np: ORAS OU Suspect Process, Round 3 - Ghosts [Giratina-O remains in Ubers - check the OP]

[Lok'tar]

252 Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Explosion vs. 0 HP / 248 Def Giratina-O: 794-936 (180 - 212.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

+1 192+ Atk Pixilate Mega Altaria Return vs. 0 HP / 248 Def Giratina-O: 480-566 (108.8 - 128.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Life Orb Teravolt Kyurem-B Outrage vs. 0 HP / 248 Def Giratina-O: 546-642 (123.8 - 145.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Mold Breaker Rampardos Head Smash vs. 0 HP / 248 Def Giratina-O: 382-450 (86.6 - 102%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

252+ Atk Choice Band Huge Power Azumarill Play Rough vs. 0 HP / 248 Def Giratina-O: 422-500 (95.6 - 113.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

+2 252+ Atk Bisharp Sucker Punch vs. 0 HP / 248 Def Giratina-O: 440-522 (99.7 - 118.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

As you can see, OU is full of Pokemon that deal with Giratina-O and it's walling capabilities against other Pokemon will be a great addition to OU, stopping some of the more OP threats such as Beedrill and Gallade.

Just by demonstrating Pokemon X beat Pokemon Y, you cannot come to the conclusion that pokemon Y is not broken. IMO, there are also problems with your calc. For example, CUBE does not run Outrage that often. Giratina-O has willo, so bisharp cannot get that sucker punch, and a +2 knock off won't KO. Rampardos, I am pretty sure is not relevant in the Ou meta.

 

[Magcargo]

Giratina-O + Hazards is looking to be extremely dangerous in the metagame. Giratina-O pretty much plows through nearly every defog user + rapid spinner in the tier and its ridiculous bulk means that it can just sit there and spam D-Tail to weaken the opponent's team. Only a handful of Pokemon can check it as well, as Shadow force / Shadow Sneak can destroy nearly every fairy-type in the tier (Shadow force can force even more switches as well), while Dark- and Steel-types like TTar and Bisharp can be crippled with Wisp. Once Tina has weakend the team with D-Tail, a cleaner like Mega Lopunny can easily plow through the opponent's weakened team. I've been using Giratina-O with a bunch of hazard setters and a couple of cleaners on the ladder and the team has not disappointed me at all.

 

[Enki]

Ironically though, Giratina-o is the best defogger in the tier, able to take out Bisharp with Aura Sphere/wow, while being extremely bulky, also Giratina has troubles against Latios, being slower and ohkoed by Draco Meteor, and Shadow Sneak does not ohko even after SR and Sand damage.

 

[astroboy]

imo if you're gonna run CM-resttalk gira, this is the set to use

Giratina-Origin @ Griseous Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 116 Def / 68 SpA / 228 SpD / 96 Spe
Bold Nature
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Shadow Ball
- Calm Mind
the spread lets you avoid the 2hko from adamant LO bisharp's knock off, while being able to outspeed it and kill it with aura sphere. 228 spdef evs lets you avoid the 2hko from LO gengar's shadow ball at +1 and never being able to OHKO after two rounds of rocks. rest in sp.a so your shadow balls are a little stronger, but whatever.

 

[havokchomp123]

imo if you're gonna run CM-resttalk gira, this is the set to use

Giratina-Origin @ Griseous Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 116 Def / 68 SpA / 228 SpD / 96 Spe
Bold Nature
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Shadow Ball
- Aura Sphere / Dragon Tail
the spread lets you avoid the 2hko from adamant LO bisharp's knock off, while being able to outspeed it and kill it with aura sphere. 228 spdef evs lets you avoid the 2hko from LO gengar's shadow ball at +1 and never being able to OHKO after two rounds of rocks. rest in sp.a so your shadow balls are a little stronger, but whatever. dragon tail is another option you could opt for over aura sphere to shuffle things out and rack up hazard damage, but aura sphere is generally preferred because of the perfect neutral coverage it provides. dragon tail also leaves you walled by THE LORD AUDINO

u forgot to put calm mind on the set.

