Battle Spot Triples Metagame Discussion

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Battle Spot Triples
as requested by Theorymon
Triples was introduced in Gen V as pretty much a sideshow in the Battle Subway, but it has since grown to be one of the defining formats in present-day Battle Spot. Well, now Triples has earned itself quite the fanbase around these parts, thanks in part to its fast-moving nature and especially its unique battle style – in Triples, attacks are bounded by reach, so Pokemon can only hit targets which they are adjacent to. Special moves, such as Flying-type moves and Pulse-category moves, can hit across the field to Pokemon on the far side. So, unlike in Doubles or Singles, positioning is highly important in Triples!

Another notable aspect of Triples is the freedom it gives teams to use unique strategies. Strategies such as Rototiller + TR and Perish Trap are much more effective in Triples than in Doubles, leading to a much wider range of teams you might have to consider when teambuilding.

What strategies have you been using to great effect in Triples? Any new ORAS megas giving you trouble? Any especially tricky teams you've faced recently? Discuss everything right here in this thread!

Footnote: Since Triples is one of those definitive Battle Spot metagames, it's getting its very own set of analyses and its own QC team! Get discussion going strong here, and who knows? You might just end up at the forefront of this swiftly-developing metagame!
 
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Theorymon

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First of all I just want to note: Since we currently lack QC members for triples in battle spot C&C, we will be watching this thread pretty closely for a while. Prove yourself to be good at triples and know the metagame, and who knows, you may just get a PM a couple of months from now =)

Anyways, on topic: I just started playing Triples again today actually! Currently, I'm messing around with Clefairy.

Clefairy has been a sort of growing trend in Doubles / VGC, and as it turns out. Clefairy is pretty damn great here too! For those of you that don't know about Clefairy, let me introduce you to it's doubles set.

Clefairy @ Eviolite
Ability: Friend Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 172 Def / 80 SpD / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
- Follow Me
- Helping Hand
- Icy Wind / Snatch
- Protect

The whole reason to use Clefairy is Friend Guard, which makes your teammates only receive 3/4 damage. This is pretty excellent, and can lead you to survive some surprising stuff (for example, my max HP Mega Gengar has survived a Chandelure Shadow Ball thanks to Friend Guard). Follow Me redirects stuff as long as it can hit Clefairy (i.e. a mon on the opposite side as Clefairy won't be effected unless its using a move that ignores placement), Helping Hand and Protect are obvious.

EVs are for surviving a max Attack Adamant Mega Kangaskhan Double-Edge btw.

Icy Wind is cool for Speed Control, and some use Moonblast and 20 SpA evs to OHKO Hydreigon. However, according to battle spot usage stats, Snatch is used on over 50% of Clefairy currently. The reason is simple: Snatch takes Quick Guard and Wide Guard away, which is EXTREMELY useful in triples! Just note though, this makes Clefairy massive Taunt bait.

Now some stuff about triples in general

-Quick Guard and Wide Guard are a LOT more common here because of the extra Pokemon.

-Watch out for Smeargle: Dark Void can REALLY sting in this metagame. The most common response seems to be using Safeguard Meowstic, but I'm sure Thundurus Taunt paired with some way to deal with quick guard can work alrigh too.

-Apprenly, Jigglypuff has been in Gothitelle's top 10 teammates in the past. I'm guessing the thing Jigglypuff has over a friend guarder compared to Clefairy is Perish Song. Sounds like it's worth a try!

-I've seen some people use Eject Button on Hitmontop and a few other mons. At first I thought this was just for escaping to intimidate again, but someone actually hit their own Hitmontop with a weak Hidden Power from Amoonguss to escape Perish Song. Was sorta ingeinous to be honest!

-Weather setting moves seem sorta effective here. I got totally owned by a team today because it had Rain Dance Latias, which ruined my Charizard. Not using Politoed or any super obvious rain sweepers (he had Mega Blastoise, who is standard in this metagame) totally threw me off guard. I wonder if there's more value to this strategy...
 
I'll come back to this later but for the moment, don't forget that there was a triples CCAT in this section last summer for XY. Hitmontop with Eject Button was in that team with Landorus for double intimidate.

That was a good thread but it died out quickly. Which is a shame as I'm a fan of the format.
 
Yessss, finally triples is getting some exposure :)

So, one of the first things I wanna mention about triples that a lot of new players forget is to use shifting!

Shifting is unique to triples and it can be extremely helpful. You can avoid super effective damage for a turn, you can place a pokemon in a corner, away from something that might threaten it, you can get something closer to a pokemon it threatens. It's really useful.

