ORAS Doubles OU DOU Offensive Sun Team

[VCrakeV]

I've recently been working on a team for DOU, centering on Zard Y, and it has been doing well for the past few days with little change. However, suddenly, I only seem to win the occasional match by a lucky call. So, I'm looking for help on how to make my team more reliable and consistent. I'm open to any and all advice that doesn't involve taking out Zard Y (because he's kind of what I based the team around). However, if you think that creating a team around him is that troubling, then feel free to explain why I should go back to square one. With that said, let's cut to the chase.

Charizor (Charizard) @ Charizardite Y
Ability: Solar Power
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 148 HP / 252 SpA / 108 Spe
Modest Nature
- Heat Wave
- Overheat
- Solar Beam
- Protect

Like I mentioned earlier, Charizor is the main Poke of the team. He brings the sun for others to abuse, and uses it his own self in order to punch holes in enemy teams. I chose Solar Power over Blaze for when I'm going against other sun teams (SP Zard is nuts). Heat Wave is the obligatory STAB move. Solar Beam is to take out threatening rock- and water-types. Protect is a utility move for stalling out tailwind, staying in and waiting for another 'mon to support it, etc. Overheat is to nuke pretty much anything at the expense of switching out or being sacrificed. Nature and EV spread is for most damage possible while outspeeding whatever it can, because bulky investment can't protect it from its most common threats (rocks, sucker punch, you know the stuff).

Heliomar (Heliolisk) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Solar Power
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Focus Blast
- Hyper Voice
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]

Heliomar has been on the team for as long as anyone else, and for good reason. He is also running Solar Power, but he gets more use of it. The Scarf is to outspeed base 110s (109... really?) and higher, as well as scarfed threats (most notably, Landorous-T). Nature and EVs are similar to Charizor's for the same reason, but he's modest because the scarf makes the extra speed from timid obsolete. Hyper Voice is for spread STAB, Thunderbolt is focus STAB, and HP Ice is for OHKing Landy in the sun (and most of the time without sun). Focus Blast is new, and is basically for Heatran and whatever else it can hit the hardest. I've never known what to do with this slot, and I don't like the shaky accuracy, but it fits (at least for now).

Venusir (Venusaur) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 160HP / 252 SpA / 96 Spe
Modest Nature
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Sleep Powder
- Protect

Venusir is my chlorophyll sweeper, who also sponges some attacks. Life Orb is to maximize damage without getting locked into one move. The EVs are spread to make Venusir hit as hard as possible and outspeed Mega Lopunny in the sun. The rest is dumped into HP to increase survivability. Giga Drain over Solar Beam in case sun runs out, and to recover health lost from Life Orb (and anything else). Sludge Bomb is Venusir's nuke, and HP Ground is to prevent him from being walled by Heatran (and Ferrothorn, but it doesn't do much). Protect is to wait for sun, stall out tailwind, and so on.

Togeflinch (Togekiss) @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Calm Nature
- Follow Me
- Wish
- Air Slash
- Tailwind

Togeflinch's name is a hint at only a bonus, not its main purpose. Togeflinch is on the team to support others' sweeping. I chose leftovers to add extra sustain. Nature and EV spread is to maximize bulk, while balancing defences. Follow Me is to protect more frail members from speedy Pokemon, as well as priority. Wish is for sustain, as well as healing others with the right moves. Air Slash is obvious STAB and flinch abuse. Finally, tailwind is to help Charizor's middling base speed, and counter opposing tailwinds.

Heatyrone (Heatran) @ Shuca Berry
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 176 HP / 252 SpA / 80 Spe
Modest Nature
- Heat Wave
- Flash Cannon
- Earth Power
- Protect

Heatyrone is a reliable tank who can switch in on a lot, abuse the sun, and just chip away at the enemy team. Shuca Berry is to allow Heatyrone to survive most ground attacks at full health. Nature and EVs are to maximize power and bulk, while outspeeding opposing heatran. Heat Wave and Flash Cannon are obligatory STAB, and Earth Power is for opposing Heatran. On that note, I was thinking of putting what's in SpD into Spe in order to speed creep opposing Heatran. Protect is to stall the occasional threat (mostly ground attacks, especially if Shuca Berry is gone). It's also used for common protect utility.