 

[astroboy]

u forgot to put calm mind on the set.

oh lol. and yeah resttalk isn't particularly good but its a great wincon for stall, kinda like a way bulkier m-sable

 

[Master B8s]

No, because Giratina-Origin can't be Giratini-Origin without a Griseous Orb, just like a Mega Metagross can't be a Mega Metagross without a Metagrossite. It's not like we are only allowing Giratina-Origin + Griseous Orb, we are just only allowing Giratina-Origin, which can only be played with a Griseous Orb

We don't ban mega Pokemon; we ban the mega stones.

Edit: There is a difference between mega evolutions and Giratina-O. Mega forms need their mega stones because cartridge mechanics require that. There is no cartridge mechanic that forces Giratina to hold a Griseous Orb. In this case, it is like we are forcing a Pokemon to hold a mega stone because we think its base form is broken.

I'm just gonna leave this quote here from another reply I got because if it falls under cartridge mechanics then it might be messing with the coding
Again sorry If this is derailing feel free to delete my posts anytime

 

[Heroic Troller]

Giratina can use: Shadow Force, Shadow Ball, Calm Mind, Draco Meteor, Shadow Sneak, Thunderbolt/Thunder, Aura Sphere, Dragon Tail, RestTalk+Will-O-Wisp, Iron Head, Earthquake/Power, Hone Claws+Dragon Rush+Shadow Sneak with

150 hp
120 atk
100 def
120 satk
100 def
90 spe

Wish and Heal Bell can heal it infiinity times (can enter on every move, resist and take the Wish, 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Giratina-O: 213-252 (48.2 - 57.1%) -- 91.4% chance to 2HKO for example and it is 0 hp 0 def....), not broken uhm? Have too many sets, reminds me of something(Mega Lucario) because "it is special or physical?" and Giratina is "it is defensive or offensive?"

 

[ChinChinLives]

Honestly if this test goes through, I'd like to see Shaymin-S retested, The Relationship of Shaymin-S and Giratina-o is like the buffed up version of the relationship of Mega Pidgeot and Mega Aerodactyl in UU. Shaymin-s is hard checked/ soft countered by Giratina and Pidgeot is hard checked/ soft countered by Aerodactyl. Aerodactyl can revenge Pidgeot with ease, while it isn't revenged with ease (flinches) Giratina can easily stomach 2 hits then retaliate with a Griseous orb Draco. The re-introduction of Shaymin would not cause over centralization because it's easily checked by Talonflame, Thunderus, Tornadus, Weavile, Scarf Rachi, Mamowine and Zard Y.

 

[Chanman027]

I'm actually excited I see what Giratina-O has to bring to the OU table. I think the tier needed a reboot. I'll admit, at first I was scared as hell and my first thought was "crap OU just broke" but I think it'll make older Pokemon that have fallen in usage be used more. I'm excited for this change and I'm already ready to find the checks and counters to this thing

 

[DylanTubularK]

After having tested Giratina-O, I can say it's kind of... Well, it's strong. It hits incredibly hard, that's for sure. I found myself having to Double on it multiple times just to check all the coverage the other player was running. However, it's also worn down incredibly quickly. I was running a MegaMan team, and most of the time, my opponents only check to MegaMan was Gira-O, and as long as I kept bringing MegaMan in and using HP Ice then Volt Switch, Gira-O would get worn down fairly quickly so that I could eventually kill it with even a resisted hit. Sure, this can be remedied by using Pain Split, but Gira-O already suffers from pretty bad 4MSS, and running Pain Split prevents it from running more offensive moves, Will-O, Defog, or any of it's many possible moves.
I feel a kind of Aegislash and Greninja vibe from Gira-O, but toned down in both aspects. Aegis in that it's incredibly annoying to deal with due to its ability to take on Special Attackers while also crippling Physical attackers via Kings Shield or Will-O, and Greninja in that it can run such a variety of moves that it's hard to wall it with just one Pokemon.
However, that being said, I believe Gira-O has a bunch of ups, and quite a few downs as well. I believe that, if Gira-O is left in the tier, the metagame will naturally shift around Gira-O, which is in some ways bad, and in some ways good.
Many people complain about the metagame as it is, being so matchup based, and having too many Pokemon to prepare for. Gira-O acts as a check to many Pokemon that people find troublesome to check in the metagame, which helps Balance and Stall compete in this currently heavily offensive metagame. However, Isn't Giratina-O also one more Pokemon you're going to need a check for? I'm not sure where I stand on ban or not ban yet, and I'm definitely going to be laddering more with Gira-O to see how I feel about it, but that's my thoughts so far.