I especially like it when you're just trying to avoid damage. For example, if you have a lando-t in the center and are expecting an ice attack, you can shift your steel type and keep lando safe for another turn or two. But shifting does not have priority like switching so keep that in mind. But in conjunction with speed control the loss of priority on shifting isn't too big of an issue.

Another important thing I wanna mention is that I believe every team should have some form of speed control. The meta is heavily revolving around speed control I think. Whether it be with Tailwind, Trick Room or even Thunder Wave. You will come across it almost every game and it's nice to have for yourself as well.
 
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Theorymon

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Shame that this thread hasn't gotten more activity, because Triples is a pretty fun (and crazy) metagame!

I'll talk about a Pokemon I tried out thats been my MVP lately. It got me to break the 1600 barrier on the ladder (not a super great ranking, but usually the time where I think "oh I should refine this team some more), and I've also seen a few high ranking players use this as well.



Braviary @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Rock Slide
- Sky Drop
- Superpower

Braviary works great in Triples. Defiant gives it that attack boost for intimidate, and unlike Bisharp, Braviary can use Brave Bird and Sky Drop to ignore placement issues. Also, Braviary ANHILATES Hitmontop, which is something Bisharp sorta gets owned by. Also, believe it or not, thanks to the Jolly nature, you actually outspeed and OHKO Adamant Choice Scarf Landorus-T, which has won me quite a few games!

Rock Slide is awesome of course. It can smack weakened Zapdos and stuff, which is nice because Zapdos is among Braviary's biggest issues. And of course, thanks to the Scarf, Braviary can get some emergency kills on Mega Charizard Y.

Sky Drop may not seem like much, but in triples, its a great disruptive move. This can be especially handy against Tail Wind teams, because after the Tailwind, Braviary will get after the opponent, meaning they don't get to move for 2 turns! In general, temporarly removing a key Pokemon from the battlefield can be devestating at the right times. and its great on something that can even get an attack boost from intimidate!

Finally, Superpower is just... sorta filler. Hits rock types like Tyranitar harder, and it does a lot to Mega Kangaskhan.

So basically, whenever we get enough of a userbase to have a Triples Quality Control for C&C, Braviary is totally a Pokemon I'd approve of :P

Also, recently I faced a Cherrim team. I got smashed by this team! The guy used it with Braviary, Ninetales and Mega Metagross. He lead with Ninetales, swapped in Cherrim, and then suddenly I was facing a Braviary and a Mega Metagross with +1 Attack and Special Defense! It was pretty scary stuff, and I myself plan to make a Cherrim team later because of it!
 
I've been seeing more and more Braviary as well. It seems like a pretty good meta call imo because of the strong flying STAB with Defiant. It just faces competion with talon, so its a decision between a strong BB spammer with defiant or a BB spammer with priority and three of the best support moves in the meta.

And i've seen sooo many cherrim teams. It's something i'm a little indifferent about. The ability is nice but cherrim is eh. Luckily it gets just the right support moves to make itself useful but it still has close to no offensive presence. Another thing I really dont like about it is some of the best mons to abuse the ability with are strong megas like kanga & mence. So if you run these then you aren't running Zard Y, which means your running ninetales. And ninetales is just.. meh. So you essentially have two mons on your team that are there simply to support and dont pull their weight compared to the rest of the team. It can still work out of course but because of those restrictions it really turns me off. It's definitely something to watch out for though, especially when they start stacking intimidate it can be hard to do enough damage to their mons.
 
I faced a lot of volt absorb / lightning rod teams when I played in XY. That kind of gimmick seems like a logical extension of weather teams in previous games.

I've always wanted to try it but I suck at team building.
 
A cool mon i've been seeing is Crobat :)

I've come across it a few times, and it depends on the player how well it performs, but in a good players hands it's pretty damn good! So, at first glance crobat seems like it does nearly everything talonflame does but without gale wings. It has the amazing team support moves just like talon: snatch, tailwind, quick guard. And makes great use of them i'd add. It also trades gale wings for another useful ability, Inner Focus. It has good speed as well so it makes up for the lack of priority and that speed is really useful for QGing cause it outspeeds almost every fake outer(f u ludicolo). Its also got STAB brave bird, hits everywhere, really nice. Super Fang is another cool option as well.

But what Crobat has that gives it a niche over Talonflame is Hypnosis. Sleep is really powerful and fucks teams over really hard. Being unable to attack for even a turn can be crucial when you're getting beaten down by mons like lando, sylveon, zard y, etc. Crobat is crazy fast too so it's hard to stop it from putting something to sleep. Hypnosis is pretty inaccurate but when it does hit it'll work wonders for you, and it is in your favor to hit it. You could even run wide lens to help you out a bit more. But when you do miss it will suck sometimes obviously, but that's why Crobat isn't extremely good either.

