ORAS UU Viability Ranking Thread M2

[Thisbemyalt]

I wasnt putting words into your mouth. You were saying why it deserved A rank and I was saying why it did not. Yeah I screwed up krook calc. The point is that its dependent on late game and is walled by most physical walls. A- rank is really respectable for something so dependent on late game outcomes.

Why is a late game cleaner depending on its checks having prior damage a bad thing? Thats pretty much how all late game cleaners work and sharpedo is one of the best considering that with its ability before mega it outspeeds in just about every scenario so it can fire off High bp moves with STAB boosts. A rank has several mons that require the weakening of checks and counters like luke, lax, and reun this quality does not push them down to A-. Honestly pedo is like one of if not the best late game cleaner we have, if it wasn't a mega I would make a case for A+ however seeing that it is a use of your mega slot, A rank is a really nice place for it.

 

[Thisbemyalt]

I'd be ready to give some replays if I were recommending for anything higher than B-. But I'm not, so I don't exactly have anything for you here.

Sorry for the double post I just didn't see this.
Recommending a mon as uncommon as scyther for viability ranking is even more of a reason for you to have replays since most of us don't really know how effective it is.

 

[Godsend]

I wasnt putting words into your mouth. You were saying why it deserved A rank and I was saying why it did not. Yeah I screwed up krook calc. The point is that its dependent on late game and is walled by most physical walls. A- rank is really respectable for something so dependent on late game outcomes.

Every game has a late game. Mega Sharp is one of the best late game cleaners in the tier. On top of that you can revenge/force out a lot of mons before mega evolving when Sharp still has speed boost.

 

[Thisbemyalt]

If you put Feraligatr in the A rank you might as well put him in UU altogether!!!

Thats not an arbitrary decision it takes usage for gatr to go UU I believe it also involves time with that usage. Finally this really is not the place to post that VR is here to rank the mons at our disposal not decide whats UU and what isn't.

 

[Hariyana Grande [old]]

Hi I'm just wondering why toad is the same rank as pert? Like I'm actually confused

Ok so yeah toad switches in to cune, but it really only beats it if it's running PuP (if not it gets stalled out) and then it loses it's access to knock off, which I'm assuming is one of the reasons it's the same rank as a mom that to me, completely outclasses toad

While beating cune is one of toads niches over pert, if you choose to replace PuP for knock off(which pert doesn't get obv) for the utility, you just lost out on one of the main reasons to use it and outside of beating cune with PuP, this fighting move is honestly a waste of a slot

To add on to this, pert has superior stats to toad bar speed,while also getting access to ice beam (while toad doesn't) which takes care of dragons on switch ins

So I'm basically saying that yeah toad is a solid switch to bulky waters, but besides that I see no reason to use it over pert and why it is the same rank as it.

 

[Darvin]

Hi I'm just wondering why toad is the same rank as pert? Like I'm actually confused

Being water immune is really nice in this tier. Suicune is only one of UU's scald users; just in A-rank alone there's Tentacruel, Empoleon, other Swamperts and Seismitoads, and Mega Blastoise. None of those have reliable recovery and really want to fire off scalds so the other team is being worn down with them. Maybe there's another reason that people with more experience with Seismitoad can add, but just the mere presence of water absorb on your team really dissuades those casual scalds.

 

[Yugi]

Being water immune is really nice in this tier. Suicune is only one of UU's scald users; just in A-rank alone there's Tentacruel, Empoleon, other Swamperts and Seismitoads, and Mega Blastoise. None of those have reliable recovery and really want to fire off scalds so the other team is being worn down with them. Maybe there's another reason that people with more experience with Seismitoad can add, but just the mere presence of water absorb on your team really dissuades those casual scalds.