 

[toshimelonhead]

Honestly if this test goes through, I'd like to see Shaymin-S retested, The Relationship of Shaymin-S and Giratina-o is like the buffed up version of the relationship of Mega Pidgeot and Mega Aerodactyl in UU. Shaymin-s is hard checked/ soft countered by Giratina and Pidgeot is hard checked/ soft countered by Aerodactyl. Aerodactyl can revenge Pidgeot with ease, while it isn't revenged with ease (flinches) Giratina can easily stomach 2 hits then retaliate with a Griseous orb Draco. The re-introduction of Shaymin would not cause over centralization because it's easily checked by Talonflame, Thunderus, Tornadus, Weavile, Scarf Rachi, Mamowine and Zard Y.

I would prefer to not have to deal with the endless barrage of Serene Grace Air Slash flinches, thank you very much. That is for another day, though, let's focus on Giratina-O only before wetting our collective pants on every potential mon we can bring down to OU.

 

[SpecsHaxorus]

I have pretty mixed feelings about Giratina-O in OU. On one hand it has no reliable recovery and a mediocre speed, so it is prone to being worn down, revenge killed and needs team support to wall or sweep consistently. On the other hand it has very good typing, a great move pool on the physical and special side and physically defensive sets can tank hits almost as well as Hippowdon.
252 Atk Life Orb Garchomp Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Giratina-O: 369-437 (73.2 - 86.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Knock Off vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Giratina-O: 424-502 (84.1 - 99.6%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock.

I could see a sub calm mind/rest talk set being very dangerous in OU thanks to it's three immunities and six resistances giving it tons of switch in and setup opportunities .
Giratina-Origin @ Griseous Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute/Rest
- Calm Mind
- Shadow Ball
- Aura Sphere/Will-o-wisp/Sleep Talk


Honestly this set is really self explanatory, Sub helps avoid status and eases prediction, rest to regain health, Shadow Ball is your extremely spammable STAB move, Aura Sphere for perfect coverage, will-o-wisp to cripple switch ins or Sleep talk to not be a sitting duck while Giratina is asleep. I honestly see Giratina creating more problems in the metagame than it will solve, but hey I'm a very defensive oriented player so Giratina would be a welcome addition to my team.

 

[Lord Outrage]

lol Giratina-O getting suspected,,,hope this is joke.This will become the primal Groudon of OU and as Ubers players who know the true power of giratina-O good luck to everybody who wants to play the suspect ladder.If it has the right coverage move to your so called check you lose.That's basically primal groudon shit and would be fun to see ou turning into a mini ubers.Also prepare to see many good pokemons become unviable and all teams looking the same.