I haven't tried this out myself but it's always annoying to play against this thing. I have a replay here if anyone wants to take a look at it: WJXG-WWWW-WWXU-EZYM. It was a match against a portuguese player at about 1800(which is like top 50 in trips), so it was a fairly good game(a bit haxy cause well, hypnosis). That game shows the highs and lows of crobat. Hypnosis put it in some good work for him but he missed a few times too. You'll also see how sleep turns can often not be too favorable for you as well. He did hit hypnosis more than he missed though! :) Not sure if he was running wide lens, or a more defensive item like lum or sitrus.

I definitely wanna give this a shot myself though, might replace talon with it for a few games since it's not difficult to swap as they fill very similar roles.
 
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ethan06

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Here's a decent set I've been toying with a little:

Mienshao @ Focus Sash / Life Orb
Ability: Inner Focus
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Aura Sphere
- Hidden Power [Ice] / Grass Knot / U-Turn
- Quick Guard / Wide Guard / Fake Out / Feint
- Quick Guard / Wide Guard / Fake Out / Feint

Mienshao is already a fairly useful Pokémon in Triples with its decent speed and access to all kinds of support moves, especially both Guards. However, it's usually shunned due to its reliance on High Jump Kick, which is obviously a terrible move in Triples where everything (and I mean everything) carries Protect. Special Mienshao is a direct upgrade in almost every conceivable aspect from the common physical set - Aura Sphere is unaffected by Intimidate or Will-o-Wisp, can reach to the other side of the field, never misses, and uses Mienshao's respectable 95 SpA. Unfortunately, Mienshao's usable special movepool doesn't extend past Aura Sphere, Grass Knot and Hidden Power, so it has to choose its coverage carefully using Hidden Power, or else resign itself to not hitting very hard and run three support moves. Still a neat option for blocking / using Fake Out, having a quick surprise answer to Mega Kangaskhan thanks to Quick Guard and Aura Sphere and overall being able to do everything that Hitmontop does but with a reach move and tons more speed :)
 
Mienshao is already a fairly useful Pokémon in Triples with its decent speed and access to all kinds of support moves, especially both Guards. However, it's usually shunned due to its reliance on High Jump Kick, which is obviously a terrible move in Triples where everything (and I mean everything) carries Protect. Special Mienshao is a direct upgrade in almost every conceivable aspect from the common physical set - Aura Sphere is unaffected by Intimidate or Will-o-Wisp, can reach to the other side of the field, never misses, and uses Mienshao's respectable 95 SpA. Unfortunately, Mienshao's usable special movepool doesn't extend past Aura Sphere, Grass Knot and Hidden Power, so it has to choose its coverage carefully using Hidden Power, or else resign itself to not hitting very hard and run three support moves. Still a neat option for blocking / using Fake Out, having a quick surprise answer to Mega Kangaskhan thanks to Quick Guard and Aura Sphere and overall being able to do everything that Hitmontop does but with a reach move and tons more speed :)
I mean, low kick is a viable option and even at -1 it actually does basically just as much (or more) than aura sphere to mons you want to hit like tran, kan, hydrei. And low kick actually has pretty good chances to ohko these mons when you're not at -1, unlike aura sphere. Plus if you're not getting intimidated you have a lot more immediate power. The only reason to use aura sphere imo is to hit anywhere on the field but idk how worth it that really is. I guess a surprise HP ice on landos would be nice but then you lose out a really valuable move if you run that. I just think trying to make shao offensively capable all the time through intimidate isnt worth it because you have 3 great support moves you should be using most of the time anyway, so your offensive presence isn't even going to matter that much. I really wouldn't say that special sets are "a direct upgrade in almost every conceivable aspect" considering the power loss is pretty damn significant. It's a decent option but you're hyping it up way too much.

It's also not "able to do everything that Hitmontop does". It has no intimidate and much less bulk. Hitmontop is a lot better for pivoting, and using its decent bulk to stay around to guard/feint longer.
 

Theorymon

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A cool mon i've been seeing is Crobat :)

I've come across it a few times, and it depends on the player how well it performs, but in a good players hands it's pretty damn good! So, at first glance crobat seems like it does nearly everything talonflame does but without gale wings. It has the amazing team support moves just like talon: snatch, tailwind, quick guard. And makes great use of them i'd add. It also trades gale wings for another useful ability, Inner Focus. It has good speed as well so it makes up for the lack of priority and that speed is really useful for QGing cause it outspeeds almost every fake outer(f u ludicolo). Its also got STAB brave bird, hits everywhere, really nice. Super Fang is another cool option as well.