I would agree.And talking about movepools,for me i run a physical offensivish seismitoad.Ice punch.Knock off gives is some good utility as being able to set up a PuP againts most water types and then Knock off them away.Also i dont think swampert has any setup moves,which toad gets btw and thats PuP.Knock off getting a buff at 6th gen it made it more viable for toad to run it.Water absorb gives it immunity to 2 commonly used typings and the most used move in Pokemon,water and electric,as for the move being scald.It has drain punch as a recovery and dealing dmg move.It completely shuts Crocune set resttalkscaldmind.And having resistance to 1 of aeros stabs,his most powerfull it has a great utility of shutting three S ranked pokemon with ice punch and EQ.Allthough it takes a while it counters crocune well and 1 shots aerodactyl and mence after 1 PuP.
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Seismitoad Ice Punch vs. 40 HP / 0 Def Aerodactyl: 400-473 (128.6 - 152%) -- guaranteed OHKO.And yes i got it right this time.

+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Seismitoad Ice Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Salamence: 676-801 (204.2 - 241.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO.While they

252 Atk Aerodactyl Earthquake vs. 80 HP / 4 Def Seismitoad: 119-140 (32 - 37.7%) -- 93.1% chance to 3HKO.

252+ Atk Salamence Outrage vs. 80 HP / 4 Def Seismitoad: 280-330 (75.4 - 88.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

while he fights back stronger.

Grass types.NP Sludge Wave and ice punch.


All in all it reqs teams offensively and defensively used.Purpose of a player.

 

[bsu]

0 +Atk Life Orb Seismitoad Ice Punch vs. 220 HP / 4 Def Aerodactyl: 403-476 (220.2 - 260.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO.260%.

what kinda calc is this

0+ Atk Life Orb Seismitoad Ice Punch vs. 220 HP / 0 Def Aerodactyl: 211-250 (59.2 - 70.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

this is what i got lol

 

[Camara]

Probably he misscalculated for a lv 50 M-Aero

0+ Atk Life Orb Seismitoad Ice Punch vs. 220 HP / 4 Def Mega Aerodactyl: 169-200 (47.4 - 56.1%) -- 81.6% chance to 2HKO
0+ Atk Life Orb Seismitoad Ice Punch vs. 0 HP / 44 Def Mega Aerodactyl: 161-192 (53.4 - 63.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Yes, his calc is for a non-mega lv 50 Aero

0+ Atk Life Orb lv 100 Seismitoad Ice Punch vs. 220 HP / 4 Def lv 50 Aerodactyl: 403-476 (220.2 - 260.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

 

[Yugi]

sorry bout that
i counted vgc aerodactyl

 

[Lord Wallace]

Can someone enlighten me as to why Cresselia is so high all of a sudden? I've never used it in UU and I get that it's ridiculously bulky (from using it in RU) but isn't it a little bit too passive?

 

[YABO]

Can someone enlighten me as to why Cresselia is so high all of a sudden? I've never used it in UU and I get that it's ridiculously bulky (from using it in RU) but isn't it a little bit too passive?

It's one of three reliable nido answers, shits all over offense, sets up on stall, handles top tier threats, has great support options, and is generally a pain to deal with no matter what set it's running. For reference, Beedrill's U-turn does about half, meaning you can moonlight freely and give no fucks.

 

[Tymano]

Can someone enlighten me as to why Cresselia is so high all of a sudden? I've never used it in UU and I get that it's ridiculously bulky (from using it in RU) but isn't it a little bit too passive?

Its a very reliable answer to both nidos, and eats offensive teams as a snack. Plus Lunar dance is extremely good coming from an extremely bulky mon that can pull it off.

I'd like to suggest Mega Steelix moving from C->Unranked
What does steelix do that Aggron can't do better, have 15 more base special defense and stab EQ. Thats it, especially considering that Aggron has filter to boost its already insane bulk to even greater levels. Plus steelix gets an extra weakness to water types, and has a smaller base attack than aggron.

 

[Hogg]

What does steelix do that Aggron can't do better, have 15 more base special defense and stab EQ.

Block Volt Switch?

 

[HT]

Its a very reliable answer to both nidos, and eats offensive teams as a snack. Plus Lunar dance is extremely good coming from an extremely bulky mon that can pull it off.

I'd like to suggest Mega Steelix moving from C->Unranked
What does steelix do that Aggron can't do better, have 15 more base special defense and stab EQ. Thats it, especially considering that Aggron has filter to boost its already insane bulk to even greater levels. Plus steelix gets an extra weakness to water types, and has a smaller base attack than aggron.