 

[Gary]

On another note, while it's true that Giratina-O has a few counters, most of them are by no means 100% reliable. Giratina just has so many options to work with that it's bound to have a move that can deal with nearly all of its switch-ins. While it can't obviously run all of them, it can still run shit like Iron Tail to bop Clefable, Mega Altaria, and Mega Diancie on the switch, Thunder to 2HKO Mandibuzz and SpD Skarmoy on the switch as well as almost OHKOing Azumarill after SR, Aura Sphere or EQ to deal heavy damage to Heatran, Bisharp, and Tyranitar. Wisp also hurts a lot of Pokemon on the switch in general, and the combination of spamming its STAB moves + residual from Wisp and potentially hazards keeps shit from being able to switch-in multiple times. It's practically the same case for Landorus or the previously banned Greninja as well; both of them have a few switch-ins, but none of them are THAT reliable considering Lando and Ninja most likely had a move to deal with said threats, but didn't always have to run them.

252+ SpA Giratina-O Thunder vs. 248 HP / 108 SpD Mandibuzz: 232-274 (54.8 - 64.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Giratina-O Thunder vs. 212 HP / 0 SpD Azumarill: 300-354 (76.1 - 89.8%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
180 Atk Giratina-O Iron Tail vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Diancie: 360-428 (149.3 - 177.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
180 Atk Giratina-O Iron Tail vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 172-204 (43.6 - 51.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
180 Atk Giratina-O Iron Tail vs. 248 HP / 136+ Def Mega Altaria: 146-172 (41.3 - 48.7%) -- 71.9% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

On the bright side, many of these mons have little issue checking Giratina-O, so not all hope is lost. That seems to be one of the only reliable ways to deal with Giratina. Still, that bulk is just so fucking retarded, so it prevents Pokemon such as LO Weavile, Bisharp, and Scarf T-tar from revenge killing it reliably. Even Garchomp fails to OHKO 0/0 bulk Giratina most of the time. It also has a strong Sneak to pick off weakened Latis as well as Mega Gard and Mega Meta so its subpar Speed isn't much of an issue. On top of its bulk, it has a number of very useful resistances + a useful immunity to Landorus-T which gives it many free switch-in opportunities. It's still really early in the metagame obviously and shit will change, but as it looks now, at least on paper, Giratina-O just looks overwhelming as fuck. Oh, did I mention that Giratina-O also has the potential to run like a million different sets? Add unpredictability to that list. While it does punish previously dominating Pokemon such as Landorus, Keldeo, and Mega Meta, it still looks to be a heavily centralizing force itself, which doesn't really do much good to the metagame instead of just focusing our efforts on trying to deal with one powerhouse of a Pokemon instead of 3, which is still a pretty difficult task considering how Giratina-O is arguably better than any of those three mons.

 

[liptonic]

I have to keep thinking about it but here are my first impressions:
- Giratina-Origin has a really good typing when it comes to resistances and immunities. It gots six useful resistances (Water, Electric, Fire, Grass, Poison and Bug), and three immunities (Ground, Normal and Ghost).
- It has impressive stats, as expected from a "legendary iconic Uber": 150/100/100 for bulk, better than any OU Sweeper, and 120/120/90, great offensive pressure with average speed.
- Its movepool is even greater. You have access to Ghost and Dragon stabs, both physically and specially (pure power moves, namely Shadow Ball, Dragon Pulse, Draco Meteor, Shadow Claw, Outrage, Dragon Claw, and utilitary moves, Dragon Tail and Shadow Sneak). You have Earthquake and Earth Power, Aurasphere, Stone Edge, Iron Head (and few coverage moves may, or not, find niches: Energy Ball, Psychic, Thunderbolt...). As for support moves, Will-O-Wisp and Defog are more than enough to make him a great support overall, but we must not forget Thunder Wave, Toxic, Tailwind and Magic Coat.

