaciate / Energy Ball
- Charge Beam

 

[Throbulator36]

An example of a Kangaskhanite Pokemon who breaks the meta? Let's look at one

Victini @ Kangaskhanite
Abillity: Victory Star
4 Def / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- V-Create
- Bolt Strike
- Zen Headbutt / U-Turn
- Power-Up Punch

100/130/120/120/120/110

Do I even need to explain how this is broken? Well I guess I do. This thing is increadibly broken and anybody should be able to see that, great 100/120/120 bulk, access to the nitorious Power-Up Punch boosting move, making this pretty much a Swords Dance with 75 BP, and access to one of the most frieghting things I have ever seen, Parental Bond V-Create, now even before considering STAB this attack has a grand total of 270 BP, which is absolutly insane, I really don't see how this isn't broken

well while it is most likely broken boosting+PB V-Create isn't the best combination in the world since you'll leave yourself vulnerable the first turn only to nuke once then switch out and then repeat the process until you die(likely you won't survive the second time because even stall has scald)

making this pretty much a Swords Dance with 75 BP

*87 BP

 

[tegrof19]

Pbond vcreate is possibly the worst thing you can do to yourself js

 

[Throbulator36]

Pbond vcreate is possibly the worst thing you can do to yourself js

other than abomasite shedinja

 

[Tarontos]

parental bond over-heat/superpower/clones are way worse

 

[Throbulator36]

parental bond over-heat/superpower/clones are way worse

not if youre critdra

 

[Tarontos]

critdra?

 

[Throbulator36]

critdra?

Any pokemon that relies on crits(focus energy) to do high damage(though it's the (un)official name for the sniper kingdra set).

 

[Talpr0ne]

Super Fang+Night Shade Mew is the main treath with Parental Bond, as anything that isn't a Ghost type will have to take 75% damage, or losing 200 HP while switching into Mew. Massive 100/120/120 bulk and reliable recovery in Roost make it also very hard to take down( 252+ Atk Tough Claws Bisharp-Aerodactylite Knock Off vs. 252 HP / 104+ Def Mew-Kangaskhanite: 252-296 (62.3 - 73.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO; 252+ Atk Huge Power Diggersby-Medichamite Return vs. 252 HP / 104+ Def Mew-Kangaskhanite: 211-250 (52.2 - 61.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO ). If that's not your thing, welp, I can't help but suggest you to look at titans such as Parental Bond everything offensive. Seriously there is a reason why Parental Bond is a default ban on any meta that allows free ability choice, and not only this meta allows you to use Parental Bond, but it also comes with pretty epic stats increases.

 

[Neverman]

Archeops with Red Orb goes to 75/170/85/162/65/110, trades its Flying type and Defeatist ability for Fire type and Desolate Land for a STABed + Weather boosted Heat Wave. With Atk 170 i guess it's suicide to use Head Smash, so Stone Edge would be better, but who knows?

Escavalier with Blue Orb goes to 70/185/105/90/125/20 nullifying his only weakness. STABed Iron Head and Megahorn coming from a 185 attack must hurt, unfortunately that +30 SpAtk is wasted with it. If you want U-Turn then use Scizor instead.

Kyurem with Pidgeonite gains +65 on SpAtk (turning that 130 into a beatiful 195), gains +5 on Def and +10 on SpDef resulting into a decent bulk (HP 125/Def 95/SpDef 100), +20 Speed for a nice 115 stat, and finally No Guard so it will never miss Blizzard, Focus Miss and Stone Miss.

Rampardos with Diancite becomes a fast glass cannon (with Atk 225/Speed 118 and a wasted 125 SpAtk, or maybe not so wasted if we take in consideration it has stuff like Dragon Pulse and Fire Blast lol), so glassy that it has HP 97/Def 20/SpDef 10. MewtwoniteX gives it 20 more points in Attack and Fighting type, but no Speed, so it could be easily outspeeded and taken care of. Lopunnite could be a middle-term between Diance's and Mewtwo's Stones.

No more ideas right now.