Cresselia @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Levitate
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock
- Icy Wind
- Moonlight

Cresselia is new, missing a nickname, and fills a hole on my team, where I didn't know what to put. I figured my team needed more backbone, so Cresselia seemed like a good idea. Leftovers is for automatic sustain. Nature and EVs are to maximize bulk and defense. Minimal investment in SpD because Calm Mind patches it anyway. Psyshock is STAB that hurts specially defensive pokemon. Icy Wind is for speed control, as well as picking off almost fainted pokemon (and even dragons after some boosting). Moonlight is to recover after sponging too many hits.

EDIT:

Zapdos @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 144 SpA / 112 Spe
Modest Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Heat Wave
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Tailwind

Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Claw
- Rock Slide
- Earthquake
- Protect

Well, that's it folks. I appreciate any advice, and thank you in advance!

 

[SpaceBass]

In the current meta, I'd suggest switching Charizard over to a bulky set. You have the speed control in place already, so this is do-able. Air Slash isn't great on Zard either, swapping it to Overheat gives you a very powerful nuke option for anything that doesn't resist it.

Heliolisk is incredibly outclassed in doubles. Thundurus-T does its job but far better. Volt Switch allows you to do some damage on a switch, and outspeeds and OHKOes scarf Lando with HP Ice, a threat to sun. Another Pokemon you could try swapping Heliolisk for would be Landorus-T. A bulky variant gives you a good switch-in to Talonflame, a problem for Zard / Venu, and also deals with opposing Fire types. Intimidate patches up Charizard's poor defence stat.

Swapped your Venu to a more standard spread, 96 speed allows you to outspeed the entire unboosted meta, and some scarfers like Lando T.

Also swapped the Togekiss to a more balanced spread. Wish isn't ideal in doubles, replacing with Roost will give you more room to protect attackers.

As you have Icy Wind / Tailwind support, Heatran would be best running a Sub / Leftovers set. Sub lets you avoid status and leftovers gives Heatran a longer lifespan.

The Cresselia was fine, aside from having a -SpA nature. I changed it to -Atk and gave it 0 Atk IVs to minimize Foul Play damage.

Edit: I did actually put Goggles on Cress I just forgot to mention it lol. Also the Thunder on Thundy was a mistake, it was c/p'd from another team and I forgot to change it.

Edit 2: If Togekiss isn't working out, You could try a bulky Tailwind Zapdos. This would allow you to use Lando-T over Heli and still retain Tailwind. Added the set in the importable.

Importable of changes

Venusaur (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 160 HP / 252 SpA / 96 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 SpA / 30 SpD
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Sleep Powder
- Protect

Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 180 HP / 252 SpA / 76 Spe
Modest Nature
- Heat Wave
- Flash Cannon
- Substitute
- Protect

Cresselia @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Levitate
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock
- Icy Wind
- Moonlight

Charizard @ Charizardite Y
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 148 HP / 252 SpA / 108 Spe
Modest Nature
- Heat Wave
- SolarBeam
- Overheat
- Protect

Togekiss @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 248 HP / 192 Def / 68 SpD
Calm Nature
- Follow Me
- Air Slash
- Tailwind
- Roost

Or

Zapdos @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 144 SpA / 112 Spe
Modest Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power Ice
- Light Screen
- Tailwind


Thundurus-Therian @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 24 HP / 252 SpA / 232 Spe
Modest Nature
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Focus Blast

Or

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 48 Atk / 132 Def / 80 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Knock Off
- Protect

 

[VCrakeV]

In the current meta, I'd suggest switching Charizard over to a bulky set. You have the speed control in place already, so this is do-able. Air Slash isn't great on Zard either, swapping it to Overheat gives you a very powerful nuke option for anything that doesn't resist it.

Heliolisk is incredibly outclassed in doubles. Thundurus-T does its job but far better. Volt Switch allows you to do some damage on a switch, and outspeeds and OHKOes scarf Lando with HP Ice, a threat to sun. Another Pokemon you could try swapping Heliolisk for would be Landorus-T. A bulky variant gives you a good switch-in to Talonflame, a problem for Zard / Venu, and also deals with opposing Fire types. Intimidate patches up Charizard's poor defence stat.

Swapped your Venu to a more standard spread, 96 speed allows you to outspeed the entire unboosted meta, and some scarfers like Lando T.

Also swapped the Togekiss to a more balanced spread. Wish isn't ideal in doubles, replacing with Roost will give you more room to protect attackers.