Given all of these, I think this Pokemon has too many switch-ins. As in Uber, where Giratina-O can switch in Primal Groudon because of his bulk allowing to take a Stone Edge easily, Giratina-O can come on many neutral moves, like Excadrill's Iron Head. It can come on Keldeo, which is known to be a heavy hitter in OU, without investment, it can also take most of Landorus-I moves, excepted Psychic, which seems more and more unlikely (but which will come back if Giratina-O stays).
- 252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 8 SpD Giratina-O: 132-156 (29.9 - 35.3%) -- 27.9% chance to 3HKO
- 252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Psychic vs. 0 HP / 8 SpD Giratina-O: 151-178 (34.2 - 40.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Meanwhile, the Griseous Orb, Giratina-O's item, is a really great item, giving Giratina-O a STAB'd Shadow Ball with 20% bonus power, allowing to hit hard most of the metagame. For example:
- 252+ SpA Griseous Orb Giratina-O Shadow Ball vs. 240 HP / 16 SpD Assault Vest Azumarill: 127-151 (31.6 - 37.6%) -- 88.9% chance to 3HKO
Moreover, the few resistances available fear both of Aurasphere and Will-O-Wisp (Bisharp, Tyranitar, Lopunny), excepted Mandibuzz, making him the only mon which totally counters Giratina-O (but still, WoW will reduce Foul Play). But what if I tell you, you can play physical Giratina-Origin?
- 252+ Atk Giratina-O Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 136+ Def Mandibuzz: 174-206 (41.1 - 48.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

I don't know if the flaws to Giratina-Origin (Fairy, Dragon, Ice, Ghost and Dark weakness) will be enough to make him a healthy mon in OU, however I highly doubt Giratina-Origin is adapted to OU metagame as it is right now.

 

[firehusky]

I don't really know why we're suspecting this. It has insane bulk, and the ability to check many powerful OU threats such as Serperior, Lando-I, Keldeo, Mega Charizard Y, and Mega Gallade (I really don't know any other pokemon that can check all of those), as well as being an offensive behemoth with Griseous Orb boosted Draco Meteors, Shadow Balls, and Shadow Forces. If I recall correctly, Griseous Orb can't be knocked off which makes it even more harder to check. Giratina can even run defensive sets thanks to it's solid 150 / 100 / 100 bulk. It has access to defog and can block rapid spin, as well as having some nice utility moves such as toxic, will-o-wisp, and dragon tail.

Giratina-O has immense bulk, the ability to counter many top tier threats in OU, while also being an offensive behemoth. It also has many nice utility moves such as defog, will o wisp, toxic, and dragon tail. Giratina-O also has decent coverage; aura sphere and earth power can bop heatran and bisharp, thunderbolt nails azumarill and skarmory.

Some calcs showing off it's insane bulk and power

252 Atk Tyranitar Crunch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Giratina-O: 270-318 (61.2 - 72.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage
252 Atk Life Orb Bisharp Knock Off vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Giratina-O: 268-320 (60.7 - 72.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Play Rough vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Giratina-O: 356-422 (80.7 - 95.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Pixilate Mega Altaria Hyper Voice vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Giratina-O: 416-492 (94.3 - 111.5%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Mega Diancie Moonblast vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Giratina-O: 404-476 (91.6 - 107.9%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO (and that's a minus special defense nature)
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Giratina-O in Sun: 174-205 (39.4 - 46.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Garchomp Outrage vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Giratina-O: 392-464 (88.8 - 105.2%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Kyurem Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Giratina-O: 385-455 (87.3 - 103.1%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Griseous Orb Giratina-O Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Sableye: 235-277 (77.3 - 91.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Giratina-O Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 108 SpD Mandibuzz: 192-226 (45.3 - 53.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Griseous Orb Giratina-O Draco Meteor vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 177-208 (51.9 - 60.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Griseous Orb Giratina-O Shadow Ball vs. 248 HP / 176 SpD Mega Scizor: 138-163 (40.2 - 47.5%) -- 50.8% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

The main thing is that giratina is just so damn bulky, stuff like scarf ttar's crunch can't even revenge kill it. It's also rather hard to wear down, being immune to spikes and only being neutral to SR; many other powerful mixed attackers such as kyu-b are vulnerable to entry hazards and their defensive typings are also kinda sucky. Giratina hits really hard and has insane bulk and a solid defensive typing which makes it super hard to revenge kill.