 

[Ghoul King]

An example of a Kangaskhanite Pokemon who breaks the meta? Let's look at one

Victini @ Kangaskhanite
Abillity: Victory Star
4 Def / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- V-Create
- Bolt Strike
- Zen Headbutt / U-Turn
- Power-Up Punch

100/130/120/120/120/110

Do I even need to explain how this is broken? Well I guess I do. This thing is increadibly broken and anybody should be able to see that, great 100/120/120 bulk, access to the nitorious Power-Up Punch boosting move, making this pretty much a Swords Dance with 75 BP, and access to one of the most frieghting things I have ever seen, Parental Bond V-Create, now even before considering STAB this attack has a grand total of 270 BP, which is absolutly insane, I really don't see how this isn't broken

It can also run a special set if it wants too

Victini @ Kangaskhanite
Abillity: Victory Star
4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Blue Flare
- Psyshock
- Glaciate / Energy Ball
- Charge Beam

First and foremost, it has no priority and will be outsped by lots of things. Ever notice that V-Create Victini is always Scarfed? Notice that this can't be Scarfed? Notice that it has to exist alongside Scarfed Kyogre Blue Orb anything able to freely switch in on its V-Create? (In particular, Orbs activate immediately, the end, and therefore there's no question of whether you've already Mega Evolved or not) Etc?

Not even getting into all the Sucker Punchers that will kill it effortlessly. And Aqua Jetters. And Shadow Sneakers.

Picking out something with a powerful move and then going "lol Parental Bond is broken with this" does not an argument make.

And, of course, you provided no calcs. Lemme provide some.

252+ Atk Parental Bond Kangaskhanite Victini V-create vs. 0 HP / 252 Def Sablenite Blissey: 522-616 (80.1 - 94.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Oh look it can't even OHKO Sablenite Blissey. Now, of course, one might argue that it will just get the job done next turn, and that's that, but, uh, you've halved all your defensive stats. And your Speed. And Blue Orb will still block your primary attack entirely. But wait, there's that Special se

252+ SpA Parental Bond Kangaskhanite Victini Blue Flare vs. 0 HP / 252+ SpD Sablenite Blissey: 153-180 (23.5 - 27.6%) -- 71.6% chance to 4HKO

-oh. This is the same Blissey, by the by. Seismic Toss is a 4HKO, and it can just Softboiled every other time. And Sablenite Blissey isn't going to be acting as a Physical wall anyway. Let's go find a real Physical wall.

252+ Atk Parental Bond Kangaskhanite. Victini V-create vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Giratina: 153-181 (30.4 - 35.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

Whoo. So lethal. This is a 4HKO on a standard Ubers Giratina.

0 Atk Giratina Dragon Tail vs. -2 0 HP / 0 Def Kangaskhanite Victini: 111-132 (32.5 - 38.7%) -- 98.6% chance to 3HKO

OUCH. Giratina can 3HKO you back with friggin' Dragon Tail, no hazards, because you used V-Create once.

But wait, you have other moves!

252+ Atk Parental Bond Kangaskhanite Victini Zen Headbutt vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Giratina: 139-163 (27.6 - 32.4%) -- 64.1% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

Never mind, this is weaker than V-Create. But surely, the Special set's access to Glaciate will sav

252+ SpA Parental Bond Kangaskhanite Victini Glaciate vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Giratina: 189-225 (37.5 - 44.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Nope.

0 SpA Giratina Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Kangaskhanite Victini: 150-176 (43.9 - 51.6%) -- 7.8% chance to 2HKO

Hah. This will leave you with a sliver of health if you V-Created as it came in. Or OHKO you sometimes.

Now how about a real Physical wall?

252+ Atk Parental Bond Kangaskhanite Victini V-create vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Sablenite Gastrodon: 154-183 (36.1 - 42.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Not happening. And as with the earlier calc, Zen Headbutt is weaker.

0 SpA Sablenite Gastrodon Earth Power vs. -2 0 HP / 0 SpD Kangaskhanite Victini: 338-398 (99.1 - 116.7%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO

So basically Sablenite Gastrodon can switch in on Kangaskhanite Victini, and then kill it if it was stupid enough to use V-Create. In fact, even if it hasn't Mega Evolved yet

252+ Atk Parental Bond Kangaskhanite Victini V-create vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gastrodon: 220-261 (51.6 - 61.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

it can still switch in, survive, and then have good odds of surviving the follow-up hit while it Mega Evolves and Recovers. Seriously.

And I'm not even going to the "complete jackass" direction of grabbing random Blue Orb users. Actually, let's go for a possible 'generic offense' choice.

