np: ORAS UU Stage 3.1 - Sex on Fire [Victini Remains BL]

[kwahelgae]

sad thing is lax isn't even a counter because of basedhaxgod. I remember I had one team that lost to pidget as soon as I lost snorlax. rip me.

Not a counter but a near-solid check. Apparently Umbreon is a good way to counter StallBreaker Pidgeot

 

[sniperr]

Not a counter but a near-solid check. Apparently Umbreon is a good way to counter StallBreaker Pidgeot

my pidgeot at plus one attacks with 0 attack Ivs takes about 40-45 percent from foul play I believe. I would post calcs but I'm on mobile. I've beat many umbreons at plus one, the confusing coming into effect ofcourse

 

[Duskt]

Also, not to suggest something too off the road, but Jolteon is one of the few electric types that can outspeed and KO Mega Pidge. In fact, it doesn't even need a life orb. It's also only 3HKOed by Hurricane or Heat Wave. To me this seems like a decent offensive check (even though Jolteon has its own well known problems *cough* the movepuddle.)

 

[Schpoonman]

I don't see how Jolteon is any better of an answer to Pidgeot than Aerodactyl, especially since Aerodactyl is a much much better Pokemon in general and has recovery. I guess you could run Assault Vest, but now Jolteon fails to KO damn-near-everything it wants to that's not on Offense, but Jolteon is more-likely-than-not 2HKO'd by Heat Wave after Rocks.

 

[slated]

I don't see how Jolteon is any better of an answer to Pidgeot than Aerodactyl, especially since Aerodactyl is a much much better Pokemon in general and has recovery. I guess you could run Assault Vest, but now Jolteon fails to KO damn-near-everything it wants to that's not on Offense, but Jolteon is more-likely-than-not 2HKO'd by Heat Wave after Rocks.

I don't think there's debate on whether or not Aero is the best check to Mega Pidgeot on offense, I think it was just a pokemon that could see usage for people not running aero without any Pidgeot checks. There really isn't a lot to come by in terms of offensive checks because Mega Pidgeot hits a godlike speed tier and has only three very uncommon weaknesses, along with solid bulk and a no-drawback 110 BP move with a confusion chance. If you can't run Mega Aerodactyl, Jolteon sounds like a not-bad option to check Pidgeot (although Specs Rotom-H is probably better)

 

[Duskt]

I don't think there's debate on whether or not Aero is the best check to Mega Pidgeot on offense, I think it was just a pokemon that could see usage for people not running aero without any Pidgeot checks. There really isn't a lot to come by in terms of offensive checks because Mega Pidgeot hits a godlike speed tier and has only three very uncommon weaknesses, along with solid bulk and a no-drawback 110 BP move with a confusion chance. If you can't run Mega Aerodactyl, Jolteon sounds like a not-bad option to check Pidgeot (although Specs Rotom-H is probably better)

That was kind of my thinking, yes. I guess there's also the benefit you don't have to take up your mega slot (partially made irrelevant because Mega Aero is one of the best in the tier, but you may not want to use it because your team uses another mega). It does similar Flying check jobs to Mega Aero, but not much of anything else. Again, relatively niche, but it has some degree of potential.

 

[psVoltage]

I've been messing with lanturn a bit as a check to both M-bird and Gatr, I haven't figured out a specific set thats good because no time. Just did 252hp and split the other evs in half. Lanturn is pretty decent because it can switch into an attack and threaten them to a certain extent, be it thunder wave, scald or volt switch/ thunderbolt.

Calcs

252 SpA Mega Pidgeot Hidden Power Grass vs. 252 HP / 128 SpD Lanturn: 146-172 (32.1 - 37.8%) -- 93.2% chance to 3HKO
idk if they run hp grass but it seemed like the best thing to hit it with

0 SpA Lanturn Volt Switch vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Pidgeot: 146-174 (47.4 - 56.4%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO

0 SpA Lanturn Volt Switch vs. 28 HP / 0 SpD Feraligatr: 140-168 (44 - 52.8%) -- 21.1% chance to 2HKO

+1 252 Atk Life Orb Feraligatr Crunch vs. 252 HP / 128 Def Lanturn: 188-222 (41.4 - 48.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

If this has already been mentioned sorry there is alot of pages

 

[LilOu]

I've been messing with lanturn a bit as a check to both M-bird and Gatr, I haven't figured out a specific set thats good because no time. Just did 252hp and split the other evs in half. Lanturn is pretty decent because it can switch into an attack and threaten them to a certain extent, be it thunder wave, scald or volt switch/ thunderbolt.