But what Crobat has that gives it a niche over Talonflame is Hypnosis. Sleep is really powerful and fucks teams over really hard. Being unable to attack for even a turn can be crucial when you're getting beaten down by mons like lando, sylveon, zard y, etc. Crobat is crazy fast too so it's hard to stop it from putting something to sleep. Hypnosis is pretty inaccurate but when it does hit it'll work wonders for you, and it is in your favor to hit it. You could even run wide lens to help you out a bit more. But when you do miss it will suck sometimes obviously, but that's why Crobat isn't extremely good either.

I haven't tried this out myself but it's always annoying to play against this thing. I have a replay here if anyone wants to take a look at it: WJXG-WWWW-WWXU-EZYM. It was a match against a portuguese player at about 1800(which is like top 50 in trips), so it was a fairly good game(a bit haxy cause well, hypnosis). That game shows the highs and lows of crobat. Hypnosis put it in some good work for him but he missed a few times too. You'll also see how sleep turns can often not be too favorable for you as well. He did hit hypnosis more than he missed though! :) Not sure if he was running wide lens, or a more defensive item like lum or sitrus.

I definitely wanna give this a shot myself though, might replace talon with it for a few games since it's not difficult to swap as they fill very similar roles.
I myself am probably gonna breed a Crobat later this month (Especially since I also need an infiltrator one for Rotations lol). I've seen that thing do good work in triples! Something I want to emphasize is that Inner Focus on a Tailwinder is freaking awesome, and to be honest you can actually make it hit a bit harder than Talonflame if you want (I haven't actually seen an LO Crobat, but Ive seen a sky plate one at least once).

I myself am probably gonna try out a more offensive Crobat first, Hypnosis sounds scary but Im worried Im gonna miss too much lol. Maybe I can be a weirdo and use Crobat with Gravity. Becoming weak to Earthquake sucks, but it would make Hypnosis more reliable...
 
I myself am probably gonna breed a Crobat later this month. I've seen that thing do good work in triples! Something I want to emphasize is that Inner Focus on a Tailwinder is freaking awesome, and to be honest you can actually make it hit a bit harder than Talonflame if you want (I haven't actually seen an LO Crobat, but Ive seen a sky plate one at least once).

I myself am probably gonna try out a more offensive Crobat first, Hypnosis sounds scary but Im worried Im gonna miss too much lol. Maybe I can be a weirdo and use Crobat with Gravity. Becoming weak to Earthquake sucks, but it would make Hypnosis more reliable...
Gravity + hypnosis spam teams are pretty good if you wanted to go that route. They usually use sableye with gravity. And then add a few fast hypnosis/grass whistle partners like mega gar, ninetales, & chlorophyll mons. Grass whistle is better than sleep powder when you have gravity usually since you can still sleep grass types with it and it goes through subs i think.
 

Theorymon

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I haven't gotten to playing Triples this season yet (though I plan on doing so after the little cup tournament, especially since Triples analyses may be starting soon), but I notice that at the moment, Zapdos is in a lot of teammates (and was in the top 12 really early in the season)

I'm not surprised at all, I saw a ton of them near the end of last season, and Zapdos is pretty great in triples! Zapdos is a really nice, bulky Tailwinder, but I think what makes it really special is its impressive offensive typing and movepool. Heat Wave is pretty rad at hitting Steel-types, especially with Charizard-Y / Sunny Day support, while Thunderbolt lets Zapdos anhilate bird spammers like Talonflame, Crobat, and Braviary. Hell, it even slams Mega Blastoise! This pretty much means that Zapdos screws up a lot of the "screw placement" mons, which is AWESOME for a Tailwinder!

Also, I noticed that Hitmontop dropped out of the top 12 so far this season, but Hariyama rose back up. I saw several Wide Guard Hariyama last season, but this time, almost all of them are Assault Vest! I'm guessing part of the reason why this is happening so far this season is because the rise of Bsiharp and the continuing bird spam might overload some teams that rely on Hitmontop for Feinting, so Hariyama trades the awesome intimidate for dealing with Mega Charizard Y better, and having that beefy 120 base attack Close Combat!

Also note: Since Triples is one of the less active ladders (nowhere near the level of Rotation's low activity though), the stats maaaay be a bit skewed until the first month of this season is over. Still, the stats do cover players with a 1600 rating, so like rotations, I think its safe to assume that most of these people know what they're doing!
 
This happened a couple seasons ago too. Hitmontops usage was low at the beginning of the season while hariyama's was high but towards the end hariyama dropped and hitmontop rose.