-1 252+ Atk Parental Bond Kangaskhanite Victini Bolt Strike vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Charizardite X Gyarados: 141-166 (42.5 - 50.1%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO

This is as good as it gets, by the way. Zen Headbutt is weaker, and of course V-Create is even weaker because Water/Dragon typing. Meanwhile

252+ Atk Tough Claws Charizardite X Gyarados Waterfall vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Kangaskhanite Victini: 402-474 (117.8 - 139%) -- guaranteed OHKO

it effortlessly destroys Victini. And this is probably a Dragon Dancer set, so odds are good that it sets up in your face (Or while you switch) and then goes on a rampage.

Seriously. If you can't be bothered to perform any calculations of things possible in the meta, don't go around claiming "This is obviously broken!" You have zero basis for this claim.

You might as well go to the Ubers people and tell them they're crazy to have Mega Kangaskhan legal in it. Really?

Super Fang+Night Shade Mew is the main treath with Parental Bond, as anything that isn't a Ghost type will have to take 75% damage, or losing 200 HP while switching into Mew. Massive 100/120/120 bulk and reliable recovery in Roost make it also very hard to take down( 252+ Atk Tough Claws Bisharp-Aerodactylite Knock Off vs. 252 HP / 104+ Def Mew-Kangaskhanite: 252-296 (62.3 - 73.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO; 252+ Atk Huge Power Diggersby-Medichamite Return vs. 252 HP / 104+ Def Mew-Kangaskhanite: 211-250 (52.2 - 61.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO ). If that's not your thing, welp, I can't help but suggest you to look at titans such as Parental Bond everything offensive. Seriously there is a reason why Parental Bond is a default ban on any meta that allows free ability choice, and not only this meta allows you to use Parental Bond, but it also comes with pretty epic stats increases.

The argument that Parental Bond is banned from the likes of AAA is completely meaningless. Parental Bond is banned from AAA in no small part because it renders so many other Ability picks irrelevant -that's not the same thing as saying that Kangaskhanite is broken. It isn't even the same thing as saying Kangaskhanite renders most other Stones irrelevant -it doesn't. The only Mega Stones that genuinely seem questionable because of Kangaskhanite are...

-Sharpedonite, which has the same Speed increase, an overall similar stat spread, and a much more limited Ability.

-oh wait I'm done

Oh no. Unbanning one Mega Stone might make one Mega Stone a non-pick. Net variety change: 0. How terrible. Please note that Sharpedonite is going to be an extremely niche pick regardless, since so few Pokemon have any use for Strong Jaw.

You're also looking at the wrong place for finding an offensive monster to kill Kangaskhanite Mew.

252+ SpA Life Orb Dark Aura Yveltal Dark Pulse vs. Kangaskhanite 252 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 432-510 (106.9 - 126.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Oh look. A standard Yveltal set OHKOs the Kangaskhanite Mew you're using. Meanwhile, committed Physical Yveltal produces this:

252+ Atk Life Orb Dark Aura Yveltal Sucker Punch vs. 252 HP / 104+ Def Kangaskhanite Mew: 359-424 (88.8 - 104.9%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO

Note that Banded Yveltal actually happens and turns this into a for-sure OHKO.

Frankly, I won't be surprised if Mew is broken with Mega Stones in general, due to its solid stats, huge movepool, and resultant unpredictability. (Since it can run tons of Mega Stones viably) Saying Kangaskhanite Mew is broken (Which I'm not even convinced by anyway) runs into the question: is non-Kangaskhanite Mew not broken? Which we don't actually know yet, and probably won't know until the meta is actually being played.

Getting tired of people arguing that "of course Kangaskhanite is broken" and completely failing to adequately back their position. If it's so obvious that it's broken, it should be easy to prove. (Just showing that it destroys the Ubers meta would at least be suggestive, and people are failing to do even that!) Where's this easy proof?

 

[canno]

Just saying that Giratina is going to have a hard time actually getting that Dragon Tail off since Zen Headbutt flinches around a 50% chance to flinch (I'm too lazy and bad to calculate the actual flinch rate taking account miss chance and the fact its 2 Zen Headbutts but I think it should land around 50%). Not saying that PB Victini is borked, but that is something to look into.