As you have Icy Wind / Tailwind support, Heatran would be best running a Sub / Leftovers set. Sub lets you avoid status and leftovers gives Heatran a longer lifespan.

The Cresselia was fine, aside from having a -SpA nature. I changed it to -Atk and gave it 0 Atk IVs to minimize Foul Play damage.

Importable of changes

Venusaur (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 160 HP / 252 SpA / 96 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 SpA / 30 SpD
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Sleep Powder
- Protect

Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 180 HP / 252 SpA / 76 Spe
Modest Nature
- Heat Wave
- Flash Cannon
- Substitute
- Protect

Cresselia @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Levitate
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock
- Icy Wind
- Moonlight

Charizard @ Charizardite Y
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 148 HP / 252 SpA / 108 Spe
Modest Nature
- Heat Wave
- SolarBeam
- Overheat
- Protect

Togekiss @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 248 HP / 192 Def / 68 SpD
Calm Nature
- Follow Me
- Air Slash
- Tailwind
- Roost

Thundurus-Therian @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 24 HP / 252 SpA / 232 Spe
Modest Nature
- Volt Switch
- Thunder
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Focus Blast

Or

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 48 Atk / 132 Def / 80 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Knock Off
- Protect

Wow. I wasn't expecting so much help so fast (and from one post). Thanks! For anyone still checking this thread, I'm still open to other ideas.

EDIT: Is sleep powder worth the shaky accuracy? On that note, why have Thundurus with Thunder on a sun team? Its already shaky accuracy drops to 50% in the sun.

 

[Yellow Paint]

I think I'll make general improvements to your sets and evs in case you want to keep your mons, but something about the team as a whole appears pretty shaky.

air slash zard as well as 252 252 zard aren't too great as of now, with base 100 not meaning much anymore. Here's a bulkier set, stolen directly from shaian.
Charizard @ Charizardite Y
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 248 HP / 64 Def / 88 SpA / 108 Spe
Modest Nature
- Heat Wave
- Overheat
- Solarbeam
- Protect

I remember scarf heliolisk, from my own first dubs team. You might wanna try volt switch>tbolt, and hyper beam>hyper voice, and a spread of 160 spe, max spa, rest in hp. It's has a niche in solar power, or at least in my heart ;-;

for venu, you need to outspeed adamant lando, and sleep powder is a must.
Venusir (Venusaur) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 196 HP / 252 SpA / 60 Spe
Modest Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Sludge Bomb
- Sleep Powder
- Protect

I feel like togekiss doesn't do much for the team. I'd suggest either lando t or garchomp(fire/rock resist) to replace it.
Landorus-Therian @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 44 HP / 252 Atk / 212 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- U-Turn
- Superpower

Garchomp @ Life Orb
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Substitute
- Protect

That tran enjoys being a bit faster. Make the evs 180 hp, max spatk, and 76 speed.

For cress, give it safety goggles, which are far better than lefties, and a bold nature.

edit: how are both of you so fast I like just typed this up. Also, heliolisk is better than thundy under sun.

 

[VCrakeV]

Edited my post in case anyone else came across this thread, or if anyone wants to see if my changes have merit.

 

[Yellow Paint]

252 hp rocky chomp is super pointless, as its only niche over lando t is typing and the ability to be fast without a scarf. The only reason I suggested chomp was if you already had an electric scarfer, and didn't want two choicelocked mons. In your case, as you have no scarf, either my scarf lando t set or space's bulky lando t are far better choices.

Also, heat wave is quite redundant on zap cause you have two other fire types. If you don't like light screen, at least use protect, volt switch, or thunder wave.

 

[VCrakeV]

252 hp rocky chomp is super pointless, as its only niche over lando t is typing and the ability to be fast without a scarf. The only reason I suggested chomp was if you already had an electric scarfer, and didn't want two choicelocked mons. In your case, as you have no scarf, either my scarf lando t set or space's bulky lando t are far better choices.

Also, heat wave is quite redundant on zap cause you have two other fire types. If you don't like light screen, at least use protect, volt switch, or thunder wave.

I actually super hate Landy. Plus, I've found Chomp to be a great switch in to ruin the day for weakened physical attackers. But yeah, Lando is one of the few Pokemon I just won't use. It's not so much about how he's used (because although he's usually scarfed, he has multiple playstyles). It's just a personal thing. Any other ideas?

And yeah, I was greedy with the fire-boost across my team, but it does seem to be a better idea to put some extra utility on Zapdos.