Calcs

252 SpA Mega Pidgeot Hidden Power Grass vs. 252 HP / 128 SpD Lanturn: 146-172 (32.1 - 37.8%) -- 93.2% chance to 3HKO
idk if they run hp grass but it seemed like the best thing to hit it with

0 SpA Lanturn Volt Switch vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Pidgeot: 146-174 (47.4 - 56.4%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO

0 SpA Lanturn Volt Switch vs. 28 HP / 0 SpD Feraligatr: 140-168 (44 - 52.8%) -- 21.1% chance to 2HKO

+1 252 Atk Life Orb Feraligatr Crunch vs. 252 HP / 128 Def Lanturn: 188-222 (41.4 - 48.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

If this has already been mentioned sorry there is alot of pages

Lanturn also caught my attention as a check for Mega Pidgeot, as it can come, take 0 from whatever Pidgeot can throw at it and then Volt Switch out, it also serves as a great Heliolisk/Rotom-H switchin, stopping them from using Volt Switch of their own; however, it doesn't do so great vs. Feraligatr (you forgot Sheer Force and Adamant)

+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Sheer Force Feraligatr Crunch vs. 252 HP / 128 Def Lanturn: 268-316 (59 - 69.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

 

[psVoltage]

Lanturn also caught my attention as a check for Mega Pidgeot, as it can come, take 0 from whatever Pidgeot can throw at it and then Volt Switch out; however, it doesn't do so great vs. Feraligatr (you forgot Sheer Force and Adamant)

+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Sheer Force Feraligatr Crunch vs. 252 HP / 128 Def Lanturn: 268-316 (59 - 69.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Thanks for correcting that, I forgot to double check x.x
If thats the case i might just end up going with full spdef rather than trying to be a gatr check aswell.

 

[fatty]

koko, and anyone else who mentioned it I guess, I love u brah but Idk where you're coming from generalizing that everyone who voted to keep tini banned came into this thinking it was broken. Not only is it impossible to know what all of us were thinking, but I can at least tell you that I was actually on the opposite side at the beginning. I wanted to retest tini because I thought it would be good for the metagame, giving us another offensive way to deal with fairies and helping to break balance, but the ladder / test changed my mind. There's too many mind games to play with vict, and when mind games aren't taking place, somethings getting obliterated with V-create. If you played on the ladder you know that it seemed victini itself (yes I know people over prepared) drove balanced / bo right out of viability. These aren't the only reasons, but I firmly stick by my vote.

And for people being pessimistic, shut up lol. This test wasn't that bad. Victini was going to be tested at some point anyway, and no way was there this much clamoring about gatr / bird being broken before this test came about. I'm sure the uu tls will do what they can in the near future to help the meta, but for now ya'll should stop whining and let the suspect process take its course.

 

[r0ady]

koko, and anyone else who mentioned it I guess, I love u brah but Idk where you're coming from generalizing that everyone who voted to keep tini banned came into this thinking it was broken. Not only is it impossible to know what all of us were thinking, but I can at least tell you that I was actually on the opposite side at the beginning. I wanted to retest tini because I thought it would be good for the metagame, giving us another offensive way to deal with fairies and helping to break balance, but the ladder / test changed my mind. There's too many mind games to play with vict, and when mind games aren't taking place, somethings getting obliterated with V-create. If you played on the ladder you know that it seemed victini itself (yes I know people over prepared) drove balanced / bo right out of viability. These aren't the only reasons, but I firmly stick by my vote.

And for people being pessimistic, shut up lol. This test wasn't that bad. Victini was going to be tested at some point anyway, and no way was there this much clamoring about gatr / bird being broken before this test came about. I'm sure the uu tls will do what they can in the near future to help the meta, but for now ya'll should stop whining and let the suspect process take its course.

We've been screaming for gatr and pidg to be suspected for months....

 

[kwahelgae]

Just a correction on the feraligatr calcs

+1 252 Atk Life Orb Sheer Force Feraligatr Crunch vs. 252 HP / 128+ Def Lanturn: 222-263 (48.8 - 57.9%) -- 53.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Sheer Force Feraligatr Crunch vs. 172 HP / 188 Def Lanturn: 248-292 (57.1 - 67.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Not the best, but it does deal with Mega-Pidge pretty well.

EDIT: Ninja'd

 

[fatty]

I agree gatr / bird should be and should've been already suspected (i even posted abour it right after mamo dropped) but there wasn't nearly as many people bitching about it as there is now now that they can try and point fingers. The fact is people need to start realizing that these higher up oras metas can't help but be unbalanced without incredible amounts of overhaul. And even then, you're always gonna piss someone off.