I seriously think this is an april fools joke

[21:10:22] %bludz: ox, you know that normally when the suspect ladder goes up
[21:10:29] %bludz: the normal ou ladder disappears
[21:10:30] %bludz: but we still have both

 

[ChinChinLives]

I would prefer to not have to deal with the endless barrage of Serene Grace Air Slash flinches, thank you very much. That is for another day, though, let's focus on Giratina-O only before wetting our collective pants on every potential mon we can bring down to OU.

Well, we seem to be able to deal with Togekiss and Rachi, who also have better typings.

 

[RoyalDispenser]

For those making the comparisons between Aegislash and Giratina-O, I think it's worth noting that unlike Aegislash, Giratina-O doesn't force mindless 50/50s with King's Shield

This was posted a couple pages back.. but I wanted to touch on this.


Here's the thing with KS.. on KS, you'd have to use a contact move for it to bother anything, otherwise KS can give you a status or setup opportunity and cause the game for the aegislash player... If you did make contact, your attack got halved.. giratina has something that aegislash doesn't called will-o-wisp which is even more crippling in the same manner but so happens to have it's effect regardless of if you setup on it or not. Will-o-wisp also isn't ignored by defiant.

Instead of 50/50, you have 0/100 with giratina.

and three immunities (Ground, Normal and Ghost).

?
I think you meant fighting..

 

[HyperPyro215 Unsolaced]

It's really bulky but not ridiculously strong. I see it as a bulkier but weaker version of Kyurem-B. Its being forced to hold the Griseous orb is a huge setback for it too. I think it could be balanced in OU

 

[HyperPyro215 Unsolaced]

I know I haven't posted much in suspect threads since I usually leave this up to people who are significantly better than I am at the game, but I believe this is a good time to break that streak.

This would be a welcome change, I feel. Ever since the removal of Aegislash it's clear that the tier has been lacking in good Ghosts to use, and I feel Gira-O would be the perfect replacement, possibly even slightly weaker to make it not overcentralizing. Unlike Aegislash it doesn't have a Steel typing, meaning you can still whittle it down with Toxic Spikes so it's not as much of a nightmare to deal with.

Giratina-O has levitate, it's immune to t spikes

 

[havokchomp123]

It's really bulky but not ridiculously strong. I see it as a bulkier but weaker version of Kyurem-B. Its being forced to hold the Griseous orb is a huge setback for it too. I think it could be balanced in OU

The only problem I have with this comparison is that Kyruem-B had a poor physical movepool to back up it's sky high 170 attack and it had a stealth rock weakness too.

AM Edit: Deleted comment you replied to
Havok Edit: Sry about that, the dude was kinda ticking me off

 

[RoyalDispenser]

It's really bulky but not ridiculously strong. I see it as a bulkier but weaker version of Kyurem-B. Its being forced to hold the Griseous orb is a huge setback for it too. I think it could be balanced in OU

I still don't see how Griseous orb is a setback, it's a 20% boost to all it's high base power STABs coming off respectable 120 offenses. It's only 10% off from being a recoilless life orb.

Only thing is losing out on lefties with that bulk.. but there's so much bulk you can just go offensive.

 

[ChinChinLives]

The only problem I have with this comparison is that Kyruem-B had a poor physical movepool to back up it's sky high 170 attack and it had a stealth rock weakness too.

AM Edit: Deleted comment you replied to

Well Kyurem's LO draco is stronger than Giratina-o's draco, even if fully invested.

 

[HyperPyro215 Unsolaced]

I still don't see how Griseous orb is a setback, it's a 20% boost to all it's high base power STABs coming off respectable 120 offenses. It's only 10% off from being a recoilless life orb.

Only thing is losing out on lefties with that bulk.. but there's so much bulk you can just go offensive.

It's mostly a setback because it makes Giratina more predictable. People will know it's not scarfed or leftovers, for example. But I do certainly see the positives of the Griseous Orb.