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Spe-Neutrality
- Thread starter Sun King
- Start date
252 Atk Mega Lopunny Focus Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Machamp: 211-249 (54.9 - 64.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Machamp can't switch into Lopunny's own Focus Punch under any circumstances. It is a check, though.
Honestly, Trick Room is the best Mega Lopunny counter. Most Trick Room sweepers plow right through it.
After looking at Focus Punch's distribution, I'm going to agree here. The least restrictive option would be to ban Focus Punch. M-Luke is something I can see dropping due to a loss of priority, and I'm not letting Focus Punch be the one thing that pushes it over the edge (300BP Focus Punch O_O what). Other notable things would be CharX, M-Lop, and either form of Blaziken. It's entirely possible that Blaze could stay banned though, as Speed Boost + Baton Pass will be one of the metagame's most irritating strategies.
Here's my list of likely initial bans:
-Mega Gyarados
-Haxorus
-Focus Punch
Here are a few things I'll keep a very close eye on:
-M-Aerodactyl
-Rampardos
-M-Lopunny
-Whirlwind
-Speed Boost + Baton Pass
I mention Whirlwind and not Roar because Roar can also be blocked by Soundproof, and I see no reason why we shouldn't create a new niche in Roar-Blocking. Dragon Tail and Circle Throw aren't mentioned either because there are entire types that are immune to them.
Likely drops from Ubers:
-M-Lucario
-Aegislash
-M-Mawile
Here's my list of likely initial bans:
-Mega Gyarados
-Haxorus
-Focus Punch
Here are a few things I'll keep a very close eye on:
-M-Aerodactyl
-Rampardos
-M-Lopunny
-Whirlwind
-Speed Boost + Baton Pass
I mention Whirlwind and not Roar because Roar can also be blocked by Soundproof, and I see no reason why we shouldn't create a new niche in Roar-Blocking. Dragon Tail and Circle Throw aren't mentioned either because there are entire types that are immune to them.
Likely drops from Ubers:
-M-Lucario
-Aegislash
-M-Mawile
Not to go extremely ban-happy here, but any particular reason as to why you're considering Aero but not Zam? Zam has ridiculous power and is literally the fastest thing in the game barring scarves; the only thing really keeping it in check iirc was priority.
Aero has Whirlwind, which would easily make it centralizing unless every other team has Mega Sableye. Aero could shuffle pretty much anything that can take a hit and then finish it off when it's racked up enough residual damage.
The OP says everything. All priority is set at Stage 0. Nothing can increase or decrease this--not Prankster or Gale Wings
Withdrawal is based on speed.
I don't understand the problem here. All priority is removed completely; these are just decided by speed tiers like any normal move.
edit: the ninjas
Priority has nothing to do with it's being broken and what you're suggesting is just broken checking broken. If anything priority Brave Bird doesn't exist so that's one more thing it doesn't have to worry about trapping.
Diggersby @ Life Orb
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Agility
- Return
- Earthquake
- Knock Off
How do you deal with this? Insane Attack with Life Orb and Agility. Good coverage too.
Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Flare Blitz/Iron Tail
- Dragon Tail
- Focus Punch
DD + STAB Tough Claws Dragon Tail means that it will hurt a lot AND force switches. Focus Punch with Tough Claws is 200 BP non drawback fighting move that will shit on Heatrans. Also Flare Blitz that destroy almost anything, though you can use Iron Tail to say "FK YOU FAIRIES THAT ABSORB MY DRAGON TAIL."
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Agility
- Return
- Earthquake
- Knock Off
How do you deal with this? Insane Attack with Life Orb and Agility. Good coverage too.
Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Flare Blitz/Iron Tail
- Dragon Tail
- Focus Punch
DD + STAB Tough Claws Dragon Tail means that it will hurt a lot AND force switches. Focus Punch with Tough Claws is 200 BP non drawback fighting move that will shit on Heatrans. Also Flare Blitz that destroy almost anything, though you can use Iron Tail to say "FK YOU FAIRIES THAT ABSORB MY DRAGON TAIL."
I can: All of the Soundproof 'mons are bad. Of them, literally only Exploud is viable in its own right, and no good team is going to toss an Exploud on just for the sake of blocking Roar. Using Exploud, or any other Soundproof user, is basically a liability because you're not using something more versatile or powerful.
I see no reason to allow broken because it's countered by bad.
Let me spell it out in plainer English for everyone: I plan on phasing being a major part of the metagame.
This OM is not going to work like OU minus priority. The entire reason I said it was OU based was because the speed tiers in OU are nicely balanced (for the most part). If you do not want to prepare for shuffling, then you probably won't do very well in this metagame. I think it adds a fun component and requires a hell of a lot better counterplay. Don't want your team weakened? Then carry speed and preserve your fast threats. Or you could just slap M-Sableye + Magic Guard Clefable on your team and now you have an anti shuffling core. Does this limit team building? Maybe. Maybe not. We're literally theorymonning right now, so there's no clear "right answer". As it stands, you can deal with shuffling, or you can not play the meta.
This OM is not going to work like OU minus priority. The entire reason I said it was OU based was because the speed tiers in OU are nicely balanced (for the most part). If you do not want to prepare for shuffling, then you probably won't do very well in this metagame. I think it adds a fun component and requires a hell of a lot better counterplay. Don't want your team weakened? Then carry speed and preserve your fast threats. Or you could just slap M-Sableye + Magic Guard Clefable on your team and now you have an anti shuffling core. Does this limit team building? Maybe. Maybe not. We're literally theorymonning right now, so there's no clear "right answer". As it stands, you can deal with shuffling, or you can not play the meta.
If everything is banned, then what is going to be the difference between this and OU? This isn't OU, as said above. Has anyone even played a match yet? You people haven't played a single battle and want to ban already.
I've said this in numerous metas. Don't even suspect anything until it's actually tested out. Phazing might definitely be centralizing, but you never know, something more weird like Sticky Web and/or Thunder Wave might become even more centralizing. Theorymon sets and mons, not possible bans.
I realized something today.
You speed tie yourself when you megavolve. This basically means that most megas are outclassed by their base forms/are shit.
Also, Suction Cups is a viable way to stop phasing since you can still switch out(inb4 Haxorus) though if you're using offense you're stuck with either malamar or octillery.
You speed tie yourself when you megavolve. This basically means that most megas are outclassed by their base forms/are shit.
Also, Suction Cups is a viable way to stop phasing since you can still switch out(inb4 Haxorus) though if you're using offense you're stuck with either malamar or octillery.
What? A Mega's base speed isn't determined by priority, and I have no idea how this correlates to being outclassed or horrible.
megavolving has a priority of +5 in standard(hence why it happens after switching but before everything else(you can prankster protect whimsi to get above it tho)) but here it has a priority of 0 which means it goes by your base speed. since your base speed is the same as itself you have a chance of moving before megavolving.
I'm not entirely sure about that, as the priority thing seems to apply to moves and abilities.
But that said, would mechanics be altered such as Mega Evolving and Priority, Sun King ? And by the same standard, would Pursuit still work the way it does?
Lcass4919
The Xatu Warrior
mega evolution is actually based on priority (same with switching, pursuit on switching poke, and focus punches initial charge) lel, mega aero best pursuit trapper y/y
well, at least, from what bulbapedia says. dont hold me to this.
I'm pretty sure this is only meant to affect moves. Mega Evolving and switching are not affected.
Pursuit and Focus Punch are moves, so they are affected.
Pursuit and Focus Punch are moves, so they are affected.
Lcass4919
The Xatu Warrior
yea i was just about to edit my post with that, it says on the first sentence "all moves with priority become 0"