 

[YABO]

I don't see how Jolteon is any better of an answer to Pidgeot than Aerodactyl, especially since Aerodactyl is a much much better Pokemon in general and has recovery. I guess you could run Assault Vest, but now Jolteon fails to KO damn-near-everything it wants to that's not on Offense, but Jolteon is more-likely-than-not 2HKO'd by Heat Wave after Rocks.

Actually, way back down the road when Raikou left the tier there was a brief surge in Jolteon usage and I for one can say that Jolteon was a massive pain in the ass to deal with. Beforehand, my way of dealing with Raikou was by never letting it get a hit off for free but Jolteon could do so as long as Mega Aero had not evolved yet. There were a couple games where Jolteon actually just ran me over because I never found a turn to evolve.

 

[Ducem]

I'd like to also say that Jolteon manages to add offensive presence that heliolisk fails to do. For instance, Jolteon can out speed crobat (keeping in mind that it doesn't run full speed on most sets), keeping it from U-turning on Jolteon. Jolteon also adds pressure on the after mentioned aerodactyl (before mega evo) annihilates swampert with HP grass (the HP you ought to run imo), and keeps Shaymin away (an underrated gem) with signal beam. Not to mention that Jolteon blocks volt switch. So, if correctly predicted, it can take some momentum away from volt-turn teams. Which, in case you didn't know, is kind of helpful. Sorry if this felt like more of a rambling than anything else. I've got a little bit more than Pokemon on my mind (4th quarter GS vs Cavs with a 6 point game as of now)

 

[jamashawalker]

Get ready for the jolteon surges on the ladder now...

 

[Sam]

Hello all.

There is a Pidgeot suspect test on the horizon. In the meantime, Hikari and I are looking in to some things to improve the suspect system. We'll start the suspect once we have all of that ironed out.

Continue use this thread to talk about the current meta and not the future suspect please!

 

[MANNAT]

Is MAero gonna get suspected at some point?

 

[Ununhexium]

Is MAero gonna get suspected at some point?

I would say no because its not broken. Its just extremely good

Speaking of maero, in terms of current meta, maero wrecks Pidgeot wrecks salamence wrecks Hydreigon wrecks mamoswine wrecks and a few other things wreck but I don't feel like listing all of them

 

[slated]

Is MAero gonna get suspected at some point?

Doubt it, it's pretty easy to check on most teams since it doesn't pack brutal force like Feraligatr or a powerful, spammable STAB like Pidgeot. Its biggest asset is its speed, bulk and typing in tandem, which means it's able to check a lot of different pokemon in the metagame; however, it doesn't make the pokemon itself hard to check. Offense has a few different options, including Mamoswine, Mega Swampert, Tyrantrum (to an extent), Mega Blastoise, Cobalion, or pokemon that can take a hit and OHKO back, like Feraligatr, Rotom-C, or or even Stone Edge Krookodile.

Balance doesn't have a huge issue with maero because of p2/reuni/def pert/cune etc etc and stall only cares about defensive taunt/roost/toxic/eq because that's in a different ballpark but that's not the best stallbreaker in the tier by any margin. Honestly Pidgeot deserves a suspect (and is getting one!) but Aero doesn't really need one.

also thanks ununhexium for ninja'ing me by writing two sentences

 

[psVoltage]

Actually, way back down the road when Raikou left the tier there was a brief surge in Jolteon usage and I for one can say that Jolteon was a massive pain in the ass to deal with. Beforehand, my way of dealing with Raikou was by never letting it get a hit off for free but Jolteon could do so as long as Mega Aero had not evolved yet. There were a couple games where Jolteon actually just ran me over because I never found a turn to evolve.

I'm having this problem now actually. I didn't prepare for it at all so it just grabs free momentum and its very unsafe for me to try to mega evolve my aero. Ended up being whittled down so much that feraligatr just got a clean sweep, whoops.

 

[mertyville]

It would be nice if there was a way to see if the ones that want to vote have seen the suspect a centain amount of times.
The main issue was people barely saw a Victini and still chose to vote without actually knowing if it was really broken or not.

 

[GULLY]

idk why ppl are trying to discredit others opinion. if you got reqs your opinion/suspect experience is as valid as anyone elses.

 

[Meru]

Can we just all put aside our differences for five seconds to rejoice over the fact that Mega Pidgeot is finally being suspected

 

[sniperr]

The sooner that bird is gone the better. ill probably abuse him for now though lol