Really couldn't tell you why exactly this happens. But if i had to guess I'd think the same thing will happen this season. But like you said hariyama is pretty good for a better offensive presence and has a slower speed for trick room. But i think hitmontop's intimidate still makes it more useful overall.
 

cant say

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I'm not expert stat analyst but to me it seems like all the good players would be the first to break the 1600 mark early in the season and so the usage stats would reflect what they're using (Hariyama), and then as the season progresses, more and more people are breaking 1600 and their stats are being recorded, and so the Hitmontop users drown out the Hariyama ones, forcing Yama out of the top 12.
 

Demantoid

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I've recently been using a Golbat over Crobat for Quick Guard + Tailwind and it I've gone 9-0 with its team so far. I've been using a physically defensive one (should probably be specially defensive) with a moveset of QG, Tailwind, Brave Bird, and Taunt. Brave Bird is mostly for chip damage but can do a good amount. Taunt is for trick room setters besides mental herb Dusclops. Even though it is the pre evo of Crobat people still use Fake out on it and do not expect Quick Guard. Golbat is bulky enough to survive almost all double targets and some triple targets. Tailwind + Quick Guard makes it an excellent partner for Charizard and Sylveon. Super Fang could also be used to chunk targets before Sylveon attacks.

Edit: If you search Golbat on PGL right now I'm the only one to use it.
 
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cant say

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I hope nobody is dumb enough to use that.
I guess it has the advantage of making people think it's a guaranteed Eviolite user so easy Taunt bait. If it's job is solely to get Trick Room up it will probably at least do that.

But then again, Knock Off stops both of those strategies (makes it frailer so can be picked off before it moves or gets rid of the Mental Herb so it can be Taunted) so just use that imo
 
I guess it has the advantage of making people think it's a guaranteed Eviolite user so easy Taunt bait. If it's job is solely to get Trick Room up it will probably at least do that.

But then again, Knock Off stops both of those strategies (makes it frailer so can be picked off before it moves or gets rid of the Mental Herb so it can be Taunted) so just use that imo
The only thing really good about dusclops is the eviolite bulk though. And plus taunt isnt even as common in triples. Lum berry would normally be better since sleep is a more common way to stop TR setters, especially considering how popular DV smeargle is.

Plus you have aromatisse who cant be taunted and can have another item if you want to go the route of never being taunted. Also has a better typing and better support moves like heal pulse.
 
I was wondering how intense offense is supposed to play out. I've got all of the Superstars for Singles at my disposal, Mega Kang, Garchomp, Talonflame, Azumarill, I'm wondering if I can just make some small changes with one or two support Pokemon. I currently have Dual Screens Klefki and/or Follow Me & Thunder Wave Togekiss for support. Still need to build some more stuff.

Its a pity there's so little info around this thread =(.
 
I was wondering how intense offense is supposed to play out. I've got all of the Superstars for Singles at my disposal, Mega Kang, Garchomp, Talonflame, Azumarill, I'm wondering if I can just make some small changes with one or two support Pokemon. I currently have Dual Screens Klefki and/or Follow Me & Thunder Wave Togekiss for support. Still need to build some more stuff.

Its a pity there's so little info around this thread =(.
Keep in mind all the "singles superstars" arent always as good in triples. There are some that are though, like Kan and Lando-T. But i think teams should have a good balance of bulk and power. So dual screens is definitely solid.

You should also try to have forms of speed control like tailwind, or trick room. Wide Guard is an important thing to consider as well.
 
Ya know, I'd love to couple gravity with Fighting types if I can. But how do I avoid getting Taunted or KO'd or something like that. Hmm... Clefairy is bulky enough to survive a turn, but still, Taunt.
 
Ya know, I'd love to couple gravity with Fighting types if I can. But how do I avoid getting Taunted or KO'd or something like that. Hmm... Clefairy is bulky enough to survive a turn, but still, Taunt.
Mental Herb is an option, not for clefairy lol you need eviolite on that. But gravity sableye is good since you have prankster to set it up safely and it's immune to fake out as well(barring scrappy).

Gravity is a really cool strategy with things like dynamic punch and hypnosis.
 

Theorymon

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I made a rushed team last week to try out, and tried out Bulky Mega Blastoise with just enough speed to outspeed Mega Manectric under Tailwind (its like 36 speed evs or so).

I actually like this Mega Blastoise. Its the standard set but with Water Pulse instead of Water Spout. I understand why Water Spout is popular (if you set i up right with Tailwind, it hits hard), but atm I like Water Pulse more because it means Mega Blastoise needs less support.
 

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