Something that interest me though is how Mewtwonite X is suspected when the almost 100% superior Lopunnite goes off completely scot free. Sure its a whole 20 stat points difference in Attack, but Lopunnite also grants a +30 to speed and a very useful ability in Scrappy. Let's see the example given in the OP

Mewtwonite X Landorus-Therian:
Ground/Flying -> Ground/Fighting
Intimidate -> Steadfast
89/225/100/105/90/91

Now lets compare it to Lopunnite Lando

Lopunnite Landorus-Therian:
Ground/Flying -> Ground/Fighting
Intimidate -> Scrappy
89/205/100/105/80/121

So in exchange for a slight power nerf, you get a blistering 121 speed (vs the old 91) and an ability that's actually useful. This isn't even the best mon to do either stone with btw. Lets look at something slightly better

Mewtwonite X Staraptor
Normal/Flying -> Normal/Fighting (rip Flying/Fighting ;( )
Intimidate -> Steadfast
85/200/80/50/70/100

vs

Lopunnite Staraptor
Normal/Flying -> Normal/Fighting
Intimidate -> Scrappy
85/180/80/50/60/130

I don't know about you, but the latter seems a lot more appealing than the top one. 100 speed is not that great, especially in a meta where things get Speed Boosts, while 130 is actually kind of high even in the meta where things get speed boosts. It also has an ability that's actually good, being able to hit Ghosties with both its STABs - Return and Close Combat.

At the very least I don't see why one is suspected while the other one is basically free.

 

[Da Pizza Man]

Wall of Text

I will admit Victini was a horrible example, but your forgetting completely about one of the most prominent things about Parental Bond, which is that the user is often going to have a +2 boost from Power Up Punch (If Physical) or Charge Beam (If Special), pokemon who use this are not going to be at 0 most likely.

+2 252+ Atk Parental Bond Dragonite Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Multiscale Lugia: 229-270 (55 - 64.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Yeah, this thing can 2HKO a Lugia, now that is some pretty good wallbreaking potential right there, and that is counting in multiscale, so things like this can probably be seen everywhere with that around

 

[Throbulator36]

I will admit Victini was a horrible example, but your forgetting completely about one of the most prominent things about Parental Bond, which is that the user is often going to have a +2 boost from Power Up Punch (If Physical) or Charge Beam (If Special), pokemon who use this are not going to be at 0 most likely.

+2 252+ Atk Parental Bond Dragonite Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Multiscale Lugia: 229-270 (55 - 64.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Yeah, this thing can 2HKO a Lugia, now that is some pretty good wallbreaking potential right there, and that is counting in multiscale, so things like this can probably be seen everywhere with that around

but in a meta with geoxern and altarianite everything outrage is not a move you want to spam. try calcing something else.

 

[Da Pizza Man]

but in a meta with geoxern and altarianite everything outrage is not a move you want to spam. try calcing something else.

Dude, I never said your going to be spamming it (Rayquaza sometimes uses Outrage here), although not a bad idea

+2 252+ Atk Parental Bond Dragonite Dragon Claw vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Multiscale Lugia: 153-180 (36.7 - 43.2%) -- 98.7% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
(This is really a 2HKO when considering Multiscale damage, it can't come in at all, and this is one of the best walls in Ubers)

 

[Ghoul King]

Charge Beam

Non-Uber fully evolved Pokemon that get it...

Absol, Alakazam, Ampharos, Aromatisse, Audino, Aurorus, Azelf, Banette, Beheeyem, Bibarel, Blissey, Bronzong, Celebi, Chimecho, Claydol, Clefable, Cresselia, Dedenne, Delcatty, Drifblim, Druddigon, Dunsparce, Dusknoir, Eelektross, Electivire, Electrode, Emolga, Furfrou, Furret, Gallade, Galvantula, Gardevoir, Girafarig, Golurk, Gothitelle, Gourgeist, Grumpig, Heliolisk, Hydreigon, Illumise, Jirachi, Jolteon, Kecleon, Klinklang, Lanturn, Latias, Latios, Lopunny, Lunatone, Luxray, Magnezone, Manectric, Mawile, Meloetta, Meowstic, Mesprit, Mew, Minun, Mismagius, Mr. Mime, Musharna, Octillery, Pachirisu, Plusle, Porygon-Z, Raichu, Raikou, Raticate, Regice, Regirock, Registeel, Rotom, Sigilyph, Smeargle, Solrock, Stantler, Swoobat, Thundurus, Uxie, Victini, Volbeat, Wigglytuff, Zapdos, and Zebstrika.

Most of these aren't remotely credible Special Attackers by OU standards, or aren't credible by OU standards at all. The ones I can see actually being relevant are...

-Hydreigon. Maybe. Still slow, lacking priority, and quite vulnerable. Keep in mind this is a meta in which Fairy-typed Extreme Speed is going to be a thing. And of course GeoXern is a menace to you.