Steelix has an electric immunity so it can block volt turn

edit: ninjad haha

 

[Tymano]

Block Volt Switch?

Steelix has an electric immunity so it can block volt turn

edit: ninjad haha

Besides that, stab EQ, and 15 more base special defense, Steelix has nothing over aggron while aggron has Filter, 15 more base attack, 20 more speed (not like it matters, but hey) Hone claws, more coverage options, and a neutrality to water, and resistance to grass.

 

[Hogg]

Besides that, stab EQ, and 15 more base special defense, Steelix has nothing over aggron while aggron has Filter, 15 more base attack, 20 more speed (not like it matters, but hey) Hone claws, more coverage options, and a neutrality to water, and resistance to grass.

Congratulations; you've discovered why MAggron is A ranked and MSteelix is C. I'm not saying Lix is anywhere near as useful overall, but it does have a niche, and can be used over Aggron if your team has trouble with VoltTurn.

 

[Skankovich]

Yeah, I honestly really like Mega Steelix, destroying voltturn is really useful when a lot of defensive cores can end up weak to common mons in the playstyle (Mega bee hitting the common psychics and fairies, electric types hitting common waters). STAB ground is also really useful when a lot of the tier's answers to steel types are weak to ground.

Not only that, but it's spdef is pretty significantly better, like Steelix tends to be 4hko'd by chandelures shadow ball while mega aggron is a guaranteed 3hko, and Steelix is also like twice as heavy making heavy slam a far more reliably powerful move, despite aggron's higher base attack. It might be largely outclassed, especially with the nasty water weaknees, but its niches are big enough to easily deserve C.

 

[radianthero156]

porygon2 from B rank to A+ rank (RIP cased)

seriously, duck is an amazing lord of destruction. basically it counters literally every pkmn that isn't a fighter or has recovery. this includes: nidos, salamence, mega aero, chandelure, feraligatr, crobat, mega pert, (mega) pedo, mega scept, mega glalie, slurpuff, and much more. it can take two close combats from non cb ape which is pretty brutal already. in some games it ends up being a win condition just because offense cant kill it, and basically all the support it requires is cleric + fighting counters.

 

[DaSpoofy]

porygon2 from B rank to A+ rank (RIP cased)

seriously, duck is an amazing lord of destruction. basically it counters literally every pkmn that isn't a fighter or has recovery. this includes: nidos, salamence, mega aero, chandelure, feraligatr, crobat, mega pert, (mega) pedo, mega scept, mega glalie, slurpuff, and much more. it can take two close combats from non cb ape which is pretty brutal already. in some games it ends up being a win condition just because offense cant kill it, and basically all the support it requires is cleric + fighting counters.

I was thinking more like A- rank but yeah. It needs to be ranked up

 

[carrilero]

I was thinking more like A- rank but yeah. It needs to be ranked up

If you look at the description for A-rank it says the pokemon has the ability to wall large majorities of the metagame which Radian has shown so it could have a case for A+

 

[DaSpoofy]

If you look at the description for A-rank it says the pokemon has the ability to wall large majorities of the metagame which Radian has shown so it could have a case for A+

No heal bell.

 

[Roseguardin]

No heal bell.

Cresselia can wall large portions of the metagame without heal bell...

 

[Skankovich]

Cress can also act as a good wincon and is overall more versatile. Pory is really neat but A+ seems kinda steep considering the prominence of knock off and burns, and that the position of bulky normal type is as hotly contested as ever with snorlax being really good right now. A- or A seems good to me.

 

[Wish9]

porygon2 from B rank to A+ rank (RIP cased)

seriously, duck is an amazing lord of destruction. basically it counters literally every pkmn that isn't a fighter or has recovery. this includes: nidos, salamence, mega aero, chandelure, feraligatr, crobat, mega pert, (mega) pedo, mega scept, mega glalie, slurpuff, and much more. it can take two close combats from non cb ape which is pretty brutal already. in some games it ends up being a win condition just because offense cant kill it, and basically all the support it requires is cleric + fighting counters.

A+ is way too high for Porygon-Z although I do agree that it needs to rise to at least A-.