-Mew, as covered.

-Meloetta. Problematic typing and movepool though.

-Porygon-Z. Actually, I'm joking, because it's slow, can't be Scarfed or Specs, is vulnerable to priority...

-Raikou? Maybe?

-Thundurus. I'm not sure how big a deal this is when it already runs Nasty Plot.

-The Latis? Parental Bond is bad with Draco Meteor though.

-Jirachi? It does credibly approximate Serene Grace... but I honestly think Ampharosite is probably a better deal for it, or maybe Charizardite X. Or Sablenite. A lot of things, really.

Power Up Punch

Same as with Charge Beam...

Aggron, Ambipom, Ampharos, Audino, Azelf, Azumarill, Barbaracle, Beartic, Bisharp, Blastoise, Blaziken, Blissey, Breloom, Cacturne, Charizard, Chesnaught, Clefable, Conkeldurr, Darmanitan, Delibird, Delphox, Diggersby, Dragonite, Druddigon, Dusknoir, Eelektross, Electivire, Emboar, Exploud, Feraligatr, Floatzel, Flygon, Furret, Gallade, Gengar, Golduck, Golem, Golurk, Gothitelle, Granbull, Grumpig, Hariyama, Hawlucha, Heatmor, Hitmonchan, Hitmonlee, Hypno, Illumise, Infernape, Jirachi, Jynx, Kangaskhan, Kecleon, Kricketune, Krookodile, Ledian, Lickilicky, Lopunny, Lucario, Ludicolo, Machamp, Magmortar, Marowak, Mawile, Medicham, Meloetta, Meowstic, Mesprit, Metagross, Mew, Mienshao, Miltank, Mr. Mime, Muk, Nidoking, Nidoqueen, Pangoro, Politoed, Poliwrath, Primeape, Quagsire, Rampardos, Regice, Regirock, Registeel, Reuniclus, Rhyperior, Sableye, Sawk, Sceptile, Scrafty, Seismitoad, Shiftry, Simipour, Simisage, Simisear, Slowking, Smeargle, Snorlax, Spinda, Sudowoodo, Swalot, Swampert, Throh, Toxicroak, Trevenant, Typhlosion, Tyranitar, Ursaring, Uxie, Victini, Volbeat, Watchog, Weavile, Wigglytuff, Zangoose

More variety than Charge Beam, anyway. But what might actually be threatening with it, and out-do Mega Kangaskhan itself? That's an important point -you can still run regular Mega Kangaskhan, it isn't too much for Ubers, and it has an essentially perfect intersection of qualities. What, exactly, is actually scarier and gets Power Up Punch, than Mega Kangaskhan itself?

-Barbaracle. Too slow without a Shell Smash, and why would you run Shell Smash alongside Power Up Punch on a Kangaskhanite variant?

-Bisharp. Definitely scary with Sucker Punch and all, but I don't see why it would even run Power Up Punch when it can try to abuse Defiant triggering, or just Swords Dance up. What, are you expecting Focus Sash in this?

-Dragonite. Probably more threatening running Pinsirite or Salamencite for Aerilate Extreme Speed.

-Mew again, I guess.

-Tyranitar? Maybe? Really slow and better off with Dragon Dance in all probability, honestly...

-Conkeldurr? It at least has priority and a lot of power...

-Mawile. Oh wait, it would rather run Mawilite. Or better yet Medichamite!

-Victini. You've already admitted it's a bad example, and yet it outclasses tons of the things that get Power Up Punch at all.

-Jirachi again, and again I find it questionable.

-... Snorlax? It might make more sense than its Belly Drum set... but it competes with Mega Kangaskhan itself. Yeah, more bulk, but also way slower and with no priority.

-Infernape? It's faster than Kangaskhan, hits harder, has priority, and its typing is an excellent offense typing. It's also more fragile, and Giratina seriously just laughs at it, so maybe not.

... that's all I'm coming up with. I might be underestimating Weavile though.

---

Don't assume everything is mini-Mega Kangaskhan in every respect. They aren't. Assuming they are is baseless and ridiculous. Mega Kangaskhan has an excellent combination of power, Speed tier (And remember: this is an Ubers meta and it's not too much for Ubers), and moveset, and even has utility out of its base species letting it hit on Ghosts that can give its Mega form trouble. Parental Bond =/= the reason it's broken in OU. It's one part of a complete picture, and other Pokemon just do not replicate the whole thing -let alone do so in such a way that they overwhelm the meta completely.

Lopunnite

That's an extremely good point and pins down exactly why it bothers me that Mewtonite X is Suspected already.

 

[Throbulator36]

Dude, I never said your going to be spamming it (Rayquaza sometimes uses Outrage here), although not a bad idea

+2 252+ Atk Parental Bond Dragonite Dragon Claw vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Multiscale Lugia: 153-180 (36.7 - 43.2%) -- 98.7% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
(This is really a 2HKO when considering Multiscale damage, it can't come in at all, and this is one of the best walls in Ubers)

technically its a possible 2HKO but none of this matters if rocks.

 

[mallpal]

Crobat @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly / Naïve Nature
- Brave Bird
- Super Fang
- Taunt
- Roost / Heat Wave

Outspeeds and 2HKOes most of the meta, barring physically defensive base forme Giratina and Aegislash. Also resists Pixilate espeed and is generally pretty hard to murk with uninvested neutral hits. I wouldn't go as far as to call it clearly broken; it's probably not more limiting than some Pidgeotite users. It's pretty damn hard to deal with defensively, though.


252 Atk Parental Bond Crobat Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 144 Def Arceus-Ghost: 211-249 (47.5 - 56%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Parental Bond Crobat Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Zapdos-Sablenite: 81-96 (21 - 25%) -- 0% chance to 4HKO (enough to kill if it switches into super fang with rocks up)

252 Atk Adaptability Mamoswine-Lucarionite Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Crobat: 212-252 (68.1 - 81%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Parental Bond Crobat Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mamoswine: 283-334 (78.8 - 93%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock (this may look unimpressive, but keep in mind that's 110/98 bulk. this matchup is admittedly shaky but bat can still pull it out in a pinch)

 

[jordanthejq12]

A perfect example of Kangaskhanite something that is merely lethal, not broken. Granted, it's Crobat, so it's not like we're talking Archeops or something. Remember that you only get one Kangaskhanite on your team. And one Pidgeotite (Victini says "Pick me! Pick me!"), so use them wisely.

 

[Ghoul King]

I also meant to add two other points, but was pressed for time yesterday.

Kangaskhanite's "epic" stat boosts

Kangaskhanite has one of the more poorly distributed Mega stat boosts, actually, and unlike some Megas it doesn't cheat and effectively provide more than 100 BST by stealing from irrelevant stats.

Assume Power Up Punch/Charge Beam=+2

In addition to what I already covered, it's extremely questionable to assert that we should assume that Power Up Punch=+2 Attack when one of the primary walls of Ubers is a Ghost type, not to mention Mega Gengar is a thing. And Aegislash. Charge Beam meanwhile is actually an approximately 44% chance of being +2 after use, between its chance to miss and mere 70% trigger chance per hit, so it's not reasonable to just assume Charge Beam provides a +2, and regardless it is basically impossible to combine Charge Beam with priority, since Vacuum Wave is it for Special priority, so unless your Charge Beam Kangaskhanite abuser is lightning fast it's all too possible to switch in something fragile and fast and proceed to kill the Kangaskhanite user. By the way, the fastest Charge Beam users are all questionable combatants -the actually competent ones all hover around 100 or so Speed, which is not that good even after Kangaskhanite in this meta.

Crobat @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly / Naïve Nature
- Brave Bird
- Super Fang
- Taunt
- Roost / Heat Wave

Outspeeds and 2HKOes most of the meta, barring physically defensive base forme Giratina and Aegislash. Also resists Pixilate espeed and is generally pretty hard to murk with uninvested neutral hits. I wouldn't go as far as to call it clearly broken; it's probably not more limiting than some Pidgeotite users. It's pretty damn hard to deal with defensively, though.


252 Atk Parental Bond Crobat Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 144 Def Arceus-Ghost: 211-249 (47.5 - 56%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Parental Bond Crobat Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Zapdos-Sablenite: 81-96 (21 - 25%) -- 0% chance to 4HKO (enough to kill if it switches into super fang with rocks up)

252 Atk Adaptability Mamoswine-Lucarionite Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Crobat: 212-252 (68.1 - 81%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Parental Bond Crobat Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mamoswine: 283-334 (78.8 - 93%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock (this may look unimpressive, but keep in mind that's 110/98 bulk. this matchup is admittedly shaky but bat can still pull it out in a pinch)

I'd assume that Mamoswine is running Scizorite or possibly Heracronite over Lucarionite, and in any event Scizorite is both a bigger boost to Ice Shard's damage even with less Attack and a bigger boost to both Defense and Special Defense. At that point Mamoswine comes out much more consistently ahead. (It also probably makes more sense for it to run bulky Adamant at that point, which swings things much more strongly in its favor)

Crobat is also vulnerable to Refrigerate Extreme Speed -Glalite Lucario/Entei/Arcanine/Zygarde/Dragonite may all have value for countering stuff like Landorus-Therian, at which point poor Crobat is getting caught in the crossfire. (Entei is generally preferred to Arcanine, except that Arcanine gets Morning Sun where Entei normally relies on Leftovers to keep its health up, which it can't do if it's holding a Mega Stone. Plus Arcanine's Intimidate is actually useful on the switch-in, not so much Entei's Pressure) It also doesn't resist Aerilate, so something like Pinsirite/Salamencite Dragonite might murder it off raw firepower. But cool thing regardless.

----

So some other thoughts I've been having...

-Altarianite Dragonite is honestly probably superior to Salamencite/Pinsirite Dragonite, going from the problematic Dragon/Flying typing to the very, very good Dragon/Fairy typing, still gaining STAB Extreme Speed, and being able to get the benefits of both ends to a degree ie switching in on Spikes harmlessly and then Mega-ing up.

-Bisharp is Dark/Steel, which means that it retains Sucker Punch STAB when changing types through a Stone. Good news for it! Mind, Pinsirite Bisharp probably wishes it got the awesome Steel/Flying defensive typing, but oh well.

-Slowbronite/Sablenite Cresselia looks awesome. I'm more interested in Sablenite Cresselia for the Toxic immunity, Roar immunity (Unfortunately Parting SHot can still be using to push it out), etc, but even so.

-I anticipate a lot of weird, surprising Banettite users. 50 Attack is a lot (Yeah other stones provide Abilities that boost offense, I know), and its the only Prankster source out of all Mega Stones. For instance Pangoro becomes this meta's STABmons Sableye when given Banettite, being able to priority Parting Shot after the first turn, while having an impressive 174 Attack to hit things with. That's actually really cool.

-Landorus-Therian can do a lot of interesting things, like run Manectite for double-Intimidate, Sablenite for wallin' and Will O Wisp immunity, Diancite to produce a lightning-fast attacker that's, again, immune to Will O Wisp, etc...

-Cameruptite (Sablenite is not a valid choice because 30-30=0) Reuniculus looks interesting, being able to set Trick Room with a base Speed of 10, 155 Special Attack backed by Sheer Force, and excellent bulk and recovery.

-Rampardos looks like an interesting Diancite user. I mean, it dies the instant anything sneezes on it, lacks priority, and in general is basically going to have to pull a Beedrill to get going (Protect on the first turn), but once it's Mega Evolved it has 118 Speed (Which pulls ahead of a lot of the "Kangaskhanite threats", many of whom also lack priority) and 225 Attack. With STAB Head Smash. Note that this is comparable to Mega Medicham's High Jump Kick, only you're faster and Head Smash is arguably a better type than High Jump Kick.

-Manaphy looks like an even scarier Diancie user, if you can clear out the enemy priority. Tail Glow and Mega Evolve (Or Tail Glow without Mega Evolving to hold onto your solid defenses first turn? Depends on what you expect your opponent to do) and then just murder everything off 160 Special Attack, at 160 Speed, with +3 to your Special Attack.

-Diancite Bisharp also looks really really scary. 185 Attack, Sucker Punch, immune to Will O Wisp, base Speed of 130... trigger Defiant and go to town.

-Diancite Victinie! Awesome offenses and Speed, able to U-Turn out of a bad situation for obnoxious damage, doesn't double-trigger V-Create and in fact will outspeed a depressing portion of the meta even at -1 Speed... yikes.

... Diancite is kinda scary, actually poking around. It's arguably worse than Mewtonite X about "sweeper in a can", due to the ridiculous Speed boost, not even getting into the potential for mixed attackers! And Magic Bounce is A: actually a good Ability and B: blocks a lot of effects that normally get used to interfere with such a sweep. Actually, Diancite Sucker Punch users are, in general, really nasty -if you use a Status move, it better be self-targeted or else it will backfire. If you attack, they kill you. Ouch.